IMAGE EVALUATION TEST TARGET (MT-3) €^/^ ^ 1.0 I.I :^ ug 12.0 USi jL25 1 u U4 IH^^ llili^^ ^ . 6" - ► FhologFaphic ScMioes Carporatidn 23 WBST MAIN STMIT WnSTM,N.V. t4SM (71*)t7a-4903 4^ CIHM/ICMH Microfiche Series. CIHIVI/iCMH Collection de microfiches. Canadian Inttitute for Historical Microraproductions / Institut Canadian da microreproductions historiquas Taohnioal and Bibliographic Not«s/NotM tacliniquM at biblloflrapliiquaa T TIm Inatituta haa attamptad to obtain tha baat originai copy avaiiabia for fiiming. Faaturaa of thia copy which m jy Im bibiiographicaiiy uniqua, wliich may altar any of tha imagaa in tha raproduction, or which may aigniflcantly changa tha'uaual mathod of fiiming, are chaclcad baiow. D D D D Cclourad covara/ Couvartura da couiaur r~] Covara damagad/ Couvartura andommagia Covara raatorad and/or laminatad/ Couvartura raataurte at/ou palii suite I I Covar titia miaaing/ La titra da couvartura manqua Coiourad mapa/ Cartaa gtegraphiquaa an couiaur Eoiourad inic (i.a. othar than biua ncra da couiaur (i.a. autra qua biaua ou noira) [~~| Coiourad mapa/ □ Coiourad inIc (i.a. othar than biua or black)/ I I Coiourad plataa and/or iilustrationa/ D Planchaa at/ou iiluatrationa an couiaur Bound with othar metariai/ Rail* avac d'autraa documanta Tight binding mny cauaa ahadowa or diatortion along intar!or margin/ La r« iiura aarrAa paut cauaar da i'ombra ou da la diatortion la long da la marga intiriaura Blanic laavaa addad during raatoration may appaar within tha taxt. Whanavar poaalbia, thaaa hava baan omittad from filming/ II aa paut qua cartalnaa pagaa blanchaa ajouttea lora d'una raatauration apparalaaant dana la taxta, maia, iorsqua cala Atait poaalbia. caa pagaa n'ont paa «t« fiimAaa. Additional commanta:/ Commantalraa auppltenantalraa: L'Inatitut a mierofiimA la malllaur axampiaira qu'il lui a it* poaalbia da aa procurar. Laa ditaiia da cat axampiaira qui aont paut-Atra unlquaa du point da vua bibliographiqua, qui pauvant modlflar una imaga raproduita, ou qui pauvant axigar una modification dana ia mithoda normala da fllmaga aont indiquia ci*daaaoua. D D D D B n n D D Coiourad pagaa/ Pap^ da couiaur Pagaa damagad/ Pagaa andommagiaa Pagaa raatorad and/or laminatad/ Pagaa raatauriaa at/ou pailicuiiaa Pagaa diacolourad. atalnad or foxad/ Pagaa dicoiorAaa, tachatiaa ou piquiaa Pagaa datachad/ Pagaa d4tach6aa Showthrough/ Tranaparanca Quality of print variaa/ QuaiitA inigaia da I'impraaaion inciudaa aupplamantary matarlal/ Comprand du matirlal auppMmantaira Only adition avaiiabia/ Saula MMon diaponibia Pagaa wholly or partially obacurad by arrata aiipa, tiaauaa, ate., hava baan rafllmad to anaura tha baat poaalbia Imaga/ Laa pagaa totalamant ou partiallamant obacurclaa par un faulHat d'arrata, una palura. ate, ont MA filmiaa A nouvaau da fa^on k obtanir la maillaura imaga poaalbia. T P o fl O b ti •i 01 fii ai 01 Tl ai Tl w M di ar be rl| ra m Thia itam ia filmad at tha raductlon ratio chackad balow/ Ca documant aat f Ilm4 au taux da rMuetion indlqui ci-daaaoua. 10X 14X laX 22X 2BX 30X ■•■■■ ■■■■I i^l^H ^a^m V^i^BBBBiHi^H^BaB^l^ 12X 1«X 23X MX 28X 32X Tha copy film«d h«r« hat baan raproducad tfianka to ttw o*naroaity of: Library off tha Public Archival off Canada Tha Imagaa appaaring hara ara tha baat quality poaalbia oonaidaring tha condition and iagibllity of tha original copy and In Icaaping with tha filming contract apacifficationa. Original coplaa in printad papar covara ara filmad baginning with tha front covar and anding on tha laat paga with a printad or iliuatratad Impraa- •ion, or tha baolc covar whan appropriata. All othar original coplaa ara filmad beginning on tha firat paga with a printad or iliuatratad impraa- sion, and anding on tha laat paga with a printad or iliuatratad impraaalon. Tha laat racordad fframa on aach microficha ahail contain tha aymboi -^ (moaning "CON- TINUED'), or tha aymboi V (maaning "END"), whichavar appllaa. Mapa, plataa, charta, ate, may ba filmad at diffarant raduction ratloa. Thoaa too larga to ba antiraiy inciudad In ona axpoaura ara filmad baginning In tha uppar iaft hand cornar, laft io right and top to bottom, aa many framaa aa raquirad. Tha following diagrama illuatrata tha mathod: L'axampiaira film* fut raproduit grica k la gAn4roalt4 da: La bibliothiqua daa Archival pubiiquaa du Canada Laa imagaa auivantaa ont «ti raproduitas avac la plua grand aoln, compta tanu da la condition at da la nattat* da l'axampiaira film*, at an confformit* avac laa conditiona du contrat da ffiimaga. Laa axampiairaa originaux dont la couvartura an paplar aat Imprlmte aont ffilmte an commanpant par la pramiar plat at an tarmlnant aoit par la darnlAra paga qui comporta una amprainta d'Impraaalon ou d'llluatratlon, aoit par la aacond plat, aaion la caa. Toua laa autraa axampiairaa originaux aont ffllmte an commandant par la pramlAra paga qui comporta una amprainta d'Impraaalon ou d'llluatratlon at an tarmlnant par la darnlAra paga qui comporta una taila amprainta. Un daa aymboiaa auivanta apparaftra sur la darnlAro imaga da chaqua microfficha, aaion la caa: la aymbola — »• aignlffia "A SUIVRE", :e aymboia ▼ aigniffia'"FIN". Laa cartab, planchaa, tablaaux, ate, pauvant Atre flimte A daa taux da reduction dIffffAranta. Loraqua la documant aat trop grand pour Atra raproduit an un aaul cUchA, II aat ffiim* A partir da i'angia aupArlaur gaucha, da gauche « drolte, at da haut an baa, an pranant la nombra d'Imagaa nAcaaaalra. Laa diagrammaa auivantu llluatrant la mAthoda. 