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 THE 
 
 ERAL CONSTITUTION 
 
 IN 
 
 1787-1788. 
 
 1 
 
 1 r 
 
 COLLECTED BY 
 
 ■ORTHINGTON CHAUNCEY FORr 
 
 V :} 
 
 i 
 
 H
 
 f '^'i^' 
 
 THE 
 
 FEDERAL CONSTITUTION 
 
 IN 
 
 VIRGINIA. 
 
 1787-1788. 
 
 COLLECTED BY 
 
 WORTHINGTON CHAUNCEY FORD. 
 
 [RbPKINTBD FBOM THB PrOCUEDINOB of the MABSACHDaBTTS HiBTOBICAL 
 
 SociETT, October, 1903.] 
 
 CAMBRIDGE: 
 
 JOHN WILSON AND SON. 
 
 SnibrTstts Ptoo. 
 
 1903. 
 
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 \ s 
 
 i^ 
 
 X. 
 
 k-a, 
 
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 7K ' 
 
 It/ 
 
 THE FEDERAL CONSTITUTION IN VIRGINIA, 
 
 ] 737-1788. 
 
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 2 
 
 The interest oi the follo\. ing letters is to be found in the pic- 
 ture tii.y present of tlje j « utical problems existing in the years 
 17S7 i-M! 1788, in which tl;e United States passed from a loose 
 confedt; ration of States, po sessing the shadow of a central au- 
 thority, a thoroughly discredited Continental Congress, into a 
 nation, under an instrument which, in spite of its compromises, 
 created the machinery necessary for its existence and develop- 
 ment We have form:.! liistories of the time, accounts of the 
 influences leading up to the framing and adoption of the 
 Ccustitntion, and meustirsraents of the results. It is well, 
 however, occasionally to return to original contemporary rec- 
 ords, and ireL at iirst hand the impressions, the fears, and the 
 aspiration oi those who v ere interested in the politics of that 
 di^y. Not only does a general view lose sight of many details, 
 but it eliniTnat( s mueh ot the local color that is so important 
 to the complete piotvirt. No two States offered precisely the 
 same conditions; no State was homogeneous in conditions or 
 in policy; the existence of parties and factions was recog- 
 ni:;ed, and the personal influence of leaders counted for much. 
 In Virginia, for example, the tide-water counties were very 
 different politicalJy from the counties beyond the mountains. 
 Their ec^ -ni- relations were separate, and this led to a wide 
 •nterescs. The ocean and rivers were the natural 
 astern Virginia, and wanting towns and ships, New 
 •n ed the accessary commercial functions. The 
 faced the other way, and in default of good 
 Rading to ocean connection, it looked on the 
 a li" i:/a] channel for the export of produce. 
 . > of th^ leaders of Virginian politics are well 
 the extensive collections of letters from Washing- 
 
 division < 
 carriers ff 
 England 
 western 
 roads r 
 Missir 
 Thf 
 knov 
 
 IL, 
 
 448997
 
 i 
 
 y\ 
 
 i 
 
 ton, Jefferson, and Madison. What is not so well known are 
 the opinions of the lesser leaders, who reflect more clearly the 
 local view, depending upon the immediate opinion of their con- 
 I ' stituents or summarizing the policy of a county meeting or a 
 
 State Assembly. It is from this point of view that the follow- 
 ing letters become so suggestive. Jefferson was in Europe, 
 Madison was in the very front of the constitutionalists, and 
 Washington exerted a dominant influence on the same side. 
 Their correspondents were not of one opinion, and give many 
 shades of suggestion and criticism. Jones was almost in oppo- 
 sition ; Carrington was a judicious critic ; Madison (cousin of 
 the Madison) was less balanced in his comments, and allowed 
 personalities to sway his judgment. Each writer has some 
 individuality, and touches are given that could be derived 
 from no study of the writings of the " fathers." Time has 
 tested their position, and most of the questions that troubled 
 them have ceased to be vital and become historical. Yet the 
 profound influence exerted by these political problems on the 
 history of the country commends them to our reconsideration ; 
 and the issue of the newer problems of "empire" rests upon 
 the development of government and political liberty under the 
 Constitution. Virginia in 1787 faced its " colonial " question 
 in the desire of Kentucky to become an independent State. 
 The continent determined its colonial question in 1787 by the 
 Ordinance for the Government of the Northwest Teriitory. 
 Not until territory was acquired beyond the natural limits of 
 the United States could the problem of dependencies, colonies, 
 or protectorates arise. 
 
 The originals of these letters are, with the exception of the 
 Jones material, in the Department of State, Washington, and 
 will soon be removed to the Library of Congress. The Jones 
 letters were copied many years ago, and I do not know where 
 the originals now rest. They supplement the series printed in 
 the Proceedings, second series, vol. xvi. pp. 116-161. 
 
 GEORGE MUTER TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Kentdckt, Meecee Codnty, 20 February, 1787. 
 
 Sir, — I beg leave to return you my thanks for your favor of the 
 7th of January, which I received a few days ago. 
 
 Our convention was sitting when the act of last session arrived. 
 The moment the convention received information of the act's being 
 
 J 
 
 ll
 
 come to hand, it was directed to be read ; and on considering its con- 
 tents, it was tlie opinion of the members generally, that the convention 
 by the passing of the act, was dissolved. I was doubtful then, that 
 that opinion was too hastily adopted, and that a dissolution of the con- 
 vention was not intended ; in which opinion, since I received your 
 letter, I am now satisfied I was right. I have showed your letter to 
 several of the members ; they are of the same opinion with me, but 
 we can see no means of the convention's being able to act again during 
 its continuance, or even of being called, let the meeting "be ever so 
 proper or necessary. A very considerable delay must now take place 
 in the business of separation ; whether that will be attended with good 
 or bad consequences, I am at present unable to determine. Those of 
 the people that were against a separation, exult exceedingly ; they think 
 they have gained a victory, and plume themselves upon it, highly indeed. 
 The friends to a separation are rather displeased, they think the peti- 
 tion signed by about 70 obscure persons, had more influence than it 
 ought to have had ; and they fear, disagreeable consequences may arise 
 from the delay. 'T is remarkable that the petition was drawn by a 
 Dr. Brooke, who was a member of the first convention, and moved 
 that Kentucky should immediately declare itself independent ; and that 
 Taylor who carried it in, from some expressions that I heard drop from 
 him, I think there is reason to believe, would wish for an uncondi- 
 tional sepa-ation. I am, however, of opinion, that the terms held out 
 by the act of separation will be accepted of, in spite of everything that 
 can be done to the contrary ; and, 1 am certain, that the convention 
 would have voted the terms reasonable, in a few hours after the time 
 they received the act 
 
 I am perfectly satisfied of the propriety of the 7th Article: your 
 reasonings have convinced me my doubts (for it went no farther with 
 me) were wrong. I find too, that many others with whom I have 
 conversed on that subject since I received your letter, agree with me in 
 opinion. 
 
 There has, I firmly believe, a great change taken place in the minds 
 of the people since the last election ; but it is very different from what 
 I have reason to believe, it was represented to be in Richmond ; I have 
 not a doubt that a great number of people who were against a separa- 
 tion at the time of the election, are now for it, and I have not heard of 
 a single person who was inclined for a separation then, having changed 
 his mind. 
 
 Our people here are greatly alarmed at the prospect of the naviga- 
 tion of the Mississippi being given up. And 1 have not met with one 
 man, who would be willing to give the navigation up, for ever so short 
 a time, on any terms whatever. For my own part, although I wish 
 for the right of the navigation's being secured to the citizens of the 
 United States, yet I could wish to see the people of the western country
 
 6 
 
 in general, and the people of Kentucky in particular, make but a verj 
 
 sparing use of it. I am satisfied, foreign commerce can never be bene- 
 ficial in any considerable degree to a people so far removed from the 
 sea ; and that it must be ruinous if the people are engaged in raising a 
 
 t rough material, and that a bulky one, and of little value too, to be 
 
 ■- ' improved by foreigners. This country in my opinion must be princi- 
 
 *■■: pally employed in manufacturing their own necessarys, or forever be a 
 
 poor one. If after supplying themselves with all their coarse goods 
 
 i they might stand in need of, the people could furnish some article of 
 
 light carriage and high value, such as silk, to exchange for such fine 
 
 ; goods as they wished to have, and could not conveniently make, it 
 
 might be well enough ; but to goe farther would be acting contrary to 
 
 i their true interest; and I am inclined to think contrary to the intention 
 
 of Providence who seems to have formed this country to live within 
 
 itself, by furnishing it with all the absolute necessarys of life, in such 
 
 plenty, as to require only the industry of the people to procure them in 
 
 the greatest abundance. 
 
 I The situation of the people of this district from the war with the 
 
 ; Indians is really distressing. The expeditions of last fall, tho' carried 
 
 i on at a vast expense, seem not to have been attended with one single 
 
 ^ good consequence: on the contrary, there is reason to believe, the 
 
 Indians have rather gained a greater degree of confidence than they 
 
 before possessed, and have been more irritated against us than they 
 
 ' were. They seem now to be pushing us on every side ; mischief has 
 
 been done lately on the frontiers of almost every county in the district, 
 and partys have even ventured to commit their depredations within 
 about 15 miles of Danville; and one party, supposed to consist of 
 about twenty, was seen last week, not much over 15 miles from Dan- 
 ville, and within about six or seven miles of Harrodsburgh. A great 
 many poor people have already been forced to remove from their habi- 
 tations, and it is not to be doubted, but that many more will be forced 
 to follow their example. There seems to be no security at present, 
 but in the very thickest settled parts of the country, and how long 
 there may be safety even there, it is impossible to determine. The 
 people however do not seem dismayed ; they keep up their spirits still, 
 and they seem generally to be of opinion, that the strength of the 
 country is fully sufficient for its defence could it only be properly 
 
 I ^^^'■^^<^- At the same time, they think Congress ought to make some 
 
 exertions m their favor ; but they have little hopes of any good arising 
 to them, at least this spring and perhaps summer, either from the 
 troops resolved to be raised by Congress for the defence of the western 
 country, or from any other exertion by Congress in their favor 
 
 ■: whatever. 
 
 I . 7*"! '^\"*^^° ^^ *^«'" i" Massachusetts seems to be distressincr 
 
 \ ■' '°*^"^- A°^ '' '«' I tbi^k, to be feared, that the example may bS
 
 productive of mischief in some of Uie other States. Such a sUte of 
 utfairs is truly deplorable, more particularly as there is reason to suspect 
 that British emissarys are busying themselves on the occasion. How 
 far the mischief may extend it is impossible to foresee ; but, I would fain 
 hope, it will produce an inclination in the minds of all men to use 
 every endeavor to bring about such an amendment of the federal union 
 . i has, now, become absolutely necessary. Virginia has done herself 
 Honor in the choice of her deputies. I hope her example will be 
 followed by the other States, and I pray that the exertions of the 
 deputies from the States of the union, at their meeting, to amend the 
 constitution, and thereby to secure to the people, the blessings that may 
 be reasonably expected from the revolution, may be blessed with the 
 fullest success. I am, &c. 
 
 Geobgb Mutek. 
 
 JOHN CAMPBELL TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 PiTTSBPROH, 21 Pebnuiy, 1787. 
 
 Sir, — On my way to this place, I met a man from the settlement 
 on Cumberland River, in North Carolina, who had just come in by 
 the way of Kentucky. He informs that the minds of all the western 
 people are agitated on account of the proposed cession of the Mississippi 
 navigation to Spain. Every person talks of it with indignation and 
 reprobates it as a measure of the greatest injustice and despotism, de- 
 claring that if it takes place they will look upon themselves released 
 from all federal obligations, and fully at liberty to seek alliances and 
 connections wherever they can find them, and that the British officers 
 at Detroit have already been tampering with them. I am apprehen- 
 sive that these matters will hasten the separation of the District of 
 Kentucky prematurely from the other part of the State, the inhab- 
 Hants of North Carolina to the westward of Cumberland Mountain 
 l)eing desirous to join the people of Kentucky in forming one State, 
 an event desirable in my opinion both to the' old and the new, pro- 
 vided we parted in friendship, which I sincerely wish to be the case, 
 happen when it may, but which does not promise fair from the present 
 appearance. 
 
 I enclose your last week's gazette, wherein you will see the resolves 
 of the Patriotic convention of Washington County. This town has 
 also framed a petition to the Assembly respecting the navigation of the 
 Mississippi, which is now out signing, and have also appointed a Com- 
 mittee of Correspondence to receive and communicate intelligence from 
 and to all places to the westward immediately interested. 
 
 Before I conclude, I must not omit- mentioning what appears to me 
 singular. Every individual wi»h whom I converse on the subject is 
 
 II
 
 8 
 
 fully sensible of the pernicious t^nrlency the measure of ceding or for- 
 bearing the use of the river will have iu reducing the value of the 
 "Western Lands belonging to the United States, and whenever they 
 assign any reason that would induce Congress to such a measure, 
 impute it to the spirit of speculation in some aristocratic Junto who 
 wish to procure vast landed property in that country for little value, to 
 the great injury of the Publick. 
 
 I have no other news to communicate, except that the Indians still 
 continue their depredations in Kentucky, having killed some people 
 lately in Jefferson County. I shall set out thither shortly, and if any 
 thing worth communicating occurs, I will take the first opponunivy of 
 acquainting you of it. . . . 
 
 John Campbell. 
 
 A. DONALD TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 Richmond, 1 March, 1787. 
 
 ... In consequence of the agreement with the Farmers General 
 of France on the 24"?' May last, to receive from 12 to 15,000 hhd's of 
 tobacco, over and above the quantity contracted for with Mr. Morris, 
 ai the same prices which are paid him, provided the tobacco was sent 
 direct from the place of its growth, in French or American vessels, 
 several speculations have already been made, and I have lately char- 
 tered a large ship to send to Havre de Grace, but I am much alarmed 
 at being lately informed that every possible obstacle is thrown in the 
 way of carrying the resolutions of the Committee of Berri into effect. 
 Some cargoes have been refused, and those that have been accepted, 
 have been at an inferior price to what Mr. Morris receives for tobacco 
 shipped from the very same rivers. I hope this information is not 
 founded, but if it is, many individuals will suffer severely by their 
 confidence, and it will be a great loss to the publick. For the prices 
 allowed Mr. Morris appeared so tempting, that many gentlemen were 
 mduced to speculate to France. The consequence has been a very 
 considerable rise in the price of tobacco at all the river warehouses 
 on this river, as well as at Petersburg, and upon Rappahanock and 
 Potowmack, from which places Mr. Alexander chiefly draws his quan- 
 tity. He ships very little from this place, or Page's, (where you and 
 myself have passed some happy days). 
 
 I will not presume to trouble you with my opinion of the political 
 situation of the United States. That you will no doubt be informed of 
 by those who are more adequate to the task ; but I cannot help ex- 
 pressmg great uneasiness at the disturbances in the Eastern States 
 And It gives me pain to add, that the people in this State will in the 
 course of a year or two be unable even to pay the taxes, unless there
 
 9 
 
 is a possibility of falling upon some happy plan of moderating their 
 extravagance and encouraging their industry. I am sure you will 
 blush for your countrymen when I assure you that in this and all the 
 other towns in this State, we are supplied by our sister States to the 
 eastward with the most of our hay, cabbages, potatoes, onions, &a so 
 that they even send us lime, bricks and framing for houses ready for 
 setting up. Many a time I laugh at my Friends for this want of 
 industry. . . . 
 
 A. Donald. 
 
 JOHN DAWSON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Fredbricksbdhoh, 15 April, 1787. 
 
 . . . From a persuasion that a large majority of the citizens of this 
 State are warmly opposed to the payment of British debts, I am appre- 
 hensive that tlie act of Congress will be but coolly received, the* I 
 presume in their letter they will give reasons of sufficient weight to 
 convince the disinterested. I assure you that matters here wear a very 
 disagreeable aspect — the people of Carolina have, I am informed, 
 entered into an association, and are determined to purchase no property 
 sold by execution. The extreme scarcity of hard money is the reason 
 urged, and indeed there is too much weight in it. Three days since I 
 attended a sherrifF's sale in this county, where very likely negros, such 
 as before the war would have brought eighty pounds, were sold for 
 thirty. In most of the counties, petitions to the next Assembly will 
 be handed about, for the payment of debts either in property, or by 
 installments, and should both be refused, and the scarcity of money 
 continue, I know not what may be the consequence, as I am informed 
 that in some of the low counties, they talk boldly of following the 
 example of the insurgents in Massachusetts and preventing the courts 
 proceeding to business. 
 
 Much depends on the Convention in May. The attention of almost 
 every person is fixed on that body, and should the issue not be success- 
 ful, which I am very sorry to find you suspect, I fear there will be 
 an end to the general confederacy. You have I presume heard that 
 Gen'l Washington has consented to attend. About that time I expect 
 to have the pleasure of seeing you in Philadelphia. As my object is 
 to gain information on many political points, which I presume will be 
 investigated in the ablest manner, and which will be very useful to me 
 in the next Assembly, I must renew a request I before made, that if 
 it can be done with propriety, you will permit me to hear the debates. 
 If it cannot, I am sure you will give me any information in your 
 power, and I shall ever thank you, if you will, in case you arrive before 
 me, engage a room in the hou^e you put up at, convenient to yours.
 
 10 
 
 Oar friend Monroe is elected for this county contrary to the expec- 
 tations of almost every body. Mr. Page's conduct during the last 
 Assembly, and his opposition to the tobacco bill lost him bis election. 
 Old Mr. Harrison, I am informed, is also elected. Mr. Marshall and 
 young L. Lee are acquisitions to the house; but the loss of R. B. Lee 
 a disadvantage. Mr. Smith, I hear, will probably be left out. . . . 
 
 J. Dawson. 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 New Yobk, 24 April, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — I had the honor to receive your favor of the IG'!" of 
 
 January by Col° Franks, and thank you sincerely for the confidence 
 
 with which you claim my services, as for your friendly communications. 
 
 The former you may at all times command ; the latter will not only be 
 
 gratefully received, but repaid as far as my attempts to do so can go. 
 
