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rrata
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leture,

«f

fiouse of Commons Betiat^s

FOURTH SESSION-SIXTK PARLIAMENT.

SPEECHES OF HON. EDWARD BLAKE, M.P.,

ON THE

ELECTORAL FRANCHISE.

FRIDAY, MAY 9™, 1800.

ill-. BL.\KK. It may be ilesiral>le to liavo a
special provisiou for a i)arti(nilar ease, altliough it
is obvioas tliat tlioie would lie (laii]L'er in adopting
the Hiiggc-tion of tlie lion, incnilier t'or.A' ; ■ ia(.Mr.
Dawson), heiause it would give the hou. gentle-
man's voters the opportunity of voting " early and
often" with greater facility. But it is very da iger-
ous to ap])ly the argument that because a spedal
district ie(juires special legislation, that legisliition
should he made ge orally ajiplicalile. Let me make
this suggestion to thi; hon. .Secretary of State :
The hon. gentleman says the reason for his change
is because a particular revising oHicer has been
under the impression that the Taw permitted him
to make [)olling districts (1 any size he pleased.
I tiiink, Sir, that while it miglit be expedient to
provide against injustice arising from some error
of a revising officer, so as co avoid the disfran-
chisement of voters; it is very inexpedi>'nt that
we should open any wider door for the revising
officer to decline iloin ,' his full duty. I woiilfl sug-
gest to the Secretary of State the a<lvisal)ility at
the same time at which lie makes provision for a
possible neglect or error of duty, of making it still
clearer what that duty is. He tells us that a revis
ing officer,wlio is also "a judge of the Superior Court,
has construed it to be witliin his duty, deliberately
to make a polliiig division comprising .soinel.lOO
voters. I do not understand that to I'e the intention
of the -law. I understand it to be the duty of the
revi.sing officer to restrict tlie number to 'IM voters.
If we alter the law as it stood, and ad.l this provi-
sion, we will be rendering it more likely that simi-
lar results will happen in tlie future. Tiiere are two
■several clas,ses of cafes which occur to me. 1 think
it may very often happen that a revising officer,
through error, or perhaps thinking it reasonable,
may allow a small nunibfrof fifteen or twenty votes
iu a polling division, more tlian the maximum.
That would be amply satisfied, I think, by just
leaving things as tliey are. I believe there is no
difficulty in polling at the one place a larger num-
ber than our maximum, and I believe it would be
less evil to permit, within a moderate liiiii-
Uitioii of that kind, the division to icinairi
undisturbiid, than to allow the returning officer,

a week before the election, in the case of an
error of tiiat kind, to dislocate the appointed
divisions. Theie is" really no necessity for it in the
great number of cases for wiiicli we may lie expect-
ed to provide. Such an exceptional case as the
hon. the Secretary o{ S<^'.ite cites to iis as one tn be
provided against, would be provided against
chiefly by making the law very plain, so tliat lie
who runs may read, and by stating thlit it is the
duty of tlie revising officer to divide tlie ptdling
sub-divisions for eacii '-'(Ml or '2M) voters. As :ny
hon. friend has .said, we have known in daj's tliat
are past, very great improprieties committed by re-
turning officers in reference to the discharge of dis-
cretionary cluties. I have had before mean authen-
ticated instance wherein, at the last general elec-
tion, a polling station was established, no! in the
most convenient or central place, but in a jilace ex-
tremely iniMinvenient to the greater number of the
voters who lia|)])eiied to be of one party, and thus
creating an absolute injustice. I am not djsposed
te give to the returning officer, who is appointed
shortly before an election, who is appointeil at the
will of the (iovernment, frequently upon the nomi-
nation of the candidate, and who is acting in the
heat of a contest, ami largely at the suggestion of
a candidate- any more discretionary powers than
we can avoid. Some such powers he must have,
but I think we should limit them to the utmost.

Mr. BLAKE. I do not understaml that it is
limited in point of time, but that it will lie perpe-
tually engrafted on the law, so that after the next
revision, if you should find that a dozen revising
officers had maile the same default of <luty, you
would find a dozen returning officers performing
the same duty.

PATENT BALLOT BOXES.