1 2 3 1 2 3 4 5 6 N' BRITISH NOm AMERICAN ASSOCIATION. ^.:'4 s P* E E o h: OF THE HON. A. T. GALT. AT THE CHAMBER OF COMMERCE, MANCHESTER, SBI»TE]MBBR S6, 1862. LONDON. 1862. /-.fo/.r THE KCOnsr. -A.- T. GhjA.LT OM •r.^r ! I f « CANADIAN AFFAIRS. On the 26th Sept., the Hon. A. T. Oalt, late Finance Minister of Canada, gave an address in the Town Hall, Manchester, to the members of the Chamber of Commerce. A requisition, signed by the principal Manchester merchants and manufacturers, had been previooslj addressed to the chamber, requesting them to invite Mr. Gait to a£fbrd them information respecting Canada and its Goyetnment. The Chamber of Commerce acceded to the re- quest, and this meeting was the result. The Mayor of Manches- ter (Mr. T. Qoadsby) presided and Mr. Gait was introduced by Mr. H. Ashworth, the President of the Chamber of Commerce. The Hon. Mr. Galt, after a few prefatory remarks, spoke of the progress of Canada, in the Government in which he had had the honour for several years to hold a place. It was the largest and most important of the British oolonies, having a population of 2,600,000, most of whom had proceeded from this country to find a home. It was desirable that in snoh a colony there should not be any misappre- hensions entertained as to the sympathies, intentions, and acts of the motber-oonntry. Taking the last census, it was found that the population of Canada West had increased from 952,000 to 1,396,000, being an inerease of 40 per cent.; the lands held had increased from 9,825,515 acres in 1852 to 13,854,907 in 1861. The acres under oul. tivation in 1852 amounted to 3,702,788 and in 1861 to 6,051,619, being an increase of 63 ^ per cent. The wheat products had increased from 12,082,550 bushels in 1852 to 24,640,425 in 1861, being an in- , erease of 103| per eent. Canada was now producing results which in a few years must greatly enhance the importance she bore towards Great Britain, and which rendered the connection of the colony with the mother-country all the more important. This was a further reason why no mistakes should occur between them. Those points where 2 THR HON. A. T. OALT i I diffloalties ooonrred shoald be bronght into harmony. The points upon which oliijeotionfi had been taken in England might, he thongbt, beanmmed up into three— namely, that the tariff leginlation — theoom- mereial legislation— was not oonsiatent with the present riawa of political economists here, and that it had not been advantageous either to Canada or this coontry ; secondly, that the cost of maintaining the colonies by this country had been large, while the result had been small ; and lastly, that eTon assuming that the tariff question was settled and that the question of cost was satisfactorily adjusted, there were gentlemen in England who said that both England and the colonies would be better off if they were separate. The first point bad excited the greatest attention in England and in the northern dis- trict—he referred to the commercial legislation adopted by Canada. It would, however, be well to refer to the causes which had necessitated the imposition of customs' duties at all, because it was now generally admitted that, where it was possible, direct taxation might be the eheapest and best mode of providing for the wants of an estate. In England the largest part of the revenue was still raised by indirect taxation ; and, notwithstanding the vast amount of realised capital and the general intelligence of the people, it had not yet been found practicable to raise more than one-third of the revenue by direct taxation ; it might, then, be readily understood what the diflSoulties were in Canada, where they had not equal advantages. The incomes of the people residing there were so small that it was scarcely possible to impose an income tax that would yield any large amount, and the fact that the country generally was settled upon by poor and in many respects uneducated persons was a reason why it was more difficult to make them acquiesce in the visits of the tax gatherer. He did not consider it possible to raise for the ordinary purposes of the Government any considerable psft of the revenue by direct taxation, though a system had been introduced— a municipal system— for local wants, providing for education, highways, and other objects. Conse- quently they had had to look to indirect sources of revenue, and amongst them the customs' duties had naturally been the principal. Revenue was derived from the postal servioa, the sale of lands, the public works, and other items. But the revenue derived from publie lands had been wholly devoted to the settlement of those lands, it being necessary to survey the forest, to lay it out into lots, to open roads, and to take steps which were abttolutely necessary for the benefit of the thousands