 The letters to your friends were immediately forwarded under cover to 
 
 Dr. Curry. The packages are committed to the care of Mr. Bannister, 
 
 who goes off this day by stage to Richmond. No gentleman before 
 
 him has been travelling thither by this mode, since the arrival of the 
 
 . ! packet, and to hav committed them to the stage, without the immediate 
 
 '*| care of a person who was to go the whole way, would have amounted 
 
 f to no more than an consignment to the first stage office in which they 
 
 .^ might have been deposited for a night, or perhaps to be thrown into 
 
 the highway by the first traveller who might conceive himself incora- 
 
 I moded by them. There is scarcely an instance of any thing's going 
 
 I safely that is casually committed to the stage. Mr. Bannister intends 
 
 to go immediately on, but should he by any accident be delayed, he 
 
 will more readily meet with a hand who is going to Richmond further 
 
 on the way than I shall here, and is apprised of the despatch which is 
 
 necessary in the case. 
 
 You have doubtless been informed of the measure of a general 
 
 convention which was proposed by Virginia in the fall session, for 
 
 ^ revising and thoroughly amending the Confederation. Some of the 
 
 I States hesitated upon the adoption of the measure, as being unauthor- 
 
 I ize*^ by Congress, and of course, improper. To remove every possible 
 
 {difficulty Congress came to a resolution in February recommending its 
 adoption; all the States have appointed deputies except Maryland, 
 j' Connecticut and Rhode Island. Maryland is now in session, and that 
 
 ; she will appoint is not doubted. Connecticut is also in session, and it 
 
 18 believed will appoint. Rhode Island is at all points so anti-federal, 
 , and contemptible, that her neglecting the invitation, will probably occa- 
 sion no demur whatever in the proceedings. The meeting is to take
 
 11 
 
 place in Philadelphia, the second Monday in May. VariouB are the 
 conjectures as to the issue of this meeting, and still more various are 
 ibe suggested remedies to the defects of our system. I am rather a 
 zealot in the measure because it will operate, at least as an alarm, but 
 whether it will be productive of any immediate effects may be doubtful. 
 Perhaps that experimeut has not yet been made of the present system, 
 which could discover its defects, or point to their remedies. I am cer- 
 tain it is very imperfect, but at the same time there are evident causes 
 for its failure, other than those of defectiveness in the construction. 
 The best of governments, like other things, can prosper alone by due 
 Attention. America was placed in possession of peace and independence 
 under circumstances which have not only deprived her political systems 
 of the necessary care of her citizens, but exposed her to the injunous 
 designs of men whose interest it has been to destroy the efficiency of 
 trovernmeut, a great proportion of the people being loaded with debt 
 have found an interest in promoting measures directly opposed to good 
 crovernment, and have been solicitous to direct the public affairs ; whilst 
 better men have been inactive or engrossed by the alluring invitatioDS 
 of ease and plenty in our vast western and southern regions. 
 
 The deputies to the convention for Virginia are Gen! "Washington, 
 E. Randolph, G. Wythe, John Blair, Geo. Mason, J. Madison, and 
 Jas. McClurg. Mr. Henry, Mr. R. H. Lee and Genl. Nelson have 
 declined appointmenca which were oiicred them. Genl. Washington, 
 it is hoped, will attend, but there is some reason to apprehend the 
 contrary — his state of health is not a good one. 
 
 I am pleased to hear of the impressions which have been received in 
 Europe with respect to the late commotions in Massachusetts. A 
 perfect quiet prevails there now, but it is said the elections for the 
 ensuing year are not free of the influence of malcontenta. 
 
 The convention will be productive of things worth communicating to 
 you, and I will do myself the pleasure to write by the first opportunity 
 that offers after its commencement. 
 
 £d. Carrikoton. 
 
 WILLIAM HAY TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 Richmond, April 26, 1787. 
 . . . Your native country eihibit-s at present a very gloomy picture, 
 the striking tracts of which are a degeneracy of manners and an nnequal 
 and slow administration of justice. The people are greatly in debt, and 
 the cry is paper money ; punctuality is gone, and all faith and credit in 
 individuals are lost. The prudent measures of last assembly respecting 
 paper money and tlie public securities, gained them immortal honour,
 
 ^ 
 
 12 
 
 I 
 
 and had their other proceedings been dictated by the same wisdom we 
 should ere this moment have heartily begun a sprieB of reformation. 
 The means which, since the peace, have fostered luxury and extrava- 
 gance are now withheld from the bulk of the people, the staple com- 
 modity of the cx)untry is fallen, and goods are now and will be more 
 and more scarce. Necessity therefore will teach us frugality and 
 temperance. Indeed the culture of cotton, flax and hemp is taken up 
 again, and as if awoke from a dream the people wonder how they could 
 lay aside manufacturing the coarse articles which their families stood 
 in need of, and of which experience during the war, taught them the 
 advantages. Farming and gardening are more general and the culture 
 of the grapes is now become fashionable. The farmer however has 
 seen with sorrow his crops of small grain, particularly the wheat and 
 frequently the corn, almost totally destroyed for some years pa«5t by a 
 pernicious insect. The damage is done while it is yet in its first stage 
 of existence, the little enemy dwells in safety between the outer leaves 
 which cover the joints and the stalk. In this state they appear not 
 unlike a young bed bug, and smell exactly as they do. They differ in 
 colour only by a duskish black streak across the neck ; when they have 
 acquired wings, they are all over of that dusky colour, except a very 
 large one which you will find now and then of the same colour of the 
 young brood, whether male or female, I have not been able to deter- 
 mine. No remedy has been found out for them. Their progress is 
 from south to north, and such havock have they made, that many 
 farmers have been obliged to leave off the culture of wheat, and by that 
 means they have left their farms. The same bug is known to the 
 northward, and is there denominated the Hessian fly. . . . 
 
 Wm. Hat. 
 
 EVAN SHELBY TO BRIG. GEN'L RUSSELL. 
 
 Sullivan Countt, 27 April, 1787. 
 Dear General, — Nothing but real necessity and the dreadful ap- 
 prehensions of an intestine war induces me to correspond with you on 
 that head. The lenient and conciliating measures of the General As- 
 sembly of North Carolina being treated with the utmost contempt, the 
 new State party are now falling on the civil officers of government, with 
 men in arms, and wresting their property from them, forcibly and con- 
 trary to law ; their Assembly have also set, ratified and confirmed sundry 
 acts, one of which doubtless Virginia must share in its consequences ; 
 they opened an office for the lands from French broad river to Tennessee 
 nver, being the lands reserved to the Indians by the General Assembly 
 of North Carolma to them and their heirs forever; they are forcibly 

 
 13 
 
 taking possession of the same aud settling in view of their towns. This 
 cannot fail bringing ou the resentment of the Indians, aud involve us in 
 a war with them, which your frontiers must share in its dreadful conse- 
 quences ; This I should think highly necessary to be known to the 
 Executive of Virginia. I am now under the fullest apprehension of 
 engaging in an intestine war, in consequence of which have made an 
 application to Government for assistance ; those unprovoked insurreo- 
 tiotis seem to have a tendency if possible to dissolve even the very bands 
 of the federal union. I am not certain that I may not be under the 
 disagreeable necessity of making a very speedy application to you for 
 assistance, should not the troops from our State arrive in time to relieve 
 us. I therefore hope you will as a member of the union and a lover of 
 your country lend every possible aid and assistance to relieve us, and 
 hold yourself in readiness for the same. Having the fullest confidence 
 in vour Patriotism, your valor and good conduct, I submit the same to 
 
 your mature consideration. I am, &c 
 
 Evan Shelby. 
 
 ARTHUR CAMPBELL TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Washington Codntt, 12 May, 1787. 
 Sir, — Being neither acquainted with your Secretary at War, nor 
 Doctor White, the Superintendent for the Southern Department, I 
 have taken the liberty to request your notice to the affairs of the South- 
 ern Indians which aie now in such a State, that the Spaniards on one 
 hand, and other improper intruders on the other, may excite them all 
 to become our enemies : or at best useless friends, whereas a little kind- 
 ness and good management this year may engage them lastingly in the 
 American interesu I am doubtful the choice of Doctor White is rather 
 1 unfortunate one for Virginia, and indeed for the Union, as he seems 
 be very much a stranger to Indian manners and customs, and per- 
 -ps loves ease too well to undertake the journeys necessary to make 
 16 proper arrangements. At all events, if continued in office, he 
 ouglit to be urged speedily to fulfil the purposes of the ordinance for 
 the regulation of Indian affairs. Connected with this, indulge me to 
 hint, that a company of the troops of the United States ought to be 
 stationed somewhere on the Tenassee, above the Cumberland mountain 
 for one year. They might then move down the river towards the 
 mouth. The greater strangers these men are the better. 
 
 If this should reach you before the Convention breaks up, Governor 
 Randolph can explain the matter more fully from the communications I 
 have lately had the honor to make him. Together with what you may 
 learu from the bearer, Mr. Alexander Drumgoole, who is lately become
 
 14 
 
 a popular trader in the Cherokee country, and is now intrusted with one 
 of the war captains of that nation to make an application to Congress. 
 I am Sir, &c. 
 
 Arthur Campbell. 
 
 WILLIAM GRAYSON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 24 May, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — I am much obliged by your kind favor, and am sorry I 
 have so little to communicate from this quarter worth your acceptance ; 
 we have been a caput mortuum for some time past, except the little 
 flurry that was kicked up about Philadelphia. Carrington, I presume, 
 has given you full information on that point; during the contest, the 
 enemy wanted to raise a mutiny in our camp by proposing to go to 
 Georgetown at a certain time. They were answered, they had served 
 us so once before. Since the matter has blown over, some particular 
 gentlemen have offered to join us in getting Georgetown fixed as y' 
 capital of the foederal Empire : they say they will vote money for the 
 buildings, and in every respect make the compact as irrevocable as the 
 nature of the case will admit of, provided we will agree to stay here a 
 reasonable time untill everything is made proper for their reception. 
 I am not certain when all the Eastern States come forward, but some 
 good may come out of this, provided we act with delicacy and caution. 
 Most of y' foreigners who come among us say the sessions of Congress 
 should be fixed by national compact ; I think they are right in their 
 reasoning with respect to all such governments as ours. The argu- 
 ments are too obvious to be mentioned to you. We have a right to 
 it at Georgetown : and ought in justice to get it 
 
 Entrenous, I believe the Eastern people have taken ground they will 
 not depart from respecting the Convention. One legislature, composed 
 of a town-house, tri-ennially elected, and an Executive and Senate, for 
 a good number of years. I shall see Gerry and Johnson, as they pass, 
 and may perhaps give you a hint. 
 
 Since your departure, Maryland has openly declared against the 
 Mississippi. It is therefore of y' utmost importance that S° Carolina 
 should think right on y« subject Parker, who comes in in November 
 next, is firm ; and Mr. Kean from his bad state of health will not in all 
 probability attend. 
 
 We have lately had a new farce wrote by Poet Tyler, called May 
 day. It has plott and incident, and is as good as several of y* English 
 farces. It has, however, not succeeded well, owing, I believe, to y« 
 Author's making his principal character a scold ; some of the New York 
 ladies were alarmed for fear strangers should look upon Mrs. [illegible] 
 as the model of the gentlewomen of this place. 
 
 William Geatson.
 
 16 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 New York, 9 June, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — I did myself the honor to address you by favor of 
 Mr, Payne, in answer to yours of the \S*^ January. 
 
 The proposed scheme of a convention has taken more general effect, 
 and promises acre solid advantages than was at first hoped for. All 
 the States have elected representatives except Rhode Island, whose 
 apostasy from every moral as well as political obligation, has placed 
 her perfectly with the views of her confederates; nor will her absence, 
 or non-concurrence, occasion the least impediment in any stage of the 
 intended business. On Friday the 25"' ult. seven States assembled at 
 Philadelphia. The convention was formed by the election of General 
 Washington, President, and Major W. Jackson, Secretary. The 
 numbers have since increased to 11 States. New Hampshire has not 
 yet arrived, but is daily expected. 
 
 The commissions of these gentlemen go to a thorough reform of our 
 confederation. Some of the States at first restricted their deputies to 
 commercial objects, but have since liberated them. The latitude thus 
 given, together with the generality of the commission from the States, 
 have doubtless operated to bring Genl. "Washington forward, contrary 
 to his more early determination. His conduct in both instances indi- 
 cates a deep impression upon his mind of the necessity of some material 
 chancre. It belongs to his wisdom and weight of character to be averse " 
 to meddling in a fruitless attempt, and this must have been the case 
 upon a confined ground, or a very partial representation of the States. 
 It would have been equally inconsistent with his situation to come for- 
 ward upon any occasion, except in the extremity of public necessity. 
 In every public act he hazards, without a possibility of gaining, reputa- 
 tion. He already possesses everything to be desired from the love or 
 confidence of a free people, yet it seems that it remained for himself to 
 add a lustre to his character, by this patriotic adventure of all for bis 
 countries good alone. 
 
 The importance of this event is every day growing in the public 
 mind, and it will, in all probability produce an happy era in our politi- 
 cal existence. Taking a view of the circumstances which have occa- 
 sioned our calamities, and the present state of things and opinions, I 
 am flattered with this prospect. Public events in the United States 
 since the peace have given a cast to the American character which is 
 by no means its true countenance. Delinquencies of the States in their 
 federal obligations ; acts of their Legislatures violating public treaties 
 and private contracts, and an universal imbecility in the public adminis- 
 trations, it is true, form the great features of our political conduct ; but 
 these have resulted rather from constitutional defects, and accidental
 
 16 
 
 causes, than the natural dispositions of the people. Destitute as thei 
 federal sovereignty is of coercive principles, backwardness in thel 
 component parts to comply with its recommendations, is natural and! 
 inevitable. Coercion in government produces a double effect. While! 
 it compels the obedience of the refractory, it redoubles the alertness olf 
 the virtuous by inspiring a confidence in the impartiality of its burthens] 
 From defect of penalty, ideas of delinquency are inseparable. States 
 as well as individuals, will contemplate both together, and apprehen] 
 sions of unequal performance, produce disgust and apathy throughout. 
 
 The nefarious acts of State governments have proceeded not from tin 
 will of the people. Peace once obtained, men whose ability and integJ 
 rity had gained the intire popular confidence ; whose zeal or indolent 
 in the public affairs, alike, moved or lulled the people, retired from th< 
 busy scene, or at least acted with indifference ; the newspapers ceasec 
 to circulate with public information ; demagogues of desperate fortunes'- 
 mere adventurers in fraud, were left to act unopposed ; their measures] 
 of course either obtained the consent of the multitude by misrepresen-l 
 tation, or assumed the countenance of popularity because none said Nay.! 
 Hence have proceeded paper money, breaches of treaty, &c. The 
 ductility of the multitude is fully evidenced in the case of the late 
 tumults in Massachusetts. Men who were of good property, and owed 
 not a shilling, were involved in the train of desperadoes to suppress the 
 courts. A full representation of the public affairs from the General 
 Court through the clergy, has reclaimed so great a proportion of the 
 deluded, that a rebellion, which a few months ago threatened the sub- 
 version of the government is, by measures scarcely deserving the name 
 of exeruon, suppressed, and one decided act of authority would eradicate 
 It forever. In this experiment it is proved that full intelligence of the 
 public affairs not only would keep the people right, but will set them 
 so after they have got wrong. 
 
 Civil liberty, in my opinion, never before took up her residence in 
 a country so likely to afford her a long and grateful protection, as the 
 United States. A people more generally enlightened than any other 
 under the sun, and in the habit of owning, instead of being mere tenants 
 .n, the soil, must be proportionately alive to her sacred rights and qual- 
 ified to guard them, and I am persuaded that the time is fast approach- 
 ng when all these advantages will have .their fullest influence. Our 
 tendency to anarchy and consequent despotism is felt, and the alarm is 
 spreading. Men are brought into action who had consigned themselves 
 
 l^of^rEm^r' '"' '^"^^°'^"' " ^ ^^"' ^« --^"^ ^« ^"- 
 
 thaTt%L'''f '°^ in^pression as well in, as out of the Convention, is 
 that a federal government adapted to the permanent circumstances of 
 the country, without respect to the habits of the day, be formed, whose
 
 17 
 
 efficiency shall pervade the whole Empire : it may and probably will, at 
 first, be viewed with hesitation, but, derived and patronised as it will 
 be, its influence must extend into a general adoption as the present 
 fabric gives way. That the people are disposed to be governed is 
 evinced in their turning out to support the shadows under which they 
 now live, and if a work of wisdom is prepared for them, they will not 
 reject it to commit themselves to the dubious issue of anarchy. 
 
 The debates and proceedings of the Convention are kept in profound 
 secrecy. Opinions of the probable result of their deliberations can 
 only be formed from the prevailing impressions of men of reflection and 
 understanding. These are reducible to two schemes: the first, a con- 
 solidation of the whole Empire into one republic, leaving in the States 
 notliing more than subordinate courts for facilitating the administiaUon 
 of the" laws ; the second, an investiture of the federal sovereignty 
 with full and independent authority as to the trade, revenues and 
 forces of the union and the rights of peace and war, together with a 
 negative upon all the acts of the State legislatures. The first idea, I 
 apprehend, would be impracticable, & therefore do not suppose it can 
 be adopted. General laws through a country embracing bo many 
 climates, productions and manners as the United States, would operate 
 many oppressions, and a general legislature would be found incom- 
 petent to the formation of local ones, as a majority would in every 
 instance be ignorant of, and unaffected by the objecU of legislation. 
 The essential rights, as well as advantages, of representation would 
 be lost, and obedience to the public decrees could only be assured by 
 the exercise of powers different from those derivable from a free con- 
 stitution. Such an experiment must therefore terminate in a despotism, 
 or the same inconveniences we are now deliberating to remove. Some- 
 thing like the second will probably be formed. Indeed I am certain 
 that nothing less than what will give the federal sovereignty a complete 
 controul over the State governments will be thought worthy of discufr 
 sion. Such a scheme constructed upon well adjusted principles would 
 certainly give us stability and importance as a nation, and if the Execu- 
 tive powers can be sutficiently checked, must be eligible. Unless the 
 whole has a decided influence over the parts the constant effort will be 
 to resume the delegated powers, and there cannot be an inducement in 
 the federal sovereignty to refuse its assent to an innocent act of a State. 
 The negative which the King of England had upon our laws was never 
 found to be materially inconvenient. 
 
