G ^N JViy A. BUDGET SPEECH liKLIVKUKI) Ity HON. CKORCE HrFOSTKK, D.C.L., M.l\ •«• MlNlSTKll OF FINANCE IN TllK HOUSE OF COMiMONS riJKSDAY, •.':". MAIU11 1894 OTTA WA rRINTKI) HY S. E. DAWSON, nilNIKU lO Till'; (^UKKN'S MOST KXCKLI-KNT MA.IKSTY 1894 C^jSTADA BUDGET SPEECH M.I.I \KKKI> l-.Y HON. (.iEUlidI': i:. FUSTKI!, l).('.l.., M\ MINIS rKl; or I'lNANCK HOUSE OF (^OMMONS TIKSDAV, i:"! .MAiail 1894 () T T A W A PRTXTKI) BY S. E. H.VWSON. I'lUNTKH TO THK QUKFNS MOST i:.\(i;f,l,K.\T .M.A.IKSIV BXJDG^ET SPEECH DKLIVKnKU BY HON. GEORGE E. FOSTER, D.C.L, M.P. AnXl.^TKH OF FlXAiVCE IN TIIK HOUSE OF COMMONS, TIJKSDAY, Q7th MARCH, 18SM I WAYS AND MKANS-TUK BUDGKT. Mr. FOSTER moved : Tii.it the HmiHi' rcsolvi' itself into Comiiiiltcf to ouiistiJiT the Ways uiui Mi'iins for misiiig tin- Supply to be grantcil to Her Majesty. He aild : Mr. Sinvikcr, I shiiJl hsive to emvi- the iiuliilK«'iice of the Iloii.se to-day for a more K-nK'thy he!irin>; tlinii tistial, and to bespeak the kindly attention, even a more conshlerato attention, which 1 could scarcely ask, tlian lion. tnenilxTs have jrenerally K'ven me, owinj; to the magnitude and len^'tJi of the task which Is set before ni(». lu tlie first place, I will a.-* lirlelly, a." jdalnly and as de- finitely as pos,>iilile. lay before the House the Rtiilement of the liiiani'i-s of iJie i)reredin,i; year, with the usual ri-inarUs ;iiid obser- vations wltli respect to the current and suc- ctedinir years, and after that, will j)roceeil to explain tlie tariff ri'iviiimn'iidations with which I have been intrusted, and which 1 am to present to the House. I do not In- tend to make any pretense of a speech In \ tlK' slateiuenis that I am to place before the House, but I desire to do my work in tJie shortest and most business-like w.iy po.sslble. HKVENUE FOH 1802-D3. I I-aat year, It will be remembered. I pave no detailed statement of tlie proltable revenue to accrue durliij? the current year, but pave a pross estimate amoiuitlnp to tlie sum of $:{S.fHM».(KH). The actual revenue has e.\- ceedcHl the estimate by $1«8.(K)8, tlie Castoms F 1.1 overrunnhn; tlie Customs receipts of the prtvedliiK ye.ir by $»r»'J.!>44. tlie Excise over running tJie Excise receipts of tiie preceding year by ijrJ-M'i!", and the miscellaneous re venue or earnings overrunniuf; those of the preeedinp year by $.'!71,.')2(i. So that tlie excess of rovenuo from these tliree sources, besides belnj; .'jsKJS.tWi.S more tlian was estimated, shows $l."i4(!,7;57 in advance of the revenue of the precedlnji year. The jirinclpal items in wliicli the revenue increas- ed, briefly stated, axe as follows :— nre,i 7,1.'>0 ll.ijim 1<),.V)8 ;t8,(>Hi 7,407 12,281 I'lixr. and ni.iiiMfii(tiir<»of t '.','.•'•2 Thn nii>\i'ii!7,4!»:< , liik<'n f<)r consiiniiition and duty accrufil on Siiifar, moll»»«H «.4'',f. oxclsnblo articles in ISOii-OH as against W'ikmI, iiinniifitcturen of 17,042 .'' "'•"'"• ^^]nf« .Nliilf fiirar-" .. Citrnri'tti- Tolmcco and intitf 'Pile duties aocrnin); in IW ••_'-",);{ as i(iiniini'i'i> 2,747,r>!»7 60,082,7.M ll4,(!68,SO!i 42,870,bH» l(»,(H)(»,fMI2 Duty, 1S92. t ;«,873,801 928,.'-) 17 G2;t,ii."i2 (I2.!t:« 2,a")t;, 2,37!»,812 8,2f>('.,70»l Incrpftdo in 1803. $ 2<).">,50.'-. 7:i,138 67, (!"(". I,:i72 22,!tO.H 7,840,107 420,.V,tO S Beer .c •J £ ■f r- palls. (falls. (.'alls. 11.S. .Xsivjiire from 1807. 1120 2-7(iS •i:<7 2 1.-.2 do dn 18!)1 r tho average, and over tho coi. The House will see. tlien. from what 1 hav<> stated tli.-it the remarkable fact about the year ISirj ',>;?--;inil I think it is a fact well worth noting just here— has be(>n tli(> extraoriliiiary recupera- tive power whicli has lieen oxhil)iled ; a ro- cnporativo power which in ''anada luis brs'ii in marketl contrast with tiio hislnry of irreati'r coimtrios. and I may ^ay. in fact, with all tho great nations of tlio world. I'or. wlioroas tliose other coimtrios have during tlio .veiir IStH'-OH oxporioncod oxceedingl.v groat disturbances of trado, with a f.alling off in exports and imports, and a tailing olT in ro- \emn' as well ; tho f.-ict remains tliat as far as trado is conrornod. as shown by tho Cus- tom llous(> revontio. as far as oxciso is oon- cornod. and as far as tlie ejirnings. th(> inis- ct'llanoons rovonne of the cotmtry are con- cerned, there was nn increase In each Item; a consldorable and a steady increase over tho .\oar preceding, wiiich. as tlio House inay re- iniinber. marked tho highest period whi.-li had boon nltiilnod from (Joiifedoriition up. Tlies<> facts. I think, are worthy of con- sideration and of note at tills time, siiow- ;iig as tliey do the lioaltliy condition of trado ill Canada as comp.irod with other c(nnit.rios, showing the Increased consumptive power of tho pes. Anotiior gratifying fact about the .year 1,S!V_Mt;t is that the nii.<;ccllaneous receipts of Canada In- creased hy the sum of .fiTI ..">2fi. showing that the earning power of tho.se Investments of the Government has kept steady and gradual pace wit'i tlio tra House with tlioin just hero. I wish to , state that these receipts have shown a gratl- f,\iiig incroa.so for a number of years back. 'I'liey amounted In ISCTtJS to $l,n87,'i47. and I by l,*^7;!-74 they had grown to $4,(»7.">,!M)7. I or an Incroaso of 10." jjcr cent. In 1.S7S-79 I they had decreased sliglitly, nMiiaining almost at the tlguro they wore In ]S7;?-74. In 1892-93 they had bound(>d ui) from four miUlon.s of dollars to $S,,S47,241. or an Increase over 1S7S-70 of 118 per cent. The Increase In the i'arninj;s, or Milsct'lliinfous n-i-fipts of 18'.t2-'.t;! ov.T ilicsc of isiil-'.n' was $:;7l,.-.2t;. us I liavc staitMl. or 4':, per cfiit. Tli<> rati' ol' taxation on lioriii nsiiinptioii i-iitiii's of iliitialtlc Ko<(Is last year was ."ioi's per cent ; on llio total of };ooi|s iinport<>> per cent, thus sliowin:;: a (li'ci'casf In tlio pcricntaK<' raised on woods ontiMvd for coiisninptlon. Iioih diitlalili' and frc •. from L'l-Ul pt-r ('iiii in iss'.tiio ii. IT .'{s imm- iS-nt in the year wiiicli has Just itasstnl. Whilst, tln'rcfore. the otlu>r colonies of (ireal Hritjiin have felt very acutely the commercial de- pression, tlie loss of revenue and t!ie loss of tiade in llieyear ISDi!-!*;!; and wliile tli.tt iia>! Ii< 111 felt also by the p-eui countries i f the world. Caiuida, i)erlia|is. wit.iiout e\ ception .•iiiiongst tlie countries of tli' World, shows an increased trade hotli in im- jiorts and exports, and an ini-reascd revenue of <>uc aud a quarter million dollars over I lie [ireceditij; year IS'Jl-Oi:. KXI'KXUITL'KK KOIl ISOl' rt.'J. Coming now to the ex|)endittn'e for the past year, 1 stated about a year a;;o. or a little more, that my estimate ot exp(>ndituri' for the year kS'.VJ-It.T was ,»;:!r,.r.(i(),(MX>, whereas the actual expendittu'c was i<:!ti,.S14,<).7_'. The iuciune was 9«.".ti,- l(;s,(',(»S. so tliMt the total exjiemlitures on consolidated fund accotiiU taken from tlie ti tal revenue on rest on (he ilebt, the increasiHl 'siukiiiK fund cliar;:os, the large «iuarantine exjienditure to wliieh the country was put, the mail and steamship subventions which have bev'ii added to. and the increasing demands for the various public S(Mvices of the country. In fact It is well for the House to remem- ber lust at this moment, that from IS.ST to lS!il'-;{ there has been almost a stationary ex peniliture ui)on Consolidated Fiuid account. In the year 1.S.S7-.SS, $;{G,71S,4!»4 was expend- ed, aud in 181»li-l)a, ^3(5.814.()5l.'. or an increase of only ^1)5,558, aud the average of the ex- jieniliture for the six years from 18,87-88 to l.S!rj-!».{ was .$:!(J.,V.>'.i,;!lL'. the expenditure during tliose six years being, as 1 have said, .iboiit stationary. So tliat it would not be .inything more than pardonable for me and for the tioverniuent. auil for the party which supiiorts the (iovi-rnnicnt. to i;ike note of tlii> fact, and to (>ini>hasize it -that. In six years of t.'an.idfi's growth with .services iivi-r a widely extended range of coimtry constantly growing, and new ones constant- ly coming to the front, and in a time of |)ro- gress and compelitlou. when thos(> services have to be gencrotisly met, wt> have been .ible to meet them, and have lieen able to keep the •cunlry's ex|)endltiire lUi Consolidated Kund .it an almost stationary figure, and to have a :rood surplus each year to carry to capital account. Coming to capital account, the ex- lieiiditiuv for this year ha.s been in excess of the expenditure of last year, mainly owing to tlie extraordinary expenditiu"!.' lor the finishing of the Sault Ste. Marie Canal. The exiiendiiure upon railroads and cansils. chietly. of course, on <'auals, wjls $2,782,490 ; on public works, .$181,877 ; on Dominion lands, !i!U5,0.!8 ; making altogether .?:{.(»7!l.- 4tHj. as against .$2,l(i."),7tX) for these items the year previous. If you add to this amount railway subsidies, which total .5811,:«U. as compared with :? 1,248,21.') thi- year preced- ing, you liave a total cai)itnl expenditure, ailding some few miscellaneous items, of fi,i);!!),t>7;{ during the year just )iast. Taking from that sum the siu'iilus of ^l,:>."i4,.V>."5. as against an addition to the debt last year of «;:;,: ;:!2,44):!: .■mother evidence of careful linancial super- vision and careful and iirudeni exiieiiditure. The expenditure en capital account, has been icet by temporary loans and by the issue of st(.ck, the temiiorary loans made for this l>\irposi> amounting to li!I,4(><»,(KK), and the stock issue amounting to |l,18tJ,4o;!. So n.ucli with reference to the capital expen- dittire. Sir lllCHARn CARTWUKIHT. Will my lion, friend state from whom he borrowed the $l,4t>0,000 V Mr. I'OSTKIJ. The Hank of Montreal, em- linancial agents, which, I think, took UiHrt of th« TroiiMiirjr nilbi. altlmuKli thvy bnv(< Ix'i'ii MiMiNittI »iiiiu>wh:it l>>' i>ili<-r Lmi duli ll(lUMt>li. KKVf.Nt K \Mi KM-KMHII l(K. 1 K!l.1-!'4. • ■oiiilnjf iiow to ri'Vi'iiiK' ami oxja-iKll- timt for 1M>.'{, I muMi frankly sjiy to Uh' lloiiw that I caiiiint prcwnt so favniir- lil)l)> a Htuti'iiifiil ; liiit thf statriiK'iit. sii'li an It Im. iiiid fxiutly uh it Ih, 1 IntiiKl m kIvc Thi> rovciiUK and fXiM-uditiirc up to tli<- Hull (if Miirch of tlit> pn'Hi'iit yt>iir. and of last year ri«p«'Ctlvt'ly, wi-re n« follows :— Kovenuo to lOtli Manli. IM'JI fi'p.rCHl.OiMi ilo do Is'.i:!. •.'.■•,771,iNHi Kx|> lulittintolntli Miirrli. 1X!M. »'.iki:i.i"i<) do do IMSKl. -J-.'.'.';!,'!."""' fjisr ytar from llio loth of .Manli to tJio ::<)th of .liinc, ri-vciiiio accnu'd to tlir ainoiiiit of |li.',.'!!i7.;e in tariff ctmditioim, and what followed from that, naturally and logically, a general prud- ent restriction of expenditure, and waitltii; to see what the tarilf would be liefore mak- ing larjre purclia.s«'s or underfakiiiK larKc ex- penditmes. This, 1 have no doubt, has liecn tlK- principal cause of the temporary re( e.-4slon of the revenues. There has been, however, 1 think, another caust\ whicli is this : Thouuh tills country stood remarkably Weil the sir<>ss of tlio hard times and tlie com- merciftj disturbances whlcli the world ex- perienced In ISUl: and IS1I.'{, and seemed to have passed tlirou^h them without visible effect upon oiu" trade or revenue, we are now feellnjr the reflex or dyInK Influences of thai World wide deim'sslon and period (if low prices, and It has had and Is having tiie effect In Canadii— 'or n p«'rlod short n« >et, and wlilcli I lii'lieve will not be of lone ilura.ion 4if makli.K peoph' prudent in e.x pendituri< and <-areful and conservative In tlieir purchases. These reasons lead me to think that the revemies will be considerably less durinc tlie year lMt,'!',>4 thiin the revenue which accrued in IMC'it,'!, and from present appearand^ I du not anticipate more tlian thirty six and a half or thirty six and three quarter million of dollars. If tlie e.vpendl- ture from tlie loth of Mapli to the em! ..f the year should be normal, that would lea\e us with a dellcit : but this (iovernment has como to the conclusion- a wise conclusion, wliich 1 think will be )><-ho«il liy this House, and In which the toivernment will liave the coopi-ration and cordial help of the lluiise to endeavour to live iluriiiK tliis year witliin our iiK'ome. and. If our Income is less, to resolutely keep down the expenditure, so that In the end we shall not have that un- welcome visitation wliich so often made its appearance to my lion, frieml who sits op posite me an u^ly and ii!-visa;;e(l deilcii. \ prudent business nutn, any prudent busi nes« .•oiicern, any [irivate jri'iitleman, any liiiusebolder. Would take that course i>{ action : and In lie mitient, It seems to me, to fol- low the same course. It is fortunate that we h!iv(> come pretty closely up to the liuiit of our capital exjiendiftu'e u|)on ureal worlds Tliree luoutiis frotn to-MHl.tios-n..t a very larRo ainonnt. about our it'vt'nuo must nion- n-arly oqiiitl ..ur .'i- $ I '.>.(« km >••<.. aiul wl.iih nMiuiiiw fairly >*ui- pondlturpH on CnsolUlnt.-l rmi.l a. unt. so il..nnry-wo fln.l that tlio total dtimslts ot that we shall liav.' to borrow loss lur the the pcopU'. tlii- total Ka\lii>:s of tin- ptK.plo- uircssary capital fxpoiulltiiiv whkli, from tlmo to time, will have to ho made. Mr. CHAHI/ro.N. What expcnillturr Is (IwiiumI iii'i'ossary on tlit- St. Ijiwri'tic*' lanals, and wliat dt'plh of watur is it pro |H)si>(l to provide ? Mr. rdSTKK. That Is n qnosllon whl.h iiioro partlcidarly portains to my Imn. frliiul pirlod and tlio prcMtnt lla^ takou phut- ol who sits li<'sl<• p«'r hoad for tho popnlatlon of the onntry. Whon wo tako Into aicotmt tho fa:{. 1 have briefly notey to say a w<)Pd or two with roforence to two hundre7S.(rj(;. French commerce (UM'lineii !, they had increased only to .fJO.oLMt, .'>4<>. but the doiKtslts had an upward tend onoy. .'U(,.'{.">«). Another evidence of the thrift and prosperity of our country dur in>: the year 1M!)2-!t;{ is shown hy the fad that whilst this incroa.se took place in the (Sovt'rnmont savings banks, there w;is al844. With tills record of decrease and dee.idenco in Uade, it is ploas- Inj: to contrast <:anada"s experience, which shows an incr<'ase in trade of $ii,'JtiO,177, and an increase In exports of home products o( $(!,4."iS).344. If that is lui indication of protrross relative to our foreiuti commerce, \vh«n we com(> to the country itself wo tlnd ihat more miles of r.-iiiway have been oper- ated, namely. tr,,(>20, as compared with 14,- .-,.s.-> In the procedluK year. We tlnd that there has been an Im-roa.se in tho passengers carried ; we tind iliat about an cHpial amount «)f freiuht has boon move«l— some twenty-two million tons— and we find that (ho earnings are laip'r than in the preoed- iii;; year, aiiiomitlnK to about $rrJ,(»(Ht.Of»0. riio tonnage by lake and sea has lieen well sustalne (imls— tlitTt) lias beiMi a lar«<' (Icvi'lupiiRMit. tlio yoar ISDl'lU sbowiiiji a total export of those proilnots of $4!>,::.!.'.H)«i, a;raiiist .MtJ,- 14r>..V.N> the pnHVNliii)? yoar. As to the ilistri- liution (pf the i'X|torts to tlic riiilcd Slates, Canada sent ft>,02<),'.»lti' worth in 180:;. as a;.'ainst .50,5'.).") iho proc-rdiii;; vi'.ir. Tin; FisrAi, I'oi.irY. Now. Mr. SpoMkor. having thus hriofl.v and rapidl.v jjoue ovor the financial ex- position, as It is oallod (which I thiuli cannot tmt ho. on the whole. s;ralifyin« to the llonse) it hocomes m.v ilnty to take ni) tho second branch of my labour of the day ; that is, to say somethin;; with roforcnc<> to the tariff chaJig<'s wliicli it is proposed to introduce. I am siu'e the House will pardon me if I preface' the recital of these chaujies by some general remarks upon the question. You will aiiree with me. Mr. Speaker, that there could not well be a more important ; ipiostion for a I'arliameut to discuss and for! a couutry to decide than the principle upon ! which and the details with which it arrauy:es its tiseal and tariff le;;islation. The arran.i:e- ment of a tariff and the principle wliicli is to be adopted has two aspects— it looks to the i-evenue which is re(iuiro(1 in a country, and it looks as well to the sencral trade ana development of a country. I wish, at this early stajre of my remarks upon this subject, to .say that, so far as the revenue aspect is concerned, it is of inlinitely less importance than the effect of tho principle and the details of the laritT upiui the trade and de- velopment of a counti'v. 1 know— and lion, uentlemen on bolli sides of ilie House will ri'cinrni/.e it as a fact when 1 state it— that the revenue which is raised under a tariff is used often (and uswl. in my opinion, very often wron};ly'> (>itlier as an arfjument in fa- vour of a tarill' principU' or as an argument against it. It lias not been outside of the experience of myself and other hnn. sjentle- meu on this side of the House ihai the l';ict that tliirly-ei;,'lit millions were raised and spent in the country in a sinule year lias been debited to and made the ground of attack upipii the policy, and tlii> principU> or the policy under which that reveiuie accrued. That is a position wlili'h. to my miini. is sc.inily defensible. The principle of the tariff ha.« nothing to do in this year iSO.'i '.M with tho amount of money which is required for the country's expenditure ; iind the fact that thirt.v-eight millions of dollars are raised iindi'r it is neither an argument for its sup- port nor an argument for Its condemnation. In the first place, thirty-eight millions of dollars are not raised by tho tarill at pre- sent in force, and would not bo raised by any tariff put in force in this country. Of tho thirty-eight millions of dollars of re- venue, twenty-one millions of dollars has to do witli tariff principle or tariff detail. But tho other seventeen millions of dollars are raised in totally different ways, as hon. gi-ntlonien well know. So that the fact that a large .