Mr. BLxVKE. I thought this must be an ex
pof't facto arrangement, and that it was not really
designed that the Committee should send for per-
sons at this late stage of the Session. I do not
think that these persons should be paid their ex-
pcn..i,a for coming hei'e in jnirsuit of their own
1 business, and, for my part, I shall object to it.

T'TW

■ :!

Mr. I.LAKK. I do not tliiiik the onsf. is iit nil < were to count on tlieir constructing l.rnnch
piinilicl to i.ny ijusu we Imvc liuil Kcfoix-. It wu.h ^ liniH tlirovij.'!! the N'ortli We t liy niciin.t of tlnw
j)uivly 111 tlicirown iiitcrcHttliiit tli.s(,l.f.oj.lcciinii- KiiintH. I rin<l ii.,w lluil it i.s "iiroiPoMMl to utivt-
hfiv. Iliuv canif 111 till! li(,|Ht tlii.i their invcii- I huge ^^lll,.si,li^s to the CiunuUun I'acii; • itailuav
tloiis w'liiilil III' aildiiti'il. iiiirl t liiit til.. \' tt ..iiM iiM.I/.. I '1,1,11... lit' (..,. <i .^:... f .1 I V

tioiis wxiijil lie ailoiitcd, and that they Would make
niciiiey DUt of tlieiii. It seeiim to he out of tlie
(juestloii tiiat we simiihl pay them f<ir tliiee at-
tendances lieie, and their' travelling ex])enNe.s
lie.iiiles. If we sanction thi.s now , w here are we
f;oiiig to draw the line ? There in a trial reconi-
niended of three of thc^e liallot ho.v.e.s, and are we
going to pay these 1111,11 for tiie ]ireliminary use of
their iiixeiit icin ?

Mr. CHArLEAU. Tlie hoii. genthiimii evi-
dently ihtnk.s tliat anything Imt his dwn advice or
couclusion.s are alisdlnti ly in he disieganled.

Ml. r.LAKK. Xo. ■ .

Mr. ('irAI'LK.\U. Instead of making the re-
marks that the lion, gentleman has just favored
the House with, he should liaNfapjirared hefoiethc
romniittee and w itne.'^.^el| w lial was done. He sent,
it i.s tine, a suggestion from one of the returning
otliceivs ; one of hi.s own friend.s, I )iresume.

-Mr. I5LAKK. No, it was for Mr. Pdackhurn,
the fill iiier editor of tile London F,■l^ J'rcn, anil
now icgistr.ir of .Middlesex.

I'KIXTIXt; OF PARLIAMENT.

Mr. liLAIvE. That clause is expunged. I

(juite agree in the view that it oiiglit to bo ex-

))unged, because it would he co:itraiy to the statute

w liirh provides for the ))aymeiit of "the indcinnity.
At t l.,i ......... •■ ; I,..* . 1 _ . 1 ■ ' 1

Company for the constiiiction of thos( hraiuii
j lines which we were told tliey would liiiild in eon-
I se.|iien.,e of iiifi\iiig lho.se large grant ^ of money
j and land. 1 \m,u1.1 ask the <lo\einmeiit to .say
1 why thi.s ilepailuro is inaih frnni the policy
I enunciated in IS,S(» SI ?

! Mr. DEWDXKV. The line from (ilenhor..-
westward cm: .titutes a portion of a line which, I
ihiiik, was originally called the Winnipeg .South-
Weste'-n. There were twd ,>south- Western Uail-
ways, and the ch.irlers were purcha.sed from the
parties who held them liy the Caii.idian I'ucitic
Kaihvay. so th.it the first rcMilution would not
come under the ohjcctinii of the lion, gentleman.

.Mr. I'.L.AKE. I am i|uite aware, from the lie of
the gidiin.l and from seeing the mai), that this
piece does not run from the main line of the Cana-
dian IVicilic Railway, Init i.s conneeted with a
branch line which the c<iiiii>aiiy has ac'|uired. Rut
it was a pari of the under.staniling with tlu^ Cana-
dian I'acitic Railway Com])any that the branches
were to lie eoustructed at tlieir exjiense. Vhe
Canad.ian I'acitic Railway Comjiany took over a
branch w hich had been subsidi-ed by the country,
and now it is ])ro]iosed that .111 ai'hlitional piece
sihall lie added to that by tiic ii)iiipau> at our ex-
pense in part.