 The ideas here suggested are far removed from those which pre- 
 vailed when you were amongst us, and as they have arisen with the 
 most able from an actual view of events, it is probable you may not be 
 prepared to expect them. They, are, however the most moderate of 
 any which obtain in any general form amongst reflective and intelligent
 
 i 
 
 i 
 
 j 
 
 4 ' 
 
 18 
 
 men. The Eastern opinions are for a total surrender of the State 
 sovereignties, and indeed some amongst them go to a monarchy at 
 once. They have verged to anarchy, wiiile to the southward we have 
 only felt an inconvenience, and their proportionate disposition to an 
 opposite extreme is a natural consequence. . . . 
 
 Ed. Carrington. 
 
 REV. JAMES MADISON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 11 June, 1787. 
 Dear Col., — I am greatly indebted to you for the books you were 
 so good as to send me by Mr. Griffin, particularly y* observations of 
 Mr. Adams ; not, however, that he has made a Convert of me, any 
 more than I trust, he has of you, to what appears to be y* secret Design 
 of his Work. It is probable, my dear Friend, that all that Trouble 
 was taken, and shew of learning displayed, merely to refute the Opinion 
 of Mr. Turgot — an opinion sufficiently innocent in itself, and which) 
 had no, or but very few Advocates in America, if we judge from the ' 
 Gov*^ wh. have been establislied. Mr. Adams is greatly mortified that 
 our Executives have not a Negative upon the Legislatures — and 
 thinks the British System of Gov! beyond Comparison, y' wisest and 
 y* best ever yet invented. He must wish then to introduce a similar U' 
 
 Gov! into America. His Executive (w".'' he also thinks sh"! be single) 
 must be a King — y^ Senate, Lords, the House of Delegates, Plebeians 
 or Commons. Thus under ye mask of attacking Mr. Turgot, he seems 
 insidiously attempting, notwithstanding now and then a saving clause, 
 to overturn our present Constitutions, or at least to sow the seeds of 
 Discontent. I believe, if this supposition be just, it is the first In- 
 stance wherein a public Minister at a foreign Court has been foremost 
 in openly and avowedly plotting Revolutions in the Gov! he represents. 
 I fear his Optics have been too weak to withstand the Glass of European 
 Courts. Their air may have corrupted the plain Republican, and lest 
 he should be farther mortified, I think Congress would do well to give 
 him as speedily as possible ye opportunity of breathing once more 
 y* purer American air. Jefferson thanks his God that the day of 
 Kings, Nobles and Priests are almost past. Adams must trust in his, 
 that they will be seen to rise in America with new Splendor — which 
 sentiment is y' more worthy of a man of common sense, I will not say 
 political knowledge, we need not determine. The Truth is, I believe, 
 y' Outlines of y'= American governments are as well drawn, in order to 
 promote public and private Happiness, and to secure that greatest pos- 
 sible Portion of Liberty, which we have so successfully contended for, 
 as human sagacity could possibly devise. These Outlines only require 
 
 «
 
 19 
 
 to be skilfully filled up, perhaps in some Cases to be somewhat ex- 
 tended ; but as to a llenunciation of y* original Plan, I hope iu God, 
 no houest, independent Man will hesitate. The least that ought to be 
 done surely, is to make a fair Experiment. This requires Time, par- 
 ticularly as we may reasonably expect that y'= rising Generation will 
 be much better actors upon y* Republican Theatre than their Pre- 
 decessors. Besides Time is essentially necessary to give Force and 
 Energy to any Government, Nothing is more illusory on most occa- 
 sions, than y* use of metaphorical Language. I question whether this 
 Balance, w'f" Adams talks so much about, has not served somewhat to 
 mislead him. Government must be properly balanced. But a Balance 
 must be supported or held up, and there must also be something to 
 be weighed in each Scale. Hence the Idea of a Monarch, King, or 
 Executive, with negative Powers, holding in his all powerful Hand 
 the Beam, and Lords and Commons dancing up and down iu each 
 Scale, until his Majesty takes as many of his good People oat of one 
 Scale, and throws them into ye other, as will produce ye desired 
 Equipoise. Then arises a goodly Gov^ admirably balanced. 
 
 There is another Circumstance of much more Importance, which 
 these Admirers of British Gov? seem entirely to forget. There did 
 exist in that Country, and indeed throughout both ancient and modern 
 Europe, from ye earliest Periods, this spurious Race of Men called 
 Nobles. They become so firmly established either through Power or 
 Prejudice, that to eradicate them was impossible; so that in settling 
 ye British Gov', the only Question could be how shall we moderate 
 this enormous Evil as much as possible. It could not be removed, and 
 therefore it was wise to adopt a System, by w'."" the least probable In- 
 jury should be sustained from it. Perhaps the British Gov! may be 
 considered as having fortunately adopted that which would best temper 
 an Evil inseparable from the Nation. But surely, notwithstanding 
 what Adams may dream, and De Lome think, it would be as rational 
 for a healthy, robust Mountaineer to take a moderate Dose of Arsenic, 
 or something else, to reduce himself to y* Temperament of a Lowlander, 
 as for America, free and uncorrupted as she now is, to encourage a 
 system by which a Race of Men might be gradually introduced, which 
 must eventually prove a certain Poison both to public and private Hap- 
 piness, tho' she might be assimilated to that Idol, Great B — Fortu- 
 nate as we are in knowing no Distinction among Men, but such as 
 Nature has established ; singularly fortunate indeed, in being free from 
 y"= most absurd and degrading Differences amongst Citizens — DiflTer- 
 eiices, which Ignorance and Poverty gave Birth to, and wl*" Nothing 
 but Folly and Pride would introduce or maintain, I trust the Patriotn 
 of America will ever evince to their Country and y' World, not only 
 y' Resolution to maintain our present Forms of Government, pure as
 
 20 
 
 they originated, but that they will discover y' Means of giving them 
 that Energy w".*" a (xov! of Law requires, and that Permanence, which, 
 if possible, may be everlasting. 
 
 Thus have I said twice as much as I intended, or need have said to 
 you. But ye Subject is interesting and you see ye Impressions w"^!* ye 
 first reading of ye Defence has made upon me. Besides, I find even 
 here, the Publication of that Book is considered as a Sanction for ye 
 open avowal of opinions w*;*" tend effectually to undermine or stab our 
 
 Republic. . . . 
 
 J. Madison. 
 
 JOHN DAWSON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 12 June, 1787. 
 Dear Sir, — After an absence of near three weeks, I have just re- 
 turned to this place and am favored with your letter of the 27 of 
 May. The prospect of a general convention of the States appears to 
 me very faint, and I wish to be informed whether the States assembled, 
 or those that probably will meet, will proceed to any business. I ap- 
 prehend that nothing decisive can be done without the concurrence of 
 the whole. 
 
 I have lately been on the south side of James River ; the people in 
 general appear very much discontented, and I really fear that a major- 
 ^^ ity of that part of the State are in favor of paper money. Neighbors 
 
 ■^ A / ' , to the Carolinians, (whose money has depreciated one hundred per cent) 
 
 they have contracted a similar way of thinking — and inattentive to the 
 future honor and interest of the State, they are friends to any measure 
 which will afford present relief. In Henry county, the high Sheriff has 
 not given security for the collection of the taxes, and I was told it 
 would be dangerous for any person to offer. Of course, no collection 
 goes on, and the people appear happy in this expedient of evading pay- 
 / ment. In King William, the night before the May court, the court 
 
 I house, with all the records of th« county, was burnt down. Some cir- 
 
 I cumstances prove that it was designedly done. 
 
 - You, I know, are opposed to the plan of incorporating towns, which, 
 
 in this State, has been so much in vogue, for some years past. The 
 people in this county, convinced of the bad policy, intend to petition 
 the next Assembly for a repeal of the law incorporating this town. I 
 have promised to forward these wishes, and will thank you for any in- 
 formation you can give me on this subject, together with your reasons 
 for being unfriendly to them. Are any towns in the Eastern States 
 incorporated? Is Philadelphia? Was it before the war, and how 
 I lo°g? • • • 
 
 !i . . J. Dawson. 
 
 1 
 
 '.
 
 21 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 New York, 13 June, 1787. 
 . . . Had the rules of the Convention permitted communications from 
 thence, you would have conferred an obligation by including me in the 
 number of your correspondents upon the subjects of deliberation in that 
 assembly. My curiosity is, however, perfectly suppressed by the pro- 
 priety of the prohibition. Having matured your opinions and given 
 them a collected form, they will be fairly presented to the public, and 
 stand their own advocates — but caught by detachments, and while 
 indeed immature, they would be equally the victims of ignorance and 
 misrepresentation. The public miud is now on the point of a favor- 
 able turn to the objects of your meeting, and, being fairly met with the 
 result, will, I am persuaded, eventually embrace it — being calculated 
 for the permanent fitness, and not the momentary habits of the country, 
 it may at first be viewed with hesitation, but denied and patronised as 
 it will be, its infiuence must extend into an adoption as the present 
 fabric gives way. The work once well done, will be done forever ; but 
 patched up in accommodation to the whim of the day, it will soon re- 
 quire the hand of the cobbler again ; and in every unfortunate experi- 
 ment, the materials are rendered the less fit for that monument of civil 
 liberty, which we wish to erect. Constitute a federal government, 
 invigorate and check it well, give it then independent powers over the 
 Trade, the Reven.ies and forces of the Union, and all things that involve 
 any relationship to foreign powers ; give it also the revisal of all State 
 acts, unless it proposes a compleat control over the State Governments, 
 the constant effort will be to resume the delegated powers. Nor do I 
 see what inducement the federal sovereignty can have to negative an 
 innocent act of a State. Constitute it in such shape that its first prin- 
 ciples being preserved, it will be a good republic I wish to see that 
 system have a fair experiment — but let the liability to encroachments 
 be rather from the federal, than the State, Grovernments, In the first 
 case we shall insensibly glide into a monarchy, in the latter nothing bat 
 anarchy can be the consequence. 
 
 Some Gentlemen think of a total surrender of the State sovereignties. 
 I see not the necessity of that measure for giving us national stability or 
 consequence. The negative of the federal sovereignty will effectually 
 prevent the existence of any licentious or inconsiderate act, and I be- 
 lieve that even under a monarchy, it would be found necessary thus to 
 continue the local administrations. General laws would operate many 
 particular oppressions, and a general legislature would be found incom- 
 petent to the formation of local ones. The interests of the United States 
 may be well combined for the common good ; but the affairs of so exten- 
 sive a country are not to be thrown into one mass. An attempt to oon-
 
 22 
 
 federate upon terms materially opposed to the particular Interests would 
 in all probability occasion a dismemberment, and in that event, within 
 a long time yet to come, the prospects of America will be at an end as 
 to any degree of national importance, let her fate be what it may as to 
 freedom or vassalage. Be good enough to present me to your honor- 
 able colleagues and believe me, &c 
 
 Ed. Carrington. 
 
 l\ 
 
 -/ / 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 New York, 26 July, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — . . . We are trying to do something with our Western 
 Territory to make it useful to the purposes for which the United States 
 were vested with it. You have seen in the papers the scheme for the 
 temporary as well as perpetual government of it. A practicable measure 
 for the sale of it, or rather by means of it to redeem the domestic debt, 
 remains still to be agreed upon, and I fear the difficulties which have 
 always stood in the way of this great object, are not yet to be sur- 
 mounted. Col. Lee joins Grayson and myself with great zeal, but what 
 will be the issue of our efforts I know not. 
 
 Indian affairs wear an hostile aspect, and money must in all proba- 
 bility, be expended in Treaties with them. A general confederacy is 
 formed of all the nations and tribes from the Six Nations inclusive to 
 the Mississippi under the immediate influence of Brandt A general 
 Council has been held in form, near Detroit, as long ago as last Decem- 
 ber, in which have been considered as grievances, our surveying over 
 the Ohio, the cessions being made by only parts of the Tribes having 
 rights in the ceded Tracts. Of these injuries or grievances they have 
 sent an united representation to Congress, requesting that a general 
 Treaty may be held. Perhaps this business may be directed by an 
 authority higher than that of Brandt, and should our titles to thejand 
 be compleat, it will still be better to spend a little money in Treating, 
 rather than expend a great deal in War, which from the generality of 
 the confederacy is seriously to be apprehended. This subject is now 
 under consideration. 
 
 As to the hostilities upon Kentucky, the superintendant of Indian 
 Affairs, or in case of his inability to go, Colo. Josiah Harmar, is ordered 
 to proceed immediately to some convenient place for holding a Treaty 
 with the hostile tribes, and by that means restore peace between them 
 and our people if practicable. In the meantime Col. Harmar is so to 
 post the Federal Troops as to provide the best defence for the Country, 
 and to call for such aids cf militia as he shall find necessary. Should 
 the Treaty not succeed report is to be made to Congress for their further
 
 28 
 
 orders, as to oflfensive operations. The state of the general confederacy 
 requires some care iu the directiou of this business. The desperate 
 state of things in the United Netherlands you see in the papers. . . . 
 
 Ed. Carsinotom. 
 
 REV. J. MADISON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 WiLLiAMSBCBo, 1 Augost, 1787. 
 Dear Col. — We are here, and I believe everywhere, all impatience 
 to know something of your conventional deliberations. If you cannot 
 tell us what you are doing, you might at least give us some rnformation 
 of what you are not doing. This would afford a clue for political con- 
 jecture, and perhaps be sufficient to satisfy present impatience. I hope 
 you have already discovered the means of preserving the American 
 Empire united, and that the scheme of a disunion has been found preg- 
 nant with the greatest evils. But we are not at this distance able to 
 judge with any accuracy upon subjects so truly important and interest- 
 ing as those which must engage you at present. We can only hope 
 that you will all resemble Caesar, at least in the particular ** nil actum 
 reputans si quid superesset agendum " ; and that your exertions will be 
 commensurate to the great expectations which have been formed. It is 
 probably my observations upon Mr. A's book must have appeared to 
 you to be hasty and undigested. I wish to know what you think of it. 
 Congress, I find, by a late ordinance establishing temporary govern- 
 ments in the new States, have adopted the Adamic idea. Would not 
 the other States be wise to wait for the issue of the experiment which 
 will there be made. We shall then have two important experiments 
 going on at the same time. The results of which may be the best 
 guide. . . . 
 
 J. Madison. 
 
 
 J. McCLURG TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 RicHMOxD, 5 Angast, 1787. 
 Dear Sir, — I am much obliged to you for your communication 
 of the proceedings of the Convention since I left them ; for I feel that 
 anxiety about y' result which its importance must give to every honest 
 citizen. If I thought that my return could contribute in the smallest 
 degree to its improvement nothing should keep me away. But as I 
 know that the talents, knowledge and well-established character of our 
 present delegates have justly inspired this country with ye most entire 
 confidence in their determinations ; and that my vote could only operate
 
 ^ 
 
 24 
 
 to produce a division, and bo destroy y* vote of y* State, I think that 
 my attendance now would certainly be useless, perhaps injurious. 
 
 I am credibly informed that Mr. Henry has openly expressed his 
 disapprobation of the circular letter of Congress respecting ye payment 
 of British debts ; and that he has declared his opinion that ye inleresta 
 of this State cannot safely be trusted with that body. The doctrine of 
 three confederacies, or great Republics, has its advocates here. I 
 have heard Harvie support it, along with y" extinction of State Legis- 
 latures within each great department. The necessity of some indepen- 
 dent power to controul the Assembly by a negative, seems now to be 
 admitted by y* most zealous republicans — they only differ about y* 
 mode of constituting such a power. B. Randolph seems to think that 
 a magistrate annually elected by the people might exercise such a con- 
 troul as independently as ye King of G. B. I hope that our representa- 
 tive Marshall will be a powerful aid to Mason in the next Assembly. He 
 has observed the continual depravation of men's manners, nnder ye cor- 
 rupting influence of our legislature ; and is convinced that nothing but 
 ye adoption of some efficient plan from ye Convention can prevent 
 anarchy first, and civil convulsions afterwards. Mr. H y has cer- 
 tainly converted a majority of Prince Edward, formerly the most averse 
 to paper money, to ye patronage of it. The opposers of this scheme 
 are generally favorers of installments, together with a total prohibition 
 of foreign luxuries ; that people having no temptation to spend their 
 money may devote it to justice. The importance of ye next Assembly, 
 with respect to so many objects of great public interest, makes one wish 
 most sincerely that Congress was deprived of you, at least for this session. 
 Mr. Jones has left town, on a pilgrimage to the Temple of health, 
 somewhere about ye Mountains. He had been very sick, but seemed 
 well enough recovered before he left us. . . . 
 
 James McClurg. 
 
 'j EDWARD CARRINGTON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 New Yoek, 11 August, 1787. 
 . . . The departure of North Carolina and Georgia left only 7 
 States, and the day before yesterday we lost another in the decamp- 
 ment of Doctor Holton, whose declining state of health obliged him to 
 retrograde. The Doctor is tolerably free from localities, and I am 
 sorry to lose him : but on account of the breaking up of Congress, we 
 have but little to regret, unless there had been an early prospect of 
 raising the number of States above 7, for with that number, I think, 
 there will never be a good act passed. All the Indian affairs still 
 remain to be acted upon, and many other things of great consequence. 
 The President has been requested to write to the States unrepresented, 
 
 \
 
 25 
 
 pressing upon them the ohjects which require the attendance of their 
 delegations, and urging tbera to come forward. Amongst those objects 
 is that of the report of the Convention, which it is supposed, is now in 
 the state of parturition. This bantling must receive the blessing of 
 Congress this session, or I fear it will expire before the new one will 
 assemble ; every experiment has its critical stages which must be taken 
 as they occur, or the whole will fail. The people's expectations are 
 rising with the progress of this work, but will desert it, should it 
 remain long with Congress. Permit me to suggest one idea as to the 
 mode of obtaining the accession of the States to the new plan of govern- 
 ment. Let the Convention appoint one day, say the 1st of May, upon 
 which a convention appointed by the people shall be held in each Stat«, 
 for the purpose of accepting or rejecting in toto the project. Suppos- 
 ing an act of the ordinary legislatures to be equally authentic, which 
 would not be true, yet many reasons present themselves in favor of 
 special conventions, ilany men would be admitted who are excluded 
 from the Legislatures, the business would be taken up unclogged with 
 any other ; and it would effectually call the attention of all the people to 
 the object as seriously affecting them. All the States being in Conven- 
 tion at the same time, opportunities of speculating upon the views of 
 each other would be cut off. The project should be decided upon with- 
 out an attempt to alter it. You have doubtless found it difficult to 
 reconcile the different opinions in your body. Will it not be impossible 
 then to reconcile those which will arise amongst numerous assemblies 
 in the different States ? It is possible there never may be a general 
 consent to the project as it goes out ; but it is absolutely certain there 
 will never be an agreement in amendments. It is the lot of but few to 
 be able to discern the remote principles upon which their happiness and 
 prosperity essentially depend. The many must be asked to consent to, 
 but not^ 
 
 J. McCLURG TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 22 Auguat, 1787. 
 
 ... I have still some hope that I shall hear from you of ye re- 
 instatement of ye negative, as it is certainly ye only means by which 
 the several legislatures can be restrained from disturbing ye order and 
 harmony of ye whole, and ye government rendered properly national 
 and one. 1 should suppose that some of its former opponents must by 
 this time have seen ye necessity of advocating it, if they wish to support 
 their own principles. 
 