who were in the habit of seeking their shores. The public works had not yielded the revenue which was expected from them, although the amount was something considerable. Policy had ON tAMADIAN AFFAIRS. sompelled the QoT«rnment to forego a large portion of the tolls, but the prospects for the fhtare in this respect were better. They were , therefore, bronghk to the necessity of eonsidering the means of raising revenue by duties imposed noon the imports of the oonntry. It was plain that the first question to suggest itself would be whether the expenditure of Canada had been judicious — whether, in fact, a large expenditure for public works and other objects ahonld have been undertaken. The public debt in Canada was about tweWe millions sterling. Of that, four millions had been expended in oanals for the purpose of rendering the navigation of the St. Lawrence complete, about four millions had been advanced in aid of the railway system, and the remaining four millions had been expended partly in the oonntrnction of lighthouses, in the formation of provincial roads, and in a variety of minor charges. The two great itema were those of canals and railways, making together two* thirds of tho publio debt of Canada. The position in which Canada stood originally was that of a country possessing no roads whatever, having her principal water oomrounications interrupted by rapids which com • plotely barred the navigation, having no lij;hthonses in the lower part of the gulf, and their trade consequently being subjected to very heavy iasftrances. When the goods formerly arrived in Montreal they were handed over to ^he forwarder, who had to pass them through a variety of communioadon, firom carts to boats, aud from boats to cares again, so that the rate of charges to tbe consamer was very great indeed, be necessarily paying the whole cost up to the time the goods reached him. In Canada, then, whilst the cost of the goods was largely aug- mented by the insufficient means of communication, the produce which was sent to this country for the purpose of paying for these goods was, from the same cause, greatly diminished in value. The effeet of the improvements had been that all the charges upon those goods and upon that produce had been largely decreased. Instead of being, as in many cases, augmented 100 per cent., they were now taken to the most distant part of Canada at a minimum cost. The navigation of the St. Lawrence was the fineKt in the world; and the railway system, especially the Grand Trunk and the Great Western lines, bad greatly facilitated oommuni. oation. The policy of Canada in undertaking those publio works had therefore not only been beneficial to the country its If, but it had placed it in a better position to carry on business with England (hear, hear). A very important question might arise as to whether the policy which had been adopted with regard to the imposition of the customs' duties had been governed by THE HON. A. T. QALT If 'I sound principles, or an approximation to soand principles, even sup* posing tho duties themselves were necessary. It must be perfeotlj oleAr that with a long frontier like that between Canada and the United States, in a comparatively unsettled country, large facilities would exist for the carrying on of an illicit trade. It was, therefore, plain that if Canada imposed duties upon articles which were imported f^ee into the United State**, from America the supply by smuggling would come and the Treasury would not receive the duties. The same result would apply if the duties in Canada were high and those in America low. The articles which formed the bulk of the indirect revenue of England had been, until the American war broke out, free from duty in the United States. There had been no excise duty on spirits ; there had been no duty on tea except when imported in foreign ships ; and there had been no duty upon sugar and tobacco. These, whence the bulk of the* British revenue was derived, were admitted to be fair articles of taxation, and the only limit that could be put upon them was that regu- lated by consumption. In Canada, although some advocated it, they did not adopt the American principle ; duties had always been imposed on tea, sugar, and tobacco, and limited excise duties on spirits. These duties had formed an important part of their revenue, but they had never been so high as absolutely to encourage smuggling from the United Scates. Having got as much from these articles as they could get, they had to supply the deficisucy from the other articles imported into the country. The pricoi]»le adopted in Canada had been that of admitting all raw materials free. The next class of articles were those which had received a certain amount of manufacture, but which could not be used till they had received a certain amount of re>manufacture, and upon them a 10 per cent, duty was imposed ; and upon articles fully manufactured the duty wfis 30 per cent. The main bulk of the customs' revenue was undoubtedly derived from the 20 per cent, duty, but the result of the whole was an average of 1 7 per oent. Had they imposed a lower duty, they would still not