The Christian-Quaker and his divine testimony vindicated by Scripture, reason, and authorities against the injurious attempts that have been lately made by several adversaries, with manifest design to rendor him odiously inconsistent with Christianity and civil society : in II parts. / The first more general by William Penn ; the second more particular by George Whitehead. Penn, William, 1644-1718. 1674 Approx. 1386 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 310 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images. Text Creation Partnership, Ann Arbor, MI ; Oxford (UK) : 2003-01 (EEBO-TCP Phase 1). A54120 Wing P1266 ESTC R37076 16204746 ocm 16204746 105069 This keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the Early English Books Online Text Creation Partnership. This Phase I text is available for reuse, according to the terms of Creative Commons 0 1.0 Universal . The text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A54120) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 105069) Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1641-1700 ; 2825:1, 1599:1) The Christian-Quaker and his divine testimony vindicated by Scripture, reason, and authorities against the injurious attempts that have been lately made by several adversaries, with manifest design to rendor him odiously inconsistent with Christianity and civil society : in II parts. / The first more general by William Penn ; the second more particular by George Whitehead. Penn, William, 1644-1718. Whitehead, George, 1636?-1723. [34], 163, 176 [i.e. 376], [1] p. s.n.], [London? : 1674. Errata: following p. 162 of first count, and at end. Includes "A discourse of the general rule of faith and life," p. 136-162, with special t.p. and imprint date 1673. 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Keying and markup guidelines are available at the Text Creation Partnership web site . eng Society of Friends -- Apologetic works -- 17th century. Society of Friends -- Doctrines -- Early works to 1800. 2002-03 TCP Assigned for keying and markup 2002-04 Apex CoVantage Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2002-05 TCP Staff (Oxford) Sampled and proofread 2002-05 Judith Siefring Text and markup reviewed and edited 2002-06 pfs Batch review (QC) and XML conversion THE Christian-Quaker , AND HIS DIVINE TESTIMONY VINDICATED BY Scripture , Reason and Authorities ; AGAINST The Injurious Attempts , that have been lately made by several Adversaries , with Manifest Design to render HIM Odiously Inconsistent with CHRISTIANITY and Civil Society . In II. Parts . The FIRST more General , by William Penn. The SECOND more Particular , by George Whitehead . Veritas fatigari potest , vinci non potest , Ether . & Beat. lib. 1. Thus saith thy Lord the LORD , and thy God that pleadeth the Cause of his People ; Behold I have taken out of thy Hand the Cup of Trembling , even the Dregs of the Cup of my Fury , thou shalt no more drink it again : But I will put it into the Hand of them that Afflict thee , Isaiah 51. 22 , 23. Printed in the Year 1674. TO THE Noble Bereans Of THIS AGE . WHen our dear Lord Jesus Christ , the Blessed Author of the Christian-Religion , first sent forth his Disciples , to proclaim the Happy Approach of the Heavenly Kingdom , among several other Things that he gave them in Charge , it pleas'd him to make this One of their Instructions ; Into whatsoever City or Town ye shall enter , enquire who in it is Worthy ; fore-seeing the ill Use Unworthy Persons would make of that Message , and with what Unweariedness the implacable Pharisee and subtil Scribe would endeavour to Pervert the Right Way of the Lord , and thereby prejudice the Simple against the Reception of that Excellent Testimony . This being our Case , who above every Tribe of Men are most Maliciously Represented , Bitterly Envied , and Furiously Oppugn'd by many of the Scribes and Pharisees of our Time , for as Impious Wretches as Those of that , reputed our Blessed Saviour and his Constant Followers , it becometh us in a Condition so desperate , to provide our selves with some Worthy Readers , Men that dare trust their Reason above Reports , and be Impartial in an Age as byass'd as this we live in ; whose Determinations shall not wait upon the Sentence of Ignorance nor Interest , but a Sincere and Punctual Examen of the Matter . And since there are None recorded in Sacred Writ , on whom the Holy Ghost conferr'd so Honourable a Character , as the Bereans of that Age ( for that they both searched after Truth impartially , and when they found it , imbraced it readily ) for which they were entituled Noble ) Therefore it is that to you , the Progeny of that Worthy Stock , and Noble Bereans of our Age , We , the so much Calumniated Abettors of the Cause of Truth , choose to dedicate this Defence of our Holy Profession from the Injurious Practices of a fort of Men , who not unlike to the Jews of Thessalonica , that , Envying the Prosperity of the Gospel among your Ancestors , made it their Business to stir up the Multitude against the Zealous Promoters of it . And no Matter what it be , provided they can but Obtain their End of fixing an Odium upon the Quakers : They do not only boldly condemn what they esteem Worst in us ( how deservedly we will not now say ) but slyly insinuate what is Best , to be Criminal . The Sobriety of our Lives , they call a Cheat for Custom ; and our Incessant Preachings and Holy Living , a Decoy to Advance our Party : if we say Nothing to them when they interrogate us , 't is Sullenness or Inability ; if we say Something to them , it is Impertinency or Equivocation : We must not believe as we do believe , but as they would have us believe , which they are sure to make obnoxious enough , that they may the more securely bait us for it ; Nor must our Writings mean what we say we mean by them , but what they will have them to mean , lest they should want Proofs for their Charges : It was our very Case that put David upon that sad Complaint , Every day they Wrest my Words , all their Thoughts are against me for Evil ; But to David's God we commit our Slander'd Cause , and to you the Bereans of our Age. Degenerate not from the Example of your Progenitors ; if you do , you are no longer True Bereans , and to such only we inscribe this Work ; if you do not , we may assure our selves of the Justice of a Fair Enqui●…y and an Equal Judgment . The God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ augment your Desire after Truth , give you clearer Discerning of the Truth , and enable you both more readily to receive , and with greater Resolution to maintain the Truth . We are Rickmersworth , the 16th of the 10th Month , 1674. Your greatly Traduc'd , but truly Christian Friends , William Penn , George Whitehead . THE PREFACE . THe Insatiable Thirst of Men after Religious or Civil Empire , has filled almost every Age with Contest : But for Pure Religion scarcely has any one contended . To mention the Disorders within the first Six hundred Years from Christ ( who have been by far worse succeeded ) were to write the Ecclesiastical History ; But such as are not ignorant in it , must needs know , that Religion so early , became a Cloak for Dominion , and Truth a Pretence for Revenge . What better has happen'd since , Modern Stories tell us . Certainly the Separation of most Parties from former Institutions , however rightly begun , have basely degenerated into Self-Promotion , and when there , to the Exercise of that Power over Consciences , which , when it was their own Case ●…o suffer from others , they esteem'd most Cruel . I well know , that there is something in Man , that prompts to Religion , and such as stands not in the Traditions of Men , nor any meer Formality : But Man , that he may not wholy lose the Honour of a share , or be reputed sloathful ; with an unwarrantable Activity so adulterates , and by an Intermixture of his own Conceptions with those Divine Dictates , and purer Discoveries , so sophisticates , that they last become more his own Workmanship then the Truth 's . And so fond is he of this Child of his Brain , that like some ancient Tyrants , he will rather cut his way to the Throne by a Violence upon all other Consciences , then not put an Earthly Crown upon its Head. They that know not the Truth of this , have scarcely look'd back to their Great-Grand-Father's time . Two Centuries have not past as yet , since Bold and Honorable Attempts were made against that Apostate Church of Rome , which prov'd so Successful , as to win many Kingdoms from her Tyranny : God certainly blest the Endeavours of those Consciencious Persons , who spent their Estate , Time and Blood in that truly Holy , but Passive War. But this hath been the Misery , that they being intercepted by Death , their Successors , who acted not in the same Simplicity , and upon like Convictions as they did , began to think it no small Testimony of their regard to their martyr'd Ancestors , to invest what they call'd their Religion with Worldly Majesty , and then make use of the temporal Sword to establish it , with their own Additio●…s , as the most true , certain and infallible Way ; Employing that Force , those Mulcts and cruel Penalties to extort Conformity , or else perish who dissented : which rendred Rome's Actions so detestable to the very Martyrs , and indeed without which they had not been Martyrs . The Work was now to promote Religion by Power , who had so lately overcome It by Suffering . Leagues , stately Embassyes , great Conventions , raising of Armies , War with one , and Peace with another took up the Minds of most , how to defend the Stateliness and Pompous Grandure of their Religion , though they by so doing , gave Testimony , they had lost much of the true Sence of that very Religion they pretended to advance . 'T was now that some appear'd dissatisfied with such Proceedings , decry'd that Superstition and Formality which had been unadvisedly detain'd by the English Church as Decent ; for the Invention of that Church , the Protestants themselves stil'd Antichristian . They believed mens Lives were much corrupted , and laid the fault upon the Pride , Avarice , Voluptuousness and Ignorance of the Clergy ; they stript themselves of most Superfluities , and seem'd to promote a streighter Way , then what was then generally professed ; these they called Puritans . But such sowr Resentments had both the Powers and Prelates of their Procedure , that Laws were enacted , and executed to Blood , as well to hinder Religion from being more refined , as they had for preserving it from being again more gross . Surely , this look'd more like Care for Power , Faction and Interest , then Religi●… . For without doubt , the Plea of those Puritans was thus far unanswerable by their Adversaries . By this time almost all People were taken with their Complaints , especially those , who seem'd more Religiously inclin'd , which at last had so leavened the Gentry , as well as the Commonalty , that when that memorable Parliament was chosen , and for their Sitting , call'd afterwards , The Long-Parliament , the Sream clearly run on the Puritanical-side . The Church of England disdaining their pretended Reformation , and as resolved to abate in nothing of Her Splendor , Wealth and Preserment , in e●…ther Civil or Ecclesiastical Matters , makes Head against th●…se supposed Disturbers of the Peace of both Church and State : And as the blind Wrath of Heathens taught the Papists , and the Papists the Protestants ; so the Protestants by their Coercive Power for Religion , taught the Puritans to be resolute and fierce in the Defence of their Separation . The Complaints of the one , meeting with strong Denials from the other , they came to Big Words , and from thence to Heavy Blows . Such Feud , such Hatred , such War , Spoil and lamentable Slaughter , as for many Ages had not been known , were the most deplorable Effects of that Contest for Religion . By this time Victory turning to the Puritanical Party , now degenerated into harsh Presbytery ; they who before did fasten Anti-Christianism upon the Church of England , for offering to act Coercively towards them , in what concern'd Consciencious Separation , become themselves the most Narrow in Religion , and Vigorous in imposing upon the sharpest Penalties ( known to those times ) what they Synodically agreed to be Scripture-Faith , Worship and Discipline ; forgetting or denying to leave that Liberty of Examination to others , they had so earnestly contended for against the Prelates of the English Church . So partial is Self , so blind is Interest . But neither doth our Story end here ; for these Men forgetting their Primitive Tenderness , and that lowly Spirit , which justly charged the English Clergy with some Degeneracy , as had that done the Romish , were quickly Reminded by the timely and honest Zeal of those they call Independants and Anabaptists : who having a clearer Sight of things , as I believe , and more Regard for Reformation , at once charg'd them with neglect , and endeavour'd to push things a Step further . They lowdly exclaim'd against the Loosness of their Parishes , and their too free Administration of the Sacraments to mixt and unqualified Persons ; They decry'd the Absoluteness of their Church-Monarchy , with the Necessity of Humane Learning to Ministerial Qualification : And lastly , with great Earnestness they disclaim'd against the Imposition of any Faith or Worship , or punishing with Corporal Penalties , such as dissented for the sake of Conscience . One would have thought , these Men had set the last bounds to the Spirit of Superstition and Revenge , and that having seen the Rock on which their Predecessors split , they should have learnt Safety by their Destruction , and Construed those foregoing Calamities Land-marks for their preservation , as was anciently said — — aliena pericula cautum . that is , having beheld so many fair Adventures for Reformation ( begun certainly from an inward sense of the corrupt , and Un-Christ-like State of things ) to issue in Fulness , Pride , Superstition , and base Coertion upon Conscience , they should have liv'd in an holy Subjection , and awful Regard to that holy Spirit of Truth , that had given them some farther Illumination , which would have taught the Denial of those Worldly Lusts , that Covetousness and Revenge whetted their desires after , and have preserved them in the Way of Meekness , Patience , Long-suffering and Holiness , without which none shall ever see God. But alas ! as Reformation from Popery and Prelacy was soon over-run by Party-Asperity , and Self-Promotion ; so truly these Men made as little Conscience to employ the old Weapon of external Force to advance themselves , and depress others , as had those that went before them . 'T is true , the Presbyterian , who shewed them the Way , as had the Protestant him , and the Papist the Protestant , being so considerable in Number , and these Peoples Maxime so narrow ( viz. ) Out of a Church , out of the Faith ; Not Dipt , not Christian'd : That too great Division might not perish the whole Affair , of continuing the Government in its present Channel of incredible Advantage unto them , they much against their Will , admitted the Presbyterian into a share with them , especially of Parochial Churches , as they are called , and did not wholy exclude the more Moderate of them , a part in the Administration of the Civil Government . Thus then ( though with regret , and no small Jealousie ) being tollerably well agreed , like as he that from a poor Priest to a Pope , was wont to be remembred of his Original , by a Net ( because several of the Apostles were Fishermen ) which he commanded to be brought to his Table , when Pope , cried , Take it away , Take it away , the Fish is caught ; So they having caught the Great Two-Headed Fish of Civil and Ecclesiastical Power , and upon one a Crown , upon the other a Miter , Laodicea-like , Full , Rich , and wanting nothing , and willing to forget their small Original ; their Fathers House , those Heavenly Convictions , and their humble frame of Spirit , their early Sense in some good measure had reduct them to ; O! Into what Falsness , Cruelty , Covetousness , and Folly did they not precipitate themselves ! To violate Faith with Men , and break the most Solemn Covenants that any Age have ever made with GOD himself , to sayl to Security through Blood , and establish their Church in Persecution ; not un-like the Ottoman Emperors , that never think their Imperial Crowns better settled , then in the Murther of their Brethren . But above the rest , to decry Tyranny and Persecution , and yet to be the Authors of both ●…s if they could not have used their Power without abusing it , is unworthy the Name of true Men. I will believe succeeding times may have out-done them in Debauchery ; but I can never think ( unless better inform'd ) that any Age hath so much as equal'd them in a Treacherous Hypocrisie : though ( that I may be just ) several among them were not wanting to express their utter Abhorrence of such Procedure , which hath thus far aggravated the others Apostasie , that they were worse treated then such that were reputed their Publick Enemies ; as if not to be Treacherous , had been to be Dis-affected : concerning which I refer the Reader to the first and second Narratives , printed in the Year 1659. Certainly , it was now time , that God should arise , and that his Enemies should be manifest ; who , under the Splendidst Shew of Reformation , that almost any Age for 1400. Years could parallel , had Crucified the Holy Life of Religion , stifling the Spirituality thereof by reform'd Formality , empty Shews , and meer tinckling Cymbals of Sin-pleasing Doctrines : And their Primitive Tenderness being worn off by Time and Preferment , none grew more Superstitious and Persecuting then those who once seem'd most averse from it ( I charitably forbear the mention of particular Persons ) In short , Pride , Self-Seeking , and Self-Establishment , in Glory , Wealth , and Worldly Prosperity having undermin'd the Worthy Honesty , that was at first stirring in the Hearts of some of them : Behold a Glorious , but Empty Trunk of Profession ! as lofty as the Jews themselves , pretending to be Children of Abraham , and Heirs of the Promise , yet Servants to Sin ; Christians by Imputation , but not by Qualification ; saved in Christ , though lost , through Sin , in Themselves ; pray by the Spirit , yet their Duties unholy Things . Behold Babylon in one of her best Trims ! But it was at this time , serious Reader , when Religion was so much talk'd of , and so little practis'd , that it pleased the Eternal Wise God , who is unsearchable in his Goings , to appear , and manifest the Knowledge of Himself , by a Way contemptible to the World ( as indeed , when did he otherwise ) shewing himself first to Shepherds , and Men of mean Rank , whose , outward Abilities were as incapable to gain Applause from Men , as their Meanness to invite them : Men , Plain and Simple , who desired of long time above Worldly Treasure , they might be acquainted with the true & unchangable Way of God. All the Religion they were taught of Men , or the strength of Memory could collect from Books , joyn'd with their own Simplicity and Zeal , was not able to overcome the Enemies of their Souls , for whose Redemption God appear'd , and they often groan'd in secret ; being truly willing to undergo any cross , that might but help them to this Knowledge , after which they had daily thirsted more then for appointed Food . Thus , that no Flesh might glory in his Presence , did the Almighty God , according to his many Precious Promises , break in upon the Spirits of a poor despised People , by his terrible Power , which caused the old Foundations to shake , and begat holy Terror and Dread , because of the Glory of his Majesty , who had reveal'd Himself . Judgment overtook for Sin , and Righteousness was laid to the Plummet , and a true Scale was erected , wherein all the Profession in the World was lighter then the Chaff , which is blown away of the Tempest . This Day of Judgment for Sin , and Consumption upon all the pleasant Pictures of Religion , that Tradition , Education , or Imagination had drawn in the Minds of Men , they were constrain'd to Declare , and the very Utterings thereof were astonishing , both to Professors and Prophane ; For being Witnesses of a nearer thing , then an Out-side Religion , however refin'd , in which the whole World was adulterated from God , and that the Time of the Kindling of the Indignation of the Lord God Almighty was come , because of Iniquity and Unrighteousness that cover'd the Earth , as the Waters cover the Sea ( which made the Controversie Essential ; Not to consist about exterior Order , Church-Government , or meer Articles of Faith ; But that Inward Principle of Righteousness , which reduceth the Soul to the Heavenly Order , and that Faith which overcomes the World. ) Therefore in the Name of the Lord , and by the alone Arm of the Almighty , did several of these poor Men go forth into Towns , Citties , and Countries , proclaiming the Day of the Controversie of God with Men , by the pleadings of his Holy Light , Power , or Spirit in their Hearts and Consciences , decrying all Notions of Christ above Possession ; calling the lofty Cedars to bow , and the sturdy Oakes to bend before the Heavenly Appearance of the Lord , by his Light within : that all Knowledge of God , not gotten through inward Judgment , and Experience of the Operation of his saving Hand , was accurst of God : And that as the Earth of Wickedness in Mens Hearts should be consum'd by the Refiners Fire , so the Heavens of lofty Knowledge should by the fiery heat thereof , be wrapt up as a scrole , that a new Heaven and a new Earth , in which dwelleth ( not IMPU●…ATIVE , but ) Real , Inherent , & Everlasting Righ●…ousness , might be known to be created by the Word of God , nigh in the Heart . I say , these Men alarming the Nation with the Sound of this harsh and terrible Trumpet , who had taken so long a Nap in Pleasure , Ease , and Fleshly Religion , caused very strange , and differing Apprehensions . Some prickt to the very Heart , cryed out , What shall we do to he saved ? whilst the Wolf and the Fox lay in wait to intercept the blessed Work of the Lord , by several wayes of Cunning and Cruelty . The Priests ( who were degenerated as well as the People , basely Teaching for Hire , and Divining for Money : The best accounted of them making Bargains , how much a Year to preach the Gospel , as they call it , and so is it to this Day ) like Foxes seeing their Kennel found out , into which they had so long hid their Prey , and fearing that the Turning Men to the Light in the Conscience , and their so resolutely Testifying , That no Man could be at Peace with God who went condemn'd thereof ; and that all Knowledge of the things of God , which hath not been received through the holy Subjection of the Creature to God's Heavenly Appearance Within him ( for whatever may be known of God , is manifested within , saith the Apostle ) was above the true Teacher and the Sufferings of the Cross of Christ : They posted to the Magistrates , Saul-like , with whole Packets of Lyes , Slanders and Invectives , on purpose to beget a Wolf fish Nature in them , to put a stop to the Progress of this blessed Manifestation of the Eternal Light of Righteousness ; but the Exercise of a Merciless Power . Some few would not be prevailed upon ; but the Generality , seeing their Worldly Honour , and which to some of them was dearer , their beloved Easie Religion was struck at , Root and Branch , they , as an Arm'd Man , furiously employ'd their Strength to the Relief of the Priests , and Subversion of these poor Men : Some were Imprison'd , others Whipt , several Bruised , not a few Murther'd , and many Robb'd and Spoil'd of their Goods . And that the Priests might shew themselves ; some of them thinking it to long to wait the Magistrates Leisure , turn'd their own Pay-Masters upon Heads , Shoulders , and other Limbs of Men , and Women , not distinguishing in either Sex , or Age. The Cry of these Innocent People came up to the then Supream Authority , but Relief could not be had . One Book came out upon another , conjuring the Magistrates to employ their Power , to the utter Extirpation of these Seducers , & commanded the People that they should not so much as have any common Intercourse with them , but avoid them as the Pest , and fly them as Witches & Sorcerers : It were to irksom to tell the moity of their Stratagems . O the Mercys of these Men were Cruelties ! But yet farther , many things were writ by us in Vindication o●… our Innocency . Some that sought for the Redemption of Israel , and the Right Way of God , believ'd ; here & there a Simeon , a Centurion , a Priest , a Lawyer , a Physitian , a Customer , & Fisherman , and abundance of Handecrafts , for the Poor receiv'd the Gospel . But Alas ! Neither our Apologies , nor grievous Sufferings , were enough to allay that swelling spirit of Cruelty ; nor in the least affect the minds of Priests or Rulers with the Deploredness of our Condition , so as to redress all these grievious Sufferings : perhaps , somtimes a little shew of Favour there might be , but usually attended with a more terrible Storm . They at last ( I mean the Magistrates ) by the detestable Suggestions of the Priests , not having any Law in force , by which they could just●…fie the Rigor of their Carriage towards us , enacted first , that no Man should Travel on the Sabboth-Day , thereby to punish us as Criminals , for going to our Assemblies to Worship the living God ; and next , that such Persons as should be found above so many Miles from their own Homes , not being able to give a good account of themselves , should be whipt as Vagabonds ; by which Laws , they miserably opprest our Friends , many Men of considerable Estates , being worse us'd then very Vagabonds . Thus covering the one over with Devotion , for the Day of rest , and the other , with prudent care , for the Good of the Common-Wealth . Nor was this all ; but as if they would out-do the Ages of cruel Popery and degenerated Prelacy , they received both the Oath of Queen Mary , made against such Protestants as came to decry the Idolatrys and Superstitions of the Romish Worship in the time of their Service , thereby to justifie themselves in the Exercise of Cruelty and Revenge upon us , for bea●…ing our faithful Testimony against their Formal and Hypocritical Preachments ; and that Oa●…h of Abrogat●…on of Popery , that by the Advantage they took of our not Swearing at all , they might the better fasten upon us the Character of Papists , as Men Jesuited to that Interest , with plain Design to render us odious , and cover their own Cruelty ; Well may I say OUT-DONE , when pretended reformed Protestants , endeavour the Security of their Religion by the enaction of those Laws , which were made by Inhuman Papists , against such as in good measure we can say , were truly reformed Protestants ; thereby condemning that in the Papists , which they vigorously acted themselves : and basely sought to entrap us by a colourable Oath , wickedly forecast , because they knew we could not Swear at all , to punish us for not swearing against the Papists . This was their Cloak they had to cover their Malice , but it is grown to short , scanty , and out of date . The Bruises , Blood-shed , grievous Beatings and tedious Imprisonments which followed this procedure , are now seen with detestation of almost the very multitude it self , and after Generations shall have it in utter abhorrance . O what did not the Blood-thirsty Spirit in its Day ? These were the great pretending Presbyterians , Independents and Anabaptists , Fighting , Knocking , Kicking , Robbing , Imprisoning and Murthering an Innocen●… People , whose whole Business was to Deny the daw●…g Doctrines of the Times , and to Direct People to a certain Holy Principle in themselves , unto which being Obedient , they should experience Sin conquer'd , and Peace with God ; preferring this above all the Traditions of Men , or utmost Power of Human Ministry . But , as many of us saw in the Eternal Light , that such Obstinacy in both Priests and Rulers , to the Heavenly Truth , would provoke the Just God , to overturn them forever ( which though we did once and again tell them by Writings , and by Word of Mouth , they slighted our plain-Dealing , turning it upon us , that we should vanish in a little while ) So within very few Years God wrought the wonderfull Revolution ; and those who had been Inflicters of Heavy Punishments upon us , became the Objects of their greatest Dis-pleasure , whose Power and Estates they had so long usurp'd : I can call it no otherwise , for not the Country , but Self was wickedly advanc'd thereby . Behold the Justice of the Almighty , such as refused us our Liberty , after their Solemn Oathes to God and Men , for the Preservation of Liberties , Civil and Religious , became destitute of their Own ; and who spoil'd us , were spoil'd by Others , and we just now under their Fee●… , came upon Equal Terms with Our Adversaries : At what time , though both They and We , used our Endeavours to prevent Coertion upon Conscience , yet whether they prevailed or no , some were in Hopes , that the Edge of their Spirits , by this Change of Affairs , had been so doubl'd , as never more to cut , or wound a People that had never wrong'd them ; and that their Retirement would have been rather employ'd in hearty Sorrow , for their Abuse of Government , in their Unjust Severity , towards us as well as others , then a Continuance of the same Enmity . But thus far such fail'd in hopes , their Displeasure against us surviving their Power to inflict it ; for though it is true , that in time of Persecution , they would inquire out of their By-Holes , of our Well-fare ( for who had so long reigned shew'd they were most unfit for Suffering ) and like People upon City-Walls or from other conven●…ent standings , would diligently observe the State of things , and by their Observation , or Inquiry , carefully acquaint themselves with the Success ( for our Overthrow had been the End of them ) and as one of themselves said , We were the Bulworks that receiv'd the Shot ) Yet , so unabated hath their implacable Malice been ; at the King 's first coming in they thought to do great Matters by letting the Powers know they were no Abettors of the Quakers ; which indeed stood us in great stead , least we might have been taken for those Tumultuous , Blood-thirsty , Covenant-breaking , Government-destroying Anabaptists : and that they might prove to the World , we were not of them . No sooner those Storms of Persecution have been over , but like forgetful Mariners , they have faln to their Old Work of bitter Envying : Either some one of their Church leaves them ; or the Quakers are prosperous in their Labours ; or any thing else that is next for a Cover , to palliate their Emulous Spirit in all its base Detractions from us , and the blessed Truth . Which truly when I have beheld it , Grief has overwhelm'd my Soul , and a Pitty for their sakes has risen in my Heart , that all those Tryals , which rightly understood and improv'd , would have turned to great Advantage , should be as water spil'd on the Ground . Many Instances we have had , of this , since their Descending the Throne of Power ; Particularly in the Years 1668 , 1669. which time ; there being some respit , from any violent Persecution of men , upon the account of Conscience . What preaching was almost in every Meeting against the Dangerous Errors of the Quakers , as they pleas'd to traduce them , and how were they slander'd upon Several Stationers Stalls ? we could scarcely walk the Street , but our Ears must be disturb'd , with the Cryes of the Antidote against Quakerisme ; the Synopsis of Quakerisme ; the Damnable Heresie of the Quakers , with the like virulent Expressions , bestow'd upon us in their Title-Pages , to be-speak their Sale more easie , with Persons Inquisitive or prejudic'd . Nay , whilst they commended the King's Indulgence to their own Parties , and publickly render'd him their Acknowledgment of his Clemency , they sedulous endeavour'd my Imprisonment , in particular , and did not stick , both to character me the most wretched and enormious of Men , for a Book , they ( I may in a manner say ) extorted from me , and at that time too , when both my Body was straightly imprison'd , and my Life greatly indanger'd ; and as the Completement of their Wickedness , they maintain'd the Justness of my Confinement . But to pass over this , and observe the Consequence of succeeding Troubles ; The former Acts receiving New Life , from one more sharp and Cruel , what could we hope , but that this Act executed , were enough to make these Professors forever out of Love with Persecution , who are yet too warm Abettors of it . For , though their Vain Boasts of Standing , quickly vanisht at the Rattling of a few Musquets , and that God , by his Almighty , Invisible Power upheld us , through all those Hardships , of Bruises Blood-shed , broken Limbs , tedious Imprisonments , and Great Spoi●…ing of our Goods ( enough to melt the Hearts of Infidels ) And I cannot say , but then they would Nicodemus-like give us their Night-Encouragements ; some Blessing God that we were set to blunt the Edge of Persecution , and so be as a Bulwark for them ) yet so quickly did their Kindness coole , upon a Relaxation of such Procedure against us , that their Tenderness seem'd to Dye with the Hardness of our Persecutors ; For no sooner were we out of Prison , but instead of Congratulations , we were Saluted , or Affronted rather , with an Imposture from Lincoln , and a Lye from Dover ; the Former stampt by R. James , the Latter by T. Hobbs , both Anabaptists , as they are commonly call'd , to their own Infamy , and the great Disgrace of their Profession . These Beginnings , Reader , were followed by the pressing Endeavours of Our Dissenters in general , whether by Preaching , Disputing , Writing or other more secret Traducings , both in Cities and Country , but more especially in London : where the greatness of our Sufferings from the Powers , seems out-done by the Malicious Practices of Dissenters . Nay , so Restless are they in their Attempts against us , that they will Disturb themselves rather , then let us be Quiet ; and care not whom they molest , if the poor Quakers may but be render'd Odious ; witness among others a Libel , call'd The Spirit of the Quakers Tryed ; A Letter , subscrib'd J. G. and a Dialogue , T. H. ( the two Last of the same Fraternity with those before mention'd . ) Behold , what Use these Men make of Tolleration ! with which since Authority hath oblieg'd them , their Gratitude , or their P●…licy has turn'd the torrent of their virulent Hammer against us ; whom they daily wreak under their ungodly Hate , as if they were resolv'd to interrupt the King's Indulgence , with their Persecution : and by a kind of Revenge upon us for our Liberty , suffer it to be a time of Calm with none but themselves . But , what makes the Matter worse , some Emulous Spirits among them wisht , as I heard , for an other Storm , that the Quakers might but be shipwrackt by it . O strange Impiety ! that Men should lay our Prosperity so to Heart , as therefore to wish our Ruin ; and rather , then not effect it , run the Bold Hazard of their Own : Unless they resolve to keep their Old Haunt of Creeping into Garrats , Cheese-loifts , Coale-holes , and such like Mice-walkes , and using more Equivocation to hide a Meeting , then a Romish Priest hath been wont to do , to conceal his Function . Well may we take up a Lamentation for these things , that Men should so fearfully rend Religion from Charity , and Faith from the good Works of Patience , Mercy , and Universal Love , as if to Quarrel about Religion were to be Religious , and to call Names , and Jeer a Mark of Zeal and Witt. To Conclude , and sum up what I have said ; This hath been the Misery of almost every Reformation , that its Authors have Degenerated from their first Sense ( which plac'd Religion in a clean Conscience , not in a full Head : in Walking with God , more then in Talking of Him ) to Self-Promotion , and Persecution of all Dissenters from their Establishment : and the Cause of it is briefly this ; a 〈◊〉 from that He●…venly Illumination in themselves , setting up their Own Contrivance , before they had pull'd down all Contrivances of Men ; and their Covetousness , to advance their own Inventions ; and Impatience , to see them not assented to , ●…ave promoted Crue●…ty , and with this very Cup have the Nations been Drunk , as well Refin'd , as more Gross Professors of Religion . That God therefore fir●…t Appeared to , and Impower'd , and Sent forth Plain Men , to declare the Plain Truth , to turn Men from that Darkness , which cover'd their Hearts , notwithstanding their splendid Profession , to the Light that hath shined therein uncomprehended , which obeyed , was sufficient to Salvation ; that they were first Slandered , then Persecuted , and that by most Sorts : But their Persecution not always continuing from the Powers , they have been , and now are diligently followed by their old Adversaries , the Separatists , with their Cryes of Heresie , Error , Blasphemy , and the like , if possible , to make them a Burden upon Earth , witness their many printed Books and Impostures , particularly , The Spirit of the Quakers Tryed , The Letter , The Dialogue betwixt a Christian and a Quaker , Qu kerism no Christianity , and The Controversie Ended ; unto all which from Beginning to End , so far as concerns CHRIST , THE TRUE LIGHT , ENLIGHTNING ALL MEN , THAT EVER CAME , AND DO , OR SHALL COME INTO THE WORLD , WITH A SAVING LIGHT ; & WHAT IS THE GENERAL RULE OF FAITH TO CHRISTIANS , I here present the World with our plain & full Defence , having throughly considerd them , with what other Objections , I thought to carry any weight against Us : Which being our Fundamental Principle , if prov'd , the common Notion of Satisfaction for Sins past , present , and to come , Justification in the strictest Sense , without inherent Righteousness ; their fearful Tale of Predestination , and their P●…eas against Perfection will tumbleto the Ground . And I earnestly beseech the Reader in the Love of God , not to believe every wandring Book or Story that is out against us , but hear us before he passeth Judgement against us , and then let his Conscience tell , if We are not the True Apostolical Christians , promoting the Interest of the Pure Spiritual Apostolical Religion . For , what we believe and assert , we Witness ; We don't Steal , nor Robb our Neighbours , God has brought it to us , beyond all Imitation : Our Religion He has made our Own through his internal Operations ; And against Convictions there is no standing , as well as without them there can be no solid Knowledge : the want of which makes the World miserable , & renders us unknown . Having thus Historically introduc'd my present Discourse ; and my Witness is with God , the Rightteous Judge of all , not out of ill-Will to any , but in perfect Love to all , that the very Truth of things may be brought to Light , in order to a more clear Understanding of that Controversie , which is now on foot betwixt the so much despised Quakers and their Adversaries . For this let all know , I Write not for Controversie , but truly for Conscience sake , that not empty Conquest , but sound Conviction may be the End of all my Labours for the Lord my God , who is over and above every Name , worthy of Eternal Praises and Dominion . I shall conclude , with these Earnest Desires in uprightness of Soul to God ; that Truth , Righteousness and Peace may prevail to the more plain Detection of Error , and utter Confusion of all Envy and Prejudice . THE CONTENTS OF THE First Part. CHAP. I. The Occasion of the Discourse . The unhan●…some Dealing of T. Hicks , with respect to the Invented Weak●…ess 〈◊〉 charges upon the Quakers , as the strength of their Cause . Pag. 1. CHAP. II. The Gross Lyes Tho. Hicks tells in the Name of , or fastens upon the Quakers . Such Proceeding , full of Envy , Folly , and Ungodliness . pag. 4. CHAP. III. That he does not only make us impertinent and Lye ; But he mannages the Whole prophanely . That he who is an Anabaptist , has forgot the Scorn once cast upon his own Perswasion . Men are not to be mockt out of their Religion . pag. 7. CHAP. IV. That a Right-Relish of the Manner of the Dialogue is a sufficient Antidote against the Matter of it . His Questions stated . His feigned Answer . A True Answer to the First . What is Salvation ? To be saved from Sin and Wrath ; not Wrath without Sin. pag. 10. CHAP. V. The second Question stated . Particularly what is meant by Light. It is more then an Act ; It is a Principle that discovers the Sate of Man. pag. 12. CHAP. VI. That the Light Within manifests Sin ; yea , all Sin. That Apostacy , or Sin in any , is no Argument against the Light , but rather for it . That the Additional Services of the Jews show No Imperfection in the Light , but the People , whose Minds were abroad . If Insufficiency against the Light should be admitted of , because of Reb●…llion and Wickedness in Men , the same would be objected against the Scriptures , which overthrows our Adversary's Assortion concerning their Sufficiency . pag. 13. CHAP. VII . Another Objection against the Light 's Sufficiency to manifest what ought to be done , though it were able to discover what should be avoided . It is answered . The Light 's not telling 〈◊〉 all it knows , or man may know in time to come , is no Argument to prove , it knows not all things . Men know more then they do , let them first obey what they know , and then what is convenient will be further Reveal'd . It is proved from the Reason of Contraries ; because it show●… what ought not to be done : From Scripture at large , that 〈◊〉 instruct what to do ; and that there is Vertue in it to the Salvation of all that Believe and Obey it . That there is no ●…ssential Difference between the Seed , Light , Word , Spirit , Life ; Truth , Power , Vnctio●… , Bread , Water , Flesh and Blood ; only so denominated from the various Manif●…stations , Operatio●…s , and Effects of one and the same Divine Principle . pag. 17. CHAP. VIII . An Objection against the Light 's 〈◊〉 Being to Christ's Coming . It is proved to have been known to be a saving Light from Adam ' s Day , through the Holy Patriar●…s and ●…rophets time down to Ch●…ist's , from the Scriptures of Truth . pag. 25. CHAP. IX . Another Objection , that though the Jews had it , it will not f●…llow that the Gentiles were so illuminated . It is Answered by several Scriptures . In this Chapter quoted to prove , that they were not exempted ; but had a measure of Light , some Divine Seed sown in their Hearts , some Talent given , and that it was sufficient . T. Hicks ' s Challenge to give an Instance of one that by the Light within was reprov'd for not believing that Jesus was the Christ , is answered . Such as believed in the Light , and walkt up to it , did receive Christ when he came . The high Pretenders were they who to Scriptures Opposed , and Crucifi●…d him . The Light from Scripture concluded Universal and Saving . pag. 31. CHAP. X. That the Gentiles Believed in one God. That he enlightned all Men with a saving Light. That Men ought to live piously . That the Soul is immortal . That there is an Eternal Recompence . The Whole call'd Gentile-Divinity . The first Point proved by sixteen Testimonies . pag. 41. CHAP. XI . The second Fundamental of Gentile-Divinity , viz. That God hath Imprinted the Knowledge of Himself on the Mind of all Mankind , Proved from twelve pregnant T●…stimonies , as well of whole Societies , as particular Persons . Compared with Scripture . pag. 52. CHAP. XII . That this was not only the Doctrine and Faith of the Gentiles ; but the very primitive Doctors or Fathers both so held , and so exprest themselves : Eight Testimonies produced for Proof thereof . pag. 60. CHAP. XIII . The Third Part of Gentile-Divinity , viz. That they were Men of Vertuous Lives , and taught the Indispensibleness thereof to Life Eternal . Prov'd by Numerous Instanc●…s . pag. 66. CHAP. XIV . That the last Point of Gentile-Divinity , to wit , Immortality and Eternal Rewards , is also very clearly and positively held forth by the ancient Heathens : Six Testimonies from them , to prove it . Socrates ' s Great Faith in particular ; and the lofty Strain of the Pythagoreans . pag. 76. CHAP. XV. That the Heathens had a Sight of the Coming of Christ : That , and not Swearing , proves the Sufficien●…y of the Light. pag. 80. CHAP. XVI . It is granted that the Jew , and much more the Christian , hath the Advan●…age of the Gentile ; yet that the Gentile had enough to Salvation . pag. 84. CHAP. XVII . A great Objection stated ; Answered . The Light both Law and Gospel ; not in the same Discovery , but in it self . A Way to reconcile the seeming Difference about it ; The Light still defended . pag. 86. CHAP. XVIII . The second Part of the Objection , that Christ was not anciently called the Light ; Answered . And the Contrary proved from Scripture and Reason . pag. 91. CHAP. XIX . The third Part of the Objection : If Christ was enjoyed under the Law , as he was ; If the Light be Christ , why was he typified ? is proved of no Force . The Type and Anti-type in some respect may be at one and the same Time ; This is proved by plenty of Scripture . Our Adversaries Opposition and Cavil weak and insuccessful . pag. 94. CHAP. XX. The fourth Part of the Objection stated and considered . Christ ' s Death and Sufferings confossed to , and respected ; They were Beneficial . The Light of Christ within is the efficient Cause to Salvation . pag. 99. CHAP. XXI . A Confession in particular to Christ ' s Redemption , Remission , Justification and Salvation . pag. 104. CHAP. XXII . That Christ is the Light ; or , the Light is Christ , proved from Scripture , and so concluded ; notwitstanding two Objections , which are fully answer'd . pag. 114. CHAP. XXIII . The Universality of the Light proved by Reason . pag. 120. CHAP. XXIV . The Sufficiency of the Light proved by Reason . pag. 122. CHAP. XXV . The Question , Who He , or They are that obey the Light , & c ? consider'd and answered ; being a Character of 〈◊〉 true Quaker . pag. 124. CHAP. XXVI . The Discourse hithero summed up and concluded with an Exhortation to all Professors of Religion , especially our Opp●…sers . pag. 128. APPENDIX . Of the Rule of Faith and Life . pag. 135. Of the Judge of Controversie . pag. 155. Th●… Conclusion . pag. 160. THE CONTENTS OF THE Second Part , Entituled , The CHRISTIAN-QUAKER , and his Divine Testimony Vindicated : Which consists of several Treatises . The Contents of the First Treatise . To the Unprejudie●…d Reader , an Epistle , from pag. 3. to pag. 9. Some of the Doctrines and Contradictions of T. Hicks , declared at a Discourse between him and some of the Quakers ( so 〈◊〉 ) in Aldermanbury , London , the 20th of the 3d Moneth , 1672. p. 10 , 11. Christ's Light Within asserted , as it is Divine ( and therefore a sufficient Rule of Life unto Salvation to all that truly obey it ) and vindicated from Tho. Hicks ' s dark Exceptions , fallacious and Impious Arguments ( consisting of manifest Ignorance , Confusion and Ranterism ) which are here inserted , as they were exhibited in a Paper , afterwards owned and signed by him , from p. 13. to p. 23. Section 1. ( In Answer to his Dialogue ) The Light within proved Divine and Saving , &c. p. 24. § . 2. The Life , which is the Light of Men , not a Creature or meer Effect , &c. p. 27. § . 3. The Baptist ' s Quarrel grounded on his Mistakes about the Light , and our Testimony of it , p. 29. § . 4. Christ guideth to Salvation by his Inward Light ; and the Baptist Confounded in his Opposing it , p. 31. § . 5. The Dipper proved a Blind Guid●… , and in gross Confusion , in undervaluing the Light Within , p. 32. § . 6. His Ignorance of the Divine Principle , p. 34. § . 7. His Madness and Self-Contradiction about the Light , p. 35. § . 8. Christ , as the Rock of Ages ; and the Intent of his Coming in the Flesh not known to the Baptists , while they Oppose his Light Within , p. 37. § . 9. The Dipper plunged in a Labyri●…th of Self-Contradictions ; and the Light within proved a Rule above the Scriptures , p. 39. Sect. 10. The Subject , Understanding and Obeying the Light Within , unknown to the Cavilling Baptist , pag. 41. § . 11. Concerning the Soul of Man , as under divers Considerations and States ; and G. Fox ' s words so considered ; with Eight Queries added , from pag. 43. to pag. 47. § . 12. The Neck of the Baptist ' s Cause broken by his own Concession to the Light Within , in which Christ and his Testimonies are effectually received , p. 47. § . 13. The Baptist's impious Forgery upon the Quakers , about the Scriptures , which are in reallity owned and used by them , p. 49. § . 14. His impious Abuse about Revelation , Light Within , Scriptures , &c. from p. 50. to p. 56. § . 15. His partial Relation against John Story , p. 59. § . 16. The Baptist ' s Dispargement of the Light within , contrary to his own Pretence , p. 61 , 62 , 63 , 64. § . 17. His Slander about the Person , Offices , Sufferings and Blood of Christ , and continued Abuse of the Light Within , p. 65 , 66 , 67 , 68. § . 18. The Baptist ' s Quarrel against S. Crisp removed p. 69 , 70 , 71 , 72. § . 19. The End of Christ's Coming , Example and Suffering more truly owned by the Quaker then the Dipper , p. 73. § . 20. The Baptist ' s Ignorance and Cavil about Redemption , and the spiritual Discoveries of Christ and his Seed , p. 74 , 75 , 76. § . 21. The Baptist ' s imperfect Work against Perfection , p. 77 , 78 , 79 , 80. § . 22. Thomas Hicks ' s groundless Calumny and malicious Railing against George Whitehead , p. 81 , 82 , 83 , 84. § . 23. The Baptist ' s Abuse against G. W. about a Meeting with them at Devonshire-House , London , p. 85 , 86. The Contents of the Second Treatise [ entituled , LIGHT SPRUNG UP in the Despised Quaker , &c. ] are inserted next after the Title , before page 87. The Contents of the Third Treatise [ entituled , THE ANGRY ANABAPTIST proved Babylonish ] follow after the Title , before pag. 121. The Contents of a Bill of Excommunication exhibited by the Baptists at Chichester ; together with a brief Answer thereunto , from pag. 159. to pag. 166. Some Confessions concerning the Baptized Churches , made by their own Messengers in their Bewailing Epistle from Tiverton , from p. 167. to p. 170. The Fourth Treatise [ THE PRESBYTER's ANTIDOTE TRYED ] in Answer to Stephen Scandret . The Contents : Chap. I. A comprehensive Account concerning the Rule , the Light and Scripture , explaining both Our Sense of the Terms , and Stephen Scandrets : Together with the Assembly ' s Confession about the Scriptures , from p. 173 , to p. 180. Stephen Scandret ' s Sense about the Points in Controversie examined , p. 181 , 182 , 183 , 184 , 185. Chap. II. About JUSTIFICATION and IMPUTATION , from p. 185. to p. 209. Chap. III. About Christ's Justifying Righteousness , the best Robe ; the Necessity of its Inherence ( or being inwardly enjoyed ) not to invalidate , but to fulfil the blessed Intents and Ends of his Suffering , in Reply to S. S. from p. 210. to p. 224. Chap. IV. Of SATISFACTION ; some serious Considerations , farther opening the Doctrine and Sense of our Opposers , from p. 225. to p. 238. An Appendix , wherein the Controversie is summ'd up and resolv'd partly by way of Question and Answer , with a plain Intimation of my Sense thereof , as relating to the second , third and fourth Chapters before , fromp . 