 We have been informed from Green-bryar that a number of men in 
 that county, to the amount, it is said, of 300, have signed an Association 
 1 Rest of letter miasing. 
 
 r 
 I
 
 26 
 
 to oppose ye payment of ye certificate tax, and in general of all debta ; 
 and it is apprehended there, that they will attempt forcibly to stop ye 
 proceedings of ye next court The Ringleader of this riot, I apprehend 
 from ye length and sound of his Christian name, Adooijah Matthews 
 must have come from New England.* 
 
 A newspaper writer from Prince Edward, has promised to iovestigate 
 and expose ^e dangerous tendency, as well as unsoundness of John 
 
 Adam's doctrines — supposed by some to be Mr. H ^y. This book is 
 
 squibbed at in almost every paper ; but I have not heard that anybody 
 speaks of it with more acrimony than your namesake at Williamsburg. 
 
 "We have got the burner of one prison a Mr. Posey of N. Kent, 
 deposited in ye goal of this city. 
 
 James McClurg. 
 
 WILLIAM GRAYSON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 New York, 31 Augiwt, 1787. 
 
 . . . Judge Symmes of Jersey yesterday made an application for all 
 
 that tract of country lying between the Great and Little Miami, the 
 
 east and west line, and the Ohio, supposed about two millions of acres 
 
 on the same terms with the Eastern Ohio Company. His application has 
 
 met with the entire approbation of the members present : and there is no 
 
 doubt but as soon as there is a congress, that this contract will be closed. 
 
 ^.^^\- -A. Committee is appointed to draught an ordinance for indiscriminate 
 
 >» ^^/ locations, but a difficulty has occurred which I fear will destroy the 
 
 * * ' whole affair : the Committee don't know what the deficiency is on the 
 
 Cumberland River, and have figured to their timorous and suspicious 
 
 imaginations, that the Virginia officers and soldiers mean to take eight 
 
 or ten million of acres between the Scioto and Miami. The Committee 
 
 also contend that the State of Virginia should make proof of the de- 
 
 JJiciency of good lands on the Cumberiand ; should ascertain the quantity 
 I I they want and have a right to, on the northern side of the Ohio ; and 
 
 should then take that quantity in one Body. I wish you would speak 
 ^° o""" governor on the subject Perhaps it may be in his power 
 shortly to obtain information of the quantity claimed by the officers and 
 soldiers on the other side of the Ohio. If this fact was known, other 
 difficulties might perhaps be got over, as I apprehend it is not very 
 j ', considerable. ... 
 
 I W. Gratson. 
 
 f ^- ^' "T^e Mississippi is in a state of absolute dormification. 
 
 1 " Adonijah MatthewB, of whose turbulent attempts I informed jou, U said 
 teiXrnSL '" ^'^ ^"^ °^ Green-brjar." McClurg to MadUon. 6 Sep-.
 
 27 
 
 JAMES McCLDRQ TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 10 September, 1787. 
 
 . . . The report of a tendency to insurrection in several quarters of 
 the State is not without some foundation ; tho' the friends of order 
 have hitherto maintained ye superiority so as to prevent any very 
 outrageous doings. An expectation of a remedy for their discontents, 
 well or ill-founded, from ye next assembly, assists in keeping them 
 quiet. 
 
 There is said to be a disposition generally prevalent thro' this State 
 to comply with ye plan of ye Convention without much scrutiny. 
 Hervey, who has been in Albemarle lately, says that Nicholas is de- 
 termined to support it, however contrary it may be to his own opinions. 
 I am persuaded that those who sacrifice solid and permanent advantages 
 in this plan, to their idea of the transitory disposition of the people, 
 will condemn themselves hereafter. . . . 
 
 James McCluro. 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 [13 September, 1787.] i 
 Dkar Sir, — Although I wanted materials for a letter, I should have 
 dropped you a few lines had I not been absent for some time from 
 Fredericksburg, and had I not been informed the convention would 
 certainly rise the first week of this month. 
 
 The continuance of your session and some stories I have heard since 
 my return and on my visit to Alexandria, make me apprehensive 
 there is not that unanimity in your councils I hoped for and had 
 been taught to believe. From whence it originated I know not, 
 but it is whispered here, there is great disagreement among the gentle- 
 men of our delegation, that the general and yourself on a very im- 
 portant question were together, Mr. M n alone and singular in his 
 
 opinion and the other two gentlemen holding different sentiments. I 
 asked what was the question in dispute, and was answered that it 
 respected either the defect in constituting the Convention as not pro- 
 ceeding immediately from the people, or the referring the proceedings 
 of the body to the people for ultimate decision and confirmation.' My 
 informant also assured me the fact might be relied on as it came, as he 
 expressed it, from the fountain head. I took the liberty to express my 
 disbelief of the fact and that from the circumstances related it was very 
 
 ' Madison's indorsement. 
 
 2 Mason's position is shown in Madison's letter to Jefferson of 24 October, 
 1787. Of the Virginia delegation Wythe and McCiurg had left the Conventioa 
 before the Constitution was completed, and Randolph and Mason refused to sign.
 
 I 
 
 ^-'1?/ 
 
 28 
 
 improbable and unworthy attention. I mention this matter for want 
 of something else to write to you, and more especially as it respects our 
 delegation in particular. 
 
 I shall towards the last of the month, if not sooner, visit the lower 
 part of Potomack aud Rappahannock — a route the reverse of what I 
 some time ago inteuded ; but I am desired by the Executive to visit the 
 naval offices and searchers in that quarter. I hope this business will in 
 future be placed under the direction of another power, I mean the 
 regulation of oar trade. 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 New Yoek, 23 September, 1787. 
 
 Mt dear Sir, — The gentlemen who have arrived from the Con- 
 vention inform us that you are on the way to join us. Least, however, 
 you may, under a supposition that the state of the delegation is such as 
 to admit of your absence, indulge yourself in leisurely movements, after 
 the fatiguing time you have had, I take this precaution to apprise you 
 that the same schism which unfortunately happened in our State in 
 Philadelphia, threatens us here also. One of our colleagues, Mr. R. H. 
 Lee, is forming propositions for essential alterations in the Constitution, 
 which will, in effect, be to oppose it. Another, Mr. Grayson, dislikes 
 it, and is, at best, for giving it only a silent passage to the States. Mr. 
 H. Lee joins me in opinion that it ought to be warmly recommended 
 to ensure its adoption. A lukewarmness in Congress will be made a 
 ground of opposition by the unfriendly in the States. Those who have 
 hitherto wished to bring the conduct of Congress into contempt, will in 
 this case be ready to declare it truly respectable. 
 
 Next Wednesday is fixed for taking under consideration this business, 
 and I ardently wish you could be with us. 
 
 The New York faction is rather active in spreading the seeds of 
 opposition. This however has been expected, and will not make an 
 impression so injurious as the same circumstance would in other States. 
 Col. Hamilton has boldly taken his ground in the public papers, and 
 having truth and propriety on his side, it is to be hoped he will stem 
 the torrent of folly and iniquity. 
 
 I do not implicitly accede in sentiment to every article of the scheme 
 proposed by the Convention, but I see not how my utmost wishes are 
 to be gratified until I can withdraw from society. So long as I find 
 it necessary to combine my strength and interests with others, I must 
 be satisfied to make some sacrifices to the general accommodation. I 
 am, &c 
 
 Ed. Carrinoton. 
 
 K ■i
 
 29 
 
 J. DAWSON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Frbdrsickbbuko, 25 September, 1787. 
 
 . . . The proceedings of the Convention have been forwarded by 
 Mr. Randolph, to Mess. Mercer and Monroe, and are at this moment 
 the subject of general conversation in every part of the town, and will 
 soon be in every quarter of the State. Opinions have already been 
 delivered, and that work, which was the production of much labor and 
 time, has been iu a few hours either damned or applauded, according to 
 the wish, sentiments or interest of the politician. Altho' there are 
 many warm friends to the plan, be assured that the opposition will be 
 powerful. Our old friend, the Col. from Frederick, will, I think, be 
 much alarmed, and will not fail to paiut his fears in strong colors. I 
 also thiuk the powerful member from P. E. will be unfriendly. A 
 report is circulated that some few days since the people of that county 
 (P. E.) were assembled, and harangued by Mr. H. in favor of a paper 
 currency. That a Mr. Smith of the Academy, opposed the scheme, 
 that on a decision a large majority coincided with Mr. Smith. That 
 !Mr. Smith then recommended to them the adoption of whatever should 
 be done in convention ; to which they agreed. That Mr. H. informed 
 them, that they should no longer consider him as their representative. 
 
 The improbability of this report is sufficient to destroy its authen- 
 ticity, although it comes well supported, and I think we may recelTe 
 it in part. . . . 
 
 J. Dawson. 
 
 BENJAMIN HARRISON TO GEORGE WASHINGTON. 
 
 Bekkelbt, 4 October, 1787. 
 My dear Sir, — Your favor of the 28th ult° got to me two days ago: 
 I am particularly obligd to you for this additional mark of your friend- 
 ship, and attention, than which, there are very few things indeed, that 
 can be more acceptable : I feel my self deeply interested in every thing 
 that you have had a hand in, or that comes from you, and am so well 
 assured of the solidity of your judgment, and the rectitude of your inten- 
 tions, that 1 shall never stick at trifles to conform myself to your opin- 
 ions; in the present instance, I am so totally uninform'd as to the 
 general situation of America, that I can form no judgment of the neces- 
 sity the convention was under to give us such a constitution as it has 
 done : If our condition is not very desperate, I have my fears that the 
 remedy will prove worse than the disease. Age makes men often over 
 cautious ; I am willing to attribute my fears to that cause, but from 
 whatever source they spring, I can not divest myself of an opinion, that 
 the seeds of civil discord are plentifully sown, in very many of the
 
 
 
 j.j^''''<7 
 
 \m 
 
 h i 
 
 11 
 
 1, 
 
 30 
 
 powers given both to the president and congress, and that if the con- 
 stitution is carried into effect, the states south of Potowmac, will be little 
 more than appendages to those to the northward of it. You will say 
 that general charges are things without force, they are so, but in the 
 present instance, I do not withhold particular observations, because 1 
 want them, but that I would not tire your patience, by entering deeply 
 into a subject, before I had heard the reasons which operated with them, 
 in favor of their measures, I will then more at large give you my senti- 
 ments, in the interim, I shall only say, that my objections chiefly lay 
 ag"' the unlimited powers of taxation, and the regulations of trade, and 
 the jurisdictions that sre to be established in every State, altogether 
 independent of tlieir laws. The sword, and such powers will; nay in 
 the nature of things they must sooner or later, establish a tyranny, not 
 inferiour to the triumvirate, or centum viri of Rome. But enough of 
 this, till another opportunity, in the meantime I have only to add, that 
 I am with the most unfeigned attachment, and perfect esteem, &c. 
 
 Benj. Harrison. 
 
 GEORGE MASON TO GEORGE WASHINGTON. 
 
 GcNSTON Hall, 7 October, 1787. 
 
 ... I take the Liberty to enclose you my Objections to the new 
 Constitution of Government ; which a little Moderation and Temper, iu 
 the latter End of the Convention, might have removed. I am however 
 most decidedly of Opinion, that it ought to be submitted to a Conven- 
 tion chosen by the People, for that special Purpose ; and shoo'd any 
 attempt be made to prevent the calling such a Convention here, such a 
 Measure shall have every opposition in my Power to give it. 
 
 You will readily observe, that my Objections are not numerous (the 
 greater Part of the enclosed Paper containing reasonings upon the 
 probable effects of the exceptionable Parts) tho' in my mind, some of 
 them are capital ones. . . . 
 
 6. Mason. 
 
 PATRICK HENRY TO GEORGE WASHINGTON. 
 
 Richmond, 19 October, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — I was honor'd by the Rec'. of your Favor together 
 with a Copy of the proposed foederal Constitution, a few Days ago, 
 for which I beg you to accept my thanks. They are also due to you 
 from me as a Citizen, on account of the great Fatigue necessarily 
 attending the arduous Business of the late Convention. 
 
 I have to lament that I cannot bring my mind to accord with the 
 proposed Constitution. The Concern I feel on this account, is really
 
 31 
 
 greater than I am able to express. Perhaps mature Reflection may 
 furnish me Reasons to change my present Sentiments into a conformity 
 with the opinions of those personages for whom I have the highest 
 Reverence. Be that as it may, I beg you will be perswaded of the 
 unalterable Regard & attachment with which I ever shall be, Dear Sir, 
 your obliged and very humble servant, 
 
 P. Henbt. 
 
 \ 
 
 J. DAWSON TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 19 October, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — Your favor of the 2nd instant I received in due time. 
 Before this I presume you have heard that one hundred and five mem- 
 bers attended at the state house on the first day. Whether this is to 
 be attributed to the ten pounds, or to a proper sense of duty, I leave * 
 with you to determine — perhaps to both. On motion of Col. Mat- 
 thews, seconded by Mr. B. Harrison, Mr. Prentis was called to the 
 chair without any opposition. On the Wednesday, the Senate elected 
 Mr. Jones their speaker. A number of papers have been laid before 
 the house by the executive, among them are the proceedings of the 
 Convention, as forwarded by Congress. 
 
 On Thursday next we are to go into a committee of the whole house 
 on this business. Altho' the constitution offered has some able oppo- 
 nents, yet there is a decided majority in favor of it. There will be no 
 opposition, I think, to a state convention, for it appears to be the gen- 
 eral opinion that the legislature ought to send the constitution to the 
 people without any mark either of censure or approbation. I enclose 
 you a paper in which you will find a piece said, with truth I believe, 
 to be written by Col. Mason. He is not yet arrived, but is hourly 
 expected. 
 
 The system of politicks this year will I apprehend be too much like 
 that of the last. Mr. Nicholas has already declared in favor of scaling 
 the provision certificates by permitting the people to pay their certificate 
 tax by a fourth of the sura in specie. On Tuesday the appointment 
 of Delegates to Congress will take place. I suspect Mr. Harrison, Col. 
 Bland and Mr. Corbin will be brought forward. 
 
 The freeholders of Fairfax have, in the most pointed terms, directed 
 Col. Mason to vote for a convention, and have as pointedly assured 
 him he shall not be in it. With much respect, &c 
 
 J. Dawson. 
 
 [ <
 
 J 
 
 I 
 
 ^ 
 
 32 
 
 ARCHIBALD STUART TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 21 October, 1787. 
 Dear Sir, — Contrary to custom we had a house of Delegates on 
 the 15th inst: and proceeded to road the governor's letter with its en- 
 closures. We have resolved to discontinue the additional tax of 6/ pr. 
 hhd. on tobacco exported ; to amend the militia law by furnishing the 
 militia with public arms, and by annexing to each battalion of infantry 
 a small troop of horse, to be raised by voluntary enlistment and ac- 
 coutred at their own expense. 
 
 The language from every quarter of ye House is ye necessity of al- 
 leviating the publick burthens, and at the same time supporting the 
 publick credit and ye certificate tax, our only sinking fund, I fear, will 
 cease, and those in the hands of the holders be added to ye mass of our 
 funded debt. 
 
 Next Thursday is set apart for adopting the necessary measures for 
 calling a Convention on ye subject of ye federal Constitution. From 
 the disposition of some of ye members I fear it will be difficult to exe- 
 cute that business without entering into ye merits of ye Constitution 
 itself. 
 
 Mr. Henry has upon all occasions, however foreign in subject, at- 
 tempted to give the Constitution a side blow. Its friends are equally 
 '7> . . warm in its support and never fail to pursue him through all his wind- 
 
 jj_^J»!^ K ings. From what I can learn the body of the people approve ye pro- 
 
 * posed plan of government. It has, however, no contemptible opposition. 
 
 ,^ Our two dissenting members in ye Gen'l convention, P. H.?, ye family 
 
 of Cabells, St. Geor' Tucker, J. Taylor, \V. Nelson, Gen'l Nelson, W. 
 Ronald, I fear, ye Judges I am told except P. Carrington, and others 
 too tedious and at the same time, too insignificant to mention. 
 ) The doctrine of installments is once more to be the subject of debate, 
 
 * . and a clog to ye district bill an incumbrance which I fear will again 
 
 (damn that important measure. 
 We have had notice that a commutation of tobacco for specie in pay- 
 t • ^ ment of taxes will be proposed, ye result of which you shall shortly 
 
 !{ know. 
 
 Would it be proper that the ensuing convention should also reform 
 our State constitution. Ye objections to these innovations are that in 
 ye mean time the minds of men are agitated, and government unhinged, 
 and as we are about to encounter this and every other objectipn, would 
 not the present be ye most favorable crisis for this important business. 
 I am, Sir, &c. 
 
 Arch? Stuart.
 
 S3 
 
 i 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 New York, 28 October, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — I Lave been honoured with your favor of the 4* of 
 August. Inclosed you will receive a copy of the report of our late 
 federal Convention, which presents, not amendments to the old confed- 
 eration, but an entire new constitution. This work b short of the ideas 
 I had the honor to communicate to you in June, in no other inBtanoe 
 than an absolute negative upon the State laws. 
 
 When the report was before Congress it was not without its direct 
 opponents, but a great majority were for giving it a warm approbation. 
 It was thonght best, however, by its friends, barely to recommend to 
 the several legislatures the holding of conventions for its consideration, 
 rather than send it forth with even a single negative to an approbatory 
 act. The people do not scrutinize terms. The unanimity of Congress 
 in recommending a measure to their consideration, naturally implies 
 approbation, but any negative to a direct approbation, would have dis- 
 covered a dissension, which would have been used to favor divisions in 
 the St ites. It certainly behoved Congress to give a measure of such 
 importance, and resf)ectable birth, a chance in the deliberations of the 
 people, and I think the step taken in that body well adapted to this 
 idea. 
 