•imount of roviMiue is raised and spent in the country is not to be used by opponents of tho present policy either in Its details or in its principle as an argument against it and for its condonmation. The first thing to be settled by a country In tlits relation is how much money it ought to r.iist> for its current expenses. When once that is settled, then the question of tariff simidy has to do with revenue in this light— whether that rovenuo can be raised under th.at tariff or not. and thou the tariff Is relegated to the place where it projiorly be- longs, and tho view with which it should properly be canvassen a retrospect Is to be taken of the taritl' in its operation, and when the tpiestion comes again before rarllnmont as to the principles of the tarill' and as to the details which shall be built upon those prln- dples. It seems to mo lli.it tlicrc arc only' tliroo possible principU's upon wliic-li. or j iiictlioilH liy wliicli. a tafilT ciin In- ininlfllcd. | <)no is to ii;iv(> siiui>i(> fri'c trade, nmlcr i wliic'li you liave no customs imposts at ail, ; tliM ii'vcnuc necessary for I ho country be- in.i; raised by direct taxation, liowever it may \w ilistributed. Another is to have a ' revenue tarilY which selects a list of articles and places rates of impost upon those articles, <'hlelly with a view to the quickesr. i easiest and best method of raising: tlie amount which Is necessary, but al-^o with the necessary s«iuence of incidental itru tectiou whenever this selicie to consume, and over .ind above that, as much as posslbI(> of what outside comitrles can be «ot to take of the priMlncts of the labours of th(> jjcoiile. S.> the dill'rrence between a revenue tarilT and a Iiroicctive tarifT is not that th(>re may not be in both an incidental protection, but that in n purely revenue tariff that protection Is Niniidy incMeiitai and not desiifiied ; whilst la a pro- tective t.iriir it is both incidental and is do.«)y:ned to be a protection, and is pnt iii)on the statute-book for lliat purpose. Now. Sir, it seems to me that outside of these three methods no others have ever Iteen jiroposed, or have ever been acted upon. Take the til St, the simply fr(>(» tr.ide method. There is no country in the worlad anxc(>ptiou of (ireat Rrit.'iln. has adopted and has in practice, and that is the protective .system, in which a list of artlc!(>s Is selected, iind upon which impost rates are placwl with tlie design, not only of raisinix a reve- nue, but of protecting' the country in its various industries, in its labi>ur and in Its general develojimeiit. ii- protectlve, is a coimtry which commenced her career b.v a protection which In some cas(>s ainoiuited to absolute prohibition, ami wliich, for many years, proKfesseil under a very hi^'h rate ; and it was only wlien at last, b.v the unhiue development of her own forces, her own industrial i)owers as compared with surronndint: (vnintries, and the imlque combin.ition of conditions outside of herself whicli imt her In a i)o-ltioii to doniliiate com|>li'tel,v the industries oi' the world, that she thri>w her ports open ntnl idlowwl all products to come Into her markets without imi)Osts, in order that she inli;ht. for her own interest and b(>ne(ii. carry the ju'oducts of her labour, of her inventive f.icul ties iind ineclianical nenlns. into every (piarter of the world. Slie did that. l)iii year by year her cnstoiners liavt> been learnln;: lier .'irts. tlioii.irh they have uov practised lier example : iind whilst they, in iuvimtive ;;enius. in ineclianical dexterlt.v. in industrial development, in many cases are eciuallinjr ("Jreat Itrit.'iin. or couiins c'.o>e up to her. at the same time they are protecting; 10 ll.i'ir own i>')rts and ilicir own O'liiitr.x ; au.l Mori' tlian that, it proposi-s to bilse its exist- I" (lay wart's and ;.'<»mIs v liicli I'uruii'rly wcie I'liec for many days to come upon that prin- niadi.' in (iiv-at Britain alouc. arc nou- ni.ido In ( "py (lUiirter of tiif lilolic and ihc.\ arc coiniuji from prutcctivc cimntrics intn the markets id' Crcat r.iitain in cniniii'tc witli what she miniilactiiros, and thmwing out of employment, in many instances. Ilie very arti/.aiis wlio are descended from generations of industrial oiieratives in Cireat Hritain. Mr. r.AN'DFdtKIN. Would tlie lion. i;oii- tlon).in leave the a-ailemy an 1 com to I'.irli im -lit ? Mr. r< >S'li;U. 1 have a lirst duty to perform to my hot;, friend to make up for souiething in nhich, possihly. he lias been previously laekiiiK. !ind to K'vt- liiiii a toucli of tli(> aca- demy before I come down to lii.s comprehen- sion. If Canada wore to-night commeneiug anew and discussinj: the principle upon which she should iirranLre her tariff ^itli a view to the do-elopment of her resources and of her industries, she would have this sur- ronndinj^ set of circumstances of which to take coKiiizance : that bein.ir younj;. witliout the ad- vnutaKcs of wcaltli, with all the initial dis- advantages of a new country and a compara- tively undeveloped country, so far as indus- tries are coucerne and th rcely comiieting for trade in those ind;;s- trial products which Canadii herself might have to take for the consumption of her people. If she were in that position to-day it seems to me that tlie very sami- tiling would have to be done which was done in 1878 when she first cmivassed this question, when she first cam(> to the decision that it was impossilile for her to have tlie industrial 4levelopment wliich slie iieediNl, and wliich was necessary to her progress and her jcer- manence, unless she gave to her people the vantage ground of a measure of protection wliich would ndtigate the fierce competition and the aarty esponsiHl that principle, thtit party has ex- lste«l on that principle up to the present time, it exists to- will poll their votes not luany months hence Mr. CII.VKLTOX. How many ? Mr. FOS'l'EU. 1 cannot tell my hoii. friend. If 1 did so, he would know .iust ."is much as I do. and 1 never want an oppon- ent to know as much as I know myself. .Mr. CHAULTON. Does the hon. gentle- man know V Mr. FOSTKH. I invite the hon. gentleman, who will speak in the course of this debate, to be frank in this matter, as he has never been frank with the country or with this Parliament in the matter of tariff, and to tell the iieoplo and to tell this rarliament just what he propones as the principle. T do not a'sk liim for the details, on wliich he will liase his fiscal policy. The (piestion is so serious and tht; consequeiices which hang upon it are so great, that the peoiile will demand— and the hon. gen- tleman might just its well give it now as give it later— that he go to the country with a definition of his principles wliich will not have any doubt about it, l)ut wliich will lie plain, delinite and clear. HAS THIC lAKIFK H.\TK HKKN AHNOHMALLY lIKJll / The ;iolicy of lUMtection. which wa.s ad- cjited in IS7S, has been ol)jcted to for several reasons, and just for ti moment I wish to glance at two or three of the ob- jections which have been made. In the first iilace. it has b(>en objected to l)ecause of the alleged high rate of duty which It im- It poses upon products imported into the coun- try ; and the attempt is made with many persons, who do not liave the advanta>.:o of readinj;, diseussjiis and unih-rstanding these matters as do gentlemen who are con- tinually en;;af:e protective system that has been in tovm' in Canada since 1S7S, and which is in force now, is one that is ab- normally and outraf-'eously hi^h. I,et me discuss that (incstiou for a single moment. Is it hi;;h ? It' tliere is to bo a protective system at all, everybody knows that it nnisi bo higher In its inception than as the years gradually pass, when industries have be- come established and when the industrial development of the country grows apace. If a high degree of protection is necessary at any time, it is necessarj- in the initial year.s of a policy which adopts the principh? of protection as its basis. Comi)aro the rate of Impost upon products coming into this country with that In other protected countries, and how do we stand ? Is the assertion correct, that tlie rate of impost in Canada under th(> protective policy Is absurdly and outrageously high ? Suppose we cou'pare it witli other countries, not with Frant'c. wliicli is a most highly pi'o- tected country, but with the United States, and consider the actual ligures as to what the impiists are in our own country. Well, Sir, if you take the average of tlie ad valorem duty i)aid on all dutiable goods imported into this cotuitry for home con- sumption from 1S70 to ^S'.Y^, you will tind that in no year has (he rate exceeded .'{1 'Sri per cent, and that the average of those years has been liS.'. per cent. That Is a refreshing and moderating fact when taken in coimection witli the assertion constantly made by the opponents of the policy that uniler It the imposts reach 40, 50. 00, 70 and 100 per c«nt. Some hon. MKMHKRS. Hear, hear. Mr. FOSTEU. True In regard to trivial and individual items here and tliere, but entirely misleading, as tending to Induce the ptdilic to believe iliat it is an outrageously high rate. That is a mod(> of .argmiient which Is open to h(in. gentlemen opposite, but at least, we must confess that it has not the merits of open, candid and toiuplete truth. The rate per cent of imports dtitiable com- ing into the United State.? between 1879 and IS'.);; has never been below 43 per cent, and has gone up to i")0 per cent, and the aver- age of those years Is 45;, per cent, on the importe\ free, .as a Oasis of cheap manufacturing, and the duti able list and the free list go side by sid»! and have gone sidi' by side under this policy; and the true measure of the impost and cost, so far as revenno is concerned, and so far as the people of Canada are ccmcerned, is to find out w hat has been the duty rate on the total quantity of goods they have imported and consumed in this country. Taking tliat as a basis, wliat do we tind V Tliat in no year from 1SG0 up to now. has there been more than 21%")7 per cent duty upon dutiable and nondutiable goods on an average as an ad valorem Impost in this country, and' that the average has been 10 per cent. In the United States there has never, until the last two years, been a less duty than U'> per cent ; it has become lower during the last two years, since raw sugar was taken off the dutiable list and put on the free list, but, notwithstanding that fart, from 1S70 to 1.S1K5 the average imiHist on dutiable and free goods in the United States was 21; per cent, while in Canada it was 10 per cent. Mr. CHAUl.TON. What lias it been In the United States during the last two years ? Mr. FOSTER. In the last two years in the Uultetl States it has been 21L'U per cent, and 2'.i-i[i per cent. So that 1 think the contention Is fairly made and Is well foniicb'd. that If you take the liirilT as a wIidIi- ami ooiiiparc it with till' tariff i(f priiirctt'd I'liiiiitrii's, fvcii lis to tlio iliitlal)li> list, it is nil the avfranc ; and if yoii take lu couiicc- ticiti with tliat the laf;:i' freo list wliicli H""'** side hy sidi' with tlio list of imposts, tln' laritT is fi'iiiarlI.l;i|" :ir at the present time 17'- per cent, or tides of wear: the boots uud shoes, upon wliieli tliere is a laritf of .:'> per ceni. I>ui ' every man knows that lu Canada boots and .Mr. (".\S!:Y. No. ;i shade below it. Tin; T\i!iKi AM) .-TAi'i.i; citnm iise for a I nioineiit to tills point. What are tliey V Tlie ' Mr. FOSTKU. 'l'akiii« quality and cost staples of living jtrodiiced in tliis country Into account, 1 say yes. I iiave had two liavo been lieiielited, ill that tiie protective jtieces of cotton placed before iiie, bleaciied policy lias liept the iiiarki't from perlo^lical cotton. and sectional demorali/.atioii. and that has been Us value, and that is the value of the prineiiile of protection .so far as it apiilii's y\y iHisi'i;!:. .\etually yes. My lion lo tlie staple products of the country, which ipjeiid may never liave seen the lilie, inn I • ire produced in siirplius. But, with reference h.ive. One of tiiese pieces was a Canadian lo these tliiii),^ what is the truth of the mat- c,.tton and tiie other :i foreign cotton, and. ler ? In liinilier, in brick, and in stone, which lo i„ok at tlieiii, tliey appeared equally >;ood : are the staples of building, tliis eoiiiitry has i,ut if you tore the foreign cotton, the sU eves a surplus, and they ;ire not eiihaiici'd in ,,t' your coat would be covered witii ilie clay price. Ill llie m.itter of fuel, of wood and liiUn;; with which it aboiunb'd ; wliile. If you of coal: tlie one abounds everywhere, the , ,„ie the Canadian cotton, you had the strong, second alioiinds in dillVieiit iiortions of tlie , steady libre. Take the wooUens of the coun- eountry in large degree ; and since the year t,.y. There has been an average impost Ujion 1S.S7 the only remaining article of the fuel of them of but ;'.0 per cent, and the woollen ihe people. In the sliaiie of ant hraciti- coal, has coiisuiners of Canada have been well suppliwl been free. So lli.ii to-day tli.' fuel that ilie with good iiialerial and cheap. lOven take people of tills country need for warmth and the iron that has been used in the country, for comfort, is free .iiid untouched by the I upon which my lion, friend opposite has de- Xatioual I'olicy re. they are raised lu stu-- 1 i |,;ive been able to get Iroiii him. Hut, liliis, and, so far as the energy and power of I sir. It may surprise my hon. friend, who has Ihe people is concerned, tliey are hamper.'d | ,„-obably not looki^l into it, to know, thai if to no degree by th(> National Policy. The ; i„. will Like the Imports of Iron into this tea, the cotTee and the sugar of the people , ,.„untry l;ist year, and calculate the ad val- have also beeu made free under the National j „rein diUy on the whole of tlu>m, it only Policy-alt'aough thai was a Ivion which I j,iuouuts to 122 per cent. So that, even with •jould not be given by hon. gentlemen oppo ,i,p „utrageous iron duty that Is spoken of so 13 murh. when you take flic lii;;h prlpod. tho low-dutitKl and tho free top-thor. the nvvr- age ad valorem duly last year amounted to alMiut 22 per rent Those are the four jrroat staples of manufactured products, and in that regard I hold that tho National rulicy h.is laid no heavy hand upon tho jiooplo -if this country, so far as the consumption of those articles Is coneorned. Mr. lyAlIUl'Il. Surely, you are not going to amend this very perfect tariff ? Mr. FOSTKU. My hon. frleii.l wants me i to tell him two hoiu's in advance what I am going to do. Mr. LAN'DKRKIN. The chances are even yet. Mr. KOSTKIt. They ;iro even yet. Now with regard to the luxuries. The tiuv in tills country imdor the National Policy has not been excessive and the rate which has been placed upon luxuries Is a i:ite whicli they are (luite able to bear, and whicli in ;iiiy i form of tho tarilT they should bi'ar in their contilbutiou to tile pultlii- service. ABot T K\n\N( i\(; Tin: rosT. Another objeiiiKn that h;is been made to tho National Policy and to the pro- leciive iirinciple in it, is : that ilie c.ist of many mamifaicttn'ed giMxls lias bu enhanceploy the industrial activities, upon which they may giiin experience, and In which they may get siiiil ; and tho object of a protective tariff is to give tliiit vantage ground, tind In giving It 1 frankly admit ihut in the initial stages the price will be raised to a certain degree. But I want to moot my hon. friends opposite on this argumi'nt of theirs, which agtiln Is not altogether tnithful and perfectly honest. That Is : that in theip speeches before tho country and in their spofH-hes In this Mouse, they tax the National Policy with raising the cost to the full amount of the duty which each article bears at pn>- .sent. Now I say lliat that is unfair. 1 aftirni that the only measure of rise, the ulti- mate measure of rise in cost under the Niilioiial Policy is, the difference between the impost that it i>uts upon .-i certain line of gc.iKls and what would have been put upon that line under a roveiiue tariff, and a tariff for revenue purposes only. And 1 say this : tlmt if lion, geiitienien opposite reproach tho National Policy with a .^0 per cent tariff upon hardware, while they ptit a \~Vi per cent impost upon it ; in perfect fairness all tho cost they can debit to tlie National Policy is the ris*> b(>tween IT'C- per cent and .'50 p^r cent, or lL"j per c(>nt. If they thought it was necessary to put a tarItT of 17'{. per c( lit upon boots ;iiid shoes for revenue merely, with the incidental protection that it gave, and if tlie duty on boots and shoes to- da.v is l.'5 per cent, do not debit tho National P(licy with tho full '2't per cent of rise, but debit it with what properly belongs to it. n:!iiiely, the TVi per cent. Let us go further than this. Go back to 1S78 and calculate the ad valorem ecpiivalent upon all goods duti- able and free brought in to this country, and it is 14 per cent. Calculate it to-day and it is 17'^ per cent, and debit the Na- tlcmal Policy with what belongs to It, namely, a rise on the total consumption of the country of .S'^ per cent Now, Sir, I have been frank to admit that, in the initial stages of a protective policy, tho prices of goods manufactured under it will be enhanced; but 1 am here to state another fact, and that is, that as capital Invests Itself, as industrial establishments multiply, as they become diversilied and distributed throughout the country, the power of internal competition comes in to take tho place of external competition— a competition in many cases more keen and destriii'tive than the foreign competition, owing to equal conditions of production and (>qual conditions of carriage and i\ the Statute-hook. Tliere is tin- straiglit • ■St and frcH'st communication betweeu tlic li';:islative power and the constituencies which are the basis of tho le):islatlve power , ;ind no loni.' years of dilly-dallyiny:, no lon^' years oi' dehiy. take jilace lietweeii the ex- pression of the people's sentiments at tlie polls and the cryst.-iUization of tlial senti- ment on the Statute-l)ooks of tiie country And to say tli.'it a system like tiiis. canvass ed from one end of tliis cnuiitry to tlie otluT in tSTS, before an intelli^rent Canadian elect- orate—canvassed ever since, ami decided four times at tlie polls, and always l)y the same intelli;:ent electorate — can be sot down as the cupidity and sellishuess of a few to rob tho people under the jrnise of law, is to make on<' of those assertions, so extrav- i aiiant. and conseiiuently so liarmless, tliai T wonder hon. >rentlemi!n ojiposite have nut reformed their metliods in this r(>spect, and come down to milder and more moderate lan^ruasxe. 