Mr. RLAKE. When first the policy of aiding rail-
ways in the North- West by land grants was bron«dit
!,..(■ .1... ir • _ 1 _ _ 1 .. " r .1 '^

At the .same time, we have been made acouainted ' J*""y*"" tli<'^<"'th- West by land grants was brought
with this regrettai.le fact- I think liy tlie Auditor ■ '"^■f'"''-' '''^' Ifou.-e. iiide|H-iidently of the great grant
Ceiieral's Rejiort -that a very considerable sum is i to the Canadian J'acilic Railway, in regard to which
owing in the way of ariears on this account. That i fe'™"*' ;'"""'^^y'"it .special rea.-.ons w ere adduced, I

o^.i iiig ill the way of ariears on this account. That
ought not to happen, and. if lion, members take i
advantage of the inovision, by which they can I
olilain iinblic documents at cost prici'. and do not ,
1 lay for tliem,! think the circiimstani-es should be
known. I iiropose, on the tirst day of the

grant .somcwiiat .spi ^ ,.,„,,,..,,, ._

advanced this view : that although it was eminently
advantageous, and it wasabsolutidy lU'cessiry, that

I railways should be built through the Nortli-We.st ;

' although it was extremely rcasimable that that
country should bear, by the means we were jiro-
])osing, = ' — '' - -■ r .. ,

made known. I propose ^ ,.,„., ,,, ,,.,r- . -

next .Sessi.iii of Parliament, lo move for th'e names ' P"j^''ig'. " eonsideralde ])ortion of the burdens in-
of the members who remain in arrears. We have '' ^'!'^'''J '" 'he construction of those cnter)iri.se.s :yet,
talked a good deal about clubs here to-day, and we ' '"f'^'' ''' ^^ ''*^ "* *'"' a;*-''te.st po.ssible consetiuencc
know there is a very g<iod system in clubs of post- ! . .^ "*-' ■'*l"'!i''l di vi .s<inie means to a,-.oidthe

j that we sliouiil d. v; .s<inie

I locdiiug up of large ,, utilics of land, ami jiarti-

ciilarly the locking up of those areas of land along.
: side the lines of railway, which would be the lirst
j desired for settlement, and more especially when
' these M-ere alternaiing with free grant sections,

which would be sought for before the sections

whieh were to be obtainable only by iiaynient.

We know that, during the period" in which
, there was a considerable immigration and an ex-
Tliiii it is cxpcdicii; to inithorisc tlic CnvrriKir in ' '''tt'inent with respect t<i the values of land in the

If ;;•: i.::;,!!:;;;:^ i:;„!ir',^"!;;r';;yi.;!;r1!;:t ^:;I^:?,l;:'^i'^ ^T^l-^^'r^^:/'"" -y^-*-" '^-^\ -ivan...ge wonid

tliDM.-^.-iii.l luin- liniiilre.l .-lore.- mn- iiiilo I'ni- n l.nineli liTio to

ing the members w iio are in arrears. I shall pn
pose to post those member.s of this House wIkj are
in arrears in this way.

LAND CRANT.s Tt) RAILWAV.s.

(fn the Coiiimitlee.)
On resolution 1 ,

.,,.., ■!(,„■ I .,v I, .- ,,,:i iiiiiu nil it Mr:i Ilea inic rti

no ooiislnicied Iroiii (ilc.nl.onj' wc.<;erlv. u iliatain'o nf
ahijMt sixty iiuioii, tn a imiiU (.11 the iin. posed liraneli
railway ol tlie .-iiinl cuiiiii.iny rmiiiin),' ticm liniudoii
."nutli-wcstorly.