239 to p. 249. The Difference between our Opposer's Gospel and OUR's , briefly stated , p. 250 , 251. Chap. V. Concerning ELECTION and REPROBATION , from p. 252. to p. 290. The Contents thereof follow . A brief Introduction , with the Assembly ' s Opinion , and Stephen Scandret ' s uncertain Proposition for it , p. 253. Section 1. His Abuse of divers Scriptures in his State of the Case sor a Personal Election answer'd ; the Way of Goa's Choosiag resolv'd , p. 255. § . 2. The Weakness of his two first Arguments touching Gods Decree and Promises , p. 257. § . 3. His gross Ignorance of those Names written in the Lamb's Book Arg. 3. His Impertinency and ignorant Allegation , and Misunderstanding of divers Scriptures , concerning God's Choice and Ordination ; and the Cause of men's Destruction opened , against Arg. 4. Persons being chosen , proves not their Eternal Election , as Persons , p. 260. § . 4. Concerning Jacob and Esau ; Christ's Sheep , those that come , ●…ome drawn and given unto him of the Father , Arg. 5 & 6. p. 262. § . 5. Election explained ; God's Loving Jacob and hating Esau ; their Posterities concerned therein ; and how far the two Births were figured in Jacob and Esau , p. 265. § . 6. Our Opposer's blasphemously placing a partial Resolution upon God ( as creating Persons with Intention to leave them to Destruction ) contrary to his universal Call and Tend rs of Salvation , p. 268. § . 7. The Unchangeableness of God's Election , in what State ; and our Opposer's Ignorance and Error concerning God's Purpose , p. 269. § . 8. My Unanswered Objection of setting Life and Death before men , and Warning them of Destruction , p. 271. § . 9. The Cause of God's Hardening Pharaoh , Judas and others , not grounded upon meer Will and Pleasure , but for their Rebellion , p. 272. § . 10. Touching the Fall of particular Angels and Men ; the Tendence of God's Long-suffering towards the Wicked ; and my Opposer's Confession to Truth , to the utter Overthrow of his Opinion , p. 273. § . 11. Presbyters Mockery in their Warnings , and setting Life and Death , Conditional Promises and Threats before People , contrary to their Partial Opinion of an Eternal Personal Election and Reprobation , png. 275. Sect. 12. The sad Consequence of their Accusing God with decreeing to deny Saving Grace to particular Persons , yea , to the greater part of Mankind , shewing , that Divine Justice it self hath not so decreed , pag. 277. § . 13. Grace differing from Debt : The Reason why God finds Fault with Men : The Question , Who hath resisted his Will ? resolved , p. 278. § . 14. Their urging all to forsake Sin , contradictory to their Opinion , and not in true Faith : Their flattering many with fair Pretences , contrary to their own Intentions : The poor Encouragement and cold Comfort , that their Doctrine of a Personal Reprobation yields to the greatest part of Mankind , p. 279. § . 15. The Wise God , the Just Judge , is the Ordainer of the Punishment , not of the Fact ; nor the Author of Sin , or their Wickedness who persecuted Christ , p. 281. § . 16. Hypocritical Priests , making and strengthening Hypocrites by deceitfully daubing them up in their Sins , and flattering them with a [ YOU ARE NOT FALLEN FROM GRACE ] while they are guilty of gross VVickedness , p. 283. § . 17. Concerning God's Covenant with David and his Seed , and the Mystery typified in him , p. 284. To all which is added a Short Postscript concerning the WILL of God in its Manifestation ; 1st , as Unresistible ; 2dly , as Resistible , p. 286 , 287 , 288 , 289. Chap. VI. VVhether PERFECTION , that is , a State freed from all Sin , be attainable in this Life ? from p. 290. to p. 312. The Fifth Treatise , about the RESURRECTION , beginning at pag. 315. to the end of the Book . The RESURRECTION owned by us , and Scripturally asserted , with the Future and distinct Beings of Men & Angels ; and the Eternal Advantage , Glory & Felicity of the Righteous or Saints after Dissolution : The Scriptures spiritual Teftimony thereof , being owned and vindicated by us , in Opposition to our OPPOSER ' s CARNAL THOUGHTS about the Resurrection and future State , particularly in Answer to Tho. Hicks , W. Burnet and Thomas Danson . Unto which is annexed Thomas Vincent ' s Illustrations about the Resurrection , as partly an Explication of the Sense of the rest of our Opposers therein . Finally , Some Passages of Hen. Moor ' s , for the SPIRITUALITY of the Resurrection-Bodies , viz. the Body of Christ , and the Bodies of Saints . The Intent of all this Fifth Treatise being both to remove Groundless Objections , Unnecessary Questions and Fruitless Disputes about this Weighty and Mysterious Point of the Resurrection . THE CHRISTIAN-QUAKER And his DIVINE TESTIMONY VINDICATED , &c. Viz. The Universality & Sufficiency of Christ's LIGHT WITHIN , through all Ages to Eternal SALVATION : fully Stated and Defended . CHAP. I. The Occasion of the Discourse . The Unhandsome Dealing of our Adversary , with Respect to the Invented Weakness he chargeth upon the Quakers , as the Strength of their Cause . THere is a Book lately come to my Hands , intituled , A Dialogue between a Christian and a Quaker ; which with several others lately publisht against us , hath given Occasion for this general Undertaking . I was very curious to peruse that Discourse , which should make a Difference between them , having in my diligent Search after Religion , ever desired to understand and profess That , which upon true Convictions , I had Reason to believe was the most Christian : But as upon Impartial View I found the Weakness of that Book more favourable to us , then the Uncharitableness of the Title-Page , which seem'd to dis interest a Quaker in Christianity ; so most unexpectedly I found my Name , among others , often us'd , and as often undeservedly abus'd by the Author . I was not willing that any else should answer for my Faults , if any there were ; and if Innocent , I esteem'd my self both sufficient and oblig'd to my own Relief , which will not be hard to do : and the Reason is , because so little Reason , and so much Railing , have been by him imploy'd against me , as if he intended to scold rather then confute me ; and to let the World know , how much better skill'd He is in Scurrility then Argument . This I confess , drew me first into any Willingness of considering his Discourse at large : Not , that the Truth was not first in mine Eye ; but because I know the Person most concern'd with him , to be both able and resolv'd to reply , I thought my Endeavors ( at least for this time ) might have been very well excused . But so many Out-cries coming upon the Neck of another , if possible , to expel us the World , I found my self press'd in Spirit , to buckle my Mind to this Enterprise , notwithstanding that my late Concernment with some other Adversaries had left the Wearisomness of a Combat upon my Spirit , and the Hopes I had of being spared , by the ingenuous Acknowledgment of our Enemies , from the like Necessity of further Controversie . But as it fell out with the People of Syracuse , that several very Bad Tyrants were succeded by Worse ; so truly it hath done with us : The Confutation of one Adversary , redoubling Envy , Prejudice , and almost every evil Quality in the next ; as if to be overcome were more intollerable to them , then to find the TRUTH by it , would be Acceptable . Oh Lamentable Use that these Men make of our Love and Pains ! But we have some Cause to think , that failing of that Reason , which is necessary to prop so infirm a Cause , they would , if possible , supply the Want of it with the LAST WORD , which at Billings Gate , I hear , goeth a Great Way to Advantage , and turn the Scale in all Disputes . And truly , if the Temper of this Adversary be but consider'd , with what Help he himself has given us to do it ; For my part , I should stand amaz'd that any Sober , Civil or Christian Man , could refrain passing severe Sentence against him , as one that writeth of Religion , out of all Sence of either Religion , or good Manners ; and that only took Occasion , thereby to prove eminently to all Impartial Men , he really has neither . But to let that pass , I leave the Book to speak , for or against it self : I shall only premise , that though I have particularly observ'd the Manner of his Dialogue , as an apt Introduction , and that my Discourse has been occasion'd by this and several late Attempts made against the Truth ; Yet my Answer , to avoid their Accusation of Personal Heat , is not Immediate , Direct , or Particular to any one . The Matter of our Judgment , both with respect to the Light , and Rule ( comprehensive of all ) I have positively stated , and so defended by Plain Scripture , Sound Reason , and Universal Consent of former Ages : and what Force any Books , Argument , or Objections ( present with me ) whether from our Adversaries , especially T. Hick's , or my own Remembrance , I shall by the way Faithfully , and I hope , Effectually consider : To the end I may avoid the great Vanity , of Bragging of a Victory obtain'd against a Man of Straw , and Enemy of my own making , and that Detestable Sin , and Dis-ingenuous Practice , of charging those Lyes , and that weakness upon my Antagonist he never thought , nor could be guilty of . In short , what I have against the Book in general , and for the Truth and My self in particular , I shall in their proper Places produce ; And now descend so to do , with what convenient Brevity I can . First then , he has taken a very Unfair Way of Opposing our Principles ( if we may yet call them ours ) since instead of collecting what truly are so , and those most forceable Arguments We have been wont to offer in their Defence , out of our own Writings ( which in Honesty and Justice he ought to have done ) he presents the World with a Dialogue between a Christian and a Quaker , which we may truly say , are both of his own making , at once abusing both himself and that People ; For neither has he truly represented the Quaker , nor much more honest is his Character of a Christian : And whilst he doth most partially render , his own Opinions to be those of a true Christian , rather then a true Christians to be his , he brings in the poor despised Quaker , saying any thing that may be most Ridiculous , Weak and Impertinent to the Matter ; which Way of Confutation is so far from being truly Manly , much less Christian , that the Wisest Man may be so disguised into the Greatest Fool , and Truth it self seem vanquisht by the weakest Forces of her Enemies . It was by Wayes not less Injurious , though more Ingenious , that the esteem'd best Heathen of his time , was by some of his Emulating Contemporaries brought into utter Disgrace , with that only People , which once most of all deservedly admired him ; as they who will take the pains to read the Comical Abuses of Anytus and Aristophanes , upon Socrates may easily inform themselves : Whose Life being Blameless , and Vertue unparallel'd in his Day , did by his strict Precepts , and Example , so influence the People into a dis-like of those Comedians , and their loose Adherents , that till the frothy Spirit of the Multitude became reviv'd , by their ridiculous Representations of that worthy Man in a Play , it was impossible for them to work his Ruin. Methinks , this Man's Dialect savours of the same Spirit , though its Grossness tells us , It hath not the same Wit. Let me never have so infirm a Cause to manage , and grant me but Leave to make my Adversaries Answers , and I will never fear the Consequence of such Encounters . But , who will yield to this , that doth not first resolve to be Overcome ? Let T. Hicks but permit me that Liberty against his Water-Baptism in Defence of Childrens , and I will warrant him a Rebel to the Church of England . But doth he do as he would be done by ? If this be the Ne plus ultra , or Upshot of our Adversaries Strength , to feign Weakness for Us , that he may appear Some Body , I think , we need say no more , but leave it with every unprejudic'd Conscience to guess at the Meaning of such base Designes . Certainly , We have not been justly dealt with , nor our Cause weigh'd in the Equal Scale of Righteousness ; and indeed , this Imperfection is most of all incident to that Way of Writing . CHAP. II. The Gross Lyes Tho. Hicks tells in the Name of , or fastens upon the Quakers . Such proceeding , full of Envy , Folly , and Ungodliness . NExt , he has as well made us to Belye Our selves , and Principles , as to appear Impertinent ; a thing so fouly Uncharitable , indeed very wicked , as me-thinks , every Sober and impartial Mind may have just occasion to be scandaliz'd at his whole Enterprise . What! not only make us to answer in his own Language , but Lye in it , and that against our very Principles and Consciences too ; This is an Aggravation , at once , of his own Enmity , and the Imbecillity of his Cause . For can any believe , that knows us well , that when we are ask'd , as he fictiously doth in his Dialogue , Do you believe the Scriptures to be true sayings of God ? We should answer him thus ; So far as they agree to the Light in me . For , though it be thus far true , viz. that the true Light within is the same in kind with that which shined in the Hearts of the Holy Pen-Men , and therefore may rightly be said , to agree both in it self , and in the several Testimonies of Divers Ages ; and consequently it may truly be allow'd to judge of what are the sayings of God , from what are those of Wicked Men , &c. Yet has he disingenuously obtruded those Words by Way of Answer upon us , which he cannot find so laid down by any of us , much less all the Quakers . Again , in another place of his abusive Catechism , he thus Queries . Q. Then may I not conclude , that the Reason why you so freely Rail against , and Reproach your Opposers , is only to Secure your Credit with your own Proselytes ? which he thus makes the Quaker to answer . A. I cannot deny , but that there may be something of that in it . O Impudent Forgery ! Whether this Invention becomes a Man that has the least honest pretence to Christ's Pure Religion , or one who would be thought as Serious as an Anabaptist-Preacher ought to be , judge all you that read us ? I cannot believe , but Many who go under that Name , have more Tenderness and Conscience , then to abet this kind of Proceed against us . In short , It was an uncharitable Spirit ask'd the Question , and from that became a Lying one to answer it . Our Witness is with God , as to our Innocency in this very matter . But he proceeds . Q Will you be so Liberal of your Revilings , whether your Adversary gives occasion or not ? he answers for us . A. It concerns us to render them as Ridiculous as we can , and to make our Friends believe they do nothing but contradict themselves . Again to the same Unrighteous Purpose , Q. But doth not this signifie a very Dishonest and Malicious Mind in you ? He makes us return . A. We care not what you think , provided our Friends think not so . And to conclude his Slanders of this kind , hear him once more . Q. Doth not W. P. in his Book against the Author of the Spirit of the Quakers tryed , manifest great Displeasure against the Man for concealing his Name ; Suggesting , that if he knew it , then probably they 〈◊〉 have something , to detect him ? &c. I shall omit in this place making mine own Defence ; but be pleas'd Curteous Reader , to observe the Man's Answer , which he would have the World to believe was ours . A. Whatsoever thou or others may think of our Writings , we will give it out , that we have both answer'd and consuted our Adversaries , and our Friends will believe what we say in this matter , which is enough to us . O Lyes , Madness , and Folly. Certainly Reader , By this time thou canst not but with me believe , I had Reason enough to make this General Exception against the Dialogue , as neither becoming what I am so tender as to think , our bitter Adversary upon more serious Considerations might esteem a Right Christian ; nor yet that Character of a Quaker , which the more Sober Sort of Men , carry in their Minds concerning us : and in the fear of Almighty God , we do appeal to the Consciences of all People , that shall ever read us , whether we have been treated by this Man in his Dialogue and Catechism with that Spirit of Meekness , Righteousness and Truth , which is , or ought to be the Rule and Guide of Christian-Men in their undertakings , more especially in and about the very weighty matters of Religion . Indeed , we need no other Apology in this case , then the Folly of his Answers ; For all the World will think , we had least need of seeking the Good-Will of our Friends which we had already , and rather conclude it our interest , to care after , and not to slight what others say or believe concerning us . 'T is true , I perceive our Adversary is a great Slighter of Conscience , and that Light of Truth which should be the Instructer thereof , and therefore no wonder if we find so little of it in his Dialogue : but however , he sets little by it , preferring his most defective Head-Conceits before the holy certain DICTATES of the Heavenly Light in the Consciences of Men , as his Unconscionable Dealing with us sufficiently testifies ; yet is it our Desire to act suitably to that in our selves , and to seek the Approbation of it alone in others , rather then by a disingenuous way of Writing , obtrude our own Fictions for Christian-Faith , much less meer Impertinencies and very Lyes , for the only and best Answers of our Adversaries . CHAP. III. That he does not only make us Impertinent , and Lye ; But he mannages the Whole prophanely . That he who is an Anabaptist , has forgot the Scorn once cast upon his own Perswasion . Men are not to be mockt out of their Religion . BUt , He has not only made us to say what he pleas'd , Impertinently and untruly , but he has done it , with a manifest shew of Prophaneness , by a Light , Taunting and Inapplicable Use of those Expressions , which in a way of Seriousness and Simplicity , may have been sometimes uttered by honest and Religious People . Such are these , that he makes us to give , in Answer to his Questions , which we refuse not to render a distinct account of , to any Sober Man at any time , viz. Thou runnest into many Words and carnal Distinctions , and wouldst have thy fleshly Wisdom satisfied , but I tell thee , that Dust is the Serpents Food . To his Answer against the Sufficiency of the Light , he makes the Quaker Reply , I see thou art a Poor Dark Creature , as by thy talking is manifest , yea 't is manifest in the Light. To the like Purpose ; Thou art a wicked Creature , Blackness of Darkness is reserv'd for thee ; Thou art a Serpent , and the Curse of God is eternally upon thee . Again , Thou manifests thy Darkness , and that thou art still in the Imagination . Again , Thou lookst for Words , but thy Flesh must be silenc'd . Again , We witness it ; Poor Creature , Thou runst to the Letter , what dost thou witness in thy self ? Again , I command thy Flesh to be Silent ; I bear Witness against thee . At other times , in Answer to such like Questions , Yea , Verily . Alas for thee , These are thy own Dark Imaginations . Now thou runst to Meanings , We deny Meanings . Thou manifests a Perverse Spirit . We are dead to Distinctions . We deny Dispositions , Thou suggests thy own Imagination . These , Impartial Reader , with more of the like tendency , he is pleas'd to set down as our Strongest Answers to his Questions , several of them such , as have receiv'd , and yet may , very Rational and Satisfactory Returns from many of us : However , if any such kind of Answers have been given to the Unseasonable Queries of Airy and Entrapping Persons , neither is it more Ridiculous , then Christ's Immovable Silence to Inquisitive Herod was judged of old ; Nor did he Manfully , to assault our Weakest Part , if such he thought it . But least of all is he excusable , that one who is reputed an Anabaptist ; the very next in Religion , that seems expos'd to the Scoffs of Libertines , should take so much pains , not only to render a Sober People Ridiculous ( though it will return upon himself ) but with the common Taunts of Prophanenists , to venture to give their Serious Language in a Jeer : An Employment , that had much better become a Comedian , then a Christian , and the Entertainment of Loose , then Religious Persons . Certainly Reader , We must be at a very great Loss for Religion before we could embrace it from such a hand ; supposing us to be as meer Heathens , as he would have others to think us : For , how can we believe him , to have any Sincerity to God , who so far seems to have forgotten the Reproach , which his own Separation from others hath been attended with , as to make that of ours , a Subject for his Mockage and Scorn . Let him call to mind some of the Infamous Playes of those Comical Wits , Sylvester , Shackspeer , Johnson , &c. with too many of our own dayes , wherein the Preciseness and Singularity of Puritans and others , are abusively represented , and expos'd to the Life , for the Entertainment of Vain , and Irreligious Persons . If this then be a Crime in an unconcern'd Wit , can it be excusable in a Christian , for such he would have us think him to be ? No certainly ; but will be a great Aggravation of his Account in the Day of the Lord , unless it be wip'd out by unfeigned Repentance , as well as that it must needs deter all Persons , that are in earnest about the weighty Life of the true Religion , from countenancing his ungodly Attempts against us . And me-thinks , it is no small discovery of the exceeding Vanity of his Mind , that instead of putting away Foolish Jesting , he should entertain base Mockage and Derision , and that about Religion it self . What ? Is he grown so hardy , that he can handle Holy Things without Fear ; and make bold with tender Conscience , so far as to abuse it self ? Is Singularity become so offensive in a Quaker , as an Anabaptist must show his little Wit in Deriding it : But certainly , Reader , it can be no small Advantage , that both his Bitterness and Lightness , give us against a Man of his high Pretences to Religion . However , our Conquest here will be our Patience , Innocence , and Truth ; Not that I will believe , he thinks I want Words ( to whom , he more then once makes the having of them Criminal ) and all that read him may see , he hath furnisht me with Matter GROSS enough : But I delight not to spend my time upon Invectives , did I , perhaps I might bestow a Tragick Comedy upon a Railing Anabaptist , in return of that Ridiculons Dialogue , he disingenuously would fasten on an unconcerned Quaker : But my God forbid , that I should Sport about Religion ; or make so much as any Man 's pretended Religious Dissent , a Theam for my Railery or Abuse ; for I think it an ill way to Laugh men out of their Profession , as well as I can never esteem that any sincere one , which men are Jeer'd into : and as Conviction is the most Serious Ground , on which to receive Faith ; so , to detract , or deal disingenuously with any man , may harden , but can never Proselyte ; and this is our very Case , with respect to T. H. Yet I would have him know , That our so much reproached Light Within , he so little concerns the Government of his Life withal , incites us not to an Eye for an Eye ; but teacheth us that Forbearance and Forgiveness , which we have some Reason to believe , his Principles are wholly Strangers to ; else , what can mean his greedy Endeavours , To pluck out others Eyes , that never yet assaulted so much as one of his , either by Word or Writing . Well may we take up the Complaint of God's Prophet of old , We are had in Derision daily , and almost every one Mocketh us . But let the Carnal Christian-Mockers , have a Care ; for though their Cruel Mockings be our Portion in this Life , yet also , for a Recompence , shall their Bonds be made Strong , and a Consumption from the Lord of Hosts is determined against them , that persist therein . Having now rendered with all convenient Brevity my just Exceptions against the manner of the Dialogue , and spirit of the Man in general ; I shall proceed to offer something against the distinct Doctrines of it , in my particular Vindication of the Truth , viz. The Universality and Sufficiency of the Light Within , and Demonstration of the General Rule of Faith. CHAP. IV. That a Right Relish of the Manner of the Dialogue is a sufficient Antidote against the Matter of it . His Questions stated . His Feigned Answer . A True Answer to the First . What is Salvation . To be saved from Sin and Wrath ; not Wrath without Sin. WHat I have already said , being duly weighed , may be an apt Introduction to what follows ; For he that relishes the Unsavouriness and Rancour of His Spirit in the Mannagement of his pretended Christian-Dialogue , surely can have but little Appetite to feed upon , a Dish cook't up with such Poysonous Sauce . Enmity and Truth were never Companions ; and where there appears so great a share of the one , as hath been truly observed , we may , I hope , without Offence conclude , there can be but very little , if any , of the other . However , let us see , with Reason and Sobriety , whether the Matter of his Dialogue be more commendable , then the Manner of it , writ with so much Railing and Immoderation . For Reader , this know , I writ not for Conquest , but for Conscience sake : and what I can grant , I shall ; and what I must oppose , I hope , to do it with Truth and Meekness ; being only desirous to approve my self to God , who will Reward all men according to their Works ; and to that Measure of Divine Light in every Conscience , with which I shall begin , and which , as the Lord God shall enable me , I will endeavour to maintain against the Angry and Undervaluing Reflections of its Adversaries . To overlook then many unnecessary Queries , that are set down , either to Abuse us , to fill up Corners , or make the Dialogue glide the better , no wayes true in themselves , and wholly impertinent to the Matter , I receive and prosecute the Main Questions , which he propounds , thus : 1. What is that SALVATION , which the Light leads to ? 2. What is this LIGHT that leads to It ? and 3. Who this HE , or THEY are , that Obey this Light , and in Obeing attain Salvation ? Sober Questions , I grant , and as necessary to be known ; but I am willing first to set down the Answer he makes the Quaker to return , before I give mine own , that the Sober Reader may judge , how different the Reason of a True Quaker is from T. Hicks's Phantastical one . 〈◊〉 Thou runnest into many Words and Carnal Distinctions , and wouldst have thy Fleshly Wisdom satisfied ; but I tell thee , that Dust is the Serpent's Food . Is this to act the Christian , or the Scoffer towards the Quaker ? 'T is not to be doubted but T. H. knows better , and that he hath not herein done to us as he would be done by ; For all his Pretences to Christianity , he is thus far Debtor to , and Criminal by the LIGHT he vilifieth : But the Truth is , he therefore maketh his Quaker to render him no better Reason , whatever he knew , because indeed it was inconsistent with his Design that he should . But I will see if I can supply that voluntary Defect , in Rebuk to his Disingenuous Practice , on the behalf of the poor Abused Quaker . I answer : I. By SALVATION we understand , as by Scripture is deliver'd to us , A being saved from Sin here , and the Wages of it , which is Wrath to come : Whereby we are taught utterly to renounce and reject the common Acceptation of it , as the full and compleat Force of the Word , viz. barely to be saved from Punishment hereafter : In which Security , through a vain Expectance of Salvation , whilst not really & actually sav'd from the Power of Sin and the Captivation of Lusts , through the invisible Power of Christ , Thousands dye ; and T. Hicks is one of those that not only is inthroal'd himself , but earnestly contends for that Beggarly Faith and Religion , to be the most Christian , which is so unable to deliver both himself and others that believe in it . In short , We call Salvation , Christ's making an End of Sin , Destroying the Works of the Divel , Finishing of Transgression , Binding the Strong Man , and Spoyling of his Goods in the Hearts and Consciences of Men and Women ; and bringing in his Everlasting Righteousness into the Soul , whereby to Cleanse , Wash , Regenerate , Renew and Refresh the Soul ; in one Scripture-Phrase , to Save his People from their SINS . These are the Times of Refreshment , and this is the Day of Restitution ; and thus is HE King , to Reign ; Prophet , to give Vision ; and High Priest , to Anoint with the Holy Unction , that leadeth into all Truth ; whose Lips alone preserve Knowledge ; and therefore is it the Unchangeable Gospel-Rule to Believers : And those who are thus freed or saved here from the Power , Nature and Defilement of Sin , are the alone Persons , that are or shall be hereafter saved from Eternal Wrath and Vengeance , the heavy Recompenee of Sin. All this we understand by that Word Salvation ; and in this center the Great & Glorious Prophecies and Performances of Christ. CHAP. V. The Second Question stated : Particularly what is meant by Light. It is a Principle that discovers the State of Man , and leads to Blessedness . THE second Question runs thus : What is that LIGHT which leadeth to Salvation ? and if he pleaseth to give me leave , I will add to this Question , How doth It Lead to Salvation ? By Light I understand not the frequent Metaphorical Use of the Word ; as when Christ said , 〈◊〉 the Lights of the World ; or as the Apostle Speaks , Now are you Light in the Lord ; neither the meer Spirit or Reason of Man ; but , that Glorious Sun of Righteousness , and Heavenly Luminary of the Intellectual or Invisible World , represented of all Outward Resemblances , most exactly by the Great Sun of this Sensible and Visible World , that as his natural Light ariseth upon all , and gives Light to all , about the Affairs of this Life ; so that Divine Light arises upon all , and gives Light to all , that will receive it , about the Concerns of the other Life : Such a Light I mean by That Light which inlightneth every man coming into the World , and that leadeth those that obey it to Eternal Salvation ; The Scripture sayes no less , John 1. In the Word-God was Life , and that ( very ) Life was the Light of Men , that inlightneth every man , &c. But to demonstrate it the most obviously that I can , to the lowest Capacities , I shall evidence the Nature and Virtue of this Light by the Holy Effects of it , which is the HOW , or the WHICH WAY it leadeth to Salvation : This is so necessary in order to explicate the other , that as the Tree is known by his Fruits , so the True Saviour , by his Salvation . If then I can make it appear , that the Light , as obey'd in all its Discoveries and Requirings , is sufficient to Salvation , the Debate wil end , and T. Hicks must yield to the Efficacy of the Light within . I shall then by the Properties of the Light , prove it Saving : In order to which I shall begin with the first Step towards Salvation , namely , A Sight of the Cause of Damnation ; and from whom this most necessary Beginning must be taken , viz. The Light within ; which I thus prove by Scripture . CHAP VI. That the Light Within manifests Sin ; yea , all Sin. That Apostacy , or Sin in any , is no Argument against the Light , but rather for it . That the Additional Services of the Jews show No Imperfection in the Light , but the People , whose Minds were abroad . If Insufficiency against the Light should be admitted of , because of Rebellion and Wickedness in M●…n , the same would be objected against the Scriptures , which overthrows our Adversary's Assertion concerning their Sufficiency . THE Light with which Christ inlightens all Men , manifests Sin , as these Words import ; for every one that doth Evil hateth the Light , neither cometh to the Light , lest his Deeds should be Reproved : Implying , That if they would have brought their Deeds to the Light , the Light would have detected them , and tryed them . To which the Apostle Paul bears express Testimony , in his Epistle to the Ephesians , That whatsoever is Reproveable is made Manifest by the Light ; where the Universality of the Apostle's Assertion shows , that nothing that is Reproveable , is , or can be excluded from the Search or Knowledge of this Light ; which takes in as well Thoughts , as Words and Deeds . So that nothing being Reproveable , which the Light doth not first Manifest : How obvious is it to every Understanding , that if our Adversary believeth all Men to have committed Sin , and so , as that they know it ( which is Reproveable ) the Light must needs have been , and be in all Men , in order to such Manifestation and Conviction . It is as much as if the Apostle had said , * Sin is that which Damns all Men ; now it could not Damn , if it were not Reproveable ; and it could never be Reproveable , if the Light did not Manifest and Condemn it as such . So that our Adversaries affirming the Light not to be Sufficient to Discern all Sin , is a flat Repugnancy , and a down-right giving of the Lye to the Apostle ; For says the Apostle , All things that are Reproveable , are made Manifest by the Light. But sayes Tho. Hicks , All things that are Reproveable , are not made Manifest by the Light. Sober Reader , dwell here a while , and after a little paws tell me , Who deals most Unworthily with the Apostle and the Holy Scriptures of Truth , T. Hicks or the Quakers ? Obj. But T. Hicks objects , with some others , If there be that Light in all Men , how comes it , that all Men are not Convicted of their Disobedience and Duty , as the Heathens of old , and many Infidels at this day ? Did the Light in Saul reprove him for Persecuting the Church ? I Answer , That this no way impugnes the Light , although it greatly aggravates their Evil that so Rebell'd against it . But that there were Heathens , who became a Law unto themselves , through that Light they had , by which they did the things contained in the Law , and were preferred far before the Circumcision that kept not the Law : The Apostle Paul himself is very express in that known Passage to the Romans . Nor are other Histories silent , but loud in their acknowledgment of very Divine Attainments , which by this Light several Famous Gentiles arrived at ; and for their Belief of One Eternal Being , his Communication of Divine Light to Men , and of an Immortality , with their Strickt Conformity thereto , are left upon Record . by Credible Historians ; and their Praises not a little added to by after Ages , even of those called Christians too . Such are Reputed , Pythagoras , Timeus , Solon , Bias , Chilon , Anaxagoras , Socrates , Plato , Antisthenes , Xenocrates , Zeno , Antipater , Seneca , Epictetus , and others . But what if Jews and Gentiles at any time did Apostatize , and particularly ? What if Saul persecuted the Church of God , putting Disobedience for Duty , Murder for Service ? Will it follow , that the Light was Insufficient ? By no means ; but rather that Saul was Rebellious , Stiff-necked , Resisting the Holy Ghost ; as did his Fathers , so did he ; and thus much the Words themselves show ; for he kickt against the Pricks . Then it seems there were Pricks ; And where were they , if not in his Conscience ? And what were they , if not the Light of Christ within him , which Manifests Evil , and Reproves the Deeds thereof : otherwise called that Son of God , that to the Galatians he said , It had pleased God to reveal in him ? though Paul knew him not , nor his Voice of a long time ; his Eye being darkened , and Ear stopt by the God of this World , who had crept into the Outward Forms of Religion , then , as now , and in that employ'd many Emissaries to decry that Pure , Heavenly and Invisible Life of Truth and Righteousness , which was then , and is now begotten in the Hearts of many , to the ending of the Idolatries of the Gentiles , and Formality and Outward Services of both Jews and Carnal Christians . And I affirm in the Name of God , and with the Reason of a Man , That it is most preposterously absurd , for any to charge the Rebellion of Men , to be Insufficiency in the Light : For if men are Wicked , not because they will not be better ; but because they neither see nor know , nor are able to do better ; How Heavy , how Black , and how Blasphemous a Charecter doth the Consequence of these Mens Opinion fasten upon the Righteous God of Heaven and Earth ; since it supposes him , Not to have given either Inwardly or Outwardly unto Men Means sufficient to do that which he requires from them ; and for the not doing of which , they are to be sentenced to Eternal Misery . But I confess , How deep soever this may stick with Impartial Spirits , I almost despair of entering our Adversaries , whose Souls are pinch'd up within the narrow Compass of a most Detestable Kind of Predestination , making the Eternal God , as Partial as themselves , like some Ancients , That because they could not Resemble God , they would make such Gods as might Resemble them . I say , what else can be the tendency of this kind of Doctrine against the Sufficiency of the Light Within , then that the Gift of God is not Perfect , or able , because Men don't Obey it : and that the Talent God has given to all , is therefore Insufficient for the End for which it was given , because Man hides it in a Napkin ? Again , Let them tell me , Would it be a good Argument , that if the same Corn should be sown in a Fertile and Barren Soile , that growing in one , and not in the other , the Fault should be in the Seed , and not rather in the Ground ? Who knows not , how Tradition and Custom have eaten out much of Conviction , blinded the World , and that it is through Lusts and Pleasures become stupified , as to the Invisible Things of God. Alas ! there had never been so much Need of many Exteriour Dispensations and Appearances in reference to Religion , so much preferred by the Professors of this Day , had not Mens Minds been departed from the Inward Light and Life of Righteousness ; so that they being abroad , God was pleased to meet them there with some External Manifestations , yet so , as to turn them home again to their first Love , to that Light and Life , which was given of God , as the Way to Eternal Salvation : Nor could any of those cleanse , as concerning the Conscience ; wherefore God still , by his Servants and Prophets , admonished and warned the People of Old , To Put Away the Evil of their Doings , and to Wash themselves , and to Cleanse themselves ; for that all their Exactness in Outward Services , was otherwise but as the Cutting off a Dog's Neck , a Sacrifice equally pleasing : wherefore the Abrogation of all Outward Dispensations , and Reducing Man to his first State of Inward Light and Righteousness , is called in Scripture , The Times of Refreshment , and of the Restitution of all things . In short , Though there have been External Observations , and Ordinances in the World , by God's appointment ; either to prevent the Jews from the Outward splendid Worship of the Idolatrous Gentiles , that he might retain a Peculiar Soveraignity over them ; or to show forth unto them a more Hidden and Invisible Glory ; this remains sure forever , That Light there was , and that the Ancients saw their Sins by it , and that there could be no Acceptance with God , but as they walk'd up to it , and were taught to put away the Evil of their Doings by it ; suitable to that Notable Passage , The Path of the Just is a shining Light , that shines clearer and clearer unto the Perfect Day . What was this Day , but compleat Salvation ? Can there be any Imperfection or Darkness in the Day ? Surely no : What if their Light was not so large ? Was it not therefore Saving ? Yes surely . But as where much is given , much is required ; so where little is given , but little is required . If the Light was not so Gloriously manifested before the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ in the Flesh , less was then required at that time , then since ; yet it follows not , that there was Two Lights , or that the Light was not Saving before the Visible Appearance of Christ , to as many as lived in an Holy Conformity to it . And if it be agreed , that Blindness in Men can be no Argument against the Light of the Sun ; neither is the Light Insufficient , because the People of any Nation remain Blind through their Vain Customs : Nay , should any such Doctrine be admitted , what would become of our Adversary's Opinion , That the Light of Scripture is Sufficient of it self to give Men the Knowledge of God ? For if those People , who have the Scriptures , do not so Know , Believe and Obey God , as T. Hicks says , they ought to do ; will it not follow upon his Principles , that the Defect is not in such , as if they were Ignorant and Rebellious , but in the Scriptures ? Certainly the Consequence will hold as well against the Scriptures , as the Light : If then such wrong the Scriptures , who so dispute , Let T. Hicks , I intreat him , endeavour to Right the Light , and not longer maintain a Position , that being admitted , would equally overturn his Notion of the Scriptures , without Belief of the Light Within . CHAP. VII . Another Objection against the Lights Sufficiency to manifest what ought to be done , though it were able to discover what should be avoided . It is answerd . The Lights not telling man all it knows , or man may know in time to come , is no Argument to prove it knows not all things . Men know more then they do , let them first Obey what they know , and then what is convenient will be further Reveal'd . It is proved from the Reason of Contraries ; because it shows what ought not to be done : From Scripture at large , that it does instruct what to do ; And that there is Vertue in it to the Salvation of all that Believe and Obey it . That there is no Essential Difference between the Seed , Light , Word , Spirit , Life , Truth , Power , Unction , Bread , Water , Flesh and Blood ; onely so denominated from the various Manifestations , Operations , and Effects of one and the same Divine Principle . BUt there is a Second Objection ; That there seems to be a manifest Insufficiency in the Light : For , though several things are Revealed by it , yet several necessary matters are not , nor cannot ; So that though it should manifest all that is Reproveable , yet cannot it Discover all that is Necessary to be either Believed or Done. I Answer , this is but a peece of the former Objection already considered ; I perceive the Pinch lies here ; that because Men do not Do what they should , or don't Know all that may be Necessary to be known , therefore the Light is Insufficient . The first will be answer'd by what I have already said ; the Reason being the same for the Sufficiency of the Light , against such as charge it with Defect , because they do not do what they should , as against those who so impeach it , because they do those things which they should not . As for not knowing all that is to be known , I deny it utterly , For things are necessary in reference to their proper times ; That may be requisit to morrow which is not to day . It is fit for Children to learn to read , yet it is most necessary , that they should begin to spell first . If a School-Master should be charg'd with Insufficieney , because he tells not little Children , all that he knows , as soon as he initiates them in the first Principles of Learning , he would think himself unreasonably dealt with . What must we then conclude , but that the Master may be very capable , were his Scholar so ? that if the Scholar observe and obey his Master , he will increase in his Learning , that the Defect of the Scholar should not be laid upon his Master ; that to tell or amuse him about things unsuitable to his present Capacity , were the ready Way to overcharge and wholy Spoile him : And Consequently that the Tutor , not telling his Pupil , all that is fit to be known , at once , implyes no Defect in , or Ignorance of those things in the Tutor ; which to apply Scripturally , in short thus : If you do my Will , you shall know ( more ) of my Doctrine ; I have yet many things to say , but you are not able to bear them now . In short , If for a Man to say that the Light of the Gospel ( for so T. Hicks thinks Pauls was ) to be charg'd with Insufficiency , because it discover'd not to every Believer , all those ineffable things , revealed to the Apostle , would be both False and Antichristian ; to what an Extremity doth Tho. Hicks's Zeal lead him in his passionate Endeavours against the blessed Light of the Son of God as he is the Inlightner of Mankind , who charges it with Insufficiency , because it Reveals not to every Individual , in every Age , what HE shall ever know it self , or shall be known in future times . The Light then is not Insufficient , though it tell not all at one time , which may be a Duty to the End of the World ; especially in extraordinary Cases , whilst it informs me , or any Man , of Daily Duty . Yea , the Light is Sufficient in Point of Discovery , whilst it shews unto any Person something more , then they do , and which they ought to perform . If T. Hicks will say , and can prove , that he is come to the Upshot of the Light 's Teachings , that he has Learnt whatever it is possible for the Light of Christ to Teach him , and yet is able to make appear , that there is some thing further wanting , he will prove himself not only above Men , but God also , who is the Fountain of all Light ; that searcheth the Hearts , and tryeth the Reins of Men by the Inshinings of his manifesting Light , and which , as obey'd , leads to God , who is the Fulness of all Light and Life : But indeed , this Light is the Savour of Death ( the Wages of Sin ) to all that Rebel against it , and the Savour of Life to those only , who are Obedient to it ; For , Such shall not walk in Darkness , but have the Light of Life . But , whilst he pleads against a Sin-less State , and shows so Sin-full an One in his Scribles , let him cover his Face for Shame , for all his Attempts against the Lights Sufficiency ; for in that State he shall never know the Life and Vertue of the Light. To conclude , If the Light be allowed to Manifest all things that are Reproveable , then by the just Reason of Contraries , should it be Sufficient to Discover all things that are Approveable , with respect to Man's Faith , Salvation and Duty . If the Light tells it is Evil , not to Believe in God , it follows , that to Believe in God , is according to that Light Within . And if it Reproves T. Hicks for being Passionate , it consequently Teacheth him , that he ought to be Patient : If the Light Condemns Theft , it necessarily Instructeth to Honesty : If it Reprove me for doing my own Will , it implies I ought to do his Will to whom I ow all : and if it Reproves for Sin , it Instructeth to Holiness , without which none shall see God. In short , If it Manifest Reproveable Things to be such , at the same time It Condemns them , and Teacheth Things quite Contrary ; The Unfruitful Works of Darkness are judg'd by the Light , that the Holy Fruits of the Light may appear : ●…e were Darkness , but now are ye Light in the Lord ; and The Reproof of Instruction is the Way of Life . He that comes out of the Reproved Darkness , walks in the Approved Light ; and who so answers the Holy Reproof , unto Such is Sealed up THE INSTRUCTION OF THE WAY OF LIFE . And this brings me to the third Property of the Light , with respect to Men ; and that is , It doth not only Manifest and Condemn Sin , and discover and incline to Purity ; but as adhered to ( or rather that Principle which is this Light ) it is able , in Point of Power and Efficacy to Redeem from Sin , and Lead to a State of Highest Felicity . I am the Light of the World , ( said Jesus himself ) he that follows me shall not walk in Darkness , but shall have the Light of Life . In which it is very evident , that , The same Light , which Manifests Darkness , Redeems from it , unto a State of Light and Life : that is to say , Those who confidently believe in Christ , as he manifests himself a Light , to condemn Sin in every mans Flesh ( whom he hath therefore illuminated ) and obediently follow the Holy Requirings , and yield to the Heavenly Discoveries of that Blessed Appearance , relinquishing the Pleasures of Sin , which last but for a season , and taking up the daily Cross ; such shall most assuredly find that Divine Principle , which in reference to the Dark State of Men , and that Discerning and Conviction it brings , is rightly denominated Light , to have also Power and Efficacy , to Save from that which it manifests and condemns , and to bring unto that Glory , which it gives a true Revelation of : For , that same Word of God , who is called the true Light that inlighteneth all Mankind , is also the Life , Power , Wisdom and Righteousness of the Father , in whom are hid all the Treasures of Wisdom , and unto whom all Power both in Heaven and in Earth are committed , who is Heir of all things : who also said , While ye have the Light ( for their Day of Visitation was almost over ) or , as some Translations more truly have it , While you have a little Light IN YOU , believe , or walk in it . ) believe in the Light , that ye may be Children of th●… Light : Again , I am come a Light into the World , that whosoever believes in me should not abide in Darkness : So that a Sincere Faith in , and Obedience to the Light of Christ , as it shines in the Heart , whereby to give the Living and Experimental Knowledge of the Glory of God unto the Creature , is the Way to be Redeemed from Darkness , and to be made a Child of Light ; or that there is Power and Vertue Sufficient in the Light , to Ransom the Souls of such as diligently adhere to it , from under the Power of Darkness . For as the true Knowledge of God is Life Eternal , so , whatever may be known of God is manifested within , which Manifestation cannot properly be without the Light , whose peculiar Property it is to Discover , Reveal or Manifest the Mind and Will of God to Mankind ; as saith the Apostle , For whatsoever doth make Manifest is Light. In him was Life , and that Life was the Light of all Men : But not therefore the Life of all Men , Spiritually and Unitedly considered ; That was the peculiar Priviledge of those who Believ'd in it , and walkt up to it . There is a great Difference , not in the Principle , but in its Appearance to Man , as Life , and Light. Such as believe in it ; IT , What ? the Word-God , who is that true Light , as he appears to Discover or Illuminate the Heart and Conscience , do really know and enjoy a new Nature , Spirit and Life ; And in that Sense it may be said , As the Life became the Light , so the Light became the Life again . Who so follows me shall not walk in Darkness , but have the Light of Life . Not , that there is a Difference , or so much as a Descent in Kind from Life to Light ; only in Operation with respect to Man : For as it is the very Life of the Word , in the Word , it is the Light of Men : and so much it is , let them reject the Vertue of it , if they will. But as it is received , and believed in , It begets Life , Motion , Heat , and every Divine Qualification , suitable to the State of the New Birth . And thus the Life of the Word , which is in common the Light , becomes the Life of every such Particular , by communicating to , or ingenerating Life in the Soul ; so that no more he lives , but Christ ( the Word-God , whom he hath now put on , and who is become his very Life , as well as Light ) that dwelleth in him . Let not Men then in their Dark Imaginations , with their Rob'd Knowledge from the Letter of the Scriptures themselves , contend against the Sufficiency of what they obey not ; neither have seriously tryed the Power , Vertue , and Efficacy of it , which brings Salvation to as many as are turned to it , and abide in it . And indeed , so express are the Scriptures in Defence of the Sufficiency , and Necessity of the Light to Salvation , that it seems to have been the great Intendment of our Lord Jesus Christ in delegating his Disciples , to preach his Everlasting Gospel , viz. That they might open the Eyes of People , and turn them from Darkness to the Light , and from the Power of Satan unto God , that they might receive Remission of Sins , and an Inheritance among them that are Sanctified through Faith , that is in Me ; who , ME : that am both the Light of the World , and the Power of God unto Salvation . Now certainly , the Eyes that were then blind , were not the Natural , but Spiritual Eyes of Men ( and such must the Darkness and Light be also ) blinded by the God of this World , who raigned in the Hearts of the Children of Disobedience : No Wonder then if the Light was not comprehended of the Darkness , and that blind People did not see the Light ; but it plainly proves , That Light there was , though not seen . Now the Work of the Powerful Ministry of the Apostles was , To open the Blind or Dark Eye , which the God of the World had blinded , and then to turn them from that Darkness , to the Light ; the Darkness was within , so must the Light have been ; since the Illumination was there necessary , where the Darkness had been predominant ; Consequently , The Way to be Translated from Satan's Power to God , to have Remission of Sins , and an Inheritance with them that are Sanctified , is , to be turned from the Darkness in the Heart , unto the Marvelous Light ( that had long shined uncomprehended ) to wit , the GOSPEL , which is called both the Light and Power of God. The same Apostle in his Epistle to the Romans , is more express concerning the holy Nature and Efficacy of the Light to Salvation , when he thus exhorts them ; The Night is far spent , the Day is at hand ; Let us therefore cast off the Works of Darkness , and put on the Armour of Light : Let us walk honestly as in the Day , not in Rioting and Drunkenness , not in Chambring and Wantonness , not in Strife and Envy ; but put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ , and make no provision for the Flesh , to fulfill the Lusts thereof . From whence I shall briefly remark three Things , greatly to our Purpose , and the Truths Defence in this Matter . 