1 say. Sir, that tliere was a nobler sentiment and a stronger reason for the adoption of the National Policy iu 1S7S than the one just given. I look upon It that the National Policy in 187S— whosesoever brain conceived it, wherever the plan came from— came at the right moment, and in answer to a sentiment that was growing ;iud developing iu the country— the sentiment springing from a growing knowledge of Can- ada's resources and Canada's greatness ; a sentiment of hope and aspiration. Every ,i\ akening feeling of a people coming up into stronger and lustier manhood at that time, look hold of the idea thjit w.as emliodied in the National Policy. They said this : Here we are, on this continent, a small people, widely separated with geo graphical dilliculties, but with immense ami almost boundless nattiraJ resources ; we can- not make up our minds to live always as a people simply giving our attention to one kind of work, and one kind oidy ; these resources must be developed ; those varied industries which have made the life of all great coimtries. wliich are imlispensable to the life of every great conn try, must be planted, and perman- ently planted, in tliis country as well : and with our present position, and in the competing circuinst:inces aiul rlisadvantages around us, there is no way by wliich we can do that otiier tliaii by making the nt>ces- sary sacrilic(> — liy obtaining for ourselves the vantage ground, even tliougli \\-e liave to l>ay for it at first, in order that thos*? In- dustries may be developed, and in order that We may grow up to be a progi'essiv(> and selfdepeiident p4'opl(>. That was I lie Iiriiiciple taken hold of and embodied in tlie National I'olicy in 1S7S, and to that prin- ciple tlie people of C.in.ida liave been true and steady :il every polling, and in every ele(?tion ever since. Tin: iii:si i.rs ok imioticctiov. Now. Sir. another statement which Ins Iteen luaile widely by lion, genllemeil 011)10- siie— aiiDiJKM" of those mild and moderate stateiiieiits— is that this policy and this sys tem has been a lilighl and a curse to Can Mda. Sir UICII.XKD C.MtTWIllCIIT. Hear. lle;ir Mr. FOSTKU. .And my hou. friend is kind (■nough to emphasize the assertiou which 1 have made, in his usual emphatic way, and in doing so, to help mo iu the answer which I am going to givo to tliat statement. If tho National Policy and tho protective sys- tem has l)e(>n .1 blight and a curse to Can- ada, it has had a very odd way of showing it. Take tho period covered by the National 15 Policy, and contrnst it with any oili«r ijcriod in the history of Canada's growth ; has there ever been a brighter, a strDnger, a more prosperous, a more prou'rossive period ? And this result has lict'ii achieved— it is the dark sjwt in the prospect— uotwithstaiidiny the fact that the National Tolicy has been dci)reriatod by nearly one-liaif of the people of tills country, wlio belonj; to one political party, and desi)ite the groans and sighs and lamentations and objurgations of hon. gen- tlemen ojtposito tliat liave been launcheil against it. I would not find fault if tliey had been launched simply against the policy ; but the trouble is tliey !iave been launched against the country as well. In the creation of despondency in blighting liopo and aspiration, these hon. gentle- men, by the very vehemence and absurdity of their language, have been themselves what they declared llie National Policy was —a bliglit and a curse to this country. Tiiou- sands of people are to-day, far distant from Canadian homes, in countries to wlilcli they wish tliey had never gone, and which they would bo glad to leave ; and they are there for wh.at reason ? Because, Sir, of tlio sad and doleful pictures and prophecies of hon. geulicnien opposite. Somo hon. MIOMHKUS. Oh, oh. .\Ir. FOS'l'i:U. Hon. gentlemen may treat tliis matter liglnly and jissume a careless coimtenance, but it shows r.-ithor a sellish and callous heart after all when they must iviiow that their laclc of faith in and their depreciation, of Canada liave cau.sed tlie ex- patriation of thousands of their too conllding countrymen, tlie vision of whose ;irivations and distress sliould liaimt tlu'iii niglitly in their dreams and daily in tlieir tlioughls. But, Sir, if tiiis National Policy was u blight and a curse to tlie country, It has had an odd way of showing it ; for, from ISTS to tlie present time the revenues of tliis coun- try iiavt." been Ijuoyant and abundant, and the delicits wliich were numerous under hon. gentlemen opixisite. liavo disap- peared, and surpluses liave taken their places. The $(l,00o.o(iii minus sign lias Ix'conie .$J0,- 000,000 with a plus sign. Capital expendi- ture, for llie last fourteen years, has been aided on an average of one and a half millions yearly or more, by tlie overplus from Consolidated l^md revenues. The credit of the country has steadily advanced .and the interest rate on om- debt steadily I decreased. The financial conditions of this cotmtry have been sound, though our peo- ple havt- taken, during these late years, as it was right they shotdd, every couti- sel of i)rudence. In the periods of stn'ss and slorm, wliich have recurred from linu' 'to time, in tlie cycle of f(mrtecn years, Can- ada has stood the strain better than ever she did during similar periods before, and com- j)ar.i lively with other countries has passed tlieni well an record written In bro.ad lines, , and it does not bear out the assertion that j the National Policy has been a blight and a curse to tliis country. The condition of the people has improved. The !?S7,n(»(',000 of ' eai-nings, wliich they had saved in 1878, has 'l)cci.iiie .?L'4:{,(>< '0,000. an incr(>ase of 180 piT cent. The aggregate wealth, comfort and haiMiiiiess of the iieople have iui'rrased enor- mously as regards tlieinselvcs, and comiiara- tlvely as regards other peoples ; so that to-day it is a truism— no argument is required but tlie bare statement is sutlicieiit— th.at tlie peo- ple of Ci-uada. taken as a whole, are as pros- perous and comfortable as the people in any other part of the world. This makes out, I think, a stnmg prima facie case against the I assertion that the National Policy has been a blight and a curse to this country. It has changed the whole face of business in this country. Old Industries have been broad- ened and enlarged ; new ones have been introduced ; tiiere has been a great diversl- flcfltion of lnilnsiri«'S. tofliiy. Soiiif bun. MKMIiKKS. H.nr. Ii.ar I ItcinI tlip census of ' sn imuli in lnvf with fho dmisms tliiit I must t;\\v tlu in some inort? tiguros from it in onlt-r I to inform tliciii uixtii some points which they I have uut found within itii columns. Mr. FOSTKK. My lion, fii.iuls nad it I HB some people road lln- Hilile, to lind Just what they want iind iioihinK ilsf. Imt if iliey rend it carefnlly and reail ii all lliroii>;li. j they will tind evidences of diveisiiicatioii which hear oui my assertion iliat almost everytiilnK recjulred in this country is to-day I'lade liy the meclianics. artisans and worl; people of Canada. (»wr indiisiries have not yel oNertaken Ihe home consumiitMin of the I;eople, Imt are j;radually srowin^' up to tin? point of meeting the consumptive demand in tlie ctiiMiiry. Look at liie lists of r.'.w ma- terial whicli liavt> been brouglit in and which show the |)roi;re.-s of our matiufacturing in- dustries. Let us lake some of the principal ones ; f"lii-.>c fiict(.iif',K, viihieof pro««■. .Sinfar ri'tincries Ho do ... 17,127,100 .Mint, tish, fruit iind vi-getuhle curing. . . l(>,0iJ7,%K T..ii,! .'*!i,'),;«s.^i.!m> Iron and SSImJ iii(lu!>trie8. 18H1. IWM. I InorcnM'. K^tiililishiiicMt H. N,, KlMploVlf.s \VuL'.->; . . Iiu« iiiatcriiil. Kiiiiilii'd pi-nijnct I 9,312 11,024 I M.HM; 4!t,104 i.s i*r.,sn."i.L'ol il,.".7i,sii; 27,.">07.ls.-. llllpulf Ills. Wool (1,2»>,0S4 Cottons 8,011,7.V.i I{aw siigjii ' l!t,K7t>,H72 Hides, *(• 1.202,:«i<' Rubber If<7.2:f4 Jute ."(.."o Lunil>eruiidtiini)<'r(forei>?ii) 20."i,!iS4 Veneers 10,541 Hemp i l!)'.i,17!i Furs imd skins i 14.s,!Hili Raw silk I 32,tKi4 CorkwtKxi I 12,0!i."i Broom corn | S'.t,(».-)4 I0,5(i.%)i4.") 40,2(i;<,;{;<;{ •.V_',(;44,(K!(i « 2.0t.-),17,j .s<)2,ii;< ;<.s(l,.")77 .S77.»;4 .SO.OliS 1,1.")0,1.S4 7s.",,4;« 2ot;.47] 72.!I(1H blf,,!)87 Pig and scrap iron, wlilch in 1S78 was in- troduced to the amount only of 34,W)(i tons, was imported in IS'.K! to tlie amount of 107,- (X3() tons, while 4S, tons were made in this country itself. Tlii-se things show the wonderful increase and expansion in Industrial developments which has taken place. Under the regime of hon. gentle- men opposite, most of our iiianufactm-cd goods we would have imported from abroad, paying the artisan and Hie workingmau in the foreign country. Fnder our policy we Import the raw materials duty free, wo malco them up, and Canadian caiiital, Canadian brawn and Canadian brain has a chance to rlo this work. My hon. friends ojiposito nro The wood industries in 1S.SI hiid an otitpui of S.7.Mr_'-_',llMi. and in bSlH this output h.id become $S28. Tex- tiles show an increase from .1!i;{,L'5f<,l!t7 to .?17.472,22G as between ISSl and ISOL Cheese factoiies show an increase of .S4.;!ll>.s,'{4 ; tlonr mills, .'i;i(»,(>.M.".J14 : sugar reiineries. .S7.- .">(Kt,(MM) ; musical insirinneiiis. J^^.H."..!;!"^ ; paper and pulp ndlls, .i;ii,147,S.'iO; furriers and hatters, .>j;i.(;:!l,;)S() ; tobacco ami cigar niak ers, .fi'.tl.SL'.-Jlit. The wages jtaid in (janada in tlie woiid industries as between INSl and \S<)\. shown an increase of $ti.!t!»4.-J-_':! : leather industries an Increase of $7'.>4,:{31 ; fexiiles an increase of .'iil,7t)7,t'>.V.» ; food in- dustries show an increase of wages of $1.- S((4,b21 ; musical instrument niannfactories an Increase of .'?."ij."),400; paper and pulp mills, $ti!t:{.ini. .^ir U1CI1.\U1> CAKlWUKiUT. 1 .isk the hon. gentleman's pardon for a inomciii. In sjicaking of "textlh's" I undersland him to mean all kinds of woollens as well .as cottons, and so on. Mr. FosriMt. Yes. riirriers and hatters show an increase in wages of .'Rl«!l.(')tl!i. T.Mk- ing tli(>so and a few other industries which I have given. th(> total incr(>aso in wages in \s,'M over ISSt is !i;i!>.r..Si),()44. Mr. CIIAKLTON. Would the hon. gentle- man be kind enough to give Ihe total amounts for IS.Sl. and l.S'.tl, so that we may .judgi' of the percentage of increa,so as well as the total ? 17 Mr. l'(tsri',l{. I am anxioiw in nivc my Mr, CI I. MM. TON. 1 jiiil^'c ihf Imii. jr.nilc- hoii. fiii-iid all till' iiiforiiiaiiiiii I can. Ixit it man miv;lit ilo tltiit lilmsi-lf. happins that I have not ilir tot.ils l.y mi', aiiil yif kosTKK. The foll.nvlUK U ;• mm- I must ask lilin to i-xcrt lils iiivi.siiKatin« ,„.,ry i,f Caiiailiaii iiidusstilt's by the riiiMis fiUMiltics for the liifnrmatlnii iiiiulrtil. returns :— I'v-I. IMII. \' M!l \TIl)N?l. Niiliil»r lit' i»l;ililisli lIHIlt^ Xc. j ! 4!»,!n.';<' L'ts. I Xll Iiur.a^i-. I » .•!>., Nil. i -S I I : :•^.84^' X.. .M K 7.">.7tiK . I I <'ii|pital invi-Kt.'il ' ii;.".,:!"2,i;i';i ;ri:i,s:ii;,si7 \ iss,:,ni,iiii , . II \ I Xiiiiiiii-iMf .iiiiiidyi-i-rt. -j."!-!.!*:*.') ;«;7.w>."> li-J.'i.'io ti i Waj;i- i^iil I .V.I.r.tl.iHL' !l'.l.7i;'-', HI; 4o,;a't.t;t!i . Costiif raw iiiat.iial.. . | \ 17!»,illH,.'>!»H ' I'.M.iKI.LMJt N'.ili f pni'liictH I I ;)(l!l,(i7l'.,K I7"p. l.Vi,7l>.") 7t!.tl«14,t>".'<> l(i.\7ii'.",l'.:i7 1H f,: Ml So tliat ny assertion that a tmtabli- clianp- lias iai in tlir iinliisirial lil'i' of till' niiiiiti'y in lliis pcTliiil of till' Xational rolicy is siilistaiitiati'ij liv ilio best statistics at our conimnml. staiisiics which, takinu tln'iii as the basis of ci.iii- parlsoii bi'twi'i'ii 1SS1 ami IS'.tl. arc riliablc. tlu> stntisiics of is'.tl bi'iiiK as reliable aiiil even more carefully collecteil Ihati those of IS.SI. Rut. Sir. there h.'ive been >;reat ch:im,'es ill fonrtcen ye;irs in the impDsis init upon the iieople. anil I invite the atli'iiiioii of lion. :,'entleineu opjiosile for a iiiomeiit to this point. The history of tlie .National Policy lias not been wholly a history of r.-iisiiif: the import ihilies, altlioiijih lion, fii'iillemen n]< posite are foiiil of so I'cpri'seiiiiii^x il. The Xational Policy has hail two .ittcmlant features which shoiilil be noteil. The tirst is that, while cliaiiu:es were iiiaile in the imposts upon ilntiable « Is. the free list has been constaiilly expaiuliiiK. ami to-ilay it is very larfjo. Another is tliat burdens and imiiosts have been repeatedly taken from the liacks of the people Initn ISSil up to the present time, and that by the very liersons who supported and believed in the National Policy. Now. Sir. if yon wish to debit us witli all the imposts we put on under the Xational Policy, be eipialiy frank and honest in Kivin^; us credit for those we have taken off -and they are neither few nor trival. Sir, In tlie matter of bill stamps and newsjiapers. taxes were taken olT. So far as the second 's ooncerneil I am not prepared to say that the cli;in;.'i' li;,'lili'iii'il the burdens of the people, but it li);hteiu>4l .somebody's burdens certainly, jind If the bellelit did not nil to the lH'ople y;i'ni'r- ally. it went to that very eiiterprisiiij; d.iss of people in our country who disseminiite iii- formaiioii for us, and veiy often };ive us in- formation that we could jji't in no other way. P.ut when We come down to other things, there can be no diuibt abmil where the benelit went. Hon. i-'entlenieii opposite, when In power, taxed tea ,"» and li cents per pound ; under the Xiitional Policy that tax was taken otT. They taxed cutfee 1! and .'! cents ii pound ; under the Xatioiiiil Policy tliat tax was doiii' ;iw;iy with. The lax on an- Ihracile inal, whidi at the befiinnin;; of the Xational Policy Wiis ."iD cents per ton, was taken off in 1S.S7. and iintliracite coal has been free ever since, reiiresentin;; a less- enin.i: of duties to the tune of about three-ipiarters of a niillion dullars a year. The duties on a^-Mix hav(> been reduced ; the duties on salt have been reduced ; the duties on molasses have been reduced one-half ; and, more than all. three years ajro the duty on raw suv:ar was completely taken off. reniit- tini: taxation to the amount that had former- ly been eollected. Some hon. .MEMBERS. Hear, hear. 18 Mr. r<»S-n;U. My li.-ii. Iii.ii'l says •• Hoar. Iifjir." IK) iloiil)t Willi a llii-kcriiiK i admit that, the duty >>n raw siii.'ai- Ix-jii;; taki-n off Uu' taxos of ilii- |icii|ilt' Were sii iniicti litrhii'iicd. ilii-rcforc wf havo ndnilttcd tliat a duty under tho Na- tional Tdllcy is always a tax. But then- is cvi'iy dllTcrciirf Ix'twt'cn a duty on an artl^-lo which is made In this country, ilic lils on su^ar wiif> an actual, positive and Imnu'diiite boneflt to I lie tax-iiayers of this country, a henelit well clilTiLseil over every i)art of this coiuiiry. So that, takin;; these things Mlto;.'ether— and I ask my hon. friend's attention to this—the ;,y^jr,.,.j;„n, auiouut of tMxatiou remitted slm-e issu' ou the articles I have enumerated amounted to .<•_".». ."vmi.ikm*, or an averaj^e of about .«i;.5"tO,()()() a year. I'or 1802-9."?. I have hiul the pleasure of announciii); in Parliament Ui.M we li.id a sunilus of .'!il..",.'(4,o of the tariff, :nid becatise I think it well that they should be brought up in Parliament, jind that tho ar- vrumeiits In rejjly to them should be statfd to tlie |>eople of this country. Tin: I'lilNOIl'I.K or PUOTKCTIOM M.MNTAINKn, -Now. Sir, there have been many changes since 1,878. Since tho inception of the Na- tional Policy. fourtt>en years have gone by. Cliauges have taken place in the bu.';iness oon(iitions of this conntiy Itself. (;haug'.>s in the value of raw material and of manufac- tiu'cd products, changes which, .so f;ir .is the ad valorem equivalents of duties are con- cerned, have made a very great diffe-ence as to the nature and rates of Imposts be- tween those times and the present day. The industries of this country have, tuany of them, well established themselves. The aiuoiuit of prott'clloii wliich they iieod-il be- fore, they do not need to so great .a de^'ree to d.iy ; and for s presi«nt day. Those changes have taken place, and those changes hiive been rocogid/.ed. 1 wish again to sttite j as forcibly .as possibly that the argument - not strong at all. but used lartrely, and teiid- ' Ing to deceive lu some regards, If not cure- I fully considered— that the argument is coin- \ pletely baseless, that the policy of protec- I tlon de|iu]ids upon tlie per cent of impost j that shall be put upon a certain article. B--- I cause tho Government recognizes, as all people recognize, tluit the conditions of i)tisiness have changed wltliin the last roiifie(>n years, and that it is well to re.ar- .range the tariff to suit liiose chtinged condi- j tlons, does not justify the conclusl..n that I therefore tho CJovernnnMit have gone bai-k upon the principle of protection, or denied the- cardinal priuciiile of the National Policy. Sucli reasoning is iiK'onsequeiitlal, .'iiid an argument which has iuMther logic or force. I wish to state here that the Governmout of to- day, and the party which supports the (Jovern meiit of to-day. take their stand sipiarely and firmly tipon the embodiment and upoii the preservation of the priuciph,' of protec- tion In the tarltf. the degree of tiiat protec- tiini to be according to the circuiiistances of the industry and the conditions of l>uslness and of trade at the present time. Btit. when they do that, they tire not to be taunted witli -'oing biick ui>on their policy. The argu- ment is not sound, and cannot fairly be us( d. that they have therefore repuditited thecar- ! dinal principle and plank of their policy for the last 1-t years. So that these chiinges. as I have said, having been recognized it becomes necessary for the Government to carry out its pledge given last year in Par- 19 liuinent, n phxJge wlilch was lightly treated by some lion. Ketitlomcii diiposiii'. \vlii> tliciugbt we wore simply tiiriiiiiK tlic corntT, who tliou>;lit wi' only wanted 1<> shelve the (liiestiou for iinothiT your and. perhaps, t<» KO before the electorate, to get ahead of the hoa. jjt'iillcint'ti opposite i nd steal their elollies —if Indeed tliey liave any political clothes worth atcalini;. 'i'lieir clotlies have become so variegated 'vilhiu the last six or seven years that they outrival Joseph's coat of many colours. Wlalsl we to da.