 The project is warmly received in the Eastern States, and has 
 become pretty generally a subject of consideration in Town meetings, 
 and other Assemblies of the people ; the usual result whereof, are 
 declarations for its adoption. In the Middle States appearances are 
 generally for it, but not being in habits of assembling for public objects, 
 as is the case to the Eastward, the people have given but few instances 
 of collective declarations. Some symptoms of opposition have appeared 
 in New York and Pennsylvania. In the former only in individual 
 publications, which are attended with no circumstances evidencing the 
 popular regard ; the Governor holds himself in perfect silence, wishing, 
 it is suspected, for a miscarriage, but is not confident enough to commit 
 himself in an open opposition. In the latter the opposition has assumed 
 a form somewhat more serious, but under circumstances which leave it 
 doubtful whether it is founded in objections to the project, or the 
 intemperance of its more zealous friends. The Legislature was in 
 session in Philadelphia when the Convention adjourned. 42 members 
 were for immediately calling a Convention, before the measure had 
 received the consideration of Congress, and were about to press a vote 
 fur that purpose. 19 seceded and broke up the House, and although 
 they afterwards added to their protest against the intemperance of the 
 majority, some objections against the report, yet it is to be doubted 
 whether they would have set themselves in opposition to it had more 
 
 S 
 
 J
 
 34 
 
 -<7r- 
 
 iisf^-^C:/ 
 
 i«^ 
 
 
 i : 
 
 
 moderation been used. The next morning the resolution of Congress 
 arrived, upon which the 42, wanting 2 to compleat a House for business, 
 sent their sergeant for so many of the seceders, who were brought by 
 force. Whereupon an act was passed for calling a convention in 
 November. The seceders are from the upper countries ; have carried 
 their discontents home with them, and some of them being men of influ- 
 ence will occasion an inconvenience. But gentlemen well acquainted 
 with the country are of opinion that their opposition will have no exten- 
 sive effect, as there is, in general, a coalescence of the two parties, 
 which have divided that state ever since the birth of her own constitu- 
 tion, in support of the new government. From the Southern States 
 we are but imperfectly informed. Every member from the Carolinas 
 and Georgia, as well in convention, as Congress, are warm for the new 
 constitution ; and when we consider the ascendency possessed by men 
 of this description over the people in those States, it may well be con- 
 cluded that the reception will be favorable. In Virginia there may be 
 some difficulty. Two of her members in Convention, whose characters 
 entitle them to the public confidence, refused to sign the report. These 
 were Colo. Mason and Governor Randolph; nor was that State with- 
 out its dissentients, of the same description in Congress. These were 
 Mr. R. H. Lee and Mr. Grayson, but upon very opposite principles; 
 the former, because it is too strong ; the latter, because it is too weak, 
 [and Colo. H. Lee is by no means an advocate.^] The Governor has 
 declared that his refusal to sign shall not be followed by hostility against 
 the measure ; that his wish is to get the exceptionable parts altered if 
 practicable ; but if not, that he will join in its support from the necessity 
 of the case. 
 
 Mr. Madison writes you fully upon the objections from Virginia, and 
 therefore I will not impose on your patience by repeating them ; one, 
 however, being merely local, and an old source of jealousy, I will present 
 to your consideration my opinion upon. This is the ability of a bare 
 majority in the federal government to regulate commerce. It is sup- 
 posed a majority of the union are carriers, and that it will be for the 
 interest and in the power of that majority to form regulations oppress- 
 ing, by high freights, the agricultural States. It does not appear to me, 
 that this objection is well founded. In the first place it is not true that 
 the majority are carriers, for Jersey and Connecticut who fall into the 
 division, are by [no] means such. And New York and Pennsylvania, 
 who also are within that division, are as much agricultural as carrying 
 States : but, admitting the first position to be true, I do not see that 
 the supposed consequences would follow. No regulation could be made 
 on other than general and uniform principles. In that case every 
 created evil would effect its own cure. The southern States possess 
 * Struck oat in the original. 

 
 36 
 
 more materials for shipping than the Eastern, and if they do not follow 
 
 the carrying business it is because thej are occupied in more lucrative 
 
 pursuits. A rise of freights would make that an object, and they would 
 
 readily turn to it; but the competition amongst the Eastern States 
 
 themselves would be sufficient to correct every abuse. A navigation 
 
 act ouj;ht doubtless to be passed for giving exclusive benefits to Ameri- 
 can sliips. This would, of course, serve the Eastern States, and such 
 
 in justice ought to be the case, as it may perhaps be that no other 
 
 advantage can result to them from the Revolution. Indeed it is 
 
 important to the interests of the Southern States that the growth of 
 
 a navy be promoted, for the security of that wealth which is to be 
 
 derived from their agriculture. 
 
 My determination to join in the adoption results from compound 
 
 consideration of the measure itself, the probable issue of another 
 
 attempt, and the critical state of our affairs. It lias in my mind great 
 
 faults ; but the formers of it met under powers and dispositions which 
 
 promised greater accommodation in their deliberations than can be 
 
 expected to attend any future convention. The particular interests 
 of States are exposed and future disputations would be clogged with 
 distractions and biassed by the presentiments of their constituents. 
 Hence it is fairly to be concluded that this is a better scheme than 
 can be looked for from another experiment. On these considerations 
 I would clearly be for closing with it, and relying upon the correction 
 of its faults, as experience may dictate the necessary alterations; but 
 when I extend my view to that approaching anarchy which nothing but 
 the timely interposition of a new government can avert, I am doubly 
 urged in my wishes for the adoption. 
 
 Some gentlemen apprehend that this project is the foundation of a 
 monarchy, or at least an oppressive aristocracy ; but my apprehensionb 
 are rather from the inroads of the democracy. It is true there is a 
 preposterous combination of powers in the President and Senate, which 
 
 may be used improperly ; but time is to discover whether the tendency k^ 
 
 of abuse will be to strengthen or relax. At all events this part of the 
 Constitution must be exceptionable ; but when we consider the degree 
 of democracy of which the scheme itself partakes, with the addition of 
 that which will be constantly operating upon it, it clearly appears to 
 my mind, that the prevailing infractions are to be expected from 
 thence. As state acts can go into effect without the direct control of 
 the general government, having clearly defined the objects of their 
 legislation, will not secure the federal ground against their encroach- 
 ments, a disposition to encroach must in the nature of the thing exist, 
 and the democratic branch in the federal legislature, will be more 
 likely to cover their approaches, thau resist them. 
 
 The Western Territory belonging to the United States has more
 
 36 
 
 X' effectually received the attention of Congress daring this session tban 
 
 • . it ever did before. Inclosed you will receive the ordinance for estab- 
 
 f lishing a temporary government there, and providing for its more easy 
 
 ' passage into permanent state governments. Under the old arrangements 
 
 the country might upon the whole have become very populous, and yet 
 be inadmissible to the rights of state government, which would have 
 ' been disgusting to them and ultimately inconvenient for the Kmpire. 
 
 Ij The new arrangement depends on the accession of Virginia, which 
 
 i there can be no doubt of obtaining. The offices of the T. government 
 
 } are filled up as follows: Genl. St. Clair, Govf, Winthrop Sargent, 
 
 1 Secretary, Gen'l Parsons, Gen' Armstrong, Jr, and Gen'l. Varnum, 
 
 I Judges. 
 
 I Seven ranges of townships are surveyed; they extend nearly to 
 
 I Muskingum and contain about 12 or 15 million of acres. About 
 
 ' ■ 130,000 acres have been sold according to the Ordinance. The sur- 
 
 •' veys will probably go no further in strict pursuance of the ordinance, 
 
 , but still the system will be preserved in the conditions of contracts for 
 
 J large tracts of the country, to companies of adventurers. The first 
 
 /■ instance of this mode presents itself in an authority to the Treasury 
 
 Board in August last, to contract with a large company of New Eng- 
 landers for all the country from the seventh range to Scioto, within a 
 due west line to be continued from the northern boundary of the tenth 
 I Township. The whole of this tract is supposed to contain about 5 
 
 millions of acres. The terms are that the U. S. shall survey and 
 ^^^ ^ demark the external boundaries, and ascertain the contents of the 
 
 ' '' tract. The Company to lay it out at their own expence, into town- 
 
 ships and sections agreeably to the ordinance, subject to the reserves 
 therein described, except that one of the sections for future sale, shall 
 be granted for the purposes of religion, and there are also two com- 
 plete townships granted for an University in or near the middle of the 
 tract. All other lands, good, bad and indifferent, to be paid for at 
 2/3<^ of a dollar per acre, half in securities, excluding the interest, half 
 a million of dollars to be paid down upon closing the contract, and 
 possession taken so far as such payment will cover. Afterwards pay- 
 ment and occupancy are to go on pari passu at certain periods, under 
 certain stipulations of reciprocal insurance. This contract is now actu- 
 ally closed. Another offer is made by Judge Symes and his associates 
 from Jersey, for about 2 millions between the Miami's, upon the same 
 terms, and sundry other propositions are forming. Whereupon Con- 
 gress have authorized the Treasury Board to &e\\ by contract any 
 quantity not less than a million, making the terms of the Eastern 
 company the ground, with deviations from the grant for an University, 
 and those for religion, unless the tract be equally large. This mode 
 of sale will relieve the U. S. of much expence, and the progress of 
 
 i^*»*
 
 37 
 
 Bales promises to be sufficiently rapid to give our people early relief 
 from the pressure of the domestic debt. 
 
 I am iDclined to believe that some successful experimeut might be 
 made for the sale [of] a part of this territory in Europe, and have 
 suggested a trial with a few ranges of the surveyed Townships. It 
 did not strike Congress as eligible and of course no step was taken 
 in it. I do not suppose it would be worth while to try the project on 
 any but lands actually surveyed and well described. 
 
 We have received no accounts from Europe since your August de- 
 spatches ; of course the state of things there are in considerable obscurity 
 as to us. 
 
 Your remarks upon the French loan have occasioned some discussion 
 in Congress, but many' reasons operate to prevent an assent to your 
 proposition. By some it is supposed it would be found inconvenient 
 to shift from creditors that will not complain of our delinquency, to 
 those that will ; by others that we have reason to rely upon the indul- 
 gence of France in the case of a debt which .was contracted for the 
 common benefit of the two nations. My own opinion is that the trans- 
 fer ought to be made, if practicable. 
 
 Ed. Carbinoton. 
 
 DANIEL CARROLL TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Near Geobgetowk, 28 October, 1787. 
 
 ... If the information I have received relating to this State can be 
 depended on, everything I hope will be right. Mr. Carroll, who 
 waited for me, soon after saw Mr. Johnson, and sends me word that he 
 is a warm friend. That Gentleman, Mess. Lee and Potts, were chosen 
 the following week representatives, with a view principally of prevent- 
 ing mischief and forwarding this great object. Mr. Chase has, I hear, 
 publi^hed a piece under the signature of Caution, which indicates an 
 adverse disposition. He has bound himself to propose a convention ; 
 and if chosen of that body will be bound to ratify the proposed federal 
 government; the impression in Baltimore being strong and general in 
 favor of it. 
 
 The General informed me that Mr. Houston bad called on him in 
 his way to Georgia, and told him that Mr. Yates (of the Convention) 
 had declared himself a warm friend. Is this so ? 
 
 Col. Mason had no. set off for the assembly when I heard last I 
 overtook him and the Major on the road. By the time they had 
 reached within 9 miles of Baltimore, they had exhausted all the stories 
 of their youth &c., and had entered into a discussion of the rights to 
 the Western World. You know they are champions on opposite sides 
 
 448997
 
 li! 
 
 r 
 
 > ■'. 
 
 i 
 
 ^ 
 
 38 
 
 of this question. The Major having pushed the Col. hard on the 
 charters of Virginia, the latter had just waxed warm, when his char- 
 ioteer put an end to the dispute by jumbling their honors together by 
 an overset. I came up soon after. They were both hurt. The Col. 
 most 80. He lost blood at Baltimore, and is well. . . . 
 
 Dam'l Cakroll. 
 
 CHRISTOPHER GADSDEN TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 Charleston, 29* October, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — My friend Mr. Izard favored me with a sight of yours 
 
 to him of the 18*!" JsovT and first of Aug! last, together with MT de 
 
 Calonne's and les S? Jean Jaques Berard &. Co.'s letters to you, the 
 
 u first dated 22*? October 1786, encouraging from authority the opening 
 
 and fixing a general trade with the United States, the other proposing 
 
 a plan of mutual commerce between this place and France, particularly 
 
 respecting rice, which I have read with great pleasure and attention, 
 
 i wishing it to be carried into execution. From this opening, and the 
 
 honor I had to labor with you formerly in the political vineyard, I take 
 
 the freedom to congratulate you on the noble constitution agreed upon 
 
 by our late convention, and farther, on its seeming to give general 
 
 satisfaction, from whence 't is hardly doubted it will be adopted ; if so, 
 
 and it is firmly and efficiently carried into execution, a new and impor- 
 
 i ' t^^'T^' * tant epocha must arise in our affairs. The apprehensions strangers 
 
 '**^' \ ' were under for some time past discouraging them from dealing with 
 
 - us so largely as many wished, will then diminish greatly, and in a ^hort 
 
 "^ time cease altogether, as our trade would soon be on a safe, proper and 
 
 resj>ectable footing, uusubjected in future to frauds from paper tenders, 
 
 and other too common, unjustifyable practices from unprincipled D? 
 
 very prejudicial to their C". Besides this advantage a diminution of 
 
 that pernicious partiality to the British trade will in my opinion follow 
 
 I of course. The number of foreigners that will from other than inter- 
 
 |i ested mercantile views frequent us, will soon tend to open the eyes of 
 
 J our countrymen thoroughly to their own interest, and to see with 
 
 (, astonishment to what a paltry customer we have been so long and 
 
 losingly attached, and that maugre all their sophistry, that the trade 
 of France and Germany are of ten times the consequence to this State 
 than theirs, and therefore ought by prudent traders to have ten times 
 more attention. All the States may be said to be shopkeepers, and 
 what folly for any to give the preference to that nation that is of the 
 least importance to them, that consumes the smallest quantity of their 
 produce, which witli regard to our chief staple, rice, is the case of Great 
 Britain, who though they have made peace, are manifestly far from. 
 
 *'
 
 39 
 
 being cordial friends with us. If France at this crisis, continaed her 
 encouragemeuts, fix and support proper shifting ports similar to that 
 of Cowes, attentively despatching our rice ships, she will in no long 
 time, from the advantage of her being so almost infinitely a greater 
 consumer of that article than G' B?, thin the business to that Harbor, 
 and in a few years dwindle it to nothing. But attention and patience 
 in commencement are everything. 
 
 From what I have learned, the French merchants we have had here, 
 have been as impolitic in their method of introducing a trade with U8, 
 as most of our people in trying the like with the new markets opened 
 to us since the peace. We, besides the infatuation of giving the British 
 the preference of our direct consignments to their island, have as 
 stupidly, or more so, even in our few essays to other markets, suffered 
 them to be conducted under their auspices. 'Tis natural and com- 
 mendable for all powers to give a preference to their own subjects, bat 
 on new trials, of trade especially, quaery whether the end would not be 
 sooner, more effectually, and generally come at and fixed, by employing 
 men of the place, of established character and experience, unsuspected 
 of any improper bias to the British interest, well acquainted with the 
 nature and quality of the articles most suitable and wanted, for a few 
 years than for a new adventurer speaking a different language, to con- 
 duct himself through the medium of such an interpreting clerk as he 
 cin pick up; but this has been the method generally used here by the 
 French merchants, and 'tis thought the cause of many of the losses 
 and disgusts they have experienced. Few people, ours particularly, 
 like to close their bargains but with the principals. This city does not 
 want for many houses of this character mentioned, among others 
 Messrs Brailsford & Morris are well established here, both natives of 
 the United States, the first of this city, the other of Philadelphia. Mr. 
 Morris I am nearly connected with as having married my daughter, 
 and should be happy to be the means of recommending that House to 
 any unengaged Friends. 
 
 I make no doubt the philosophic part of Europe will admire the 
 constitution recommended by our convention, the trading part of 
 G' B°, perhaps many of them, may be jealous of it considered in a 
 commercial view in its probable consequences to them by increasing 
 the means of opening the eyes of America and exposing many rooted 
 prejudices to them particularly. I have little doubt ^ that part of the 
 Island who so generally and pointedly hung upon our skirts during the 
 
 ^ Those subtil, dextrous, long trained, svstematical opponents well knowing 
 the constitution recommended must be approved of in toto, or not at all, there- 
 fore would seem to approve of it as highly as any the most zealous for it, onlj 
 with an all but which but altered, would gain they would pretend universal satia- 
 faction, that it may be deferred for that mighty reasonable But, to another con- 
 vention, hoping that will never happen, and so the bubble burst of coarse. 

 
 'ji 
 
 I 40 
 
 \ "I 
 
 i'.i 
 
 ; t 
 
 p-1 
 
 whole war will not be less busy on this occasion. For my part I bless 
 God to have lived to see this important point in so fair a way to be 
 accomplished, and if I live to see it completely so, I shall be apt to cry 
 out with old Simeon, " Now may thy servant depart in peace, for mine 
 eyes have seen thy salvation." . . . 
 
 Chris : Gadsden. 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 RiCHMOHD, 29 October, 1787. 
 i J ; = Dear Sir, — On my arrival in Richmond the other day I found 
 
 ' your favor of the T'.*" from New York, with some newspapers inclosed. 
 
 Mr. Thomas Pleasants who called on me the next day inquired whether 
 I had lately heard from you, which being acknowledged brought for- 
 ^ ward a conversation on the new constitution, and finding him a strenu- 
 
 ;' I ous advocate for it I asked if he had seen or read some pieces in favor 
 
 «• . 1- of it under the signature of au American citizen. He said he had not. 
 
 I '. I then informed him I had received some papers frotu you, which con- 
 
 tained three numbers on the subject and did not doubt he would be 
 pleased with the perusal of them ; whereupon he signified his desire to 
 possess them. When I delivered them to him I told him it would not 
 I thought be amiss they were put into the printer's hands, that be 
 might, if he thought proper, insert them in the newspaper here. He 
 said he would tliink of it, and I have not seen him since. I shall 
 speak to him on the subject as soon as I meet with him, but have no 
 doubt he will endeavour to have them printed. 
 