1. That there is an absolute Opposition , betwixt Light and Darkness ; as Darkness can only Vail the Light , from the Understandings of Men ; So Light only can Discover and Dispel that Darkness . Or thus , That the Light Manifests and Condemns the Works of Darkness ; for , what Communion hath Light with Darkness . 2. That in the Light there is ARMOUR , which being put on , is able to Conquer the Darkness , and Secure the Soul , from the evil of it ; otherwise it would be very strange , that the Apostle should exhort the People to put it on . 3. That putting on the Armour of the Light , and putting on the Lord Jesus Christ ( the Light of the World ) are Synonimous , or one and the same thing ; for it is for one and the same End , as may be observed from the Words , Let us put on the Armour of Light , and walk Honestly , as in the Day , not in Rioting and Drunkenness , not in Chambring and Wantonness , not in Strife and Envying . But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ , and make no provision for the Flesh , to fulfil the Lusts thereof . I hope then , Neither will it be disallow'd , that Christ is that Light , with which Men are Inlightned ( but more of that anon ) nor is that Light , Men are exhorted to Obey , a Naked and Insufficient , but a Searching , Expelling , Powerful and Arming Light , against Darkness , and all its Unfruitful Works , and consequently SAVING . Thus the Beloved Disciple testifies very emphatically , in his first Epistle , where he gives us a Relation of the Apostolical Mission : This then is the Message which we have heard of him , and declare unto you ; That God is Light , and in him is no Darkness at all ; if we say , we have Fellowship with him , and walk in Darkness , we Lye , and do not the Truth ; But if we walk in the Light , as he is in the Light , we have Fellowship one with another , and the Blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all Sin. Here is a brief Stating of the whole Great Case of Salvation : ( 1. ) What God is ; Light. ( 2. ) Who can have no Fellowship with him ; such as walk in Darkness ( that is Sin. ) ( 3. ) Who have Fellowship with him ; such as walk in the Light , as he is Light. ( 4. ) the Reason why , is given ; because such as walk in the Light , are there sure experimentally to feel the Vertue of Christ's Blood , to cleanse them from all Unrightcousness ; Where observe , that the Light 's leading out of Darkness , that is , Unrighteousness , is the same with the Blood of Jesus Christ cleansing from all Sin ; Sin and Darkness , and to be cleansed from the one , and to be translated from the other , is equivalent ; otherwise , a Man might be delivered from Darkness , and walk in the Light , and not be cleansed from Sin , which is that Darkness ; a thing Absurd and Impossible : In short , they go together . By this 't is evident , that the Light being walkt in , doth directly lead to God , and Fellowship with him , who is the Saving Light and Health of all Nations ; and consequently , that the Light leads to Eternal Salvation . Many are the Denominations that are given in Scripture to one and the same Being , or Condition ; Christ is called , The Word , the Light , the Saviour , Emanuel , a Rock , a Door , a Vine , a Shepherd , &c. A State of Sin is sometimes called , Darkness , Death , Disobedience , Barrenness , Rebellion , Stiff-neckedness , Eating of Sowr Grapes ; And Wicked Men , Bryars , Thorns , Thistles , Tares , Dead Trees , Wolves , Goats , &c. On the contrary , a State of Conversion , is sometimes expressed , by such words , as , Purged , Refined , Washed , Cleansed , Sanctified , Justified , Led by the Spirit , Baptized by one Spirit into one Body , Regenerated , Redeemed , Saved , Bought with a Price , &c. And Persons so qualified , The Children of God , Children of Light , Heirs of Glory , Lambs , Sheep , Wheat ; And that by which they become or continue thus , Light , Spirit , Fire , Sword , Hammer , Power , Grace , Seed , Truth , Way , Life , Blood , Water , Bread , Word , Unction , that leadeth into all Truth ; All which respectively , is but one and the same in Nature : That is , Sin or a Sinful State is so variously denominated from the divers Operations and Discoveries of the Nature of it in Wicked Men. The like may be said of the several Vertues in Good and Holy Men , and so of that one Divine Principle , which so qualifies and preserves them ; For as the Primitive Saints felt the Operation of the One Holy Principle , so they denominated it : to men in Darkness , they call'd it Light ; to such as believed and obeyed , It became a Leader ; and those who witnessed their Sins conquer'd , their Lusts cut down , their Hearts broken , and their Souls Washed , Redeemed and daily Nourished , they called that Divine Principle , a Sword , Fire , Hammer , Water , Flesh , Blood , and Bread , and Seed of Life . In short , The same Heavenly Principle became Light , Wisdom , Power , Counsel , Redemption , Sanctification , and Eternal Salvation unto those who believed in it : So that the Variety of Expressions in the Scriptures , must not be taken for so many distinct things in kind , no ; nor sometimes in Operation . And indeed , notwithstanding that Light , T. Hicks would have lodg'd in the bare Scriptures , exclusive of the Spirit , all the Men of the World met together , would be confounded , to give a true Account of the Matter therein contained , if they were not Living Experimental Witnesses ; For as he is not an Evidence sufficient in Laws Humane , that was not an Eye or Ear Witness ; neither are they Evidences for God and Christ , who are not Eye and Ear Witnesses of the Light , Spirit , Grace and Word of God in the Heart . And I boldly affirm , the Scriptures speak no more for such , as are not Inheritors of that Blessed Condition , they declare of in some Measure or other , then any Deed of Gift would do for a Person no wayes Nam'd or Interested therein . It is time then for T. Hicks and his Partners to look about them , lest the Midnight-Cry overtake them , and their Professing Lamp be found without Oyl : For I must needs tell him , in the Beloved Disciple's Language , He that saith , he is in the Light ; and 〈◊〉 his Brother , is in the Darkness even until now . And in my own Language , That I take that to be their State , who shew so much Envious Displeasure against an Harmless People , and those in particular , that never yet Offended , much less Justly provokt them . But would they bring their Thoughts , Words and Deeds to the Light in their own Consciences , and let true Judgment pass upon them , and patiently undergo the Heavenly Chastisements for their Disobedience to , and Vilifying of the Light , they would come to witness a turning from the Darkness to the Light , and continuing therein , as that Holy Way , in which the Ransomed of the Lord alwayes did , do , and shall walk through all Generations , they would know the Injoyment of Eternal Peace : Yea , such is the Excellency of Christ , the true Light , that as He was First , so shall He be the Last , when all Outward Performances , Writings , Worships , yea , the whole World shall be at an End ; the Use and Excellency of the Light will remain forever ; as saith John the Divine , And they shall see his Face , and his Name shall be written in their Fore-Heads , and there shall be no Night there , and they need no Candle , neither Light of the Sun , for the LORD GOD GIVETH THEM LIGHT , and they shall Reign forever and ever , Amen . CHAP. VIII . An Objection against the Light 's Antecedent Being to Christ's Coming . It is prov'd to have been known to be a Saving Light from Adam's day , through the Holy Patriarchs and Prophets time down to Christ's , from the Scriptures of Truth . HAving then plainly prov'd from Scripture ( 1. ) That the Light is Saving , since the time of Christ ; beginning with its first Appearance , as Manifesting Sin. ( 2. ) Condemning of It. ( 3. ) Redeeming from It , as obeyed . And that the same Principle which is called Light , is the Seed , Grace , Truth , Word , Spirit , Power , Unction , Water , Way , Life , Flesh and Blood ; and therefore not a Distinct Being from that , which T. Hicks himself , if he will own plain Scripture , must confess doth Save ; I call it the LIGHT OF SALVATION , OR THAT LEADS TO SALVATION . But there remain yet several Objections to be Answered , which done , we shall immediately proceed to give Judgment upon the Question , Who , or What this Light is , with respect to all our Adversaries Cavils . Obj. Though you have thus far evinc'd the Universality of a Saving Light from the Scriptures , since Christ's Life , Death , Resurrection and Ascension ; yet that which is the Pinch of the Controversie will be this , Where was this before Light ? Had any this Saving Light ( they had a Light ) before it came in that Eminent Manner above One Thousand Six Hundred Years since ; It is generally believ'd , that Christ's then coming benefitted the World with it , in case the World universally hath such a Saving Light ? To which I shall give my Answer , both from Scripture , History and Reason . The first Scripture I shall quote , is in the first of Genesis ; So God created Man in his own Image , in the Image of God created he him . From whence I draw this Argument , That if Man was made in God's Image , then because , God is Light , Adam must necessarily have had of the Divine Light in him , and have been the Image of that Light , so long as he walkt and remain'd in It : Since no man walks in the Light , but he becomes the Child of Light. And as the Apostle Paul expresseth it , of such as were converted to that Light they had once erred from ; Ye were Darkness , but now are ye Light in the Lord ; That is , Through Obedience to the Light of the Lord. For any man then to say , Adam had not Light , were to suppose his Innocent State to be that of Darkness , and instead of , and being God's Image , who is , and ever was , and alwayes will be Light , he would have been wholy ignorant of him , in whose Image he is said to have been created . II. This Moses directed the Children of Israel to , when he in God's stead , recommended and earnestly pressed the keeping of the Commandment , and Word in the Heart ; as we read in Deuteronomy . For this Commandment which I Command thee this day , is not hidden from thee , neither is it far off : It is not in Heaven , that thou shouldst say , Who shall go up for us to Heaven , and bring it unto us , that we may hear it and do it ? Neither is It beyond the Sea , that thou shouldst say , Who shall go over the Sea for us , and bring it unto us , that we may hear it and do it ? But the Word is very nigh unto thee , in thy Mouth , and in thy Heart , that thou mayst do it . See , I have set before thee this day , Life and Good , and Death and Evil. From whence I cannot but observe these Three Things , 1. That the Commandment , and the Word , are so called by way of Excellency and Preheminence , to all written Commandments or Words . 2. That this Commandment or Word is Nigh , even in the Heart of Man it self : none need plead Distance or Ignorance . 3. That the Setting Life and Good , Death and Evil was and could only be in the Light within , since without the Light , how could they have Seen it Set before them : And that it was in their Hearts , the Lord so set those States before them , the Verse immediately follows that wherein the Word is by Moses argumentatively prov'd , as well as affirm'd to be in the Heart of Man. Now I hope , it shall not be injuriously done of me ; and I know who will bear me out , if I say , This Commandment is that which David spoke of , when he said , The Commandment of the Lord is pure Inlightning the Eyes ; and this Holy Word , the same with that Word , which he said , was a Lamp unto his Feet , and a Light unto his Path , and not an other Word , then what Paul call'd the Word of Faith , which he preach't , by which the Just live ; consequently a Saving Commandment , Word or Light it was , and is to such as Believe and Obey it . III. The next Scripture I will urge shall be this : For thou art my Lamp O Lord , for the Lord will Lighten my Darkness . Now if God was the Light and Lamp of that Day , to such as regarded the Light , cerainly then they had a Light and such an one as was Saving too ; unless we should Blasphemously Deny , God to be either a Light , or a Saving One , who is most certainly both . IV. Wicked Men were not without Light to Condemn them , as Good Men ever had Light to Preserve them : They are of those that Rebel against the Light , they know not the Wayes thereof , nor abide in the Paths thereof , said Job . In which Passage it is very obvious , that Wicked Men have Light , otherwise it would have been utterly Impossible for them , to have Rebell'd against it ; Nay , against THE LIGHT , implying , that it is the same Light in Nature , with that , which Righteous Men are guided by , answerable to another Emphatical Passage in the same Book of Job , Is there any Number of his Army , and UPON WHOM DOTH NOT HIS LIGHT ARISE ? Certainly , this Universality strongly pleads on the behalf of our Belief of the Light ; And if our Adversary would but venture to let it come close to his Conscience , I cannot be so Uncharitable as to think he should not make some Acknowledgment to its Universality , antecedent to the Coming of Christ. I omit to say much of its Efficaciousness at that time ( though one would think that Light alwayes gives to Discern a Good Way from a Bad one ) referring it to another place : Only I shall observe , how that Job expresly tells us , and that when he was in his deep Troubles of Spirit : O that I were as in Months past , in the Dayes when God preserved me , when his Candle shined upon my Head , and when by his Light I walked through Darkness ; where it is most apparent , that Job attributes his Salvation from the Darkness ( which stands both for Sin and Affliction ) unto the Light , wherewith God had Inlightned him . And certainly , It had been utterly Impossible for those weighty things , that are deliver'd in that Book of Job , as well from others , as from Job , to have been known , had not they been Inlightned , and received very great Discoveries from that Light and Candle of the Lord in their Hearts ; For in all the whole Book I find not one Verse expresly cited out of any other Writings , but what purely proceeded from Immediate Impulse , and Inspiration of the Almighty , which sayes the same Book , gives Men Understanding . V. To this Doctrine David was no Stranger , who so very often commemorates the Light , and the Divine Excellencies of it ; some few places I shall mention of those many that I might offer . The Lord is my Light and my Salvation , whom shall I fear ? the Lord is the Strength of my Life , of whom shall I be afraid ? This weighty Passage of the Prophet is a lively Testimony to the True Light , wherein David confessed what John call'd his Evangelical Message , viz. That God is Light. Next , that not only God is Light , but which doubtless was most of all to his Comfort , HIS LIGHT ; The Lord is MY Light , and MY Salvation : As much as if he had said , Because the Lord is become my Light , I have known him to be my Salvation , or him by whom my Salvation hath been wrought . In short thus , That God is My Salvation , as he is My Light ; or , as I have Obey'd the Lord My Light , I have witnessed Salvation . O! that such Professors of Religion , in whom there is any Moderation , would but be pleas'd to weigh , What was David ' s Light ; What his Salvation ; and Who must needs have been his Rule at that time of the World , of which he further speaks : God is the Lord , who hath shewed us Light. Thy Word is a Lamp unto my Feet , and a Light unto my Pathes . I have not departed from thy Judgments , for thou hast taught me . This made him far Wiser then his Teachers in the hidden Life and Mystery of things , whereby David had long seen beyond all Types and Shaddows of the good Things to come , to the very Substance it self , from whence came his excellent Prophecies : agreeing with that passage , The Path of the Just is as the shining Light , that shines more and more unto the perfect Day , said the wise Man. This strongly implies , that David , and not he alone , but the Just of all Ages , were attended with the Discoveries and Leadings of a Divine Light ; which as obey'd , did make Just , and alwayes lead in the Way of Salvation : unless the Just Way was not the Saving Way ; and if it was , certainly it is still : for it is the Lord himself , whom in Samuel's History , he is recorded also to have called a Lamp , as he here doth the Word , which Moses said , was nigh in the Heart , that Men should obey it and do it . This was the Word of Reconciliation in every Generation , whose Holy Water washed their Consciences from Sin , who heard , andobey'd it . Again , that this Light was not confin'd to David , or such Good Men , take these two Passages . * Thou givest thy Mouth to Evil , and thy Tongue frameth Deceit ; Thou sittest and speakest against thy Brother , thou Slanderest thine own Mothers Son : These things hast thou done , and I kept Silence , thou thoughtest that I was altogether such an one as thy self , but I WILL REPROVE THEE , AND SET THEM IN ORDER BEFORE THINE EYES ( saith the Lord ) Again , His Lightnings inlightned the World , the Earth saw , and trembled . In which two places it will appear upon impartial Consideration , that God hath inlightned the World , and that as Light ( Difcovering the Works and Workers of Darkness ) he doth reprove the Inhabitants of the World , set their Sins in order before them , and cause such Guilty ones to Tremble at his so appearing , which is expresly confirmed in that notable passage of the Prophet , For Lo ! He that treadeth the Mountains , and cleareth the Wind , that makes the Morning Darkness , and treadeth upon the High Places of the Earth , and DECLARES UNTO MAN , WHAT HIS THOUGHTS ARE , THE LORD , THE GOD OF HOSTS IS HIS NAME . This the Psalmist was well acquainted with himself , when he uttered these Words , Whither shall I go from thy Spirit , or whither shall I flee from thy Presence ? which plainly shows to us , that the Spirit of the Lord , and his Presence was every-where , and that as Light , discovering Darkness with respect to Mankind : For the Question was not , whether God by his Spirit was not every-where , for that our Adversaries grant , or he could not be God ? But whether it was possible for David to withdraw himself into any place , where his Mind could not be sensible of the Eternal Spirit and Immediate Presence of God ( who is Light it self ) either as a Reprover , Exhorter , or Informer ; as the foregoing Words intimate ? O Lord thou hast searched me , and known me , — Thou understandest my Thoughts afar off — Thou art acquainted with all my Wayes . Which however God might know them , it stands firm , that David could never have known God so as to see and behold them , but from that Light and Spirit of which he sayes in the 7th vers . following ( which I have already cited ) Whither shall I go from thy Spirit ? In short , it must needs be evident , to all unprejudic'd Readers , that David had this Light within , or Spirit of God present with him , as a Reprover , Informer , or Comforter , since it was impossible for him to be any-where without it . Which may prove to us , that however he lived above a thousand years before the Apostle Paul , he very well knew the meaning of that Doctrine he preach'd to the Athenians , God is not far away , or at a Distance from every one of you . Which truly known and experimentally witnessed , not only as a Reprover , but by an humble and holy reception of him into the Heart , as King and Lord , is the Glory of the Evangelical Dispensation , where God dwells in his People as an Holy Temple , and Tabernacles with them . This is the blessed Emmanuel-state God with , and God in Men. I might here to sub-joyn the Account we have of the great Illumination of Daniel , and the Gentiles clear Acknowledgment of the same , which they could never have done , with that Seriousness and Conviction , but from some glimps of the same Divine Light ; but that I shall pass over with several Passages of other of the lesser Prophets ; and conclude this Scripture Proof of the Gift of the Light and Spirit , antecedent to Christ's coming in the Flesh ; and from Stephen's Testimony , Howbeit the Most High dwelleth not in Temples made with hands , as saith the Prophet : Heaven is my Throne , and Earth is my Footstool , what House will you build me , saith the Lord ? or what is the Place of my Rest ? Hath not my hands made all these things ; Ye Stiff-necked and Uncircumcised in Hearts and Ears , ye do always resist the Holy Ghost , as your Fathers did so do ye . And lest it should be objected , that it was only in Stephen then , and the holy Prophets of Old , that both they and their Fore-Fathers resisted the Holy Spirit , Remember Reader , that weighty Passage in Nehemiah , Thou gavest also thy Good Spirit to Instruct them , and withheldst not thy Manna from their Mouth ; by which it is most evident , that the Light of God's Spirit , or the Spirit of God , was given as well to the Rebellious as Obedient ; that it might as well condemn for Sin , as lead into all Righteousness ; And since we are to suppose God's Spirit , and the Light thereof , to be sufficient to Salvation , ( for God's Gifts are perfect in themselves , and are given to accomplish their Ends perfectly ) from that Sin and Iniquity which the contrary Spirit draws into , we may without any offence , I hope , conclude , that during those many Ages before the Coming of Christ in the Flesh he did Illuminate Mankind with a sufficient measure of his Divine Light and Spirit . CHAP. IX . Another Objection , that though the Jews had it , it will not follow that the Gentiles were so Illuminated . It is Answerd by several Scriptures . In this Chapter quoted to prove , that they were not exempted ; But had a measure of Light , some Divine Seed sown in their Hearts , some Talent given , and that it was Sufficient . T. Hicks's Challenge to give an Instance of one that by the Light within was Reproved for not believing that Jesus was the Christ , is Answer'd . Such as believed in the Light , and walkt up to it , did receive Christ when he came . The high Pretenders were they who to Scriptures Opposed , and Crucified him . The Light from Scripture concluded Universal and Saving . Obj. BUt here I expect this Objection , having run our Adversaries unavoidably to it : Very well , Taking it for granted that what you have said in reference to a Saving Light or Spirit , universally bestow'd upon the Jews , THAT WERE A DISTINCT PEOPLE from the rest of the World , under very many peculiar Rights ; yet cannot we think it good Arguing , to infer the Gifts of God's Light and Spirit to the Gentiles , that make far the greatest part thereof ; from these Scriptures , that only seem to prove it the Priviledg of the Jews . To which I Answer , That I conceive I have urg'd those Scriptures already , that afford a plain Conviction , and Evincement of the Truth of that general Inference ; but because I am desirous from my very Soul , in perfect Love to theirs , that shall read this Discourse , of removing what Objection I am able to fore-see it may meet with , after it shall have past my hand , I will endeavour to make appear , first from SCRIPTURE , and next from the Best Account we have of the DOCTRINES and LIVES of HEATHENS , and lastly from REASON ; That God's Love in the Illumination of his Spirit or Gift of a Measure of his Divine and Saving Light was Universal ; or that Mankind was ( and consequently is ) antecedently to Christ's Coming in the Flesh , enlightned with such a Measure of Light , as was Saving in it self : And to all such , as received the Light , and obeyed it , in the Love of it . In order to this , I shall briefly insist on a few Scriptures , some of which have been already quoted , though not so directly to this Matter . I. My Spirit shall not alwayes strive with Man. Here observe , That no one Nation was interested more then another , but Man stands for the whole Adam , or Mankind ; from whence I do very truly Conclude , that Mankind was not destitute of the Spirit , or Light of the Almighty , though it might be known in no higher Degree , then that of a Convincer and Reprover of Sin : yet it follows not , But if man had yielded to the Striving of it , doubtless he had been thereby redeemed from that Spirit of Iniquity , that was the ground of his grievous Resistance , which I call Salvation from sin . II. They are of those that Rebel against the Light , they know not the Wayes thereof , nor abide in the Path thereof . Here is no mention made of the Jews , in this Chapter , nor in many foregoing or following it , if at all in the whole Book . For Job is here giving the Character of wicked Men in general , that is , not with respect to any . * particular Nation ; so that we may well infer , neither did he understand , the Light whereof he spoke , should be limited ( as to its Illumination ) or any particular People . In short , I argue thus ; If such as pluck the Fatherless from the Breast , and take a Pledge of the Poor , as ( the Context relates ) are those that Rebel against the Light , and walk not in its Way ; then because that Vice was never limited to the Jews , but other Nations work'd that Wickedness as well as they , it will plainly follow , that the Light , against which such Offenders Rebell'd , also was not limited to the Jews , but extended to the Gentiles also ; unless it should be said , That what was Rebellion and Wickedness in the Jews , was not so in the Gentiles . But because , Sin was , and is Sin , all the World over ; Light was , and is Light , all the World over , whether Men bring their Deeds to it or not . III. But again let us hear the same Book speak , Is there any Number of his Armies ? and upon whom doth not his Light Arise ? This Question carries in it a strong Affirmative of the Universality of God's Light , as much as to say , Who is there among all the Sons and Daughters of Men , that can say , I am not Enlightned by Him ? If then none can , it must needs follow , That all are Enlightned , as well Gentiles as Jews . IV. Thus much these two Notable Parables teach us of the Sower , and the Lord that gave his Servants Talents . They who believe Scripture , must acknowledge them to represent God's Dealings with Mankind , in reference to Gift , Duty and Reward . Observe the first Parable . The same Day went Jesus out of the House , and sate by the Sea side ; And great Multitudes were gathered together unto him , so that he went into a Ship , and sate , and the whole Multitude stood on the Shore . And he spoke many things unto them in Parables , saying , Behold , A SOWER WENT FORTH TO SOW , and when he sowed , some Seeds fell by the Way side , and the Fowls came , and devour'd them up ; Some fell upon Stony places , where they had not much Earth , and forthwith they sprung up , because they had no Deepness on Earth , and when the Sun was up , they were scorched , and because they had not Root , they wither'd away ; and some fell among Thorns , and the Thorns sprung up and choack'd them ; But other fell in Good Ground , and brought forth Fruit ; some an Hundred-fold , some Sixty-fold , some Thirty-fold . Who has Ears to hear , let him hear . It is granted by all that I know of , that the Seeds-Man is God ; the Scripture saith , the Seed is the Word of the Kingdom , which must needs be the Spiritual Word nigh in the Heart , suitable to the Heavenly Kingdom Christ said , was within , other-wise call'd Light , that is said to be sown for the Righteous ; or the Grace , that appeares unto all-Men , and brings Salvation to them that are taught by it : And lastly , common Sense tells us , that the several Grounds comprehend Mankind ; for they must either include the Bad with the Good , or the Good only must be benefited : But the very Scripture expresly distinguisheth betwixt the Good and Bad Ground , yet affirms the one to have been sown with the Seed as well as the other ; Therefore Gods Gift is Universal , however Men by Wicked Works may have render'd their Hearts Stony , Thorny , or otherwise defective and uncapable of bringing forth Fruit. The other Parable is also very weighty , and much to our purpose : For the Kingdom of Heaven is as a Man travelling into a far Country , who called his own Servants , and delivered unto them his Goods ; and unto one he gave Five Talents , to another Two , and to another One , to every Man according to his several ability , and straight-way took his Journey . Then he that had received Five Talents , went and traded with the same , and made them other Five Talents ; and likewise he , that had received Two , he also gained other Two ; But he that had received One , went and digged in the Earth , and hid his Lord's Money . After a long time , the Lord of those Servants cometh and Reckoneth with them : And so he that had received Five Talents came and brought other Five Talents , saying , Lord , Thou deliveredst unto me Five Talents , Behold , I have gained besides them Five Talents more . His Lord said unto him ; Well done thou Good and Faithful Servant , thou hast been faithful over a few things , I will make thee Ruler over many things , Enter thou into the Joy of thy Lord. He also that received Two Talents , came and said , Lord , Thou deliveredst unto me Two Talents , Behold , I have gain'd Two other Talents besides them , His Lord said unto him ; Well done Good and Faithful Servant , thou hast been faithful over a few things , I will make thee Ruler over many things , Enter thou into the Joy of thy Lord. Then he which had received One Talent , came and said , Lord , I knew thee , that thou art an hard Man , Reaping where thou hast not sown , and Gathering where thou hast not strawed ; and I was afraid , and went and hid thy Talent in the Earth : Lo , there thou hast that which is thine . His Lord answer'd , and said unto him , Thou Wicked and Slothful Servant , thou knewest that I Reap where I sowed not , and Gather where I have not strawed , Thou oughtest therefore to have put my Money to the Exchangers , and then at my Coming I should have received mine Own with Usury : Take therefore the Talent from him , and give it unto him which has Ten Talents ; For unto every one that hath shall be given , and he shall have Abundance , but from him that has not shall be taken away even that which he hath : And cast ye the Unprofitable Servant into utter Darkness , there shall be Weeping , and Gnashing of Teeth , when the Son of Man shall come in his Glory , and all the Holy Angels with Him , then shall He sit upon the Throne of his Glory , and before Him shall be gather'd all Nations , and He shall separate them one from another , as a Shepherd divideth his Sheep from the Goats , and He shall set the Sheep on his Right Hand , but the Goats on the Left. Serious Reader , I have the rather repeated the Scripture at large , because of that great Strength it carries , methinks , to the Conviction , at least Confusion of that Narrow Spirit , which confines the infinite Goodness of God , and renders him , whilst he is an Universal Creator , but a particular Benefactor , shutting up his Gifts within the straight compass of a FEW ; representing him thereby , as partial , as some Parents , who they know not for what , beside their own unequal Wills , do frequently bestow their Favour ( indeed the whole of their Affection ) upon an Elected Dareling , to the manifest , though causeless Neglect of the rest . But to speak the Truth of the matter , the Over-fondness some bear to their own Opinions , joyn'd with the Envy raised towards those who conform not to them , has so emptied them of all natural Affection , that looking upon God in that condition they dare to think him as unnatural as themselves ; For my part , I have not a great while believ'd , but that it rather rise from an Unwillingness in some , that Dissenters from them should be saved ( thereby endeavouring a Compliance upon Necessity ) then that God had not been propitious unto all his Creatures . For who sees not , who can or will see , that God is this Soveraign Lord , that he made Mankind to be his Servants , that these Three are representative of the whole , and to the End they might not be Unprofitable Ones , that he gave them Talents to improve against his Return , that is , against the Day of Recompence ; for which they are accountable , that who improve their Talents may be rewarded , and they who make no improvement of their Talents , may be punisht with Eternal Separation from the Presence of God , and all his Holy Angels . I will conclude with these Five Observations : 1. That God ( though it be his Soveraign Prerogative , what he will give ) has given a Talent out of his Celestial Treasury unto every Man and Woman . 2. That this Talent is in it self Sufficient ; but as the best Corn , so this Talent , put up into a Napkin , must needs be Unprofitable ; yet , that the Fault is in the Party Neglecting or Hiding of it , not in it self . 3. That those who improve not their Talent , are most apt to charge God with Reaping where he Sows not , as do those Professors we have to do with ; who make God to require an Account of all , and yet deny , in order to rendring up this Account with Joy , that he has given all a Talent Sufficient thereunto . 4. That the Eternal Estate of Men and Women , as Sheep and Goats , purely depends upon their Improving , or not Improving of that Heavenly Talent wherewith God has indu'd them . Lastly , Neither is there any Shelter for these Parsimonious Men , or their Hide-bound Faith , under the Inequality of the Number of the Talents ; for it is not , how many Talents are given , but what Improvement is made of what is given : Wherefore greater is his Reward , who makes one Talent Three , then his who of Ten , advances but to Fifteen ; since the one makes but Half , whilst the other makes Treble Improvement . Blessed therefore are you all , and will you assuredly be in the Day of the Lord's Recompence , who disregarding the Vanities , Pleasures , Cares and Fleshly Religions of the World , diligently mind your own Talent , and are in the Pure Wisdom and Holy Counsel of the Lord , making your daily Improvement of the same , laying up Treasure in the High and Heavenly Place , that is Durable and Everlasting . V. This reasonable Truth is yet further manifest , from the weighty Words of our Lord Jesus Christ ; For every one that doth Evil hateth the Light , neither comes to the Light , lest his Deeds should be reproved : To which I would add that of the Apostle , Whatsoever is reproved is made manifest by the Light. Certainly then , unless Men will be so Unjust to God , as to think ( contrary to Scripture and Reason ) He should let Millions of Men , and Scores of Generations live in Sin , without a Light to shew it them , or a Law to limit them ; it must be yielded , that they had Light and Law in their Hearts and Consciences , by which they were Convicted of Sin ; and such , as obey'd it , led to work Righteousness , since their Refusing to bring their Deeds to the Light , was not an Act of Ignorance , but Design ; because they knew their Deeds would be Condemn'd , and they for them ; which loudly asserts , that they both had a Light , and knew they had it , though they Rebell'd against it . And if I should grant , that whatever was reproveable , was not made manifest unto them ; yet this will no wayes hinder the Capacity of the Light to do it . 'T is evident , That some things which the Gentiles did , were reprov'd , therefore they had the Light : And if they had it not in all the Extent of its Revelation , the Light was no more to be blamed , then that Guide , whose Passengers therefore could not arrive at their Journey 's End , because they never would begin , at least proceed . Had the Heathens been Faithful to what they had of God in themselves , and not been blinded by the Vain Idolatries and Superstitious Traditions of their Fathers , they had more fully known and learn'd the Mind and Will of their Creator ; which some of those Gentiles notwithstanding did , as will yet further appear . VI. Thus the Apostle Paul teaches us to believe , in that remarkable Passage of his in the first Chapter to the Romans : For I am not Asham'd of the Gospel of Christ : For it is the , Power of God unto Salvation , to every one that believeth , to the Jew first , and also to the Greek . For therein is the Righteousness of God reveal'd from Heaven against all Ungodliness and Unrighteousness of Men , who hold the Truth in Unrighteousness . Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them , for God hath shewed it unto them . For the Invisible Things of Him from the Creation of the World are clearly seen , being understood by the Things that are made , even his Eternal Power and God-head , so that they are without Excuse ; because that when they knew God , they Glorified him not as God , neither were Thankful ; but became Vain in their Imaginations , and their Foolish Hearts were Darken'd . And even as they did not like to Retain God in their Knowledge , God gave them over to a Reprobate Mind , to do those things which are not Convenient . These Notable Lines of that Great Apostle , give an apparent Overthrow to all Objections against , either the Universality or Sufficiency of the Light within ; which will be further manifest , if the Reader be but pleas'd to observe these few Particulars . ( 1. ) That in the Gospel of Christ is the Righteousness of God revealed , and that from Faith to Faith. ( 2. ) That this Faith the Just have ever lived by , for he quotes a Time past , as it is written , which Writing was about 700. Years before he wrot that Epistle . ( 3. ) That many had degenerated from the Righteousness of God , to wit , the Gentiles , into Ungodliness , against which the Wrath of God was revealed from Heaven . ( 4. ) That they however , once knew the Truth . ( 5. ) That they came to the Knowledge of this Truth from the Manifestation of God ( who is Light ) within ; since what might be known of God was manifested in them , because God had shewed it unto them . ( 6. ) That the Cause of their after Darkness , was their Rebelling against that Manifestation or Light , not Glorifying the God that shewed it to them , when they both saw it , and knew him so to do . Consequently , that God had given them Light Sufficient , both to know and obey him . And since they liked not to retain God in their Knowledge , the Deficiency was theirs , and not the Light 's . ( 7. ) If therefore their foolish Hearts were darkned , that is , by Disobedience , it follows , that therefore that Darkness came by Sin into their Hearts , they had Light in their Hearts , or a Light within . 8 ) Lastly , If the Wrath was therefore revealed , because the hold the Truth in Unrighteousness , and when they knew God by that Manifestation of Light within , they glorified him not as God , but became vain in their Imaginations , and their foolish Hearts darkned ; Then certainly , had they kept to that Principle , call'd the Truth , and the Manifestation of God within , and preserv'd their Faith in God , as he had reveal'd himself to them ; So glorifying him as God , and delighting to retain him in their knowledge ; Not Wrath , but Mercy ●…nd Peace had been revealed from Heaven , as saith the same Apostle in his following Chapter , to them , who by patient continuance in well doing , seek for Glory and Honour and Immortality , ETERNAL LIFE . In short ; This we may safely conclude , that the Righteousness 〈◊〉 ( in the Gospel of Christ , of which Paul was not ashamed ) from Faith to Faith , by which Faith , he 〈◊〉 the Just Ancients lived , or were accepted , is One in N●…ture , though not in Degree with that TRUTH the Gentiles Apstatized from , and therefore lived without Faith , Righteousness or God in the World ; for which the Wrath was reveal●…d ; which had they lived up unto , glorifying God , as God , ●…ccording to the Manifestation of himself in their Hearts and Consciences , they would have had , not the Revelation of Wrath , but of the Righteousness of Faith , by which the Just in all Ages have liv'd ●…cceptably with God : For without Faith can no Man please God , in any Age ; as without Holiness ( that flows from true Faith ) to Man shall ever see the Lord. VII . And Lastly , I do earnestly intreat the Unprejudic'd Reader , to observe these two notable Passages , which with my Consideration of them , shall conclude the Scripture-Proofs I have urg'd for the Universality of the Light , and Spirit of God , antecedent to Christ's Appearance in the Flesh. Then Peter opened his Mouth , and said , Of a Truth , I perceive that God is no Respecter of Persons , but in every Nation , He that feareth him , and worketh Righteousness is accepted with him . For not the Hearers of the Law are Just before God , but the Doers of the Law shall be justified : For when the Gentiles which have not the Law , do by Nature the things contained in the Law , these having not the Law , are a Law unto themselves , which shew the Works of the Law written in their Hearts , their Consciences also bearing Witness , and their Thoughts the mean while Accusing or Excusing one another , in the Day when God shall judge the Secrets of Men by Jesus Ch●…ist , according to my Gospel . These Scriptures are a severe Check to our Adversaries undervaluing Apprehension of the blessed Light of God , and that will appear in several particulars . 1. God is no Respecter of Persons in any Nation ; from whence I honestly conclude , that all Persons and Nations were inlightned , as well Gentiles as Jews . 2. That here are Men ( not of the Circumcision made with hands ) who fear God , work Righteousness , and are Doers of the Law , not from any outward Obligation ( ●…or they had none ) but the inward Work of the Law writ upon 〈◊〉 Hearts ; which is a Demonstration , that they had not only 〈◊〉 Light as a Reprover , but as a Teacher and Leader , whereby th●…y came to fear God , and work Righteousness , which is else-where said to be the Sum of the Matter , and whole Duty of Man : 〈◊〉 then no 〈◊〉 that fears God , works Righteousness , and keeps the 〈◊〉 Law of God , as the Scriptures testifie some Gentiles to h●…ve done , can be said to do so , and yet worship false Gods , or not ri●…htly Worship the true one , be void of the true Light , the most part of T. Hicks his 9th page , where he objects the 〈◊〉 Ignorance of the true God , against the Sufficiency of the Light within , and a Challenge to us to produce one Instance amon●… the many Thousands of Mankind that from the Light within , hath been reproved for not believing Jesus to be Christ , 〈◊〉 as the smoak ; For though perhaps he thinks , he may have done a great deal , in making that bold Demand of 〈◊〉 , yet I shall briefly tell him , that such as lived up most sincerely to the Light in their own Consciences , acknowledged most readily , that glorious Appearance of Light in ●…hat Body then in the World. They were the great Pretenders to Scriptures , that would not come to Christ , the Traditional , Literal and Ordinance-Men that Rejected and Crucified him ; and that had not both , Cornelius and the Centurion , with many others , been upright Livers to the Light within , neither 〈◊〉 Peter been so received by the one , nor Christ so follow'd by the other . But that measure of the Divine Light , which they had thitherto obey'd , as the more sure Word of Prophecy , lead them naturally , unto the Rising of the Day-Star , which , though a more glorious manifestation , yet not of another Light , Life , or Spirit , then had ever been ; for there are not two Lights , Lifes , Natures or Spirits in God , he is ONE for ever in himself , and his Light one in kind , how ever variously he may have declar'd himself or manifested it at sundry times of the World ; His Truth is one , his Way is one , and his Rest one forever . But last of all , that which greatly joyes , is this , that the Narrowness of some Mens Spirits in this World , will not be found able to exclude vertuous Gentiles from their Reward in the other : But maugre all the Heat , Petulancy , Conceitedness , and Fleshly Boasting of Carnal Christians ; such as fear God , and Work Righteousness , and are Doers of the Law , we are assured , shall be accepted with , and justified of God , in the Day that he will judge the Secrets of all men by Jesus Christ , according to Paul ' s Gospel ; and if any man bring another , let It be accurst ; Amen . I have here on purpose overlookt many very pregnant Instances both in the Old and New Testament ( so call'd ) for Brevities sake , in which the Righteousness of the Gentiles hath in several Cases more evidently appeared , then that of some of the Jews , and which undeniably testifies to the Sufficiency of that Light , they had , both to manifest that which was Good , from that which was Evil , and give an Ability to such as truly minded its Illumination , whereby they were enabled to do the one , and to reject the other . Such were Abimelech , Cyrus , Darius , the Ruler that came to Christ , and many others , which I shall omit to mention more particularly ; the chief Bent of my Mind being , to demonstrate the Truth of my Assertion , from their own Writings . CHAP. X. That the Gentiles Believed in One God. That He inlightned All Men with a Saving Light. That Men ought to live Piously . That the Soul is Immortal . That there is an Eternal Recompence . The Whole call'd Gentile-Divinity . The First Point prov'd by Sixteen Testimonies . HAving prov'd briefly , but truly from the Scriptures , that the Gentiles in general , were Illuminated with a Divine Light ; I shall now make it my Business , to evidence the Truth thereof by most undeniable , particular Instances , out of their own Writings . And because I am willing , my Defence of both , the Light within , and Those of them , who obey'd it , should turn to the clearest and best Account , I will endeavour to resolve the Whole into as plain a Method , as the Matter , and their Way of delivering it will allow me . First then , from their own Authorities , I am taught to affirm , that the Gentiles Believed in One , Holy , Infinite and Eternal God. Secondly , That they did therefore so believe , because God had imprinted the Knowledge of himself in their Hearts ; or in our Language , that he had Illuminated all Mankind with a Divine Light which , as conversed with , and obey'd , would lead to Eternal Happiness . Thirdly , That they held , and practised high Sanctity of Life . Fourthly , That they affirmed an Immortality of Souls , and Eternal Rewards of Felicity , or Misery , according to Man's Obedience to , or Rebellion against the Eternal God his Creator : which Excellent Principles , true and clear , being the Result of their Discourse , on those Subjects , do worthily deserve , in my esteem , the Style of DIVINITY , which shall be the Denomination , I hope , I may without Offence bestow upon them in this Discourse . That the Gentiles did acknowledge and believe , There was but One Supream God , that made all things , who is Infinite , Almighty , Omni-present , Holy and Good forever : I shall produce some of those many Authorities that aver the same ; and accommodate it to such Scripture , as the Truth of them , as well as Practice of very Ancient Fathers will bear me out in . I. ORPHEUS , as Old , as more then One Thousand Two Hundred Years before Christ , thus expresseth his Belief of God : His Hand reaches to the End of the Sea , his Right-hand is everywhere , and the Earth is under his Feet . He is only One , begot of himself , and of Him alone are all things begot ; and God is the First and the Last . Hereby not only telling us , there was a God , but attributing that Almighty Power and Omni-presence , which show , he meant no Statuary Deity , but the God that made the Heavens and the Earth . II. HESIOD , Of all , which do not Dye , thou art King and Lord ; none can Contend with Thee concerning Thy Power . This Emphatically proves God to have been but One , and Omni-potent in their Belief . III. THALES , a very Ancient Greek Phylosopher , tells us ; That there is but One God , that he is Glorious forever and ever : And he openly confesseth , That he is called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , HE WHO KNOWS HEARTS . Thales being demanded what God was , That ( saith he ) which has NEITHER BEGINNING NOR END . Another asking , If a Man might do Ill , and conceal it from God ? How , ( saith he ) WHEN A MAN THAT THINKS IT , CANNOT . Men ought to believe , saith * Cicero , in his Name , that God sees all things . IV. SIBYLLA , There is One God , who alone is Infinite and without Beginning . — Again , Who can see with Fleshly Eyes the Heavenly , True and Immortal God , whose Seat is in the Highest of Heaven ? This Sibyll is Aged above Two Thousand Years . The Question implies her Faith ; that God was a Spirit , as Christ himself also testifies . V. PYTHAGORAS , a Modest , but Diligent and Retired Man , in his Search after Heavenly things , saith , That it is Man's Duty to believe of the Divinity , that it is , and that it is in such a manner , as to Mankind , that it overlooks them , and neglects them not ; for we have need of such a Government , as we ought not in any thing to Contradict ; such is that , which proceeds from the Divinity : For the Divinity is such , that to it doth of Right belong the Dominion of all . Again , God resembleth LIGHT and TRUTH . In another place , God himself inhabits the Lowest , and Highest , and the Middlemost ; there is no Being nor Place without God. God is One ; HE IS NOT ( as some conceive ) OUT OF THE WORLD , but entire within himself , as in a Compleat Circle , surveying all Generations . HE IS THE SALT OF ALL AGES , the Agent of his own Powers , and Works ; the Principle of all things ; One Heavenly Luminary or Light , and Father of all things ; Only Wise , Invisible , yet Intelligible . Which very Pathetical Account of the Divine Being , so correspondent with Scripture ( yet he a Stranger to it ) I mean the Words only ; for the Matter in this Point , he weightily hits , deserves very Serious Consideration and Acknowledgment , from all , especially those who would not Narrow God's Mercies to their own Time or Party . VI. To the same purpose speaks HERACLITUS , that sensibly Afflicted Philosopher , for the World's Impieties and Idolatrics , whose very Sorrowful , yet sound & smart Expressions , show they came from a Mind deeply touch'd : In one of his Epistles to Hermodorus , his Friend , he thus seemeth after a while to address himself to Eutycles , and the rest of his Enemies , that Impeacht him for being an Enemy to their Stony Gods : Thus I shall be condemned of Impiety by the Impious . What thinkest thou ? Shall I seem Impious to them for Dissenting from their Gods ? If Blind Men were to Judge of Sight , they would say that Blindness were Sight : But O ye Ignorant Men , teach us first , what God is , that when ye declare us to be Impious , you may be believed . Where is God ? shut up in Temples ? O Pious Men ! ( he speaks Ironically , or by Contraries ) WHO PLACE GOD IN THE DARK . You Ignorant People ! KNOW YOU NOT THAT GOD IS NOT MADE WITH HANDS ? This is a most Clear , and Ample Testimony against their Idols , mixt with a Religious Derision ; yet qualified by a kind of Lamentation : Surely Heraclitus believed in God , yea , and that he was Light too , and such a one as should never set ; by whom he else-where says , He had overcome the Enemies of his Soul. VII . ANAXAGORAS , esteemed Noble by Birth , but more Noble for his Knowledge and Vertue , who was Master to Socrates , taught thus concerning God ; That God is an Infinite Selfmoving Mind ; that this Divine , Infinite Mind is the Efficient Cause of all things ; every thing beingmade according to its Species , by the Divine Mind ; who , when all things were confusedly mingled together , CAME AND REDUCED THEM TO ORDER . Which doubtless is so true , that Anaxagoras had no small Share of true Light , to give this Account , of both God and the Creation : And indeed , his Memory was Celebrated by the Greeks , for having very much improved that Discovery , they had concerning God and Immortality . VIII . SOCRATES , that Good Heathen ( if without Plat. phaed. Offence , to the Professors of Christianity , I may say it ) not only confesseth to ONE God , but I am of Opinion , they will think he gives good Reason why he doth so . He first layes down , That the Mind , which they frequently call God by , is the Disposer and Cause of all things . Or in other words of his thus , God To these Notable Arguments urged for the Proof of a Divine Super-intelligent Being , and his Creation and Providence , may well agree those Pathetical Expressions of Job , the Psalmist , and several Prophets , Evangelists and Apostles ; concerning , God's Creating the World , and upholding it to this day , his laying the Foundations thereof ; his Providence over the Lillies and the Sparrows ; his bringing forth Fruits in due season ; his Lights by Day , and by Night ; that the Disciples should take no Thought what they shall Eat , and Drink , or put on ; That there is a Spirit in Man , and the Inspiration of the Almighty gives Understanding ; and lastly , Can any hide himself in secret Places , and I not see him , saith the Lord , Jer. 23. 