Mr. I5LAKI

J n-collcct very well that, during

ic taken by the railway corjiorationsof their jiower
aslaml holdcr.s. was reali.sed. ^^'c know that their
beiiavior wassiuh as indeed we could not coinjdain
of ; that it h.-id rt^spcct to wli.Tt they thought their in-
terest undeitliecircuinstani'cs: and tlial they raised
,1, I- ', , ■'■ J .••-"■■■'"• ""■i-i; the prices of their liinds, a.s they had a leual ri'dit

Co of : w li H • i "" , '1'" '^'"'"'">" ^ '""' "" '"'-''^ '" '•oudcmn, to the hid.est point that

o I. ,..; ' on. i V lY "/ '"' T- ,'"""''■'■' "'",' ' ''"-• "'"" '""''■'^■'' '■"■"Htion of the market' would, it

1- t^^^ w^^^^^^^^ "h ' '^^•■'^'<^^^"''«"''-«p"'t'" 1 Y« thought, allow. Lan.ls. which had been sale-

m he inteiest of the c.iunlrybeeau.sc the company to <<:■,, S(i ,an.l e.en .SS per acre, and sale and
vete expecting them.selves to construct and , .settlement were checked, and the coimtry was hi-

ctinj; liraiirli

CllllS Ot tlll'MC

pnxcil to i;i\"i'

uilii: liailuay
tlii>s( liiaiii'h
liiiilil in coii-
lU ~ of money
iiiiLiit til .siiy
n till' jiolicy

ini (JltnlHiro"
iiif wln'cli, I
nipt'g Soutli-
fstiiii Hail-
se<l from the
uliaii I'atific
1 woulil not
ticiitlfliian.

•nni tli«.' lie of
ij), that this
of tlie ('ana-
lU'd witli a
"|uirt'(l. Hut
;h th(! Cana-
tl'.e ))rani;iioa
:pense. Tile
took over a
thi country,
itional piece
i\ at our ex-

if aiding rail-
was l)rouglit
"great grant
aril to wliioh
) ailduced, I
a.s eminently
ees-^ury, that
Colt h- West ;
le tiiat that
e were prcj-
IniideuN in-
iprises ; yet,
eonse(iuenco
to avoid the
t. anil jiarti-
t land along-
1 lie the lirst
eially when
mt sections,
the sections
>y ])ayment.
I in \\hicli
and an ex-
land in the
iitag(' would
their jiowor
w that their
lot complain
gilt their in-
l they raised

I legal riglit
it condition
■i point tliat
et would, it

I I lieen sale-
vere laised

III sale and
itry was in-

jured. The Hettlement of the country is efFect-
<.d very satisfaitorily indeed iindei- those condi-
tions wlilch allow two or iliree members of u
family oi- two or three close .md intimate fiitiids
to go together. Oiieof tlie great di/ticulties in a
ne«- country like the Norlii-West i.- tliese])aiation
of the settlers, at the hest. from Die aggregates of
Ijopulation. Tiiat difficulty tin y nnist encounter
until towns grow ; that diiliculty is made greater
in the N'orth-Wes. hy reason of the large areas
wiiicii we allow for the iiidi\idual settlei', and
which make him in a sense remote even from his
iinmciliiite neighlior. Itiil that diiliculty is inten-
sified when inider our principles of "settlement
there is going to he settlement in the first instance
only in alternate .^o'tions ; wlien you have a set of
sections for .sale along the railway, and a fiee grant
set of sections, alternating with each other. It
is ohvious, except in the case of an immigrant
who has considei'ilde capital, that a .settler
will he almost driven to say " the capital I
have must lie jmt into fencing and liiiildings and
into inipli'nienls aiyl lireakint' the land, and I
cannot allord to jiay a, price for the laml ; " and,
therefore, you have these inevitahle difticiillies to
5'ome extent intiiisitied, even liy any systini under
which there will he a clieck on fi'ee' settlement.
We caiiiot avoid that, we cannot oat our cake and
have our cake. If it is iieces.nary to make tlie.se
railway grants to secure the construction of roails.
we iniist do so on the Iciis't disadvantageous terms
to the jmlilic consistent with rea.sonahle advantage
to the railways. When these grants Were proposed
andsnhmitted lo the Hou.-ie, ! sulmiitted a motion,
which will lie found recorded in thedournals of the
Hou.se. for a vote was taken Ulioii it, that tiie grants
shotdd he made only on comlition that the ai-eas
granted (if agricultural lands (I ilid not speak of
laud with mill jirivileges or station grounds or
town sites, or otlier special values, hut only of
ordinary agricultural lands) should he o|ien for
sale on reasonable conditions for actual set-
tlement and in reasonable areas, at a price
not exceeding a nuixiijium to be fixed. My
object was to ensure that a man w ho goes out to
that country U> hunt for land, and takes a map on
which he finds the alleinate .sections indit'alcil,
would know that if he has found a choice .section
on railway hin<ls, he w ould be as certain to get that
section if it had not been entered before, on coniing
back to the railway oliice and paying the stipu-
lated price, as he would be certain On coining
back to the (ioveinment olHce of getting the free
grant which is adjoining it. He could tluischoo-^e
his free grant, and for his neighbor oi- friend with
wiuun he wished to live in proximity he could
choose the railway land. \\y this mean.syou \. ould
provide against the lock tip of land which the
hon. mendier for Muskoka (Mr. O'Hrien) has
referred to, and w hicli ni.iy be a very serious evil.
You wo\ild make this land as freely ripen foi- settle
nient as the <lo\ eminent lands, except on the addi-
tion of having to pay a certain sum. I:i the old times
when I had nn o|)|)ortnnity of taking an interest in
these matters -an interest which the hon. member
for A.ssiniboia (Mr. Davin) ilmditsa little soinetim.'s,
but which I can assure him, however n isdirected
was. at any rate, very sincere— i received com-
plaints from persons w iio had becMi in that coiiulry
and who said : " \Ve went here and there and every-
where, and on coinim.' back, having made one iir