 I must confess I see many objections to the constitution submitted 
 to the conventions of the States. That which has the greatest weight 
 with me lies against the constitution of the Senate, which being both 
 legislative and executive, and in some respects judiciary, is I think 
 
 (radically bad. The President and the Senate too may in some instances 
 ', legislate for the Union, without the concurrence of the popular branch, 
 
 : i ^ ^^^y ™ay make treaties and alliances which when made are to be 
 
 }l • paramount [with] the law of the land. The State spirit will also be 
 
 J; preserved in the Senate, as they are to have equal numbere and equal 
 
 votes. It is to be feared this body united with the President, as on 
 most occasions it is to be presumed they will act in concert, will be an 
 overmatch for the popular branch. Had the Senate been merely legis- 
 ative even proportioned as they are to the States, it would have been 
 less exceptionable ; and the President with a member from each State 
 as a privy council to have composed the Executive. There is also a 
 strong objection against the appellate jurisdiction over law and fact, 
 independent of a variety of other objections, which are and may be 
 raised against the judiciary arrangements, and the undefined powers of
 
 41 
 
 that Department. I own I should have been pleased to see a declara- 
 tion of rights accompany this constitution, as there is so much in the 
 execution of the government to be provided for by the legislature, and 
 that body possessing too great assertion of aristocracy. The legislature 
 mav, and will probably make proper and wise regulations in the judi- 
 ciary, as in the execution of that branch of power the citizens of all 
 the States will generally be equally affected. But the reflection that 
 there exists in the constitution a power that may oppress, makes the 
 mind uneasy, and that oppression may and will result from the appellate 
 power of unsettling facts does to me appear beyond a doubt. To 
 rehearse the doubts and ditficulties that arise in my mind when I 
 reflect on this part of the judiciary power would I am sure to you be 
 unnecessary. 
 
 It would be more troublesome than useful to recite the variety of 
 objections that some raise ; some of more, others of inconsiderable 
 weif^ht. Could I see a change in the constitution of the Senate and 
 the right of unsettling facts removed from the Court of Appeals, I ^ . 
 
 could with much less reluctance yield ray assent to the system. I could 
 wish, 1 own, to see some other alterations take place, but for the accom- 
 plishment of them, I would trust to time and the wisdom and modera- 
 tion of the legislature, rather than impede the putting the new plan in 
 motion, was it in my power, because I well know our desperate situa- 
 tion under the present form of government. It is at this time very 
 diflficult to inform you what is the prevalent opinion among the people. 
 If we are to judge of them at large from their representatives here, they 
 must be very much divided and I think the advocates for the new plan 
 rather diminish than increase in number. You will have from the 
 Executive an account of the proceedings of the Houses on the report 
 of the Convention. I think they have taken a wise course in delivering 
 it over to the people without conveying sentimentfi of approbation or 
 disapprobation. At present nothing of consequence except the refer- 
 rincr to the people the new constitution has beer done in the Assembly. 
 Tomorrow they are to discuss the recommendation of Congress respect- 
 ing British debts. I think there will be a majority in the delegates 
 for the repeal of the laws. How it will go down in the Senate, 
 I am unable to calculate. You shall be occasionally informed how 
 
 we go on. 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 A. DONALD TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 Richmond, 12 November, 1787. 
 Dkar Sir, — Many thanks to you for your very friendly and polite 
 letter of the 28f' July.
 
 ill 
 
 
 42 
 
 You will DO doubt have seen before this time the result of the delib- 
 erations of the Convention, which was assembled at Philadelphia last 
 summer for revising and amending the Federal Constitution. I am 
 sorry to say it is like to meet with strong opposition in this State, at 
 this moment, but believe that a great majority of the people approve 
 of it, but I can easily conceive that interested men will do everything 
 in their power, between this and the electing of our State convention, 
 to poison the minds of the people, and get them perswaded to give their 
 votes to such gentlemen as they knaw are decidedly against the adop- 
 tion of the new constitution. I will not presume to be competent 
 to give an opinion on such a complex subject, but I can see that there 
 may be some objections made to it, but still it is my sincere opinion that 
 the adoption of it will be the salvation of America ; for at present there 
 is hardly the semblance of law or government in any of the States, 
 and for want of a superior power over the whole, a dissolution seems 
 to be impending. I staid two days with General Washington at 
 Mount Vernon about six weeks ago. He is in perfect good health, and 
 looks almost as well as he did twenty years ago. I never saw him so 
 keen for anything in my life as he is for the adoption of the new 
 scheme of government. As the eyes of all America are turned towards 
 this truly great and good man for the first President I took the liberty 
 of sounding him upon it. He appeare to be earnestly against going into 
 public life again ; pleads in excuse for himself his love of retirement 
 and his advanced age, but notwithstanding of these, I am fully of 
 opinion he may be induced to appear once more on the publick stage of 
 life. I form my opinion from what passed between us in a very long 
 and serious conversation, as well as from what I could gather from 
 Mrs. Washington on same subject. 
 
 Our Assembly are now sitting ; they have not yet done much busi- 
 ness, but what has been done is highly commendable. They have in 
 very strong and pointed language thrown out a proposal for emitting 
 paper money, and they iiave repealed the Port Bill which was attended 
 with numberless inconveniences to the merchants. At the request of Col° 
 George Mason, I have drawn up a plan for a new bill, which will more 
 effectually secure the revenue than the former, and will remove the 
 many objections that mercantile people had to the last Till this As- 
 sembly an idea seemed to prevail almost universally that the landed 
 and commercial interests were opp^ised to each other. I have been at 
 great pains to do away this erroneous opinion, and from the laws that 
 have l>een made for two years past, such unexpected consequenccR 
 have followed, that the minds of the people are now disposed to hear 
 reasoning upon the su! ^.ct of trade from those who have been long 
 engaged in it. An instalment bill for paying debts engrosses much 
 time and attention. This is a favorite child of your friend ColP George 
 
 \ i
 
 43 
 
 Nicholas. I have only one objection to it upon the principles they 
 talk of, and that is the precedent. I am satisfied that 'take the State 
 altot'ether, it owes more money than its lands can produce for three 
 years. Therefore the debts cannot be paid in that time. I would be 
 for giving four years which surely would be much better for the cred- 
 itors than going to law, when I could not obtain a judgment in less 
 than seven, and if the sum is considerable, he roust follow his debtor 
 into the Court of Appeals, and from thence into Chancery. And after 
 troinor through every court, when he has an .execution served upon the 
 estate of his debtor, the last reply vies (this is a new trick) and in 
 short every delay and chicanery is made use of, to stave off the pay- 
 ment of first debts ; and this country, which is blessed by nature with 
 many advantages, is likely to go to anarchy and ruin, for want of a 
 proper execution of the laws, and of a firm and efficient goverament. . . . 
 
 A. Donald. 
 
 SAMUEL POWEL TO GEORGE WASHINGTON. 
 
 13 November, 1787. 
 It is said that R. H. Lee escaped the resentment of the People at 
 Chester by his short stay there, which he employed in fixing up and dis- 
 tributing printed Papers against the proposed Constitution. At Wil- 
 mington he harangued the Populace and cautioned them against hastily 
 adopting it, assuring them that a powerful} opposition was forming 
 against it in Philadelphia, and, in Confirmation of bis Assertions dis- 
 tributed many of his inflammatory Papers. On such conduct there can 
 be but one comment made. 
 
 i 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 22 November, 1787. 
 Dear Sir, — I have your letter of the 26'*" of October and have this 
 day obtained from Mr. Thompson the survey of the upper part of 
 James River, and shall to morrow morning have an answer from Mr. 
 Lambert (to whom I was advised as a proper person to copy it) whether 
 he will undertake to do it. If he does, the work will perhaps be well 
 executed. Should he decline doing it, my endeavours shall not be 
 wanting to engage some other person to undertake the execution of it, 
 and forward it to you as early as I am able. There are uo wild crab 
 trees that I can hear of near this place, except at Col R. Goode's, who 
 I am told has a few trees standing in one of his inclosures, where 
 probably some sprouts may be got, if not injured by the cattle. I will
 
 'fs 
 
 
 1 
 
 ; ' t 
 
 
 Ij 
 
 44 
 
 send there for the purpose, and if they can be obtained contrive them 
 to you as safely as I can. 
 
 Tlie Assembly have not yet passed any act of consequence. British 
 debts, installments and the circuit or district plan of jurisprudence are 
 under consideration. There is great diversity of opinion on these 
 subjects. One party presses forward the removing impediments to 
 the full fulfillment of the treaty ; another for removing the legal im- 
 pediments by one bill and introducing installments by another; a third 
 class think the recommendation of Congress respecting the treaty had 
 better lie unmoved until the Convention shall have decided on the new 
 constitution of government. The introducer of the British debt propo- 
 sition suspending the law if it shall pass until the other States pass 
 similar laws, is the introducer of the plan of installments for these and 
 all other private debts ; and from the manner in which the business is 
 managed will probably lose the whole. 
 
 This day a Committee of the whole are upon allowing tobacco to be 
 received as a commutable in taxes. The price at these. warehouses and 
 Manchester, &c. 30/ ; those at the heads of the other rivers 28/, and so 
 on with all the other warehouses, in the same ratio of increase on the 
 prices of last year as fixed by law, and from the spirit of accommodation 
 which seemed to govern to day, from what prevailed a few days past 
 when the subject was first debated, I think the measure will succeed. 
 
 The new plan of government is still very much the subject of con- 
 versation. I mix little in the crowd and am unable as yet to form any 
 estimate whether it gains or loses ground with the members of the 
 legislature. Whereon I hear the subject agitated I find gentlemen 
 pretty much divided, each party appears to maintain its opinions with 
 apparent zeal. After a while more temper will prevail, and the excel- 
 lencies or defects of the system be treated with less prejudice and more 
 moderation. I much doubt whether the people in this State, whatever 
 may be the situation of men's minds in other States, are yet ripe for 
 the great change which the new plan will ultimately effecL There 
 would have been less repugnance to it here had the judiciary been less 
 exceptionable, and the Executive and legislative had been separate. 
 The true hne, could it have been hit, was to have yielded full manage- 
 ment of all exterior matters to Congress, leaving interior matters to The 
 States, so far as the power of regulating trade as well between other 
 nations as the States would have admitted of. With a court of appeals 
 properiy constituted for administering justice ultimately to aU ^e. 
 and with some means of coercion, not violent or military- some 8u<A 
 J^lpro^•ements our State, from all I can learn, would have not hesitated 
 in yielding their part to. The great change proposed will I think meet 
 with strong opposition, though it may be adopted. Could the consti- 
 tution of the Senate be varied and the judiciary be better established
 
 46 
 
 than it now stands ou the paper, I could more willingly give the Con- 
 stitution my assent. As it stands, I shall receive it with reluctance. 
 The 4'?' number of the American Citizen has been printed here in 
 Davis's paper. The three numbers you sent me were printed and in 
 the same paper. 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 RicuHOMD, IS'.*" December, 1787. 
 
 Dear Sir, — Mr. Lambert has executed Col. Thompson's survey of 
 James River, excepting that part of il that comprehends the canal. 
 For a sketch of this part he depends ou Mr. Harris, the manager of 
 the work, who has not yet been pleased to furnish it. I shall if the 
 day is fair ride there to-morrow myself and prevail on Hjirris to give 
 me a sketch of it that Mr. Lambert may complete the business, which 
 I think he has executed exceeding well. Col. R. Goo<le has promised 
 me to endeavour to procure as many wild crab-tree scions as you wrote 
 for, but having heard nothing from him since I made the request, 
 Anthony has gone over to try what he can do about them. I fear, if 
 they shall be procured, an opportunity will not offer that can convey 
 them by the time you proposed. 
 
 The Legislature have proceeded so slowly in the public business, and 
 have even now concluded so few things of consequence that they are 
 scarce worth mentioning. The Delegates will pass the District bill, 
 and it is probable the Senate will do the same; but of this there is 
 some doubt. This measure would not have succeeded but for its being 
 accompanied with another bill called a bill for amending the execution 
 law, which it is said is calculated to give some relief to debtors, without 
 any direct interference with private contracts. The principal object of 
 this bill is to appoint commissioners to act on oath to determine, instead 
 of the sheriff, whether the property offered for sale under executions ,! 
 
 goes at three-fourths the value. If they do not, the sale may be post- 
 poned on bond and security being given to pay in twelve months, which 
 at the end of the term, shall be carried into a judgment on motion and 
 no further delay obtained if the money is not punctually paid. It is 
 proposed these bills shall go together and commence the fir»t of June 
 next. The revenue bills are to be considered by a committee this day. 
 A short law has passed making some appropriations for a sinking fund, 
 the produce to be applied by the executive to purchasing public securi- 
 ties carrying interest. The revenue bill at present makes further pro- 
 vision for this fund, but how it will terminate depends on the pleasure 
 of the two houses. A new naval office bill is before a committee, but 
 not yet reported. We are told you mean to come in and give m your 
 
 1 > 
 
 'J 
 ■> }
 
 
 
 ii ' 
 
 I ! 
 
 46 
 
 assistance in the Convention. I hope you will do so. Publius is vari- 
 ously ascribed to M — d — n, Ha — It — n, J — y. It is certainly among 
 the first publications on the subject of the new constitution of govern- 
 ment. AVhat has been done by the States on the business and when 
 do their conventions assemble ? 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Spring Hill, 21 January, 1788. 
 
 Dear Sir, — I beg your pardon for omitting to write to you the 
 
 last two or tiiree weeks. I have been little in Richmond during that 
 
 period and of late have been confined by an attack of the rheumatism 
 
 which though very painful for two or three days, has now left me. 
 
 I mean, nothing unforeseen preventing, to visit Richmond next week. 
 
 Before I came away Col. Goode had sent me a good many slips of the 
 
 wild crab tree, but not one scion. These I knew would not answer 
 
 your purpose aud threw them away. He informed me there was not 
 
 a scion to be got. Mr. Selden could not discover any of the trees on 
 
 his place. The scion I suspect is not easily procured unless from trees 
 
 that can be found under inclosure. The season being now past for 
 
 sending thera to New York in time for planting could they be procured, 
 
 VKf^ • you must desire your friend to have patience until next fall, by which 
 
 ^ time I doubt not to be able to gratify him. I think I have seen several 
 
 of them near where Col. Carter resides. The tree at Col. Goode's 
 bears the largest apple for a wild crab I ever saw. The servant 
 brought me one of them with the slips as large as a hen's ego and of 
 , I very agreeable scent. * 
 
 \ I I "^^^ "*P o^ Jan^es River was completed when I left Richmond, 
 
 ^ ^ ' ®*^P' ^^^ trace of the canal, which being a material part of it more 
 
 on account of the notes of reference than any difficulty in laying it 
 down, I declined receiving it from Mr. Lambert until these were 
 added. Mr. Harris, the manager of the work, although he had prom- 
 ised to furnish me them had not then complied with his promise. 
 Lambert promised me if he did not soon do so, he would ride up to 
 his house near the canal and obtain his sketch and notes. Would you 
 have the map forwarded to New York by some safe hand that offers 
 or retain ,t here until you come in in March which I hear you intend 
 doing. It will be too large for a letter by post. 
 
 The Assembly have passed the District plan in a law, much changed, 
 I am told, from the former plan. Not having seen the law I can speak 
 only from information: there are eighteen districts; four additional 
 judges of the general court; [?] of the general court judges ride the
 
 47 
 
 upper districts, three to a circuit ; the chancellors and admiralty judges 
 
 take the six lower districts ; chancery, admiralty and appeal courts as 
 
 heretofore. District courts take cognizance of no demands under 
 
 30 /. Civil process commences 1^ January next; the criminal, I am 
 
 informed, some time in the fall. The judges have 20/ each a day 
 
 aud 5 d. per mile during their journeys, I think in addition to former 
 
 allowance. So it stood in the bill and is so, I presume, in the law. ; 
 
 The lawyers fees 15/ and 30/ — the same as the county courts. The 
 
 revenue law, which is also the appropriation law, is calculated to lessen 
 
 all it may the state debt, I mean the internal debt. The certiBcate 'i 
 
 tax is taken off, and an additional duty on certain enumerated articles 
 
 and 3 per cent on other goods, payable in certificates, is the present 
 
 plan for sinking them. 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 RiCBHOND, 14'> February, 178a 
 Dear Sir, — From Fredericksburg I informed you of the issue of 
 my endeavour to procure the crab tree scions. On my return to Rich- 
 mond I found the chart of James River in the state it was when I left 
 that place. Mr. Lambert says after waiting some time in expectation 
 of hearing from Harris respecting the canal he at length finding he did 
 not call on him rode to his house but was disappointed in meeting with 
 him. The trace of the canal is noted on the map, but some descriptive 
 notes are wanting to make it more complete. These I am in hopes I 
 shall obtain to morrow from Mr. Harris whom I have just seen, and 
 he promises me they shall be left out at his house in the morning 
 should business occasion his absence when I call. Col. Heth being 
 soon to set out for New York I shall, if ready, as I expect it will, 
 confide the conveyance and delivery of it to him. 
 
 Your two last favors I have received, — that of the 251" since my 
 arrival here, and am much obliged to you for the communications they 
 contain. S. Adams's silence as to the new plan of government, if 
 not calculated to secure him a seat in the Convention, proceeded very 
 probably from his desire of discovering the temper of the people in 
 general, before he took a decided part. This, with the admission of 
 Gerry to a seat in the Convention when not a member, and the great 
 number that compose the body, are unfavorable circumstances, and 
 authorize a conjecture that the new system will not be adopted by 
 Massachusette. Should that State give it a negative and not proceed 
 to offer some amendments and propose another convention, I fear it 
 will produce disagreeable consequences, as it will not only confirm 
 New York in her opposition but contribute greatly to strengthen the
 
 
 ' 
 
 ]'!' 
 