24 — No ; If I take the Wings of the Morning and flee to the uttermost Part of the Earth , thou art there , Psal. 139. 9. — And by me Kings Raign , and Princes Decree Justice , saith God , Prov. 8. 15 — And is every-where , Josh. 2. 11 — And orders all , Wisd. 11. 20. & 12. 15 — There is but One God , and none else besides him . Eph. 4. 6 — In the beginning God Created the Heaven and Earth , Gen. 1. 1 , 2 , 3 — In him we Live , Move , and have our Being , Acts 17. 21 — Thus he Sees and Hears all , and is Every-where , Psal. 34. 9 , 10 , 11. is ONE , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , PERFECT in Him-self , giving the Being and Well-being of every Creature . And this he giveth his Reasons for : * * Xen. memor . 1. That GOD , Not CHANCE , made the World and all Creatures , is Demonstrable , from the Reasonable Disposition of their Parts , as well for Use as Defence , from their Care to preserve themselves , and continue their Species ; that he particularly regards Man , in his Body from the Excellent Upright Form thereof , from the Gift of Speech ; from Allowance 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , in his Soul , from the Excellency thereof above others , both for Divinations , and Praedicting Dangers ; that he regards Particulars , from his Care of the whole Species ; that he will Reward such as Please him , and Punish such as Displease him , from his Power to do it , AND FROM THE BELIEF HE HATH IMPRINTED IN A MAN , THAT HE WILL DO IT ; professed by the most Wise and Civilized Cities and Ages . THAT HE AT ONCE SEETH ALL THINGS , from the Instances of his Eye , which at once over-runs many Miles ; and of the Mind , which at once considereth things done in the most distant Places . * * Id. eod . That God knoweth all things , whether they be SAID , DONE , or SECRETLY DESIRED . * * Id. 4. That God takes Care of all Creatures is demonstrable from the Benefits he gives them , of Light , Water and Fire , Seasonable Production of Fruits of the Earth ; That he hath particular Care of Man , from the Nourishment of all Plants and Creatures for Man's Service , from their Subjection to Man , though they Exceeded him never so much in Strength ; from the Variety of Man's Sense , accommodated to the Variety of Objects , for Necessity , Use and Pleasure ; from Reason , whereby he discoursed , through Reminiscence , from sensible Objects from Speech , whereby he communicates all that he knows , gives Laws and governs States . That God , notwithstanding he is Invisible , hath a Being from the Instances of his Ministers invisible also , as Thunder and Wind ; AND FROM THE SOUL OF MAN , WHICH HATH SOMETHING WITH , OR PARTAKES OF THE DIVINE NATURE , in Governing those that cannot see it . Finally , THAT HE IS SUCH , AND SO GREAT , AS THAT HE AT ONCE SEES ALL , HEARS ALL , IS EVERY-WHERE , AND ORDERS ALL. So that here is both Socrates his Faith in God , and his Reasons for it ; drawn from the outward Creation , and the inward Divine Sence , that from the Divine Instinct , or Nature , he receiv'd , in which he lived , and for which he willingly dy'd , as afterwards may be related . IX . TIMAEUS Locrus , in his Work of Nature , thus Argumentatively expresseth himself in ; One Principle of all , is Unbegotten ; for In the Beginning was the Word , and the Word was with God , & the Word was God , all things were made by him , &c. John 1. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 if it was Begotten , then were it no more that Principle , but that of which it were Begotten would be the Principle . Suitable to this saith CLEMENS ALEXANDRINUS , Clem. Alex. * * TIMAEUS affirms , namely , Hear , O Strom. L. 5. 2 King. 19. 19. — Mark 12. 32. — 1 Tim. 2. 5. Israel , the Lord thy God is One , and him only shalt thou Serve . Thus did he endeavour to Refute the Gentiles , and prove the Scriptures out of their own Writings . But again , That God is , and that he is a Spirit , De Anim. and that he is the AUTHOR Mund. God is a Spirit , John 4. 24. — God said , Let there be Light , and there was Light , Gen 1. 3 — He is the Father of Lights , Jam. 1. 17. of all Light. Which how Sober and True it is , let the Scriptures here inserted testifie . X. ANTISTHENES , one of Socrates's School , expressing himself , as it were , Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5 That thou mayst know , that there is none like Me in all the Earth , saith God , Exod. 9. 14. & 8. 10. — Who in Heaven can be Compared unto the Lord ? who among the Sons of the Mighty can be Likened unto the Lord ? Psal. 89. 6. by way of Paraphrase that Prophetick Saying ; Whom have ye likened me unto , saith the Lord ? thus speaks , He is like none , because no Man can know him from a Likeness or Image . By which we may perceive he did not believe him to be an Image , who could not be known by an Image , nor any thing that could be seen with Carnal Eyes : a Step beyond the Romanists , that teach the Knowledge of , as they darkly Fancy , by Images . XI . PLATO , also Schollar to Socrates , and whom the Greeks for his Heavenly Contemplation , and Pious Life , surnam'd , Divine , gives us his Faith of God in these words , God is FIRST , ETERNAL , I am the Alpha and the Omega , the First & the Last , Rev. 22. 13. Thou art the Everlasting God , Isa. 40 — The Way of the Lord is Perfect , Psal. 80 , 30. He is a Rock ; his Work is Perfect ; for all his Ways are Judgment ; A God of Truth , and without Iniquity , Just & Right is he , Deutr. 23. 4 — For I am the Lord , Isa. 45. 5 — I Change not , Mal. 3. 6. INEFFABLE PERFECT IN HIMSELF ; that is , needing none , and ever Perfect ; that is , absolute in all Times ; and every way perfect ; that is , absolute in every part , Divinity , Essence , Truth , Harmony , Good : Neither do we so name these , to distinguish one from the other , but rather by them all to understand one . He is said to be GOOD , because he bestows his Benefits upon all , according to their several Capacities , and so is the Cause of all Good ; FAIR , because he is in Essence , both More , Better and Equal ; TRUTH , because he is the Principle of all Truth , as the Sun is of all Light. Moreover , God not having many Parts , can neither be locally mov'd , nor alter'd by Qualities ; For if he be alter'd , it must be done by himself , or some other ; if by some other , that Other must be of greater Power then he ; if by Himself , it must be either to Better , or to Worse ; both which are Absurd . From all these it Follows , That God is Incorporeal ; and by all which it is evident , how True , and how Reasonable , and how Firm a Belief Plato had , of One Eternal Being and Father of all . XII . And Lyricus MELANIPPIDES , praying saith : Clem. Alex. Hear me , O Father , thou Wonder of Strom. L. 5. Exod. 1. 15 , 11. — Psalm . 136. 4 , 5 , 6. Men , who alwayes Covernest the Living Soul. This plainly preaches to us their Belief of One Eternal God. XIII . PARMENEDES Magnus , as saith Plato in Clem. Alex. Sophista writes concerning God , on Strom. L. 5. Thy Throne is establisht of Old , thou art from Everlasting , Psal. 93. 2. — Jehovah is Everlasting , Isa. 26. 4. this wise , He is not Begotten , neither is he lyable to any Death ; like a Chain , whose Links are Whole & Round , and alwayes Firm , and Void of a Beginning . What was this , but the Eternal God , by whom all things were made , the First and the Last . XIV . ZENO , a Grave and Wise Philosopher , who instituted the Way of the Stoicks , but not of Vertue ; both the Cynicks and Stoicks , mostly teaching such Doctrine as tended to good Life , may well be said to have been the Followers of Socrates , the ExcellentMan of his time , only they a little differed themselves by some particular Severities too Voluntary , which the Mild , Serious and Unaffected Piety of Socrates gave them no Encouragement to , though none of them trod in a more Self-denying Path , then History tells us , he walkt in . This Zeno and his Disciples , were Vigorous ●…sserters of One Infinite and Eternal God , as by their Doctrines may appear . Zeno tells us , That God is an Immortal Being , Rational , Laert. Perfect or Intellectual in Now to the King Eternal , Immortal , Invisible , the Only Wise God , be Honour and Glory forever , 1 Tim. 1. 17. — The Rich and Poor meet together , the Lord is the Maker of them all , Pro. 22. 2. Come now let us Reason together , saith the Lord , Isa. 1. 18. — Be ye Holy , for I the Lord your God am Holy , Levit. 11. 44. — One God and Father of all , of whom are all things , Ephes. 4. 6. 1 Cor. 8. 16. — Who is a God like Aristot. de Xen. unto thee ? Exod. 15. 4. — The Almighty is Excellent in Power , Job 37. 23. — And his Kingdom rules over all Psal. 103. 19. Beatitude , void of all Evil , provident over the World , and things in the World ; Not of Humane Form , MAKER OF ALL , AS IT WERE , FATHER OF ALL. Again , God , and the Power of God , is such , as that it governs , but is not governed : It governeth all things ; so that if there were any thing more Excellent , He could not possibly be God. This was Zeno's Faith of God , which I cannot believe , that Tho. Hicks himself has so far abandon'd all Reason , as to censure for False , or Idolatrous , that he Taught It as well as Thought It. Let us hear some of his Followers , XV. CHRYSIPPUS , also avers , as his Belief of a Laert. de Ira Dei c. 10. God , that the World was made by him ; consequently he believed there was one : For if Lord , thou art God , which hast made Heaven and Earth , and all that in them is , Acts 4. 24. God that made the World , Psal. 90. 2. — All Nations are unto God , but as a Drop to the Bucket , and the Dust to the Ballance . Isa. 40. 11 , 15. ( saith he ) there be any thing which can procr●…ate such Beings as Man indued with Reason is unable to produce , that ( doubtless ) must needs be Stronger , and Greater , and Wiser then Man ; but a Man cannot make the Celestial things , therefore that which made them transcended Man , in Art , Counsel , Prudence and Power ; And what can that be but GOD ? Thus far Chrysippus , the Stoick , in reference to God. But again , XVI . ANTIPATER , a Famous , Serious and Accute Stoick , in his Discourse of God and the World , declares Plut. himself to us after this manner : Plat. phaed. God is a Spirit , John Antip. de Mund. l. 7. 4. 24. — In whom are hid all the Treasures of Wisdom & Knowledg , Col. 2..8 — Of the Incorruptible God , Rom. 1. 23. The Lord is Good to all , and his tender Mercies are over all his Works , Psal. 85. 9. — God is not far away from every one of us , Acts 17. 27. We understand by that which we call God , A SPIRIT , full of INTELLIGENCE or WISDOM , a Living Nature , or DIVINE SUBSTANCE , Blessed and INCORRUPTIBLE , doing good to Mankind , PRESENT THROUGH THE WHOLE WORLD ; receiving several Denominations from the DIVERSITY OF HIS APPEARANCES , and the various Operations and Effects of his Divine Power shewn therein . Which kind of Evangelical Definition may very rightly induce us to believe him , to have been at least of those who knew God ; but we hope , not of those , who when they knew him , Glorified him not as God. Indeed , what we have hitherto produc'd of them all , may worthily be accounted DIVINITY ; and not the worse for being Gentiles , since God is also therein to be Admired ; so Forceable , so True , and so Conspicuous are their Assertions , and their Reasons for them ; that who will yet believe , there was not a Measure of the Eternal Fulness of all Divine Light shining in the Hearts of these Heathens , to give them the Knowledge of the Glory of the Only True and Invisible God ; must not think it strange , if upon their own Principle of Incredulity , after all their Protestations for , and Professions of the Christian-Religion , any should believe them to be very Mahometans or Infidels ; and that they are over-cast with the darkest Clouds of Envy and Uncharitableness : For my part , I am of the mind , that many Thousands of Christians , at least so reputed ( I mean not of the Rabble neither ) believe not God so clearly , nor are able to give better Reasons for what they do believe of him , then these exhibited in this first part of the Gentile-Divinity . Thus much concerning God , with respect to Himself , his Creation and Providence . CHAP. XI . The Second Fundamental of Gentile . Divinity , viz. That God hath Imprinted the Knowledge of Himself on the Mind of all Mankind . Proved from Twelve Pregnant Testimonies , as well of whole Societies , as particular Persons . Compared with Scripture . IT will be now requisit , that I give an Account of their Belief in God , with respect to that Discovery he is pleased to give of himself unto Mankind , how , and where ; which amounts to what is laid down in my Second Assertion . viz. That God Imprinteth the Knowledge of Himself in the Mind of Mankind ; or , that God's Way of Manifesting Himself to Mankind , is by Enlightning the Soul with his own Divine Light , which Obey'd , leads to Blessedness . That this was their Doctrine , and the Ground of the Knowledge they had of God , be pleased to weigh these their following very plain , yet very weighty Expressions . I. The Mind , saith PYTHAGORAS and his Disciples , onely seeth the ETERNAL GOD , the Ruler and Father of all things . — What greater Pleasure then to behold the Serene Aspect of God ? — What things are agreable to God , cannot be known UNLESS A MAN HEAR GOD HIMSELF . They mutually exhorted one another , not to Divide asunder the * GOD THAT WAS IN THEM ; for that it ought to be their Care , to Preserve their Union with God , and one with another . — Again , saith * Timaeus , one of the Exactest of that School ; The most Excellent Thing the Soul is Awaken'd to , is her Guide , or Good Cenius ( that is , a Measure of the Divine Light and Spirit ) but if she be Rebellious to it , it will prove her Daemon , or Tormentor . But having overcome these things , saith Pythagoras , ( to wit , Evils ) thou shalt know 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the Co-habitation or Dwelling together of the IMMORTAL GOD AND MORTAL MEN ; whose Work is Life ; the Work of God is Immortality , Eternal Life . Thus far the Pythagoreans , and certainly far enough to prove the Assertion ; for next to Hearing and Seeing God himself , his Dwelling in , and Tabernacling with Men , what is there of greater Spiritual Intimacy or Union ? O the Folly and great Uncharitableness of those Professors ! that exclude both such Men , and such Knowledge the Kingdom of God , because it is not deliver'd in absolute Scripture-Phraise , whilst it imports much of the very Substance of them , as to Divine Vision , Union with God , and Eternal Life . But to go on . II. HIERON , that Ancient Philosopher , intituled the Universal Light shining in the Conscience , which witnessed , by its Reproof , against Evil ; and if obey'd , led to Immortality , A DOMESTICK GOD , or GOD WITHIN the Hearts and Souls of Men. The Eternal Mind is God , MANIFESTING HIMSELF IN EVERY PARTICULAR OF US . God is that which in Mortal Men gives them to Know aright concerning God. Certainly these Gentiles had an high Veneration for that Light which manifested Darkness , who made it their Rule , their Guide , their Domestick God ; they set him not at a Distance without them ; but believed in him as God , the WORD ; speaking to them in their own Consciences . In which respect the Minor Poets notably express'd themselves . III. BYAS , Prince of his Country Pireen , being invaded by Enemies , and several of the Inhabitants put to flight , with their greatest Wealth ; and He being asked , Why he also carried not his Choisest Goods with him , he answered , I do carry MY GOODS with me . HE BORE THEM ( saith Valerius Maximus ) IN HIS BREAST , not to be seen by the Eye , but prized by the Soul , inclosed in the narrow Dwelling of the Mind , not to be Demolisht by Mortal Hands ; WHICH IS ALWAYS PRESENT WITH THOSE WHO STAY , and NEVER DESERTETH OR FORSAKETH THOSE THAT FLEE . Certainly then , they thought this Divine Principle the greatest Treasure , the surest Companion , the best Comforter and only Sanctuary of the Soul in greatest Extremities , induing it with Piety and Patience , and as what gave that Contentment , which was able to wade through the deepest Calamities . IV. SOPHOCLES is also of that Number , that bears Testimony to Divine Illumination . God grant ( saith he ) that I may alwayes be so happy , as to observe that Venerable Sanctity in my Words and Deeds , which is commanded by these NOBLE LAWS ( speaking of the Laws written in Men's Consciences ) which were made in Heaven ; GOD IS THEIR FATHER , NOT MORTAL NATURE , neither shall they ever be Forgotten or ABROGATED : for there is in them a Great God , that never waxeth Old. This is ( saith he again ) with respect to Man's Conscience , a Divine , a Sacred Good , God the Overseer . Certainly in themselves , very Seraphick Epithites , fraited with strong Faith of a God , and that Way of Inward Discovery , he is pleased to make of himself to Mankind . For it was he that said , Truly there is but One Onely God , who made the Heavens and the Earth . V. It is frequently said of SOCRATES , He had the Guide of his Life Within him ( which , it was told his Father Sophroniscus , should be of more Worth to him then 500. Masters ) he call'd it , His Good Angel or Spirit : that it suggested to his Mind , what was Good & Vertuous , inclin'd & dispos'd him to a Strict and Pious Life ; that it furnisht him with Divine Knowledge , and very often impuls'd or MOVED HIM TO PREACH ( THOUGH IN THE STEETS ) TO THE PEOPLE ; sometimes , in a way of Severe Reproof ; at other times , to Information ; and otherwise , gently to diswade them from Intemperance , Vanity of Life , particularly , from seeing of Playes , and to exhort them to Repentance , Reformation , and Self-Denyal , in hopes of Immortality . VI. PLATO * is not wanting to bring in his Vote , for further Confirmation of our Assertion , on the Behalf of the Gentiles : The Light and Spirit of God , saith he , are as WINGS TO THE SOUL , or as that which raiseth up the Soul into a Sensible Communion with God above the World , which the Mind of Man is prone to slug or bemire it self withal . And adds * PLOTIN , a Famous Platonist , God is the very Root or Life of the Soul. Again , Man hath a Divine Principle in him , which maketh the true and good Man. And the Platonists in general , held Three Principles to be in Man ; the first , they called , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , Mind , Intellect , Spirit , or Divine Light. The Second , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the Soul of Man. The Third they called , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the Soul's Image , which , say they , is her vital Energy upon the Body , and the Feminine Faculty of the Soul. By all which it is evident ( though I could more abundantly prove from their many Writings ) that they believ'd and held Divine Illumination and Inspiration , and that such a Principle resided in Man , even the Eternal 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , or Mind ; which is to say in proper English , God Himself , by which alone the Soul could become , what it ought to be to God. VII . CLEANTHES , the Stoick , alloweth not Mankind to be govern'd of right by the Dictates of their own Nature , which barely renders them Men , but by that Divine , Infinite and Eternal Nature , which is God , universally defus'd or sown through the whole Race of Man , as the most sure and infallible Guide and Rule . To live ( saith he ) according to this Knowledge and Direction , is truly to live according to Vertue ; not doing any thing that is forbidden . The Vertue and Happiness of a Man depends upon the close Correspondence of his Mind , with the Divine Will of him , who governeth the Universe . Again , saith the same Cleanthes , THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOD IS IMPRINTED UPON THE MINDS OF MEN. VIII . MENANDER , signifying God to be Good , saith , Every Man hath a good Daemon as soon as he is born , an Holy Instructor in governing of the Life ; as that I may confess him to be an Evil Daemon , who hurts the Life of a Good Man. Then subjoyns he , That a Good God is in all , that God is perfectly Good , and that he is Good in all . Again , on another Occasion saith he , God , who is alwayes near , sees this ; for God is not a God afar off . IX . PHILO , though a Jew born , yet a very Serious and Refin'd Philosopher , gives us his Judgment in this Particular very positively , and to purpose : How should the Soul of Man ( saith he ) know God , IF HE DID NOT INSPIRE HER , AND TAKE HOLD OF HER BY HIS DIVINE POWER ? Again , That the Divine Reason we have from God , is an Infallible Law , not a Mortal Rule given , by this or that Mortal ; NO LIFELESS PRECEPTS WRITTEN IN PAPERS , OR UPON PILLARS , BUT IMMORTAL , being ingraven by the Eternal Nature IN THE MINDS OF MEN. This is an undeniable Testimony to the Law written in the Heart , as a more Excellent Dispensation , then that which is written in Paper , or engraved on Pillars , But further , X. Nor is PLUTARCH wanting to the Proof of this Assertion , on the behalf of the Gentiles Divinity , who thus delivers himself , speaking of the Principle of God in the Conscience : It is a Law ( saith he ) not written in Tables or Books , but dwelling in the Mind , ALWAYS AS A LIVING RULE , which never permits the Soul to be destitute of an interiour Cuide . Again , To debase this Ancient Faith of Mankind , and Natural Belief , which is planted in all Reasonable Souls , is to Overthrow the Strong and Everlasting Foundation of Vertue . Doubtless very Peremptory , Zealous and Sensible , doth Plutarch show himself on the behalf of an Internal , Divine Principle . XI . But be pleased to hear what * EPICTETUS says in this Matter , whose Vertue was admirable in its time , and whose Memory is preserv'd in great Respect among many , who would think themselves much wrong'd , if they should not be accounted Christians . When you have shut your Gates ( saith he ) and made it all Dark Within ; that is to say , are retired to your own Dwelling , as alone , do not say that you are alone , for you are not alone , but GOD IS WITHIN : What need then is there of outward Light , to discover what is done , or to light to good Actions , who have God or that Genius , or Divine Principle for your Light , as the following words do further import . But above all the Gentiles that have been mention'd , I mean in Point of plain and Positive Expression ( for I will prefer the Life of none before that Self-denying Martyr Socrates ) let us hear with great Attention , what kind of Lecture SENEC A will read us upon the Subject handled ; truly something very weighty . XII . The Multitude ( saith SENECA ) is the worst Argument ; Let us inquire what is best to be done , not what most usually is done , and that may settle us in the Possession of Everlasting Happiness ; not what is allotted by the Vulgar , the worst Interpreters of Truth ; I have ( saith he ) a clearer and more certain Light , by which I may judge the Truth from Falshood , that which appertains to the Felicity of the Soul , the Eternal Mind will direct to ; that was the Light doubtless Seneca meant — * Again , It is a foolish thing for thee to wish what by thee cannot be obtained . God is near thee , and HE IS IN THEE . The Holy Spirit SITS OR RESIDES WITHIN US ; the Observer of our Good and Evil Actions ; as he is dealt with by us , HE DEALS WITH US — But yet further , we have this great Gift , saith Sene●… , * That Vertue ( meaning the Principle , or God ) hath sent her Light before into the Minds of all ; for even they that follow her not , SEE HER. Where observe , Reader , how he confesseth to the Universality of the Light ; yet lays the Fault of Rebellion against it , not ( as T. Hicks doth ) upon the Light , but such as refuse to follow it ; implying their voluntary Rejection of its Heavenly Discoveries . — * Again , Wonderest thou that Men go to God ? God comes UNTO Men ; nay , which is more near , he cometh INTO MAN ; and he makes the Heart of every good Man his Habitation . — Yet again hear him ; * Nothing is closed from God , he is within our Souls , and he Cometh INTO THE MIDST OF OUR THOUGHTS . — And lastly , * Every Man ( saith he ) has God indued with that , which if he forsake it not , HE SHALL ARISE LIKE GOD. How much more weighty , O Sober and Impartial Reader , are these inward Doctrines of the Vertuous Gentiles , then the Vehement Clamours , and Uncharitable Exclamations of Empty Christians against them . Men , that seem as if they were a●…raid of nothing more , then inherent Holiness , though of Christ's working ; reputing it a kind of Undervalue of his Blood , to feel the Only ( I mean the Inward ) Benefit of it : accounting us the greatest Hereticks , for assenting to the greatest Truth ; to wit , The Sufficiency of his Universal Light in the Hearts of Men to Salvation ; challenging us to prove it by Scripture , or any Credible History ; objecting the Heathens Ignorance and Idolatry against the Truth of its Discoveries and Efficacy of its Power . If we had not desended the Light 's Sufficiency from these Authorities , then our Assertion had been declared infirm ; with no small Shew of Triumph and Insult ; and now we have made good our Ground against their Objections , the next News I expect to hear from such as are Perverse among them , will be our Heathening , ●…r turning Heathens . But as all they could do , would not make us Christians , if Heathens ; so neither can their Prejudice ( being True-Spirited Christians ) render us in their Sense Heathens with Sober and Impartial Persons . CHAP. XII . That this was not only the Doctrine and Faith of the Gentiles , but the very Primitive Doctors or Fathers , both so held and so exprest themselves . Eight Testimonies produced for Proof thereof . BUt as I have hitherto made evidently appear , both that the Gentiles Believed in One God , and had a very clear Apprehension of the Light , or Divine Principle placed in Man , from whom all Heavenly Knowledge was to be derived ; and that this Divine Light , or Spirit , or Principle was by them asserted to be the most certain Guide , and infallible Rule of Faith and Practice : And further , that the Scriptures produced abundantly verifie their Doctrines , as that due Comparison of them will evidence ; so to the End these angry Men I have to do with , should not count it a Prophaning of holy Writ ; or think that I am the only Man , that ever had that favourable Apprehension of these Gentile-Doctrines ; I am willing to instance some of the most Primitive and Approved Fathers of the Christian-Church . And by a short view of what they believed in reference to the present Subject , with their way of phraising such Belief , we may the more clearly perceive , how far those Gentiles are by them Reprehensible , either with respect to their Soundness in Judgement , or Expression ; that if it be possible , we may remove all Pretence for Objection against the Universality and Sufficiency of this Blessed Light. I. JUSTINUS MARTYR , whom I therefore chuse to begin with , because from a Learned Philosopher , becoming an Honest Christian , and Constant Martyr ( from whence he was sirnamed , Martyr ) he could the better tell us the Difference of the Change : But so far was he from reputing the Principle of God within Men Hetrodox , or Inconsistent with the Purity of the Christian Religion , that with no small Earnestness , he therefore pleads against all Coercive Power upon Conscience , and the Pompous Worship of the Heathens , in their Temples ( as his Apologies will inform us ) because saith he , GOD HATH BUILT TO HIMSELF A NATURAL TEMPLE IN THE CONSCIENCES OF MEN , as the Place wherein he would be Worshipped ; and that there Men ought to look for his Appearance , and Reverence and Worship him ; or to that purpose . II. To this doth CLEMENS ALEXANDRINUS , that Earnest Contender against the Apostate Gentiles , plainly assent , who often , but more particularly in these few Places following , recommends to us the Light , or Word Within . It is the Voice of Truth ( saith he ) that Light will shine out of Darkness . Therefore doth it shine in the hidden Part of Mankind , that is , in the Heart ; and the Rayes of Knowledge break forth , making manifest , and shining upon the inward Man , which is hidden . — Christ's Intimates and Coheirs , are the Disciples of the Light , He further expresseth himself in another Place ; Man cannot be void of Divine Knowledge , who Naturally , or as he comes into the World , partaketh of Divine Inspiration ; as being of a more Pure Essence , or Nature , then any other Animals . And as assenting to the Doctrine of some Ancient Philosophers and other Heathen Authors ( for against the Gentiles of his time , I suppose , he may make use of no less then about Two Hundred and Fifty ) he doth very frequently attest , the Truth of the Doctrine of the Divine Light in Man , as Man's Concomitant , to all good Works ; as one Passage eminently proves . I earnestly exhort thee , because I would have thee saved , and that would Christ also , who offers thee Life in one Word : But thou mayst say , What is it ? IT IS THE WORD OF TRUTH , THE INCORRUPTIBLE WORD , WHICH REGENERATES MANKIND , AND LEADS HIM AGAIN TO TRUTH ; the Spur that pricketh on to Salvation , who expelleth the Destruction , chaseth away Death , and hath BUILT A TEMPLE IN MANKIND , THAT IT MAY PLACE GOD IN MAN. I know not any of the Ancients more profoundly read in the Doctrines of the Gentiles , then this Clemens Alexandrinus ; and who to prove the Verity of the Christian-Religion against them , doth numerously cite , and insert the Writings of the more Venerable Heathens , and with the very Books of their Admired Ancestors , doth he accutely argue the Unreasonableness of their Opposition to Christianity , the very top of Vertue , and Perfection of Goodness ; as did Christ , to prove himself the True Messiah , urge the Scriptures to those ( pretended ) great Believers in them , as an Aggravation of their Incredulity . III. TERTULLIAN , then whom there was not any I ever read more sharp against the Dissolute Gentiles of his time ( as his most quaint Apology for the Christians , and in it his severe Charge against their Enemies doth particularly assure us ) thinks it to be neither Heresie nor Heathenism , as it is commonly understood , to believe and assert , That a Life , subject to the Holy Guidings of the Universal Light in the Conscience , is a kind of Natural Christianity , or , to be Naturally a Christian. And though in his Apology he stabs , with the sharpest Points of Wit , Reason and Truth , the Cause of Degenerated Philosophy , or rather those that were unmeritedly called Philosophers ; yet he lays it still on the side of their great Apostacy from that Noble Principle , which worthily Renowned their Predecessors ; the Being of whose Stock , and Assuming whose Titles alone , they Vainly esteem'd Warrant enough , for their so great Pretensions to Real Science ; not unlike the Pharisees of the Jews , as hath already been observed . IV. ORIGEN , who I may say was twice a Christian ; first , by Education , and next , by Choyce ; a strong Defender of Christianity , as his notable Books against Celsus and others , do abundantly witness ; treating of that Divine Light , with which God has illuminated Mankind , as his Universal Endowment , calls it , AN IMMUTABLE LAW , WHICH WITH THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL , IS ENGRAVEN UPON THE HEART , AND GRAFTED INTO THE SOUL OF MAN. V. LACTANTIUS , Scholar to Arnobius , who writ smartly against the Apostate Gentiles , esteemed a good and acute Man , thus delivers himself about the Matter in hand : THE LAW OF GOD ( saith he ) is made known unto us , WHOSE LIGHT , like the STARS TO THE MARINER in the Night Season , clearly discovers to us THE PATH OF WISDOM : That Law is Pure and Unspotted Reason ( not inconsonant with , nor unintelligible by Nature ) DEFUSED THROUGH ALL THE WORLD ; in it self UNCHANGEABLE and ETERNAL ; which , that it may deter Man from Vice , doth faithfully by its INJUNCTIONS and PROHIBITIONS , DECLARE UNTO MAN HIS DUTY . — Again , The Way to ascend up to the House of Truth , IS TO BEHOLD WITHIN US , THAT THERE IS ONE MOST HIGH GOD , who made , and governs all things ; that Christ is God's Ambassadour and Builder , sent unto Men , and as they receive him INTO THEIR HEARTS , HE BUILDETH A DIVINE AND IMMORTAL TEMPLE IN THEM . VI. But let us deliberately read , what the so much admired ATHANASIUS says to the Gentiles , who did frequently cast out that ( Vulgar ) Objection to the Christians ; How know you that yours is the Right Way ? The Way , whereby to attain to the Knowledge of God , IS WITHIN US , which is proved from Moses ; who saith , THE WORD OF GOD IS WITHIN THY HEART ; and from this Saying of Christ , THE FAITH AND KINGDOM OF GOD IS WITHIN YOU . If then , says Athanasius , the KINGDGM OF GOD BE WITHIN US , likewise are we able to understand the WORD or VOICE OF THE FATHER . Which Solid , Ancient and Great Truth , could not but highly aggravate the Blame of such , as were Infidel to it ; because it was but the Doctrine of their Fam'd Philosophers more clearly and Scripturally exprest ; as it doth abundantly testifie to us , upon which Ground it was , the Primitive Christians believed , and practised their Religion . Not Tradition , however Holy ; but Sound Internal Conviction and Revelation ; from no Words Without , BUT THE ETERNAL WORD OF GOD IN THE HEART ; the great Discoverer of the Will and Way of God to Men : He that knows this Word or Divine Principle to raign in his Heart , knoweth the Kingdom of God come there , and his Will done , even the Sanctification of the Soul. VII . CHRYSOSTOME also , is not wanting to ascribe some Honour to this Holy Light , we contend for ; who not only confesseth the Light mention'd in the first of John , to be Christ , the Word-God , who inlightneth all Mankind coming into the World , but also avers it to be of a Saving Nature unto all who believe in it , and follow it ; wherefore , saith he , Let none blame the Light they are not Saved , but their own Rebellion , who refuse to be saved by it . This he very solemnly calls , A TEACHER OR INSTRUCTOR , DWELLING IN MAN's NATURE , or that no Man is without a Teacher , to Instruct , Inspire , Help and Assist him in what leads to Eternal Life I will conclude these Christian Testimonies with a Passage out of AUGUSTINE , not unsuitable to the Business in hand . VIII . AUGUSTINE , in his Discourse on John , has this very notable Passage , viz. THAT GOD IS PROPERLY KING OF MINDS OR SOULS , because when he is receiv'd in , he governeth by his Divine Power and Spirit in the Heart ; therefore is not his Kingdom after the Manner of this , World , BUT WITHIN ; and much to this purpose . Again he Distinguisheth upon the Word REASON ; There is a Superior and Inferior Reason , saith he , the Inferior is a meer Rational Creature , or that Understanding which distinguisheth a Man from a Beast ; but the Superior Reason is a LIGHT , or , as it were , a POWER in Mankind , DICTATING , REVEALING and INJOYNING DIVINE , ETERNAL and INTIRELY GOOD THINGS , as for Example , when it shall say , This is Sin , thou oughtest no to commit , but AVOID it ; Why ? Because it offends God. Thus far of Primitive Christian-Divinity , from about 132. years after Christ , to about 400. years after Christ ; by way of Confirmation , of that Part of the Gentile-Divinity , which might with least Credit be imbraced ; for to cite never so many Primitive Christian Authors , to prove a God , Holy Life , and the Immortality of the Soul , the other Points of Gentile-Divinity would look like Labour in vain , since none that believes them to have been Christians , ought to doubt of their holding these very things , which in a great measure character'd them such ; but that which is ( though it should not be ) the Wonder , is , to quote them in the Language of the so much , yet so undeservedly decri'd and abused Quakers , viz. That not only the best Gentiles , but most approved Christians of the Primitive Times , Confess to a Divine Light , Principle , Word or Spirit in Man , whose Inspiration gives infallible Understanding , and as Man is guided by it , he shall be Recovered out of that Mire , Sin has stuck him in , and it will Free him from the Snares of Pleasures , Inlighten his Eyes , Inspire his Soul , and Lead him gently by the hand in the Way of Eternal Righteousness ; whose Reward from God will be Immortality and Eternal Life . CHAP. XII . The Third Part of the Gentile-Divinity , viz. That they were Men of Vertuous Lives , and taught the Indispensibleness thereof to Life Eternal . Prov'd by Numerous Instances . IT may be now time , that I dispatch the other two Parts of the Gentile-Divinity , which I shall endeavour with all convenient Brevity . There are many Instances of their Pious Doctrine , and singular Examples of their Vertue ; I will instance in a few , to convince , if I can , such as scarcely believe any Good of them , ( and the rather ( I fear ) that they may not charge the Bad upon the Light ) that their Doctrines and Practice , with respect to Good Living , were , and are very Commendable and Approveable of all Good Christians . I. PITTACUS Mitilenaeus , one of the Seven Wise Men of Greece , as they were called , his Apophthegms were these : What thou tak'st Ill in thy Neighbonr , DO NOT THY SELF . — Reproach not the Unhappy ; for the Hand of GOD is on them . — Restore what is committed to thy Trust. — Bear with thy Neighbour . — LOVE THY NEIGHBOUR . — Reproach not * thy Friend , though he recede from thee a little . — Acquire Honesty ; Seek Obsequiousness ; Love Discipline , Temperance , Prudence , TRUTH , FAITH , Experience , Dexterity , Society , Diligence , Oeconomy and PIETY . II. CHILON , another of them , he was so Just in all his Actions , that in his old Age he professed , He never had done any thing contrary to the Conscience of an Upright Man , only that of one thing he was doubtful ; Having given Sentence against his Friend , according to Law , he advised his Friend to Appeal from him ( his Judge ) so to preserve both his Friend and the Law. Agellius relates it thus ; When his Lise drew towards an End , ready to be seized by Death , he spoke thus to his Friends about him : My Words and Actions in this Long Term of Years have been ( almost all ) such , as I need not Repent of , which perhaps you also know ; TRULY , EVEN AT THIS TIME I AM CERTAIN , I NEVER COMMITTED ANY THING , THE REMEMBRANCE WHEREOF BEGETS ANY TROUBLE IN ME , unless this one thing only , which , whether it were done amiss or not , I am uncertain : I sate with two others , as Judge upon the Life of my Friend ; the Law was such , as the Person must of necessity be condemned , so that either my Friend must lose his Life , or some Deceit be used towards the Law ; revolving many things in my Mind , for a Relief of a Condition so desperate , I conceived , that which I put in Practice , to be of all other the most easie to be born : Silently I Condemned him , and perswaded these others who judged to Absolve him : Thus preserved ( in so great a Business ) the Duty both of a Judge and Friend ; but from the Act I receive this * Trouble , that I fear it is not free from Perfidiousness and Guilt ; in the same Business , at the same time , and in a publique Affair , to PERSIVADE OTHERS , CONTRARY TO WHAT WAS IN MY OWN JUDGEMENT BEST . Of his Apophtegms , or Sayings , these few are delivered to us by Laertius . He said , Providence of Future Things collected by Reason , is the Vertue of a Man. Being demanded , wherein the Learned differ from the Unlearned ? he answered , In a Good Hope . What is hard ? To conceal Secrets , to dispose of Leisure well , and be able to bear an INJURY ; therefore said Chilon to his Brother , I CAN BEAR INJURIES , THOU CANST NOT ; nor Tho. Hicks , I am sure , sor he is Angry where he sustains none ; HIS WATER HAS NOT WASHT HIM SO CLEAN , AS THE LIGHT DID CHILON . III. The Precepts of the Seven Sophists of Greece , in general ; THALES , SOLON , PERIANDER , CLEOBULUS , CHILON , BIAS , and PITTACUS ( called seven Wise Men ) collected by Sosiades , about 2300. years old . FOLLOW GOD ; Obey the Law ; WORSHIP GOD ; Reverence thy Parents , Suffer for Justice ; Know thy self ; Consider Mortal things ; Respect Hospitality ; Command thy self ; Honour Providence ; USE NOT SWEARING ; Speak well of that which is Good ; * Disparage none ; Praise Vertue ; Do what is Just ; Abstain from Evil ; Instruct thy Children ; Fear Deceit ; Be a Lover of Wisdom ; Judge according to Equity ; Curb thy * Tongue ; Examine without Corruption ; Do that whereof thou shalt not Repent ; When thou hast sin'd , be Penitent ; Confine thy Eye ; Perfect quickly ; Pursue what is profitable ; Be in Childhood Modest , in Youth Temperate , in Manhood Just , and in old Age Prudent ; THAT THOU MAYST DYE UNTROUBLED . Thus far the Wise Men , which were therefore so call'd , because of their Extraordinary Vertue , and truly deserved the Name of Christian , and Vertuous , more abundantly then they , who have it . IV. PYTHAGORAS very truly tells us , The Discourse of that Philosopher is Vain , by which no Passion of a Man is Healed . What serves the much Preaching of T. H. J. G. and J. B. then , who have not yet Cured themselves ? All which is determin'd to be done , should aim at , and tend to the Acknowledgment of the Deity . Endeavour not to Conceal thy Faults with Words , but to Amend them by Reproof . This is the Principle , ( saith Pythagoras ) and the whole Life of Men consists in this , THAT THEY FOLLOW GOD , and this is the Ground of Right Philosophy . Purity is acquir'd by Expiations , and by Refraining from Murder and Adultery , and ALL POLLUTION . We ought either to be Silent , or to speak things that are better then Silence . Temperance is the Strength of the Soul ; for it is the Light of the Soul , clear from Passion . It is better to Dye , then to cloud the Soul by INTEMPERANCE . ●…ythagoras returns not Reproaches for Reproaches . Tho. Hicks and John Bunion Reproach , when they are not Reproached . Behold the Difference betwixt an Heathen , and two Scolding Christians , but therefore no True Christians . V. ANAXAGORAS held , That CONTEMPLATION OF GOD was the End of Li●…e , and that Liberty , which proceeds from such Heavenly Meditation To one who blam'd him for neglecting his Country ; WRONG ME NOT ( said he ) MY GREATEST CARE IS MY COUNTRY ; pointing to Heaven . Suidas saith , That he was cast into Prison by the Athenians , for Introducing a New Opinion concerning God , and Banisht the City , though Pericles undertook to plead his Cause . Josephus saith , That the Athenians believing the Sun to be God , which he affirm'd to be without Sense and Knowledge , he was by the Votes of a Few of them condemn'd to Death . However thus they writ upon his Grave , as Englisht by T. Stanley . Here lies , who through the truest Pathes did pass O' th World Celestial , ANAXAGORAS . Which was an high Testimony to his Good Life , and their Belief of his arriving at Immortality VI. SOCRATES , Right Philosophy is the Way to True Happiness ; the Offices whereof are two , To Contemplate God , and to Abstract the Soul from Corporeal Sense . To do Good is the best Course of Life . Vertue is the Beauty , Vice the Deformity of the Soul. Nobility is a good Temper of Soul and Body . The Best Way of Worshipping God is to Do what he Commands . An hard Saying to Professors . Our Prayers should be for Blessings in general ; for God knows best what is good for Us. GOD CONSIDERS INTEGRITY , NOT MUNIFICENCE . This judgeth Formal Christians , with their Exterior Worship . The Office of a Wise Man is , to discern what is Good and Honest , and to shun that which is Dishonest . They who know what they ought to do , and do it not , are not Wise and Temperate , but Fools and stupid . Of all things which Man can call his , the SOUL to be Chief ; and that HE ONLY IS TRULY HAPPY WHO PURIFIETH THAT FROM VICE . He taught every where , That a Just Man and a Happy Man were all one . He said , He wondred at those who carve Images of Stone , that they take such Care to make Stones resemble Men , whilst they neglect , and suffer themselves to resemble Stones . He meant , they had Stony Hearts , as the Prophet expresseth it . Being demanded , who live without Perturbation ? he answer'd , THEY WHO ARE CONSCIOUS TO THEMSELVES OF NO EVIL THING . Being demanded , whom he thought Richest ? he answer'd , Stob. 40. HE WHO IS CONTENTED WITH LEAST ; for Content is the Riches of Nature . Being demanded , what CONTINENCE is ? he answer'd , GOVERNMENT OF CORPORAL PLEASURES . Good Men must let the World see , THAT THEIR MANNERS ARE MORE FIRM THEN AN OATH . Then there is a State of Integrity above Swearing , that by the Light Socrates had , he preferred before Swearing , as I may again observe . But to proceed , let us hear the Charge of his Enemies , and his Defence . Melitus , Son of Melitus , a Pythian , accused Socrates , Son of Sophroniscus , an Alopecian : Socrates violateth the Law , not believing the Acities which this City believeth ; BUT INTRODUCING ANOTHER GOD. HE VIOLATES THE LAW LIKEWISE IN CORRUPTING YOUTH ; THE PUNISHMENT , DEATH . The Charge is the same to this day ; Good Men are made Offenders for a Word . Soon after Anytus ( who caused that Bill to be preferred by Melitus , in that Socrates industriously assay'd his Overthrow , and the Rest of his Comical Associates ; for they were Comedians ) sent privately to him , desiring him to forbear the mention of his Trade ; and assuring him , that he would thereupon withdraw his Action . But Socrates return'd him Answer , THAT HE WOULD NEVER FORBEAR SPEAKING TRUTH SO LONG AS HE LIVED ; That he would alwayes use the same Speeches concerning him ; That this Accusation was not of Force enough , to make him refrain from speaking those things , which he thought himself before oblieg'd to say . Again observe his Resolution . It is likely , God in his Love to me , hath ordain'd , that I should Dye in the most convenient Age , and by the Gentlest Means ; for , if I dye by Sentence , I am allowed the