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Central Experimental Farm. 
 
 :o:- 
 
 DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE, 
 
 OTTAWA, ----- CANADA. 
 
 Evidence on the Establishment of Branch Experi- 
 mental Dairy Stations, given before the Select 
 Committee of the House of Commons on 
 Agriculture and Colonization. 
 
 :o:- 
 
 By Jas, W. KOBElil'SOX, JJuirj Cominission'-r. 
 
 The CiiAiKMAN.— Professor iiobertsou is before us to-<l:iy for tlie 
 lniri»ose of giving infonuation with respect to outside exi»erinieiital 
 dairy stations. I presume it would be well to allow liiin to follow 
 the same course as at last meeting, making his statement first, and 
 reserving questions until he is finished. 
 
 Profess<»u Rohkrtsox. — Mh. Chairmax & Gkxti.emkx, — In 
 j)resenting to the Committee a very brief outline of what has been 
 done in j»re|>aratit)n for, and in connection with the establishnuMit of 
 Experimental Dairy Stations, I may say a few words in regard to 
 the need and value for these Stations in the Dominion, in order to 
 show the Committee that the plans which, we have adopted are 
 adequate to meet the needs, and just suitable to give assistance in 
 developing this important branch of farming. In nearly all 
 other countries where agriculture has been followed successfully, 
 something in this line of work has been and is being done. Most 
 of you are, I dare say, better ac(|uainted with the conditions of 
 farming in England and Scotland than elsewhere in I£urope, and in 
 these countries dairv farminir has been made a ^ri'at success. In one 
 resjtect, the dairy farming of England has not been profitable in 
 measure with the oi»portuiiities of that country. A consider- 
 
able proportion of the Englisli dairy i)roducts, during the last six 
 or eight yeais, has been sold at higli prires mainly owing to the 
 prejudices of consumers in favour of home made articles. I will 
 put a statement in here to show you the value of such work as we 
 are undertaking. 
 
 I find that nearly one-iifth of the tine Canadian cheese sent to 
 England, is still sold on the counters of English shops as English 
 Cheddar Cheese ; and under that name it l)rings nearly four cents ])er 
 pound more than the same or similar cheese when offered for sale 
 in the same shops under the name Canadian cheese. That is after 
 all, a value which is given to the article on account of prejudice 
 and preference on the part of the consumer, I have gone to sho])s 
 and have found English cheese, and Scotch cheese, and Canadian 
 cheese on the same counter, being sold at prices varying from 
 twenty cents to tAvelve cents, the Canadian being the lowest. Yet 
 the Canadian cheese in many instances was superior in every sense, 
 in nourishing (jualities aiul flavour, to the twenty-cent-per-pound 
 cheese, Avhich Avas branded and was " home made." Wo ho})e to 
 gain for our own producers, the full value of their cheese and butter, 
 by overcoming the j)rejudice of the consumers by encouraging the 
 manufacturers of our finest cheese and creamery butter to brand 
 them "Canadian." 
 
 Notwithstanding the advantages which that prejudice lias given 
 to the English and Scotcli dairymen, they have found the need of 
 doing some experimental dairy work ; for after all, no trade can 
 be sustained very long if its profits rest upon such a basis as preju- 
 dice. The Imperial Parliament has made a grant during the last 
 few years of £5,000 stg. to promote the work of dairy instruction. 
 
 Very few dairy stations are in o]>eration, but all over the south 
 of Scotland and in a few districts in England, the Avork of travel- 
 linginstructorshas been prosecuted. They have besides, in Scotland, 
 only one Experimental Dairy Station or School, which is bonussed 
 and sustained to some extent by the Government grant. The 
 effect of that work has been this, and I have it from the wholesale 
 merchants in the article there :— That the general quality of dairy 
 l)roducts, maiidy cheese, through the west of Scotland has been 
 improved to an increased value of twenty-five per cent, within the 
 last three years, and that is nearly all due to the instructions of 
 Canadian instructors who have gone there engaged to do this work. 
 
 il 
 
 ) 
 
il 
 
 The improvement is in this direction : — Not that the very best 
 dairies liave been enabled to make better (juality, bnt tliat tlie 
 poorer dairies have been enabled to make the goods that they tnrn 
 out, nearly e(jual to the best. An averaging up of the qualities has 
 been the advantage the country has rea[)ed. 
 
 Now, the exi)erimental dairy stations in Cana<la have just the 
 same object in view, — not so much to help men to make cheese and 
 buttei- different from, and better than what are now made in the 
 best factories and creameries, as to average up the poor (piality 
 until the goods we send abroad are unifonnly fine, carrying a good 
 reputation with them and thus fetching a higher price. I need not 
 detain the Conmiittee with a long explanation of what such coun- 
 tries as Denmai'k, Sweden and Holland have been doing, since it is 
 probably familiar to most of you that they have been s])eiiding 
 larger sums of jnoney to promote skilful dairy practice, than in 
 any other branch of effort to improve the condition of agriculture. 
 To such an extent has this work been carried, that in Denmark 
 alone there are something like seventy-five dairy stations which 
 may l»e used as schools. They are on rather a small scale, but 
 these stations have been the agencies through which Denmark has 
 been enabled to produce the largest (juantity, and the fi-u'st (puility 
 of butter sent by any country to England. 
 