 J'r*^* f> 
 
 % 
 
 1 i 
 
 I 
 
 48 
 
 opposition in the States that are yet to consider the measure. If nine 
 States assented before Virginia meets in convention, her course I think 
 will be to adopt the plan, protesting or declaring her disapprobation of 
 those parts she does not approve of. Or if not agreed to by nine, she 
 will in that case propose amendments and another general Convention. 
 H — y will, I think, use all his influence to reject at all events, but am 
 satisfied those who are for it as it stands, and those who wish some 
 alterations in it before its adoption, if circumstances authorize the 
 attempt, will be greatly the majority. What change may be produced 
 should Massachusetts reject cannot well be foreseen. I think, how- 
 ever, in that event Virginia will propose amendments and another 
 Convention, and I trust such will be the conduct of Massachusetts, 
 rather than hazard a loss of the system, and the mischievous conse- 
 quences that may result from disagreement and delay. I congratulate 
 my friend Griffin on his being placed in the chair to whom be pleased 
 to present my best wishes. R — d — h, R. H. L., M — n have been 
 assailed in our papers. The enclosed will, if you have not seen them, 
 exhibit some specimens, and serve to amuse you. 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 17 February, 1788. 
 
 Dear Sir, — Col. Heth came to town and proceeded on his journey 
 sooner than I expected and before I had an -opportunity of seeing Mr. 
 Harris. After calling upon him and getting the survey of the canal, 
 I found little information could be collected from it and inserted in the 
 map. I have therefore sent what Mr. Lambert had executed by Col. 
 Henley, who I understand means to go on to-morrow and has promised 
 to deliver it safe to you. Some notes respecting the canal, obtained 
 from Mr. Harris's information, I send enclosed. They may be useful 
 if anything beyond the labour of Mr. Lambert is intended. 
 
 We anxiously wait for the decision of the Massachusetts convention. 
 Turn as it may, the deliberations of the States yet to meet will be 
 greatly affected by what shall be determined by that body. Davis's 
 next paper will, I expect, contain another publication under the signa- 
 ture of Cassius against R. H. L. You shall have it if printed. The 
 plain dealer is supposed from the manuscript to come from Essex 
 R— ne.i Pray do not fail to keep me informed from time to time of 
 the proceedings of the States on that important business of the new 
 government as they shall come to your knowledge. 
 
 1 Probably Judge Spencer Roane. In 1785 he was chosen to the executive 
 council, and Madison then spoke of him as "young Mr. Roane."
 
 49 
 
 p. S. I am well informed Col Pendleton and Col. James Taylor 
 will come from Caroline. H — y is preaching to the people in some of 
 the southern counties. 
 
 Jos. JONBB. 
 
 DAVID STUART TO GEORGE WASHINGTON. 
 
 Abingdon. 17 February, 1788. 
 ... I have just returned from a tour round part of the County — I 
 mean about the middle of the week to set out again. I find that Pope 
 and Chichester in particular, have been very active in alarming the 
 people. The latter Gentleman and myself were near meeting at 
 several C. Houses. He had his pockets full of Mason's objections; 
 which he leaves wherever he calls. He is trying to persuade some one 
 opposed to the Constitution to offer for the Convention. Mr. Pollard 
 informed me that he applied to him, but that he declined it. I am 
 happy to find, that he has met with no success except with old Broad- 
 water. Mr. Little informs me that he appears to be changed, and to 
 be disposed to offer himself in opposition to those who approve of the 
 Constitution. I almost think that Mason, doubtful of hb election in 
 Stafford will offer for this county, notwithstanding his declarations. I 
 think he might have been satisfied with the publication of his objec- 
 tions, without taking the pains to lodge them at every house. I find it 
 commonly believed in this County, that you consider amendments 
 necessary. It therefore appears to me, that it would be of advantage 
 to the Constitution, to undeceive the people in this respect; by some 
 communication or other. Would not Mr. Blair your fellow labourer in 
 the business, be a proper person through whom to introduce it to the 
 Publick ? If you should think proper to take any step of this sort, it 
 would be particularly useful, to take some notice of the difference 
 between the objectors. I find this argument to have the most weight 
 
 with the common class. I am, &c ^ 
 
 David Stdart. 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 New York, 24 April, 1788. 
 Dear Sir, — I was but a few days ago honoured with your favor 
 of the 21 December, having been absent on a trip to Virginia ever 
 since the 1'.' of January. I was alike cut off from it, and an oppor- 
 tunity of writting you. Massachusetts, Jersey, Pennsylvania, Dela- 
 ware, Connecticut, and Georgia, have adopted the Constitution. New 
 Hampshire has been in convention upon it, but finding that a majority 
 
 4 

 
 50 
 
 » 
 
 ,1 
 
 i, 
 
 had assembled under instructions or promises to vote in the negative, 
 of whom a sufficient number were converted to turn the scale, an ad- 
 journment has taken place until June, for the purpose of getting such 
 clear of their fetters, and it is not doubted by the friends of the meas- 
 ure that this will be effected, so that a ready adoption will be the con- 
 sequence of their reassembling. New York, Maryland, Virginia, North 
 Carolina and South Carolina are to deliberate between this and July. 
 In Maryland and South Carolina no doubt is entertained as to the 
 adoption. In New York and Virginia very active opposition is made, 
 and the event is uncertain — in the latter it will depend much upon the 
 ideas entertained in convention as to the issue in N. Hampshire, whose 
 reassembling is to be after the meeting in Virginia. I am certain that 
 a great majority of our Convention will be for adopting upon being 
 ^certained that nine States will adopt, as much worse apprehensions 
 are held from the event of a disunion, than from anything that is in the 
 Constitution. We have a party that is truly anti-federal headed by 
 Mr. Henry, but it will be limited to a few, unless the federalists who 
 are for amendments, should from a mistaken view of the probability of 
 the measures being carried into effect by nine States, be drawn into 
 
 steps favoring the anti-federal schemes. Mr. H does not openly 
 
 declare for a dismemberment of the Union, but his arguments in sup- 
 port of his opposition to the Constitution go directly to that issue. He 
 says that three confederacies would be practicable and better suited to 
 the good of America, than one. God forbid that I should ever see the 
 trial made. Virginia would fall into a division from which she might 
 add to her burthens, but could never derive aid of any kind. 
 
 North Carolina is to sit after Virginia, and it is probable, will follow 
 her. Of Rhode Island we say nothing when speaking of American 
 politics. 
 
 Of the States which have adopted, Jersey and Delaware were unani- 
 mous. Georgia we hear was also unanimous. In Pennsylvania the 
 majority was about two-thirds, and the minority continues much dis- 
 contented. In Connecticut the majority was about two-thirds, the 
 minority acquiescing. In Massachusetts the majority was small, the 
 minority acquiescing. The debates of this Convention have been pub- 
 lished, a copy whereof you will receive herewith. 
 
 It would have afforded me much pleasure to have seen yoar senti- 
 ments fully upon this subject, but Mr. Madison, having gone to Virginia 
 before my return to this city, I have not seen your letter to him as yet. 
 You ask, " would it not have been better to assign to Congress, ex- 
 clusively, the article of imposts for federal purposes, and to have 
 left direct taxation exclusively to the States." It is probable that 
 the former, aided by the Land Office, might have cleared off the 
 present debts of the Union, and supported the current expenses of
 
 61 
 
 government during peace, bat in a case of war, other resonrces mast be 
 brought into practise, and with a view to such an event, some coercive 
 principle must have been established whereby the federal government 
 should act with effect, and had this not been interwoven in its civil 
 admiuistration, a military one must occasionally have been put in 
 practice upon delirujuent States. The former will never be exercised 
 but when necessary, and then in a way not odious or inconvenient to 
 the people ; the latter must forever be both odious and inconvenient, be 
 the occasion what it may. 
 
 I feel seriously for yonr situation with our numerous and too justly 
 discontented foreign creditors, nor do I see a prospect of relief before 
 the new Government shall get into operation, which must still require 
 some time. The proposition for filling up the loan in Holland, pro- 
 vided the broker be suffered to retain 180,000 guilders, the interest of 
 certain certificates in his possession of our domestic debt, will not be 
 acceded to by Congress ; and yet I do not see upon what ground we 
 are to expect that loans will be made upon the common principle. I 
 should myself be for acceding, because it appears that it would preserve 
 our credit until it is probable the new government would commence. 
 This I think so great an object that I would not stand on a precise 
 adherence to systems. We have at present not a competent Congress 
 to act in the case, but from the sentiments of the numbers attending, 
 and those of the Board of Treasury, I am convinced the terms would 
 not be accepted. I hope the views of our creditors are tamed upon 
 the revolution which is about to take place with us, and that they may 
 be induced to continue their patience, until time shall produce the issue. 
 I apprehend that amongst the first measures of the new government 
 will be that of negotiating loans for the purpose of satisfying the 
 foreigners to whom the U. S. are indebted, as it will require some 
 time to bring into practise the resources from which money is to be 
 derived. 
 
 I am happy that my information in the case of Commodore Jones 
 apprised you of the hazards you might have run, and I am at the same 
 time pleased that you fell on the expedient of acting safely without 
 disappointing him. The business of the prize money which was paid 
 under your direction is fully understood in Congress, and I believe 
 every one else whose attention has been called to it. 
 
 I am much obliged to your information upon European politics. It 
 is true we ought not to entangle ourselves in the affairs of others, where 
 we can avoid it, but keeping clear of them depends, in some measure, 
 upon knowing their circumstances and views. I will venture one idea 
 upon European politics. It would seem the Turks should meet with 
 support against Russia from other powers in addition to France. Russia 
 has. already a vast territory which is peopling fast; she is also growing 
 
 .i 
 
 i
 
 I 
 
 ^ in naval force. Suppose she should get Turkey with those seas which 
 
 tj belong to it, would she not be dangerous to the rest of Europe ? 
 
 ' Ed. Carbington. 
 
 I have not a list of the returns for the Virginia Convention, or I 
 would send it to you. It contains many obscure characters whom you 
 would know nothing of. It is unfortunate that in this great business 
 the passions instead of the reason of the people were called into opera- 
 ' tion. This circumstance renders the issue there the more uncertain, 
 
 because a great proportion must act from the influence of a few men 
 whose popular talents may be exerted. 
 
 i1 
 
 '1 <: 
 
 . 1 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 New Tobk, 14 May, 1788. 
 My deab Sir, — Mr. Barlow of Connecticut will have the honor 
 to call on you with this letter. I have not the pleasure of a personal 
 
 I acquaintance with him, but his literary talents have considerably dis- 
 
 tinguished him as a poetical as well as prose writer, and he is intro- 
 duced to me as a gentleman deserving your countenance. Permit me 
 to recommend him to your attention and civilities. He conducts to the 
 Marquis de la Fayette, the eldest sou of our illustrious friend Gen'l 
 ^ ^f^ * Greene, who is sent at the particular request of that nobleman, to 
 
 receive his education under his direction iu France. I have given the 
 ,, ' little fellow [George Washington Greene] a few lines to you and 
 
 directed him to deliver them in person. It is unnecessary to solicit for 
 him the attention of one who so well knew his father. 
 
 I had the pleasure to write you pretty fully on the 25* ult by 
 Mr. Paradise, since which no event has taken place except the adoption 
 J I of the Constitution in Maryland, by a majority of 63 against 11. South 
 
 / j Carolina is now sitting and the general countenance of intelligence 
 
 I from thence is much in favor of the measure. There seems to be no 
 
 • i doubt entertained of an adoption by a considerable majority. Should 
 
 i \ this be the case, it will give eight States. Virginia being the next to 
 
 .,( sit will meet under very critical circumstances, because upon her 
 
 I decision will in my opinion depend, not the fate of the measure, but 
 
 whether some degree of convulsion shall or shall not attend its matura- 
 tion. It will have gone too far to be retracted, and even Virginia her- 
 self, should she in the first instance reject, must afterwards come iu. 
 Indeed, New Hampshire will certainly accede when she re-assembles, 
 and compleate the nine for giving action to the project. But a decision 
 in the negative in Virginia would, in one moment, give additional Ufe 
 to the minority in Pennsylvania, whose opposition has taken a stubborn
 
 53 
 
 stand, and the appeal may in that quarter be to the sword. Nor will 
 I venture a conjecture upon the effect such au effort there will have 
 amongst the opposers in Virginia. I hope, however, the possibility of 
 a calamity of this sort, will have its effect on some of the more wise in 
 the opposition, and incline them to adopt rather than run such a hazard. 
 Should Virginia adopt, we shall at once have a government, the issue 
 of a thorough revolution, without the violent means which have uni- 
 formly been requisite for the like events elsewhere. I pray Grod we 
 may exhibit to the world this instance of our superior wisdom and 
 benevolence. 
 
 I do myself the pleasure to send you by Mr. Barlow a volume con- 
 taining a number of periodical papers which have been written in this 
 city, upon the occasion of the constitution. These are written, it is 
 supposed, by Messrs. Madison, Jay and Hamilton. The numbers run 
 to as many more, the remainder are to form a second volume, which 
 will be published in a few weeks. I will do myself the pleasure to 
 send it to you, as soon as it is done. 
 
 Mr. Madison in a letter which he wrote me a few days ago, re- 
 quested me to obtain the first and second volumes of the Philosophical 
 Transactions of the Society in Philadelphia, and forward them, to you. 
 Upon inquiry I find that the P.' vol. is not in print, having been 
 destroyed during the war. The second I have got through favor of 
 Mr. Barlow to take with him for you. I am told the 1? is to be 
 reprinted; when it is done, we will take care to forward it to you. 
 During Mr. Madison's absence in Virginia I am aware of your depen- 
 dence upon me for regular information upon the progress of the busi- 
 ness of the constitution, and shall omit no opportunity of writing you. 
 
 Ed. Carrington. 
 
 EDWARD CARRINGTON TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 Nbw York, 9 June, 1788. 
 
 Mt dear Sir, — I had the honor to write you by the last packet 
 by Mr. Barlow and Master G. W. Greene, since which South Carolina 
 has acceded to the new Constitution by a great majority. The inclosed 
 papers contain the act, and some of the Debates of the Convention. 
 
 Virginia is now sitting, having met last Monday, but we have not 
 yet received any intelligence as to the probable turn the business will 
 take there. I am inclined to think the critical stage in which this Con- 
 vention meets the affair, will have much influence upon the opinions of 
 many who sat out in the opposition. In adopting they will certainly 
 avoid commotion, and, at worst, accept a constitution upon which eight 
 States have already agreed to hazard their happiness, and which may
 
 64 
 
 T 
 
 *" » 
 
 «»f1 
 
 be amended, should it be found to operate badly ; in rejecting they 
 
 may produce commotion, with but little prospect of preventing the 
 
 ado'piiou. The five States who have not yet acceded, would never 
 
 agree in these objects and could even this be brought about, they must 
 
 a^ last rather yield to the 8, than these to the five ; and it appears that 
 
 the submission on either side must be intire, for should the 8 think of 
 
 a compromise with the 5, there would be difficulty in agreeing what 
 
 points to yield. Tliese considerations will, I apprehend, effect in the 
 
 convention of Virginia and produce an issue different from that which 
 
 might have taken place under other circumstances. I am happy to 
 
 find that the five are so separated that there cannot be a possible effort 
 
 to unite in an attempt to dismember the Union. Had the southern 
 
 States joined in opinion as to the constitution, I verily believe such a 
 
 desperate step would have been tried, but it would have ended in their 
 
 destruction, and perhaps that of all the others. 
 
 Mr. Madison and myself have sent you sundry pamphlets and pieces 
 which have been written by the friends of the Constitution ; I have 
 endeavored to select from those which have been written on the other 
 side, that which is reputed the best, to send you now, that you may 
 fairly judge of the arguments brought forwards amongst us pro & con. 
 The two books enclosed contain a number of letters under the signature 
 of the Federal Farmer, but the author is not known. These letters ai-e 
 reputed the best of anything that has been written in the opposition. 
 
 I hope by the next opportunity to be able to send you the second 
 volume of the Federalist. 
 
 £d. Carrington. 
 
 JOHN^B. CUTTING TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 London, 26 June, 1788. 
 . . . The public objects manifestly intended to be accomplished by 
 its operation are important [Southern whale fishery bill]. Among 
 the principal ones which this government mean to effect I select the 
 following : 1. To distance all competition in the fisheries and monopo- 
 lize the oil trade, and nourish a national nursery for seamen. 2. To 
 defeat, Iwth as to France and America, that mass of growing benefits 
 which might otherwise result from your edict of Decf, 1787. 3. To 
 extirpate a (suppositious) projected settlement of American whale fish- 
 ermen in France. 4. To establish such a settlement on the coast of 
 Scotland (vid. Bufoy's speech). 5. To check the growth, or perhaps 
 suffocate the germ of our rising marine in the west. 6. To diminish 
 the maritime jKJwer of France, or hinder its augmentation. To these 
 public may be superadded the private views of Anglo-American mer- 
 chant*, some of whom expect a liberal remittance from Nantucket as
 
 55 
 
 an immediate adjunct of the plan, beside the consequent advantages 
 from the conversion of forty foreign bottoms into domestic ones, and 
 fixing in Britain forever the best of human implements for executing 
 and extending so productive a commerce. 
 
 These private purjwses stimulated the first application to government 
 for this new bill to depopulate Nantucket, and impoverish our best 
 national resource. Lord Hawksbury (late Mr. Jenkinson) who suc- 
 ceeds to that secret influence with the sovereign which his patron, the 
 Earl of Bute, bequeatlied to him on his political demise, encouraged 
 and brought forward the scheme from its earliest suggestion in March, 
 soon after that indiscreet promulgation of the French edict of Decem- 
 ber. He drew the heads of the act him>elf. From the board of trade, 
 whereof he is president, it came recommended. It was adopted and 
 was only approved by that junto of the privy council who agree upon 
 the substance of all great acts ere they assume even an embrio shape 
 in the committee. Being hostile to America it met the applause of the 
 monarch. It was hurried through a committee by Mr. Grenville — 
 the sub-conductor of Hawksbury's commercial systems — and from that 
 moment to the last form of its enaction, discussion at large of its merits 
 was evaded, and all disclosure of the chief objects it is intended to 
 effectuate, was studiously stifled and prevented. 
 
 If the plan prospers, it is to be extended occasionally, whereby a 
 palsy may be infused into the stoutest sinew of the United States, 
 while Britain gains an accession of strength. By the complete success 
 of the first experiment only she obtains nearly five hundred of the most 
 vigorous, skillful and undaunted seamen ever seen on the face of the 
 
 John Brown Cutiing. 
 