Benefit of the most easie kind of Death ; I shall give my Friends the least Trouble : Further , If , when I give an Account of my Actions towards God and Men , the Judges think fit to condemn me , I will rather chuse to Dye , then to beg of them a Life worse then Death . Yet that I dye unjustly , it will not trouble me , it is not a Reproach to me , but to those who condemned me ; I am much satisfied with the Example of Palamedes , who suffered Death in the like manner ; He is much more commended , then Ulysses the Procurer of his Death : I know , both future and past Times will witness , I NEVER HURT OR INJUR'D ANY , but on the contrary have Advantag'd all that conversed with me to my utmost Ability , communicating what Good I could gratis , and not for Gain . I think it most Unbeseeming a Philosopher to Sell his Advice , and extreamly contrary to my Practice ; sor ever since by God's Command , I first enter'd into * Philosophy , I was never known to take any thing , but keep my Exercises in publick , for every one to hear that will ; I neither Lock the Door when I Teach , nor go abroad to the Multitude , and exact Money of the Hearers , as some heretosore have done , and some in our times yet do . Was not Socrates then beyond the Priests of our Day , I mean as well some Creeping Non - Conformists , as any other , who make a Trade of it , and indeed it is their best . The Righteousness of this Heathen condemns their Mercenary Practice , who pretend to be Christian-Ministers ; and giveth Proof of an higher State , then they have yet attained . VII . ANTISTHENES , Institutor of the Cynicks , as they were called , and Scholar to Socrates , taught , That Vertue was the truest Nobility , that PIETY WAS ALONE NEEDFULL TO LASTING HAPPINESS . — That true Vertue stood not in Saying , but Doing that which was Good. — Not in much Learning , or many Words , but upright Actions . In short , that the Principle of Vertue is sufficient to what Wisdom is needful , and that all other things ought to have reference thereto . That PIETY IS THE BEST ARMOUR , and Vertuous Persons are alwayes Friends . That Vertue is an Armour , none can either pierce , or take from Good Men. He prefers a Just Man before his Neighbour , and good Women's Souls the same Priviledge to Vertue , with Men's . He accounted Pleasures one of the greatest Mischiefs in the World ; and being ask'd , what LEARNING was best ? he answer'd , That which Unlearns Men Evil ; for those , saith he , who would Live forever , must have a Care that their Lives be Holy and Just in this World. IX . From DIOGENES , his constant Scholar and Friend , take this one very true and notable Saying . Of Spiritual Exercitation Laertius makes him speak to this purpose , in his Account of his Doctrine : That where Men's Souls are deeply and frequently employ'd in that Spiritual Retirement , and waiting for Divine Strength ; and are often exercised in Meditation upon the Eternal Mind ; HOLY REVELATIONS OR ILLUMINATIONS WILL OCCUR , WHICH ENLIGHTEN THE SOUL , AND ENABLE IT , THE BETTER TO LIVE , AND ACT VERTUOUSLY . X. Nay , so greatly were the Piety and Wisdom of XENOCRATES reverenc'd at Athens , about Four Hundred Years besore Swear not at all , was spoken by our Lord Jesus , that the Judges of that Place would not offer to put Xenocrates upon his Oath in an high Matter of Evidence , in case he would have Sworn ; because they thought it an Affront to his Integrity , that his bare Word should not be prefer'd before all the Oaths of other Men ; Dispensing , says Valerius Maximus , with that to him , they would not have Excused in one another . Which is no small Proof , that the LIGHT among the Heathens , impeacht Oaths in Evidence of Imperfection , as being but only Supplemental , or in the Place of Remedies , against want of Honesty ; and obviously esteem'd it an higher , and more noble State , to arrive at the Integrity , which needs not the extraordinary and a frighting Obligation of an Oath , where meer Fear of the Curse , intail'd upon Perjury , and not an innate Faithfulness , most commonly extorts true Evidence ; which is a sufficient Answer to T. H. how , and by what LIGHT we could have aim'd at that Perfection , or have known that Doctrine , had not the Scriptures been . XI . The Chief Good therefore , said ZENO , is to square our Lives according to the Knowledge given us from the Eternal Being , when the Soul , entring into the Path of Vertue , walketh by the Steps and Guidance of right Reason , and followeth God. Which brings to my Remembrance these Stoical Maxims deliver'd by Laertius , Cicero , Quintilian , &c. and collected by T. S. for us ; charg'd upon Zeno , and his Disciples : some of which I had formerly an Occasion to mention in another Discourse . They are these : A Wise Man is void of Passion . ( Remember T. H. and J. B. unless you will renounce Patience , because an Heathen preferrs it ) — A Wise Man is Sincere . — A Wise Man is Divine ; for he hath God with himself : but a Wicked Man is an Atheist — The Wicked are contrary to the Good ; God , he is Good , so against God. — A Wise Man is Religious , he is Humble , He only is a Priest. — He only is a Prophet . — He Loves and Honours his Parents . — A Wise Man only is Free. — A Wise Man is void of Sin. Upon which I query , whether this amounts not to as much as what the Scriptures teach , and these here inserted tell you ; That the Fear of the Lord is the Beginning of Wisdom , and to depart from Iniquity a Good Understanding ? But further , to the same Purpose ; A Wise Man is Innocent . — A Wise Man is Free ; Wicked Men are Slaves . — Again , A Wise Man is only Perfect ; for he wanteth no Vertue ; a Wicked Man is Imperfect , for he hath no Vertue . Whereby it is evident , that the Wisdom they meant was Vertue , in Opposition to Vice , which they esteemed Folly , as doth the Scripture frequently ; as much as to say , those who are thus Good , are only Wise. Again , A Wise Man never Lyeth . — A Wise Man is Peaceable , Meek , Modest , Diligent , Vertuous , Constant , and only is Incitable to Vertue ; Fools are not . Where it is obvious , that by Fools they meant Wicked and Indocible People , who are Stiff-necked , Rebelling against God , not delighting to retain God in their Knowledge . XII . PLATO thus , To be like God , is to be HOLY , JUST and WISE , which is the End of Man's being born , and should be of his studying Philosophy ; that Vertue and Honesty are all one ; as saith Clemens Alexandrinus out of him . This , Reader , was the Doctrine ; this the Study ; and which is best of all , this was the Practice of many of the Vertuous Heathens ; who became a Law unto themselves , bounding their Appetites , whether Corporal or Mental , within the approved Limits of an Inward Holy Guide , like Careful Mariners , steering the Course of their Lives by the Direction of that Heavenly Star , which in the Gentile-Night rise in their Consciences , to guide them unto a Blessed Immortality ; which will be the Last Point of their Divinity , and then we close this Discourse with respect to them . CHAP. XIV . That the Last Point of Gentile-Divinity , to wit , Immortality and Eternal Rewards , is also very clearly and positively held forth by the Ancient Heathens . Six Testimonies from them , to prove it . Socrates's Great Faith in particular ; and the Lofty Strain of the Pythagoreans . THat the Gentiles believed there was an IMMORTALITY , and that all Men should hereafter be Accountable for the Deeds done in the Body ( a Point , but obscurely lay'd down , among the Jews themselves ) be pleased to take these few insuing Authorities , as a Proof of what is asserted . I. PYTHAGORAS , and the Pythagoreans , that they all held the Immortality of the Soul. Consider his and their Doctrine in the Point . First , he said , That the Soul is Immortal . Next , That the Soul is Incorruptible , it never Dyeth ; for when it goes out of the Body , it goes into the other World , THE PURE TO GOD , THE IMPURE BOUND BY FURIES IN INDISSOLVABLE CHAINS . Here IMMORTALITY and REWARDS are asserted . But when a Man , who has lived Justly , dyeth , his Soul ASCENDETH TO THE PURE AETHER ( or Heaven ) and lives in the Happy Aevum ( or Everlasting Age ) with the Blessed . II. * HERACLITUS , If my Body be over-press'd , it must descend to the destinate Place ; Nevertheless , MY SOUL SHALL NOT DESCEND , BUT BEING A THING IMMORTAL , SHALL FLY UP ON HIGH TO HEAVEN . III. EURIPIDES , a grave Tragedian , whose Work was to undo what Wanton Comedians had done to undo the People , speaks thus : Who knoweth , whether to Dye be not to Live , and to Live to Dye . Surely he said so not out of any Distrust of Immortality , but in Belief of it , and that Reward which would attend Good Men. IV. SOCRATES , The Body being Compounded , is Dissolved by Death ; The SOUL being Simple , PASSETH INTO ANOTHER LIFE INCAPABLE OF CORRUPTION . THE SOUL OF THE GOOD AFTER DEATH ARE IN A HAPPY ESTATE , UNITED TO GOD IN A BLESSED IN ACCESSIBLE PLACE ; THE BAD IN CONVENIENT PLACES SUFFER CONDIGN PUNISHMENT . This puts the Case , of the Sufficiency of the Light , to discover Immortality to the very Heathen , out of all doubt , and not only so , but Rewards too ; since we have them , here , believing , THE RIGHTEOUS SHALL BE SAVED , AND THE WICKED DAMNED . This made Socrates so chearful at his Death , something of which I think fit here to insert . Truly , did I not believe , I should go to the Just God , and to Men better then any Living , I were inexcusable ●…or contemning Death ; BUT I AM SURE TO GO TO GOD , A VERY GOOD MASTER , and hope to meet with Good Men ; AND AM OF GOOD COURAGE , hoping that SOMETHING OF MAN SUBSISTS AFTER DEATH ; AND THAT IT IS THEN MUCH BETTER WITH THE GOOD THEN WITH THE BAD . When he had made an end of Speaking , CRITO ( one of his Followers ) ask'd him , what Directions he would leave concerning his Sons , and other Affairs , and if they could do any thing that might be acceptable to him ? I desire no more ( saith he ) then what I have often told you , If you take Care of Your selves , whatsoever you do , will be acceptable to me and mine , though you promise nothing ; if you Neglect Your selves and VERTUE , you can do nothing acceptable to us , THOUGH YOU PROMISE NEVER SO MUCH . That , answer'd CRITO , we shall observe ; But how wilt thou be Buried ? As you think good ( saith he ) IF YOU CAN CATCH ME , and that I give you not the slip . Then with a Smile applying himself unto us , I cannot perswade CRITO ( saith he ) that I am any thing more then the Carkase you will anon behold ; and therefore he takes this Care ●…or my Enterment : It seems , that what even now I told him , that as soon as I have taken the Poyson , I SHALL GO TO THE JOYES OF THE BLESSED , hath been to little purpose ; He was my Bail , bound to the Judges ●…or my Appearance , you must now be SURETIES to him , that I am DEPARTED ; Let him not say , THAT SOCRATES IS CARRIED TO THE CRAVE , OR LAID UNDER GROUND ; for know , dear CRITO , such a Mistake WERE A WRONG TO MY SOUL ; be not dejected , Tell the World , MY BODY ONLY IS BURIED , and that after what manner thou pleasest . Yet ( saith SOCRATES ) I may pray to God , and will , That my Passage hence may be Happy , which I beseech him to grant ; and in the same instant drank it off easily , without any Disturbance . This ( saith Plato ) was the End of the Best , the Wisest , and most Just Men. A Story , which Cicero professeth he never read without Tears . This ends Socrates upon the present Subject ; and Happy Man was he , to make so happy an End , as to Dye for the only true God : he had great Reason to believe ( maugre the Envious Uncharitableness of T. H. ) that he would Reward him , when it shall be said to many Bawling pretended Christians , Depart from me ; I know you not : for as Men Sow , so shall they Reap in the Day of God. I need not to tell the World , that Plato , and other Heathens , have written accurately upon that Subject , when it is so Notorious : Wherefore to close up my Testimonies upon this Head , and whole Discourse of Gentile-Divinity , I will present the Reader with two short Passages , one of the Pythagoreans ; the other from Virgil , thus tran●…lated to my hand ( only a little varied ) by an Ingenious Author . V. Donec long a Dies perfecto temporis Orbe Concretam exemit Labem , purumque reliquit Aethereum Sensum , atque aur ai simplicis ignem . In English thus : Till that long Day at last be come about That wasted has all Filth and Foul Desire , And leaves the Soul CELESTIAL THROUGHOUT , Bathing her Senses in pure liquid Fire . To which agrees that Golden Distick of the Pythagoreans , as it hath been called . VI. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 To this purpose : Who after Death once reach the Heavenly Plain , BECOME LIKE GOD , and never Dye again . The Greek has it , as Immortal Gods. Which Hierocles interprets thus : Herein shall Good Men resemble the Deity , that they shall be Immortal , like God himself . Thus Reader , have I given thee a very true Account of the Gentile-Divinity , what was the Faith , what the Practice , and what the Prophecy and Hope of many Gentiles through this Light Within , each of which had numerous Followers . Observe , They began where Jews and Christians begin , that is , WITH GOD ; and they end with what they confess to be theirs , namely , a State of Immortality , in which every one is Rewarded according to their Works : Only they are thus far to be Commended before either of them , ( if we consider many of our Times ) That they were more Certain , Plain and True in their Acknowledgment of a Divine Light , Law , or Principle in Man , which obey'd , supply'd then with dayly Wisdom and Strength , and finally led to God : And also were more Just to their Faith , by a Life excelling theirs in Vertue and Self-Denyal . And certainly , in that Great and Terrible Day , when God will judge the Secrets of Men by Jesus Christ , according to Paul's Gospel , will such Pious Gentiles , who knowing God , they Glorified him as God , and Conscientiously did the Things contain'd in his Law , be finally Acquitted and Rewarded . CHAP. XV. That the Heathens had a Sight of the Coming of Christ. That , and not Swearing prove the Sufficiency of the Light. OVer and above what I promised , being rather willing to Err on that End , if yet it be Erring ; I shall briefly observe two things greatly importing our Defence of the Light , and the Satisfaction of our Adversaries , if it be true that they query to be satisfied . 1. That the Testimony of Socrates and Xenocrates about Swearing sufficiently prove to us , that by the Light they had , they saw a State above Swearing , or a Righteousness excelling that of the Legal Jews , which manifestly corresponds with what Christ said ; who above Four Hundred Years after them taught , as what Purely became the Evangelical Righteousness , SWEAR NOT AT ALL. 2. That though their Light did not tell them the express Names Christ should be called by , yet they Fore-saw and Prophesied of his Coming , and how he should come of a Virgin , and what both he was , and the Work he came to do ; which the Names given of the HOLY GHOST did strictly import or signifie . Neither is it the knowing so many Letters , Syllables , or Words that gives true Knowledge , or Salvation , but the Experiencing him to be that which he is , and wherefore he is so denominated : for to that End came He into the World. Christ signifies Anointed ; with respect to that peculiar Manifestation . Jesus a Saviour , for he should save his People from their Sins . Emanuel , which is to say , God with us , &c. that in this Sense he was Prophetically held forth by the 〈◊〉 through that Measure of Light they had : Hear Plato and Virgil. Marcil . Ficinus , who writ the Life of that Great Gentile , tells us among many other things , that , Being very seriously askt by some that visited him , as the last thing they had a Mind to be informed about , HOW LONG MEN SHOULD ATTEND TO HIS WRITINGS ? Of which he seem'd so cheery , Living and Dying in the Belief of what he recommended to the World , He solemnly answer'd ; TILL THAT MORE HOLY AND DIVINE PERSON SHALL APPEAR TO VISIT THE WORLD , WHOM ALL MEN OUGHT TO FOLLOW . At once , both believing such a one to appear , and then forbidding all to prefer that lesser Discovery he had given the World , through the Improvement of his Talent of Light , to that greater Manifestation , which that Divine Person would bring with him into the World ; as if he had said : Mine may help you with respect to that Knowledge which is your Duty in this Generation , and so direct to him that afterwards shall come ; but I am not He , neither do I believe this the most excellent Discovery that can be made : but as the lesser Light may point to the greater , and is at last swallow'd up of it ; so can I only point at him , and when he is come , all I have done must yield to him : for I declare , that all ought to follow him ; for , in following him , they will obtain Eternal Blessedness . Let us now see what Virgil will add to this Matter , as translated in Eusebius . Jam nova Progenies Coelo demittitur alto . Now is from Heaven high Descend'd a new Progeny . And in his Bucolicks : Sicelides Musae paulo majora canamus . Ye Muses , with a lofty Wing , Let us of higher Matters sing . And what be they ? Ultima Cumaei venit jam Carminis aetas . Who lives this Age , will clearly see , Cumea's Vers's accomplisht be . This Cumea ( so called of her City ) was a Sibyl , who liv'd about 600. Years before Christ , and prophesied of him . Virgil writ these Verses about Forty Years before Christ was born . I query if the Jews themselves had so positive a Sence of the Messiah's Coming . But to proceed . Magnus ab integro seclorum nascitur Ordo : Jam redit & Virgo , redeunt Saturnia Regna . Th' Integrity of Times shall now renew again , A VIRGIN also shall bring back old Saturn's Raign . This is a direct Prophecy of the Marvellous Conception , that he should be born of a Virgin , and the Good that would redound to the World thereby , as he further addeth . Tu modo nascenti Puero , quo ferrea primum Desinet , ac toto surget Gens aurea Mundo , Cast a fave Lucina — Hoc duce , si qua manent sceleris vestigia nostri , Irrita perpetua solvent formidine terras . The Birth of that most happy CHILD , by whom The Iron Age shall end , and Golden come , Chast Lucina favour — HE SHALL THE POWERS OF WICKEDNESS DESTROY , AND FREE THE WORLD FROM FEAR AND ALL ANNOY . Yet again : Ipsae lacte domum referent distenta Capellae Ubera : nec magnos metuent armenta Leones . The Goates shall bring their Udders Milk-fill'd home , And th' gentle Flocks great Lyons shall not shun . Yet further : Ipsa tibi blandos fundent cunabula flores , Occidet & Serpens , & fallax herba veneni Occidet : Assyrium vulgo nascetur amomum . Thy Cradle fairest Flowers shall send forth still , Which shall have Power , THE POYSONOUS HEARBS TO KILL , The SERPENT HE SHALL TO DESTRUCTION BRING , Assyrian Amomum shall each where spring . Hinc ubi jam firmata virum te fecerit aetas . When thou shalt attain at length To Years of Manhood and firm Strength . Now let any tell me , if this be not a most Pathetical Account of the Vertue and Power of Christ , and the very End of his coming into the World , as by a Comparison of it with Scriptures in the Margent will plainly appear . Et durae quer●…us sudabunt roscida mella . From the hard Oak there shall Sweet Hony sweat forth and fall . To Conclude , Cedet & ipse mari vector ; nec nautica pinus Mutabit merces : omnis feret omnia tellus . Non rastros patietur humus , non vinea falcem , Nec varios discet mentiri lana colores . Sponte sua sandix pascentes vestiet agnos . O mihi tam longe maneat pars ultima vitae , Spiritus & quantum sat erit , tua dicere facta ! The Sea shall then be quiet , no Ship shall range Abroad her Wares with others to exchange ; Then every Land shall every thing produce , And then to plow the Earth they shall not use : Vines by the Hook shall not be rectify'd , Nor Wool with divers Colours shall be dy'd ; Fair Fleeces voluntary shall proceed , And clothe the Lambs while they do gently feed . O might my Dayes be lengthned , so that I Might sing of thy great Deeds before I dye ! Thus , to say no more , though much more might be said , of this kind , have Heathens by the LIGHT , we have been hitherto defending , not only fore-told Christ's Appearance , but the very Work , for which he did come , and from whence he received those peculiar Names of Christ , Jesus , Emanuel , the Restorer of Breaches , Redeemer , Saviour , &c. So that I hope , our Adversaries will either disprove these Writings , or confess that the Light God gave to the Gentiles , they receiving it , was sufficient , and that by it they had some of them a Sight of Christ , with respect to the great Performance , for which he was so named . I have omitted any mention of those Sibylls , so much believed in by Justin Martyr , Tertullian , Clemens Alexandrinus , and abundance of the Ancients , for David Bloudell's sake , an accurate French-Man , who indeavours to prove the Books that go under their Name , to be an Imposture writ since Christ , by some affected to ●…hristianity , to promote it with the Gentiles ; and therefore no true Prophecyes of his Coming ; though he grants , Sibylls there were of old , and Excellent Things they wrote , but that they were burnt in the Capitol of Rome several Hundred Years before Christ came in the Flesh , and scattered Remnants onely extant , yet among them enough will be afforded , as Virgil from the Cumean already mention'd , whereby to prove the great Fore-sight some of the Gentiles had of Christ's being Conceived by the Holy Ghost , Born of a Virgin , and finally , Coming in the Flesh for the Salvation of the World : And which is more then any before Virgil had done ; the Time when ? namely , WITHIN THAT AGE , which was the Reign of Augustus Caesar , in the beginning of which Virgil wrote , and about the End of which Christ was Born. CHAP. XVI . It is granted that the Jew , and much more the Christian hath the Advantage of the Gentile . Yet that the Gentile had enough Salvation . BUt that I'may provide against both Ignorance and Malice : Let none unworthily infer from hence , that I prefer the State of Gentilism before the State of Christianity ; No , nor yet so much , as that I intend to equal it to that of the Jews , to whom pertained the Adoption , Glory , Covenant , and the giving of the Law , whose were the Fathers , and of whom Christ himself came after the Flesh , who is God ( the only God ) over all , Blessed forever , Amen . For this let all know , that far greater were the Priviledges that both Jew and Christian were blessed with , then those of the Ancient Gentiles . God gave the Jews what the Gentiles had , but he was not pleas'd to endow the Gentiles , with all that he freely bestowed upon the Jews : Yet that he gave them what was sufficient to Godliness is altogether as certain ; For the Difference lay not in the Root of the Matter , but only in some Extraordinary Helps , and several visible Services , Figurative of a further Glory . The Word nigh in the Heart ( of which Moses testified ) was not the only Priviledge of the Jew , but of the Gentile also . The Spirit of God strove as well against the Gentile as the Jewish Man ; And God himself declared their New Moons , Solemn Assemblies , Sabbaths , &c. to be an Abomination ; and bid them , cleanse themselves , and put away the Evil of their Doings ; and that they would make them a new Heart , and a new Spirit : intimating , that though he did attend their Childhood with many Helps that were wanting to other Nations , yet he required Fear , Purity and Righteousness , as the most essential thing of all other ; which , because it was required of the Gentiles as well as Jews , and that many Gentiles believed so , and accordingly lived , unto which , declaring they were inclined by that Spirit , which ( Job sayes ) is in Man , and that Inspiration of the Almighty which gives Understanding ; I cannot in Justice but conclude , they wanted not the Ground-work any more then did the Jews . So that the Sum of what I have been urging is but this ; and thus much it is , That though God was more Beneficent to the Jew ( especially to the Christian ) then the Gentile ; and consequently that as the Jew had those Assistances the Gentile had not , so the Christian-Dispensation is the Perfection of the Divine Light , Life and Immortality , more weakly seen , both by Jew and Gentile ; Yet also , That God did communicate to the Gentiles such a Measure of his Divine Light and Spirit , as diligently adhered to , and faithfully sollowed , was sufficient to their Salvation , from Sin here , and confequently from Wrath to come : And that they themselves did so Believe , Teach , Live and Dye , in perfect Hope and full Assurance of Eternal Recompence , in a State of Immortality . And though I will not be so strict in my Opinion of the best Gentiles , as to deny there might be some Self-Mixtures from Temper , Education , or otherwise ; yet I will also boldly affirm , that as the Light they had was sufficient in it self to their Salvation ( of which their Life and Doctrine are a notable Demonstration ) so they had some of them a glimmering Prospect and bold Belief of as high a State of Purity , Glory and Immortality , as Man's Nature is well capable of attaining to . Let thus much suffice ( whether T. Hicks be pleased , or not pleased ) in Defence of the Universality and Sufficiency of the LIGHT , at least with respect to the Gentiles Divinity ; and a round Answer to the Clamours of our many Adversaries against the Light 's Sufficiency to discover Sin , and convert from it . CHAP. XVII . A great Objection stated ; Answered . The Light both Law and Gospel , not in the same Discovery ; but in it self . A Way to reconcile the seeming Difference about it . The Light still defended . BUt because I am yet to expect Doubters about the Light , who rather strive how to oppose it by their Notions , then believe and obey it . I will suppose that some may ( as indeed doth T. Hicks , J. G. and almost all who have writ against us ) yet object : Certainly this Light Within can be at most but the Law in the Conscience , answering to the First Covenant ; For here is scarce any mention made of Christ in this long Discourse ; and if this Light were Christ , as is affirmed by you Quakers , then how comes it , that he was not so called of Old by the Jews and Greeks ? and why typified out to come , when he was come before , and whilst typified ? And further , In what Sense can he be understood to bear our Iniquities , and Men and Women to be saved by his Blood , if this Light be the Saviour , Messiah , Christ , &c. as you believe , and endeavour to maintain now in the World ? This Objection , I suppose , the Reader will allow to be the most weighty made against our Principle , and that I have dealt more fairly by our Adversaries ( especially by that Unjust and Malicious Man T. Hicks ) then they have dealt with us in his abusive and impertinent Dialogue ; since I have here laid down the Strength of their Objection , and the whole Scope and Intendment of his 8 , 9 , 10 , 11 , & 12. pages against the Light. To all which I thus answer , in the Fear of God & Spirit of Moderation . The Objection consists mainly of these Four Parts ; The First , relating to the Light 's being but the Law , not the Gospel . The Second , to the Light 's never being called Christ by Jews or Greeks . The Third , to Christ's being typified , and yet in Being at the same time . The Fourth , to Christ's Blood , the Bearing our Sins , and which way this could be appropriated to the Light , and not do Injury to the Holy Manhood . First then , I shall answer to that Part of the Objection which concerns the Light 's being but , or no more then the Law. I do thus far agree , That the Light is the Law ; but that it is not therefore in any sense the Gospel , I also deny , yet not in that Capacity wherein it is the Law ; for as in that state it cannot justifie , so it would be to say , it is the Law , and it is not the Law. I say then , that the Light may be both , in reference to a two-fold Manifestation . Where there is no Law there is no Transgression . It might as well have been said ( since they themselves confess it to be the Law ) That where there is no Light , there is no Transgression ; and the rather , because whatever is reproved , or Sinful , is made manifest by the Light ; therefore , since all have transgrest , all have Light , and ever had : In this State then it is a Law , which justifies none ; for whoever is in that which is reproveable , is under Condemnation from the Law , or the Reproving Act of the Light. But again , Such as by unfeigned Repentance come to turn unto the Light , they are herein justified in a two-fold Sense ( and I so speak for the sake of the Simple , beguiled by a wrong Apprehension of the Word ) First , In that God acquits for his Name 's sake , who is Merciful , Pardoning Iniquity , Transgression and Sin , all that Repent with Unfeigned Repentance . Secondly , In that he accepts upon the Renewal and Conti●…uance of the Creature 's humble and sincere Obedience . Neither are such properly come to the compleat Sonship ; they are but on their Journey , they must give good Proof of their Fidelity , Diligence and Loyalty to God , as Servants , before there be a Receiving of them into that excellent State of Sorship which never goes out of the Father's House 〈◊〉 . This is clearly distinguisht , and weightily exprest by the Apostle Paul to the Galatians , The Heir , sayes he , whilst 〈◊〉 Age , differs not from a Servant , but is under Tutors until the time ●…pointed of the Father ; even so we , when we were Children were in Bo●…dage , under the Elements of the World : therefore the Seed came , that by Faith in it the Adoption of Sons might be known . This is the Perfection of the Brightness of the Light , which is all along still the same in It self , though not the same to the Creature . The outward Sun is the Cause of the early Dawnings , and is at that very time in it self the same Glorious Body of Light , as when in the Meridian ; but if Men either through Natural Weakness , or the many Fogs and Mists of Tradition , Education , Ignorance or Prejudice suffer an Eclipse , they must not blame the Light , but themselves . He that follows the Light , which was ever the Just Man's Path , shall meet with Blessedness at the End of his Travels ; But such as let the World of Wickedness get between , are over-taken with Night . Abraham saw Christ's Day ; What Day ? The Dispensation of Sonship , as Heir of all things , the Day of perfect Restitution ; which he could never have done , had he not had Light , by which to have seen it . So several of those Holy Ancients obtain'd a Degree above many , and arriv'd at a Growth , yea , the Benefit and Enjoyment of a Dispensation , that was not general , through the Weakness of the Age : Such really saw beyond the Offerings , Types , Figures and Shaddows , to a State more Inward , Spiritual and Substantial , by taking good heed to the Heavenly Light. And this was the End of all External Administrations , to drive the Creature in , & point out unto it some more hidden Mystery that Man's Wandering from God had caus'd him to neglect ; yet still was Christ , the Word . God , a saving Light in that State. And the Light of the Law was as a School-Master , that led such as diligently obeyed it , to that more excellent Discovery of the same Light , which is now called the Gospel , or Glad-tidings , as certainly it was and is , after so Black and Cold a Season , as hath tediously overcast the Heavens , to have that Sun of Righteousness appear in that Body , prepared and anointed for that Purpose , in a transcendent Manner to all former Manifestations of Himself . Thus it was that such as had liv'd up most faithfully to the Law of God , or Light of that Dispensation , gladly received Christ , believed in him , became his Followers , and the Companions of his Sufferings ; so that he , who was the Light of the Law , is also the Light of the Gospel , though not in one and the same Degree of Discovery , as the Light is not one in Condemning and Justifying , though it be one in it self ; nor in the Degree and Growth of little Children , young Men and Fathers , yet one Pure , Eternal , Unalterable Light of Life and Righteousness in it self . If therefore it doth the Office of the Law in any , to be sure such one is yet under a State of Condemnation for Evil , and he is not yet come to know the fulfilling of the Law , as becometh every Follower of Christ , yea , every one that would come to Christ. Christ indeed fulfils the Law for us ; but how ? The Light in us , as we are subject to it , and led by it , administers an Holy Power , by which we are enabled to do that which is Good and Acceptable in the Sight of the Lord ; and so obeying the Light , we fulfil the Law : Thus he works his Works in us and for us . And so far was Christ from Dis-ingaging his Followers from an indispensible Necessity of keeping the Law , as outwardly ingraven on Stones , that he set them a far harder Task , by how much it is more easie to restrain from Acting then Thinking . Thou shalt not Commit Adultery , saith that Dispensation of Moses ; Whosoever looks on a Woman , to lust after her , hath committed Adultery already with her in his Heart , saith that more Excellent Dispensation of Christ. Certainly then those Men , who fancy themselves upon the easie Terms of being excluded the Fulfilling of the Law , or Performing good Works , as a Condition to Justification , must basely abuse themselves , and dangerously adventure the Well-being of their own Souls . In short , He was the True Light , who said , He that looks upon a Woman to lust after her , has committed Adultery with her already in his Heart : But so was he also that said of old by Moses , Thou shalt not commit Adultery ; Therefore should we conclude two Lights , and not rather two several Manifestations , or gradual Discoveries of the self-same Eternal Light ? To conclude , The Law ( as I may say ) is the Gospel begun , and the Gospel is the Law finished ; He that would be justified must first be condemned , and who would be healed , must first be wounded : The Law is as the Sword , the Gospel as Balm ; The one Duty , the other Love. And that which alone is needful to attain unto the highest Discovery , is , to be humbly subject , and constantly obedient to the lowest Appearance of it : The faithful Servant becomes a Son by Adoption . Wouldst thou know the Word a Reconciler , thou must first witness it an Hammer , Sword , Fire , &c. The Way to arrive at Evangelical Righteousness , is first to perform the Righteousness of the Law : By Law , I mean not that of Ceremonies , or the External Order of the Jews ; but that Moral & Eternal Law , which is said to have come by Moses , and is accomplisht by Christ. And there is great Hopes , that who Conscientiously keeps the Beginning , will compass the End. Such as have Conquer'd bad Doing , if they be faithful in what they have received of God's Light and Spirit it will inable them against bad Saying , till at last they overcome evil Thinking too ; and witness that Scripture fulfilled ; Judgment ( the Law ) is brought forth into Victory ( the Gospel ) He that follows me ( the Light of the World that inlightens all Men coming into the World ) shall not abide in Darkness , but shall have the Light of Life . I make not this Distinction of Law and Gospel to distinguish in Kind , but Degree , and for the sake of the Weak accustomed to it . And if the Son make you free , then are you free indeed : For as it is a Condemner it may be called the Light that brings Death , in that it slays by the Brightness of it's coming into the Conscience , the transgressing Nature ; like unto that Expression the Day of the Lord is a Day of Darkness , because of the Judgments and Terrors of the Lord for Sin ; But to the Obedient it is the Light of Life . Thus is Christ as the Word-God , and Light of the World through every Dispensation , ONE in himself , though to Mankind he has variously appeared , not by Differing Lights , but Manifestations only , of one and the same Eternal Light of Life and Righteousness . CHAP. XVIII . The Second Part of the Objection , that Christ was not anciently called the Light ; Answered . And the Contrary proved from Scripture and Reason . TO the Second Part of the Objection , If the Light in every Man were Christ , how comes it that the Jews and Greeks never called it so ? I answer , We do not say , that the Light in every Man is Christ , but of Christ ; He is that Fulness from whence all receive a Measure of Divine Light and Knowledge ; but not that every Individual has the whole or compleat Christ in him ; such an Absurdity never fell from us , nor our Doctrine , though the Malice of our Adversaries hath charged it upon both . But as the External Sun darts its Light upon the Organ of the Eye of the Body , by which it conveyes true Discerning to act , how , in and about Visibles ; so doth the Internal Sun of Righteousness shine upon the Eye of the Soul , giving it the Knowledge of those invisible Things , which properly relate to the Nature of the Soul ; So that we are the less oblieged to give a Reason , why others called not the Light in Man , Christ , since we renounce all Share in such Belief our selves : Which is Answer enough to T. H's dis-ingenuous Inference , that because G. W. affirmed , the Light , with which Mankind was inlightned , was God , therefore sayes T. H. Every Man his whole God in him , or to that Purpose , p. 5 , 6. Yet thus far I will tell those Men , that Christ was called Light , before ever he was in the World , though not before he was Christ. I will give him for a Light to lighten the Gentiles , &c. Now if any will say , that this Light was not Christ , let them tell us so in plain words : But if it will be allowed , then T. Hicks had best ask , why the Prophet by the Holy Ghost should call Christ , Light , even as soon , if not before he was called Christ ; and why in that very State , in which he was called Christ , he should be called Light. Certain it is then , that by Him , the Light , we are to understand Christ , which is one and the same thing , as if he had said , I will give Christ for a Light to enlighten the Gentiles ; or , who is the Christ , is the Light ; or , the Light is Christ : So that it will follow , that the Gentiles were inlightened by Christ , which is the Whole of what we understand by our Assertion , as to the Light in Man. Again , John expresly calls that Light with which every Man is inlightned , the Word ; and the Word is said to have taken Flesh : If then he that took Flesh was Christ , and consequently that Body , Christ's Body only , as none , I think , will dare deny , but Muggleton , and his Credulous Followers , it will follow , That Christ , who took , or appeared in that prepared Body , is the Light , with which every Man is inlightned . Further , Christ himself sayes , I am the Light of the World ; which is as much as if he had said , I have inlightned the World : therefore the Light , which shines in the Hearts of Mankind is Christ , though , not every particular Illumination the entire Christ ; for so there would be as many Christs , which were Absurd and Blasphemous . But Lastly the Apostle himself calls him Christ before his Coming in the Flesh ; or that Christ was Christ before his Appearance in that Body at Jerusalem , which clears that Point in Controversie : for the Stress of T. Hicks's Objection , as to this Particular , lies here , Christ , as Christ , was not before he took Flesh ; therefore though I should grant ( might he say , and he doth say as much ) that as the Word-God all are inlightened by him , yet , sayes he , not as he is Christ before that visible Appearance : One would think he were a very Socinian by his Arguing ; not that I write so in Slight , Abuse or Reflection ; but if Christ was not before , then the Manhood , that was taken in time , must be the Christ ; and what should materially hinder their Conjunction I know not ? But I would fain know his Reason for it , if it be Lawful to expect what I fear he has not to give ; however , if he darest , he would give you his Interest in lieu of a Reason for his so holding , but that I shall do for him , and with Impartial Minds it will be a Reason against him . The Dilemma in short is this , If he denies Christ to have been Christ before that Coming , he thwarts as plain a Text as the Scriptures have ; and if he should allow of it , his whole Fabrick ( now a Fortification , he thinks ) would fall like a rotten House about his Ears . Well , but I will tell him , and all concern'd , for his base Opposition , That since Christ , as the Word-God , hath illuminated all Men antecedent to his Coming in the Flesh , as confesses T.H. J.G. J.F. and many more of them , & that the Apostle says , that the Word was Christ , or Christ was before he came in the Flesh ; for Christ was in the Wilderness a Rock to Israel , unless Christ and the Word are two distinct Beings , or that there be two distinct Christs : Christ was that Light , with which Mankind was illuminated , or that Light , Mankind was inlightned with , was the very Christ , and consequently , the Light has been called both expresly and implicitly Christ before that visible Appearance at Jerusalem . Nor is the Allegation of that Scripture pertinent to the Matter in hand ( viz. ) Which none of the Princes of this World knew , &c. brought by T. H. for that was spoken in reference to the Wisdom which had been hid , and not the meer Manhood of Christ ; But suppose it had deeply concern'd it , we have this to say , that such as rejected , much more those that crucified him in his outward Appearance , had first despised and slain him within , They were of those who Rebel against the Light , and Love not the Wayes thereof . And I affirm against all Opposers , that it was by that Sight the Light within gave to Simeon , Peter , Nathanael , and all others , who believed in him , that they Confessed him , and Suffered for him ; such as had not so Out-sinned their Day , Defiled their Conscience , Clouded their Understandings , and Hardned their Hearts , as others by Wicked Works had done ; but through the Light of the Lord , had in good measure kept their Consciences void of Offence , they received and imbraced him . The Light knew its own ; The Lesser led to the Greater , and the Greater Light as naturally attracted the Lesser , as we may see Fire do every day . To conclude this Particular , let me add , that they were not the Princes of this World that put him outwardly to Death ; for it came by the Envious Accusations and most Inveterate Suggestions of the Jews ( a Broken Conquered People ) to Pilate , but Governour of a Province ; therefore , since I believe what the Apostle saith to be true , I have rather Reason to infer , that it was meant of Christ Mystically , then of that Visible Body . However it be , that part of our Adversaries Objection about the Light 's not being call'd Christ , antecedent to his Coming in the Flesh , can be of no Weight to the Matter under Debate , since we have so evidently made the Contrary appear . CHAP. XIX . The Third Part of the Objection ; If Christ was enjoyed under the Law , as he was , if the Light be Christ ; why was he Typified ? Is proved of no Force . The Type and Anti-type in some Respects may be at one and the same time ; this is proved by 〈◊〉 of Scripture . Our Adversaries Oppostion and Cavil Weak and Insuccessful . THe Third Part of the Objection , and what seems at first sight to carry something of moment against us , is this ; If the Light Within be Christ , and the Jews and Gentiles had it from the beginning of the World , how can Christ be said to be typified out , as not come , and Prophesied of to come , when by your own Principle he has been alwayes come ? I answer , This part of the Objection is in some respect built upon the same Mistake as was the second , namely , that the Light within is intirely Christ ; concerning which I have plainly and truly exprest my self before ; I will therefore faithfully state the Question for them thus : Well , but still you say , Christ inlightned Jews and Gentiles before that visible Coming ; if so , then was he come by your own Principle , whilst his very Coming was typified out , and Prophesied of : Doth not this seem a Contradiction ? But to this I say , that the supposed Contradiction ariseth from the Mistake of the Dispensations ; for it takes for granted , that there was no Difference in the Degree of Illumination before , and at the Coming of Christ after that visible Manner into the World , which all must needs confess : For as I would be understood , when I call the Light before , and after Christ's Coming in the Flesh , Light , to mean but one and the self-same Light in Nature ; So let none apprehend , that we make not a Difference by the Acknowledgment of a more eminent Manifestation of the same Light. What follows then ? Why thus much most clearly , That under the Enjoyment of the Lesser Manifestation of Light , suited to the then Childish State of the Jews , God was pleased to allure them after an Expectation of , at least a Belief in higher things , by Types and Prophecyes of that far more Excellent and Exceeding Glorious Dispensation of the Light and Love of God in after Ages . The End of God's giving the Israelites that outward Prophet and Leader Moses was , to bring to the Inward , which though they through Carnality and Weakness were not then sensible of him , so as to stay their Minds upon him , yet Moses prophesied of him ; and all the External Dealings have been with respect to bring to the Seed within , which is able to bruise the Serpent's Head , and did so in some measure through all Ages . So that in good Reason and Truth may we assert , Christ the Light , was the Rock that follow'd Israel in the Wilderness ( who is the Rock of Ages , and Foundation of all Generations , who ever enlightned all Mankind , the same yesterday , to day , and forever ) yet a greater Manifestation of that Divine Light might be typically preacht forth under the Enjoyment of the Lesser : And that we herein are not without the Suffrage of the Scriptures to our Defence , I would fain know of T. Hicks , or who else that is concerned against us , If notwithstanding all those outward Washings of those Times , God did not frequently press the very Substance it self , namely , a Clean Heart and a New Spirit ; accounting all short thereof but as the Cutting off a Dog's Neck ? And whether Christ himself did not with his own Hands give the Bread and the Wine to his Disciples , and yet bid them do it till he came ? Whence it is easie to observe , that unless Tho. Hicks , and the rest of those Contenders , say with the Papists , The Bread and Wine are very Christ ( and so make Christ giving Christ , thereby destroying the Nature of a Sacrament ; and instead of doing it till he come , that he should come when-ever they do receive it ( which Ignorance I will not suppose him or them guilty of ) I say , unless then that they were of one Mind with the Romanists in the Matter of the Supper , it must be granted to us , that Christ present gave them a Figure of Christ to come ; therefore to figure out Christ to come , destroyes not Christ's being come ; especially with our most necessary Distinction of the lesser Manifestation from the greater , which nevertheless divides not the Light , but that remains in it self one Pure , Eternal Being of Light , and Sun of Righteousness through every Dispensation . This , that Passage I have already observed from the Apostle Paul , in Answer to the second part of the Objection plainly clears to us ; For if Christ typified out was their Rock , or the Rock of that Age , even when the Brazen Serpent the Type was in being , I cannot see , but the Type and the Thing typified might be at one and the same time ; not as to Degree , but Nature ; for so I would be understood . Before I conclude take this notable Saying of Christ to the Jews , and what may be collected from it to our Purpose ; BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS I AM — ABRAHAM SAW MY DAY , AND REJOYCED — which affords us briefly thus much : That though he was not so visibly come , yet it was the very same HE that came about One Thousand Six Hundred Years ago , who was with the Fathers of Old ; and that Abraham , who lived One Thousand Nine Hundred Years before that outward Appearance , saw him , and his Day . If this be not the Import of the Place , I know none ; For the Jews not believing him to be the Messiah , thought it high Presumption sor him to compare with Abraham ; Art thou Greater then our Father Abraham , who is dead , and the Prophets are dead ? Whom makest thou thy self ? said that Unbelieving People ; Unto which he answered ( that he might prove himself to be the true Messiah , the Christ of God ) ABRAHAM SAW MY DAY , and rejoyced : They still harping upon that Visible Body , not Thirty Three Years old , replyed , Thou art not yet Fifty , and hast thou seen Abraham ? Taking that to be the Messiah , the Christ of God , and Saviour of the World he meant , which they saw with their Carnal Eyes . To which he rejoyn'd with a Verily , verily I say unto you , before Abraham was I am ; then took they up Stones to cast at him , &c. By all which it is most clear , that unless our Adversaries will deny him that so spoak ( which yet T. Hicks's Anti-scriptural Opinion doth imply ) to be Christ , who singled and distinguisht himself , as the Messiah , the Christ of God , and Saviour of the World from that Visible Body , not Fifty Years old indeed ; both Christ that then spoak must needs have been long before Abraham's Time ; and that such Holy Ancients were not without a Sight and Prospect of him , and the Day of his Glorious Appearance , or that most Signal Manifestation of himself in that Body prepared for that Great and Holy Purpose ; witness the exceeding Clear and Heavenly Prophecyes , that were as so many Fore-runners , or Introducers of the Evangelical State. And this is unquestionably confirm'd unto us by that known and very weighty Expression of the Apostle Paul to the Romans : Whose are the Fathers , and of whom as concerning the Flesh Christ came , who is over all , God blessed for ever , Amen . Since here both Christ is distinguisht from the Body he took and made one with that God , who is over all , blessed for ever , Amen ; As much as to say , of whose Flesh Christ took , therefore Christ was before he took it ; or his taking it did not constitute him Christ , which Christ is God ; And if God ( which cannot be said of meer Flesh or any Corporal Lineage ) then must he have been from all Everlasting . To conclude , As Abraham Outward and Natural was the great Father of the Jews Outward and Natural , whose Seed God promis'd to bless with Earthly Blessings as Canaan , &c. & that they were figurative of the one Seed Christ , and such as he should beget unto a lively Hope through the Power of his Spiritual Resurrection , it will consequently follow , that this Seed must be Inward and Spiritual ; since one outward thing cannot be the proper Figure or Representation of an other : Nor is it the Way of holy Scripture so to teach us ; The Outward Lamb shows forth the Inward Lamb ; The Jew Outward , the