\ lake our stand upon tiie principle of protection in the tarllT, will boa. gentle- men opposite be eS'rEK. There Is one honest fre(» trader in this House, anil he comes from Charlotte county, N.H., who lias no hesiia tlou in saying what his piincii)les are, wliu does not seek to befool or befog the people by stating in a roundabout wjiy what he proposes to do. He is frank euouf;li to say tliat. if he were In power, he would apply tlie principle of free tr.ide and take every vestige of protection out of the tariff of this coimtry. Let me tell that hon. gentleniaii that if he is following the leader of the Op- position with the idea that when he gets Into power at some future time— I do not know- how far dlstjiiit— he will exorcist; (>very ves- tif;e of protection from tlie taritf. he has pinned his faith to a broken reed. In the lirst [ilace. he will not be able to do it ; in the second place, It Is perfectly Impracticiible and iiripossible In this country. Mr. r.n.T-MOR. It is not impossible. You cannot find a bit of protection in the British tariff. Mr. FOSTER. I think I could. Mr. GILLMOU. Then you have got to hunt for it. DIFFICULTIES AND METHODS OF REVISION. Mr. FOSTER. I have to acknowledge that in coming to a revision of the tariff and a rearrangement of It at the present time, F-2i there are two dlHleiiltles that have to lie met. The ilrst ditliculty Is the depression lirices which exist over a large part of the iiianufaciurinL: world to-d.ay. and wliicli are now based on abnornial conditions; and the other dltUculiy is tlie fact that we are face lo face with a revenue which Is not In 'i-easing, but, on the contrary. Is ratlier tailing. These two causes make It dilllcult to-day to revise and an-ange the tariff, and they must Itoth be taken Into accouut in the consideration of the recomniendatioiis which llie (lovernmeiit are to place liefore this House. The brief review that 1 made ■ if the tlnancial situatlwii «1|m>ii tlifiii. it fruuilN of valiialioii ; in iiilicr r)'H|N'CiM tticy iir<- UH*-rnl in iiKlncinL: tlic ccinsiiniiitinn of n lii;:lii'r tin't' urailc of ariiilc lOvcry <-u.sl<>m-i liuusf ollln-r, ">r • iHirsc, (liliirliis In Kpcclllir ilniics ; tiny ari' not comidox. an<1 tlu> linporlciw of tlii- I'.iiinlry titiil it .asy to iiiak<' tln'lr ralciila lions umh-r ilifin. Tin- lit,' in prlrc. Mr. MII.I.S ij'.oiliw.lli. Woollen uos act Ko as to raise ili(> mie upon Hie cheaper tlioii;;h nootl ariieles. thus CtS. Sir i!i('iiAi;i» <'.M;iui;ii;irr. ir ii„ Inn. gentleman will permii in>' lo iniil;e a sMt'Restioii, it is that as li*> appears lo Im> somewhat tired, six o'clo.-k nii;.'lii now be culled, iind ilie hon. ^'eiilienian mlKhi r>- siimc after recess. has been found iinpossllile In all caxi-s to strike them out. and In .sonic <•a.^cs the nc- cessltii'S of the silliation seeni to dl'llllllld their coniiiniancc The prliib- object In view has been to chc.ipeii the cost of niaiiiira<- tnriH In this comilry, to cheapen the co.>i at which the l'ocmIs issue fi-orn the fact'iry It- self ; for iliire is aiioiher fact of which pet.ple think too liiile and which is iiot clearly ireali'd cmii by Ihose who do know it, and that is. that the cost to tho consumer an.el|i| for VYi cents per paikaue, and it never realizes I li'ss than r» cents per package. (Joal oil w is sold at I'elrolia for ti cents per L:iiiion, and the cost of cairyiiic it to a certain i(»wn i was - cents' per i.':illoii, and yci it was I sold in lii.it town at ■_'."• cents and -7 cents. 1 i nnmiicniliie instances can !»■ found of larye iinrease of I'osi on uoods from Ibe lime they leave Hie factory until lliey JJet into the hands of ih )nsiuner. and that has inlli- taleeir. All I ask is. that in lookin;; ai Hie ulii- Mr. l-'<>.STi;iJ. I prefer lo proc i, ns I ' leale cost of the ;,'ooils to the consiiincr, the desire to elo.se a certain ; .nrl of my slate- I mMmiraiiiiie slioiild be looked at aii.iit fmni nient bofore sl\ o'clock (Mie niaiu objct has been to simplify the larilT an mak*- It clear. Its f.ii.'i items of diiiialtle ;;oods have been, as the Mouse will see. \cry consider- alily condensed. 'I'liree seliedllh'S iiave been made ; one for ,( differeni kinds, but | li.il, and liy transleirin^' raw maierials from yet Whicll blended Willi eacll oilier, s,, ;is to | Hie diiliabie to Hie free list. Il lias I n make if dillicult for tlie .aitpiaisers jiiid cus- 1 round in ilie cour.se of Hie work llijil we torn-house ollicers lo tell the diirereife be- |,j,,l pielly well exploited thai division of twooii tlu'iii. lo jilaee iliem under efpijv.-ilent fliities and thus avoid the inconvenience, tlie vexaiion and ilu' coiifiisiou tli;ii .arose from conlliclin;; claliiw as to the (pi.ility of the article and the item under which It c.iine. As fai- as it could possibly be doni', s|ie<>|;il exemptions have been sinieU from the list. Hie subject already, .and that In iliis cotin- iry almost ;ill the irreat stii|iles for manufac- iiirin;: were already on Hie free list, in coiitra-distinction to our nei;rhbours to the soiiUi. where they ari- today liubliiu' over the vexed ipiestiou as to whether or not wool, ;i irie.ai stajile for a larp- Industry In that I'l i< iMitry, iuhI .mi iiiiicli" nf iinirmniis foii Miiiiptliiii, Hhiill Immi- a tax ,,f II ..r l.' i-cntn |i<-r iiiiiiinl or III- i>lar)N| oii tln' I'l'i-i- li-t. In is'.i;!, j(;ii;|,(i(N»,(Hi«i wort'i of pmmIm wcmi- en i<'ii'<| for liniiif (iiiisiiiii|it|i)ii ; of thiH aniniini !<5l.'.'NMi.uK» i-f|(ri'S('iiti| ae (•(■riliiiu' to till" viuoiir mill tin' (|cvrlii|»tii('iil of III"' iiithistry ilsi'ir. ac nliii.' to tin- (v.ii- •lllloiis of compoiltloii oiilHiilc, ncconl ng to llio a«lvnniai;i'S thai lioiin- prMtluciioii Iisih for varjiiiis reasons in our own markrl, anil ai'fonlln;; to nii'ilmils nt iiMsim-ss in sunir rasi'S as wi'll, WIumi an;.' pi-rson timlrr- tiiUi'S to loo|{ at tlic ffTfct ol' till' ilnty wlilrli is pl.ici"! In till' ri'visi'd tariff upon a pailirn- lararlirl"' in wii!"li In- in intori'stcii, hr should not Kiniply look upon llu- impost pl.iri'il upon that artirli', lint hi> shoniii loi)l< as Wfll at ilic list to whirli fri'c (jikmIs have lii-i'ii trans fcrri-il from tin' Jmmmi ri'diii-i-il so far as iiniiort iliity was .•onj'<'riu'y tin' impusltlou ol a ri'asonaldt' ;ive it snilicii'nt vaiitap' u'round to maintain ilsi'lf Iuti', i-m- Itloyin;; lalioiir and payin;; wa.'cs Into the hands of laltoiir. to 1h' usod a^ain in liuyiiit: Iho itriMlUi'ts of tin- farmers, we have en- deavoured to take tliese matters into ac- count, and hy a i-isisonable pretectiun to re- tain all iliose induslries wliicli are in the eiPiintry which employ labour, and wideli work up tlie r;iw material of the country or use iniporteret the beiieiii which accrue-., bill that the Indiisiry sli.all be kepi as well ; for it would be of lliile avail in this country tiiai an oper- iitlve Mhoiild be abl" to buy his t;iMids at ,h cent a pound, or a cent a yard less than :ii I'lcseiit. It he dill dial und4-r a condiiioii of iliiiik's wliicli would keep him from earning' the waKc Willi which it was necessary to net the wheivwlilial to pay for that which he bouiiht. It Is Very well to have In this counlry consumers wlio can u'el wliat tlicy want as cheaply as possible, l>iit It is W"ll also lo have consumers who, by virtue of lu- Vested capital, and by industries in llie coun- try. Iiave a place where iiiey can lind their daily work, tiom wliicli they can draw tinir daily w.me and have tlie ujottey to pay for that whidi Iliey consume. Now, .Mr. Sp ■akei', I have iravelled over tlie most of liie ground that. I think, inierveiied beiween the coiii- iiiencenieii! of my remarks, to wliidi the Mouse has most kindly listened, and the e\ plaiiatioii of the dilTei'cUt tarilf lleiiis. It beiiitf Six o'clock, the Speaker left the tniair. After Recess. I in: \';i!irii.'ii iiAi. iNir.itKsrs consiokhkk. .Mr. I'OSTKU. .Mr. Speaker, when the House rose at six o'clock I was sayinu tii.at in till' lariff revision it has been the aim of tlie Covernmeiit, while seeiii;; tiial induslries are reasonably protected in this country, to also see that the rights of the consumers are caiefiilly looked after, and that all ila.s,ses and all condilions of tlie |i(Mi[ile shall have fair consiih ration in tlie arranj^ement of the laiilT. If there has been any exi eption at all with reference to any class, It has been in I lie view t.li.'ii lias lieen taken with refer- ence to llie incidence of taxaiion upon tliat larp' and worthy class of people in Canada, the foundation of its progress aiiliirs, ilillicllllirs 1)1' i-iim- pililion ill till ;;rc>:it iiiiirkfts of tlH' wnrM 1 sii.\ tliat tliis class iloiiuimls at tbc Lauds (if tho Govcrniiii'ut, as I propose it shall receive, a syinpatliclic and favoiirabli' foiisidi'i'atioii That is not saying: that, in my oiiiniun, tlic a;.'rlciiltiiral intorests of the cotnitry have nut Ix'iTi the ohJiM't of .solieitiidt' hy the (lovern- nient. I tliinU ihcy liavc liefti. and I thinlv ihf LihcralCoiisfrvative Covcrnnicnt sinrc INTS has piirsiiiHl a eoursc of (.onsiant and unvaryintx earc for the intiTests of the far- nici's of this eoiintry. Some hon. .MlOMlUOltS. llcai-, hear. Mr. FOSriOK. Om- friends in Opposition have had nuieli sympalhy and many fail' w ords for tlie farmers. Of course, they have not for the last fourteen years had a chanec to accomplish very nuich so far n.s deeds are i-oneerned. Hut the record of tli(> live years durini; which they occupied otlice. from ISl'A lo 1878, indicates no sp(>cljil coiisider.ation and no special care for tliat class. I may say. with reference to tlie aKriculniral classes of «'aniula, that the (Jovernmeut and the Lit)- or.al-Conservativc party have shown tiicir sympatliy wiili the fartners In what iliey liave done— first, in the protection that they liave giv(>n to the products of tlu' farmer, the protection wliich, as I said in a former part of luy address, was not so much with the object of raisins alniormally the prices of their producti^, as of steady- ing the market for them and prevent- ing sectional and periodical iiu'cads npon tliem, with the result of lowering the fair market value of what they produce. I wish to adduce some tigures to show what lias been done for th(> agricultural int(>rfsts of this country. In 1S77, there was entered for home consumption, of importcsl agricultural products, animals :uid their pnxhuts : from Great Britain, .f.''>l).,"iS8 worth ; from the United States, ,'j!10,(m;(;,<,)C.:! worth ; f mm other countries, $7,7!>8 wort.ii, making a total of $lti,i;U,;?4!). In 1878 these imports for home consumption amounted to $15.- nriO.!);!(X and in 187!) to .'iil(>,4i;().;!44. The Xational Policy did its work, and the result was that the importation of these products f.'ll to $4,240,840 in 1801. to !i!3,002.4,->2 In 1S02, and to !i!ii,741,7;W in 1803. In other words, in the three years, 1877. 187S and 1879, there was an average aimual imi)ort of these pro- ducts for consuiniition of $13,S(i7,.">41, whereas ill the last three years there was an average annual report of the sam(> materiiils for lionie consumption of only $,'J,;{r)S.a44. If we turn again to the imports of Hour and grain of nil kinds, iiiehiding petise. which come entirely from the liiited Stales, we tind th.it tlie im- ports for home consumption were : in 1877. .'Si;?,8."),870 ; in 1878, .i;i;{,4.v_>,4(;o ; but in 18'.rj these Importations had fallen to $1,34.'>,'J'.>4, and in 180:! to :i;i.:i30,420. Hut, as an in -lance of the special protection accorded to certain products of the farmer in 1880-00. [ will read the residts as I have collected them. It is well known that at Ih.at time the ini- |iorts of biicon, hams, shoulders, beef, mut- ton, pork and lard were very large, disphic- ing by that much the same iiroducts of the ''aii.idian fanner, and alTecting him in two ways ; in the lirst place, depriving him of part of the market which legitimately be- longed to hiiu ; and in the n(>xt [dace, tiikiiig :iway from him his desire and encourage- ment to produce those pro1 pounds. Then cim • the legislation, and in the succeeding year. l.'^OO-Ol. the imports fell to 17,4(X),.'")i»4 [lounds •ii 1801-012 to 13,4Sf!,880 pounds, and in 1801' '.•3 to 0,OOO.f>.".l pounds. That is, in 1880-01 I his country alTorded a market for taese pro- duts from the United Stxites lo the value of •S1,734,'_'"J,") ; but in 1802. under the increased protwiiou. that liad been reduced to a markei lor only $4."j'J,812 worth, T'hiit shows In disputably that the farmers have been given control of the market of Canada, and that they have risen to the hoigiit of the de- mands for consumption In this country, and have bwn able to avail tliemselves of this ilieir legitimate market by means of the pro lection given to tliese products. T'hey have had just that much more market for them. Hut another conswiuence is to be noted : the liroduction of those articles has l)een stlinti- lated. The fact that tlie farmer tindg a home market ready for what he produces, gives him the basis of a stock-in-trade on wliich to W(U-k : he worlis on that and enlarges It. and then he looks to the foreign market for the disposal of his surplus product. What hns bceu tlio offuct of that '.' I'l 1^77 tho fanners of this country smit, o( jmricniltui'al [iroducts and animals and tlicir inodiu't^, t> (Jcat Britain $I.'M.'{7,7(;j worlli. and to tli<- InitL'd States $10.11»8,tjy7 worth, or a total of ^iio,li;3,39G. In 1878 tliat total was inen ased to $'J7,t)44,(i:{(; worth. distril)iifed-.S17,o'iS,7:« to Great Briliiin and .'7,L'07 yearly. CoiniuK to 1802 and ISO:'., the exports to (ireat Britain in 1802 reached the Sinn of ?;'.<>, 8(i0,r.9.'i and the exports to llie United States the sum of ifG.Oi.J.OOO, a total of $4(;,U.-.,r)00. In lS92-0;5 they were to !);4(t.- 420,(kS1 to Great Britidn and ! ; the average ixport to the United States aniounte;iven him, the products that formerly came In fi-om the United States, :\ud in consequence of the better position thus accpiired, he has gone into the cidtivatiou of these j) rod nets more largely and sent the stn-plns to Great I'.rilain and the United States— notably Gi'eat Britain— until last year the export reached the very large sum of $49,23,'),0()0. In this respect the National P(jlicy h.as Ixmefited the f.irmer. It has done more. It Inus pro- vided experimental farms, at a very generous cost, from the Treasury. Experiments have been made, bulletins issu(>d. competent teachers have gone throughout the coimtry giving tlie results of their operations and experiments, teacliing tJie people the eU;- uu'utary principles and tlie 'atest results of science and the best business methods in tlie raising of their various products. Further, at a great cost, this policy has, for the last fourteen years, provided transport for the farmers' products going out and for the articles they consumed coming In— a tran.s- p trt system whicli goes into every corner of the country, and which, for excellence anil cheapness, is not surpassed by that of any other country in the world. Is not that a great advantage to the ;igricidtnrists, scattrr- ed throughout the country and depending on these means for the easy access of their goods to market, and benelitiiig by the better ri'sult from the sale of their goods, through the cheapness of transpcut thus afiordcd V These are two or three considerations whicli, I think, make my contention good, that the farmers' interests have not been neglected by the Government heretofor*', .and support my assertion tliat. in tlie revision of the tariff, his interests will again be found not to have been neglected. TUK CII.\N(iKS IN THE TAIUFK — TOIJACCOS AND I.IyUOliS. Now after having made these obser- vations generally and siKx-itically with reference to the tariff, I come to the items themselves. The lirsi item in the schedule of dutiable goods is that of liquors and tobacco. In tobaccos we liavi- made im cliange whatever. In spirituous liqtiors we have made no change whatever. With re- ference to malt liquors, we have made one change. It will be remembered th.it two or three years ago, when I undertook, in the face of a fairly buoyant revenue, to reduce that revenue by .$3,500,000 or more. I had to have recourse, for a limited period at least, to some speedy metluxl of recoupuig the great dro|) in the revenue caused by the reduction of the sug.ar taxation. I did so by putting a larger duty— allhough small in degree— upon tobaccos ; by heighieuiiig the duty to a small extent on spirituous liquors, both excise and customs ; by heigliteniug also the excise on malts, making the excise, wliich had always been in this coimtry, witli the exception of a very short space of time, 1 cent a pound. 2 cents per pound. Tliat was felt to he a very large increase. it operatwl in tliis way : The malt, and con- sequently the beer duty, in this country be- came 7 cents, as compared with 4 cents in Great Britain and 3 8-10 cents in the Unitetl States. The revenue has since come up largely to tlu; expectations formed. The chasm that was made has been tilled, and. luider these circumstances, the Government has determined to take off from the malt duties one-haJf cent per pound, leaving it at one cent and a half Instead of one cent. 24 wliich lias li' I'll III,. timiri> since ('uiilVMlci'a til II. Willi I'lc ...wi'iiiiiiu i)f out" or two years. 'J'lio Iiiss wliidi will uccnu' to ilio fi'vtnnu' frt.m that will In- in tlio iu'l;,'lil)oiirlioo(l of SJINt.lHKI. We will ;;i.t solDO at'ClVtloil of iivcniic [ir ilialily from tlio larger amount of malt made, bi-caiisc. iindor tlio 2 coiit duty on malt, the iiroduiiioii dccifascd to a Certain extent, and sii;,'M!- and otluT sub- stances were used which, it is said, mal^.> an inferior article. T leave that to my hoii. friends opjxjsite to judire. Sir KlCII.Mtl) C.MtrWKHIHr. "Wliat is your owu opiiiiou ? Mr. FOSTKH. I am not a pi-acticiil man myself in tliat respect. Mr. L.\.M>KUKI\. You take moments of weakness oecasionally. though. Mr. FOSTER. 