 . It is the expectation of some of us that through the work of 
 these stations in Canada, we Mill be able to develop an exjjort trade 
 in butter quite equal to that of Denmai'k and larger than our own 
 exj>ort trade in cheese now. So one main ])urpose of our experi- 
 mental dairy station Avork in Canada, is to develop an exi)ort trade 
 in butter of the very best quality to meet the needs of the English 
 market. At the same time we will not forget to bear in mind this, 
 that we should try and get for ourselves the value which our own 
 goods carry in themselves, by having everything sent from Canada 
 branded " Canadian," so that those who |)roduce our goods an<l sell 
 them under our name may get a higher i)rice for them. 
 
 I come now to a specific statement of what we are doing in 
 Canada. Before I make that, however, let me refer to one other 
 aspect of this work. In most countries the work of experimental 
 investigation has been done by scientists pure and simple. Even 
 in agricultural science, the Germans have done more in the wav of 
 investigation during the last twenty-five years than we have done, 
 
 \1 
 

 in prosecuting purely seieutitic enquiries ; but in tliat respect the 
 German scientists have always been willing to labour for a know- 
 ledge of the al)stract theory, and little effort has been made to 
 bridge over the gap between the statement of the ]»rinciple and the 
 application of that princij^le to farming i>ractices. The work of 
 our ex)»erimental farms and dairy stations, is to bridge over the 
 gap and illustrate the ai)plication of the best practices to the pro- 
 duction of butter, cheese, live-stock and all other farm i)roducts. 
 
 The original plan for the estal)lishment of ex])erimental dairy 
 stations, embraced the putting of at least one station in each Pro- 
 vince of the Dominion. The ])urpose was to have cheese-making 
 carried on during the summer tinu' so as (1) to ilhistrate the very 
 best practices of producing the finest (puUity of goods, (2) to de- 
 monstrate the different (pialities of cheese that would result from 
 different nyethods of making, and tlien (•'!) to have the same station 
 used for the prodiu-tion of tlie fiiu'st (piality of butter throughout 
 the winter season, especially with the object of encouraging the 
 farmers to get an income from their cows the whole year round 
 by making butter and raising stock through the winter, and 
 makinu cheese from the same cows during the summer. In that 
 connection comes in the value of fodder corn, of which I spoke 
 on the last occasion when I was before the Committee. When 
 cattle are fed all winter on corn ensilage, the flow of milk can be 
 kept u]) without much shrinkage ; while the practice of feeding on 
 hay, roots and meal Avill tend to dry them uj) during the winter 
 after milking for a very short i)eriod. While that was the original 
 plan which T had the honour to submit to the jNIinister of Agricul- 
 ture — a memoran<lum upon which was included in my last annual 
 report — it was found necessary to modify the application of that 
 plan in some details. 
 
 First of all, in the Province of Ontario it was found, if Ave selected 
 any one particular spot at Avhich to establish an ex])erimental 
 station, that for the ^p'rst siimtner very few peo})le would derive 
 much benefit from its existence or work. Tiiat station would be 
 to a certain extent unknown and really of little value for the 
 immediate needs of the business. To meet that condition of affairs 
 successfully, it was decided to postpone the establishment of a 
 station at any one place, and to have the men, — who would other- 
 wise do this work at stations, — travel all over the provinces and 
 
•t the 
 know- 
 do to 
 1(1 the 
 ork of 
 L?v the 
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 )tTvicts. 
 
 I dairy 
 ■h Pro- 
 nakiiig 
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 to de- 
 
 It from 
 
 station 
 
 )Ughout 
 
 ing the 
 
 round 
 er, and 
 In that 
 I spoke 
 
 When 
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 sding on 
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 I original 
 Agricul- 
 
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 II of that 
 
 e selected 
 erimental 
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 I 
 
 visit factories in the different districts, inviting the cheese-makers 
 to meet them at these factories. This plan was thought to be better 
 for the first season than that of locating an experimental station in 
 any part of the province. With that object in view I had a circular 
 issued to the factories of the different provinces intimating that 
 one object of these visits was to give instruction in the best methods 
 of testing milk, with the end in view of being able next year to 
 introduce a system by which milk at cheese factories would be pai<l 
 for, according to its quality and real value. There is a \^Yy wide 
 difference in the qualities of milk. Milk varying (piite as much as 
 from three per cent, of butter fat to four and a half per cent., has 
 been paid for at precisely the same rate per hundred pounds, regard- 
 less of its value for cheese-making, under the system generally fol- 
 lowed. We have now in use a milk-testing machine which will 
 speedily and accurately discover the real ({uality of milk as to its 
 percentage of butter fat, and we hope this year to be able to 
 announce a method by which every factory will be able to pay for 
 its milk according to its quality. That would be one of the most 
 substantial of the aids we could render to the dairy interests of 
 Canada. I find that in many cases, cheese factories are succumbing 
 to the su])position on the part of farmers that they have not got 
 fair-play. If the best farmers in a community believe they do not 
 get full value for the milk they send to the factory, their su[)port 
 ^s half-hearted. 
 