Jew Inward . As God attended the one with many singular outward Mercies ( to say no more ) above other Nations ; So the Jew in Spirit doth he benefit above all other People I have these two short Arguments to prove , what I believe and assert as to the Spirituallity of the True Seed ; and a clearer Overthrow it is to the Opinion of our Adversaries to the True Christ. First , Every thing begets its like ; What is simply Natural produces not a Spiritual Being ; Material Things bring not forth Things that are Immaterial . Now because the Nature , or Image , begotten in the Hearts of True Believers , is Spiritual , it will follow , that the Seed which so begets , and brings forth that Birth , must be the same in Nature with that which is begotten , therefore Spiritual ; then Christ's Body , or , what he had from the Virgin , strictly considered as such , was not the Seed . Secondly , it is clear from hence ; The Serpent is a Spirit : Now nothing can bruise the Head of the Serpent , but something that is also Internal and Spiritual , as the Serpent is ; But if that Body of Christ were the Seed , then could he not bruise the Serpent's Head in all , because the Body of Christ is not so much as in any one , and consequently the Seed of the Promise is an Holy and Spiritual Principle of Light , Life , and Power , that being receiv'd into the Heart bruiseth the Serpents Head : And because the Seed , which cannot be that Body , is Christ , as testify the Scriptures , the Seed is one , and that Seed Christ , and Christ God over all , blessed forever , we do conclude , and that most truly , that Christ was , and is the Divine Word of Light and Life , that was in the beginning with God , and was , and is God over all , blessed for ever . And this may yet more evidently appear , let it but be seriously weigh'd , that before ever that visible Appearance , the Seed bruised in good measure the Serpent's Head in the Holy Men and Women of all Generations , otherwise they had not been Holy , but Serpentine and Wicked ; And if the Seed , was before , and that Seed be Christ ; because there is but One Christ , as well as but One only Seed , it doth clearly follow , that Christ was Christ before that Outward Appearance ; and consequently , it could but be a more Excellent and free Manifestation of his Truth , Righteousness , Salvation , Wisdom , Power , Glory and Dominion , as indeed it was . For notwithstanding that this Heavenly Seed was in some measure known , and what was wrought of Inward Deliverance in that Day , was by and through the Power and Vertue of it , as the Minds of People were retired to that Word of God nigh in the Heart to cleanse and redeem ; And though particular Persons might arrive at great Attainments , even to a Beholding the Day of the Seeds compleat Redemption , and Conquest over all it's Oppressors ( when what was but in the Condition of a Seed , or New-born Child , should become the only Son , the Wonderfull Counsellor , the Mighty God , the Everlasting Father and Prince of Peace , of the Increase of whose Government there should be no End , as speaks the Prophet ) Yet it is granted , through that good Understanding the Lord has given us in these weighty Things , that the Generallity were but Weak , Dark and Imbondaged , as saith the Apostle , under Carnal and Beggarly Elements , not clearly seeing through those outward Services , which , if I may so speak , God held them in hand with , condescending to their Weakness , that he might both keep them from gadding after the Pompous Invention , and Idolatrous Worship of other Nations , and point out unto them under their great Carnality that more Hidden Glory and Spiritual Dispensation , which should-afterwards be revealed , to wit , The Compleat Redemption of the Soul , and Raign of the Holy Seed , from the Child born , and the Son given , to the Wonderful Counsellor , the Mighty God , the Everlasting Father , and Prince of Peace , of the Increase of whose Government there shall be no End. So that then we ought , and we do by absolute Force of Truth conclude ( 1. ) That the Seed , which Seed is Christ , was in all Ages with Abraham , with the Israelites , with the Prophets , Therefore he was as well before he came in that prepared Body , as then and since . ( 2. ) Yet it is confest , That He was not so clearly revealed , perfectly brought forth , and generally known before his so Coming as then and since , but more darkly figured out by Types and Shaddowy Services ; which though they Cleans'd not , Sav'd not , Redeem'd not , yet did show forth a more Hidden and Spiritual Substance , that was able to Cleanse , Save and Redeem , and did all that received it , and were truly subject to it . ( 3. ) That it therefore is not at all Absurd , that the more Excellent Manifestation of Truth should he Typified and Prophesied of , under the Enjoyment of the Lesser , since the Reason of the Thing , and the Testimonies of the Scripture are so express for it , which ends our Answer to this Particular . CHAP. XX. The Fourth Part of the Objection stated and considered . Christ's Death and Sufferings confessed to , and respected ; they were beneficial . The Light of Christ within is the Efficient Cause to Salvation . HAving thus considered the Third Part of this great Objection , I am now come to what chiefly stumbles People , with respect to the Light within , at least , as I apprehend ; and that is this Fourth and Last Particular , viz. But if the Light in every Man be Christ , how doth it bear our Sins , and are our Iniquities laid upon it ? and how can we be said to be Justified , Redeemed or Saved by its Blood , since all these things are spoken by the Holy Pen-men of the Man Christ , or Jesus born at Nazareth ? Surely you wholy invalidate his Life , Death , Resurrection , Ascension and Mediation by this Belief in the Light. This I take to be the very Stress of the Matter , collected out of the most Forceable Writings of our Adversaries ; To which I Answer , and let him that reads understand . It must be considered in this Last Part of the Objection , how those Questions can be applicable to the Light , and yet be reconciliable with those Scriptures that seem to attribute all to his Bodily Sufferings . I hope to make appear , that as we exalt the First , so we dare not by any means to slight the Last . The Light , or rather He that is Light in Man ( for I have alwayes desired so to be understood : Light being a Metaphor or word taken from the outward Day , and chiefly so term'd , because of Man's Darkness , which is thereby discovered ) hath been as a Lamb slain since the Foundation of the World ; that is , the World had not been long created , before the good Order of it , and every thing therein , being envied by the Fallen Angels , that Spirit of Iniquity betrayed Man of his Innocency ; and Sin by Disobedience prevailing , the Light or Principle of Life , under whose Holy Leadings Man was placed , became Resisted , Grieved , and as it were Slain ( which word Slain is also Metaphorical ) that is to say , the Innocent Pure Life was as Wounded unto Death through Man's Disobedience and Lamb-like Image , in which Adam was created , by him through Rebellion lost : Thus that Holy Principle , which God placed in the Heart of Adam , in which was true Light , Life and Power , bore the Sin , was prest under it , as a Cart under Sheaves , grieved exceedingly , and as it were quencht with Iniquity . This hath been the Condition of that Precious and Elect Seed , Spirit , Light , Life , Truth ( or whatever Name equivalent any may please to give it ) ever since that first Rebellion , to this very Day : And as in Wicked Men God's Holy Light and Spirit , or that Principle which is so called , hath been deeply Wounded , yea , as one Slain ; so in Good Men , that have had a Sence of the World's Abomination , hath it also born many Burdens and Weights ; for the Light and Life is One in All. And those who have been reformed by it , and joyned to it , have been as One Spirit , and have not been without their Share of their Lord 's heavy Sufferings , from the Ungodly World , which was as well a filling up of Christ's Sufferings that were before his Outward Coming , as what to this Generation are behind . And as at any time Disobedient Men have harkened to the still Voice of the WORD ( that Messenger of God ) in their Hearts , to be affected and convinced by it , as it brings Reproof for Sin , which is but a Fatherly Chastizement ; ●…o upon true Brokenness of Soul , and Contrition of Spirit , that very same Principle and Word of Life in Man , has mediated and attoned , and God has been propitious , lifting up the Light of his Countenance , and replenishing such humble 〈◊〉 with Divine Consolations . So that still the same Christ , Word-God , who has enlightned all Men , by Sin is grieved , bearing the Iniquities of such as so sin , and reject his Benefits : but as any hear his Knocks and let him in , he first Wounds , and then Heals ; afterwards he attones , mediates , and re-instates in the holy Image . Behold this is the State of Restitution ! And this in some Measure was witnessed by the Holy Patriarchs , Prophets and Servants of God in old time , to whom Christ was substantially the same Saviour , and Seed bruising the Serpent's Head , that he is now to us , what Difference s●…ever there may be in Point o●… Manifestation . But notwithstanding the same Light and Life , with that which afterwards clothed it it self with that outward Body , did in measure inwardly appear for the Salvation of the Souls of Men ; yet , as have often said , never did that Li●…●…eminently put ●…orth it self for that End , as in that 〈◊〉 and prepared Body ; so that what he then suffered and did in that transcendent Manisestation , may by way of Eminency assume the whole Work unto it self , that he ever did before , or might do afterwards . For doubtless that very Light , Life and Power , which dwelt in that Flesh●…y Tabernacle , eminently was the Convincer , Condemner , Saviour and Redeemer ; yet not only as confined to that Body , but as revealed in the Hearts of Men , as he was in Paul , who not consulting with Flesh and Blood against the Lord of Glory willingly receive him in , to bind the strong Man , spoil his Goods , and cast him out , that He might Reign . And that the Divine Life , Light , Spirit , Nature of Principle , which resided in that Body was the efficient Cause of Salvation , observe the Title that is given from the great Work he was to do , namely , To save his People from their Sins ; there is not one Word of Wrath , but consequentially : Therefore , since that Sin is in the Heart and Conscience of Mankind , nothing but a Divine Light , Spirit or Power can reach Immaculation into those inward Parts ; and consequently that must be the Redeemer and Saviour . But indeed , those who have a Mind to Naturalize that strange Figure into the Language of the Holy Truth ; I mean , to understand that to be saved , is to be saved from Wrath , and not from Sin ( whose assured Wages is Wrath ) may have some Interest , though no Reason for their implacable Enmity against an Inherent Holiness . But I farther confess , that his Righteous Life , with respect to its Appearance in that Body , was grieved by Sin , & that the Weight of the Iniquity of the whole World , with the Concernment of its Eternal Well-being , lay hard upon him , nor was his Manhood Insensible of it : Under the Load of this did He travel , he alone trode the Wine-Press ; that is , All others were then Insensible of that Eternal Wrath , which would be the Portion of Impenitent Persons , as well as that it was his great Care , and deep Travel , that the Holy , yet Oppressed Seed might arise over the Pressures of Iniquity in the Hearts of Men , to bruise the Serpent's Head in all ; And as outwardly he gave his outward Life for the World , so he might inwardly shed abroad in their Souls the Blood of God , that is , The Holy Purifying Life and Virtue , which is in him as the Word-God , and as which , he is the Life of the World. This was it which gave that visible Part the Understanding it had , which fitted it for so great an Embassy , by whose Power alone it Fasted , Prayed , Preacht , Cast-out Devils , Wrought Miracles , Lived that most Unblemisht Life , Patiently Suffered Death , was Raised for an Holy Confirmation , maugre all the Military Opposition of the Jews ; and this it was which accompanied the Ministry of his Followers , rendring it Efficacious to Conviction and Conversion : So that the Invisible , Spiritual and Divine Life , Principle or Nature , was the Root and Fountain of all which is sometimes asscribed in Scripture to the Body , by that Common Figure , or Way of Speaking amongst Men , the Thing containing , which was the Body for the Thing contained , which was the Eternal Power , Wisdom , Life , &c. Not that we would irreverently rob the Holy Body of whatsoever Acknowledgement is justly due , nor yet separate that God joyned ; though I confess with holy Fear , I dare not attribute to an External prepared Being , which is the Natural , Proper and Only Work of the Divine Light and Life to operate and effect : But certainly , if some Men in Scripture are intituled Saviours because of the Contribution of their Tryals , Travels and Labours towards the Salvation of Man-kind , of much more Right is that Honour ascribable to him who had the Spirit without Measure ; For I do freely acknowledge it to have been in some sense a Co-worker and Partner with the Divine Life in many of its Tryals , Weights , Sufferings and Travels for Man-kind : Yet as it was the Divine Power in them that made them serviceable in that great Work , so was it the Divine Power in him which made that what it was , and therefore ought we chiefly to appropriate the Salvation to Christ , as the Word-God , and to the Holy Manhood not any otherwise then Instrumentally , or by the same Divine Power in and through it ; I mean , as it was a Chosen Instrument or Vessel , in and by which God declared the Blessed Glad-Tidings of Love , and his Message of Reconciliation to the World , in which he gave the most Heavenly Example of Purity , and through whose whole Life , Doctrine and Death did shine forth the clearest Evidences of Truth , Goodness , Mercy , Patience , deep Travel for the World , Self-Denyal , Holiness and Triumphant Matyrdom . No Wonder then , if he be called a Saviour , who not only came on an Embassy of Salvation , and when come , did draw many after him , who were struck with the Authority of his Sayings , when he allow'd for a time to have their Eyes and Hearts upon him , as in that State present with them ; But afterwards , he let his Disciples know , of how much Benefit it would be to them , that he should leave them ; How ? Forever : In all Capacities ? No ; but as with respect to his outward Appearance , that being scattered in that Day to their own Measure of Light , Pon er and Life , they might know him NO MORE AFTER THE FLESH , but witness him come into their Hearts a Comforter , who could not leave his true-hearted Disciples comfortless . He that is with you shall be in you . To be brief , that I may yet again express our reverent Sense of Christ's Manifestation , so far as relates to that Holy Thing that should be born of Mary ; take these few particulars in my next Chapter . CHAP. XXI . A Confession in particular to Christ's Redemption , Remission , Justification and Salvation . I. WE do confess , that though the Eternal Power , Life and Light which inhabited that Holy Person , which was born at Nazareth , was & is chiefly & eminently the Saviour ( for there is no Saviour besides me saith God yet that it was Instrumentally a Saviour , as prepared and chose●… o●… the Work which Christ had then to do i●… it , which was actually to the Salvation of some , and intentionally of the whole World then , and in Ages to come ; suitable to that Scripture , Lo , in the Volumn of the Book it is written , I come to do thy Will ( O God ) a Body hast thou prepared me , &c. II. That as there was a Necessity that one should dye for the People , so whoever then or since believed in Him , had and have a Seal or Confirmation of the Remission of their Sins in his Blood , and that Blood , alluding to the Custom or the Jewish Sacrifices , shall be an utter Blotting out of former iniquates , carrying them as into a Land of Forgetfulness . This grand Assurance of Remission ( from the Wrath due upon the Score or former Offences ) do all receive in the Ratifying Blood of Christ , who Repenting of their Sins , believe and obey the Holy Light with which he hath Illuminated them . For Paul's being turned from Darkness to the Light in his Heart , was one with his believing in the Son of God revealed in his Heart . III. This more glorious Appearance ended that less glorious Service of the Jews ; the Figures being compleated , the Shadows they fell . He in that Body preacht , and lived beyond those Beggarly Elements ; He drew Religion more Inward , even into the Secret of the Heart , and made it to consist in an higher State o●… Righteousness , called Evangelical , and at once became both the Auth●…ro 〈◊〉 Heavenly Dispensation , and therein an Example to all , as well Jews and Gentiles ; sealing such a Common and General Religion to both with his Blood , as would forever end the Difference and slay the Enmity , that they might be all one in Christ. Thus did he end the Jews External Services , and overturn the Gentiles Idolatries by his one most pure and Spiritual Offering and Worship . IV. It plainly preaches thus much to us , That as Him , whose Body the Jews outwardly slew , we by Wicked Works have crucified in the Streets of Sodom and Egypt , spiritually so called , our polluted Hearts and Consciences . So , unless we come to know the Benefit of the Inward Life , answering to , and expressed by that Outward Life he gave for the World , it will avail little ; For so it is , and very Marvelous in our Eyes , that the Life of the Crucified can only save those who may well be reputed the Crucifiers . O Mystery ! And because those that did not actually slay him Outwardly , have slain him Inwardly , therefore must every such one really know that Life Inwardly raised & shed abroad for Sanctification and Redemption . O how great was his Love ! Truly larger then Man's Cruelty ; who whilst he dyed by Wicked Men , he would Dye for them ; and when dead , they could not hinder him from Rising to do them good , who had done their worst for his Destruction , thereby shewing Mercy to those , who shewed they had no Mercy for themselves . O Jerusalem , Jerusalem ! how often would I have gathered thee , and thou wouldest not , & c ? V. That Expression of his is greatly worth our Notice , I lay down my Life for the World. All he did was for the Good of the World , and particularly the Laying down of his Life , that he might both express his Love and our Duty . Had he not desired Man's Salvation , and for that purpose prepared a Body , in which to visit him , and by his daily Labours among Men to further their Eternal Happiness the Jew had never been able to put him to Death : But being come , and when come , so hardly used , herein did he recommend his great Love to us , that besides the Inward Weights of Sin he bore with his deep Concernment for Man's Eternal Well-being , he chearfully offered up his Bodily Life , to recommend and ratifie his Love for the Remission of Sin , and give us an Holy Example to follow his Steps . But these Words will bear another Sease too , as do those he spoak to the Jews , Unless ye eat my Flesh , and drink my Blood , you have no Life in you : Where we may plainly see , that as the Jews vainly and carnally fancyed , he meant his Outward Body only , to which they opposed the Impossibility of the thing ; so Christ declares their Mistake of his Meaning to his Disciples , in these few , but deep Words , The Flesh profiteth nothing : it is the Spirit that quickeneth . So that the Words are true , and weighty in both Senses . VI. And we further acknowledge , that in that Holy Body the Divine Principle of Light and Life did discover the Depth of Satan's Darkness , encounter Hell , Death and the Grave , every Temptation it was possible for the Serpent , with all his Power , and Subtilty to beset him with ( in which Sense he was made like unto us in all things , Sin excepted , that he might be sensible of our Infirmities ) the Divine Life travelled and supported under all , administring Strength to the outward Man , that it might answer the End of its Appointment , & in the End utterly defeated , and forever overcame the Power of the Tempter , bruising the Serpents Head in general , as Prince of Darkness , and God of the World , and in a plain Combat giving him that Foyl , which in good measure shook his Foundation , divided his Kingdom , chased away his Lying Oracles , and proved a very Fatal Blow to his whole Empire : Which holy Conquest obtained by Sweat of Blood , and deep'st Agonies with Holy Patience , may not unfitly be compared to that of some Worldly Prince maintaining a Righteous Cause against an Usurper of his Territories , whom he puts to rout in open Fields ; by which I understand the General Conquest ; yet many Towns , and Cities and Cittadels remaining strongly guarnison'd ( by which I understand , particular Men and Women enslaved by Sin ) they are not thereby overcome , though the Approach be easier to them , and they be truly more endanger'd then before . The One Seed , who is Christ , who is God over all , blessed forever , having given that Proof of his Everlasting Arm , that it has brought a general Salvation by a plain Overthrow of the God of this World , the Enemy of his Glory , and thereby weakened his Power in himself ( which is the single Battel fought in Garments rould in Blood , between the two Seeds , Spirits , Natures and Powers ; God and Mammon ; Christ and Belial ) had many Towns , Cities and Cittadels to vanquish , who lay strongly guarnison'd by this God of the World ; which Places , as I said , represent the Souls of particular Men and Women inbondaged by him . So that though their Hearts were , or are more accessible by that general Victory over the very Spirit of Darkness it self , and Light may be more clear d and broken up ; yet unless those particular Places or Persons are besieged and taken , their Goods spoiled , and Houses sackt of all the strange Gods , & so redeemed from under the Yoak of that Pharaonian Task-Master , reclaimed , renewed , sanctified & naturalized by way of an Holy Subjection to him , who is Lord from Heaven , the Right Heir of all things , to receive his Mark , and bear his Image ; Those Places or Persons must needs have yet been , and be Subjects of the Prince of Darkness , the God of this World , who reigns and rules in the Hearts of the Children of Disobedience . To conclude ; We , though this General Victory was obtained , and holy Priviledges therewith , and that the Holy Body was not Instrumentally without a Share thereof ; yet that both the efficient or chiefest Cause was the Divine Light and Life , that so clearly discriminated and deeply wounded this Mystery of Iniquity , and that none can be thereby benefited , but as they come to experience that Holy Seed of Life , and Mighty Arm of Power revealed to effect the same Salvation in each Particular Conscience , which none can fail of , who receive it first as a Light , that manifesteth and reproveth every Evil Way , and continues to walk up to all its holy Leadings . VII . But there is yet a further Benefit that accrueth by the Blood of Christ , viz. That Christ is a Propitiation and Redemption to such as have Faith in it ; For though I still place the Stres●… of particular Benefit upon the Light , Life , & Spirit revealed , witnessed in every Particular ; yet in that general Appearance there was a general Benefit justly to be attributed unto the Blood of that very Body of Christ , to wit , that it did propitiate : For however it might draw Stupendious Judgments upon the Heads of those who were Authors of that dismal Tragedy , and dyed Impenitent ; yet doubtless it thus far turned to very great Account , in that it was a most precious Offering in the Sight of the Lord , and drew God's Love the more eminently unto Mankind , at least such as should believe in his Name , as his solemn Prayer to his Father at his leaving the World , given us by his beloved Disciple , doth plainly witness . For how can it otherwise be , but that it should render God most propitious to all such , as believe in Christ the Light of the World , when it was but a letti●…g of his only begotten Son's Sufferings turn to their account , that should ever believe in him . Yet doubtless greatly did it influence to some singular Tenderness , and peculiar l●…egard unto all such , who should believe in his Name among other of his weighty Performances , for the sake of that last and greatest of all his External Acts , the resisting unto Blood for the Spiritual Good of the World , thereby offering up his Li●…e upon the Cross through the Power of the Eternal Spirit , that Remission of Sin , God's Bounty to the World , might be preacht in his Name , and in his very Blood too , as that , which was the most ratifying of all his Bodily Sufferings . And indeed , therefore might it seem meet to the Holy Ghost , that Redemption , Propitiation and Remission should be declared , and held forth in the Blood of Christ unto all , that have right Faith therein , as saith the Apostle to the Romans ; Whom God hath set forth to be a Propitiation through Faith in his Blood : and to the Ephesians ; In whom we have Redemption through his Blood , the Forgiveness of Sins , &c. because it implies a firm Belief , that Christ was come in the Flesh , and that none could then have him as their Propitiation or Redemption , who withstood the Acknowledgement of , and Belief in his Vi●…ible Appearance , which John tells us , some denyed and withstood . 2. That he came in order to the Remission , Redemption and Salvation of the World. 3. That his so Dying was both an evident Token of his Love , and strong Argument of Confirmation of his Message and Work. 4. That it might the better end the Jews Services , by an Allusion to the Way of their Temporary and Shadowy Sacrifices , as the whole Epistle to the Hebrews showeth . 5. And that by bringing ( through the holy Light in the Partic●…lar ) i●…to the Acknowledgment of , and Belief in the Blood , which was ratifying of that whole Appearance , Men might be brought unto the knowing Christ after a more Inward and Spiritual Manner , suitable to Christ's own Words , It is the Spirit that quickens ; and the Apostle avers , that the Lord from Heaven is that quickning Spirit ; by which Eternal Spirit he offered up himself without Spot . Nor can any reasonably suppose , that when Christ so spoak to his Disciples explanatorily of what he had obscurely and in Parables said to the Jews , that he meant not something more hidden and Divine then what they and the Jews saw ; Yet that which hindred those Jews from the Knowledge or Benefit thereof , was their Stumbling at him without a Confession , unto whom they co●…ld never come into the Beholding or Experiencing of his Divine Life in them . To conclude , That Body was the Divine Lifes , a Body hast thou prepared me ; therefore all that was done by that Body towards the Redemption of Man-kind , was eminently the Divine Lifes ; yet because many times Actions are denominated from , or appropriated to the Instrument as the next Cause , though not the Efficient , or most Eminent Cause ; therefore the Scripture speaks forth ( as indeed is the Propriety of both the Hebrew and Greek Tongues ( Parabol cally , Hyberbolically , Metaphorically ) the inward Substance and hidden Life of things , by things more Exteriour and Obvious to the Sense , to the End that such Mysteries might be the better accommodated to Vulgar Capacities . Consider what I say with this Qualification , that ultimately and chiefly , not wholy and exclusively the Divine Life in that Body was the Redeemer : For the Sufferings of that Holy Body of Jesus had an engaging and procuring Virtue in th●…m , though the Divine Life was that Fountain , from whence originally it came . And as the Life declared and preached forth it self through that Holy Body ; so who did then come to the Benefit procured by the Divine Life , could only do it through an Hearty Confession to it , as appearing in that Body ; and that from a Sence first begotten by a Measure of the same in themselves . This is the main Import of those Places : Whom God hath set forth to be a Propitiation , and in whom we have Redemption through Faith in his Blood. For who is this H E , whom God hath set forth , and in whom is Redemption ? Certainly the same H E , that was before Abraham , the Rock of the Fathers , that cryed , Lo , I come to do thy Will ( O God ) a Body hast thou prepared me : which was long before the Body was conceived and born . But may some say , How is it then his Blood ? Why , just as the Body is his Body . Those who had Faith in that Blood believed his Visible Appearance , inasmuch as they acknowledged that great Seal and Ratification of it , to wit , the Shedding of the Blood of His Body , who came to save the World , and who alone is the Propitiation , Redemption and Salvation of all who had right Faith in that Appearance and Message so confirmed , and therefore so often exprest by it , as inclusive of all his whole Life and Sufferings beside . And this is my Reason for it , that it was impossible for any Man in that Day to confess to , and believe in that Divine Light and Life , which appeared in that prepared Body , but from the Inward Discoveries and Operations of that Light , with which Christ the Word-God who took Flesh , had enlightened him . However , though the Apostles might then so express themselves , thereby to assert and recommend unto the Faith of all that most Heavenly Manifestation , and the great Love of Christ therein , as the Visitation of the Heavenly Life through that prepared Body , and the deep Sufferings of both for the World , being True and Spiritual Witnesses thereof ; yet it was never intended , that any should barely rest in that , but press after the Knowledge of Christ by Faith in something farther , and beyond that Body , in which he appeared , not excluding our Belief in that too : They who knew Christ after the Flesh , were to press after some more Spiritual Discovery of Him ; and who almost doted on his outward Manifestation , it was expedient , that they should be weaned from it , to the End his more interiour , and indeed beneficial Revelation of himfelf might be witnessed . Faith in his Blood was requisite , that they might confess him , whose Body and Blood it was to be Christ , who is God over all , blessed for ever ; The great Question with the Jews , Whether God was truly manifested in that Body of Flesh which they saw ? So that the Stress lyes in Confessing to the Divinity come in the Flesh ; otherwise they would have rejected not only the most signal Suffering of the whole Manifestation ; but consequently that It self . To conclude , we confess , HE who then appeared , was and is the Propitiation , &c. and in Him was Redemption obtained by all those , who had such true Faith in his Blood : But still it is to be understood , that there must be a Witnessing of a measure of the same Light , Spirit and Power to appear for Redemption in each particular . VIII . That Justification came by Faith in his Blood , is clear in a Sense ; for by the Law could no Flesh be justified : That is , the Law being added because of Transgression , certainly the Transgressor could not be justified , whilst such , by that Law which condemned him for being such . Which puts me upon Distinguishing betwixt Justification , as it is sometimes taken , viz. for Remission , Pardon or Forgiveness of Sin past upon Repentance ; and that Justification , which implies an Acceptance with , and an Access to God , as a Keeper of the Law of the Spirit of Life , which is to be made Inherently Just. In the first Sense , Since all have sinned , no Man can be justified by the Law he has transgress'd : Therefore that great Favour and Mercy of Remission , Pardon and Forgiveness was only then generally preacht in the Name of Jesus , that such as believed in his Message should obtain . Thus by the Works of the Law shall no Flesh be justified ; because , all the Righteousness Man is capable of , ca●…ot make Satisfaction for any Unrighteousness he has committed ; since what he daily doth is but what he daily ows . But still such as keep the Law , are justified : for that a Man should be condemned both for Transgressing & Keeping the Law too , would be very hard . What shall we say then , but that Justification in the first Sense , since Adam's Day to this , hath been God's Free Love upon Repentance ; and above all , that by Christ's visible Appearance , and in his Name was Remission , Pardon , or Forgiveness preacht or held forth to the whole World , upon their believing therein , more eminently , then ever , But in the last Sense , No Man can be justified , but as he is made Just , and is found actually Doing of the Will of God ; That justifies , that is it gives Acceptance with , and Access to God : In this Sense it was , that the Apostle said , Such as are the DOERS of the Law shall be justified ; and not from the Guilt of what they formerly did against it , by then keeping it ; for that is the free Love of God alone , upon the Repentance of the Creature , ( which hath been in all former Ages , but never so eminently held forth to the World , as by the Coming of Jesus Christ in the Flesh. ) So that thus far we can approach the Honester Sort of Professors of Religion , or rather , we never were at a Distance from them , viz. That Men may be reconciled , and in a Sense justified , while Sin may not be totally destroyed : That is , God upon their Repenting of past Sins , whilst not then clearly purged from the Ground of Evil , may , and we believe , doth remit , pardon or forgive former Offences , and is thus far reconciled ; that is , h●… ceaseth to be Wrath , or at a Distance from them , as whilst they went on in a State of Disobedience to the Light. Yet forever we affirm , that no Man or Woman can be ●…ade a Child of God , but as the New Birth , Regenerat●… , and the i●…vine and Heavenly Image comes to be witnessed through the putting off the Old Man and his Deeds , and being baptized by the Holy Ghost and Fire into the one Holy Body , of which Christ , the ●…maculate Lamb of God , is Head and Lord. So that all those who apply to themselves , or others the ●…romises due to this State , unto that before-mentioned , heal themselves or other deceitfuly ; and God will judge for those things . So let all People co●…sider with Sobriety and Moderation , i●… the thi●…gs we a●…ert are not most agreeable with Scripture , and that Light of Truth , which is in their own Consciences , unto which we most of all desire to be made mani●…est . IX . Nor is this all the Good , the Life and Sufferings of that Blessed Manhood brought unto the World ; For , having been enabled so effectually to perform the Will of God Living , an●… so patiently suffered the Will of Wicked Men Dying , therein freely offering up his ●…ost Innocent Life for the World ; He certainly obtained exceeat●…g great and pretious Gifts , which , as every Man comes to believe in the ●…ight , wherewith Christ 〈◊〉 hath enlightned him , and to be lead by it , he shall assuredly f●…el a particular Benefit to him accruing from that general one procured by him , who so laid down his Life for the World. In short , As we cannot but acknowledge him a Saviour in That very Manifestation , or Coming in that prepared Bo●…y , who appeared so extraordinarily to visit the World with h●…s marvelous Light and Truth , to turn their Minds from Error and Darkness , and actually converted and reclaimed many , and endued his Followers with his own Heavenly Light , Life and Power , whereby to supply his exteriour Absence with a most lively , piercing , and effectual Ministry for the compleating the rest from Generation to Generation ; so must we needs attribute this chiefly to the Divine Light , Life and Power , that through the Manhood . of both Lord and Servants , put forth and revealed It self to the Salvation of the World. Nor are we yet , as hath been often hinted ( to speak strictly ) to asscribe the particular Salvation of every Man's Soul , to the Appearance of that same Light in Nature , in either Lord or Servant , albeit many were reacht into their very Hearts and Consciences at that time , and great and mighty things were generally procured , and Christ in that Manifestation became the Author of Salvation unto many ; but rather , as he is the Light of Men Individually , both then did , and now doth appear in the Hearts and Consciences of Men , unto the awakening of whom , and turning their Minds from that Darkness of Tradition , Formality and Sin , which had and doth overcast the Soul , unto that blessed Light in the particular , that thereby ( as to them ) suffer'd , and doth yet suffer so great and tedious an Ecclips ; ●…say , this is the Efficient of Salvation , and all other Exteriour Visitations , Ministries or Assistants , though from the same Light , are in respect of the Light in every single Man or Woman but Instrume●…al : In this Sense then Man is only a Saviour Instrumen●…ly , but Christ both , whether with reference to his own Bodily Appearance , or in the Ministry of his Servants , he is the most excellent Instrument ; and the only Efficient Cause of Salvation , as revealed and obeyed in the Consciences of Men. So that it is not the Question , Whether do the Quakers deny any Benefit to redound by Christ s Bodily Sufferings●… but Whether the Professors allow and acknowledge the Main of the Work to the Divine Life and Light ? In short , He was the General Saviour in that eminent Appearance at Jerusalem , in which he did so many great and good things for Mankind ; & a Particular Saviour , as we find him in our Hearts an holy Light shewing Sin , reproving for , and converting from it into the Holy Nature of the Light , to be Flesh of his Flesh , and Bone of his Bone. Thus have I declared , according to my Understanding grounded on Experience , and that Illumination God has given me , in Moderation , the very Truth , Weight and Tendency of the Outward Coming of Christ , and his deep Sufferings by and for the World ; And also the Nature of his Inward Coming into the Souls of Men to expel the Darkness that lodgeth there ; In both which respects , I confess him to be the Saviour of the World in general , and the Saviour of each Man in particular : But that the Benefit accruing to Men from Him as the general Saviour , is known and received only , where he is witnessed a particular Saviour , and that I will abide by ; For Christ in Man , becoming the Hope of Glory , and Man's being changed into the same Image , from Glory to Glory , even as by the Spirit of the Lord , is the Salvation and Perfection of every True Christian. CHAP. XXII . That Christ is the Light , or the Light is Christ. proved from Scripture , and so concluded ; notwithstanding two Objections , which are fully answered . THat which remains to compleat our Scriptural Discourse of the Light , is to pronounce it that which H. H. J. Faldo , Tho. Hicks , and a Multitude of other Barkers at it , despise to call it , and don 't a little undervalue both us and It because we do ; I mean CHRIST : Not that the Manifestation of Light in every Conscience is the Intire Christ , but that Christ , the Word-God , is that Light of Righteousness , which inlightens all Men ; for which the Scripture is most express in that so well known ( but little believed ) Passage delivered to us by that beloved ●…isciple , who best knew what his Lord was , and stood in no need of any of their Information , how to denominate , or rightly character him ; although they and others implicitely accuse him of Weakness , Obscurity , nay Error , if not Blasphemy too ; who make it all this ( and if it were possible more ) in a poor Quaker , for only Believing on pure Gonviction , this one weighty Passage , THAT WAS THE TRUE LIGHT WHICH INLIGHTENS ALL MANKIND COMING INTO THE WORLD . I have so throughly handled this Matter in a late Book , intituled the Spirit of Truth Vindicated , that I need the less to enlarge at this time , to which I refer the Reader for Satisfaction concerning some Objections raised against the place . However , I will briefly consider it here that our Believing Christ to be an Universal and Sufficient Light , and that to be Christ , may stand in the View of the World , upon so good Foundation , as the Testimony of that Divine and well-beloved Apostle . Two things are commonly urg'd against our Understanding , of the first Nine Verses of John , as they respect the Light. 1. Some say , that the Light here spoken of , is not a Super natural , and consequently no Saving Light , but the Light of common Reason ; Others call it of Nature , decay'd by the Fall , and what Conviction ariseth thence is only the Imperfect Remains of that Natural Light , which these Men , who thus speak , grant all to have , as well before as after Christ's coming in the Flesh. 2. Others say , that this is indeed an Universal and Saving Light , but they restrain it to that Visible Appearance , and make the ALL to be , all those that will believe ; and the World to be that New Spiritual World Christ came to create by Saving Knowledge , which Believers come into . I will briefly answer both , and therein as well all the pretended Anti-Socinians ( viz ) J. Owen , R. Baxter , T. Danson , J. Clapham , J. Bunnion , S. Eaton , J. Grig , T. Imner . T. Hicks , and abundance more who hold the former ; as those who are reputed Socinians , who hold the latter . It is agreed by the First , in the beginning of this Chapter , that Christ's Eternal Divinity is declared by the Evangelist , since some of them , and particularly J. Owen tells us out of Eusebius , that it was written on that very Occasion ; one Cerinthus then denying any such thing . This Word which was with God , and was and is God : This God , the same Person tells us in his first Epistle , is Light ; By Him all things were made , among the rest Mankind . He then tells us that This Word had Life , and from thence descends to inform us , what the Word was with respect to Man ; In Him , the Word was Life , and the Life the Light of Men ; as such , He was that True Light , and not John , who only came to bear Witness of that True Light , which inlightens all Mankind coming into the World. That this Light is Divine , and no otherwise Natural , then as it is Christ's Nature , or Natural to the Word , I shall thus prove . Man is here supposed to be before he was inlightened , therefore what ever was proper , and connatural to Man , as Man , he had before he was inlightened , that is , he had a reasonable Soul , indued with intelligent Faculties , and that clothed with a Body , fitted with sensible Organs ; The Latter differ'd him from Inanimate , the Former from Irrational Creatures . But still the Light , with which this Soul is enlightened , in reference to God , and things appertaining to its Eternal Well being , belongs not to Man , as Man : Surely then , this Light must be superadded , that is , over and above Man's Composition , as a meer Understanding Creature ; and consequently , it must descend from above , and in this Sense be Supernatural . Thus the Word created all things , and among them made Man , enlightened Man with a Supernatural Light. That this Light was not only over and above Man's Nature , but is also of a Divine and Saving , One in it self , 〈◊〉 prove from its being the Life of the Word ; for if the Life of the Word be the Light of Men , here is no such thing as descending to an Effect , to prove the Light Divine , a that the Life should bring forth a Light , and therefore this Light is Divine , because the Life of the Word that Product it is so : I say , without going to an Effect for a Proof of the Light 's Divinity , I thus Undeniably prove it from the Life it self . for that very Divine LIFE is the LIGHT , not that it createth or brings forth a Light , as a Cause doth an Effect , but is that very Light it self ; so that unless they will make that Life Natural ( I mean as they do ) Created ( though very improperly ; for a Divine Life is Natural to Christ ) they cannot conclude the Light which is not the Product , but that very same Life it felf , to be a meer Natural Light. If then the very LIFE of the Word , be the LIGHT of Men , unless the LIFE of the Word be NATURAL , the LIGHT of Men must be SUPERNATURAL , DIVINE and INFINITE , as it becomes the LIFE of the WORD ( which is GOD ) to be . And this roundly checks the dull Ignorance , or base Malice of Tho. Hicks , who either could not , or would not understand G. Whitehead , when he said The Light must needs be Divine , because the Life from whence it came is so , and the Effect is alwayes of the same Nature with the Cause , in any other sense then this , That because , saith Tho. Hicks , God is the Cause of Beasts & Trees , by G. W's Argument , therefore they are God ; For sayes he , G. W. asserts , that such as is the Cause such must the Effect be : Which strange Construction of G. W's Words , bewrayes either great Stupidity or Disingenuity . I would ask that very Angry Man ; Is there no Effect of Power , besides that of Nature ? Did the Father of T. Hicks get a B●…ast or a Man when he begat him ? Surely , unless he has abandon●…d all Understanding , methinks , ●…e that makes in his Book ●…o notable a ●…istinction betwixt Reason & Railing , by using so little of the one , and so much of the other , should put one betwixt a Natural and Potential Effect ; I mean such an Effect as proceeds from Nature , and one that comes from meer Power : The Divine Life can naturally produce nothing that is not as Divine as it self ; b●…t its Power hath made all that is not o●… itself , as well Inanimate as Animate Beings . B●…t enough of this at this time , and till this be proved not enough by those that are bet●… , as willing then proving it so . The Life of the Word being then the Light of Men , and that without any Diss●…nt , and consequently 〈◊〉 ; I have no need to prove it SAVING , till that ●…able Man has singled out Saving from ●…ivine which is not so absurd , but for all his great Skill in Divinity , he may venture at , and in my Judgment , such an Enterprise shall be sufficient to renown the Light , and ba●… him in the thoughts o●… all that forbid not Understanding in their Religion , without any further Apology . However , let me briefly say , that It being a Measure of the Tru●… Light , by way o●… Excellency , ●…ar transcending John ( ●…or as such is he preferr●…d , who is the Inlighte●…er ) and that it was through John all should believe i●… him ; and lastly , that to these who received him as the Universal Enlightener , or True Light , He gave Power to become the Sons of God , it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 follow , that the Light is Saving : and indeed I have with multiplied Arguments and Testimonies 〈◊〉 made appear from Scripture and Story the Universality and Sufficiency of that Divine Light. Such then that say , it is decayed , because they are themselves , methinks , resemble those at Sea , who , being under Sail , fancy the Shoar moves . The Fault is in the Eye , blinded by the God of the World , and not in that blessed Light , which shines unprofitably upon the Blind ( through their own Blindness got by Disobedience ) Let them by unfeigned Repentance be unscaled , and the Sun will give good Proof of its Light ; Darkness ought not to charge the Light , but it s●…f that it sees not . Tho. Hicks confesseth All are inlightened , but denyes the Sufficiency thereof : yet refuses to be ruled by it : Let him first obey it , before he despiseth it , and prove himself above it , before he throws it so far below a Christian : He may be allowed then to blame the Light as Impotent , when he can live Uncondemned of it , or Experience can tell us its Insufficiency to Well-Living : T is vain to undervalue That which chargeth both with Duty omitted , and Sin committed . Happy Man were he , if leaving Prejudice , he obeyed the Light within , it would not teach him to write Lyes , Slanders and Forgeries , nor to call Men Knave , much less to threaten them with Blows whom he scurrilously named so . But Our Religion is to Bear and His to Abuse . However , this stands sure , that the Life of the Word is the Light of Men , and consequently Divine ; and ( to say nothing of the Absurdity of their Phraises ) there I will leave this first Sort of Men , and their fruitless Opposition . To the Second Interpretation given , destructive of that Scope we testifie the Light to have , I return thus much . That because the Light of Men was the Life of the Word , which Word was God , by whom all things were created , and that all Men are mentioned in that place controverted , which presupposeth no further Qualification in order to have this Light , then being born one of that all Men into this World ; I conclude , that it is not only a most False , but Injurious Notion , to assert the Commencement or being o●… that Light , to be from the Coming of Christ in the Flesh. Besides , since this relates to the whole Man , which Word begins with Adam , and ends with the last of Man's Race , I cannot conceive how that Exposition can be valid ; for then John would have been before Christ , instead of Christ's being before Abraham ; whereas , therefore is John denyed to be that Light , because that true Light by Way of Excellency was the Enlightener of all Men , yea , of John himself , and therefore call●…d that true Light , that is , the Fountain of all Light , Light it self , from whom all derives , but he derives from none . And to say nothing at this time of the miserable Estate those of Mankind must labour under antecedently to Christ's Coming in the Flesh , let it be considered , that these first Nine Verses in John , relate not in the least to his Fleshly Appearance , from whence those Men would date both his Original , and Man's Illumination , but are a continued Series of the highest Proofs of a Divinity , that we might as well know what He was before He came , as when He did come ; and the one was an Introduction to the other . Neither is it fair for these Men to a●…egorize Christ out of his Divinity , and yet deny us any Allegory to prove it . If they deny Meanings elsewhere , let them do so here ; It unbecomes Men that have their Wits , to rack them , to prop meer Fancy . Further let me add , that as He who then came into the World , was the same that created that World , into which he came , and therefore Previous , or before such Coming ●…o neither can it hold that the World , into wa●…ch M●… comes , is the New Creation , since it is not said , who believe , which is usually joyned to things of that importance ( believe and be saved , &c. ) Nor can such as don't believe , be totally excluded from being lighted , 〈◊〉 the Wicked could not Rebell against it , if they had 〈◊〉 ; 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Evil Actions be Reproved without it : So that all such 〈◊〉 is forreign , both from Scripture , Reason , and indeed Probability also . We shall conclude then , that Christ , the Word-God , is the