1 do. but am always frank enough to acknowltnlge my inomeuis of weakness. Oth -rs are not. I have seen some hon. gentlemen get very irritable when these moments of weakness were brought to their attention. Sir UICHAUD CAUTWRIGIIT. Will you ti'll us what the I'rohibiiiou Comniissiun has to say about it ? Mr. FOSTIOU. I have not had the pleas- ure of inetMing the proliibiiion deleuaiion, and the commission b;is not yet reiioried. AlililCI l.niiAL PUODfCTS, T come iiexi to the iiem of ngriculnuMl pro- ducts, the second cJa.ss of the svluxlule. From the remarks wliich I have made, it will be seen that it is not the policy of the (^lovernment to decrease in any niaierial de- gree the protection at present afforde nt to show that that test was entirely inadequate. It was impossible to open and ins[iect every barrel and lind the uumbei of pieces, and even if that were possi- ble, it was practiciiblo for dealers to <'ut ! up the hog in such a way that there should bo the rciiuisite number of pieces, even i though it were a light pork, aud tlien, after it was introduced into the country, to re- I pack the pork, tints having the light pork come in at IVL' instead of 11 cents. That ditlicitlty, therefore, had to be over- come, and the simiiljst and easiest way hM.<5 been found to put a uniform duty of 25 per cent on both kinds. This will have the elTect of raising the duty somewhat on tlie lieavy pork, and of reducing it a shade ou the light pork. On the whole, it will make an equitable arrangement, give an adequate protection, aud take away a very serious evil and vexation, not only in the carrying out of the tarilf, but one of which the fann- ers themselves rightly complain, inasmuch as where they supposed they were getting a ' protection of o cents per pound, tlie pork was iictually coming in at 1% cents iier pound. Meats, fresli, n.e.s., which liad been placed at 3 cents per pound, are left as before. Poultry and game are kept at 20 per cent, the same as before. Extracts of meat, lluid beef, not medicated, aud soups, 23 per cent. 25 the same as before. Laid ami cottolene are c'haugo cents per pouiul, and iiO per cent ad vatoreni respeetivdy to an ad valorem duty of 'St per cent. Tallow, stearic acid and stearine, wliicli formerly were 1 cent and .". cents per iioinid, have l)e('n reduced to an ail valorein of diuy of L'O per (('111. Heeswa.v, wliich bore a duty of lid per cent, has beeu reduced to 10 per cent. I'arafhiie. wax and cai\- dlcs, which formerly paid respectively .'{ cents and 5 cents, hav(> been reducetl re- spectively to 2 cents and 4 cents. All candles which formerly bore various duties have b(>en reduced to a common duty of 25 per cent ad valorem. Soap, which bore a specific duty in two cases and a mixed spi^c'tic and ad valorem duty in anoth(>r case— i; „ ...ixed duty beintr 30 cents per pound and 20 per cent and the specific being V/j cents per pound, have been arran.ired trndm- two schedules. Tlio common or laimdr.v soap, not perfumed, will bear a duty of 1 cent instead of a duty of !',•> cents per pound, and those soaps which bore a mixed specific and ad valorem duty, will pay a lunforni rate of ,'!,"> i)er cent. C;istile soaj), iiKittled or while, remains at the ilnty at which it was before— 2 c<>nts per pouiul. Sir lUCIIAUl) CAUTWKKilLT. Can you give the eipuvalent ad valorem duty ? Mr. FOS'I'EH. I think it would be about 25 or .'{0 per cent. <;iue and mueilagt^— glue was formerly dutiable in two way.s— liquid at ."0 per cent, and oilier at ;> cents per pound, and mucilage was ."JO per cent. These have been put into one schedule, .and reduced to 25 per cent. TJrilisli gum, or dextrine, sizing cream, ^.c, are all put uni1c>r one schedule, and (■h;irgealhers. which were in three categories, are now placed in two. undressed feathers, which W(>re formerly dutiable at 15 and 25 per cent, being put at 20 per cent, and others, formerly ;?5 per cent, being now ;?0 per cent. Butter re- mains a.s before, at 4 cents p(>r pound, ami cheese, as before, at 3 cents per pound. Con- densed milk, which was divided into two scliedules, one sweeteiu'd. dutiable at I14 c<'nts per pound and ,".5 jter cent, and the other, unsweetened, at .'15 per cent, have been joined In one class containing condens- ed milk, condensed colTee. condensed coflfee with milk, milk foods, and ;dl simll:ir pre- parations, including preserved ginger. ;ire dutiabl(> at HO per cent ad valorem. When we come to the grains— oats have betMi kept at 1(» cents i)er bushel, and cormneal at 4it Clouts per b.irrel. but two schedules have been formed with other grains, and two or three other agricultur.Ml products. Tho first scliedule confaius corn .'iiid barley. The duties on these are kept as they were before, but there Is added this clause. " Provided that barley and Indian corn shall be free of duty when imported into Canada from the country of production, if such country, whence eitlier or both are imported, admits both these pro- duets free of duty, wlieii imported thence from Canada. That Is an olfer of recipro- city to any country that choo.ses to take It up. Mr. MILLS (nothwell). What Is tho object of leaving oats out ? Mr. FOSTlOlt. The object of leaving oats out of that proposal was to retain protection 10 that product of the farmer In Canada, a very large jiroduct, and one which. In some portions of Canada, might be adversely alTect- ed on several occasions in the Ibtuse. I''orinerly the uncleaned rice, or paddy, was dutiable at ITVj per cent, and tho cleaned rice at 1' i cents per pound. Two nieihods of dealing with these Hems were canvassed. One was to reduce the duty on the uncleaned rice, and to correspondingly rtnluce the duty on the cleaned rice ; but. on the other hand. It Is nece.-isary to look to the contingencies of revenue. Rice Is an article which, al- though it is used largely, is used in small (luantllles by any one family, and the price of it Is not high. A coiLsldcrable duty c:ni easily be got from it. the tax being diffused over the whole couutry, and not being fei^ 26 lis iiuy c'oiisiilcratilc tnirdeu. It has. tlici'L^ tore, boon docided to raise some $:?(i.<)(Hj— I'MsiuK ealunlation i.;,.)n the importation of l.ist yt'ar— in adilitlon to the reveuuc aii'iMdy vieldcd from rice. Sir HIGHAUD CAUTWKKHIT. Wliat will In- your total rovouue on this item '.' Mr. FtJSTEll. I'lic total rt'vciiiic. 1 think. would be ^So.tJOO or $(»,0(J(». That, how- fver, is not at tlio cxpt-nse of the consumer. The duty ui)()n cleaned riee at |)resent is I'i cents per pound. The arrangement ot duties that has been made is tliis : to place I'our-tenths of one cent duty upon the niioleaned rice, ami 1 cent per poimd upon the cleaned rice, and it will re- coup the revenue to the extent of about $.'!0.0(K). Klce tlour and sajro flour, whicli bore a duty of li cents ])er itound. have been placetl at 25 per cent. Wheat atid wheat flour are kept at tlie same r.ites as before— 15 cents per bushel on the former and 75 cents per barrel on the l;itter. His- I i;:t.-. fonuei'ly liore liuties of 25 per cent for iinsweetenetl, and .'{5 per cent for sweetened. -V uniform duty of 25 per cent is no\v placeu iipon them. Macaroni and vermicelli, for- merly 2 cents jier jioiind, are now placed at 2.") per cent ad valorem. Starch, including farina and corn starch, formerly bore a duty of 4 cents per poimd for sweetened, and 2 cents a pound for unsweetened, uo I'liange having been made since the reduction ■ if the duty on sugar. The sweetened and unsweetened have been tmited in one nni- f"nn duty of IV2 cents a poiuid. Sir KTCIIAKD CAUTWRIGIIT. Is tliat expected to make any difference in the revenue ? Mr. I'OSTER. ^'ery little. I do not iliink tliat there will be any great import- ation into tlie country. Sir lUCIIAUD CAU'inVRIGIIT. Perliiips I did not quite luideistaud. I tliouyht the lion, gentleman stated that one was loiu' '•ents a pound and the other two cents, and tliat lie now proposed to make them one and a half cents all round. Mr. FOSTER. Yes. Sir RICHARD CAKTWRIGHT. Well, if lie reduces them to one and a half cents from two and four respectively, there must be more or less loss. Mr. FOS'IMOR. I think, if my hon. friend will look up the returns ho will And that not much sweetened starch product came in at foiu" cents duty. Sweet potatoes and yams, ten cents a Imshel, witli a reduction in behalf of the consumer in part, and a reduction also with reference to the Island of Ber muda, which imposes a very slight duty ujioii Canadian prodticts going in there, and whieli. by letter or otherwise, has brought to tlie attention of the Government the high duty upon iiroducts from that island. I'ieklfs were widely distended and under dif- ferent categories as to duties ; and there were duties upon fractions of a gal Ion as well as upon the gallon. The three schedules of pickles, sauces and cat- sups have been thrown into one, and a uniform duty of 35 per cent instead of tn.' siieeilic and specilic and ad valorem duties combined, has been placed upon luom. Gar den seeds remain tlie same as before, 10 per cent wlieu in bulk, and 25 per cent when in package. Ground mustard, 25 per cent, as before. Mustard cake reduced five per cent, and made fifteen instead of twenty. Malt, fifteen cents per bushel as before. Extract of malt, no change. Xo change has been made in the duty on hops, six cents per pound. Compressi'd yeast, and yeast cakes liavi' been reduced from four and eight cents to three and si.x cents per pound, and the three schedules have been thrown into two. Trees, such as apple, cherry, peach. Iiear, plum, ipiince, of ail kinds, have been made a uniform duty of tliree cents each. The spceihc duty has been retained, as it is almost iiniiossibie to follow these in point of valuation ; that is not much cliange from the present duty. Grape vines, gooseberry buslies, raspberry buslies, currant bushes, and rose bushes, and all fruit plants not else- where specified, shade, lawn, and ornamental trees, shrubs, and plants, the half dozen categories under which these were found, some ad valorem and some speciflc, have lieen grouped under an ad valorem duty of 20 per cent. Mr. CASEY, amount to ? What change does that Mr. F0ST1;r. On some, that is a lower- ing of the duty, it is most difficult to tell, liecause of tlie difiiculty of getting their valuation. Take gooseberry bushes, their valuation, even of the same class, may bo widely difffirnt in two oi three days and is uncertain always. I'.Iat'kltt'rries. ;ioosobcr- rii'S, rasplv-rrit's. strawhiTrios, cherries, and currants, which had a duty of three cents a pound, and one cent a (piart, ri'spiM?tivi'ly, have IxH'U put into one .schedule of two ci-uts ii pound. Sir 1M("II.\U1> CMtTWUKUlT. Wlien yon say two cents per pound, what about I lie pacliajics V Mr. ]'(>STi:U. 'I'he paclcase is included in tlie Weight for duty. Cranberries, plums and q\iincos, which were thirty cents a bushel, liave been put under an ad valorem duty duty, a r(>duction from .'Fl.GO a thousand to .'^l.^)0 a thousand upon ilie Inilk. Peaches, on<» cent per pound, as lii'fore. Fnits, in air ti^ht cans are reduced from three cents a pound to two cents. Sir UlCIIARD CARTWKKillT. I take it that in all these cases the packages are in- cluded ? Mr. FOSTER. P.ncknpes are included where I do not mention otlierwiso. Fruits preserved in brandy are kept at the brandy duty, iFl.OO per Imperial pallon ; that is for fear that more brandy will be brought in than fruits. .Tellies, jams, and preserves, liich are now live cents per pound, are re- duced to three cents per pound. Honey in the comb is kept at the old rate of duty, three cents. Coffee, green, when not Im- ported direct, 10 per cent ; when It is roasted or grotmd, and not imjiorted direct, two cents a pound and 10 per cent. Colt'ee, roasted or ground, wliicli was three cents a pound in the old tariff, becomes two cents per pound. i;.\tract of coffee, or substitutes therefor, formerly live cents per pound, are reduced to three, ('hlcory, which was three and four cents a pound, whether green or dry, becomes three cents per iiuiiud. 'l"ea, a duty of 10 per cent wlien not imiiorted direct. Cocoa paste ami chocolate, which bore a duty of live cents per pound when sweetened, have been placed in the same list. and made four cents per pound. Sir RICHARD CARTWRIGIIT. Do I un- derstand that there is now a duty on cottee of all sorts ? -Mr. FOSTER. There Is a duty of tvo cents on coffee when it Is green, when It 1;. not Imported direct. Wlien it is Imported direct, there is no duty upon it. The .same with reference to tea. Cocoa nuts remain at the same duty as before. Mr. MILLS (Bothwell.) If 1 understand the hou. gentleman, coffee that will be im- ported from Florida will come In free if it was grown In Florida ; but If the coffee was Imported from Cuba to the United States it will pay ten per cent V Mr. FOSTER. It must b(> lmpt)rted direct from growth and production. Desiccated cocoa nut, which, when sweetened, bore eight cents per pouud, has been reduced to four cents per i>ound. A little cliange has been made In ginger and spices of all kinds, form- erly they were 12i/i per cent, and now they liiive been made fifteen per cent ; but when ground, tlie same duty of 2r> per cent has been retained. Nutmegs and mace remain at the same duty. That disposes of the agricultural class of products, treated under the tariff. linOKS AND PAPER. I now come to the third class, which consists of books and papers. On this (iuestlon of books, leaving aside for a mo- ment that of papers, there has been a good deal of writing, a good deal of speaking, and a great many demands have been formtdated from dltl'erent Interests, from the reading public, from tiiat i)ortion of the reading public which may bo called the studying public, who want scientillc, philosophic and educational works which are not printed In this country, and which, for evident reasons, cannot at the present time be economically 28 prodiiocd in tlic fountry. Collc^i's and libraries liavo also made a strong; ploa diu'- • ti>: several ye.irs lor the admission of bouUs for their lihi'a-ii-s free of duty, and also for tlio admission of books for courses of study in the different classes. Then, auain. there is the aspcet of the printers of the coimtry towards tlie hook publishiiis; interest to be considered. 'I'lic book pid>lishin« intei'est in Canada does nol 4ifeupy the position tliat it did many years ay:o. The lariie book houses which weic then seattereil in almost every considerable city, doin>,' business in llieir spe<'ial way, have lar;;ely sjoim out of the business, and it has taken other channels of distribution, most widely among Mhicli is that of the subscription sale and the distribution of books by means of agents through the towns, villages, and rm-al portions of the country. The book duty heretofore has been an ad valorem duty, and that has been com- plained of on the groimd of principle. After considering the matter carefully, tlie de- cision hiis been arrived to change the duty, and to make it a pound duty rather than .in ad valorem. At lirst sight that might seem to defeat the object of those who seek relief for the reading |)ublic who taUi? scien- tilic, philosophical, and educational works, becauso those books art' not ju'inted in tliis country iind camiot be i»riiited here, and it might be thought that the system would bear more heavily on that class and more lightly on the class of books of a more ephemeral character, includ- ing cm-rent literature, i)iit up in paper covers or more lightly put together than l>ooks of the other class. But the test shows that is not so. If you take a sub.scription book, bound, which sells at $:!, its weight will probably be iVmr |Hiunds. I'lider an ad valorem duty of 1.") iier cent, as at present, the duty would be 4."i cents. It is proposed to make the duty a pound duty, (i cents per pound. The duty on such a book would bo 24 cents, Instead of 45 cents. If you come down to current and light literalure, l;irge quantities of which are sent into this coun- try, aud which have not expensive bindings, and whose price is almost nominal, such a book coming liere would weigh half ti pound or tliree-quarters of a iiotmd. .lud iiie in- voice price would bo but- a few cents per pound. The ad valorem duty is almost nothing ; the pound duty will be consider- able. Another point arises, aud that is this, that iu the distribution of boolis in tlie coimtry the post ottico is largely availed of, iind great dithcidty arises from iid valorem duties in the post office customs distribution. It involves the appraisement of oacli book at the place where it is delivered. The pouu i duty is n)iich easier ; the olHc»'r has simply to i>ut the btjok in the scale and weigh it. Sir UlClIAItl) CAKTWKKJIIT. Will It bi' made fractional— 3 cents for the half pound '.' Mr. FOSTER. Yes. Broadly stated, the (inestion of principle I thinii is this, thai the pound duty does not tax the genius, tlie spirit, the thought in the book ; it ta.xes I tlie pajier, binding, aud tlu' articles eiiter- ' lug into its production. It is a better piu- lective duty to those articles and to the printer as regards tliat class of book which I it is possil)le to produce here. The duty I will bo -M cents per poimd for books, Instead of an .id valorem duly of l.'i per cent. Ihii- ' ish coi>yright. reprints of, will Inive in ad- dition to (» cents per pound, a duty of l.'j per cent, whicli is the ii mount we collect in payment of the copyright and transmit. Mr. KDC.Mv. Is this ad valorem V I Mr, !•■( ».STi:U. Yes. I'.ut there is a clause 'attached, whicli is as follows: Tliis duty shall continue' until 'JTtli March, ISO.I, and thereafter tlu' rale shall be (i cents pi'r ] pound, it being the intention of the retained at the samt> rate of duty. Tliis item is a large revenue pro- ducer, and has lieen left unchanged. Sir lUCIIAItD CAKT\VRIGnT. Does the change from ad valorem to specilic make any difference iu the rec<.'lpts V Mr. FOSTKH. It is very difficult to calcu- late that. If you take the returns (m an ad vah>reni basis you have not the weight btit simply the value ; but testing different prices of books as we have done, it nmy be fairly assumed that what is lost on one side is L'ained on the other, and that the r.'ductioii 29 on tho wholo will not ninonnt to a very \nvs:c sum. R;ink nott^s, bonds, bills of t'xchnnjic. and tho like have been kept dutiable at .'!."• per cent ; labels 15 cents per pound and '2'< per rent, this item being also a large rcvi'uuo produeer. Maps and charts are '20 per cent. Tainting, prints, and engravings remain as before. 