have been sufficiently low to have heretofore produced a demand from the United States, whose duties had averaged 24 per cent. The object of the Govern^ ment was to obtain the means of keeping up the credit of the country, and it was not intended, as had been stated, to introduce a protective system. He confessed, however, there were some articles, not of very great importance, that bore that character. The hest evidence that could be offered against the charge of protection was that the effect of the tariff had not been to produce manufactures. The manufactures in Canada were those which might be expected in a new coantiy— nails, steam engines, oofurse woollens, and other articles necessary in ON CANADIAN AFFAIRS. lea, for if the and A no wly- settled country. There was not at this moment a singU cotton mill in Canada, nor a silk manufactory. The imports of earthenware and glass, hardware and iron, and woollen cloths had gone on steadily increasing every year from 1850 to the present time. Having thas briefly shown the oaases for import duties, the princi- ples upon which they were imposed, and the effect which they had produced on trade, he would now draw the attention of the meetin;; to the iK)lioy proposed by himself on behalf of the late Oovernroent, •nd which would no doubt have been adopted by the Legislature had not the Ministerial crisis upon the Militia Bill interrupted the ordi. nary business of the session. When the American war broke oat, the necessity of providing for a vast outlay compelled the United States to alter their fiscal system and to impose excise duties upon spirits, tobacco, and other articles, and large customs' duties upon tea and sugar. Under these circumstances, it was proposed by the late Canadian Qovernment that the duties upon tea, sugar, tobacco, and spirits in Canada should be brought as nearly as possible to the rates the Americans themselves had imposed, and they expected to obtain by these means an increased revenue on the articles re. ferred to, and to apply the additional amount to a reduction in the duties upon imported goods. It was proposed to reduce the first olass goods from 10 to 7 ^ per cent. ; others from 20 to 15 per cent. ; and the three articles at 30 per cent, they also proposed to reduce to 10 per cent. It was proposed to raise a considerable sum —imitating the Americans — by means of stamp duties, wirh the view of making it a permanent source of revenue afterwards. But the Government resigned on the question of the Militia Bill, and their suc- cessors had not had time to consider fully the steps to be taken. While they might, therefore, have made mistakes in their fiscal legislation, their oltject had been to reduce the charges upon trade, to increase the imports of the country, and thereby to augment the export trade and develope the resources of Canada. It was, he must say, a source of great disappointment to many of them to find that they had been misinterpreted with regard to their intentions. It was no doubt true that there was a strong Protectiouist party in Canada, but it had not been in the ascendant, and he believed it never would be (hear, hear). It must, however, bo remembered that the system formerly adopted in the colonies was one of protection, and it need not cause much surprise if time were required to produce strong convictions on the subject of free trade. The people of Canada bad before thorn the progress in wealth, population, and intelligence of the United States, especially of New England, under a protective system, and .III 1:11 6 THE HON. A. T. OAlT > thfty might very naturally «tt"ibate to tbat Hyatem reaults whioh had "' really bera nbtained despite uf it, and whioh were truly attribatabla to the TaHt renouroea of the American continent and the wonderful energy and ability of its people. In referring to the aeoond point he had raentioned-at the ontaet, namely, the cost of the coloniea, he snid that in the old times, when the coloniea were governed flrom Downing-^treet, they were % constant toaroe of vexation and expense to this country. More particularly would this apply to Canada. The result of that old system wna expensive to England and distaatefbl to the ooionists. When EnrI Russell waa Colonial Secretary in 1840, the question of responsible or self-government was conceded to the important colonies. The result had been most aatisfactory, and, there ha'l been no serious dispute since between Canada and this country, and the same might be said of all the North American eolonioa.. Except for Imp >rial pnrpoaea, there had not—- till the American war broke out been the necessity for maintaining a single soldier in Canada. Although troops were sent out, they were never wanted for the purpose of preserving peace and order in the colony. Tbnt had been always done, and would always be done, by the ordinary Oovem- roent. In times of peace, therefore, there waa no necessity for military expenditure, except indeed for occupying the important fortresses whioh existed. The whole of the expenses of the Civil Oovemment wore borne on the Canadian budget. There might be, and be thought there were, one or