Light of the World , that all are inlightened by Him , the Eternal Sun of Righteousness ; therefore the Light of Men is Christ : For to Him , that is , Christ , or True Light , John testified , who gives Wicked Men to see their Unrighteousness , and who leads Good Men on in the Way of Holiness , which , persevered in , brings unquestionably to Eternal Happiness : and without which all Imputation of general Acts of Righteousness by another , will avail nothing in the great and terrible Day of God's Inquest : when J. Faldo , J. Bunion , J. Grig , and that malitious T. Hicks , with the rest of their Omnious Fraternity in Notion , shall be judged , not by the Deeds any other hath done for them ( wholy without them ) but according to the Deeds done in their own Mortal Bodies . This Subject I shall conclude , with a few Reasons for the Universality and Sufficiency of the Light within , that we may not only be seen to have Scripture , and other Authorities , but Reason , which is more universal , of our side too . CHAP XXIII The Universality of the Light proved by Reason . THat there is an Universal Light , the Universality of all Ages have plentifully restified unto . There is nothing more constant now that can plead either such Antiquity , or general Consent : Not a Nation in the World ever knew an Age , in which it was destitute of such a Discovery of Internal Light , as gave to 〈◊〉 Evil from Good , That Virtue was ever most commendable , and Vics above all things pernicious and damnable ; This is matter of Fact , which I have already proved , and the most Barbarous of Nations now inhabited , are a clear Demonstration of what I say : conclude therefore , that since both Wicked and Good in all Ages have acknowledged to Well and ill Doing , and that this depends upon the Discovery of that Divine Light which manifests every Reproveable Action ; that none of Mankind are exempted from this Illumination . But again , it is highly consistent with the Goodness of God , and Order of his Creation ; since it seems unreasonable , that Men should have the Benefit of a Natural Sun which shines on the Just and Unjust , by which to direct their Steps , and securely transact all corporal Affairs ; and yet their Souls be le●…t destitute of a Spiritual Luminary ; or Sun of Righteousness , when unto the Salvation of a single Soul , Christ counts the World of no value . The Soul then hath Eves as well as the Body ; and as Men may see , if they please , when the Sun is in the outward Firmament , unless they on Purpose close their Eyes , so may all rational Souls see , if they will , by their Eye of Reason , that Spiritual Sun , which gives as true Discerning and Direction to the Mind , how to think and desire as the Natural Sun doth the Body , how to act and walk aright . Were not this true , here would be a falling into a miserable Charging of God with Neglect to his Creatures ; For since it is to be supposed that God made nothing but with a Design it should acknowledge a Creator , after its respective Nature ; and that Man's Duty was peculiar , namely Divine Homage and Worship , exprest generally by a 〈◊〉 correspond●…nt to that Being which made him , it is just that we believe God hath indued Mankind with something that is Divine , in order to it ; since oth●… , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be destitute of what only co●…ld enable him to 〈◊〉 that Duty , without which he co●…ld not , please nor acknowledge God. If then all Mankind ought to Worship , Fear , and Reverence God , Certainly all mankind have an Ability from God so to do , or else perfect impossibilities are expected ; because ( otherwise ) a most impotent Creature : But it can never stand certainly with the Rectitude or Righteousness of the Eternal God to expect that from Man , he never gave him Power to do ; or the Improvement of a Talent he never had . In short , if we ought to think that God is to be reverenc'd and worship'd , we must agree that he has 〈◊〉 Mankind with a Divine Light and Knowledge in order to that End , or say with the Man in Matthew , God is as hard Master , an Austere Lord , he reaps where he never sowed , But I am almost of the Mind , that the Principles and Pre●…dice of some encline them rather to think hardly of God , then favourably of the Light. How ill doth it become th●…se to object an Impossibility of the Light 's bearing their 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , who are daily wounding it with their Rebellions ? But they object , Some deny they have it , and others by their 〈◊〉 Lives shew they are void of it . To which I say , It is not impossible for a Life of Worldly Care , or Pleasures & ●…right Debauchery , to darken and quite blind that Eye which only sees the Light of Truth ( and being kept single , preserves the Body full of Light ) but this makes no A●…eration in the Light ; if through Repentance and Contrition the Scales fall off , the Light refuses not it self to the Eye that can and will see it ; the Light remains unaltered , 't is Man that changes . Would the Running Mad of some Men be a good Argument to prove Mankind irrational ? neither is it any Demonstration against the Universality of the Light within , because some have by the Stupifyings of Sin rendred themselves I●…sensible of it . Nor doth Ill-living disprove the Light , enough improve Disobedience to it ; Is it good 〈◊〉 that 〈◊〉 Wicked Man will not receive good Advice , therefore he never was well advised ? And what better Reason can it be to say , Men disobey the Light , therefore they never had it ; whilst that proves they had it , at least as a Condemner ? A Man may be said to be enlightened , when he knows and does not his Duty ; but rather I confess , when he becomes embettered by such Illumination : In the first Sense , All are illuminated , in the last , only such as having the Light , joyn to it , and obey it ; for they will find their Understandings illuminated to that Degree , which the Disobedience of others shuts them up from . In short , All have Light to Reprove , unless they have quite put out their Eyes ; but such only have it beneficially , as their Teacher and Director who receive it ( as well as have it ) in the Love of it . Since then the Consent of Mankind , the Goodness and Justice of God , & Reason of the thing it self plead so strongly for the Universality of this Light , I need say the less , and shall descend to consider its Sufficiency . CHAP. XXIV . The Sufficiency of the Light proved by Reason . BEcause as well the Sufficiency as Universality of the Light , is struck at by our Adversaries , it shall not , I hope , seem amiss , if I say something briefly to it , though much of what I have said in the former is referrable to this . That the Universal Light is also Sufficient , is a Belief so Reasonable & Necessary , that the Opposite Opinion must needs impeach God of Want of Rectitude . All grant , that God has made Man Rational , capable of a measurable Knowledge of his Creator , which his bare Capacity will never give him , unless God please to make some Discovery of himself suitable to that Created Capacity in the Creature : Certainly then , since God desires not that the Creature should receive a wrong Impression of him , and yet he requires Universal due Fear and Reverence , he must needs have given some Certain and Sufficient Discovery , in order to it , by those Lively Manifestations , and most Sensible Touches of the Light to and upon the Soul , which cannot but be true , clear , and if minded , efficacious ; For that God should require Men to serve him , and not give them what is sufficient , is worse then not to give at all , since Man 's not Obeying such Discoveries , is not so great an Aggravation of his Neglect , as the Imperfection of them is , either of his Insufficiency , or Unwillingness that made them to do otherwise . What is this but to say , God expects Homage from Men as their Soveraign Lord , and that they live uprightly in the World , yet he has given them no Ability , in order to do it ? He pronounces such Miserable who conform themselves not to an Holy Life , but gives no Power to avoid the Curse ? In short , though Reason tell us , he made none purposely to Destroy them , but rather that he might be glorified in their Salvation , which he is also said to invite Men to ; yet that he designs nothing less , by leaving any , or all Mankind under the Fa●…ntings of an Impossible Success . But , as such Dismal Consequences belong not to the Truth ( what ever share such kind of Calvinistical Predestinarians may have therein ) so we are well assured , that the Light of which we speak , has ever been Sufficient to the End for which it has been given in every Age , both to Manifest Evil , Condemn for it , and Redeem by the Holy Inclinings and Operation of its Power , those who are the Diligent Disciples of it ; For it seems most Unreasonable , that the Spirit of Darkness should be sufficient , to draw into , and Destroy by Sin , and yet the Spirit of Light not be sufficient to Redeem and Save from it . Since therefore we cannot admit of any Insufficiency in the Light within , but we must suppose , that whilst God would be rightly worshipt , he has too darkly discovered the Way how to do it aright ; that bis Gift is Impotent , that Man is required to do what he has no Power to perform ; and that , whilst God requires Man to serve him , he hath not so much as shown him what way he ought to do it ; All which Consequences are most Unworthy of God : We rather chuse to sit down contented with this Belief , that God , who made Man , and has given him a Soul Capable of Knowing and Serving his Maker , hath also endued him with Divine Knowledge , by a SUPERADDED LIGHT AND POWER , and enabled him thereby , to live subservient to that Knowledge ; That God's Gift is perfect and sufficient for that Work ; and that such as are led by it , must needs be led to God , unto which , that Divine Light naturally tends , and attracts , as that from whom it came : which is certainly a State of blessed Immortality . In short , accept these few Arguments Comprehensive of these two Chapters , and indeed most of what goes before . 1. God requires no Man to do any thing , he has nog given him first to Know , and the●… Power to Do. But God requires every Man to fear him , and work Righteousness ; Consequently , He has given every Man both a Discovery of his Will , and Power to do it . 2. No Man ought to worship the true God Ignorantly : But every Man is commanded to worship God ; therefore , He is to do it Knowingly . 3. No Man can know God , but He must ●…over it to him , and that cannot be without Light ; therefore , every Man has Light. 4. This Light must be Sufficient , or God's Gifts are Imperfect , and answer not the end for which they were given ; But God's Gifts are perfect , and can perform what they are designed to ; therefore , since the Light is his Gift , it must be Sufficient . The Sum is this ; Every Man ought to Fear , Worship and Obey God. No Man can do it a●…ight , that knows him not . No Man can know him , but by the Discovery he makes of himself . No Discovery can be made without Light : Nor this Light give that Discovery if imperfect ●…r Insuffecient in Nature ; Therefore , all have a Sufficient Light to this great End and Purpose , viz. To Fear , Worship and Obey God. CHAP. XXV . The 〈◊〉 , Who He , or They are that obey the Light , & c ? Considered and Answered ; being a Character of a true Quak r. AS I took Occasion to begin this Discourse from the late Dialogue , so shall I end so much of it as immediately concerns the Light with my Answer to the third Query made by T. Hicks , W●…o this He , or They are that obey this Light , and in obeying attain S●…lvation ' If I should take his Question as personally directed , I mean , what Man or Men they be , I should decline to answer ; for the Controversy is not now of Person but Principles . I rather take this to be his Meaning , What are the Qualifications of those that obey this Light ? Not what are their Names ; but what kind or manner of People are they ? In short , what is it to obey the Light ? I think I have so fully exprest my self already in this Matter , that with an 〈◊〉 Adversary I might be saved the Pains of any further considering it ; But that nothing may be thought to be 〈◊〉 as Unanswerable , which is so easy to be answered , I tell him and all Men , and that not without some Knowledge experimental of what I say , That such 〈◊〉 the Light , who 〈◊〉 all that it manifests to be Evil , and inclines to perform all that it requires to be done ; For Example : When the Light shows that it is Inconsistent with a Man fearing God , to be 〈◊〉 , 〈◊〉 , Proud , Covetous , Backbiting , Envious , Wrathful , Unmerciful , Revengeful , Prophane , Drunken , Voluptuo●… , 〈◊〉 , which with such like are called in Scripture , the Fruits of the Flesh , and Works of Darkness ; and Persons so qualified , the Children of Wrath , such as delight not to retain God in their Knowledge , &c. I say , when the Light discovers these things to be Inconsistent with a Man fearing God , He , who truly Obeyes the Light , denyes and forsakes them , however Cress it be to Flesh and Blood , and let it cost him never so dear : Though Relations do both threaten and entreat , the World m●…ck , and he be sure to become the Song of the Drunckard , and a De●…ision to his Ancient Companions , No , he dare not conform himself any more to the Fashions of the World which pass away , and that draw out the Mind into vain and unprofitable Delights , by which the 〈◊〉 in him had been 〈◊〉 ; neither to gratifie the Lust of the Eye , the Lust of the Flesh , and the Pride of Life , which are not of the Nature of his Father , who has begotten better Desires in him : He rejects the Conversation he once had in the World , and in the Eye of its Children seems a Man Forlorn and Distracted ; he takes up the Cross , desp●…ses the Shame , and willingly drinks o●… the Cup of bitter Mockings , and yields to be baptized with the Baptism of deep Tryals Christ Jesus , his Lord , 〈◊〉 of , and was baptized with . He is as well taught to deny the Religions , as Cares and Pleasures of the World. Such as prosess Religion from what they have either been taught by others , or read and gathered with their Carnal Minds in the Scriptures , intruding into the Practices of either Prophets or Apostles as to External and Shadowy things , not being led thereto by the same Power they had , he can have no Fellowship with ; He counts all such Faith and Worship Imagination made of Men , or a meer lifeless Imitation ; He prefers one Sight begotten from a Sence of God's Work in the Heart beyond the longest Prayers in that State ; He leaves them all , walks as a Man alone , fearing to offer God a Sacrifice that is not of His own Preparing ; He charges all other Faiths and Worships with Insufficiency and meer creaturely Power , which are not held and performed from an holy Conviction and Preparation by the Angel of God , the Light of his Presence in the Heart and Conscience ; therefore goes he forth in the Strength of his God against the Merchants of Babylon , Woes and Plagues are Rightly in his Mouth against those Buyers and Sellers of the Souls of Men : He is Jealous for the Name of the Lord ; And therefore dares not speak Peace unto them , neither can be put into their Mouths , but testifies against all such Wayes ; Freely he received , freely he gives . Thus is this Man Unravel'd , Unreligion'd , Unbottom'd as to his former State , wherein he was Religious upon Letter , Form , Mens Traditions , Education , and his own Imagination ; He is as a Man quite undone , that he may be made what he should be . Thus is he convinced of Sin and of Righteousness too ; and the Joy he once had when he girded himself and went whether he would , is now turned into Sorrow , and his Rejoycing , into Ho●…ling : He has beheld God in the Light , and abhors himself in Dust and Ashes ; Sin , that was pleasant once in the Mouth , he finds bitter in the Belly , and that which the World esteems worthy their Care he flies as a Man would do a Bear robbed of her Whelps ; Sin is become exceeding Sinful to him , insomuch that he cries out , who shall deliver him ? He labours greatly , and is very heavy loaden : He is not willing to fly in the Winter , but is resolved to stand the Tryal ; For this Man not only brings his former Deeds to the Light , and there suffers Judgment to pass upon them , but patiently takes part in that Judgment , who was so great an Accessory to them . Nor doth his Obedience conclude with the Sentence given against past Sins , and himself that committed them ; but most patiently endures the Hand of the Lord till his Indignation be overpast , and till that which condemned Sin ( the Fruit ) hath destroyed the very Root of it , which hath taken so deep hold in his Heart , and the same Spirit of Judgment that condemned Sin , be brought forth into perfect Victory over the very Nature and Power of Sin. This Judgment is found in the Light , therefore do the Sons of the Night reject the Knowledge of its Wayes , and the Children of the Day joy greatly in its Appearance . But neither is this all that makes up that Good Man , who obeys the Light ; For a compleat Son of Light , is one that has conquer'd and expel'd the Darkness ? 'T is true , he was once Darkness , but now Light in the Lord , because he hath been turned from Darkness to the Light , and from Satan's Power unto God , who is Light it self , and with him is his Fellowship continually . This is the Man who in the Way of the Light hath met with the Inward Cleansing ; for having been purged by the Spirit of Judgment , and the Spirit of Burning ( otherwise called the severe Reproofs , Stroaks and Terrors of the Light in the Conscience he has ever a Watch set up in his Heart ; A Thought must not pass which has not the Watch-Word , but at every Appearance he cries , Stand , if a Friend , and owned o●… the Light ( who is the great Leader ( given of God for that Purpose ) then he lets It pass ; otherwise , he brings It to the Commander of the Conscience , who is to sit in Judgment upon It. Thus is Christ the Light , King , Judge and Lawgiver ; And by this he grows strong , & increaseth with the Increases of God : Yet he often reads the Scriptures , and that with much Delight , greatly admiring the exceeding Love of God to former Ages , which he himself witnesseth to be true in this ; and many things are opened to his Refreshment . So is the Light the Just Man's Path , that in every Age still shined brighter and brighter , in which the cleansing Blood of Jesus Christ is felt to cleanse from all Sin ; Thus doth he bridle his Thoughts , so that his Words and Actions offend not . Above all , he is often retired to the Lord , loves Fellowship with him , waits for dayly Bread , not in his own Words , Strivings or Will , but emty of Thoughts , or the Peace or Comfort that is drawn or imagined from thence , he silently waits to feel the Heavenly Substance brought into his Soul , by the Immediate Hand of the Lord , for it is not fetching in this Thought , or remembring the other Passage in Scripture , or calling to Mind what has been formerly known , but every Immediate Word that proceeds from out of the Mouth of God , that can satisfie him . In short , He that obeyes the Light , is thereby taught to deny Ungodliness and Worldly Lusts , and to be Sober Righteous , Patient , Humble , Meek , Upright , Merciful , Forbearing , Forgiving , Peaceable , Gentle , Self-denying , Constant , Faithful and Holy , because the Lord his God is Holy. Thus have I given a brief Account as well what HE is not , as what HE is that is Obedient to the Light within , which is Christ's Appearance in the Heart , whose Holy Blood is felt to Cleanse , Attone and Save all those who believe and abide therein . CHAP. VI. The Discourse hithertoo 〈◊〉 up , and concluded with an Exhortation to all Professors of Religion , esp●…cially our Opposers . I Will sum up the whole of this Discourse into these few Heads . I. That Salvation is to be saved from Sin first , and Wrath consequentially ; He shall save them from their Sins . II. That Christ , the Word-God , has enlightened all Mankind , not only a●…ter his Coming in the Flesh , but before : And that the Light has ever been Sufficient as well as Universal to lead to God all such as have obeyed it , as by its Properties and Effects is demonstrated . III. That the Difference betwixt the Time of the Law and that of the Gospel , as generally distinguisht , was in Manifestation not in Nature . God might be as much more propitiou●… and bou●…ti ui to the last Ages ( be it , that they were better able 〈◊〉 receive such extraordinary Discoveries , or that it wa●… the alone good Pleasure of his Soveraign Will ) as he was to the former Ages , yet that he gave them a Sufficiency of the same Divine Light to conduct them through the World to Eternal Blessedness . IV. That Jews and Creeks , Heathens and Christians agree in this . V. That still the Preheminence is given to Christ's Manifestation in Flesh , both generally and particularly , that being both the Fulness of Time , and Fulness of Discovery , which put an end to the Types and Figures and Car●…al Co●…mandements , by shewing forth an Abrogation and Consu●…tion of them all , in the Substance it self : In which State they are not needed ; but in Comparison thereof , they are ( though once they were as Calenders , for weak People to read some mystically Glory by ) but Beggarly Elements . VI. That not only in that Flesh did the Eternal Light preach forth it self the End of these Things , by Revealing & becoming the Author of a more plain and perfect Way ( though less easie to Flesh and Blood ) placing the Stress of all upon an Eva●…gelical Righteousness , whereof he became the first Mi●…er , and our most Holy Example ) but he also appear'd in that publick Body ( so peculiarly prepared ) a General Saviour , by his Life , Doctrine , Miracles , Death of the Cross & Resurrection ; in and by all which he obtained a Name above every Name . VII . That nevertheless not to the Body , but holy Light of Life therein , is chiefly to be asscribed the Salvation ; and to the Body however excellent , but Instrumentally : for that it was the Eternal Light and Life , which gave the Weight to all the Actions and Sufferings of the Body . VIII . That the Benefit then procured is not witnessed by any , but as they come to believe in Christ the Light , as he doth appear in the Heart and Conscience , to save from Sin , destroy the Works of the Devil , finish Transgression , and bring in of his Everlasting Righteousness : Wherefore to fancy one's self intituled to a State of Salvation , whilst in Rebellion against the Light within ( which is Christ's inward Knocking and Appearance ) must needs be a Delusion most pernicious , and destructive to the Souls of men . IX . That upon the whole it is determin'd and concluded , that Christ is that Light which shineth in the Conscience . X. That the Light is prov'd by Reason both Universal and Sufficient ; The first from the Consent of Mankind , the Goodness and Rectitude of God ; the second from both Experience , and that it were inconsistent with God , to give a Light to his Creature insufficient for the Work for which he gave it . Thus in short have I given the Heads and Results of most of the Matter contained in the whole Discourse upon the Light ; and I intreat our Adversaries , they would seriously weigh the Whole , before they either reject it , or endeavour to reply to it : But let them be advised to try the Virtue of the Light , before they sentence it to have none ; And in the Love of God be once prevail'd upon to consider , if something in them doth not really Condemn them , amongst other things for these brisk Attempts against it . Oh! Why should Men covet to Know so far beyond what they do faithfully Practise ? Let them first out-live the Just and Holy Requirings of the. LIGHT , before they put these Barbarous Affronts upon it , of a WIL IN THE WISP , A DARK LANTHORN-LIGHT , NATURAL , INSUFFICIENT , IGNIS FATUUS , THE QUAKERS IDOL , and abundance of such like Frothy , Prophane , and indeed Blasphemous Epithetes , which they wickedly bestow upon IT , as if they were Its P●…per Names ; when the Scriptures they would oppose to it , plainly tell them , that the whole Work of the Apostolical Ministry was , To turn People from Darkness to the Light , from the Power of Sathan unto God , that they might have Remission of Sins : As much as to say , Such as are turned to the Light , are turn'd to God , who is Light ; and those who abide there , both have Remission of the Punishment , and Purgation from the Defilement of Sin. And whatever any may think of us , we both believe , assert , and will maintain against Men and Divels , that God is LIGHT ; and that out of the Light , or void of his Divine Illumination , no man can Know him , and consequently not Worship him , unless they should worship an Unknown God : That such as receive this Illumination , and rebel not against it ; but improve this Heavenly Talent , they have Fellowship with the Pure Eternal God , and experience the Blood of Jesus Christ to cleanse the●… from all Unrighteousness . If any think to arrive at Glory another Way , and will not be admonisht , let them proceed ; we speak what we know , and can but declare what we have felt of the Work of God in our Hearts . The Scriptures we highly value : But we believe not the things we often quote thence , to be true , Only because there , but for that we are Witnesses of the same Operation , and bring in our experimental Testimonies to confirm the Truth of theirs : and such truly honour the Scriptures ; all others are at best but empty Scribes , and Pharisaical Babblers . So with God I leave my Labour in this Particular , desiring , that his Heavenly Light may yet more abundantly arise upon the Dark Hearts of Mankind and awaken them to Repentance , that since IT hath so long shined in Darkness uncomprehended , till even Darkness it self is grown so impudent as to interpret its Inability , to see the Insufficiency of the Light , he would be pleased to cause it to shine out of Darkness , that IT might plead the Excellency of ITS own Divine Nature in the Consciences of Men and Women , against the daily Scornes and base Detractions , that even great Professors of Christianity stick not to fling upon It ; so ill are they principl'd , and so un-Christianly employ'd , which proves to me , how little they are Profess●…rs of the True , Pure and Undefiled Religion , what ever Place their cunning Devices may have given them in the Hearts of Weak and Simple People . My Soul pittyeth their Opposition , and feareth the Consequence of such Resistance ; and desires they may see the very Vanity of their Endeavours against the Light , Repent of them , and be Converted , that God may yet Heal them : which sincere Desire is my Return for all their Hard Speeches and Ungodly Sayings against us in general , and my self in particular . W. Penn. AN APPENDIX To the First Part ; being a Discourse OF THE GENERAL RULE OF Faith and Life , AND Judge of Controversie . Greatly importing all those who desire to take Right Measures of Faith ; and to Determine ( at least to themselves ) the numerous Controvers●…es now on foot in the World. By the same Author . For in Christ Jesus , neither Circumcision availeth any thing , nor Uncircumcision , but a NEW Creature : And as many as walk according to THIS Rule , Peace be on them , and Mercy , and upon the whole Israel of God , Gal. 6. 16. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit ; for the Spirit searcheth all things , yea , the deep things of God — The Things of God knoweth no Man save the Spirit of God — He that is Spiritual judgeth all things , 1 Cor. 2. 10 , 11 , 15. But ye have an Unction from the Holy One ; and ye know all things , 1 John 2. 20. Printed in the Year 1673. OF THE GENERAL RULE OF Faith and Life . SInce there be so many Faiths in the World , and perplext Controversies about them ; and that it greatly behoveth every man ( if to Contend for , then first ) to Know the True Faith that overcometh the World , It may not be unnecessary to say something of the General Rule of Faith and Life , and Judge of Controversie , at this time . And indeed I am prest to it from this weighty Consideration , that Men perish for Want of it , and can no more arrive at Truth without it , then the distressed Mariner can gain his Port who sailes without either Star or Compass . I shall begin with an Explanation of the Terms , Rule , and Faith , of which we shall first treat , that we may as well express what we intend by the one , as what we mean by the other , which will be a proper Introduction to the whole Discourse . By General Rule , &c. we understand , that Constant Measure or Standard by which Men have been in all Ages enabled to Judge of the Truth or Error of Doctrines , and the Good or Evil of Thoughts , Words and Actions . By Faith we understand an Assent of the Mind in such manner to the Discoveries made of God thereto , as to resign up to God , and have Dependence upon him , as the Great Creator and Saviour of his People , which is inseparable from good Works . That Men in all Ages have had a Belief of God , and some Knowledge of him ( though not upon equal Discovery ) must be granted from that account that all Story gives us of Mankind in matters of Religion ; several have fully performed this : Ofold , Justin Martyr , Clemens Alexandrinus , Augustine , and others ; of later times , Du Plessy , Grotius , Amiraldus , L. Herbert , with many more : And indeed the reliques we have of the most ancient Historians and Authors , are a Demonstration in the Point . Now the Scripture tells us , that no Man knows the Father but the Son , and he to whom the Son reveals him : And as none knows the things of Man , save the Spirit of Man ; so the things of God knows no Man , but the Spirit of God. Hence we may safely conclude , that the Creating Word that was with God , and was God , in whom was Life , and that Life the Light of Men ; who is the Quickning Spirit , was He , by whom God in all Ages must have been revealed ; consequently , that Light or Spirit hath been the General Rule of mens Knowledge , Faith and Obedience , with respect to God. And thus much Pythagoras ( that liv'd about Six Hundred Years before those Words were spoak or writ ) laid down for a Maxim , viz. That no man can know what is agreeable to God , except a man hear God himself , that is , within ; for that was his Doctrine : To which the Apostle and Prophet thus agree ; 1. In that whatever makes manifest is Light. 2. That whatever might be known of God was manifest within ; for God ( who is Light , 1 Joh. 1. 5. ) had shewn it unto them : And God hath shewn unto thee , O Man , what is good and acceptable , &c. which could not be without his Light shining in Man's Conscience ; Therefore the Light of God in the Conscience must needs have been the general Rule , &c. It was by this Law , that Enoch , Noah , Abraham , Melchisedeck , Abimeleeh , Job , Jethro , &c. walked and were accepted , as saith Irenaeus & Tertullian , They were Just by the Law written in their Hearts ; then was it their Rule to and in that just State. Obj. It seems then you deny the Scripture to be the General Rule , &c. Answ. How can they be the General Rule , that have not been General ? That which was both before , and since they were in being , must needs be more general then they : But that was this Light in the Conscience , the Law and Guide of those Patriarchs ( for the Scriptures began long after in Moses ) consequently that must be the general Rule , &c. Obj. But granting that the Light within were so before Scripture was extant , yet since the Writing of holy Scripture , the Scripture , and not the Light , hath been the general Rule . Answ. That cannot be , unless Palestina or Canaan , a little Province of Asia , was the whole World ; and the Jews , a particular People , all Mankind : For at what time the Writings were among the Jews , other Nations were only left to the Law and Light within ; This the Apostle confirmeth in that Passage , For the Gentiles , which have not the Law ( that is , the outward Law , or Law written ) do by Nature the things conteined in the Law , which sheweth the Work of the Law written in their Hearts . And the Gentiles themselves called it , the immutable Law , the everlasting Foundation of Vertue ; no liveless Precepts , but immortal ; a sacred Good , God the Overseer ; the living Rule , the Root of the Soul ; that which makes the Good Man. Thus Thales , Pythagoras , Socrates , Plato , Plotin , Hieron , Philo , Plutarch , as cited : And saith Sophocles , God grant that I may alwaies observe that vener●…ble Sanctity in my Words and Deeds which these noble Precepts ( writ 〈◊〉 Mans Heart ) requ●…re ; God is their Father : neither shall they ever be abrogated ; for there is in them a GREAT GOD that never waxeth Old. More reverent Epithetes then John Faldo and T. Hicks can afford , as their Books too openly witness ; yet would go for Christian-men , though manifestly short of Heathens . Thus is it evident that the Scripture was not the general Rule , a●…ter it was given forth . Obj. But hath it not been since ; and is it not now the general Rule , & c ? Answ. There hath been since , and is now the same Impediment ; for before Christ's coming in the Flesh , and since , where the Scriptures never reach d , there hath been the same Light : And though Nations ( through not glorifying God as God , when they have known him ) have bin so given up to all manner of Impieties , as that their Understandings have been greatly vail'd ; yet did not the Light within so wholely loose its Ruling Exercise among them , as that they lived without any Sence of such thing ; Therefore still the Scriptures have not been , neither are the General Rule , no not so much as of any Age ; since in no Age can it be prov'd , that the whole World was furnished with them : But had they been so for some one or two Ages , as they never were ; yet the granting it will not reach our Question , where the Word General , implieth the Nature of the Thing it self , respecting Mankind from the Beginning to this Day , and so to the End. Obj. But is not the Scripture the Rule , &c. of our Day ? Answ. If The Rule , then the General Rule ; for whatsoever is The Rule of Faith and Life , excludeth all other from being General , they being but particular in respect of it self ; Therefore not The Rule of Faith and Life . But besides their not being Cenetal , I have several Reasons to offer , why they cannot be The Rule of Faith and Life , &c. 1. If now the Rule , then ever the Rule : But they were not ever the Rule ; and therefore they cannot now be the Rule . That they were not ever the Rule is granted ; But that they are not therefore now the Rule may be by some denyed , which I shall prove . If the Faith of God's People in all Ages be of one Nature , then the Rule but of one Nature : But clear it is , Heb. 11. The Faith has been but of one Nature ; Consequently , the Rule but of one Nature . In short , If the holy Ancients had Faith before they had and wrote Scr●…pture , they had a Rule before they had or wrote Scripture ; for where Faith is , there is a Rule for that Faith ; And if the Faith be of one Nature , the Rule is of one Nature : And since the Faith is Inward , Spiritual , begotten of the Immortal Word , in which is Life , and that the Light of men ; and that this Word , Life and Light was the Rule , then no more Book , Writing or ingraving on visible and perishable Matter can be the Rule now . Again ; Such as the Faith is , such must the Rule be : But the Faith is as before , Inward and Spirual ; therefore the Rule must be Inward and spiritual , which no meer Book can be . 2. If the Scriptures were the Rule , they must have always been a perfect Rule , ever since they were a Rule : But this is impossible , since they were many hundred years in writing and are now imperfect also , as to Number ; How then the perfect Rule ? That they were not the Perfect Rule before they were written must be granted ; and that they were many hundred Years awriting , must also be allowed ; and that they are imperfect now , as to Number , I prove . First , Enoch's Prophecy is mentioned by Jude , but not extant in the Bible ; the Books of the Wars of the Lord , Numb . 21. 14. The Book of Jasher , Josh. 10. 13. 2 Sam. 1. 18. The Book of Nathan , 2 Chron. 9. 29. The Book of Shemaiah , 2 Chron. 12. 15. The Book of Jehu ; The Epistle of Paul to the Laodiceans , Collos. 4. 16. and several others , mentioned in the Scriptures , not now extant : And lastly Luke sayes , That many took in hand to relate from Eye-Witnesses the things most surely believed , &c. Now 't is taken for granted that John wrote many Years after Luke ; Some think Luke wrote before Mark : However , Matthew and Mark were not many ; and to this day we see no more then those four in our Bibles , and therefore many such Writings lost ; and if lost , then the Scriptures not perfect ; and if imperfect , how can they be the Rule of Faith , since the Rule of Faith must be perfect ? 3. My third Reason is this ; The Scriptures , however useful to Edification and Comfort , seem not in their own Nature and Frame to have been compil'd and delivered , as the Rule and intire Body of Faith ; but rather upon particular Occasions and Emergencies . The Doctrines are scattered throughout the Scriptures , insomuch that those Societies who have given forth verbal Confessions of their Faith , have been necessitated to toss them to and fro , search here and search there , to lay down this or the other Principle ; and then as like the original Text as their Apprehensions are ; whereas , were it as plain and distinct as the Nature of a Rule requires , they needed only to have given their Subscription for a Confession . Besides , here they are Proper , there Metaphorical ; in one place Literally , in another Mystically to be accepted : Most times Points are to be prov'd by comparing and weighing Places coherent ; here to allude aptly and not wrong the Sense is difficult , and requires infallible Discerning , notwithstanding the Brawlers of our times against Infallibility : Now from all this , with abundance more that might be said , plain it is , that the Scriptures are not plain , but to the spiritual man ; but , as Peter said of Paul s Writings , in many things hard to be understood ; therefore not the Rule , which ought to be plain , proper and intelligible . 4. Again , the Scripture cannot be the Rule of Faith , because it cannot give Faith ; for Faith is the Gift of God , which overcomes the World : neither of Practice , because it cannot distinguish of it self in all Cases what ought to be practised , and what not ; it containing as well what ought not to be practised , as what ought . This was the Case of Christ's Disciples , who had no particular Rule in the old Testament Writings , for the abolishing of some part of the old Testament Religion ; on the contrary , they might have pleaded for the Perpetuity of it , because Christ said unto them , Do as they say , that sit in Moses ' s Chair , more reasonably then many make that a Plea now adayes for their invented Worships : What guided them in their declaring void and relinquishing those things ? For Instance ; God gave Circumcision as a Sign for ever ; And Paul tells the Galatians , That if they be circumcised , Christ should profit them nothing : Was not this the Spirit of Truth that leads into all Truth , that they made the Judge and Rule of their Doctrine and Practices ? So James and the Assembly of the Apostles , when they said , It seem●…th good to the Holy Ghost and to us , &c. 5. These very men that say , it is the Rule of Faith and Life , deviate in their Proof from their Assertion ; for the Scriptures no where say so of themselves . He that flyes to Meanings and Interpretations ; The Question arises not about the Truth of the Text , for that is agreed on on all hands ; but the Exposition of it : If then I yield to that Man , do I bow to the Letter of the Text , or to his Interpretation ? If the Latter , as manifestly I do , is the Scripture or that Man's Sense of it my Rule ? Nay the Person so interpreting makes not the Scripture his Rule but his own Apprehension , whatever he may say to gain Credit to his Conceptions in others ; then Mine it must needs be , I consenting thereto . 6. How shall I be assured that these Scriptures came from God ? I am bound to try all things : If all things , then Them amongst the rest . I would fain know what I must try them with ? with the Scriptures ? Then the Scriptures must be the Rule of my Examination , and Faith concerning themselves ; which is improper : If with the Spirit that gave them forth ( that searcheth the deep things of God , a measure of which is given to me to profit withal ) Then is it most congruous to call the Spirit , and not the Scriptures the Rule . 7. If the Scriptures are the Rule , they are so either in their Original or Copies : If in their Original , that is not extant , then no Rule in being ; for the last of it that was extant , was John's History at Ephesus , not seen these thousand Years : If the Copies must be the Rule , it were to be wished , we knew which were the nighest to the Original , there being above thirty in Number : This is undetermined and for ought we see indeterminable . And that which makes good what I say , are the Variety of Readings among those Copies , amounting to several thousands : And if the Copies cannot , how can the Translations be the Rule so differing from the true Sense of the Copies in many things , and one from another ? Besides , I would fain know of those of our present Age , who thus contend for the Scriptures being the Rule , &c. in Opposition to the Spirit , upon what foot they receive them into this Place and Authority ; Is it by Tradition , or Revelation ? I mean the Internal Testimony of the Spirit ; or the external Award and Avouchment of Men : If the former , they inavoidably come over to us ; for then the Spirit will , and must be both Rule and Judge ? If the latter , I ask , how are they assured that they are not miserably abused by Carelesness or Design ; since we see ( that using utmost Diligence ) both Translation , Transscription and Printing , are subject to numerous Mistakes , and those sometimes very material , against which the Scripture can be no Fence ? But admit there were no Ground for any such Objection , I further demand of our Adversaries , if they are well assured of those men that first collected , embodyed & authenticated them by a Publique Canon , which we read to have been in the Council of Laodicca , 360. Years after Christ ( though not as they are now received ) during which time they had bin tossed & tumbled ; some receiv'd , some rejected , doubtless many hundred times transscribed ; and it is not improbable that they were also abused : If they miss in their Judgment here , they are gone , till they come to us . I say , how do they know that these men rightly discerned true from sp●…rious ? Either their Judgment was infallible in the Matter , or it was not : ●…f it were , then there was such a thing as Infallibility since the Apostles Dayes , which is a Contradiction to your selves . But be it so that they were infallible ; how came you to be assured they were so ? Not by Inspiration ; that is dangerous Doctrine with you : Which way was it then ? Not by Tradition . Was it by the Scripture ? That were to say , that the Scripture tells you that those men that collected it for true , were right in their Judgment : but we are yet to finde any such place , and that is to beg the Question . I cannot see any other Ground , besides your very great Kindness to their Choice , which you call Popery , and believing as the Church believes , in other Folks . But if these men were fallible , as your own Principle makes them , and their own Determinations prove them ; what then ? doubtless your Condition will be desperate . Now , certain it is that some of the Scriptures taken in by one Council for Canonical , were rejected by another as Apocryphal ; and that which was left out by the former for Apocryphal , was taken in by the latter for Canonical . Now visible it is that they contradicted each other , and as true that they both erred , respecting the present Belief ; for your Canon and Catalogue varies from theirs , and , let me say without Offence , from any Catalogue you can produce . Behold the Labyrinth of Incertainties you run your selves into , who go from that heavenly Gift in your selves , by which the holy Scriptures are truly discerned , relished and distinguished from the Inventions and Abuses of Men ! 8. Furthermore , If the Scriptures were the Rule of Faith and Life , &c. then because they cannot be the Rule in their Translations , suppose the ancient Copies were exact , it cannot be the Rule to far the greatest part of Mankind , indeed to none but Learned men ; which neither answers the Promise relating to Gospel times , that is universal ; nor the Necessity of all Mankind for a Rule of Faith and Life . 9. That the Scriptures are not the Rule of Faith and Life , is proved from those voluminous Discourses of Cases of Conscience that are extant among us : For had the Scriptures be●… as sufficient as the Nature of the Rule of Faith and Life requireth , there had been no need of such Tracts ; every man might have read his own Condition laid down in Scripture without those numerous Supplements . Doth not your own Language and Practice prove its Insufficiency to that End , at what time you both exhort to , and go in secret to seek the Mind of the Lord in this or that important Affair ? Why do not you turn to Chapter and Verse for Satisfaction , if the Scripture be appointed of God for a Rule ? Strange ! That what is so common in the Mouths of all sorts , viz. God direct you ( that implieth Inspiration and Revelation , or immediate Council or Guiding from God ) should not be known , much less acknowledged by you in our Writings ; but overrun with such scaring Epithetes , as Enthusiasm , Familism , Fanaticism , Quakerism , &c. In short , there are a * thousand Cases , and not a few occurring almost daily , in which the Scripture cannot be our plain and distinct Rule and Guide ; yet has not God left himself without a Witness in every Bo●…om ; for his Grace has appeared unto all Men , teaching them that believe in it , to deny Ungodliness and wo●…ldly Lusts , and to live sob●…rly , righ●…eously and godly in this present evil World. And Christ Jesus the eternal Word , has for that End enlightened every Man coming into the World ( viz. ) to discover , reprove , and instruct ●…or Faith and Life . But it may be , and is objected by some ; Obj. If this Law and Light in the Conscience had been enough , what need had there been of Scripture ? Answ. The same Argument will hold against God , Christ , his Spirit and Grace , all which are sufficient , notwithstanding the Use and Benefit of Scripture . The Case was this : Man's Mind being estranged from the Light and Spirit , through its wandrings after visible and perishing things ; and in as much as the Light became thereby vailed from him , the Spirit as quenched , and the Law as defac'd , God in peculiar Mercy to the Jews , according to his Covenant with faithful ●…braham , super-added , or repeated ( as Ur●…n termes it ) the Law inward , by a Declaration of it outwardly ; that both God might not be without an outward Witness , as well as an inward ( they having so much lost the Feeling thereof ) And more deeply to strike their Minds , by their Senses ( into which their Minds were gone ) and to meet them abroad , whether they were roving and wandering from the Law and Light within . As it is great Vanity and Weakness to infer Insufficiency to the Light from the Imbecillity and Darkness that are in Men ( occasion'd through their Rebellion to the Law and Light within ) so from God's superadding Scripture , and other external Assistances to Men in that State : What would such have God , his Light and Spirit appear to , and converse with Peoples outward Senses ? That can't be : the one is too Spiritual ; the other too Carnal for any such thing . Or are they Insufficient , because they converse with Men through these exteriour things , suited to that imbecil State ? Or tell me , if the considerablest part of Script●…re be any more then the declared Knowledge and Experience o●… such as were come to a more improved State in the Teachings of that Light and Spirit , which is therefore given forth , that others loytering behind , might be the more prevailed with to follow them , as they had followed the Lord in the Light of his Spirit ? Certainly , it can never be , that Scripture should impeach the Light of insufficiency , when it is but the Mind and Teachings of the Light in others , declared or recorded . Does the Declaration jarr or make weak that from whence it came ? Or because of God s ( ondescension for a time to Externals , shall they turn the Light and Spirit out of the Office of Rule and Judge by being perpetuated the Rule and Judge ? Or is it to lay down instituted Religion ( as some ignorantly talk ) to press after that which was be●…ore , and ends those temporary things ? The Law outward , as a Rule , was but as Moses till the Son came . The Servant abideth not in the House forever . The written Law held its place but till the inward rise in more Glory and Brightness ; o●… rather , till they became more capable of being turned to it , and living with it ? In those Dayes I will write my Law in their Heart , &c. They who say otherwise of Scripture , do pervert and abuse it ; for there is nothing more clearly laid down in it , from Beginning to End , then the Rule and Reign of the Spirit . My Kingdom , said Christ , is not of this World. Again , The Kingdom of God is within : I will write my Law in their Hearts , and place my Fear in th●…ir inward parts . All thy Children shall be taught of the ●…ord , and in Righteousness shall they be established . I will pour out my Spirit on all Flesh. The Grace of God that brings Salvation , hath appeared to all Men , teaching , &c. Obj. But if the ●…aw engraven and delivered to Moses , was a Rule to the Jews ; why should not the Law deliverd by Christ , and written by his Apostles , be the Rule to Christians ? Answ. Christ left nothing in writing as the Rule that we hear of ; and it is not to be thought he was less faithful in his House then Moses : And doubtless , had he intended the Rule of his Followers to have been a written Rule , he would have left it upon record with all Punctuality , This must be believed , and that done , on Pain of eternal Death . Nor did his Followers write in the Method of a Rule , as the Law was written ; nor did they so call or recommend what they writ . But this leads me to my 8th Reason why the Scriptures cannot be the Rule under the New Covenant , &c. For admitting the Law written by Moses were the Rule ( A Rule I grant it was ) to the Jew outward ; yet Christ the spiritual Leader , of a spirit●…al Israel writeth his spiritual Law in the Heart , as Moses , the outward Israel's Leader writ the Law upon Tables of Stone . This was God's Promise , the Priviledge and Blessing of the new Covenant , that as the outward Jew had an outward Law , for a Directory , the inward Jew should have an inward Law for his Directory : And as the outward Jew had an outward Priest at whose Mouth he ought to seek the Law ; so the Jew inward , and Circumcision in Spirit , has an inward and Spiritual High-Priest , whose Lips preserve Knowledge ; at whose Mouth he is to receive the Law of Life . And this is his Rule , who is the Ruler of his People Israel , who reigneth in Righteousness , and of the Increase of whose heavenly Government there shall be no End. The King , Ruler , Judge , Law-giver , High-priest , Law , Rule , Temple , are all Spiritual : so the Scriptures inform us ; My Kingdom said Christ , is not of this World. Again . The Kingdom of God is within : I will write my Law in their Hearts , and place my Fear in their inward Parts . They shall be all taught of me ; and in Righteousness shall they be established , The Tabernacle of God is with Man ; He will dwell with them , I will pour out my Spirit on all Flesh. The Grace hath appeared to all M●…n , teaching , &c. A Measure of the Spirit is given to all Men to profit withal . The Inspiration of the Almighty giveth Understanding . Whatsoever may be known of God is manifest within . walk in the Spirit : If ye walk in the Light , &c. Come let us walk in the Light of the Lord. And there needed neither Sun nor Moon to shine ; for the Glory of God did lighten it , and the Lamb was the Light thereof . As many as walk according to this Rule , Peace be on them and the whole Israel of God , &c. What Rule ? Not that of the old legal Creation that passed away ; but the Rule of the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , or new Creation as it may be rendred : And as Drusius cites one to have interpreted it ; and Grotius also interprets it ; which is the Way of Life Isaiah spoak of , An High-Way there shall be , and it shall be called the Way of Holiness ; the Unclean shall not pass over it , and wayfaring Men , though Fools , shall not e●…r therein : There shall be no Lyon there , nor ravenous Beast go thereon , but the redee●…d shall walk there ; which Way , Teach●… , Guide , Rule , Light , Spirit , andholy Unction that directs & keepeth in steady Paths of Truth , is Christ Jesus our Lord. Obj. But do you not tur●… the Scriptures off , sor an uncertain & un●…rviceable Writing , and as good as reject and deny them altogether ? Answ. There is a late Author or two , who to depaint us as ugly as their Malice could invent , have rendered themselves so ridiculous , as so to infer : But it is not my Business at this time to medle with particular Controversie ; that followeth in the second Part , and shall therefore attend to answer the general Objection . The Scriptures are uncertain upon your Foundation , but not upon ours . Doth our mani●…esting your Faith concerning them to be grounded upon your own Imaginations or human Traditions , make void or render uncertain the Scriptures ? By no means ; but we would have you come to receive them upon the Spirit 's Testimony and Evidence that gave them forth : And though we cannot allow them to be the Rule of Faith and Life under the Dispensation of the Gospel , which is Power and Life it self ; yet are they to be read , believed and fulfilled under the Gospel . For notwithstanding the Law written upon Stone , was not Paul's Rule , after the Son of God was revealed in him ; yet the Son of God taught Paul to fulfil the Righteousness declared by that Law : If it were to deny and reject ( as some Persons enviously say of us ) yea , to vilifie the Scripture , because we cannot allow it to be the Rule , &c. Paul must be said to deny , reject and vilifie the Law written , at what time the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus became his Rule . There is a great Difference in asserting , that the Spirit is the Rule , and casting away & vilifying of Scripture : And indeed it is but an old Fetch of the Devil 's , to pretend Honour to the Letter , that he might the more unsuspectedly oppose the bringing in of the Dispensation of the Spirit ; which the Letter it self testifies to . They that come to be led of the Spirit , arrive at the End for which Scripture was given forth ; the Apostle John did as good as say the same thing , when he told them to whom he wrote , That the Anointing which they had received and abode in them , would lead them i●…to all Truth ; and that they needed not that any man should teach them : To deny this to have been the Saints Teacher , is to deny as plain a Proposition as is in the whole Scripture ; and that one Age of Christianity should have one Rule , and another Age another Rule ; that , the Spirit ; we , but the Letter ; is more then any Man can prove : yet did John's so writing invalid the Scripture , or vilifie his own Epistle ? Certainly , none will talk so idly . How then doth our lifting up the Light and Spirit of Christ , which fulfils the Scriptures ( by bringing such as are led thereby to enjoy the good things therein declared ) reject and vilifie the Scriptures ? Does our living up to them by an higher Rule make us to deny and reprobate them ? Erasmus and Grotius think them , then most to be valued , when men are Witnesses of them : see on 2 Pet. 1. 