20 per cent. Playing-cards will b(> () cents per pack : printed music 10 cents per pound. The question of wall pai)ci- has been settlcKl by dropping the specific duties and imposing an ad valorem duty of ;!." per cent all round. I'aiK'r sacks and bags, which were .Ti per cent. liaveb(>en made L'.'i per cent. Mill-l)oard remains the sjinu' as before, 1(» per cent. 'Par re per cent. It is desirable I think to state lu this connec- tion with rosi)ect to books on the free list— and I am stating it brietiy jind from memory —that these include IJililes, psalm-books, prayer-books, and liymn-books, instead of being charged ."« per cent ; books for uni- vi'rsity. college, and libraries of that kind, biMilis for ptiblic and incorporated mecliauics' lil)raries are also made free to the extent of two copies to eacli institution. Tiooks found in the regular ciirriculmu of colleges, uni- versities, and academies, being of a kind not printed or reprinted in Canada, arc allowe-oiu\ ssion. Mr. S)ie;iker, got by tlie Opposi- tion from the predecessor of the lion, gen- tleman, and 1 should say, wrung out of the Ministry by the Opposition. Mr. FO.'^TRR. I hope the Opposition have used them. CIIKMICM.S, .ill.s AMI IVMSIS. Coming next to chemicals, oils and paints. 'I'he vinegar duty has iK'cn kept the same as before There is an e.vcise upon the manufacture of vinegar in the cotmtry, all of which is carried on under tlie Inland Revenue, and it is proposed to make the excise duty larger and to get an additional revenue of some thousands of dollars there- from. The iirotection uiion vinegar is a large protection, but it is almost impossible to make it other than it is and keep vinegar from bi'iiig made wholesale from acetic acid and otlier ingredients of .-i deleterious and uiihe.-iltliy kind. So that that problem has been solved by keeping the vinegar at tlie old duty, and by raising an additional amount of r(>venue from the nianufacttu'e of it in the shajie of e.vcise. Sir RICHARD CARTWRIGHT. How n.ticli ? Mr. FOSTER. The additional income will !)(> probably about .-JliO.tMiO. Acid, acetic iind ipyroligneinis of any strength for the purpose of manufactures wliicli bore a dtity of 25 cents per gallon and 20 per cent, has been r(duced to 25 per cent. Aciil. mtu'iatic and nitric has l»een reduceil from 2.^ per cent to 20 per cent. Sulphuric acid which boi'c a duty of five-ti'Uths of a cent per pound lias been reduced to four-tenths ; sulphuric ether is the same duty, viz., 5 cents per piaind. .\cid jihosphate has been reduced from 3 cents to 2 cents per pound. Liquorice paste and liquorice root, which has a duty of 2 and 3 cents a pound, have been nuade ad valorem 20 per cent, a considerable reduc- tion ; !ill medicinal preparations and patent medicines have been kept at the same rate : ,">() per cent for liquids and 25 per cent for others. Cod liver oil. medicated, is kept at tlie old rat.<>, 20 per cent. Essential oils, largely used in manufacturing soaps of the lietter kind, in fact all perfumed soaps, re- duced from 20 per cent to 10 per cent. Po- mades are kept at the same rate. Perfumery, including toilet preparations, have been kept at the same r.ate, namely, ;>0 per cent. V.i- rious representations have been made in Par- liament and out of Parliament, looking to flic reduction of duty upon illuminating oil. .\fter having carefully thought over the sub- ject with a view to do whati.-ver was reason- •M) .•ililc> for ilic LTfricral ccinsiiiniiiLr |iiil)ll<', ami with ,1 Very stnmir iiiiwilliMi-'nf^s to di-r-tioy iiii iniliistry wliit'h li:is existcil from Con- f> deration up, and I'xistiMl always under 'lie jiroliH-tloii of the (loverinncnt ; an industry which is IoimI I admit, but whicli is peculiar in its naiin-c in that, in tlio locality in wiiii'li it pxists it is widely distril>uieii and l»'- rmues a liviiii;, cacli well, to tiie family, tlie small holder tliat owns the l.ijid n|ion which tlio well is worl- time the Canadian oils were scdlini; from 2.') cents to 4.% cents per ;.'iillon in Can.ada. tliey were beiuK sold In Iiulk nt Potiolia foi- '.t )\nd 11 cents per >;all(ui. It was i)oinre(1 out to tlie producers last year tluit it was necessary \'"v ilieiu to talve measures by \vlii(.'h oil sliould l)e re- duced in price to the consuinin;: jiidiiic, and witii an expenditure of ccunmend.-ilile oneriry, !iuy iiave perfected arrantremonts by wliicii to-day. in.stead of the prices which 1 have ipioted. oil 1.S beinj: distributed now from Cal- vary to Cai)o Hreton. and sold at no [ilacc iit a cost ;rreater than 2.T ceiiis per jralloii. and comin^r dowii to a cost of 10 ami 12'/j cents per gallon. The duty of 7 15 cents per L'allon is a lar^re duty, but it is a duty which is not availed of by th(> producers and sel- lers of the oil. On the otlit>r hand, from tiioso who use American oil :i very iary:e reveinie. som<» ■$44X>, been made. however, witli reference to the distribution. and arran>:eu)euts will bo luaile liy the In- land Revenno by which tliis oil eati lie de livered .-ind storiMl in tanks In any city or in any village, ami by which it can be disin buti^l without many of tliu vexations and additions to tile expen.ses whicli exist. Mr. .MILLS («oihwell). Are the me.ins ..f larriaiic to be iiiterferwl with ? Mr. rOSTER. Do you mean in transport by rail ? .Mr. MILLS (Both well). Or by water. Mr. FOSTER. The law in that nspect will remain the sanu' as it is to-day. How- ev(»r, the duty on barrels in which oil i-^ bron;rht in is at present 4it cents, and tltit has been reduced to 2n cents, ulvlnu' in thai method of l)riii.t,'iii>; in tlie oil by liarrels. .i reduction of 20 cents on each barrel. In crude oils iind gas oil and fuel oil, for fuel and maiiufacturini; purposes, a rediieiioii has been iiKule of oiiehalf of the present duty, ami in liibricatiiijr oil the limit upon which that duty is placeil has been ie(liicents per pound and wiiich is Ilie raw material for a great variety of industries, has been lowereil. .and instead of that duty which I liave mentioned, an ad valorem duly of 20 per cent has been jilaced ui'ou ii. which is a very consideriible reduction r«ard oil. neat's-foot oils, and s(>same see.l oils remain at the same rate of 20 per cent. Olive oil prepared for salad purposes, has been increased from 20 to :?0 per cent. 01i\e lil in bulk for mnnufacturing purposes has lieeu placed on the free list, used, as it is •oming to be now, very largely in the manu- facture of tlie better kinds of soap and in various otlier articles, and in tlie prepara- tion of sardines and the putting up of fi>ii. N'aseline is to have a duty of 35 per cent instead of the old duty of 6 cents and 1 I'ents per iioimd. Blacking, shoe and sho- luakers' ink is reduced from 3i) per cent to J5 per cent. Ink for writing has been re- luced from 25 to 20 per cent. Bluein,' has 'leeu reducetl from ."^n to 25 per cent. Dry white and re per cent. Oxiiles, ochres and octuvy eartli. fiuv sienniis and colours, have been ri'diice.l from .'{(I per cent to 20 per cent. Paints and colours which bore a 3() per lent duty, mid in another cUiss, 5 cents a puimd and ■_'."> per (I'lit duty, h:ive iieen reilnccsi all roiiiiil to an oven 1'5 per cent. I'aints and coloin's, ;;round In spirits, are kept at the same duty which is the spirit duty of $1 a irallon. but scarcely luiything is lione in that line, no importation now takin;: plari'. Turp ntine which is a basis for dilTcient nianul'aciurin;,' processes has been reduced from 10 per cent to 5 per cent. Varnishes, lacipiers. jap:ins and the like which bore a duty of lio cents and 25 per cent, have been r<'dui<>d to 20 tents a gadon and 2(.> |ier cent. I'aris green is kept at the same duty, namely. 10 per cent. I'utty has been riHlnceil from 2.") to l.'> per cent. K.\irriii;.\wAi:K, c.l.s.ss .wd STO\i:\VAiii.. Coming to the class of eaitlis. earthen wai'e, gl.-issware and stoncw.ire : brick foi building nmiains at 20 per cent. There were two schedules, one of China and poi«e;alu ware, and one of earthenware. Tlie duty on china and porcelain w.'is less tlian the duty on earthenware, and there wei\? occasions lor disputes arising at custom-houses. The two arc thrown into one, ;ind the couuuon duty of 30 per cent is put upon tlicm. lOarilK'n- ware and stoneware, iLmhIj )hus or jugs. churns or crocks are reduced from ;{ cents to 2 cents a gallon of holding caiiacity. Drain pipes and tiles are kept at the old rate. On glass the duties have not been interfered with in the main, except that small wares of glass, small bottles and the like, which bore ."> cents a doz(ni and :>n per cent, liave all been placed in the general cl.'iss bearing .'to i)ei' cent ad valorem. Insulators of all kinils and laiups, including arc and incandesecent lamps, lani|) cliimneys. side-lights and head lights, shades, globes, and all that kind of articles, which bore 5 cents a dozen and ."io Iier cent, and some few 2") per cent, hav(> been placed under the connuon duty of :?(> per cent, a reduction on the whoii*. Sir RICHARD CARTWUKillT. Wliat does that cover ? Mr. FOSTER. That cov-i-s nil kinds of electric tl.Ktures ,iud all kinds of lamps, side- lights, sliades and globes, whether for oil electric light or gas. Outside of what I have uientioniil. the only cliange in the scneral glass diuy lias lieeii to ve.lU-'e ili«' duty s«onif- what on plate glass, which comes in panes of not less than 12 feet sipia'c, the duty being riHluced from ti lo I cents per square foot The duly on the oiIhm- gkisses n-maius at ihe same tigin-e, iliat schedule having been veiy carefidiy gone over two or turee years at"' and arranged very satisfaL-tordy, ; tlilnk, both to the importer and lo ilit- revcnu". t»n spectacles and eye-glasses tlie dury is :!0 per cent, as l)efore, and uiion the frames or parts thereof, 20 per cent. Show-i aNC.-t, which b.ore a inixetl duty of $2 earli and '.'''< |m r I'.'iit. have been placed .at .Jo per cent. Magic lanterns and slides therefor, pliilosopliical, photograjjliic, luatliem.-itii'.al and oiitical in- struments, 2.') per cent. Cenieut, whicii ran through live .sche uniform duty of 20 jxt cent. Mr. MILLS (Bothwcll). Surely, nothing was .absurd in the National I'o'ity. Mr. FOSTIOK. The story is told tlint at one time slate was charged at so much per sqmire foot, and the way adopted to get at the duty on slate-pencils was to find out the number of slate-pencils that would He in a square foot and to calcul- ate the amount of tlie duty from th it. I state th.-it by way of informatiim to tlie lion, gentlemen when they come to frame their tariff. I.F,.\THI;R AM) .MAMFAf'Triil^S OF. Leather, manufactures of. and rublier form the next class. On fur skins, lo per cent, as at present. On fur caps, hats :ind the like, 2.5 per cent, as at present. Leather-board and le.itheroid and boot 32 jiiul «luM'-<()iiiit«'r.-i. Li) pi'i- fMt. I.ciitlnr .'itiii skins iKit iiiliiTwisi' ji'iividfil tor. wlicii i.iiinitl. iK'ltiiii.' IfatliiT sole Irailier, uplti-r li'ailici-, iiirliiiliii:: (luiunl.i, coidovaii, IjmiiIi. sliffj) iiiiil call'. Iii'i.r n iiniloiiii duly of ir. per (ciit. This is .i -li:;!!! r.'iliii'- lidii. Siilc Irailicr. roiitrli nr uii'ln ss.i.l, is ilif same as licfcu'c, iti per cfiu. ' >ii japaii- rii'tl, jiati'iii or ciiainclli-d Icailicr. a iinifnriii duty iif 'j^'io per cent. Sliiiis for iiKiroci-o li'athor. taiiiK'd. Imt ii'«i fufllici- niainifa*'- iin-cil, IT, per (•(■III. <;iov(' Icatlici's ar,', as lii'forc. at l(t per cent. .VII Miainif.ictiiri's of Icallu'i'. not clscwiicrc spcciiicd, .iro l>'fl at ■JT, per cent. McltinK of liailiiT or other material, is I'ediiced fi J.'i to Jd per cent. Harness iind saddlery ot excry deseripiioii is placed at .'!(» pel- cent. Wllips, wilicli were .'((.> conts per dozen and .'in per cent ad val- orem, have tieeii put at .■)."» per cent ad val- orem. Hoots and shoes are kept al J." per cent. India-riililier lioots and sli(»es, wiili tops or npp(>rs of cloih or of nialerial ether ili.-ui riiliher. wliicli bore ."..". p(>r (•(■nt. arc put at .'!(• iier cent. lndia-nil)l)er Imois and al of attention and c;ircrtil coiisideraiioii has been bestowed. On tlie one liaiid. the duth^s upon iron have been and ;ire relatively hij,'h. On the other hand, there is ilio patent fact that unless tli(M-e lie a sntliciciit hidnce- iii(>nt in the way of protection or lioimty uiveii for the nianufacturo of iron, it will he im- possible in this country, as it has lieeii found impossible in all other countries, (>ver lo rise from the in-oduction of raw ores, which abound in this country, to the independent and self-contained manufacture of the 'arijer portion of the Iron iie(ni duty beliigr ' I .¥1.". per Ion. upon wliicJi to hnlM up I'ne manufacture of iron in the coiinrry. Scrap, which Is a nnv niateriiil. out of which bar iron Is made. was. however, when those duties were arr;iii«;ed In Is.sT. left at the im- port dllt.V of .*-. 'I'll nse(plellce of that I has lieeii sinijily this: Instead of ilic bar ii'oii of the country bein;,' made from [ind- (llcd bars, the product from piy; iron, and the latter from the iron ores of ilie couii- ti'y. no bar iron is ;it present made in the • ■(Miniry from puddled bars. .Ml lli.at is I made is made from scrap, eitlwr the native s(a';ip or imporlcd scrap. That has its effect j upon the (pi.'ility of ihc iron, but its most serious elfeci is to retard in ili;ii way the 'development, so much desireil. of the iron in- Idnstry. Some nielhod. tlicrefore. had to be adoptc(l ill order to remove that disadvani- a^e. It is not III" iiilciilioii of the (lov |ermiicni to lake ilie line whicli has been jassciiicil to by in.v lion, friends o|ipo. as mucli relief a-; possible to llio^e who make up all kinds of articles from Ihe iron of commerce— that is. the puddled bar. or the b.ir iron. In si • in;r belweeii these two conflicting: iniei'csis, the (Government have concluded lo adopt this as their polic.v. Briefly stated, it is .is follows : to kei^p unon iiitr iron the same customs duty and the saiii(> lionnty as nt Iii-(>S(>nt— the duty beiiiy: .'<4 per ton. and the bounty ^- jier ton. Mr. KDlJAIl. That is on the net ton. Mr. FOSTEU. Yes ; the net ton is alw.iys understood in our duties. That drives to plK iron a protection of '$C, ]u-v ton. It is not jiroposcd to disturb that duly. The difflcnlty, however, which has occurred from 33 tho introduction of scnip, nnd the practical aiakinj; of all the bar Iron of ilu' country from scrap. Imil to be mot, and tho proposal of tho Govonimont is to mako the scrap tlutlca, from to-day tiiilil tlu- end of the year, $15 instead of $•_', and after tho 1st of January, 18t)5, $4 per ton. Sir HIOIIARD CAKT\VIU(!H T. How much revenue do you expect from tliat V ^rr. FOSTER. It is impnssil)le to nialvo any estimate. Under Uiat duty it is supposed th;it not a very great deal of foreifni scrap will bo imported. Our object is to Induce the manufacture of bar iron from tho iron of the country— from tho puddled bars. Sir RICHARD OARTWUICHT. You ex- pect that duty to bo prohibitive ? Mr. FOSTER. It will laiwly act as a di'terrent to tho importation of forei^'n scrap. It is proposed to keep the duly and bounty upon piR iron. In order to rrduco tlie cost of merchiintablo iron to tho country, a re- duction will be made In bar Iron of .$3 per ton. reducing' it from firj to .?!(). A ro- duction will bo made also in puddled bar from .?0 to $5, being n. reduclion of iB4 per ton, and iron and steel will bo treated all through on an equality as respects the Im- posts, and uixin these lowered duties on steel and iron tlie reductions have been made in tho articles which are manufactured from tlieso forms of iron. But in order to stimu- late tho production of puddled bar from tlie pig iron, so Uiat the process of development may not stop at the point of pig iron, it is proposed to give a bounty of .f2 per ton upon puddled bar. and what corresponds to that in steel. Both bounties in pig iron and ptiddlod bar to run live years from tho day of tills enactment, and also with this proviso, that If In two years from this, for instance a blast furnace starts and goes Into the operation of making Iron, it shall have the bonelit of tho bounties, on the strength of whicli it made the investment, for flvo years from tlio time it commeiic<"l to mako tho pig iron or puddled bai-s. :Mr. TATERSOX (Brant). Will the old con- cerns go on for five years ? Mr. FOSTER. They go on five years from this date. Mr. CIIAIU/rON. How will it be in the case of one starting four years from this date ? F 3 Mr. FOSI'EU. It will have the live years boimty in Ilie same way. Mr. FATEUSON (Brant). That one r these pro- ceedings, bounty included ? Mr. FOSTER. I may mention that al- though in tho lirst years of tlio bounty no vi'i-y groat progress was made, there has boon in the last three years great progress in tlie manufacture of iivjn, and last year tlio manufacturo of pig iron in tiiis country, upon wliicli the bounty was paid, amounted to 48.000 tons. This year, up to March, tho amount made was 42.(X)() tons. So that there is every possibility tliat tho current year will see pig iron made in tliis country to the extent of ."jO.OOO tons. Tlie Iwunty upon puddled bar, it is calculated, will in- crease that amount by about one-half, so that for the next tlireo or four years— the bounty being ?2 per ton— the amount paid will run from JFnO.OiiO up probably to !512i).0()O, or .^l.'iO.noO. or course, all depends upon iho rapidity and extent of the developiiKUt in tho production of this kind of iron. Mr. EDGAR. That Is, on tho two. Mr. FOSTini. On the two. The duty on wrought scrap iron and scrap steel tlion is, as I Ijavo stated it, and the duty upon pig iron is $4 p(>r ton, as at present. Sir RICHARD CARTWRIGHT. I did not observe that the hon. gentleman gave any :w iiiiiiiiaiioi, .,r III,. |,.v^ ..I iwrmi-. |Mii« I ' " • " ' '" ""• '"""i":'l '"i'- "f .■- i"r on ilM' I hiinhs I,.. i,ru,M.s..> I Ak,- ii "f. "''>'•''• "'' ' ■^'•- ^^'" '"' " ,( iiiii.l..iii..uu .•<» |..T Inn. 11. • MMullI I.) IlilV lliusr lU'Ur.-S '"lI nllMT Jllirl.'S 111;!-!.- iVul,, tll.'S<> IIial.TiMls. iMl'i.r.' him. r'ir«iiiL's of iion unil stcfl. wliicli w.-iv \'.j I ri'iils iM'i- |iiiiinil. Iiiil not l<-s,s than :;.'