 Another of the objects of these visits of our instructors was to 
 give the cheese-makers who would attend, heli)ful instruction for a 
 whole day in the very latest and best way of making cheese, uni- 
 form in (juality and fine in finish. Although we had only three 
 men employed in Ontario for })art of the season — that was during 
 the latter half of ^fay and June, — we have reached over one hun- 
 dred and fifty cheese-makers. Thus, in one and a half month's 
 time, we reached over one hundred and fiftv cheese-makers for the 
 purpose of showing them this milk-testing method and giving 
 instructions in making cheese. From many of these cheese-makers 
 I have letters saying they have derived very much benefit from 
 these instructions. 
 
 On such occasions also, the person who has gone to give 
 instruction in cheese-making, has invited the farmers in the 
 neighbourhood to attend a meeting in the evening, and has 
 
given instruction at hucIi gatliorings respecting tlie wliole matter 
 of feeding cattle, liandling milk, and carr\ ing on dairying in the 
 most profitable way. 
 
 In the Province of Quebec, similar work has been undertaken 
 and a programme of places is being arranged Un' until August, 
 whereby every county in that larg(; Province has been, or will be 
 visited at two or three central factories at least, to give cheese- 
 makers instruction in the best way of carrying on their work. 
 By way of illustrating the value of this work to the Committee, I 
 may say that it was my good fortune last year to visit the district 
 of Chicoutimi Avhere they have now in 0])eration some thirty odd 
 cheese factories The cheese from that region used to sell for 
 two cents less per j)Ound than the cheese from the Province of 
 Ontario. They have been gradually ini]»roving until they now 
 sell at prices much closer to Ontario than that. iMany cheese- 
 makers met me there at one factory. One had driven sixty miles 
 to get instruction, and I heard from that cheese-maker, late in the 
 fall, that the cheese from his factory had sold for the average 
 l)rice of Ontario cheese shi])]>ed to Montreal. Now, the only 
 thing that this inijtortant province needs — I mean important in 
 }»oint of geogra})hical position an<l also in enterprising po})ulation 
 — is just a little instruction. They have the facilities for making 
 cheese as fine as in Ontario ; and if they had ])roper instruction, it 
 would add nearly one cent per pouiul to the value of the total })ro- 
 ducts in cheese, of not only one district but of the whole Province 
 of Quebec, and now the Province of Quebec is reported to have 
 five hundred cheese factories and one hundred creameries. The 
 very meagre exjK'use of having one or two instructors on the road, 
 is a bagatelle compared with the immense increase in the value of 
 this product. 
 
 In the Maritime Provinces it was intended to have one station 
 in each province, and to have those in operation this year. Down 
 there the question is not so much the best way of making fine 
 cheese and butter, as of inducing farmers to go into that business. 
 Let me state for your information the condition of affairs in Prince 
 Edward Island. In Prince Edward Island the business of manu- 
 facturing cheese in factories, was started some ten years 
 ago ; but for some reason the business was not a success, and now 
 there are only two factories in existence and in operation this 
 
 mm 
 

 
 year. The farmers M'itli Avlioin I converserl upon this stibjcrt, 
 said tliere was somotluniz; in tlioir contlitions unsuitable to the 
 carrying on of the dairying business ; and they biiis(jui'ly clinehed 
 that statement by saying "You see our factories have all gone 
 down." To my mind there is notliing unsuitable in the conditions 
 of Prince Edward Island for the successful i)rosecution of (hiirying ; 
 and by having one station maintained there for a year or two, I 
 think farmers will be induced to sui))»ort the station and support 
 more factories of their own, Avhen they have the assurance that 
 there is one place, convenient of access, at which they can always 
 have the opportunity of ascertaining the best method of conducting 
 the business. This is a matter of very great moment --that 
 farmers should be insj)ired with confidence with respect to making 
 the business a success. It is a matter of making the business 
 successful, by helping the farmers and the cheese-makers with 
 instruction, and by maintaining for a time an exi»erimental 
 station to which thev can go for information. The same is true 
 of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick. During the course of mv 
 visit there this si)ring, and my second visit last month, I found 
 this state of affairs : — The su])ply of fodder wa^ very scant and the 
 farmers were buvinu" laroe (luantities of hav from the Province of 
 Quebec ; the cattle were in a very poor condition, the dry season 
 and cold spring having left the grass backward for i>asturing On 
 the whole the cattle are this season in just as poor condition as they 
 ever were before, for suj»i)orting chcse factories and creameries. 
 That brought me to the conclusion that they needed a good deal 
 of assistance in providing cheaper fodder for their cattle during 
 the winter, so that liereafter thev would not come throuoh as badlv 
 as they did this spring. Instead of starting exj)erimental dairy 
 stations in each i)rovince, we have left two men to travel through 
 those provinces to visit all the cheese factories in each province, 
 and in Nova Scotia there are some twelve new ones being started 
 this summer. After that is done, they will vi.^it sections where no 
 cheese factories exist and give information to the farmers in resrard 
 to the erection of buildings and the general conduct of the business. 
 They will also be furnished with a small kit for making butter and at 
 meetings there will be illustrations and demonstrations of making 
 butter in the best way, so that farmers and their wives may get inform- 
 ation upon the special points concerning the best way of turning out 
 