 JOHN B. CUTTING TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 LoiTOOH, 11 July, 1788. 
 Sir, — I am to congratulate you upon the adoption of the new 
 national constitution of our country by the State of South Carolina. I 
 cannot ascertain the precise numbers of the Convention, but the main 
 question was carried by a majority of sixty six members, not without 
 warm debate. I have mutilated a couple of newspapers which contain 
 nothing beside the intelligence stamp'd on the columns cut oat. From 
 the specimen of eloquence and argument expressed on one of them, a 
 fair estimate may be formed of the talents of the minority. That of 
 Maryland exhibited proofs of riper ability. It seems to me (if it were 
 not rash either to form or offer any opinion at this distance), that 
 some of the gentlemen warmly opposed to an acceptance of the plan 
 (in the back counties of Virginia) have diffused their objections through- 
 
 f 
 
 ,!
 
 
 i ■ .66 
 
 out those of the two Carolinas which are most remote from the Atlantic 
 shores. In North Carolina violent contests at the election of members 
 for their State convention by a few of those transmountain districts 
 . have resulted. In one instance the operation of those iotrigues to 
 
 , which I refer probably induced a majority of the voters to bestow 
 
 J their suffrages on men extremely obscure, and unfit from excessive 
 
 I ignorance as is alledged, to discuss or decide upon so great a question. 
 
 In consequence of this conception the election was interrupted by those 
 who wished men more enlightened, or as the phrase is, more federal ; 
 ; aud by force of club law their antagonists were defeated. I understand 
 
 i ' that North Carolina, but for such forceful zeal in several parts of the 
 
 \ country, would not have exhibited a convention so united in support of 
 
 national system as is now the promise. The prospect now is that they 
 will ratify at any rate. In apology for electioneering violences in that 
 State, which few considerate citizens of our Union will approve or 
 attempt to justify, it may be urged that among the whole thirteen there 
 is not a community, the internal and ferocious disturbances of which 
 more loudly exact the inteiference of national authority and controul, 
 such as is now to be delegated by the ratification thus eagerly sought. 
 Already the conflicts for independent power between those who denom- 
 inate themselves citizens of Frankland and the residue of their neigh- 
 bours who adhere to the legitimate government, have issued in blo«i : 
 <f ' ^'■'^^^ P»'"^ies within these few months have assaulted each other in 
 
 open warfare, besieged dwelling houses, inflicting mutual and mortal 
 wounds, and menacing future feuds with which, if not over or quelled 
 by legal authority confessedly paramount to both parties and in some 
 measure constituted for this express purpose, the worst of unsubdue- 
 able anarchy might be expected to result. 
 
 When I contemplate such events and the probability that similar 
 ones might be engendered in various quarters of the union, unless a 
 strong superintending power vest in the general government capable to 
 curb individual licentiousness and suffocate the germs of future discord 
 1 am not surprised at the energy of almost the whole body of our 
 enlightened and leading characters in every State, who otherwise would 
 seem actuated with an unnecessary if not intemperate zeal in a great 
 and a good cause. Thus a person who were superficially to peruse the 
 proceedings even of the liberal and patriotic convention of Maryland! 
 Hould be led to imagine that the objections and arguments of the 
 
 majority. Whereas a minute scrutiny into the motives and measures 
 
 say that the opposition to a thorough reform of the federal government 
 began in Maryland, even before the agitation of the qnestbn.n Te 
 general Convention at Philadelphia. Mr. Martin, the AtZ7Gene:!;:. 
 
 ^■1
 
 57 
 
 who was primarily appoiuted to that office by Mr. Chase, was in the 
 same iuflueuce deputed to represent the State, after Messrs. Carroll, 
 Johnson, &c., &c., the tirst choice of the Legislature, declined quitting 
 Maryland even upon the important business of new-framing the national 
 government, Mr. Chase having just before menaced the Senate for 
 rejecting a wide emission of paper money and appealed to the people 
 against them. They had joined in that general issue, and could not 
 venture to relinquish to a violent and headstrong party their active 
 influence in the Senate as well as in the lower House, at the very 
 moment, when it was so essentially needed to stem the torrent of the 
 populace for the paper. Those gentlemen, therefore, remained at home, 
 convinced their fellow citizen of their superior rectitude and wisdom, 
 and defeated that favorite measure of Mr. Chase. Meanwhile Mr. 
 Martin and Mr. John F. Mercer, a young gentleman whom you well 
 know, went to the general Convention, opposed the great leading feat- 
 ures of the plan which was afterwards promulged, withdrew themselves 
 from any signature of it, and from the moment when it was proposed 
 for ratification, in conjunction with Mr. Chase and his sure coadjutor 
 Mr. Paca, exerted every effort to hinder its adoption. So far did Mr. 
 Martin proceed in his avowed hostility, as even to detail in the face of 
 decency, before the assembled Legislature of Maryland, the petty 
 dialooues and paltry anecdotes of every description, that came to his 
 knowledge in conventional committees and private conversations with 
 the respective members of the Convention when at Philadelphia. I 
 blushed in my own bed chamber when I read his speech on this side of 
 the Atlantic. 
 
 An hostility so premature and determined did certainly render those 
 gentlemen who waged it, obnoxious to many of their fellow citizens, 
 who likewise recollected their warm conduct relevant to the bills of 
 credit, which they had so recently urged Maryland to issue. When the 
 Convention met oii the 21" of April, whatsoever proposition came from 
 Messrs. Chase, Paca, Martin or Mercer, was viewed with jealousy or 
 disgust, and generally rejected by a great majority. Nay, so far did 
 this disposition to neglect their sentiments prevail that when to their 
 well grounded objections and most cogent arguments no reply was 
 made, a great majority remained inflexibly silent, or called for the main 
 question ; which on Saturday the 26'? was carried by 63 to 11. After 
 which Mr. Paca renewed a proposition which had been rejected the 
 day before for tlie appointment of a committee to consider and report 
 what amendments sliould be recommended by the Convention of Mary- 
 land, when 66 voted for such a committee; and accordingly Mr. Paca, 
 Messrs. Johnson, S. Chase, Potts, Mercer, Goldsborough, Tilghman, 
 Hanson, J. T. Chase, W. Tilghman, Lee, McHenry and Gale were 
 appointed. Upon the following amendments the Committee agreed. 
 
 II
 
 
 68 
 
 1. That Congress shall exercise no power but what is expressly 
 delegated by this Constitution. 
 
 2. That there shuU be a trial by jury in all criminal cases, according 
 to the course of proceedinii: in the state wherein the offence is comniitted ; 
 and that there be no appeal from matter of fact, or second trial after 
 acquittal : but this provision shall not extend to such cases as may arise 
 in the government of the land or naval forces. 
 
 3. That in all actions or debts or contracts, and in all other contro- 
 versies respecting property, or in which the inferior federal courts have 
 jurisdiction, the trial of facts shall be by jury ; if required by either 
 party : and that it be expressly declared that the state courts in such 
 cases have a concurrent jurisdiction with the federal courts, with an 
 appeal from either, only as to matter of law, to the supreme federal 
 conrt, if the matter in dispute be of the value of dollars. 
 
 4. That the inferior federal courts shall not have jurisdiction of less 
 than dollars, and there may be an appeal in all cases of revenue, as 
 well in matter of fact as law, and Congress may give the State Courts 
 jurisdiction of revenue cases, for such sums and in such manner, as they 
 may think proper. 
 
 5. That in all cases of trespasses done within the body of a county 
 and within the inferior federal jurisdiction, the party injured shall be 
 entitled to trial by jury in the State where the injury shall be com- 
 mitted ; and that it be expressly declared that the State courts in such 
 cases shall have concurrent jurisdiction with the federal courts ; and 
 there shall be no appeal from either, except on matter of law ; and that 
 
 -^^ no person be exempt from such jurisdiction and trial but ambassadors 
 
 and ministers privileged by the law of nations. 
 
 6. That the federal courts shall not be entitled to jurisdiction by 
 fictions or collusions. 
 
 ' ■ • 7. That the federal judges do not hold any other office of profit or 
 
 receive the profits of any other ofllice under Congress during the time 
 they hold their commissions. 
 
 8. That all warrants without oath or affirmation of a person con- 
 scientiously scrupulous of taking an oath, to search suspected places, or 
 ■ . to seize any person or his property, are grievous and oppressive; and 
 
 j all general warrants to search suspected places, or to apprehend any 
 
 I person suspected, without naming and describing the place or person in 
 
 I special, are dangerous and ought not to be granted. 
 
 i 9. That no soldier be enlisted for a longer time than four years, 
 
 > except in time of war, and then only during the war. 
 
 k 10. That soldiers be not quartered in time of peace upon private 
 
 I houses, without the consent of the owners. 
 
 f 1 1. That no mutiny bill continue in force longer than two years. 
 
 12. That the freedom of the press be inviolably preserved. 
 
 ^ ^ -r^^'
 
 59 
 
 13. That the militia shall not be subject to martial law, except ia 
 time of war, invasion or rebellion. 
 
 Thus far there was a coiicurreuce in opinion either unanimously or 
 by a considerable majority of the committee. But when the following 
 amendments were laid before the committee, a majority negatived the 
 same : 
 
 That the militia unless selected by lot or voluntarily enlisted shall 
 not be marched beyond the limits of an adjoining state, without the 
 consent of their legislature or executive. 
 
 That (Congress shall have no power to alter or change the time, place 
 or manner of holding elections for senators or representatives, unless 
 a State shall neglect to make regulations, or to execute its regulations, 
 or shall be prevented by invasion or rebellion ; in which cases onlj 
 Congress may interfere until the cause be removed. 
 
 3. That in every law of Congress imposing direct taxes, the collec- 
 tion thereof shall be suspended for a' reasonable time therein limited, 
 and on payment of the sura by any State, by the time appointed, such 
 taxes shall not be collected. 
 
 4. That no standitig army shall be kept up in time of peace unless 
 with the consent of two thirds of the members present of each branch 
 of Congress. 
 
 5. That the president shall not command the army in person, with- 
 out the consent of Congress. 
 
 6. That no treaty shall be effectual to repeal or abrogate the con- 
 stitutions or bills of rights of the States, or any part of them. 
 
 7. That no regulation of commerce or navigation act shall be made, 
 unless with the consent of two thirds of the members of each branch of 
 Congress. 
 
 8. Tliat no member of Congress shall be eligible to any office of 
 profit under Congress during the time for which he shall be appointed. 
 
 9. That Congress shall have no power to lay a poll tax. 
 
 10. That no person conscientiously scrupulous of bearing arms in 
 any case, shall be compelled personally to serve as a soldier. 
 
 11. That there be a responsible council to the president. 
 
 12. That there be no national religion established by law, but that 
 all persons be equally entitled to protection in their religious liberty. 
 
 13. That all imposts and duties laid by Congress shall be placed to 
 the credit of the State in which the same be collected, and shall be 
 deducted out of such State's quota of the cotnmon or general expenoea 
 of the government. 
 
 14. That every man hath a right to petition the legislature for 
 redress of grievances in a peaceable and orderly manner. 
 
 15. That it be declared that all persons entruste<l with the legisla- 
 tive or executive powers of government are the trustees and servants
 
 60 
 
 J' 
 
 •^ '(^* 
 
 of the public, an<l as such accountable for their conduct. Wherefore, 
 whenever the ends of j^overnment are perverted, and public liberty 
 manifestly endangered, and all other means of redress are ineffectual, 
 the people may and of right ought, to reform the old, or establish a 
 new government ; the doctrine of non resistance to arbitrary power 
 and oppression is absurd, slavish and destructive of the good and hap- 
 piness of mankind. 
 
 The introduction of these articles, especially the 7* and 13'^, alarmed 
 and gave offence to many of those among the majority, who suspected 
 the motives of Mr. Chase and his particular associates to be sinister 
 and altogether hostile to any effectual plan of national government. 
 And on Monday the 29'!', while the committee were sitting, the Con- 
 vention upon motion resolved, " That this Convention will consider of 
 no propositions for the amendments of the federal government, except 
 such as shall be submitted to them by the Committee of thirteen." 
 Upon which the Committee, being sent for by the Convention, a major- 
 ity of them determined that they would make no report of any amend- 
 ments whatsoever. The Convention immediately adjourned sine die. 
 Since which William Paca, Messrs. S. and J. T. Chase and John F. 
 Mercer, members of the Committee; and Messrs. Martin, Cockey, 
 Harrison, Love, Cromwell, Pinckney and 2 Ridgeleys, members of the 
 Convention, have appealed to the pnblic, complaining of the Conven- 
 tion, defending their own conduct and asserting that they " consider the 
 proposed form of national government as very defective, and that the 
 liberty and happiness of the people will be endangered if the system 
 be not greatly changed and bettered." 
 
 I have undertaken this local detail because I thought it might not be 
 unentertaining to you, especially if you have seen no other narrative 
 of the proceedings in Maryland except that which in a Boston paper 
 of May 23 I transmitted to you through Mr. Parker. I have also 
 enclosed for the same purpose of amusing, the manly proceedings of a 
 Virgmia Court of Appeals. Without knowing the particular meriu 
 of the cause, I may venture to applaud the integrity of Judges who 
 thus fulfill their oaihs and their duties. I am proud of such characters, 
 rhey exalt themselves and their country, while they maintain the 
 principles of the constitution of Virginia, and manifest the same un- 
 spotted probity of its judiciary department. I hope you will not think 
 me too locally or statically envious when I mention that a similar in- 
 stance has occurred in Massachusetts. Where when the legislature 
 unintentionally trespassed upon a barrier of the Constitution, the judges 
 of the Supreme Court solemnly determined, that the particular statute 
 was unconstitutional. In the very next session there was a formal and 
 unanimous repeal of the law, which perhaps was unnecessary. 
 
 I have just heard from New York that Mr. Jay, who wa8 reported 
 
 ( i ' 
 
 \ ;
 
 61 
 
 to be mortally hurt in the lato anatomical riot« there, U in tolerable 
 health. . . . 
 
 If a good private opportuuity occurs soon I will transmit yon a 
 pamphlet or two lately written in various parts of the Union. The 
 most inferior I have perused upon the federal government is attributed 
 (erroneously I believe) to Mr. St. (Jeorge Tucker. Judge Hanson 
 of Maryland treats the same topic well. But Mr. Madison, (who I 
 am assured is the genuine author of the two volumes of essays signed 
 Pttbliiis, and heretofore given to Col. Hamilton of New York) it is 
 agreed transcends every politician who has attempted to explain or 
 defend any system of federal polity. . . . 
 
 This day his britanuic majesty is expected to put an end to the 
 present session of parliament in a satisfactory and pacific speech to 
 both houses. Much of the past three weeks has been consumed in 
 framing a bill to regulate the transportation of slaves from Africa to 
 the West India Islands. The attempt or supposed attempt to interfere 
 in a branch of commerce so lucrative and extensive excited great alarm 
 and warm opposition among the individuals interested in the same, who 
 are against every species of innovation. Few acts have undergone more 
 [illegible'] tation or remark, from their origin to ultimate legitimacy; 
 aliho' but an extemporaneous measure to accomplish an humane object. 
 Some national and superior system of legislation will I hope be devised 
 by our country gently to prepare the negroes for that reception of their 
 natural rights which might be effected without distracting society or 
 extinguishing property ! . . . 
 
 John Brown Cutting. 
 
 JOHN B. CUTTING TO THOMAS JEFFERSON. 
 
 [Extract.'} 
 
 [London, August, 1788.] 
 
 . . . There is a gentleman just arrived from Virginia who left the 
 
 convention debating on the 11'." of June. He says he attended several 
 
 days, and that nothing can exceed the seeming violence with which Mr. 
 
 Henry and Col. Grayson combat the constitution, except the ability 
 
 with which LIr. Madison and Governor Randolph advocate it. Mr. 
 
 Henry used such harsh language in reprobating the fickle conduct of 
 
 the latter that the House compeUed him to ask that gentleman's 
 
 pardon. . . . 
 
 John Beown Cutting.
 
 62 
 
 f * 
 
 rrt>* 
 
 i ^ 
 
 JOSEPH JONES TO JAMES MADISON. 
 
 Richmond, 8 August, 1788. 
 Dear Sir,— Hearing you were about to leave Richmond, I called 
 the moriung you set out to see you, but Anderson informed me you had 
 walked out and to what place he could not tell. I not only wished to 
 take you by the hand before you went away, but was desirous also of 
 apologizing to you for so long delaying the payment of the balance 
 I owe you. Although I have and knew I could presume on the privi- 
 lege of friendship to suit my convenience in the matter, yet I have 
 been uneasy lest in gratifying those who have been importunate, I may 
 have subjected you to inconvenience. I have hopes of being able to 
 accommodate you before Christmas. 
 
 A general acquiescence under the decision of oar convention seemB 
 to prevail through the country. We have no information from North 
 Carolina, consequently cannot communicate even a conjecture what 
 will be the result of their deliberations. From New York we daily 
 expect a communication of their decision, which from the accouuta 
 published in the newspapers will probably be a rejection, or something 
 equal to it. What has been the real object of the motion of Dane and 
 Williamson respecting the military locations on the Cumberland and 
 the reserved territory northwest of the Ohio? I suspect some- 
 thing at bottom more than is expressed. The French minister seems 
 to be warm in his appHcations in the case of Ferriar. A full answer 
 to his note to Mr. Jay was sent sometime ago, but the Secretary's 
 absence has, I suppose, delayed the communication to him. The dele- 
 gates will receive a copy of it. He seems to expect a strict conformity 
 to the stipulations of the consular Convention, which the Delegates say 
 Congress have not ratified, and I have never heard it rested solely with 
 Congress to give it operation. Was it the fact, the minister should not 
 have expected a perfect obedience in the States to the stipulations of 
 that act before it was complete and promulgated. Much less ought he 
 to have insinuated a connivance in the State to the liberation of the 
 men from the consular power before he was better informed of facts, 
 and the authority of the Executive to exercise the powers be supposes 
 they possess. I do not wonder at the zeal of the Count on this occa- 
 sion, as the conduct of the man was very reprehensible, and such viola- 
 tions of trust, especially in commercial countries call for animadversion 
 and punishment ; but 1 think his language and conclusions too strong 
 and not following from the premises. 
 
 I leave this place to morrow, and shall pass a few weeks up the 
 country, not to return here perhaps before October. When you write
 
 63 
 
 direct your letters to Fredericksburg, where I shall mostly be, and in 
 Orange and Culpeper. 
 
 The late storm has, from all I can learn, and the frequent rains einc©, 
 destroyed the crop of tobacco. That which was not drowned is spotting 
 
 and burning. 
 
 Jos. Jones. 
 
 
 '/ 3^ 
 
 •3 
 
 '*
 
 35 
 
 5
 
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