I more selections, we found eitlier that the land won

I a railway grant and we could not gel it, or it

, was held by the Canadian Pacific Railway under

that blanket >;ianl of theirs, or it was in the

' hands of speculators, and we came back (lis-

heartened." Your sy.stem ought to be one wliicli

; would leave open on phdn terms to actual settle-

j ment, irrespective of the will of the railway coni-

. pany, the agi icultural hinds, out of which, not-

j withstanding your arrangement, the r ihvay coin-

t pany shall derive a veiLsonalile price. Name a

; niaxiniu.n price, and let the lands, subject to the

j payment of that iiiaNinium by rea.sonable instul-

, inents, be 0)hii to settlement in rea.sonable

I areas. If you do that you diminish the

i diftieulti !S inseparable from ' this (piestion, to

i the greatest po.ssible extent, and, if so mini-

j mised, the advantages of securing the construc-

I tion of a railway are greater than the di.sadvan-

tages of causing the jiartiai lock up of lauds neces-

j sary for its construction. I do fear, tliat if there

i comes again a time of considerable immigiation to

'the North -West, and of consi<leiable hunting for

, land, the leckless manner in which Wf have gi^ en,

I and are giving, these grants will pro.e in t In; fn-

I ture. as it has lUdved in the past, to be a greater

I obstacle to the settlement of that country than

might exist if a ditrerent systt'Hi were adopted. It is

jail veiy well to re])eal the arguinents with which

j I was met in former years, namely, that it is in

j the interest of the laihvay comi)any tosell. and

I that we may be ijiiitc sure tluy will be glad to

set a low price on the land. W'e ha\i: heard that

before, and we have had an exain])le of the short-

.sighted ivilicy in the jieriod of inflation lo which I

have leferred, which prevented settlement just

because it was thought a little more money might

be obtaineil later on. I do not want these lands

to be used for s)iecnlation. either by the individual

buyers or by the railway company itself. I want

them to be charged, in favor of the I'aihvay

company, with a reasonably fair ])rice for the

settlers to pay; and while subject to that charge.

that they shall be as free and /

as if they were (Jovernment fi'

On resolution 1.

Mr. IJL.VKF. To the ditiiculties that beset the
Consideration of this 4uestion, the hon. member
f(ir Li.sgar (.Mr. Ros.s) has 'added other alleged
ditiiculties which do not in fact exist. He lias
.spoken about coal lands, timber lands, and lands
in the immediate \ icinity of stations and town
siU'S being incliuled. What is the suggestion T
made to the Hou.«e '.' I excluded lands of this
character ; I limited my suggestion to ordinary
agricultural lands. Lands which the com|iany
might h.ive a right to hold as having s])ecial
values, which did not come within this
denomination — lands having a sjiecial value,
such as coal hinds, timber lands, town sites
or exja' ted town sites, could, by a very easy ar-
rangement, be withdrawn from the operation of
tile regidation which wmild apply, by arrange-
tnents tube ijrescribed by the (;o\ernniciit, under
the general direction of Parliament, a niaxi-
niuni to ordinary agricultural lands alone. I admit
that there are some real dilliculties to w hich .
the hon. gentleman has alluded, but whirh ahso he
has exaggerated. He has supposed tiiat my sugges-
tion necessarily api)lied one maximum to' all Vail-

nen to the settlers
,'rants of lands.