■ |>rr .Mr. loSTKU. .\s far as .an l- .al.-u ,.„„,_ ,,.,^... , „ ,.,^„,, ,„ .,.- ,„,,,..,„ ,j„„,.., Iai.-.l. III., l.-ss nn ni.iais an.l niannla.'iuivs, .^.^^^^ ^^^. ^,^,^,, ^^^^„.,^.^ H.ann.'ls. sirwhiiMl ..wlnu I.. II... n.lu.-ii..n |.r..|M,s...l in .Inifs, ^,_,^|^_ ^ ,^^^^, ^|^^,^.,,^, s.-.-tJons, w.-i;.'irm;: !.•<,. will a.i....in. t.. nl.....i .5:!.-.• ■'- -' '■ "-'•nra...v will h.' iM„...ssil.l... ,.,,^, ^^.,^.^.,^ ^^,^_^.^, ,^^^.^,_ ,^. ^^^_,_, ,^^, ,^^.^ |^,_ l,....ans.. w.. .1.. n..i kn-w wliai will 1... tl... ,,„„,,,.,.,_ ,„„, „.|,i,,„ ^^,|„.„ i,,,,,,;,,.,., ,,, ..ir...ts ..f II...S.. .luii-s l-i yr:n I.. v..ar. ,^_.,|^,^, ,,^^.,^,,,,.^ ,.^^^. „^^, j^^^^.j^,,^ ,__..|,; liar ir.iii an.l stf..!, as 1 have slat. ..I, ai'.. ,.,,., . . ,.,. . , . ' '" " Itiiil.lin^'. cam.. HI al l:^'. p.'r ....iil. liavf 1 ii ri'diiffil I.' $1" tl toll, from .1!l."t :i ton. Ir.m ,, , , ,.,, , . ,.,. , . ' . 1 . .. . |i1,icim1 III t-'j pf.r ('..III, III.. ...in.liiiiin li'.iii;; .u" steel iilat.'s u|. sli....|s. sli..ai'.'.l or \in ... ,., .i . ., . . . ■ .. .!< ^11.1 1 i.i laK..|i ..If. s.i ili.'ii llji.y iiiav li.- im|iiirl...l l..|. slieari..l, li.i.ips, liainls. snips, an.l .sk.'lp . , . .■ • . ■ ■ . , ' ' ' rsi" liv aii\ ipiii. at this ral... Ir.m lin.K'..s ir.m .>!• si.'i'l. sli.'iir.'.l .>r rnlle.l in ^rroovi'H, i , . ■ • , ,. , , " " ' '• " jiiiii sirii.iiiral ir.m work, t.irnierlv eliarm..l .'in. I 'I'lm .)r sie..| "( all wi.lilis no! tliinn.'r ,, , i i . . i .,' ,. '" ' .,, , I'l cents per ii.iunil, Iml not less tlian iliiriv- tlian niiiiil)..r s..V(.iii..".|i ;;am;... n.'.s., will li.' ,. . i i ■ i ■ . .. . '"'"' " " " li^.,, |„,,. ,.,.„(_ i,.„| i„,,.„ placed at .ill per .'.mi. .<;i(t iM.r t.>ii. riat.'s or sli....is ol imii ..r ,.,,,,,, , ., ,. ., ^' 1" . ' " lr.in anil steel railway liars, or rails I. ir mil stei.l over iliirtv iiirli..s wi.l... an.l not less r <■ i • "' ' • ,. , ways an.l traiiiwavs. of aiiv form, piiin li..( an imli in ilii.-kiiess, , ■ ,■ . ■' ,• . ■ . .... ' , ., , . . '" ""I |mnclii..l. torinerly diitialil.. at i iicr c.miiiioiilv d.nomiiiMl...l iMdli.r plale. ami iinl- •,,.,• . • ,■, , , ■ . i.m. \mII l(i. tix...l li.'r.'alti.r at .!() per .■..111. versal mill .ir mll.'.l ...lue st....| plai..s. n.ii (..vccediiii.' Ihiity in.li..s in wi.lili. will I... >Ii-- SO.M KUVI l.l.i:. I)o..s this apply to iL't.:; per c..iit. A larL'.. r(..lii.ti.m is nia.l.. in cl....|ric r.-iihvays V ir.m '.r St... •! sli....ts, h.M.iis, l.an.ls, an.l strips, y^i^. |.-(,sTKIt. Y.'s, this w.ml.l apply le orolhor ir.m ..r sl...-lof all wi.lths. si i ir.m. ,.i,„.|ri-. railways. Uailway lish plate.s aiin ...mnn.m ..r lila.-k, sm<)..th, i...lish...l. ....ate.l ,•„. p].,t,.^_ f„rin..rly ..har^r.-.l ijilU p..r t.m, will ..r ■.'alvaniz<.l an.l Canada plates, minil),.r ,„.;.,, ,„,,. ,.,.„i. Ther.. is a .piality of ir..ii s.v..|it..<.n tram:... an.l tliiim..r. th.. chaiii:.. ^^1,1,.], ...mies int.. ih. iiiitrv an.l is lari:..ly iM.in;,' from 1li•^ p.^r ...mt. an.l, in s.mi.. <'as..s, ,,^,,,,^ ^„„^^.„ .,^ Swedish iron. It has Imriir as hl>;h as .".(• per ..ent. t.. 5 per cnt. Those ,^ ,,,„^. „f ^,„ ,„.,, ^.^,^^^ ,„.i„j, ,,,■ ,,i^,,, ^..,|,„. ar.. materials whi.'h at pn-s.-nt aiv not ma.le ,,„„, ,„..TSsMrv f..r .^..rlain pr.)C...sse., ..f maiiii- in Cana.la. an.l wlih^h ar.. lar«..|y ns...l, and |-,„.tur.., and lillin- a plae.. which ...ml.l ii..t th.' dnty is put at a nominal r:it.. so as t.. ,,,. ,.,„,.,, ,,^. ,„„. „^^.„ ,,,,„,,,, j,.,,,, .,.,„. ,|,„,. ..nc;(> tli.wo Industries which use these „,,„^ ,,,5^ ,„,.,t..rial has l.....n iiia.l.. i:. mat(.rials. p,,,. ,.(.|it. A.\l..s, ..ar sprin;;s, and spring's .^f Mr. CIIAULTON. What was the dnty on '''"" 'J'" ^^'''''l. '>'" ■'••""'^ ther..of, formerly !>:v> boil .r iilato ? I '""'" '""' '""' ""' '''^^'^ 'han ;{."> per cent, Inne I been jilaced at :?."> per cent. Mall..alil.. inn. Mr. FOSTKU. It was either ?i;5 pcM- ton eastiuKs and st(.el castings, n.e.s., w..r.. or l^'/iP'T (^t'nt. riou^'h plat.'s, m.iuld boar.ls, fo|.m..rly .fl'.*. per t.m, and imt less than ''^< land siiles, and other plates for a;:rirultural p,.r cent. This .liity has b..en li.ved at ■J.". Implements, when cut to shap.. from r.jll...l p,.,. L-i.nt. fast iron vess..ls, plates, smve sh....ts of steel, but n.it moiil.l...l, punched, pistes an.l ir.ms, sad irons, hatters' irons, polished, or otherwis.. nianufa.iiin.il, an.l b.-- tailors' irons, and castings .if ir.m not cls.'- iuL' of ii greater value than lour cents p.'r wimro spocilie.1, are rc'duced from .f l(i per ten p..und, w(.ro formerly charged at the rate ami ^ot less than :!() per cent to 27'/a P''f of TJ>/^ per cent. This is a .luality ..f steer ,.,.„t. Cast ir.m i.ij.e of every descripiieii, not made In this cnintry, anil the duty has f,„.„ierly ijilli per ton. and not li.ss than .'l.'i .55 jMT r.iit, liiis liccii rtiliiccd to !i!10 por ti»n. iiboiit 1 (•.•iii |mt |i<>iiii•• pi-r I'eiii ad coriMiL'aied liilies. or tines for marine hollers, valorem, ("lollies wrinuers, formerly .'i;i each This is a dislinct advaiitaue ic> an industry and l!o per cent, are reduced to U.'i cents eacJi which Is lar;;ely jiroseciiied in tliis country, and Llo \ti-y cent. f« riiier dulies were :!o and :;."> per pound ••ind :?m per cent. Cliains per cent. .V comiiion duly has been tixt-d at droll oi- slerl) reiii:iin at .'> per e(.ii!, ;!Ui.j;, jier cent. Ad/.es. h.-itchets. picks, inat- e.\cept that the limit has been reducctl tocks. track tools, wed^'es. ami crow-bars from niiie-sixleeiiihs to livt;sl.\ieeiitlis of of iron and sti'el. and luimiiiers or .sled^'cs an iiiili in diimieter. Nails and "pikes. , am now :!0 per cent. This is on wroujiht and jiressed, galvanized or not, ilio whole, a rediiciion. the dulies coin- horse shoe n.'iils, and all other wron^lil in>; down from about .T) per cent. On this iron, steel, and other nails, n.c.s., and horse, iliere was ;i."> per cent before. Axes of iinile Mini ox shoes have been changed from all kinds, scytlies. hay knives, lawn iiiow- I'j cents per pound, and not less than ;?,"> ers, proii;;eil foiUs, rakes, and hoes, not cLse- per cent, to :;(i pei- cent ad valorem, ('oiii- wliern specjiicd, and other aKriciiltural tools position n.iils and spikes, ami slieathJiiK , or imiilciiwnts not elsewhere specilied, :5,"> nuils have been reduced from lib i>er cent to, per cent ad valorem. These wi^re, some of l."i pi'r cent. Wire nails, cut nails and sjiikes them, P^ (ler do/.cii ;iiid 4o per cent ; some of iron or steel now liearin;; a duly of I'jof tiieiii •'i'J.ln a dozen and ad valorem duties cents per pound, but not le.ss than .■{,■> per i comliiiied. .Sliovcls and spiide.s, which hail cent, have been reduced to three-ipiariors i ."Jl per dozen and ■_'.■"> per cent, have been of a cent per pound. Out tacks, brads, or i made .'!,"> per cent. I"il(>s and rasps, ;{,'» per siiri^'s, not exceeding; 1(! ounces to the cent. Sleel needles, .'iu per cent. SurKicil tliou.sand, wen; formerly 2 coins per thou- and dental iiislruiiieiiis an- reduced from Hit saud, but this duty has been reduced to 1 to 15 per cent. Safes and the like are re- cent per tliousand. The same class of floods, duced fi'oin 'M> to 30 per cent. I'Mre en;;iiies, e.vceedin^C sixleen ounces to the thousand, ,'5'i per cent. J,ocoiiiotives for railways were formerly charged 2 cents per pound, an; t formerly :!(> per cent ad valorem wlien not reduced to I'/j ci'Uts per pound. Screws, commonly called wood screws, which for- merly had a protection of •> I'cnts, S cents, and 11 cents jier pound, respec- tively, have been reduced to I! cents, (J cents, and 8 cents per pound, but not to bo less than :}.") per cent. This Is a ri'diiction of about one-hiill' on the pre- .seut duty. Otlier screws of iron, steel or brass, or other metal, not otherwise pro- vided for, are reduced from ,'!."> per cent to 3(» [ler cent. Wrou;;ht iro.' or steel nuts and wasliers, iron or steel rives, bolts, with or without threads, nut and bolt blanks, T and strap binj;es, which formerly bore duties of less than .$2,(H)0 each. The limiilnK clause haH been stricken out, and locomotives for railways linvt> been placed at '.'>'> per cent. Steam I'liKincs, boilers, ma<'hiner.v, and the like, have been reiluced from ,'{t» per cent to 27yj per cent. Sir ItlCIIAHD CAUTWUICHT. Am I correct in understanding you tliat the total loss will only be !i;:5oL»,00U on all the reduc- tions made V Mr. FOSTER. According to the best cal- ctilation that can be made, but it is a cal- culation wliicli has no pretension to accur- acy. 30 Mr. KIXJAU. Thcsi" thing's the lion, ^'cii- ilt'innn has lately Kivou us aro incluil(Ml in that L'stiiiiato V .Mr. FOSTKU. The different kinds of tiir- niiurc iU'f not iiioliulcd. AGKICULTUK.AL IMPLEMENTS. Coining to the question of agrioultur.il iiiiipli'iiii'iits, the (Jt>vorniiioiit has I'ouiid ihat a vexotl one. Tho duty whieh has been heretofore .".."i per cent upon mowing maehines, binder.s. liarvosters, ami the liko of that, ii.as been greatly re- duced. A very strong deiiuuul has bwn made by tho fanning interest all over tlie country for a reduction in that duty. A great many have been, I think, a little un- reasonable, and have asked that the duty should be taken off altogether ; others, re- presenting large seetion.s of the I'armiiig coin- iiiunity, have petitioned that tlie duties sliould be materially reduced. These nia- phines are made at the present time almost exclusively of iron, the percentage of wood which goes into their construction being re- markably small ; and tho reduction of duties upon iron will, to the extent that it is used, be felt in the reduction of cost in the mantifacturo of these dilfereiU imple- ments. After considering tlie matter in all its phases the Governmont has come to the conclusion to reduco those from ,3.") per cent to 20 per cent, a reduction of 1,"> jior cent on the whole, and a reduction which it will tax tho manufacturers of the.se imidements to meet and keep the field in which their competition is at present even (piite heavy, especially in the Xortli-west ; but a reduc- tion with which the Government believes that they can prosecute tlieir industry, while, at tho same time, it will have the effect of greatly cheapening one of the largest items of expenditure to which the farmer has been subjected, especially In grain growing districts. Mr. CIIAULTOX. Has the Government consideriMl the question of granting recipro- city to the T'nited States in agricultural im- plements undi'r the terms of tlieir tariff, giving free admission to our agricullural Implements into the I'nited States on the condition that theirs are admitted here on tho same terms ? Mr. FOSTEIt. The Government is aware that in tho Committee's Draft Bill in the United States Senate, agricultural imiile- ments have been made free to the [leople of that country. So far as the nianut'ac- turers and buyers of Implements in the I'nited States are concerned, there is no duty upon agricultural implement.s, whether Canada reduces her duty in whole or in part. Sir UIGIIARD CARTWUIGHT. I would like to know from the lion, gentleman what he calls agricultural implements. It is ex- tremely important that that should be clearly understood. Mr. McMillan. I woiUd ask tho hoii. gentleman if the United States has not adopted a provision with respect to agricul- tural implements that they will allow them to come into their country free from any other country that aUows American agricul- tural implements to come in free ? Mr. I'OSTEK. T'ho lion, gentleman would bo perfectly correct if he had asked whether a committee had not reconiiiieiided that, but nothing has yet been .-idopted. Wliat my lion, friend has said is true with that limitation. This clause takes in mowing machines, harrows, cultivators, seed drills, horso rakes, stdf-biiiding harvesters, Har- vesters without binders, binding attach- ments, reapers, sulky and walking ploughs, all of which are placed at 20 per cent. Mr. CIIAULTOX. This is a matter of con- siderable imp(jrtance. The Senate Finance Committee's draft on the TaritY Kill pro- vides that agricultural implements slia" be admitted int(j the United States free of duty if imported from coimtrles not im- posing duties upon agricultural Implements of American manufacture exported to that I'ountry. T'hat. undoubtedly, will be a ques- tion that the Government will be calleil upon to meet. Xo doubt that provision in the tariff will be retained if the Wilson Bill liasses ; and if that provision is made 1 iire- sunie the people of Canada would like to know, now tliat the tariff' is under consiilera- tion, what course the Government of Canada woiUd be likely to take in the premises. ^Ir. FOSTlOll. All I can say to my lioa friend is that we have to legislate under present conditions. T'liis Is the legislation which wo propose under present condition. Mr. LAURIEU. How was it a moment ago about reciprocity ? 37 Mr. L'OSTER. How has It been for the last five years about reciprocity V Hon. gentloinen liave ])eon preacliiiig reciprocity fur live year.s. Xo one more tlian my iiou. Iriciui. wlio lias just spolieu, hailed with de- light and with exuberant joy the result of till' late election in the Unitwl States, and tlie comiuK into power of the Democratic party, l)ecause he believed there would be a free and open road to free trade ii the Initwl States, liut what has happened ? That although tliat party lias an overwhelm- inj: majority in the House of Hepresenta- lives and a clear majority in the Senate, after a year and a half of arduous strtifj;j;le, tliey have succeeded in gettin;; as far as llie report stage of a Bill which is protec- tive from one end of it to the otlier, and wlddi expressly abolishes every reciprocity tnaty ihat has been entered into with the I'liited States. Mr. LAUUIER. The hon. treiitleniau was asli( per cent. Pumps of all kinds and wind-mills will have a duty of 30 per cent. Type for printing will remain as before, 20 per cent ; type metal will bo 10 per cent. Bookbinders' tools, liriuting and lithographing presses and printing machines will remain at 10 per cent. I'lates engraved on wood and on steel will be 20 per cent. Stereotypes, electro- types and celluloids, for almanacs and such like, will remain at 2 cents per squiire inch ; those of books will be free, because it has l)een found that the duty upon them has in no sense affected for the better those liranches of the printing trade in this coun- try. The duty upon the stereotypes and electros has, however, a different elTeci on book publishing, and the fact that these will be made free, while it will not in any respect injure the printing business, will assist the publishing and paper interests. Bird cages will be 35 per cent ; barb wire fencing will be reducetl to % of a cent per pound, buck- thorn and strip fencing of iron will be Ms cent per pound. Machine card clothing will be 2.') per cent, and wire cloth of brass, copper and tin will be kept at tue same rate. 20 per cent. Wire of brass and copper is re- duced from 15 to It) per cent. As a con- cession to the manufacturers of wire fen- cing and wire nails, on whom the coinpetl- tiou will fall with very great force, itnd who Milder the rwluced duties will lind it a hard struggle to keep up their end of the compe- tition, we have given them a little relief by reducing the wire used for those purposes, from No. 11 to No. 14 gauge, from 25 per cent to 15 per cent. Sir RICHARD CARTWRIGllT. What Is your estimate of the lo.ss of revenue ? Mr. FOSTER. I thiiUi there will n(jt be any loss of revenue. Wire rope of Iron or steel win be 25 per cent ; luanufactiu'es, ar- ticles or wares not specially enumerated are re cents piT pound and lio per coiit. (Jas. c per cent. Kcll.s of any desoriptloii, 25 per cent. Brass and cojip ■!• nails will also pay 25 per cent ; zinc, luann- faetnn>s of. 2.") per cent ; Imlibit metal, 10 ]per Cent ; phosphor bronze, 10 pi'r cent ; lend, GO cents per 100 pounds, when in bars or blocks ; old lead, 40 cents per 100 pounds ; manufactures of le.-fd, 30 per cent ; cans and p.'ickajres made of tin or otlKn- material. 1',/. cents per quart : stamped tinware, japanned ware, 25 per cent ; enamelled iron or steel ware. 30 per cent. Telephones or teleiiraphic instruments will be 25 per cent. Compo- sition metal for the manufacture of filled p(ld watch cases, remains the same, 10 per cent ad valori'Ui ; Hrilannia metal and (ier- man and nickel silver, manufactures of, remain the same, 2." per cent. Manufac- ttu'es of ;;old and silver jewellery have been raised from 2n per cent to 2.'> p(^r cent, and I would h.ave had no hesita- tion in raising the duty still more if I thmidit it would have had the effect of brin^'ini: in additional revenue, but when you jro b(>yond a certain limit of duty no addi- tional revenue is obtained. Sterling: silver table ware and plated ware, 30 per cent, plated cutlery, .35 per cent, precious stones, 10 per cent ; clocks, 2."i per cent inst(>ad of .30 ; watches remain as before, 25 per cent. .Tewellery and watch cases have been brouirht in under a common duty of 3."( per ci'Ut. ComiuH to minerals, few changes have been made. I'lumbajjo lias been reduced from 15 per cent to 10 per cent ; manufactures of plumbago I'roni 30 (ler cent to 25 p(>r cent. Cane or rattan, split, will be 1'2\U per cent, to 10 per cent ; manufactures of plumba,i,'o from 30 per cent to 25 per cent. Manufac- tures of cane or rattan will b(> 15 per cent. LuudHT and timber manufactures, fm-ther than rou^'h sawn or hewn. 2u pep cent ; hubs, spokes, felloes and p.-u-ts of wheels have been reduced from 15 per cent to 10 per cent ; pails, tubs, churns, etc., reduced from 25 per cent to 20 per cent. Mr. LAXDEKKIX. Is there any change on the duty on a wagon ? Mr. FOSTER. I will come to that present- ly. Manufactures of wood and brushes. 25 per cent ; umbrella and parasol sticks, 20 per cent ; veneers of wood reduced from 10 per cent to 5 per cent. I'icttire and photo- g)-aph frames have been reduced from 35 jier cent to 30 per cent ; mouldings of wood from 25 per cent to 20 per cent ; llsh;ng reds are maintained at the same rate of duty, 30 per cent ; furniture of woi'V cvut. sue. A Its. We coiili' next to Ilu' items of sii^Mls anil •.. laips. Tiio i.rcsi'ni dniics upon sugars, as lion, fientlonioii will rrcotlcc-i. is S-10 of a cent upon refined su^'ars, and upon all sufi-ars abovo Xo. 14 Dutch standanl. Molasses has its duty of IVj cents per ;,'allon. grading up or gradiuK down, as the molasses becomes better or as it becomes poorer. Tlie decision of the Governnient with reference to sugar is this : to raisi' tlie colour standard from 14 to 10. so that hereafter all sugars not over, that is, including Xo. 1(> Dutch standard, will come in iree ; all raw sugars. Tliat will give in.gress to a very valu.iltle class of sugars tit for the table and culinary uses, whicli will be brought in largi^ly fi-oni the West Indies. At the same time tlie pro- tective duty for retiiied suirars. wliich is now S-10 of a cent per pound, is to be reduced lio per cent, and the duly will bo 04-100 of a cent. Mr. CITAIU/1'OX. T.ooliing to Washington Mr. FOSIMOU. Xo ; they will put a duty on raw sugar. That is, tlie committee ar- ranged it ; but what will be done, \m one knows. Mr. CHAUl/roX. They have only ;^-10 of a cent protection, Mr, FOSTER. Xo ; the present schedule, if it goes into effect in th(> T-niled States, will give a cigar 4-10 pro- tection. Glucos(>, or grape suuar, IVi cents per pound. Sugar candy, in wliicli all have an interest, whicli was V\ cents, and '2.") per cent before, is reduced to :].") jicr cent. The molasses clause has been made more strict in order, if possibli-. to include in it wliat is ••eally good molasses, tind n made as strict as it possibly could be upon molasses, and a third class is made of syrups of all kinds, the products of the sugar cane or beet root. Sir UlCIIAUD CAirrWURiUT. Do I nndersland the hon, go. ihunan correctly that from this time out the sugar duties will be 'i-ln of a cent pin* pound, all over X\). 1d duty, have be(>n placed at •J.") per cent. Cotton uubleaehed, which was formerly 1 cent a s iier cent ad valorem, has boon made 2'J'/j per cent. Whit(> or bleached cotton fabrics, which were 'J cents per square yard, and 15 per cent, have b(>en reduced to 25 jier cent, and cotton fabrics, printed, dyed or coloured, which came in largely at Hii'L. per cent duty, have been reduced to .'to per cent. Tliat takes in the cotton schedule. Iseing some live items, simple and plain, and avoiding all confusion in import.ation and appraisement. Mr. FLIXT. Does that include cotton duck ? Mr. FOSTFR. Y<'S. that includes cotton duck. Everything that is made of cotton finds its place in one or other of these .schedules, Mr. Ml'LOCK. Has any estimate been attempted as to the reductiim or revenue in this ? 40 Mr. FOSTKU. No ; if I made any estimali' It wouM .simply lie a gufss, and would not be worth (liseiissiuK. 1 cannot tell. Wo have one item after this: tliat of cotlnn anil linen, xylonite, collars and cuffs, and shirts of all kinds, whieh is a rather ditlicult one to deal with. It is an industry whieli is very widely disseminated, whieh has j;rown to very larfie proportions, and which has one most excellent feature about it. especially In the province of Qiielx'c. in tliat, the work is very Lir^ely dis- trihiitcd amongst the farinei-s' homes in tlie vicinity of these factories, where the wages Jire paid and where the effect of this dis- tribution of the money Is felt and seen In the ^'(■neral improvement and betterment of tlie conuntmity. In these collars and cuffs and shirts there is also a very strong competition, not only from the United Slates of America but more e.'duced to 24 cents a dozen .•ind 2i) per cent. Cuffs of cotton, linen, etc., have been reduced from 4 cents a pair and ;!0 per rent to 4 cents a pair and 2.") pei at. Sliirts of all kinds, costing $3 or less per dozen, have been placed at a uniform duty of 2."i per cent ad valorem, a low duty, which will. I sup- pose, have the effect of sacriticing that i>art of the industry to tlie foreign itroducer . but shirts costing more tlian !?:5 per dozen, worn 1)y the better class, have a specilic du*y of J?! per doz(>n and 2.") per cent, iiisti>ad of ^1 a dozen and ."]() per cent. Tliat, 1 believe, will ke(>p the larger part of the ind^l^.try ; aiid certainly there is no complaint in tlie country that these goods are not as well ma been imported by corset-makers under a special schcHlule at 25 per cent, and some would come-under the new 30 per cent rate. It has: been thought best to keep a special schedule for these at 2,5 per cent. Laces, braids fringes, emliroideries and the like are reduce! from 33 to .SO per cent, not because it was j thought well to partictUarly cheapen tiiese goods, as they are in the nature of luxuries, but because it was thought that 30 per cent would bring a greater revenue than 3,j. Cot- ton sewing tliread, in hanks or on tubes, black, bleached or nnlileaciied. which was 1214 per cent has been Increased to l.j per cent, while cotton sewing tlin-ad and crtMliet cottons, on spools or in balls, has b -en kept at 2.') per cent. It was considered that 10 per cent was sulHcient for the o])(>raii;iii of spooling ; a little more revenue will aecnv. while the price will not be raised to ent. .Tute cloth, dyed or I bleached or calendered, 10 jier ciMit. The silk duties have been kept as they were. Silk velvets and all manufactures of silk and rib- lions are at tlie same rate of 30 per cent. WOOLl.KNS. When we come to woollens, the difllculty of arranging the tariff was a|)|)arent from th!> outset. Tli(> woollen industry is exceedingly diversified in tlie grades and (pialities of its , productions. 'I'he present duties are spi^cillc and ad valorem together. On the lowest class of goods, or shoddies, they range to a 41 vt'i-y high ad vnlorom equivalont. and it has lu'(>ii found lmpossil)U>. evou witli tlic b(-st iiiti'utions, to do mU that was dcsirt'd for \n\t jiart of tho wonllcii trado. It has bi'cn found iniiiossililo to atford ndcquatc ])i'otoi-tion t) that t'hiss of fToods, wliicli at the saiuo liiiu' would 1)(' reasonal)h' for straight Wdnllrii goods. The Govornniont has therefore come to the decision to nialf wool have been put at the rate of .SO per cent. Women's and children's dress goods, which are imported in the lough. to be dy.'d :;nd finished in this cotnitry, ecune in at "iJ'-j per cent, luider regulations as to tlieir dyeing and finishing. Felt, pressed, of all Kinds. 11 '.j per cent. Hosiery and knitted goods, \i,-liicli have home a double duty of 10 cents a pouml and 20 per cent, are put into one schedule and will pay 3") per cent. The carpet sched- ule, M'hich ran over five or si\- items, has been reduced to one. and carpels, urits and rugs are put at 30 per cent. This will be a slight increase on Brussels caniet. which lie. fen^ liaid 25 per cent ; but those who buy Brussels carpet can all'ord to i)ay a little more for the i)urpose of uniformity in the schedule. Carpetting, mats and m.itting of cocoa, hemp or jute, the same as bi'fore, 2.') per cent. SUNIIIUKS. rinor oilcloth, which before had n mixed duty, has been piil In one item, at l!i> per cent. Window sluides, ;'.."> per cent. Gloves and mitts, 3.^ per cent. Heady maile clothing. 32'/a pei' cent. Hats, cai)s and bon- nets, undirellas .-ind jiarasols, 30 per cent. Braces and susi)enders. ;!5 per cent. Sur- gical belts and iippliances, 2.') p(-r cent. In the class of sundries, artilieial flowers are the same as before, 25 per cent. Buttons of hoof, rubl)(>r, vuleanile or composition, whieli were before 5 ceuts per gross and 2o per cent, have been put at 4 cents per gross and 20 per cent. Buttons of i)earl, vegetable ivory or horn, which were 10 cents per gross and 20 per cent, have been made S cents per gi'oss and 20 per cent. Buttons of papier macli6 and all other, n.e.s.. wliieli wore 25 per cent, are reduced to 2i> i)er cent. Combs. 35 per cent. Fireworks, 25 per cent, l-'er- tilizers, compounded, which bore 20 per cent, have been reduced to 10 per cent, and all tmcoinpoimdeil fertilizing matter comes la free, and cm bi' iniiiorted by any per.son and nnxed and componndeil by the farmer him- self for his own waius. (Jun. riile and pistol cartridges, cartridge-cases and the like are ri'duced from 35 per cent to 30 per cent. Xitro-glycerine, dualin. blasting, mining and gunpowder and other explosives, which bore specific or specific and ad valorem dnties, liave been [daced in one schoduU' at 25 per cent. rhotographic dry-plates are .".O per cent. Tobacco pipes, cigar and clgarette- liolders. 35 per cent, the same as b(>fore. Trunks and valises, 30 per cent, the same as before. Till". kki;k i.i.'^t. T ilo not propose to trouble tlii> Hou-;e by reading the wliole of the free list through. I will place that, of course, upon the Table, and it will be printed in due course. Tiiere are .iust one or two things that I wish specially to notice. With reference to books, I have explained that pretty fully. (Jenerally, I may say, that all acids, drugs, (lye St uffs-every thing which is necessary for tamnng in the manufacturing process and the like-have been taken from the dutiable list and placwl on the free list. In th:it respect, pretty nearly all. if not all. the elements that go into dyeing, tanning and the like, have been made free. In al.litiou to the books made free are those printed by ■my >'overnment or association for ilie pro- ,u,",tion of science and letters, and issued in the course of the proceedings of such ass)- eiitiou to Its members, and not for the ,„„pose of sale or trade. Als,. books, not being printcil or reprinted in ('.■uiada, wlu.ai ■u-e Included in the curriculum of any uni- versity or incorporated college in Canada; Looks" specially imported for the bona fide use of incorporated mechanics' lustlttites. ,,,e Brass scrap and brass in slieet-; or niates Brass in bars and bolts, drawn, plam •ui.l fancv t.d.ing, and otli.>r brasses, as wiU be seen by reference to the list, are made ii-ee m the article of minerals, coke, which was dutiable heretofore, has been !l '.1 on the free list. This will be a large concession to the whole of the western part rihis cout.try, in so fur as mauufactur.n,. is concerned. 42 Mr, I'ATKUSON (Braiiti. Did you S!\y iinytliins about bituminous coal V Mr. rOSTi:U. In passing over that, I , said thoy were kept as before. But there j is one item made Irei'. wh'eli deserves | special mention, and ilic oli.ject ol' wiiicli is to afford a healthy amusement, at a cheap rato, to a larf:(> .and dcs(>rvin.i,' class of our Iioimlation. t'urliuj.' stones of vJi'anite liave lieen made free. Dors have been added to otlier fowls tliat come in free for breeding purposes. Globes, geographical, topographi- c.il and astronomical, have been put on the , free list. Mining machineiy, it will be re-; collected, was put upon the free list for tlu'ee years. Mr, EDGAK, That was only what could not be made in this country. Mr. rOSTER. That has been re-enacted with an addition which will make it read as follows :— Mining iuicl siiK'ltiiiL' iniU'liincrv, i!ii|)nr(cil prior to t\w KItli May, ISOCi, wliidi i.s at tliu tiim^ of its importation of a da.^s or ]ry t, are free. This is a special concession, and I hope will prove a useful one in Manitolia and the North-west. There was no one feature of our examination into the con- dition of things in that part of the country, which impressed itself so forcibly on my mind, as the combine which existetl for the distribution and sale of lumber. Every town was parcelled out. One or two men were s(>lected, to whom was given tlie mono- poly of selling in each place. The prices were fixed, and if they sold ii fraction of a cent under the fixed prices, their privilege was taken away and given to soineliody else. That monopoly bore heavily on the people in that cotuitry, where lumber is so (>ssenti;illy necessary in the making of liarns and liouses, iind I came to the conclusion tliat if possilde help .-.hould lie given liy putting lumber u])ou the free list, and that has lieeii done. But there is a codicil, which will. I know, please my hon. friends oppos- ite. These articles are free, but it is pro- vided tliat :— If any country .shall iinpose a dnty upon tiic artiolc's in tiiis sdu'dnlo enmnerati'il, or any of tlieni, wlien iiiipoitcd into sucli country from Canada, it .sliall liu lawful for tlie (Jovernor in Coiuuil. from time to time, liy proclamation pnli- lisliiil in tlie Ciuiail'i (lu:illi, to dcclaru tliat tlio following export duties, or any of them, sliall lie cliargoalile upon log.s exported into sucli country from t'.oiada. The articles enumerated are its follows :— I'inc, I)ouglas tir, tir lialsam, cedar and liemlock logs not exceeding .•?•"! Jier tliousand fuot lioard mca.sure. In case of tlie export of any of tlie above enumeratoil logs in sliorter lengths tlian !) feet, tlien a rate per cord maybe levied in tlie .same way, L'(|iiivaleiit to t lie above enumerated rate per tliousand feet, lioard measure. And export duty sliall lie cliargealde accordingly, after tlie publica- tion of such iM'oclamatiou : I'rovided that the (iovcrnor ( leiarai in Council may by jiroclamatioii pulilislied in like manner, from time to time, re- move and ieiiii|iosc sucli export duty. AVowI pulp, mechanically ground, and clieiiii- cal wood pulp, bleached or unbleached, are added to the free list. I think I have ex- haustc. This talics into ac- I want to say. in oonchisimi. Just one nioro count the atlditious to the revenue whiili we woni witli reference to tlie iirincii)le of re- may fairly calculate upon, lu? in the cas.' of ciiirocity. \\\' have been char^'eil with not dealing with the United States In a fair and reciprocal spirit. We must consider the whole line of the Ciisioius tarilY. We liUow this fact, that the ^fcKinley IJill in is'.t:! (the last year of its operation if the new Bill is carrietl) charged an ad valorem duty rqiii- valeiit to an averajre. on tlie table of imports, irds d\Uial)le imports for home consunipti(m. went down to an averase of ;>0-28 per cent. Ever since they liave liad a protective system their duties havi' been, on tlie averai;o, from l.j to L'ti per cent hifrlier than ours, and, in some cases, tlieir duties have beeu tloulile what ours liave l>eeii. Tal per cent ; in is'.H they were 49 per cent ; in ^s^)■^ tliey were 4l» per cent ; and in IS'Xi they were riO-'J.". per cent. On carpets. tlie.y have had an even 50 per cent ; on cotton cloth from 4t; to 4S per cent ; kiiiited ^'oods. Mr. FOSTER. That is the net loss. That is a rallier bold reduction to make, tlie sit- uation being as at present, but I have every hope that the depression in the le-j ^^ ;^j„.. j,^^^;,,,^ while our tarilT, as r, venue will be short lived, and that in a few ' months the revenues of the country will recover their buoyancy w'itli i(>coverin,i; busi- ness on the other side of the line, in (ireat Britain, and, I hope, the world over. How- ever that may turn out, I think that what we have to face, as a prudent people, and to face cheerfully, is the fact that we may bo short in revenue for ,a year or two as i'oiii|iared with former terms. Tt is our duty, in making this reduction and incurring that slioi-tago, to keep the expenst^s of the coun- tr.v well witliin our revenue, wlu'ther it slight- ly exceeds our e.xpectations or whether it j ja jgo^^ an average of GS per cent. The total does not fully come up to them. I wish to state ,.„tf„i, mamifactm-es have borne a duty of this one thing in addition : After all that has I r,,-, por cent, and so on through the whole been done in the United States, after their j jj^,. j^ cannot be argued that, in the niaf- ele (piestion has been thoroughly fought out in the House of Ri^itresentatives, there is a net result, if tlie A\'ilsou Bill is carried as at iiresent, of an average protec- tion on dutiable imports of 30-Gtj per cent. That is ii little over the average upon ilie dutiable imports in Canada under the pre- sent tarilt. The .Americau representatives came face to face wiili the facts ; their theories had to be put t(j the test of a prac- tical solution, and the leaders, in the prepar treated them fairly. They have been able to get over our wall, but it has been almost impossible for us, in nearly every line of manufactured goods, to get over the wall they have built around their country. I thank you. Mr. Speaker, aial the members of the House for the attention with which you havo listened to me. Mr. DA VIES (P.E.I.) Will the hon. gen- tleman allow me a question ? He has men- ation of tlie Bill, and in the House itselt ; tioned that garden seeds remain as before were obliged frankly to acknowledge that they could not make a free tr;ulo measure and that they had to embody in the Bill the priut'iple of protection. That principle has Is grass seed in the same categoi-j' ? Mr. FOSTER. Yes ; it remains as before. Air. CHARI.TOX. If the hon. gentleman been embodied in it from the lirst. But, will permit me I desire to ask a question. -'iS after all the agitation that has taken place, I miderstaiid the hon. gentleman, b ards, tlieir average ad valorem duty, calcidated on deals, etc.. are placed upon the free list, with the basis of their imports, will be a little a iirovision that nations that do not reciiiro- liiglier than our average ad valorem tlutyleate shall have an export duty jjlaci'd upon under tho present tariff. Under tlie reduced i(,gs and some other articles. A contin'.;eiicy rates which I have just given, our ad valor- em duty will be, on tli(> average, aliout 2S per cent, which is a large reduction, and much below that of the United States as it places these articles upon the free list. Con- will be if tlie Bill is carried as proposed, sideratlon of that bill may not be com- may arise with regard to wliich 1 wish to inquire. Tlie American Congress has n I'nHliifts 24 Books and Papers L'7 Chemicals 20 Cottons ;W lOarthenware 'M i:xpon(litiire, ].Sn2-9;{ 5 Fiscal Toliey S Free List 41 Glass .'U Leather and nianufacturt's of '.',1 Metals and nianiifactures of ;!J Oils and Paints 2!) Protection, enhaiicini.' the cost 13 " «:enesi.s (if 14 " rcsiills of 14 " i)rincii)li's of, niaint.iini'd 18 Revenue for lS»2-();! 3 Revenue and Expenditure for lS!);!-!)4 Savings of the poopit.' 7 Stoneware 31 Sugars 3!) Sundries 41 Tariff, changes in 23 " lias it been abnormally hi;;li 10 ." i)rincipl('S of legislation 8 and staple products 12 dilficulties of revision 19 Trade and Conmierco 7 Tobacco and LicpKjrs 23 Woollens 4y