two small sums still which the English Government bore— suoh as the expenses, under agreements with the Society for the Propagation of the Gospel, of one or two Bishops of the country and one or two Indian treaties, but the sums were very small indeed, and were such as the Imperial Government had not thought could be applied for to the colony. The expenses of the Governor-General's salary, his seoretnry, and the whole staff were borne on the Canadian esti- mates. It might be well to state what Canada did on the breaking out of the American war, when in a state of uncertainty what Great Britain would do. No application whatever, up to the dme he left the Government, had been made by the Colonial Government for a single soldier to be sent out, bat they did aak the Imperial Govern- ment to send out and store in Quebec a large quantity of those arms which were stored 5a Woolwioh. That was three m 'Uths before the Trent difficulty occun*ed ; and that was the only application that had been made, except it had been very recently. What they desired was to have arms in the country, to be able to supply them to the militia for the (!' ~ence of the colony. When the Trent difficulty arose, it became the duty of the Imperial Government— and it nobly performed ON CANADIAN AFFAIRS. thftt doty— not to leave Oanada unproteotad. It wai iiupoHiiible that Cftaadft eould, ia suoh • oontest as iras then threatened, defend herself. She could not raise an armj of 100,000 men. England hentelf would have found a difficulty in maintaining such an army in addition to her present expenditure. The diffloulty, there* fore, became Imperial in it« character, bat ae members of the empire they thought it their duty to do their share. They were quite willing to furnish all the strength of the country, and to pay as far as they could under the circumstances, but it would be perfectly idle to assume that they could do all the work should a war break out. The proportion in men and means which Canada ought to contribute in the event of a war with the United States could be, he believed, readily settled by negotiation with the Imperial Government, provided difflcnltiea were not made through unjust and acrimonious attacks upon Canada, such as unfortunately had not been infrequent and which could not fail to cause exasperation and to obscure sound judg- ment on both sides. His own views and those of the late Canadian Government were expressed in the defeated Militia Bill, and are, briefly, that Canada should at her own coot maintain an organisation whereby 50,000 men could be at once pUced in the field, thoroughly officered and with a certain amount of drill ; and that a re<(erve of 60,000, in a less forward state of discipline, should be provided, with farther provisions for additional draughti upon the militia if required. If war actually occurred, it must be plain to every one that the ability of Canada to pay such a force would almost wholly oease if her territory beeame the battle>fleld ; and the financial burden would necessarily have to be borne by the empire at large. The question whether eolojies were of any value at all was a very impor. taat question. Its importance could not be exaggerated, because if a mistake were once made it could not be remedied. For two hundred years England had been obtaining colonies in all parts of the world ; and if they were once given up it was clear that they could not be brought back again. In speaking of the colonies o' British North America, it had been assumed that Canada could be gt /en up with the most perfect good feeling on either side ,and that everything would go on as at present, while responsibility on each side to the other would be wholly removed. Now, a very slight knowledge of human natnre would tell gentlemen that if an important community was in this way tnmed adrift, without notice or warning, that was not the best way to produce good feeling. It was eoarcely possible it could exist under such oirenmstancAs. There would be grea^ irritation ; and in th« case of Canada aoc;aer result would follow. It beinsr iutpov >V-:l« THE HON. A. T. OALT ble for her to maintftin herself ia her position to the United States, Buoh a policy woald be tantamoant to surrendering he? to the United States ; and the people of England would not, therefore, have created a new and fliendly nation, but would hare verj greatly augmented the strength of a ccnntry that had latterly shown extreme animosity towards them. This was plain English ; and the same might be said of the TTest Indies, who could not long remain independent commu- nities. He contended that before advooatlng or taking a step which could never be retraced, the present colonial policy of self'golrern' ment should be thoroughly worked out and exhausted. It had thus fak' been eminently successful, though only ij operation for a TCxy few years. Quarrels between the colonies and the mother-country had almost wholly ceased. The Imperial expenditure had in time of peace beeni reduced to literally nothing, so far as the wants ot the self-goTemibg colonies were concerned, and he believed the questiOQ of self-defence admitted of easy solution. He thought the present policy should be further developed and extended, and he would ven- ture to suggest the direction which it ought to take. Much difficulty arose, and must always exist, f^om the number and variety of the oolocies. Many had adjusted their own tariffs and established thdr o^u fiscal systems; the consequence was, that if difficulties arose with one requiring the imposition of tdxation, it might be in opposi- tion *o the policy of tha others and of the mother-country. Ha th«.aght| then, it would be desirable so to harmonise and federate them as to bring them into different groups, so that instead of fifty oolouies there would be five or six groups. It was clear that by joining the resources of all, the strength of the %hole would be increased for defence, and thus the burden 6f defending them would be reduced to the mother-icountty. As to the North American colonies, the question had been « brought under the notice of the Ihiperial Government three years «go, but no pro- gress had been made. Canada, with a population of 2,600,000, v. as debarred ttoca. the ocean duriilg thn winter season, and even in summer she had little connection with the lower colonies. Ndw Brunswick had a population of 300,000. Canada had no coal ; New Brunswick was one natural coal field. Nbva Scotia had a popnTatlon of ddO,000 ; she possessed valuable mines of irbn, coal, and even of gold. New- foundland was celebrated for its fisheries. If these Colonies could bring together the resources which each possessed for the benefit of the whole, the litrength and influence jf the whole Krould be inor«B'"^d. Instead of five different systems and tariffs, there would be only one ; instead of lines of custom bouses along each frontier, there would bo 4 ON CANADUN AFFAIRS. 9 none, and theexyensetof ooUeoting th« daties would be redsoed ; and instead of maintaining half-a-dozen different Governments, there vould be only one. The expenses of administration would also be reduced and the result would be produotire of general benefit to. all. Even as regarded Great Britain^ it oertainly would not be considered an unimportuit objeet to have availaMe in ease of need the sailors and fishermen of those eountries, 60,000 of whom were there employed. In ten cat i fifteen years the present popolatiou of 3,500,000 would probably be s doubled— its strength united and developed— and if ultimat^y iconutry and the eolony had special grievances. Mr. Gait said they paid the salary of their Governor. General, but they were not allowed to engage or dismiss him ; the motheT'Oountry, without paying the oont, demanded the patronage. On t]be other hand, he understood that the salaries of a brace of bishops were saddled npon the mother country. These were two special ^r^elr. anees. The com of Canada was admitted into England duty free, but duties were imposed upon our manufactured goods which were almost prohibitory (hear). These were not the kind of relations that ought to exist between a parent and a child. He thought the fear of dismemberment was visionary, for in the ease of Ireland the sale of estates had been the greatest blessing to that country. If the honour- able gentleman's mission was in the slightest degree to put Canadian hands into the pockets of British taxpayers, he hoped Mr. Gait would leave Manchester at all events with an unmistakeable impression that this was not the time for Canada to ask the Lancashire operatives and millowners for a portion of their taxes. (Mr. Gait — Certainly not.) Canada was like a son who wished to atart life where his faiher stopped. If Canada wanted a perfect system of railroads, she must go through the early stage of road-making which we went through in this country. We ought not to be expected to give any money for Canadian railways. He cordially endorsed the opinion of Mr. Ash- worth, and sincerely hoped, for the sake of Canada and England, that the time was not far distant when the former would be an independent nation. In a time of peace it did not matter what Government a coon- 12 / THB HON. A. T« OALT try liad, beoaase et6rybo47 wfw floarisbiog, bat Canada perhaps saw that aoHia day she might have difi^oalties to encounter from neighboar- ing States, and then what woold Canada be to as r He should most de- cidedly object to the retention of Canada as abjattle*fteld between this and any other ooantiy (hear;. If we must flghti ^>e hoped it would be upon the sea. Hr. Fekousos hoped it would be fully understood that Mr. A^sh- worth's opinions were not those of the majority of the Chamber of Commerce (hear, hear). Both the gentlemen who had spoken ex- pressed merely their individual opinions (hear, hear from Mr. Mason). Mr. MAI.Q0LU Boss did not go to the full extent of either Mr. Ash- worthor Mr. Mason. On the subject of the proposed railway guaran- tee, Mr. Boss expressed a decided opinion that it was most impqUtic tpask fQT auch a guarantee while the Canadian Government were talking about increasing the duties upon imported goods. In disproof of what Mr. .Gait had said, Mr. Koss quoted the following team an Americaa paper :-^*< The trade in home manufactured woollens has been large and very successful. There are now a gi:eat number of first-rate mills in the province, the productions of which are eagerly sought for and bear a high character. The production of our manu- factured cloth is .rapidly on the increasie. We are rejoiced at this favourable indication, and hope to see the importation of woollen goods steadily decli9e.'' Exactly the same process was going on in Canada that led to the erection of cotton mills in Bombay. We had not the slightest .desire to prevent their erecting mills, but it was scarcely fair to ask ns to contribute to the support of a country that excluded our manu^ctures by a taxation of 20 per cent He wanted both countries to go hand-in-hand with kindly feelings, and asked notiiing that he was not prepared to grant. He had no desire to turn Canada away fdthout a moment's notice, but he wished the two coun- tries to act as Jiembers of the same family (hear). England was prepared to do her duty, provided her efforts were appreciated by tlie colonists. Even if Canada were dismembered, he hoped that kindly feelings would still prevail. If we sent soldiers to fight for the Ottoman, how much stronger was the claim of Canada to our support ? (hear.) He hoped that this meeting would show that the question of our colonies was not altogether a conuideration of pounds, shillings, and pence. The Matob referred to the fact that the high tariff in Canada had been a bar to the reduction of the Indian duties. When the duties to India were 10 per cent., the deputation was asked, ** How can yon require the Government to reduce the taxes upon clolhs imported ON CANADIAN AFFAIRS. 18 into Inclia» when in Canada they are 30 per cent., reinembering that India pays the cost of her Goyernment and Canada does not by a considerable amount f The troops lately sent to defend the firontiet of Caniida certainly cost a million of money. How coahl Canada ex- pect England to do that, when she put a positive interdict upon the importation of odr industry f (hear.) Mr. Galt, in reply, said that Mr. Ashworth, in speaking of his personal acquaintance with the French inhabitants of Lower Canada, had done, no doubt unintentionally, the people very g^eat injustice. He had euUed them imbbeile. That was a term that was most wn^uit to their iatblligenoe and industiy (hear, hear). He asserted, on the contrary, that they bad hiad^ great progress, and that this fket was shown by statistics. The last censtis Showed the progress madb in Lower Oahada during this last ten yeaira. In 1862 the pbpulation bf Canada Bast was 890,000; in 1861 it Was 1,111,000, being ah itteteaSe of 25 per cent. Ih 1852 the land held by these people was &,1 18,000 acres; in 1861 it had indrieased to 10,238,000, being an increase of 27f per cent.; thnb showing that this proportion of land appro- priated had inbreased more thkn the ihiirease of population. The number bf acres nnddr cnltivatidn was 3,605,000 in 1863 ; VhCreas it Was 4,678,000 in 1861, beibg an increase of J20f per cent. With re^laird id production, that had also inbireased. l^he bti^hels 6t Wheat raised in 1863 were 3,07^,000 and in 1861 2,$63,000, being ia decrease of abotit 16 per eeht. ; but oh this point he had to say that it wto well known tiiat the farmers oJT tiower 'Cadada had turned their atteb- tion to the growth of other grains. In other grain's, for example, 'the number of bushels raised in 1852 was 1<2,U7,0(]IO, but in 1861 it had increased to ^3,634,060, being an increase of no less than i93{ per cent., or very nearly as much as was shown by' the whole British popu- lation of Upper Canada (hear). He felt it his duty to make these statements in justice to Frenoh.Cana^ians, and to add that it should be remembered that they had not had the advantages of the other portion of the Canadian community, that they had been settled for a veiy long period of time and had not had the advantages of a firesh influx by immigt'ation, and that all their advances had proceeded from themselves. He contended, then, tliat as they had, been able to intro- duce improved municipal systems, and that as there was a school in every parish, where every child received a free education, they were, or ought to be, beyond the reach of any stigma (hear). Mr. Ash worth had referred to the cost of the colonies being 600,000{. a year. This referred to 14 TUB HON. A. T. GALT the whole of oar North Amerioan posaessioDB. He eould only repeat that the troops kept in Canada in time of peace were not kept there for the purpose of the colony. England kept them there for Imperial parposes ; that was an Imperial act in eonnection with the distribution of the Imperial forces, and he thought, too, that the hon. gentleman was mistaken as to the proportion of charge dne to ». «nada. With regard to the clergy reseryes, the hon. gentleman must have been under some misapprehension. He (Mr. Oalt) would not go into the history of this question, but there could not possibly be more than two bishops connected with this charge, and the whole salaries were 1,0002. per annum each. As to the correspondence with the Duke of Newcastle in reference to the proposed law eonoeming shipping, that law was certainly not designed for the purpose supposed by Mr. Ash« worth. Great Britain had always been desirous that the ooasting trade of America should be thrown open, as hers was, and Canada was also desirous of it, but the Americans were not disposed to make the con- cession. The idea then occurred to the Gaoadian Legislature that the imposition of a small duty on vessels receiring a British register would be a fair charge, and might tend to procure a settlement of the question ; but the bill was expressly reserved for the considera- tion of the Imperial GoTemment, who, in disapproving of it, might have spared Canada an unmerited lecture. As to the Sheffield memorial, that involved the principle of self-taxa- tion, for which the Canadians had always contended itnd which they wonld uphold. Mr. Boss and Mr. Mason had referred to some possible mission which he (Mr. Gait) might have to this country in reference to a guarantee for colonial works. He could only assure the chair that his mission was purely private. He was glad to have had the opportunity of visiting Manchester, but he neither professed, nor did he in fact hold, any official connection in reference to this visit. He had come only toaflford an opportunity of making some explanations. Certainly he had no mission to the Imperial Government about railways or anything else. He should be satisfied if any good resulted from the removal of the mistake or misapprehension that, whilst some gentle- men were in England seeking a guarantee to some public works, the Canadian Government were at that time discussing the question of increasing the import duties. He could assure the chamber as a fact that during the last four years, since the tariff of 1859, there had been not only no such discussion, but no such intention (hear, hear). On the contraiy, the late Government, as already stated, took the first opportunity of proposing a redaction of the import duties (hear. ON OANADiAN AFFAIRS. 15 hear). With regard to the proposed gnarantee to the In- ternational Railway from Halifax and Nova Sootia to Canada, he was strongly in favoar of that railway, believing that it would be of great advantage to Imperial as well as eolonial interests. Bat the proposal of the Dake of Newcastle was that the colonies themselves should pay tl.e whole oost. His Grace certainly proposed that the guarantee of the Imperial Government should be given to a certain amount of the oost, but the colonies themselves were expected to pay the interest upon the whole oost. As to Canada, he might here mention that the Imperial Government gave a guarantee of 1,500,0001. sterling for Canada sixteen or seventepn years ago, for the purpose of enabling her to complete her canals. From that day to thSTthere has never been sixpence advanced or paid by the Imperial Exchequer. The whole amount had been raised by Canada three years a^o, and it was now in the hands of the British Government to be paid as the bonds fell due. This was the way Canada met her obligations ; and if it was the interest of Canada to undertake further responsibilities, they would be met ia an equally honourable and straightforward way. Canada, however, thought that her interests might have been better protected in the matter of the subsidies to the ocean steamers. Upwards of 180,0001. a year was paid to the Cunard line. The effect was to reduce the cost of goods sent by that route to that extent, thus taking Canadian trade away and enabling the Americans to build their railways and improve their communications. The neceraity of having direct communication between the St. Law> rence and England compelled Canada to pay 80,0002. a year for the purpose of maintaining her intercourse with this country, when she need not have paid anything if Canadian interests had been properly consulted at home. Under these circumstances, he hoped gentlemen would believe that he had visited Manchester from e c'inoere desire to remove misapprehensions as to the feeling and the ^oiioy of Canada ; and though he was sorry at the tone of Mr. Ashworth's remarks, he must say that it was much better that Mr. Asl); worth should have made his statements there where he (Mr. Gait) had an opportunity in his presence of answering them, than that they should have been made where they could not be answered (hear). What was wanted was frank and Aree discussion, and, with Mr. Buss, he believed the result would be the removal of those diffdrenoes wbioh were often so ii^urious to harmony (hear). AH he would add was— Let the experiment of self-government in Canada be worked out to its legitimate conclusion. If that conclusion was that it would be better to separate, so be it ; they could then separate without any danger of heart-burnings or animosity. But if the conclusion favoured those who believed in the 18 THB HON. A. T. QALT ON OANiLDUN AFFAIRS. importinoe of colonies to tho empire, then th^ oonid go on with the certainty Of the strength and prosperity of the empire being increased and not diminished by the connection (cheers). A TOte of thanlu to the Mayor broaght the proceedioga to a dose. •>:''