19 , 20. I do acknowledge they contain an Account of several heavenly Prophecies , godly Reproofs and Instructions that ought to be obeyed . Obj If so Then how are they not a Rule of Faith and Life . Answ. A Rule and the Rule , are not one and the same thing . By the Rule of Faith and Life , I understand , the living , spiritual , immediate , omnipresent , discovering , ordering Spirit of God : And by a Rule , some Instrument , by and through which this great Rule may convey its Direction : Such a subordinate , secondary and d●…claratory Rule we never said several parts of Scripture were not ; yet the Reason of our Obedience , is not meerly because they are there written ; that were legal ; but because they are the eternal Precepts of the Spirit in Mens Consciences , there repeated and declared . I●… is the T●…stimony of the Spirit that is the true Rule for believing and understanding of any or all the Scripture ; therefore not the Scripture , but the Spirit of Truth must be the Rule for mens believing , understanding , &c. Thus held the Ancients . T●…rtullian saith , Worldly Wisdom the Lord calls Foolishne ss he hath chosen the soolish things of the World to the confounding of Philosophy ; for that is the Matter of Worldly Wisdom , a divine Interpreter of the divine Nature and Disposings . Justin Martyr in Exposit. ●…id . The Interpretation of the Scriptures is to be a commodated to the Will of the Doctrine of the Spirit ; and not to human Reasonings . Hieron saith , The Scriptures ( mus●… be ) opened with spiritual Exposition . Epiphanius saith , Only ●…o the Children of the holy Ghost all the Scriptures are plain and cle●…r . Nor were the most approved Protestants of any sort ( who have been so reputed in Opposition to Popery ) of another mind . It is the Substance of the sourth Article exhibited against the Lutherans in the Council of Trent , as an Erroneous Doctrine they held , That to understand the Scripture , neither G●…oss nor Comment is necessary ; but only to have the Spirit of a Sheep of Christ's Pasture . Erasmus tells us , What Man sets forth by Man's De●…ice , may be received by Man's Wit : But the thing that is set forth by the Inspira●…ion of the Holy Ghost , requireth an Interpreter inspired with the like Spirit ; and without the Inspiration of it the Secrets of God cannot be known . Luther giveth us his Mind thus , The Scriptures are not to be understood , but by that very Spirit by which they were writ . Peter Martyr , that famous Italian Protestant , teacheth us , The Spirit is the Abettor , by which we must assure our selves for understanding of the Scriptures , that thereby we must discern between Christ's Words , and a Strangers ( quoting Christ's Words ) My Sheep know my Voice , and several other places of Scriptures . Again , The Spirit of God rev●…aleth the Truth in the Scriptures . H. Bullinger Decad. 4. Serm. 8. Men ●…etch the Understanding of Heavenly Things , and Kno●…ge of the Holy Ghost from NOWHERE ELSE , but from the same Spirit . John Bradford answerd to the Arch-Bishop of York thus , We know the Scriptures , as Christ's Sheep , by the same Spirit that wrote and spake them , being thereby assured , &c. Calvin teacheth thus in his Institutes : It is necessary the same Spirit that spake by the Mouth of the Proph●…ts , should pierce into our Hearts , to perswade us , that they faithfully delivered that which was committed to them of God. Beza saith , That the Way of understanding Prophecies , and referring them to the right Scope , must be sought or fetcht from the same Spirit , which dictated them to the Prophets themselves , and more to that purpose . W. Tindal , call'd the English Apostle by J. Fox , saith , It is impossible to understand in the Scriptures more then a Turk , for any that hath not the Law of God writ in the Heart to sulfil it . Bp. Jewel thus against Harding , The Spirit of God is bound neither to Sharpness of Wit , nor to Abundance of Learning : Flesh and Blood is not able to understand the Holy Will of God , without SPECIAL REVELATION : Without this SPECIAL HELP and PROMPTING OF GOD's SPIRIT , the Scripture is to the Reader , be he never so Wis●… and well-Learned , as the Vision of a sealed Book . D. Ames , a great Father of the Independents , saith upon Bellarmin's word●… ; The Anointing of the Holy Spirit doth teach the Faithful , to understand those things which they received of the Apostles ; therefore to understand the Scriptures in those things which are necessary to Salvation , with more to that purpose . Vatabl●…s on Job 32. 8. with Drusius , Clarius and others , speak to the same effect . G. Cr●…dock , a famous Independent - Preacher , preacht , That the Scripture is a Speechless thing without the Spirit . Ch. Goad , an eminent Separatist's Works , styl'd B. D. of K. Colledge in Cambridge , and an Independent Pastor , thus ta●…ght , There is no Knowledge of Christ , nor of the Scripture , but by Revelation . D. J. Owen , a man of greatest Fame among the present Independents , saith , The publick , authentick and infallible Interpreter of the holy Scripture , is HE who is the AUTHOR of them ; from the BREATHING OF WHOSE SPIRIT IT DERIVETH ALL ITS VERITY , PERSPICUITY AND AUTHORITY . So that we see upon the Judgment of many considerable Persons , the Scripture is no Rule for our believing and understanding of it self ; therefore not The Rule of Faith and Practice , co●…cerning the things therein declared . I will give a short Instance in Christ's words , about Regeneration ; He taught ( and strange it was , no doubt , to wise Nicodemus ) That unl●…ss a Man be born again , he cannot see the Kingdom of God. This is as plain a Proposition as can be laid down , and may be credited Historically ; But what is that to any ●…s New Birth , that they are never like to 〈◊〉 ●…formed of there ? Nor can that Scripture be my Rule in that Heavenly Travail , respecting the many and wonderful Tryals and Exercises , that are to be met with in it ; neither can any other Writing whatever : This only is the Office of that Spirit & Word immortal , by which I am anew begotten ; Who then is my Rule to inform , order , strengthen and lead through the whole Experience , but the same Spirit ? All Doctrinal Scripture was experienced before written ; or they had not been true Witnesses who wrote it . Now that which was their Rule can only guide us into the same Experiences ; nor are they to be known before experienced : Do my Will , and you shall know more of my Doctrine , saith Christ. I read the History of such things ; This saves not : Neither can the History be the Rule leading into the Mystery ; That belongs only to the Spirit , that searcheth the deep things of God. Consequently the Spirit , and not the Scripture , is the Rule for so believing and living . Obj. But is not this to make void the Protestants Plea against the Papists , That the Scriptures are the Rule of Faith and Practice ? Answ. No such matter : For the Question was not , Whether the Spirit of Christ or the Scripture was the Rule , But , Whether the Scripture , God's Tradition , or Popish Traditions , were the Rule to measure the Truth of Doctrines and Practices by ? We grant , that particular Scriptures , rightly understood , may measure what is agreeable or disagreeable to them ; that is , such Doctrines and Practices as are contrary to that part of Scripture more particularly relating to our dayes , are questionable by the Scripture ; especially since all Parties pretend what they say and do is according to Scripture : Yet this concludes not the Scripture to be the General and Evangelical Rule . Obj. But if God had not revealed those things that are in Scripture by it to us , ●…ow could they have been known by us ? Answ. They were known by the Light and Spirit of Christ before written ( from whence they are call'd Scripture ) Therefore it is said , That the Prophets searched diligently what , and what manner of Time the Spirit of Christ , that was in them , did signifie , when it testified before-hand of the Sufferings of Christ. Nor are they ever the more reveal'd to the blind and dark Mind , because there written : The Mysteries of Regeneration are as puzling to Natural Wit and Earthly Wisdom , as before ; Therefore well said Epiphanius , Only to the Children of the Holy Ghost all the Holy Scriptures are plain and easie . Mens going to hammer out Principles , without that infallible Guide and Rule , hath been the Cause of that great Confusion that is over Mankind about Religion . Obj. But how could you have known those Prophecies to be true , for that is not matter of Witnessing , but Fore-telling ? Answ. That is an extraordinary Revelation , not falling within the ordinary Discoveries absolutely necessary to mans Salvation ; but to shew his Power & Faithfulness , that he is God , and can and will fore-tell , and bring to pass : But therefore must there be an Extraordinary Light or Spirit , and not rather an Extraordinary Sight and Se●…ne from one and the same Light and Spirit in them ? Besides , That which gives me to believe and savour it to be from the Spirit , and not by Imposture , is my Rule for believing it . Now that the Spirit so doth , Calvin and Beza too , as before cited , assert for me , viz. The same Spirit , that spake by the Mouth of the Prophets , must pierce into our Hearts , to perswade us , that they faithfully declared that which was committed to them of God. Obj. But this Light you speak of could not tell you which way Sin came into the World ; That there was an Adam and Eve , that they fell after that manner , & that Sin so entered the World ; That Christ was born of a Virgin , suffered Death and rose again ; That you ought not to Swear in any case , &c. if the Scriptures had not told you so . Answ. That is boldly said : But consider well ; Moses ( sayes the vulgar Opinion ) had that Account above Two Thousand Years after the Creation , by Revelation , which we find in Genesis . Now that there could be no Revelation without this Divine Light or Spirit , which is the Life of the Eternal , Creating Word , must needs be granted : For the Spirit of God knoweth only the Things of God ; and whatever makes manifest is Light : And that the Spirit and Light are one , though two Names , has been sufficiently evidenced . If then it was this Light of the Eternal Word , that delivered these past things to Moses , and gave that Prospect of future things to the Prophets , as no doubt it was ( if Scripture be indubitable ) then to say , the Light or Spirit could not do it , is Blasphemous . Again , To argue , because the Light does not reveal every Circumstance of History to each Individual that hath already an Account , that therefore it could not , is ridiculous : Were the History of the Transactions of Christ and his Followers wanting , as before Moses , was that of Adam and his Posterity ; and that the Lord saw it needful to acquaint Mankind therewith , no doubt but the Light and Spirit , which revealed the Account of the Creation above Two Thousand Years after to Moses , and fore-told several Hundred Years many of those Transactions of Christ , by the Prophets , would also have supplyed that Want : But inasmuch as an Account is extant , and therefore not needed , 't is vain to make that Objection . Again , It does not follow , because every man has a Measure of Light to inform and rule him , that therefore he must needs know all which that Light knows , or is able to reveal to him : I return that Argument thus upon our Adversaries . They say , they have the Spirit of God ; Then they know all that the Spirit of God knows , or can reveal to them : If the latter be absurd ; then the former . Again , say they , The Light within did not reveal Christ to the Gentiles ; that Christ should be born of a Virgin , &c. therefore insufficient : I return upon them thus ; The Spirit of God , given to the Children of Israel , Neh. 9. 20. did not acquaint them that Christ should be born of a Virgin , nor much more of his Life and Bodily Transactions ; therefore the Spirit of God was insufficient . The like may be concluded against the Spirit in the Prophets : For 't is manifest from 1 Pet. 1. 10 , 11. that the Spirit had not revealed to all the Prophets the Time of Christ's Appearance and Sufferings ; was the Spirit therefore an insufficient Rule to them ? But that which falls heaviest upon our Adversaries is this , That the Scriptures , by their own Argument , are a most imperfect Account themselves of what was done , not relating the hundredth part of things ; therefore as insufficient in not relating what is behind , as they would weakly render the Light or Spirit in not revealing to every Individual those things already related : Nay , they may as well infer Insufficiency to the Spirit , or the Light within , in that it does not now shew all that shall be to the End of the World , which in their proper Seasons there will be a Necessity to know , as to reflect insufficiency upon it , &c. because it did not foretel things now past , to ●…ormer Ages , or needlesly reveal them over again to us in this Age. Neither is History , or can it be the Rule of that Faith and ●…ife we speak of , which are absolutely necessary to Salvation ; which is the Faith that not History , but God gives , that works not by History , but Love , & overcomes the Wo●…ld ; which Millions of Historical Believers are overcome by , and wallow in the Spirit and Practice of ; And the Rule must be answerable to the Nature and Workings of the Faith : so in Point of good Life , which is Duty done . Now History , though it inform me of others Actions ; yet it does not follow , that it is the Rule of Duty to me . since it may relate Actions not imitable , as in the Case of Adam and Eve in several Respects , and Christ's being born of a Virgin , dying for the Sins of the World , &c. wherefore this cannot be the Rule of Duty : The like may be said of the Jewish Story , that was the particular Concern and Transaction of that People . Obj. But these things ought to be believed . Answ. I say so too , where the History has reached , and the Spirit of God hath made a Convict●…on upon the Conscience ; which , sayes D. J. Owen , as before , gives them Authority , Verity and Perspicuity : But where this History has not reached any People , or they dye ignorant of it , they are not responsible for not believing any such Passages , as saith Bp. Sanderson . 'T is one thing to say , The Scriptures ought to be read , believed and fulfilled ; and another thing to say , They are the Evangelical Rule of Faith and Life : For when I read , believe and witness them fulfilling , I must needs have a Rule to read , understand , believe and witness them fulfilling by ; which being the Divine Light and Spirit of Christ , that , and not themselves must be my Rule for so Reading , Understanding , Believing , &c. And surther , to prove that the Light and Spirit within the Heathens was sufficient to discover these things : 'T is granted on all hands , that the Sibylls had divine Sights ; I mean not those made in their Name by some Professors of Christianity , as is charged on them , to gain Authority upon the Gentiles , against which Blundel writes ; But those acknowledged , Who prophesied of a Virgin 's bringing forth a Son ; and that he should destroy the Serpent , and replenish the Earth with Righteousness , as is before cited out of Virgil , who took it out of the Remains of Cumaa's Verses , then among the Romans . And for the Practical Part of the Objection , viz. How should we have known it had been Unlawful to Swear at all in any Case , if Mat. 5. 34. had not been ( which is of most weight in this Case , because matter of Duty , and called particularly by some , an Evangelical Precept , being a Step above the Righteousness of the Law outward among the Jews ) I have this to say in Solution of my Adversaries Objection , Reprehension of his Ignorance , and for Proof , by his own Argument of the Light 's Sufficiency . There were among the Jews themselves , long before Christ came , an entire People , that would not Swear , to wit , the Esseni : They keep their Promises ( sayes Josephus ) and account every Word they ●…peak of more Force then if they had bound it with an Oath : And they shun Oaths worse then Perjury ; for they esteem him condemned for a Lyar , who without it is not believed . Philo writes to the same purpose ; and taught himself , that it was best to abstain from Swearing ; that ones Word might be taken instead of an Oath . And Pythagoras , in his Oration to the Crotonian Senators , exhorted them thus , Let no man attest God by Oath , though in Courts of Judicature ; but use to speak such things that he may be credited without Oath . The Scythians are said to tell Alexander of themselves , Think not that Scythians confirm their Friendship by Oath ; They Swear by keeping their Word . And Clinias , a Greek , and Follower of Pythagoras , rather chose to suffer the Fine of Three Talents ( which make 300 l. English ) then to lessen his Veracity by taking an Oath : Which Act was greatly commended of Bafilius , who upbraided the Christians of his time with it ; Thereby ( after our Adversaries Way of drawing Consequences ) preferring the Light of the Gentiles before the Light of the Christians : though indeed the Light was and is alwayes one in it self ; but the Christian did not live up so closely to it as the Heathe●… did , and therefore had a greater Liberty , and walked in a broader Way . I would now know of our Opposers , if they can yet think the Light that preach'd in the Mount , that Doctrine was one with that Light that shined in the Consciences of those Gentiles , so many Hundred Years before that Sermon was writ or preached ; who so plainly believed , practised and taught it ; yea , or nay . Perhaps some of them , through the abundance of their Envy , Pride and Passion , will yet stick out , while the more moderate may submit to such Evidence , and conclude Ignorance and Folly to have made all this Opposition against us , and that of a Truth , The Voice which cryed , Prov. 8. 4 , 6. Unto you , O men , I call , and my Voice is to the Sons of men ; hear , for I will speak Excellent things , was heard by the Gentiles : and that what concerned Doctrine to Holy Living , was not hid from them ; I mean , evangelically so , provided Christ's Heavenly Sermon upon the Mount , related by Matthew , may be esteemed such ; for their Writings flow with Amens thereunto . But admitting to our Adversaries , that the Voice was then so low , and the Manifestation of the Light so small , as it discovered not many of those things before-mentioned ; could that give any reasonable men Ground to conclude , Therefore the Divine Wisdom or Light was insufficient ; or that the Divine Wisdom or Light was not then , and should not in other Ages , become the Rule and Guide of the Children of men , however promised ? Yet such false Consequences have been the Corner-Stone and Foundation of our Adversaries Building against us ; And no reasonable man , I think , will clear it from being a Sandy one . OF THE Judge of Controversie . I Shall explain what I mean by the Termes : A Judge , is one that has not only Power to determine , but Discerning to do it rightly . Controversie , is a Debate between two Parties about the Truth or Falshood of any Proposition to be determined by that Judge . From whence I am led to assert , that The Judge of Controversie must be Infallible . And though this may seem strange to some , 't is nevertheless true in it self : For if the Judge be fallible , however he by his Authority may determine the Persons controverting into Silence ; yet it does not follow , that he has given true Judgment , since he may as wel , nay , rather , determine falsly , then truly : so that Controversie can never be rightly determined by a fallible Judge , therefore no true Judge of Controversie . Indeed it is absurd , and a Contradiction in it self to think otherwise ; since he that is uncertain can never give a certain Decision ; and if not a certain one , then none to the Purpose . Nor ought any Person , no otherwise judged , that is perswaded of the Truth of his Cause , to let fall his Belief upon so fallible a Determination ; since he not only moves without Conviction , but against Conviction ; And which is worse , he is not ascertained of the Truth of what he is required to submit to : Therefore of all People they are most condemnable , who keep so great a stir about Religion , and that sometimes use coercive Means to compass their designed Uni●…ormity , and yet acknowledge to us , they are not certain of their own Faith ; unless it be those who notwithstanding yield to such uncertain Imposers . Since then the Judge must be infallible , it will be worth our while to consider , where ' this insallible Judge is to be found . There is none Good but God , said God himself , when manifested in the Flesh , that is , originally , or as of himself ; so truly there is none infaltible but God , as of himself , yet as the supream Good , is communicated unto man according to measure ; so ( well sayes Bp. Lati●…er ) is there infallibility , Certainty or Assurance of the Truth of things given to man according to Capacity ; otherwise men should be oblieg'd to believe and obey , and that upon Damnation , those things , concerning which there can be no Certainty whether they be true or false . Immanuel , God with men , as he is their Rule , so their Judge ; he is the Law-giver , and therefore the best Irterpreter of any Point that may concern his own Law : and men are so far infallible as they are subject to his Voice , Light or Spirit in them , and no farther ; for , humanum est errare , Man is Errable . Nor can any thing rescue him out of Error , or preserve him from the Infections of it , but the sound or certain Judgment God , by his Light or Spirit within , assists him with . Obj. But is not the Scripture the Judge of Controversie ? Answ. How can that be , since the Q●…estion most times arises about the Meaning of Scripture ? Is there any place tells us , without all Interpretation , whether the Socinian or Trinitarian be in the Right , in their differing Apprehensions of the Three that bear Record , & c ? also the Homousian and Arrian about Christ's Divinity ; or the Papists or Protestants about Trans-substantiation ? If then things are undefined and undetermined , I mean , expresly in the Scripture ; and that the Question arises about the Sense of it , doth the Scripture determine which of those Interpreters hit the Mark ? As this is absurd to think , so must it be acknowledged , that if Interpretation decide the Matter in Controversie , not the Scripture , but the Interpreter is the Judge . Now this Interpreter must either interpret by his own meer Wisdom or Spirit , called by the Apostle , 1 Cor. 2. II. the Spirit of a Man ; who by weighing the Text , consulting the Intent of the Writer , comparing places together , gives the Judgment , which the Scripture cannot do ; or , from the Spirit of God , which gives Understanding , as Job 3●… . 8. and as the same Apostle saith , searcheth the deep things of God : If the first , then a Fallible ; If the last , then an Infal●…ible Judge . I would sain know , whether it was the Scripture or the Holy Ghost that presided among the Apostles , when they were come together , Acts 15. when they said , It seemeth good to the ●…oly Chost and to us , &c. If the Holy Ghost , give us a plain Scripture to prove we are to have another Judge now ; If not , then we must have the same , and consequently an Infallible Judge . Obj. 'T is granted that the Spirit is Infallible : But how shall I know that any man determines a thing by this Spirit , and does not rather obtrude his own Sense upon us , under that specious Pretence . Answ. By the same Spirit ; As well said Gualt . Cradock . The Way to know whether the Spirit be in us is its own Evidence ; And that is the Way to know it in others too : and the man hat hath the Spirit , may know the Spirit in another ; There is , saith be , a kind of Sagacity in the Saints to this Purpose . Which is also true in the Sense of abundance of P●…otestant Writers ; For as they held , That no man could know the Scriptures , but by the same Spirit ; so consequently that the same Spirit only could assure him of the Truth of the said I●…terpretation . And Peter Martyr , as before quoted , tells us , The Holy Ghost is the Arbiter or Judge . Also D. J. Owen s●…ith , That the Holy Ghost is the Only Authentick Interpreter of the Scripture : I●… Authentick , then Infallible ; if Infallible , then the Judge of the Mind of Scripture is both an Only and an 〈◊〉 Judge . But to wave this ; Does not the same Objection lie aga●…st the Sense of Scripture , since one sayes , this is the Sense , and another that ? To know God's Mind , men must come to God's Spirit , else Difficulties of that sort are unsurmountable . In short ; It were greatly to be wisht , that all men would hold themselves unconcerned in disputing about what they have not received an Infallible Dictamen from the Holy Spirit upon ; since they beat but the Air , and obtain no solid Satisfaction , neither can they : God never prostrates his Secrets to Minds disobedient to what they do already know : Let all practise what they assuredly know to be their Duty , and be sparing in their search after nice and unknown Matters . Weighty and seasonable was and is the Apostle's Saying , Nevertheless , whereunto we have already attained , let us walk by the same Rule ; where he both limits to the present Knowledge communicated , and exhorts to live up to that ; and if any thing be further necessary , God in due time will reveal it by his Spirit , that gives to know , discern and judge of the things that are of God. Obj. But how will this determin the Controversie , and allay the Fury of Debates on foot ? Answ. Nothing like it , if man adhere to it ; and if he does not , there is no way left , but the Wrath that is to be reveal'd : But most Perswasions are agreed about the absolute Necessaries in Religion , from that Witness God has placed in man's Conscience , viz. That God is ; That he is a Rewarder of them that diligently seek him ; That the Way of God is a Way of Purity , Patience , Meekne ss , &c. without which no man can see the Lord : Nay , they accord in some considerable Matters superadded , as some of them speak , to wit , That God manifested himself extraordinarily in the Flesh ; that he gave his Life for the World , that such as believe and obey his Grace , receive Remission of Sins and Life Everlasting . Now , I say , since these things men generally submit to , let them live up hereunto ; and forbear wanton Scrutinies after Things or Notions that gender to Strife and Contention , and leave not Mankind better , but rather worse then they found them ; and the World would be soon rid of Controversie : Holy Living , and not Disputing , would be the Business of Mankind . What more excellent Judgment can be given , then that men quit their Contentions about Notions and Opinions , and betake themselves to the Practice of that which God hath already shewn unto them ; as spake both the Prophet Micah 6. 8. and the Apostle Paul , Rom. 1. 19. And if any thing be revealed to one more then another , let the rest judge in the Spirit , or be silent till God manifest more to them , in order to Right Judgment . 'T is good to try all things ; but we must have something to try them by ; and what ought that to be , but the Spirit that searcheth , & the Anointing that teaches all things , which is Truth it self . Here Mankind will live in Love , having at least Natural Affections ( now lost , by the B●…rbarity of some of their cruel Religions ) and a Judgment o●… things will be made , not from the Rash , Partial , Short sighted a d Froward Mind of man , but that eternal Light and Spirit that never erred ; which , however disgustful to some Protestants in this Age , was no False Doctrine in the Account of John Philpot and Bp. Latimer , two great Founders of the Reformation : The first in his Answer to the Bishop of Chichester , reproving his Confidence about true Faith in Christ ; saying . These Hereticks take upon them to be sure of all things they stand in . Let him doubt ( saith John Philpot ) of his Faith that listeth ; God give me alwayes to believe that I am sure of true Faith and Favour in Christ. The second , in his Answer to a Knight , objecting the Uncertainty of Man in what he calls Truth , thus recorded by J. Fox ; Your Friends deny not , but that certain Truths are communicated to us according to Capacity : But as to my Presumption and Arrogancy ; either I am certain or uncertain that it is Truth that I preach ; if it be Truth , why may not I say so ? if I be uncertain , why dare I be so bold as to preach it ? And if your Friends be Preachers themselves , after their Sermon , I pray you ask them , Whether they be certain and sure they preach the Truth or no ; and send me word what they say , that I may learn to speak after them . If they say they be sure , you know what follows ; if they say they be unsure , when shall you be sure , that have so doubtful and unsure Teachers . Let not Protestants for Shame judge us for owning a Doctrine , that is confessed to and confirmed by some of the Worthiest of their own Ancestors , viz. That an Infallible Judgment in things necessary to Salvation , is both possible and requisite ; and that God communicates it by his Spirit to the Souls of men . The Conclusion . TO Conclude ; Immanuel ( a word suited not only to that Appearance , but whole Dispensation ) imports , God nigh to or with men ; The Tabernacle of God is with men ; he will dwell in them , and walk in them ; they shall be all taught of me , and in Righteousness shall they be established : And this admits not of any Book , or literal Rule or Judge to come between that in-dwelling Light , Life and Wisdom of God , and the Soul , as its Rule of Faith and Life . And because it is the unutterable Goodness of God to People in these latter Dayes , as the Sum of Scripture-Prophecy , thus to make known himself ; we are incessant in our Cries unto them , that they would turn in their Minds ( now abroad , and taking up their Rest in the Externals of Religion ) that they may hear his Heavenly Voice and Knocks , and let him in , and be taught of him to know and do his Will , that they may come to be experienced and expert in the School of Christ : For never Man spoak and taught , as he livingly speaks and teaches in the Consciences of those who diligently hear him , and are willing to be taught of him the Knowledge of his Wayes : The Priest was Outward , but he is now Inward ; the Law Outward , but it is now Inward : And he is no more a Jew that is one outward ; nor that Circumcision which is outward in the Flesh ; but he is a Jew who is one inwardly , and Circumcision is that of the Heart , in the Spirit , and not in the Letter , whose Praise is not of Men , but of God. Which is so far from lessening the Scriptures of Truth , that unless this be man's Rule and Judge in the reading and believing of them , he can never , either understand them , or keep the things therein contain'd aright . And indeed , as before I have expressed , I cannot but say , That Man , whilst unregenerated , setting his Wit and Wisdom to fathom and comprehend the Intention of the Holy Ghost in many of those Writings , hath occasioned that Confusion , Darkness and perplext Controversie , that now so lamentably pesters the World ; In which State , for all the External Imitations of the Ancients in some temporary and visible Parts of Worship , I am to tell such from the Spirit of the Lord God of all Truth , they will never be accepted . The utmost of that literal Knowledge , historical Faith , and outward Religion , is at best but the Old Heavens that are to be wrapped up as a Scroul , the Old Wine and Bottle that belong not to the Kingdom , and Man's holding true Words in an unregenerated and unrighteous Nature , where he may cry , Lord , Lord ; but shal●… never enter into the Rest that is Eternal : For under such a Faith and Religion , Envy , Wrath , Malice , Persecution , Pride , Passion , Worldly-Mindedness , &c. may and do live ; yea , and are cloaked , as with a secure Cover from the Stroak of God's Spirit ; insomuch , as when any are moved of the Lord to decry such fair and hypocritical Shews of Religion , they are reputed Rash and Censorious , and presently a Plea must he made on this wise ; Do not we follow the Commands of the Scripture ? Did not such and such do so and so ? Never regarding from what Grounds the Performance springs , whether it be according to the Rule of the NEW or OLD Creature ; bu●… abuse and vilifie us for making such Distinctions , as if the Prayers , Preachings , Singings , outward Baptizings and Suppings , &c. of Men in their own Spirits , Strength and Will were required and accepted of God for Evangelical Worship : Thick Darkness and dangerous Presumption ! Thus are Men out of the Way concerning both Faith and Practice , and the true Rule and Judge of them : They make the former to lie in an Assent of the Understanding to such Propositions , and in the performing of some visible Parts of Religion in their own Spirits and Wills ( which is far from the Immanuel-State ) And the latter to be the Scriptures , which is but an Account of those Things , which others were ruled to and directed in by the Holy Spirit , before they were ever recorded or made Scripture ; and not another Rule or Judge can so regulate : For as the Faith and Experience , so the Rule and Judge of that Faith and that Experience must be one : God by his Spirit begets Faith ; God by his Spirit rules Faith , and governs the Life of his Children ; for as many as are Children of God are led by the Spirit of God. The Scripture , much of it , is but a Declaration of Faith and Experience ; therefore not the Rule or Judge : For as Faith and Experience were before Scripture , so the Rule and Judge before Scripture ; because , as I said before , there is a Rule and Judge as soon as there is Faith ; therefore the Scripture is not that Rule or Judge : And before that Declaration be answered by any , they must come to the Faith , Rule and Judge of which that is a Declaration : So that Faith is yielding up to the Requirings of God's Spirit in us , in full Assurance of the Remission of Sins , through the Son of his Love and Life Everlasting , from whence daily flow Works of Holiness well-pleasing to God , and not a meer Assent of the Understanding to a verbal , though a true Proposition . The Life of a true Christian stands not in Bodyly Exercise ; that , sayes the Apostle , profits little : nor in an Imitation of the Ancients in temporary things , which as well the Hypocrite as the Saint can do ; But in self-Denyal and walking in the Spirit , to bring forth the Fruits thereof unto all Godliness , which is the pure and spiritual Obedience , resulting from the living spiritual Faith of God's Elect , and the Rule & Judge thereof is their Author or Begetter , even the Spirit of Truth , which alone gives saving Understanding , and searcheth the deep things of God. O you Professors of Religion , that you would but seriously weigh these things , and examine your selves in God's Sight , who respects none for their fair Out-sides , If this saving Faith be your Faith , and this Heavenly Life be your Life , and if the holy Spirit be your Ruler and Leader ; if not , you are but legal , formal , in the Oldness of the Letter , and Runnings in your own Will , which obtains not : in which State , not the Wisdom from above , but that which is from below , of the old Creature , is your Rule ; in it you read Scripture , expound it , pray , preach , sing & perform all your Duties : and this is not to walk according to the Rule of the New Creature ; but in a legal Spirit to make a Gospel-Profession , the End of which , from the Lord , I am to tell you , will be a Bed of Sorrow . Therefore resist not the Light and Spirit within , but turn at the Reproof thereof , that you may come to walk in the Way of Life , daily Life to your Souls , that so you may be quickned and made alive to God , and live to him in that Life , which is hid with Christ in God ; that being thus born again , and become renewed in your inner Man , you may perform that pure and spiritual Worship , which is of a sweet Savour with the Lord ; so shall he bless you with his Heavenly Blessings , and daily replenish your Souls with the unspeakable Joyes of his glorious Salvation : This I heartily desire , and through all Difficulties incessantly travail for in Body , Soul and Spirit , that the al-wise , omnipotent God may be known , served , obeyed , to and by you , to your Comfort , and his Eternal Honour , who alone is worthy to receive it , now and forever , Amen William Penn. Errata for the First Part. REader , Several Errors have escaped the Press , partly through the Author 's frequent Absence , and the Printer's many other Occasions ; but the most considerable of them are here noted , and thou art desired hereby to correct them . Contents — Chap. 9 line 3. dele ( , ) after Scriptures . Preface — Page 1. Margent dele Milt . p. 2. l. 1. read at last . p. 5. l. 2 & 3. for Ab. rogation r. Ab●…uration . l. 25. for the read that : p. 7. l 2 : read in their Hopes . l. 14. read that at . page 9. l. 10. for disclaim'd read declam d. line 19. read — faciunt . page 10. line 32. for reduct read reduc'd . page 19. line 8. for but read by . line 31. read too irksom . page 22. line 4. for Hammer read Humor . pag. 24. line 19. begin a Parenthesis at ( And my ] and conclude it line 30. after [ Dominion ) Book — Page 8. line 42. b●…ot out self . p. 13 l. 38. for paws read pause . p. 17. l. 12. for without read with our . pag. 18. l. 25. read was to be . l. 31 for it self read himself . p. 20. l. 40 for these read those . p. 21. l. 34. for Who , Me ? read Who ? Me , p. 23 l. 26. for is read are . p 26. l. 7. for this before Light ? read this Light before ? page 28 l. 10. for at that time read at thi●… time . p. 30. l. 2. read formeth , createth . l. 39. for here to read hereto . pag 33. l. 2. read not with respect to any . l 4. dele the whole line . l. 9. for of read to . l. 37. for heart he read hear the. p. 39. l 2. for bold read ●…eld . p 40. l 20. read or be void . p. 43. Margent l. 19. for tell read tells . p. 44. l. 37. read bits ) pag. 45 l. 7. Marg. read Civ . Dei. 8. p. 47. Marg. read Id. p. 711. for Id. 4. read Id. mem . 4 p 48. line 2. dele in line 22. read on that line 32. read of him . page 50. line 32. read Idolatrous . That line 33. Thought it , let . Margen : dele Aru●…t . de Xen. Ma●…gent for Laert. de read Lactant. de . pag. 51. line . 12. for Accute read Acute . Marg. Plat. Phaed dele . p 53. l. 25. read of the. p. 54. l. 12. for Pireen read Prienc ●…in . 14. and He de●…e . l. 15. dele He at the end of the line . pag 55. l. 13. for Good re●…d Go●…d . p. 56. Marg. for Enca●… . read Aenead . p. 59. l. 6 & 7. dele p. 61. Marg. l 3. for 1543. 123. read 123. 1543. p. 62 l. 24. for accutely read acutely . p. 65. l. 13 for no read no●… p. 66. read CHAP XIII . l. 12. dele not . [ 70. Marg. l. 3. dele o. l. 12. dele ibid. p. 71. Marg. l. 2. for 48. read 84. p. 73. l. 5. read and giveth . p 78. l. 30. read of Men. p. 79. l. 24. dele Prophecy and. l. 35. for then read them p 80. l. 12. for End 〈◊〉 hand . p. 81. l. 29 , 30. for what Virgil will add to read what Eusebius will have Virgli t●… have added in . p. 82. l. 35. read Occidet serpens . p 83. l. 22. for Iandix read ●…anilix . page 84. 〈◊〉 32. read enough to . p. 87. l. 4 read Hicks , then he hath dealt . l. 5. read Dialogue ) pag. 91. l. 11. add after ( him ) so as to be no where else . l. 20. read the Manifestation of Light. p. 92. l 34. for dar●…st read durst . page 94. l. 15. for Light read ●…llumination . p. 79. l. 6 read not only . p 98. l. 8. read And that . pag. 101. l. 35. read 〈◊〉 willingly . p. 103. l. 26. for when read whom . p. 106. l. 33. for endanger'd read accessible . l. 4●… . for guarnison'd read garrison'd , p. 107. l. 2. for inbondag'd read ●…nbondag'd . l 5. read clear and broken forth . l. 15. read We say , l. 17. for not instrumentally read instrumentally not . p. 110. l. 30. read Jews , viz. p. 112. l. 23. for suffer'd read suffer . p 115. l. 17 for In●…ner read Jenner . page 116. l. 11. for Saving , One read saving one . line 16. for Product read produc'd . p. 1●…7 . l. 11. for better , as read better at . line 25. read true Light. p 119. l 27. dele Omnious . p. 122. l. 37. r. Aggravation . 〈◊〉 . 126. l. 1 for Si●… read Sigh . p. 28. read CHAP XXVI . p. 131. l. 4. for Inability , to see the read 〈◊〉 to see , the. p. 136. l. 26. r. Scriptures . p. 136. l. 34. for were 〈◊〉 . wa●… . p. 137. l. 6. for Good read Goad . l. 29 read such a thing . p. 138. l. 27. for more read m●…er . l. 39. Marge●…t for on read one . p●…ge 140 l. 29. for He that flyes read They ●…at flye . p. 148. l 〈◊〉 . for 〈◊〉 read per●…eived . p. 149. l. 24. read in his Works . p. 54. l 34 af●…er M●…unt de●… ( , ) and put a ( , ) before was . p. 156. l. 30. r. but as the THE CHRISTIAN QUAKER AND HIS Divine Testimony VINDICATED , Against the Adversaries of the True LIGHT ; BEING THE Second Part , Containing A more particular Answer to the Baptists ( and others ) Arguments , Exceptions , Errors and Falasies herein specified . By a Servant and Follower of Jesus Christ through Persecutions and Reproaches , G. Whitehead . The vile Person will speak Villany , and his Heart will work Iniquity , to practice Hypocrisie , and to utter Error against the Lord , Isa. 32. 6. Printed in the Year 1673. To the Unprejudiced READER . IF it had not been the Lord who was on our side when Men rose up against us ; Now may we ( with Israel ) say , then they had swallowed us up quick , when their Wrath was kindled against us . Had our Separation and Testimony been of Men , or by Man's Will , we ha●… fallen long since ( as many of our Adversaries have falsly prophesied ) we had not been sustained through our many Tryals , nor born up above the Floods of Enmity , if the Lord h●…d not been with us ; but he who hath gathered and chosen us to witnes●… forth his Name and Truth in the Power and Spirit of it , h●…th preserved and given us Strength to persevere therein , blessed be his Name for ever . And this I ( with my Brethren ) must give Testimony of , that as God hath in these last Dayes been pleased to visit us by his Eternal Power , and in his Love and Kindness to open the Eyes of our Understanding , to see his Goodness both to our own particulars , and to Man-kind in General , in extending Saving Grace or Light to all . So it is by his Power that he hath raised up , and set forth Witnesses of the same ; the Sence we have of the Love of God , and his Glorious Light revealed , induceth and moveth us , even in the Spirit of the Gospel , to call others out of Darkness , and to direct their Minds to the Appearance of the true Light in their Hearts and Consciences ( in what degree soever it sheweth it self ) which God in his Goodness hath universally afforded for Good to Mankind , that they might both know him , and their Duty to him : God did stretch forth his Hand , and reach unto us by his Power , for this very end , to gather us unto his divine Light or Shining in our Hearts , that thereby we might receive the Knowledge of his Glory in the Face of Christ Jesus , as his former Witnesses did . And although we must still confess to the Love and Good-Will of God to Man , in affording Divine Light universally , throughout all Ages ; yet Transgression and Darkness hath been such in the Earth , that hath in many Ages much vailed and obscured the Light , that the Knowledge and Manifestation thereof hath be●… much wanting , even because of Man's Transgr●…ssion and I 〈◊〉 . Wherefore Light being now sprung up , an●… Truth arisen out of Darkness and Obscurity ; we must faithfully testifie thereof , a●…d own the least degrees and lowest Dispensations of divine Light 〈◊〉 Man , as his Duty to observe , and not to slight , nor despise●… 〈◊〉 any ; for we know , that as Light hath risen , and shined out of Obscurity , and Truth hath risen up out of the Earth , it hath been from a less Appearance and Degree to a greater , 〈◊〉 ●…rom that Degree of shining in a dark Place , unto the perfect Day : And as all the Promises of God are yea and Amen in Christ ; so all his Glorious Dispensations and Promises do center in a Divine and Unchangeable Principle of Life and Light , 〈◊〉 gradually discovered to and in Man : Therefore the 〈◊〉 Appearance or Manifestation in any ( while 't is of the same Principle ) cannot be extinguished nor lessened by the greater in others , in that the highest Attainments of Divine Knowledge were alwayes gradually obtained by the Holy Men of God. Moreover , This we assert , that God that made Man for his own Glory ( whose Mcrcies are over all his Works , and who willeth not the Death of Sinners , but rather that they should return and live ) He hath not only throughout all Ages universally afforded an Unchangeable Principle of Divine Light , which he hath placed in man , to direct him his Way out of Darkness and Sin ; but also he signally visits him at times with Living Appearances , Motions and Opperations of his Light and Spirit , to his Reproof and Conviction , thereby often warning and calling Man out of Iniquity ; as the Spirit of God did strive with the old World that had corrupted us Way before him , and was destroyed by the Flood , for its Flood of Iniquity ; and he gave his good Spirit unto the Rebellious Jews , which they grieved and vexed , until he became their Enemy , and fought against them : He by his Lightnings enlightened the World , and the Earth trembled and s●…ke , and upon whom doth not his Light arise ? although they that rebel against the Light know not the Wayes of it , because they abide not in the Pathes thereof : yea , he that causeth his Sun to arise ●…n the Evil and on the Good , and sendeth his Rain on the Just and the Unjust ; he hath not left himself without sufficient Witness in the Earth , both inward & outward , as namely , his Divine Immediate Light in man appearing to the Soul , & his Works of Creation which are obvious to the Light , and Universally declaring his Wisdom , Power and Greatness to be inwardly 〈◊〉 , and ●…nderstood , as his Inward Light opens Man's Understanding and the Eyes thereof . