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RAILWAY AND ITS EASTERN CONNECTIONS. > • • • • » Sr^EECHI ZDELIVEI^EinD BY LOUIS BEAUBIEN, ESQ., M.P.P., IM • / THE LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF THE PROVINCE OF QUEBEC, ON IStii cTA.ISrTJA.K;."^, 1875. < • • « » • »,»••• t •' « I » • • • ■ ', ■ ' 1 . • • k * • « ^ • • * ■ MONTREAL : GAZSTTE PRINTING HOUSE, NEARLY OPPOSITE THE POST OFFICE. J875. * i i. :'t itJ»a.S&^^' ' .».*flt»^^'V!-WV4 . ■' '«»'^;- '-■ ■ - ■ " '' -"w- ■■*t^>< ^»--< Y M • • • To the Editor of '' The Gazette.", Sir, — A few days after having 'ddivered my speech in the House, I Was asked to write it out in full, as the press had repro- duced but a part of it. • To comply with the request of my friends, I have be^n obliged, in the midst of the labour of the Session Sittings of Committees and the House, to do this work. I hope I shall be therefore excused my style is not that of the man who quietly sits down in his study and there writes undisturbed. I have hastily taken up each one of the arguments made use of at the time of my speech ; that is all ' I propose to do, in fact all I could do. With these few remarks, T will at once proceed I am, Sir, Your obedient servant, • ... ^. .■•'.•..■.■, 'i •:• :'• ::^--.' L. BEAUBIEN. a V / o A 1 . ' THE PACIFIC RAILWAY AND ITS CONNECTIONS. -.^ — ■•••^- SI'EECH: HDEILiI'VEiaElD RY 1 in the ad re pro- obliged, ^nmittees ; excused lis study jach one hat is all UBIEN. Louis Beaubien, Esq., M. P. P., In the Leg-islativ(^ Assembly of tlie Province of Quebec, on the 18th January, 1875. Mr. Speaker,— I have the honor^f proposing, teconded by Mr. Bellinghfem, 4,hat the Committee on Kaihoa-ls be re- quested to enquire into the best measure to be ado[»ted to insure to the Province of Quebec a direct and advantageous communication with the branch of Pacific llailway about to be constructed between Georgian Bay and Lake ^ipi8fing, and to report thereon to the House at an early opportunity. "^ REASONS FOR PREFERRING CERTAIN QUEBEC RAILROADS. If one enquires for what reason the North Shore and the Northern Coloniza- tion of Montreal Companies have been preferred — if I may thus speak— to other Companies likewise and at the Fame time asking aid from the Province ; if it is fisked why these two railroads are pre- ferred to the Kennebec hailroad, for in- stance, which road is called to restore prosperity to the city of Quebec, that old cradle of our population ; if it is asked why these Companies have been preferred to the important E:)8tern Townships Kailways, which are expected to put us in communicatic n with the important cities oa the Atlantic coast;— the answer to th:it question will be found in the speech delivered on the Budget by the Uon. Treasurer of the Province, during the past session, wherein he says : — " Ii is highly important to our pros- perity as a Province that the eastern end of the tacific Railway should be built direct through our Proviace, to the tide waters of the oc>'an at this city. To secure this, we should be read), as soon as possible, with that portion which passes through our territory. If we wait till the Pacific Railway is^ built, before being ready for theconnectin(j link between the ecsterly end of the Pacific bailway proper and the western end of our Northern Grand Trunk Line, we may rely upon it we shall be cut oft" by other connections made from Ontario, and find ourselves too late ; other communications for trade and transport of goods opened up, trade will be diverted into other channels, and we will be left out in the cold, so far as being part of the Pacific Railway is con* cerned. Our railway, if not built now, will probably never be built ; at all events we would lose the main connection with the West or the North, and lose it for ever." 'I he Fon. Treasurer had understood that it was time for the Province of Que- bec to tike the lead in the competition for commerce of the West, towards which all the towns of the Atlantic were tending. One sees these cities extending their lines towards the West, cutting through mountains, — in a word, establishiiig a directcommunication between these same cities which are forwarding to Jiurope and the vast productive regions of the West which will give bread to the whole universe. QUEBEC ROADS THE SHORTEST. We have, therefore, had the preference shown us because we have been called to bring the products of the West to the Province of Quebec, by thS shortest route. On this score do we claim the preference shown to UB, preference which would have 51508 f 3 been a sryiug iojustioe toward the other oompanies if we had not been able to plead this grand object of the West, and I do not fear to repeat it, although myBelf interested in these roads, from having given my time to them for many yeais past, if I thought that we could not attract this con\merce from the West, as is ex- pected of us, 1 am ready to declare that we have no right to the preferential grant which has been made to us. 1 feel, there- fore, perfect'y justified, &:r. Speaker, in placing this (juestion of our relations with the West before this honorable Hou-e. We have at present, it I may thus speak, to de- rive profits from the invest uenta which we have made to attain the results inten- ded, in a word, to arrive at the goal which has been pointed out to us. ^ot only do I ask the concurrence of this honorable Uouse, but, at a time when the P'ederal Legislature is about to assemble, 1 will also venture to call the attention of the hon members of that Legislature to the bubject upon which we are about to de- bate. I cannot chose a moro opportune motnent, nor a more favorable place than the present- one to bring the question be- fore the conntry. One oi the principal questions to be discussed will be, when next the Federal Legislature assembles, that same question of deciding how and by which hnes of rail- roads it is ).roposed to bind the Pdciiic Railway with the network of the railways established in the Provinces of OutArio and Quebec. In order to confer on this all-important .question for both of them, the North bhore and Northern Colonization Com- panies met together, and after ha ing dis- cussed the question at great length came to an agreement together on all points, and appointed a deputation, to go to Ot- tawa to lay before the Premier of the Dominion the paper containing their joint views ; these papers have already been published. I must mention, Mr. Speaker, that the first point raised at this meeting was the settling of reciprocal running arrange ments between the two roads, thns allow- ing all trains to pass. The two Companies came to a perfect understanding on that score, and I believe that the country, which had the right of expecting suctf a result, will be apprised of it with satisfac- tion. DEPUTATION TO OTTAWA. The first request which the deputation had to make to the Hon. Premier was that he shoul:^ cause the exploration and localisation of the road, of which he pi o posed to construct apart, from the Riviere desFrancais to Lake Mpissing, and where- of he intended snbsidizing the other part from Lake Nipissing to Renfrew. The deputation, resting on the data supplied to it by its engineers, maintained that the road by the Mattawa was by far to be pre- f rred, both from an economical and com- mercial point of view, and de. facto the shortest, considering the easy grades, to that proposed or rather preferred by the Governmeiit; and consequently it would, only be just that the two lines should be explored in a way that would allow that a judgment, matured and founded on facts, Bhould be i)ronounced upon them. Toe Hon. Premier, pointing to the map, replied to the deputation tliat what Mon- ti eal and the Province of Quebec should. first seek was a straight line ^between a point situated ^on the Georgian B ly, at the mouth of the French liiver, and the line already constructed in the- valley of the Ottawa. None other but » direct line, said he, would ever satisfy the city of Montreal, and were any ottier line adopted, this latter one wouM not be long before it saw itself supplanted^by the direct road, as one can see in the United btates, where this is exemplified by the piercing of the Uoosac Tuanel at an immense cost, all this labour being expended merely to shoiten by a few miles the road to the West. But, Mr. Speaker, whilst the Hon. Premier, armed with this principle of a direct roadway favored the road of his choice, and was thus maintain- ing his point, it was quite a)lowable for us to anticipate a little tbe Construction of this line, whilst seeing in the future all the result") that it would accomplish; it was permissible for us to see rising, growing and developing themselves groups of populations, villages, towns, or in a word, all the vast back country of Ontario, this back country al- ready peopled and still helping to in- crease tbe preponderance acquired to On- tario by the density of its population occupying the banks of the St. Lawrence, [t was likewise allowfible for us to foresee Ontario thus assuming, by virtue of ex- penses made by the whole Dominion, a preponderance, against which all the lest of the Domiuioa would in vain have tried to struggle. We could see the Hon. Premier base all his argu nent, all his able pleading, on the fact that he had for bim on the map the direct line, and we agreed that, if we could prove that the line proposed to us as the uOst direct, was de f.clo not the shortest; but that we could claim this ad- vantage for our road by the Mattawa, all the great results that we anticipated a while ago would become the appanage of our Province. The interests of the Do- 8 other part rew. Th© .0. supplied ed that the r to be pre- il and com- '.. facto the grades, to red by the ly it would nes should vould allow Founded on ipon them, o the map, what Mon- sbec should (^between a ian B ly, at River, aud >d in th& >ther but » r saiisf y the ' other line uki not be )planted,by see in the exemplified 5 Tunnel at ibour being ' a few miles [r. Speaker, ed with thid favored the IS maintain- lowable for onstruction ,e future all iccomplish : eee rising, themselves ges, towns, vast back country ai- ding to in- lir^to On- population Lawrence. s to foresee rtue of ex- )ominion, a all the I est have tried emier base }leadiDg, on on the map that, if we posed to ua "Jo not the lim this ad- iattawa, all iticipated a ppanage of of the ho- minion would not for that be the les? served. I perceive, Mr. Speaker, that on the map being consulted I am looked up to with some surpriae. I admit' that my as- sertion needs developing s^mawh'it, but I antic pate a triu aph f jr it none the leas. SH0KTXB3S OF TUB MNH: DEM )N VI'K VTBO. With the map alone before him, the argument of the tt on. Premier is iovin cible. On that mip, Mr. Speak^^r reigns as sovereign m-vster the geometrioal axiom thit a straight line is the flhoruest road from one point to another. But t 'u line may cease to be so, not only by literal di- vergencies which will appear on the map, but also by vertical divergenc'.es whiuh will not appear on the map, and which can only be discovered by tracing the pro- file of the road. Let us rem'^mb >r the following principle : the lateral d vergency i* measured by the surveyor's chain, the vertical divergency by the ievdl of the en gineer. W« are going to prove by the report of Mr. L^gge, which I shall quote, that the vertical divergency which is foun '. in fol- lowing the road preferred by Mr. Mac- kenzie is much more considerable than the lateral di^erg-^n^y ti whish we mut submir. in folio win:; the Mattawan road. We shall thus have proved that our ro id is the shortisst. Tue experience of civil engineering has demonstrated that an elevation of 20 feet on account of the increase of traction ne- cessary to raise all the iratfic to that ele- vation, w.is equivalent to a mile-of distance gone over on a plane surface. Thus, by diviiing the total amount of feet of ver tical divergency or ot level by 20, one will have as result the number of miles to be added to such a line when one wishes to compare it in length with one constructed on a plane surface It is by putting forward this principle which noae — no engineer — can dispute, that we can, without fear of being contra- dicted, affirm \\x\i the road by the Mat- tawan is really the shortest. Let us there- fore prove thit our levels are the lo vest. But I must first tell you, Mr. Bpetker, that when I witnessed the assurance with which the Hon. Premier rejected the as- sertions of our engineer, and heard him deijlare tiat the road from Renfrew to Lake Nipissing was perfectly easy, did not present any extraordinary obstacle and did not possess the high levals which made it obj actionable, 1 wts a little sh iken in my convictions ; so that after tha inter- view had taken plaoe. I asked our engin- eer if he was still of the same opiair n after hearing su3h assertions. I had uot long to wait for an answer. Mr. Speaker, and 1 see it in a report aadressed to our Boird of Directors, on the said interview of the d^logUion with the Hon. Premier. Mr. L'^gge based his opinion on the reports of Messrs. Sbiinly and Clarke, at the tiine of their explorations for the co.istruction of a canal through the viUey of the (Ottawa, and on the scientific explorings of Sir Willi im Lo^a i. If any one wiihes to o;wt doubt on th?) re^tutation of these dia- tinguished men whose data are in our favor, we can say that on the other side, andt> sustain the rival line, that pro- posed by the Government, we hive mere- ly the report of an engineer who, without any instruments and without takiug any levels went on foot a^ much a^ he could over the proposed line betwean Renfrew and th'^ Georg ai Bvy. It seams tome, Mr Speaker, that it woull not have been diffijultf'^r this engineer to carry with him an im'trumint, which would hardly have delayed his walk and wherewith he could have from time to time taken levels, to do which he seeon to me to have been more bound than was Sir Wm. Logan when miking his report. BIPLO.IATlONS ok MBS3M. sh.vnly avd CLIRKE. In their e'cpl)ratioa3 fo.^ the omtruc- tion of the Ottawa canal, Messrs Shanly and Clarke plaoe the level of the Lac li Truite binding t)gether Like Nipissing and the Mattawa, axl situate on t^e line whir.'i we prefar, at 665 feet above the leve. of the sea. This lac all Truite is situated on ele- vated lands ; its waters lie at its weatern extremity, towards the Georgian Bay, whilst at its eas em extremity its waters meet the Ottawa. We have thus as a point of comparison between the two lines, the most elevatedpoint situated on ours. On the liae preferred by the Hon. Premier aad equally situated on elevated lands, are two considerable lakes, one the Like of B irnt Island and the other Otter Like ; the one empties its waters into the Muskoki Rver and the other in- to one of the branches of the Ottawa. We are acquainted with the level of the two likes, waich hive been furnished to us by J^ir William Logan in his reports for the years 1853 and 1856. We find th-i level of these lakes to be 1405 feet ; now we kaow, fllr. Speaker, from those wh> h ive explored that part of the Province of Oatario that the bmks of these laises attain in some places an a titude of 303 feet; consequeotly, ai the pryectel rail- ways must necessarily rise to the height of the surrounding lands, we would very likely h iV3 to add the height of tuese same f b>ik4 to that attained by the lev«l of the like, which would give u-t a height of about 10()0 feet ; Ba> lOOO feet of greater elevation for the roud ending at Hedfrew This would make aa additionHl 50 miles to be added to that ro id if we take into aocouai the aforementioned banks. MR. LK00K\S RKl'OUTS. Mp L'^gge saya in his report : ''1 am aware that the Hon. Premier i^ under the imi)re8Hion that there is no dif- ference of elevation at the point where the lines intersect, no doubt from infoima tion received from other authorities which he judges competent in the mat- ter. Navt-rtheless, I will venture to quote authorities of incontestable abil'ty. In the explorations mad » with instru ments by aaofisrs. I'^hanly and Clarke for the Ottawa Canal and Lake Huron, we find that the point where the two above- mention'-d likes discharge their waters into the Lie a la Truite, for the projt^cted cinal line in the vicinity of Lake Nipit- sing, is about 655 feet above the level of the sea. In the maps carefully prepared by Sir Wm. Logan for the yeirs 1853 and 1856 we find that the Lake of Burnt Island and Otter Lake, the respective sources of the Muskoka Kiver running into Lake Huron at the West, and of the Petewahwah dis- charging itself into the Ottawa at the iiast are each 1,405 feet above the level of the sea. These two lakes are situated at a short diiftance one from ea -h other, and on the direct line of the Hon. Premier, between the mouth of the Riviere des Frangais and Renfrew. The hills of the su rounding country through which toe road will pass are considerably abov^ the level of the waters of those lakes, whereas the south- ern shore of Like Nipissing, near the Lao a la Truite, his but a slight elevation. ^everthe.e8s, by taking the surface of the highest waters of Lac a la Truite and Otter Lake, so as not to be " istaken, we find a difterence in level of 750 feet in favftur of our line against that preferred by the Hon. Premier, and it is on this extreme height that the immense traffic which will at all times take place oa th Paoitic lldlway will have to pass. The expe- rience of engineering demonstrates that, lor the objects of transport, 20 feet of vertical height are equivalent to one mile of level grade. ( onsequently, if we adopt this view, the extreme height, let us say 751 feet, will be about equal to 37J miles of additional road, which, added to the dis tanoe already known by the map, will, for the purposes of transport, make the line of the tion. Premier 322| miles, or :3i% miles longer than its rival, the North em ClolonizAtion KomI, from Ottawa eta the Mattawa and Lako Nipissing to tha same point at the mouth of the Riviere des Frangais. These results which cannot be set aside will much embarrass those who advocate the direct line of Ontario. I am under a strong impressionthat the ultimate conclusions would be still more striking, if one had the opportunity of comparing the two rival linen, aft^r having explored them with the aid of instruments. We could then minutely compare the whole question of inclines, curves, of the actual measurement of the lines, of the costs of construction, of the amount of subsidy which would have to be given by the Local Governments of (Ontario and Quebec, to- gether wi'h" the municipal aid if there is to be any and the a to decide in favor of one of the two rival roads. As I declared in my report of the 31st Marcti,page 21 -^t: " The Federal Government would then be able to judge with a true knowledge of the facts and ac. to the best of the in- terests of the country." Ag\in, Mr. Lcgge says in his second report: '•You will notice from the foregoinf the in' ia second foregoinjr, >n of limd is a ques- termining nes One ■>art of the d inclines levatiouB, , tnking of L'lke informa- purpose lined with m with in- )oint, that ne cannot ority than struments stablished the Lake on th3 1405,85 st Messrs. vel of the intof the the same for of our id repre- ) far as it Northern ing of 37 hat road which has ion. regard to STi 8k field tting the e, facts to him, the hon. gentleman was pleaaed to observe that he con8:dered that Mr. Ij«»gge had no authority to de- cide that such a difterence existe 1 be tween the extreme levels. Thus did he at the time curtly settle the ({uestion. Aa a matter of interest one may a'so reo'd the fact that he dik for fiom the Uiviere des Frsnoais on the Georgian Bay, by way of Litke Nipissing, the Mattawa, up to Aylmer, in the f rovince of (.^uebe-i, ia, par fxce.Urnve, th'* national route which unites the most sullVages and which would Uiviere ian I)a7, by Intlawa, up tiuehe.% in, out A which whirl) would Di! into OOD* If indicate I rii and Lake nrtial engi- rniH that he of tlo firbt iteP8 whioh overnmAnt, be li=30,00() , Buys he, profit. If I d tilcult'PB onatructioQ that cffer rtuH that no e to tender » road now at a lower One muBt, et the enor- trise of the e for them. fT ROAD UX- nay happen profile are cuV)io yards be removed ntity of ma- ortfd to till g in Bome about that jr h^s gone taking any ^vertheless, ers when it road to be during last ate the line )m Aylmer taking into es, we had , a distance :)etween ta an Bay and >t a longer not done? the state of a oVijec* to i??ent pub- ebec, that on of ten- den for the oonHtruotion of the road un- dt^rtaken by the (Government hiwl expired on the 2')th or L'liit of November last. I cannot perHuade mysplf, Mr. Speaker, that the lion. Mr. Mackenzie, wi o IS preeminently a man of buHinesB neri, will proceed with iuch undue hiiHte. We are greatly interested at hiH looku)g the matter in the face onre more; for the more he o-xaniines it, the belter will be our chauceH. To day, at the time when the cont'aots for th" Government line are about to be given out, no on'» knowH, at lenst the public doeH not, where that line will strike (Georgian Hay. it is Haid ut the hiviere des fr.tnguls ; but the liivitre des Kran^ais or its mouth or rather its numer- ous mouths as it spreads itself out into eeveral rflmitic^ations, covers a vast spare of pet haps 15 or li<) miles, t- appy are those who quietly antl without noise ctin get to learn the ex e grain of the West ; elevators will rine as if by enchantment ; a large city will establish itself on the shores of the Bay and become a rival of the American city of BuflMo. And the uncertain, floating untraced line of the road without a single stnke to indicate the birth-place of the future town, says nothing to the public of the spot where these great things are to be accomplished. b as tho country not the right to demand more ample infoimation ? I will not say anything of the difficult pOBition wherein the Government will find itself if it decides upon giving the contract before any line lias been localiz- ed, without kiiOwmg the profile of the road and having to transact with contrac- tors who know still lens about it and who 'will bind themselves to accomplish a work whose extent and cost they dre ignorant of. Montreal's claims versus Toronto's. In its meracrandura, the deputation in- formed the hon. Premier that at the time when one appe red dwpoeed to favour •with subsidies three lines in the Pro- vince of Ontario to put the Pacific in communication with the roads of the Pjo- vinces, it was but ju t that of those three, one at least should be constructed as much as possible in the Province of Que- bec, especially if we offered the shortest road, will we add now. 'On our mention-ng three roads Bubsidiiied in Ontario, the Hon. Premier asked me. with some astonishment, which were, except the Canada Central which goes to Renfrew, the two others. I will now explain to this House how we arrive in finding Ihtre two other roads HuboiilJHed in Ontario. I'l.AUSH IN 1IIH PACIFIO RAILWAY ACi'. By the Act of tl.n racilio Hallway, p: Hce9 understood to represent Montreal and the other Toronto, under the old Administration ? We are all awure ihat it was the inten- tion of th • t Government to connect the Pacific Hiilway with the ne: work of rail- ways already existing by two subsidized lines, one going towards Toronto and tho other towards Montreal. This fact is known to every one. And the present Administration cannot do otherwise, let me even say would not dare do other- wise. Such a programme will force itaelf upon every administration whieh ciptivating equally the favor ot Ontario and Quebec will be desirous cf remaining in power. Should any one doubt what I'm here ad- vancing, I will content myself with invok- ing as a proof the immense clamour 4of disapprobation which would lise in all Ontario, if the Hon. Premier would declare that the line halting at Renfretv willaloae be subsidized, it) on. Mr, Mackenzie, will fi d ' « f®^ ^i^L-j ' i i' ! !l ( he ever make eu'^h a declaration ? No t Toronto, so jealous of Montreal, eo ambi- tiouB of attaining her prosperity which she enviep, will see that one of her lines going towards the Pacihc is subsidized. This gives us two of the linep, S subsided. In order, Mr. Speaker, to discover the third line which 14 to be subsidized, the reasoning will be a little longer, and I shall have to trespass for a longer'time than I am desirous on the attention which this hon. House is granting me with so much indulgence. But I have to mention facts of the highest importance for us all. If at times 1 seem to make strange digressions and to travel too far from my subject, I will beg a little patience ; after all it will perhaps be niscovered that lam not in the wrong. If I pass by the Nor- thern Kailroad of ... . Toronto, I will perchance give a good reason for it. A word by way of introduction on this railway. IN DEBT AND PLEADING POVERTY. The Toronto Northern Railway has, like the Grand Trunk Eailway, profiL.fd by the resources of the two then united provinces of Upper and Lower Canada. It ended in contracting a debt of £400 000 sttrling, say $2,000 000, which it owes to the Dominion, and of which it simply, to use plain language, wants to get rid of. It is now neariy three years that all is set in motion with different governments to attain that result. There is not anything that has not been tried. This road, which did not pay its shareholders, has fallen mto the hands of it^ bondholders. It is for that reason thst the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie says now that the Northern Railway does not exist any longer. It does not exist any longer for the good reason that the bondholders and their re presentatives having in hands the running and working of that line, and finding that it pays well and that its receipts for this year amounting to one million, increases rapidly from year to year, have not the in- tention of letting it go out of their hands. For that reason, do they make a great ■how of poverty. After having paid the interest on some preferential stock, let the income increase, thf re is always some desirable amelioration which is made ne- cessary, the poor phareholders and especially the Government is forgotten, to which latter it is essential to prove that they have a bad debt in hand, and the Government does not re- ceive anything. * Such are the details which are to be found in the Parliamentary debates them- selves, raised ol that question of the Northern Railway, during the last Federal gesaion. It is now two sessions during which, without being in the least embar'^ rassed by the changes, of governments,, changing its advocates in the kiouse, according to necessity, the Northern Rail- way always reverts to that question of be- ing relieved of its debt by making a com- pounding of 25 cents in the dolinr. Dur- ing the past session, it was the Hon. Mr.. Mackenzie himself who undertook to op- pose this measure and to prove that the Northern Railway could perfectly well meet its obligations. We of the Province of Que- bec, we united with him. I was at that time a member of the Federal Legislature. I can here call in testimony the indefati- gable representative of Terrebone in the Commons, Mr. Masson. I say indefati- gable, for really he was so on that ques- tion, and the country will be grateful to him for it. Fow we rejoiced, Mr I'-peaker, wen we found that our efforts joined to those" of the Hon. Mr; Mackenzie, who wos then leader of the Opposition, were preventing the e.Kecution ot a crying in- justice to our Province and to the whole Dominion. Why should one really aban- don a debt as bad, when capital and in- terent can be made to flow back again in- to the coffers of the Treasury. But "ar- rangements can be made with the Heavens;" I was also about to say with the Urn. Mr. Mackenzie. I see by the records of the Federal House of last session, at the sitting of May 22nd : — "Hon Mr. Mackenzie (he had then moved from the beriohes of the Opposition to the Treasury beuchet) proposes in Commit- tee the following resolution, which had received the prior sanction of the Gk)ver* nor-General : That it is expedient to pro- vide that the Govern mont should abandon ks lien on the Northern Railway of Toron- to." The Government receivmg in re- turn $500 000 and retainmg the second issue of debentures for an amount of $200,- 000, and debentures of the third iesue for an amount of $ '200,000. I have already said that the d< Ut of the Northern Rail* way amounted to $2,000,000. Thus is, therefore, the question once more brought before the country by the new Adminis- tration. At the last session, the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie did all he could to obtain for the Northern this advantageous com- position aforementioned. THE NORTHERN OF TORONTO IN A GOOD 00N» DITION. The debt of the Northern is «n excellent creau' e for the Dominion, and which can bo collected, both capital and interAt, the greater part of it at least. To prove what I advance I will quote the words of the best friend of the present Administra- tion, as recorded in the columns of the Globe: the least embar'^ of governments,, in the tiouse, le Northern Rail- t question of be-^ y making a com- he doll«r. Dur- as the Hon. Mr. indertook to op- > prove that the jrfectly well meet Province of Que- [. I was at that erai Legislature, ly the indefati- lerrebone in the I say indefati- io on that ques- 11 be grateful to 3ed, Mri'^peaker, efforts joined to Mackenzie, who )ppo8ition, were 1 ot a crying in- nd to the whole one really aban- capital and in- IV back again in- isury. But "ar- lade with the •out to say with I. I see by the House of last ly 22nd:— "Hon len moved from )Osition to the ses in Commit- ion, which had n of the Gover- :pedient to pro- should abandon ailwayof Toron- eceivmg in re- ng the second mount of $200,- third issue for have already Northern Bail- OOO. Thus is, e more brought new Adminifi* sion, the Bob. ould to obtain kntageous com- IN A GOOD OON- I is «n excellent and which can and inter^t, sast. To prove te the words of nt Administra- Qlumna of the At the time of the discussion of the measure proposed by the Hon. Mr. Mac- kenzie, Hon. Judge Wood, now Chief Justice of Manitoba, spoke strongly against the plea of poyerty set forth by the persons interested in the Northern. During the sitting of the 22Dd of May he said : " Does the Government really know all about the value and the assets of the Northern ? By the resolutions moved by the Government the Company would re- ceive a considerable sum to which it has no right. The Northern Railway is quite as able to meet its obligations as the Great Western. The Northern does not reed any special legislation." 'Ihe resolutions of Hon. Mr. Mackenzie were nevertheless adopted. That is what I read in the Globe. If I take the MaiVs version of the same debate, here are some other assertions attributed to the lion. JM r. Wood : "If he was to believe the assertions of persons in connection with the Company, it wasj in a position to pay the iutere st on all the bonds it had issued. The Company 13 not in a worse condition to day than it was lat year. If the hon. Premier insists on passing his measure, he thinks it his duty to op pose him in a most determined manner." Hon. Mr. Mackenzie states that he will insist upon the measure becoming law. The Hon. Mr. Wood continues: "The Company's affairs are not in a bad state ; it is the best road in Canada, and yet they persist in loudly complaining of their misery. Assuredly a Company whose re- ceipts amount to one million dollars in a year cannot be in a precarious position. No interest has been paid because no one has insistt d upon its being paid, and be- cause there has expended on the road all the money which might hare been re- funded to the Government." Mr. Currier declares that the Company is doing an excellent business, <&c., &c. Besides, eveiy one knows in Toronto that the Northern is in an excellent con- dition. ' Only ther» is in it, provided poverty be pleaded to all turns, an excellent affair fof the financiers who in the name of the bondliolders have in hand to-day the direction of the road. To attain this end, a group of political influ- encf s has been formed, which are set in motion according to circumstances, ac- cording to the good or bad fortune of political parties. And these men who, only a few months ago, praised to the skies the administration of Sir John, are now on their knees to that of Mr. Mack enzie. It seems to me that the hon. gen- tleman is not tiltogether indifferent to their homages, since he, once their for- midable adversary, has consented to take- their caui^e in hand. From the opinions expressed above, we may conclude that if the Govarnment will look into the matter closely and in- sist upon what is due to it, the debt of the Northern will take rank aniong the productive assets of the Dominion. Com- poundiiig so good a debt is therefore a • loss for us. Besides, fret-ing the northern of a debt which it is able to li ^uidate, if I am to believe what the Uon. Mr. Mackenzie said two years ago, is equivalent to a grant made to it by the Dorainion for a like amount. Freed from this debt, if the Northern wishes to push its line further north, towards the ter- minus of the Pacific, it will be able to do so. And that is precisely the idea. That is what is desired and projected. If the Northern comes thus unjustly and indi- rectly and plunges .ts hand into the pub- lic treasury : if it begs that one does not compel it, in just reimbursement, to dis- gorge its surplus and pay when it is able, it is to put in its power the means of pushing its line towards Lake Nipissing, and to arrive there the first, and I prove it. The Northern does not need repair- ing its way while it is in good condition. At the time that the Hon. Mr. Macken- zie, from his seat in the House, and as leader of the Opposition, brought alji pos- sible opposition to the measure proposed to rid the Northern Railway of its debt, Sir John A, Macdonald, compelled to with- draw the Bill, stood up, and I heard him pronounce the following words : ** In withdrawing this measure, I let weigh on the shoulders of the leader of the ( 'pposi- tion all the responsibility of the fact that the Northern of Toronto shall not be put in a position to be the first to arrive at the terminus of the Pacifie." MOTIVE OP THE PREMIER'S POLlOT. Fere is the true motive confessed. The Northern, which has a line in perfect order, wishes ict extend it at once, ai d be the first to put itself in com- munication with the Pacific. And the whole of the Dominion is asked to contri- bute, is invited to Qontribute, to this en- terprise of importance for Toronto I The Hon. Premier approves this idea, and at the next session we may be certain, let our representatives in the Commons ex- pect it, the question will again be brought on the tapip, and great efforts will be made to ensure its success. Let only as much be granted to the lines which run towards the Province of Quebec as one is disposed to grant to the Northern by free- ing it of its debt, and we can, if it is particularly wished, let Toronto succeed in its little stratagem. ! * ;:. Iff 10 lit I HON. MB. WOLTON'a OOXDUOT. I cannot let this opportunity pass with- out appreciating h«>re, as it de-ervea to be, the service rendered to the Province by the Hon. M. Holton at the time that 'question of the Northern was dis-cussed. Consequent with himself, and adhering to the same line of conduct which, in com- Eany with the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie, he ad held in the preceding session, Hon. Mr. Uolton "< pposed the passing of the measure which was to rid tho ^orthern of its debt. Observing the consideration which is due to one another by members of the same political party, the hou. mem- ber for Chateauguay did not wish to ostensibly and publicly oppose his poli- tical chief, but he did not any the less raise sf rious obstacles in his way, which obstacles he could easily find with bis well recognized experience of parliamentary constitution. Won. Mr. Helton attacked the form and succeeded, that is all he de&ired to do. At the next session, whether he attacks the form or the bails of the measTire, he may do as he sees fit; provided he is as successful, the Province of Quebec will be grateful to him if this unjust law 19 not imposed upon it. THE premier's STRATAGEM. Bul it will be said to me : In his answer to the deputation, the Hon. Mr. Mac- kenzie states expressly that he will not free the Northern of a single cent of its debt; yes, but we will continue the sen- tence wherein is found all that h required to allow of his renewing on that question his policy at the last session. " fc^ubject to the legislation that has taken pUce," adds the H n. Premier as a proviso and the door is wide open by the nrudent words fl^ich offer him the means of getting out of the difficulty. I'he Hon. Mr. Mackenzie \ retends that according to the existing law?, the holders of bonds who have in hands the administra- tion of the road, will always have- preference over the Govern- ment; that these preferential bonds absorb the revenues of the enter- prise, and that consequently, according to the existing laws, the Government will never receive a cent. By compounding for 25 cents in the dollar, the Dominion is therefore making a good bargain, and the Northern also apparently, will we add, since from that time it will find itself with means to strike the terminus of the Pacific. But the Hon' Mr. Mackenzie, could he not observe more -'osely this ad- ministration of the Northern, and as be- ing an important crea>^r, see what are its revenues, what are its evj'-^nses, where the surplus goes to, why this not put a»ide, as reserve, to pav the inierest on the sums due the Government ? Why does not one try first to adminieter the road by a man able and devoted to the Do- minion—a stranger to the Company, if necessary, or rather to the holders of bonds? If that does not woik, if one finds that by this method nothing can be laid aside, it will still be time to think of the desastrous composition proposed. The Northern Kailway of Toronto is thus de facto another line subsidized by the Dominion to unite tbe Pacifo with >he roads already existing or projected. Thus are the three roads shown. Of these three lines we ask thao one should be constructed in the Province of Quebec, and this also because we offer the short- est and the le^s expensive line.. A single one of these reasons is more than sufii- cien^. Such are the expenses, Mr. Fpeaker, that the construction of the Pacific and of its dependencies will cause to be made in the Province of Ontario. It is enough to make the Province of Quebec's mouth water. LOSS INCURRED BY THE DOMINION, I rau^t also take into account the loss incurred Vy the Dominion by the aban- doning of tbe debt of the Northern. That debt amounts to $2,000,000. The Company, when compounding, is • to give $500,000 to the Government, and besides $500,000 in bonds of the second and third issue. There remains one million, if ever there is even a cent of interest paid on these bonds of the second and third issue. Now, for better security, let us take oflF25 per cent, and we will say that the loss of the Dominion will not exceed three quarters of a million. As the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie has never caused any of the lines which he seems to prefer to have been surveyed, I take the map cf Ontario published by Mr. Devine in 1873. AMOUNT SUNK IN ONTARIO. I draw a straight line from the' Riviere des Francais to Renfrew. That is tho line chosen by the hon. Premier. That part of the Pacific constructed east of Georgian Bay must be 35 miles in length. [ therefore measure 85 miles on the straight line which has just been traced. At the point where these 85 miles termin- ate, which ppint becomes consequently tho terminus, I find myself 35 miles south of the South E ist Bay of Lake Nipissing, which was to be the terminus under the pre- vious administration ; I find myself at 44 miles from this point at the west of tne Ottawa, at Mattawan. No doubt but that my honorable friend, the leader of the I per u- this not put lO interest on iDt? Why does itter the road d to the l>o- I Company, if ;he holders of woik, if one nothing can be tue to think of proposed. of Toronto is subsidized by e Pacifc with )r projected, ds shown. Of lat; one should nee of Quebec, fer the short- iine. • A single ore than euffi- , Mr. Ppeaker, B Pacific and of to be made in It is enough 'uebec's mouth DOMINION. :count the loss a by the aban- the Northern. ,000,000. The iing, is 'to give nt, and besides cond and third milNon, if ever erest paid on md third issue. t us take oflF 25 that the loss of exceed three 3 the Hon. Mr. sed any of the prefer to have map of Ontario a 1873. f TAP 10. om the* Riviere . That is the Premier. That ructed east of ailes in length, miles on the it been traced. 5 miles termin- >nsequently the miles south of Nipissinpjwhich ander the pre- id myself at 44 he west of tHo doubt but that leader of the 11 Opposition, wished to fix that point as the terminus of this same Pacific, as is shown by the vote I have just now referred to. More than that, I find that terminus situated more to the south than the Hon. , Mr. Mtckenzie him;-elf wished it, in the motion nrbicb he made tr en as leader of ttie Opposition. Thus we are ever drift- ing moje "and more towards the pouth. What is the influence which predominates may be asked ? Let us make out a state- ment according to Mr. Devine's map : Bonus to the northei n of To- ronto $750,000 S5 miles of road built by the Government fiom Georgian Bay to 35 miles south of Lke Nipissing, at |30,000 per m.le,« ami that is the lowest estimate 2,550,000 From that terminus of the Pa- cific to Renfrew, 116 miles, at $12 000 per mile 1,392,000 From that same terminus to Washago, where terminate, actually I thii k, the lines in operation and coming fiom Toronto, 70 miles, at $12,000 per mile 840,000 • $5,532,000 We thus attain the liamlsome sum of over five millions and a half paid by the Tominion in the adj ining province. And 1 am not taking into accoant the other millions which will have to be spent in case one ehouid not abandon the idea of causing the Pacific Railway to pass north of Lake Superior, nor ©f the ten per cent which we shoult the same as we hal to have recourse to it for our communications with the West. THE OOTEAU LINE. To-day things are much changed. At the time when the engineers of the Grand Trunk are carefully examing the line of the Coteau, are collecting data whereupon is to be based the decision to which is to come the Grand Trunk of guaranteeing the interest on the debentures of that same Coteau line ; when this latter line and the ( an i da Cen- tral receives all the attention of the Pre- sident of the Grand Trunk, Mr. Potter, who with that object in view goes t» Pembroke ; lastly, when the Canada L en- tral is assured without us of its Eastern connections ; this latter Company seems engrossed with the sole idea, of re- lieving all opposition, all noise sur- rounding the question, whilst it quietly secures for it self the $12,000 per mile of Mr. Mackenzie and the connec- tion with the West. Whilst matters are thus progressing, we are quietly reprochod with not keeping up our foi mer pleasant relations and with not thinking sufficiently of the carrying out of our for mree. We do not ibh towards any- iaitbful to the eceiviog anyone, existing then be- lada Central, from he business of the ire never impaired risb, as well as our fo attract on our be Canada CentrHl. >t turn our backs Quebec and to the ad only the wor^t Province does not most manifest im- ie our intentions to OUIt POMCY. eason to justify the ime to-day. if at I of the by-law by > depended entirely to give U3 commu- ;, on the other hand in order to get a jal, was dependent the Coteau on the a hardly gave signs jceived in its hdpe the Montreal mil- 3t present any cer- We had no reason ada Central had, US for its connec- same as we hal to ur communications U LINE. uch changed. At neers of the Grand :aming the line of Dg data whereupon lecision to which rand Trunk of nterest on the ,me Coteau line ; d the Canada Cen> what are we going to do; what have we igot to do in the West ; our gaol, is it not Ho be at Ottawa ? THE PRESENT STATE OF AFFAIRS. Mr. Speaker, it is now the time to say rhat will be our position. Entrusted {"ly the Province with the care, ac- ordmg to the hope it had legitimately onceived, to bring to it the trade of the fWest, representing not only our Company, jbut also the interests toe most dear to the jNorth Shore, vge will then step forward [and ask in the name of our still friendly Irelations, our share of the traffic of the West. What reply will b ^ made to us ? l>id not the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie say to ithe deputation, and with sone show of reason, that if he reached Renfrew with the subsidized line, he did not think him- iself io a position to give us running ari'angementfi over the Cunada Central I from Renfrew to Ottawa? Sh.tU we then be able to treat on an equal footing ? One will say to us : What can you give us Jin exchange, that we have not, of a com- iraunicition with the West ? Without you we can send our products towards the East and the United States ; you have nothing to offer us ; you are merely asking a favor of us, and nowise proposing us an i advantageous exchange. WaSTBRN OOMUtTNIOATION NE0BS8ABT. And yet we cannot do without the Western connection. It will then be too late to look to Pontiac, and perhaps even to the Province of Quebec. The law will be dictated to us, and we shall nave to submit to the conditions which one shall see fit to impose upon us, how- ever hard they may be. I dare not men- tion those which may be reasonably fore- seen. But is it not important that the Province should remain mist' ess of its road 1 ? To this can therefore bring ua those who blime uh to-day with not adhering to our old projects, those who impute to us as a crime of letting our enterprise grow larger, viz , to deprive the North Shore of the Ottawa and the whole of the North Shore of the St. Lawrence of the only traffic which can make the North (■ hore and Northern Colonizition companies, remunerative enterprises, and at the same time the cities of Montreal an I Quebec the entrepots of the trade of the West. Those therefore who say to us: "Con- tent yourselves with wha. formerly satis- fied you ; cross over to Ottawa and die in the Canada Central," do certainly not tike into consideration the imprudent advice which they are thus giving us ; at least, such is my opinion. If they will reason the consequences of their advice, they will not be long ere they perceive that they are pushing us into a fatal course, which, in so far as I am concerned, 1 am not prepared to fol- low. FALIiACIOUS REMARKS. With regard to the communications with the West, I have sometimes heard some of our political men express them- selves in a manner which has alv^ays se- med strange to me. " Why," do they say, " take so much trouble to secure to Montreal the Western traffic, by means of the rond which is claimed to be the shortest and the most suitable, when the trade will in ^.ny case reach that city, so as do the waters of the St. Lawrence? Whatever is done, Montreal will ever re- main the gie'it centre whereto everything must tend. Whether bales of goois reach Montreal by ?vay of the St. Liwrenre or by way of the C)ttawa, they will have to come to Montreal any how. vVe have no rea-'on to fear the roads which, a little higher up, are arranging to intercept the trade to transmit to the United States without its perhaps reaching ua." SUCH PRINCIPLES A DANGER. What a fatal security no strange a prin- ciple may produce ! Because Montreal is prosperous, must she sleep on her con- ! :it Hi m !! ij i) 'i n ; city fearing less ihlidhed with the hind Mon'real, at ice and that the by without giving of its transit, in- Council should be nent giving the >ads in Montreal, ily of the Council lontreal to show in order to effect f>t should not, in a lanner, pass away t >e road of the Lawrence on the istructed at that over over at an 1 estates ? PINION. as valiantly as he Mattawan, which under all ciroum- ler speaks of the cannot sue- f plan adopted. | through any po- ^ ment, the handi f "nnient are tied, | iog or accepting i 1 it becomes the !f o look after and | ome moditication | cumstances, next | interests of the I l>oa»ible extent. J to the Hon. Pre- | o lines incident- | Hazlewood's ac- I th of French Riv- e via Do glass to mate distance of lonth of French J Pembroke, 188 it can be seen will give 29 miles I lets to construct, or at the very least a saving to the Government and Company empowered to build the subsidized section of 1870,000. " At Pembroke, moreover, the Ottawa River is tapped, while on the other line a connection is effected with the Canada Central Railway, some distance trom that river, and 70 miles above Ottawa. " In the event of the .vloutreal Northern Colonizition Railway being extended from Aylmer, along the north side of the Otta- wa, to a suitable point for crossing, say at La Passe, in the neighborhood of Pem- broke, the distance fiom Ottawa (is re- cently surveyed, via La Passe to Pem- broke) will be 87 miles, to which add dis- tance from Pembroke to mouth of French River, as above, 188 miles, and we have a total distance from that place to Ottawa city of some 275 miles. " The distance from mouth of French River via Renfrew, nnd the Canadt Cen- tral, will in like manner be 287 miles, or about 12 miles longer th^n the Pembroke and the M. N. C. R, route. This differ- ence ar ses to a great extent from the detour made by the Canada Central via Carleton Place. "It will thus be seen that even on the Honourable Premier's own ground (short- ness of distance) Pembroke will be the point to aim for, and not henfiew — to say nothing of the extra $=870,000. saved to the Government by the i em broke route. By many it has been urged that the M. N. C. R. should cross at Portage du Fort, and seek i union* with the Govern- ment subsidized line at Renfrew or Ijou- glass. From some personal acquaintance with the rough character of the country between Portage du Fort and ttenfrew, I was fearful that a road through that sec- tion would be very expensive. Mr. Starke, while prosecuting the Upper Ofctiwa fcurveys, was directed to make a special examination of the jilace, and afterwards reported that it would be nearly, if not alogether impracticable, to construct the line from Portage du Port to the localities referred to. Renfrew and Douglass had thus* to be abandoned, and Pembroke selected as the point of junction, fiom whichever direction the Gjvernment line might approach it, either direct from the mouth of French River or tiom Lake M- pissing " THE ALTERNATIVE. As sh^wn by the maps which the Gov- ernment has caused to 1)3 piioied the favoured line would go to Rehfrew. vVc see by the report of Mr.' ' liegge that we could not push our line in this diraclion. Tne nature of the locality lendfis this impossible. Thus, to obtain a communi- CAtion with the Pacific Railway, we are reduced to ask the Federal Government to come to carry out a measure of econ- omy of $348,000 of iU subsidy, by direct- ing its line towards' Pembroke, and stop- ping it at that place. Thus the Govern- ment road is made 29 miles shorter. If the Government care to subsidize 29 miles more road, the liae once brought into Pembroke, we have not the least ob- jection to it that the i?348,000 eoono. tiiized on the Southern sh ire be expended onja line from Pembi oke downwards in qur Province. And why not, since it was de- cided to expend that amount before we had m^ie our request to the Govern- ment '<* I.KTTUR FKOM TUE rREMIPiK. In a letter just received uy us from the Hon. Mr Mackenzie, he informs us that he cannot tell us at what point the sub- sidized line will touch the Ottawa River. Here is his letter : — 'In reply to your communication of the 7th instant, on behalf of the Montreal t- orthern Coloniz ition Itailway Company, asking for inform ition as to the rou'e the subeidized line of railway wuich is to con- nect with the ea tern terminus of the Canadian Pacific Riilway is to follow, so as to ^uide your Company as regards it connections with saidsubsid zed line, Is beg to btate that the Government is not in possession of such further information as could enable them to indicate w.)ere siid line is to touch the Ottawa Kiver." The Hon. Mr. Majkenzie does not say th t J e consents to favor Pembroke, and he knows that it is impossible for us to go to Renfrew. He thus destroys the hopes conceived by several of his friends at the time of his interview with the deputation. Mr. Speaker, I can perfect. ly well understand why some of the gen- tlemen present at that interview with the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie declared themselves satisfied on t^leir return. The Hon. Pre- mier had replied with such assurance to the remarks of iA r Legge concerning th© difference of tbe levels, without, never- theless, giving the figures or results of the shadow of an exploration, tint at the close of the interview we hastened to ask bur Engineer if in the f ice of this simple ipse dixit of iha Hon. Premier, bethought lie was able to maintain his views. TUE rilEMlEK's DECEPTIVE OFFER. I h^ve fubmitted to this House Mr. Legge's reply, 'by transmitting to each of ire D'emlera H copy of the laet report of that engineer. Ofittie oiber hand, the Hon. Mr. Mac- kenzie inforuie'd us that we sho.ld have toe faculty not only of running our cars, \^ 16 { 1^ i but also our loccmoti7M on the whole length of the subsidized line up to the Oeorgian Bay, and that a Board of Arbi tratOfB composed of one representative i " " chosen by the Company whose line would be subsidized, of another appointed by ' *• • the Government, and of a third selected by our Company, might be established to resolve all the difficulties and render jus- tice to all the interested parties. The perspective was a fine one, and there was but one thing mining. It was , , to place this ofTer really within our reach, and this was not doce by the Hon. Pre- mier, as I regret to have to record it here. The hon. gentleman did not do 130. He knew that we could not bring our line on to Renfrew, and he did not say then that he would consent to make choice of Pem- broke. Nor does he say so now. as can be seen by his last letter. What is the good of making*u8 ofiers which are not to be realized ? We will ask those who, as has been done already, will persist in declaring that we have received all that we asked A for, to tell us how we have succeeded, and what we h we obtained ? Has anyone undertaken to explain thi^ matter ? I have already said before that we were most politely received ; it was impossible io tell us in a more polite way that o\x: requests oould not be acceded to. 1 may here say, Mr. Speaker, that we know that the population of Pembroke is well disposed in our favour, and that it proposes liberally to subsidize our line in cose it should go there. ,,. RESUME. To resume. We think the road via the Mattawin the best and most ecenomical, and we respectfully ask that the Govern- ment should cause a serious exploration to be made of its rival ere it fixes its choice. In case the line we prefer should not be dopted, we are compeUeded to. eaker, thai we of Pembroke is jr, and that it dize oiir line in the road via the lost eoonomica], at the Govern- )U8 exploration ere it fixes it3 er should not be h1 to ask that place at Fem- poBsible for us also because a Dttawa, we are md a harsh one ;he Canada Cen- he few remarks ike before this question of our if we fail in our ovince in rapid )e vast regions, ble to accuse us 'e have done all the rest. ■r^4