wiiy grunts. Xot at nil. Ft is not necos^ary, when
yini are ilealing \\ itli the IuiiiIm nf out' railway couj-
pany, to apply the wiine niaxinunn which you
Would apply with lefereiuie to the lands of another.
For instance, there Ih a railway enterprise in
which I undertitand the lion, niendier for LiHgar
(Mr. KoNs) take.sagreat ih^al of patriot iinntereMt —
the HuilNon Kay Kailway t'onijiany. No one can
8U|)pip«e it would lie reasonalile to apply the same
iiiiniiniini or uia.xiuiuiu to that, which wouhl apply
'. > Honic of the others. lint why complicate un-
fairly and unreasonably a practical suggestion,
whatever its ditlicidties, liy adding these ahsiird
notions of dithouity which the lion, gentleman
eittert.iins ? W'-t: are now dealing with one grant ;
we are now dealing with one locality ; we are ikiw
dealing with a certain mileage of railway in one
part of the N'orth-West Territories ; ami we are
called uiKin therefore, if we deal with it intelli-
gently, t(t determine what ma.xiunnn should he
applied to ordinary agricultural lands in the
region of thai grant. Kven there, there may be
great variations in the charac'ters of tlie
lands which will be allotted to the company.
There, also, you cannot have a perfect plan because
your maximum must have regard, I will not say to
the choic(^st morsels, but to the highest class of agri-
cultural laiul properties in the grant. No ilonl)t con-
sideration has been given by tlie Administration to
those (juestions. I picsunu' the Minister who is
proposing the gi-ant, and the Minister of Railways
— for I suppose they are jointly responsible— have
C(msidered what are the dithculties and probable
co.st of construction ; what the prospects of trafiie
are, and the general (pialities of tlie lands along
this ))roposcd lailway, in respect of which this
grant of (),4(K) acres per mile is to be given. If

re giving
will cost

this, US n liraneh railway, in going to eo«t .^ll'i.SCf)
a mile, and if we are to sn[)posu those lands,
including timber lands, coal lainis, t')wn
sites anil so forth, have only to-day an aver-
age cash value of ^'2 per acre, we are
the cost of the road. If the road
5«1H,(KM) or SI1»,(MI(I a ndle eonipped, we still are
making a free gift of two-thirils <if the cost, aver-
aging the lands at .■*!* (ler acre. I do not know,
we have not tile slightest information as to whether
there are any special dithculties of constriiciion,
whether there are "any inori! rivers to cross;"
wliether the bridging, the grading, the excavation
and so on, is ex|)ensive. I do not know what the
particuhir character of the land is. Upon that no
information is vouch.safcd. .Sir, the (Jovernment
polii^ydoes not regard th<t difliculties suggested by
the hon. member for Lisgar. The grant is (i, KM)
acrt!S ner nule all round, no matter whether the
road be easy or diflicult to build ; no matter
whether it is one immediately promising a large
tratfic or promising only i laigu tralhc in the
future; no matter whether the lands are inort? or
less valuable. Except in the case of the (ialt
Road, 0,4<J<) acres is the general acreage given |)er
mile. We are entitled to ask the gri'umis of the
(ioveniment'fl conelnsion. U'e are entitled to
know whether the (lovernment have considered
these things — whether they have considered what
the probable cost of the road will be, what will be
the probable results to the company of the road,
what' the probable value of this land grant will be?
We ai'e entitled to know whether the ( iovernment
have been appropriating this land grant of (>,4(K)
acres ])ermile, with some regard to those consider-
ations, or whether it is all pure guess work, or
whether there has not even lieen a guess.

OTTAWA :— Printed by Buown Chamberlin, Printer to the Queen's Most Excellent Majesty.