uniformly tiiio dairy Vmtter. Beside this, tlicse same men will be 
 everywhere talkinir ii|» the advantage and need of growintr fodder 
 corn for cattle feeding. .Just a wor<l on that branch of the work. 
 During tlie course of jirevious visits in the ^laritiine Provinces this 
 matter has been mentioned at meetings and elsewhere with the re- 
 sult that in the Island of Prince Edward, tAvo men had built silos 
 and n-vd the ensilage from them last winter. They were gratify- 
 ing successes in every sense. 1"|) to that time very few men had 
 grown fodder corn in that part of the Dominion. In fact, at 
 several meetii gs I attended, not more than four or five men who 
 where present, had ever taken notice of the corn plant growing as 
 a field crop. In follov.ing out the line of work undertaken by tlie 
 ICxperimental Farms for distributing seed grain, T Avas able to dis- 
 tribute three-iiound bags of corn to persons attending tlie meetings, 
 with full ]>articulars of planting, so that after growing a small area 
 for one year, they woidd learn how to handle this crop to advantage 
 on a larger scale. After and <biring my last trip down there, I 
 arranged to give away seven hundred and lifty odd samples of corn. 
 So Ave have seven hundred an<l fiftv farmers tjroAvincc corn this 
 year and promising to talk it up and re[)ort on it next tail. This 
 I consider important for the reason that Avhile many men Avill not 
 build silos, they can still save the corn in a very cheap way for 
 fodder jairposes. I have been asked to bring this matter before 
 the Committee by one or two members, Avho thought that the 
 building of silos was im[)racticable Avhere farmers greAV only one or 
 two acres of corn. I have had corn groAvn in the same Avay as for 
 silos, in rows planted thin, and then stooked up in the field by the 
 use of a connuon corndiorse. If the corn be left that way, tied 
 securely at the top by means of a hay rope, sti'aAV rope, or binding 
 twine, it Avill kee[> Avith little Avaste until later in the fall, 
 Avhen it can be taken to the barnyard, Avhere a contrivance 
 can be made almost as serviceable for a small lot of corn as a silo. 
 It is not a ncAv plan for those avIio live in AYestern Ontario, but it 
 is ncAv to the people in many other i)arts of Canada. It consists in 
 taking a number of forked stakes and driving them into the 
 ground. By laying poles in these forks you can make a simple 
 corn trestle. By laying down a fcAv old rails, like the base for a 
 stack, the corn can be placed on eiul leaning against that trestle 
 to the thickness of two or three feet on both sides. Then ordinary 
 
11 
 
 rails or polos i-an be jd.'U'od on \hv outside of Xhv corn, on both 
 Hides, lengtlnvise, the whole beinj:; tied near the top ot' the e(»rn by 
 hay or straw ropes. Then, it' a lew boards \w put on the top and 
 on both sides — allowint; them to overlap — they will shed all the 
 rain. The corn stalks can be fed from the end, with very little 
 more waste than, when the crop is ].ut up in a silo, and the outlay 
 recpiireu for stooking or stacking it in that way is simply nil. .\ny 
 man can make a contrivance of that kind in a few hours ; I 
 introduce<l the plan to the peo|ile in the Maritime Pi'ovinces '\n a 
 circular which 1 issued this month. 1 have found that method to 
 be quite successful in i)ast years, and tlu' only risk incurred is that 
 if one puts straw on the rails for a foundation, it will become 
 a great lnirV)our for mice, but barring that difficulty the corn saves 
 well, and the most of the waste is a little weathering on the outside 
 stalks. 
 
 Now, I have referred briefly to what we have done in Ontario, 
 in Quebec and in tlie Maritime Provinces. It may be in place to 
 say a little with respect to what we propose ♦(> do in this j)ro- 
 vinee from this time on, and also in the other pi'ovinces. In the 
 I'rovince of Oiitario, after the beginning of July, it is j>roposed to 
 have at least two stations or cheese factories where a su]»erin- 
 tendent will stav and nnmufacture cheese with the object of 
 discovering the quantity and quality of cheese that will result from 
 different (pialities of milk. I understand that none of y '. are 
 specialists in dairying and will not understand fidly t'lese terms 
 unless I make full e.\i)lanation. We have milk going to factories, 
 containing from. 3 to 4^ per cent, of butter fat. One object of the 
 experimental work is this: — We shall have vats so c(nistrueted as 
 to have three compartments. In one compartment will be j)ut 
 milk averaging 8 per cent, of butter fat, which we will obtain 
 from the farmers furnishing milk of that (piality. In another will 
 be i)ut milk averaging 3^ per cent, of butter fat, and in the third 
 will be put milk averaging 4 per cent. The cheese manufactured 
 from these different lots will be kept separate, and will yield 
 infoi'mation as to the quantity of cheese resulting from these 
 different qualities of milk ; and we shall also discover the effect on 
 the quality. We propose to send these cheese to the foreign market 
 and test the comparative value they have there, and by that means 
 we wi'.l complete the plan which I have briefly outlined for making 
 
12 
 
 : ! 
 
 a specific scale of coiuparativc values, whereby milk of 8 per cent, 
 of blotter fat and 'U i)er cent, and 4 per cent, can be i)aid for 
 according to it;- quality. At the same time these stations will be 
 ojjen for the inspection and instruciion of any cheese-makers or 
 fanners durino- the tiuu' our superintendents are w<M-king there. 
 Then, some time during the autumn it is proposed to select two 
 stations in Ontario where the farmers will agree to furnish a 
 snjtply of milk through the winter in order to make butter, — the 
 cheese factory being adai)ted or changed for that use, — for the 
 ])ur]»ose of deanouhtrating the advantage of makhig butter when 
 butter is dear ; of making butter uniform in (piality and fit for 
 export; of encouraging the raising of calves in connection there- 
 with ; of im2>roving the <pudity of butter by the a(h)ption of co- 
 operative methods ; of developing the export trade through ship- 
 ments of fresh creamery butter, and of combining the manufacture 
 of butter aiul the "aisingof stock in the same neighbourhood and on 
 the same farms. \\ i' will thus ]iav(- more stock to export and aiore 
 cows to milk at home. If we ciin secure milk from twelve or 
 fifteen })atrons for the first year in which the station i-s established; 
 that will be sufHcient. I can name you twenty farmers now who have 
 been Uiaking butter during the w inter for the last two years and have 
 found it the most ])roHtable ])ractice in their business. I can name 
 you a few men who can tell you that tluy have made money by winter 
 dairying, and by concentrating a few years' attention on butter- 
 making and stock-raising. liut the exj)erience of these men is not 
 available for the instruction of the )»eople at large. If we get 
 farmers to heartily su]»)»ort these stations, we i-an use their ex- 
 jierience over the whole country ; and farmers everywhere can 
 draw their own conclusions. At the E'-xiJerimental Farm adjacent 
 to this citv \ve have no trouble in making winter milk and making 
 it chea|»ly by using corn ensilage, but if we cited our own ex- 
 perience only, the farmers would at once say : — " Oh, it is a Govern- 
 ment institution and you have the Government purse bobind you ; 
 but we could not make it pay." If we can get 12 or 15 men in the 
 same position as themselves to make a success of co-operative winter 
 dairying, we can spread the information abroad with a better ex- 
 pectation of it being received and acted upon. 
 
 Then we pr >pose to do the same tl.ing in the Province of Quebec 
 by having a Station there running through the winter. In con- 
 
13 
 
 neetion Avith the work in Ontario and Quebec; we propose to have 
 a quantity of the goods which are made sent to new foreign markets, 
 so that Canadian good(> will be able to a})proi)riate and control 
 th"se markets for our own ]>eoi)le. As one instance of that, 
 although the Government Station had no control of them, I have 
 had cognizance of small shipmentsof butter to Chinaandllonf; Kong. 
 Butter sells out there from fifty to sixty cents per j)ound, auvl it 
 has been going all the way from Europe, across our Continent by 
 way of Vancouver to that market. A few experimental shii)ments 
 from our own Stations, will enable our own jjcople to v-apture and 
 control those nnirkets. Then, fancy varieties of cheese fetch very 
 high prices iri foreign markets. Our peojtle have not been making 
 them. We proi)ose to make these fancy varieties of cheese to see 
 if Canadian varieties will take as well as English fancy varieties 
 havc done. 
 
 One other matter in the foreign market matter is this :--Tn the 
 case of the Maritime Provinces I find tlie iieople are afraid that as 
 soon as their limited local market is supplied, they can have 
 no outlet for their cheese. The cheese I have seen made in Nova 
 Scotia and Prince Edward Island seem quite as good in quality as 
 that in Ontario, and it would be a judicious })ian to send a few 
 hundred boxes from the jNIaritime Provinces, to give the people there 
 information as to whether their cheese will really fetch as mi.ch 
 money as do ours from Ont;;rio in foreign markets ; and if they do 
 that, the people will have further contidence to devclo}) tliis business. 
 At any rate, they will see that the foreign market is at their service, 
 quite as much as for the peoi)le of Ontario. A few manufacturers 
 in Nova Scotia especially, have sent cheese to the West Indies 
 during the recent Exhibition there. Some have gone forward since, 
 and reports of the most gratifying nature, M'ith regard to the prices 
 they liave sold for and the reception they met with generally, 
 have been returned. That is one new market we might appropriate 
 and control. I think there is nothing more in connection with the 
 work in Ontario, Quebec and the Maritime Provinces, *hat we have 
 done or have in view to undertake in tiie near future, that I need 
 to refer to this morning. 
 
 For the Province of Manitt)ba, the work Avill be of a somewhat 
 similar nature. In ^Manitoba there are, although statistics are very 
 incomplete, about twenty cheese factories and creameries. We 
 
14 
 
 propose to have one man within ten clays, visiting all the cheese 
 factories in Jianitoba, so as to enable the makers up there to adopt 
 tiie very latest method of making cheese for the local market and 
 for export. We will have some work done in connection with the 
 creameries, and then the same instructors will be available to 
 address meetings of farmers duraig the summer and autumn on the 
 best methods of carrying on cneese-making and butter-making. 
 All the men we have employed are practical men of many years 
 experience in this work. Some work will be undertaken in the 
 North West Territories. For this year it will take the form of a 
 travelling instructor carrying information to the peoi)le ; and as 
 soon as the condition up there is suitable, we will have a permanent 
 Station, that is, permanent in one place for two years, from which 
 information can be given out. 
 
 For British Columbia the })resent plan is to hold a series of 
 meetings during the month of August and perhaps in September, 
 for the pur})ose of giving farmers out there some encouragement in 
 the work of mixed farming. Butter-making out there will pay 
 remarkably well. I found, last year, many farmers selling butter 
 for fifty cents per i)Ound the year round, which is to be regarded 
 as a very good price. In some cases farmers told me, that all their 
 farms and farm buildings had been paid for out of the i)ro.luct of 
 their cows. The object of the work in British Columbia, is to 
 encourage home dairying in the most }>rotitable and successful way. 
 As far as I have seen the Province, and I have not seen very much of 
 it yet, I am convinced that the home or farm system of manufac- 
 turing products is the one which will prevail. I think there will 
 be large profits in dairying, and that this work will continue to be 
 satisfactory to the people. For this jjreseut summer, I j)ropose to 
 8i)end nearlv a month there inyself in forwardiny; this work. 
 Having to deal Avith a new and particularly important subject this 
 morning, I have already consumed a good deal of the time of the 
 Committee ; but after this matter has been discussed I would 
 crave your permission to bring before you one other matter in 
 connection with the branding of cheese and butter for the foreign 
 nuirket. 
 
 By Mr. Trow. 
 
 Q.— Do you consider that it would take a long time to remove 
 the English prejudice against Canadian cheese in preference 
 
 li^i 
 
15 
 
 to their own cheese ? The English, as a rule, are prejudiced more 
 particularly in reference to any articles of consuni})tion from 
 foreign countries, and will give large jirices for articles of home 
 production which they relish and consider preferable to foreign 
 products. If you consider our cheese equal to theirs, do you not 
 think that prejudice would soon be removed ? 
 
 A. — Our best cheese has been ecpial to most of theirs for the 
 past iive or six years ; nevertheless the ])rejudice has not given way 
 very much, for this reason : — It i>ays the English shopkeeper to 
 brand or ticket Canadian cheese as English Cheddar. They can 
 sell those cheese for a higher })rice, as much as four cents a pound 
 higher, by adopting this practice. 
 
 Q. — But is not the P-^nglish Cheddar cheese and Canadian 
 cheese different in size ? Could not the ilifference be detected in 
 that way ? 
 
 A. — Last year, English merchants found a demand for Canadian 
 cheese to be sold as English so great, that they gave instructions 
 to the makers in Canada to nuinufacture Canadian cheese the s.ime 
 size as English Cheddars and to ship it in thatway. 
 
 Q. — Do you not think the climate of Great Britain has some- 
 thing to do with the superiority of their cheese V 
 
 A. — As far as they are sui)erior, yes. Their summer-made 
 cheese is, as a rule, better than ours, but our September and Octo- 
 ber cheese is undoubtedly equal to or superior to theirs. In this 
 connection I may state to the Committee the experience we had at 
 the Colonial and Indian Exhibition, I had the very best experts 
 pass their judgment on our i 'anadian cheese and they said they 
 were the finest cheese they had seen. After that our cheese were 
 taken to the Kilmarnock Exhibition, where over fifteen thousan*! 
 cheese had been brought together, and the judges, with but one 
 exception, stated they were the finest cheese on the ground. 
 
 Mk. McMillax. — My imi»ression is that Professor Robertson is 
 beginning a little at the wrong end. I think he should have been 
 able to tell us the real value of the experimenis of butter and 
 cheese at the Experimental Farms before going amongst the 
 farmers . 
 
 By Mr. Cochrane. 
 
 Q. — Are we to understand that milk from well-fed cows is 
 richer and better than that from cows poorly fed ? 
 
16 
 
 A. — If the cow be well fed, after a long i)eriod the milk will be 
 impivved in quality. 
 
 Q. — What is a long 2)erioi[ V 
 
 A. — It would take several years to make much change. 
 By Mr. Tkow. 
 
 Q. — What is the probable cost of your dairy experimental work 
 for the season ? 
 
 A. — The amount expected to l)e expended for all 2)urposes, sal- 
 aries ami travelling expenses, is about -^1,500 per province. 
 
 Q. — For one station V 
 
 A. — For one statioji in each province. The extra station in 
 Ontario can be carried on out of what is saved from the other 
 provinces this year, where conditions do not yet exist, requiring so 
 large an ex}>enditure. 
 
 Bv Mr. Cochrane. 
 
 Q. — I think there is trouble in store for people who do not 
 pay attention to feeding. We learn that dissatisfaction exists 
 among farmers Avho feed tlieir cows well because they think they 
 do not get a fair 'price for their milk. If improved feed can only 
 improve the quality of the milk in several years, I think the opinion 
 should be set asidr that a man is entitled to more money for his 
 milk if he feeds Avell ? 
 
 A. — If a man has an improved herd of cattle, in several years 
 time the milk is Avorth more })er hundred pounds, but he com- 
 mences to gain from his extra feeding at thevery outset, by obtain- 
 ing a greater quantity of milk. 
 Bv Mr. ^J^row. 
 
 Q. — I have always understood that both quantity and quality 
 depended very materially on good feeding ? 
 
 A. — That is true. When we speak of the quality being im- 
 proved there is not only embraced in it the constituents as to the 
 solids of the milk, but the flavour, &c., which give it an extra 
 value. The flavour comes direct from the feed, but the per centago 
 of the several constituents of the milk depends on the constitution 
 and temperament of the animal, Avhich cannot be changed in one 
 or two months. Milk is an elaboration in the cow's system. You 
 can change the quality of the milk materially only by modifying 
 the cow's system, and continued good feeding will have a good deal 
 to do with that. 
 
By Mr. McGregor. 
 
 Q. — AV bat soils do you prefer for pasture? 
 
 A. — Any fairly dry soil. The grass growing on marshy land is 
 the poorest. 
 
 By Mr. Cociiraxe. 
 
 Q. — Do you find in your experiments, that there is any dis- 
 satisfaction in regard to the prices paid for milk ? 
 
 A. — Some of the factories have suffered to the extent that they 
 have been closed because the farmers in the vicinity stated that 
 they "svere not getting fair play. 
 
 By Mr. McMillan. 
 
 Q. — The Professor says that a change in feed will not show any 
 difference for a few months, but if you take a cow and feed her 
 well for three years, will she not give richer milk ? 
 
 A. — Yes, slightly richer and of greater <|uantity. And in reply 
 to the previous question of Mr. McMillan : Since I am in a measure 
 responsibleforrecommendingthe establishment of these Experiment- 
 al Dairy Stations, I wo^ild like to say that the work, in my judgment, 
 has commenced at the right end. The Ex[»erimental Farm is the 
 place where the farmers can learn the cheapest Avay o: producing 
 milk. But if we have a factory there, and make the cheese from 
 our own herd, our conditions would be altogether different from 
 what they would be, were the milk ootained from fifty different 
 patrons, as will be likely the case in time at the different 
 stations. Heie in Ottawa we cannot get the milk. The city 
 demand for table use is too great. We find it necessary there- 
 fore, to go awaj where the conditions exist, similar to those 
 which the cheese and butter niakers of the country have to 
 encounter, and for this reason we must have the factories apart 
 from the Experimental Farm. We have the two aspects of the 
 value of this service. The Experimental Farms furnish inform- 
 ation as to the cheapest and best methods of production of milk, 
 etc., while the Experimental Dairy Stations will afford assistance 
 for prosecuting the manufacture of the sanie in the best way. 
 
 By the Chairman. 
 
 Q, — Is the testing machine, an expensive one or difficult to 
 work ? 
 
 A. — For 814 you can get one of four bottle size, and any- 
 
18 
 
 one of ordinary ability can learn to use it by a few hours practice. 
 By Mr. Trow. 
 
 Q. — Do you think that the sub-division of the proceeds from 
 the cheese according to the quality of the milk would give dis- 
 satisfaction to the patrons of the factory ? 
 
 A. — I do not think so. The decision in regard to the adoption 
 of that plan would rest with the majority of the patrons. And I 
 do not think that farmers will continue to be satisfied with any 
 system which does not provide for taking account of both the 
 quantity and quality of milk. If milk containing 3 percent, of fat 
 be worth 60, 3^ per cent, worth 70, 4 per cent, worth 80, then the 
 proceeds from the sales of the cheese may be distributed accord- 
 ing to the application of thatscale. At the annual meeting of the 
 patrons who support the factories, you will find an anxiety ex- 
 pressed to have a valuation and division made according to quality, 
 and the farmers at the annual meetings may say "we will have 
 the proceeds of our milk divided in this way." That would be 
 different from any attempt at regulating the division and distribu- 
 tion of proceeds by outside interference. 
 
 By Mr. Dawson. 
 
 Q. — How do you propose to provide for the brand numbers of 
 the different factories ? 
 
 A. — In reply to that question I may say that I would propose 
 to have a provision that every factory should have a registered 
 number. Every representative should register his factory in 
 the office of the Dairy Commissioner and receive a registered 
 number for use in that factory only. Then there would be per- 
 mission given for that factory to use the words ' ' Canadian Full 
 Cream Cheese " on the cheese and on the box with the brand 
 and the number of his factory. In that way the English people 
 would get familiarized with the good quality of our cheese under 
 our own Canadian name. The intrinsic value of the best cheese 
 would give an additional value to the brand and registered number 
 on the same ; and in the future, factories knowing that they 
 might obtain a cent or a half a cent per pound more for their 
 cheese would be stirred up in a healthy effort to excel because 
 of the extra price which could be realized. There would be some 
 dissatisfaction also and trouble at first, but the end would be to the 
 advantage of the farmers and manufacturers. 
 
 It 
 
 I i 
 
) 
 
 t 
 
 i 
 
 
 19 
 
 By Mr. Chairman . 
 
 Q. — Would you have the name and number branded on ? 
 
 A. — I would have a stencil brand — the figures and letters cut 
 out, and then the same put on with a brush. 
 
 By Mr. Dawson. 
 
 Q. — Would the general public recognize it then as a brand of 
 Canadian Cheese V 
 
 A. — I think they would. I would suggest that the words to be 
 used should be " Canadian Full Cream Cheese" in letters an inch 
 long, and after a little while the name would become recognized and 
 familiar. We have had in the past, some trouble with some infer- 
 ior made cheese of the Western States, — made from milk after the 
 cream has been removed and foreign fat substituted. These have 
 been bought by Canadian merchants, stored in bond in Ingersoll, 
 Stratford, Montreal, and afterwards have been shiijped on Bills of 
 Ladin^.- dated from a Canadian place. Hence they did pass on the 
 British side ostensibly as genuine Canadian cheese. 
 
 By Mr. Bain. 
 
 Q. — How do they get over customs regulations ? 
 
 A. — Thecheese were stored in bond. As soon as the practice was 
 discovered last year, the Minister of Customs issued instructions that 
 no cheese in bond should be exported from a Canadian warehouse, 
 that did not carry on it the brand " Product of the United States," 
 or the brand of the country where produced. That stopped the prac- 
 tice to a large extent, but at the same time it would be better to 
 have our cheese branded, "Canadian Full Cream Cheese," so that 
 we may get the credit for the quality of our own products. If the 
 product of say factory No. 500 is remarkably fine, and begins to 
 sell well, the retailer will ask the wholesale merchant for that 
 brand, and it will be therefore necessary for the wholesale mer- 
 chant to meet that demand. That will induce discriminating com- 
 petition. It is one object of our experimental stations to get men 
 to know our different qualities and brands of cheese and get in this 
 I way better prices. 
 
 By Mr. Cochrane. 
 
 Q. — What is your experience as to the relative value for feeding 
 purposes of corn cured dry in the shock and cured as ensilage ? 
 
 A. — Only a few tests have been made and I would not speak 
 
■20 
 
 hastily of what has been our obsevvation. When corn is stored in 
 a loft and ])rotected from the weather it is almost as good as from 
 the silo. The silo is economical because in it you can store a large 
 (luantity in a small si)aee, but when the corn is saved in a loft and 
 j)rotected from the weather it is equal in value. 
 
 By Mr. M( Mii.lax. 
 
 Q. — Will the cattle eat it as cleanly ? 
 
 A. — Yes, except the butts of the stalks, if it be fed without 
 previous cutting. 
 
 By the Chairman. 
 
 Q. — Will feeding on dry corn make the cows give as much milk 
 as feeding them on ensilage ? 
 
 A. — Not (|uite. The succulent condition of the e'^silage helps to 
 maintain the milk yield with little shrinkage. 
 By Mr. Cochrane. 
 
 Q. Is it practicable to save fodder corn by putting it in alternate 
 layers with straw ? 
 
 A — I have never found it successful if the layers of corn were 
 more than four inches thick ; if more than four inches there is 
 enough moisture to make them mould. 
 
 By the Chairman. 
 
 Q. A suggestion v,-as made by the Dairymen's Association last 
 year about sending butter in different packages to foreign markets. 
 Did you make any inquiry res])ecting the advisability of adopting 
 that jtroposal and shipping butter abroad V 
 
 A. — This conclusion Avas arrived at, that, instead of buying 
 butter from outside factories, we would use part of the product of 
 the Experimental Dairy Stations, put it up in different packages, 
 send them abroad, and thus get all the information we want with 
 respect to the size andstyle of packages which will be most suit- 
 able for the English market. 
 
 Q. Did you make any arrangements for shipping butter, as sug- 
 gested it should be done at short intervals, in or<ler to establish 
 markets for Canadian butter when of good quality and not too old ? 
 
 A. — Nothing has been done, except that it is planned to ship part 
 of the products of these Stations, weekly or fortnightly, as the cir- 
 cumstances then exisi.ting may favour.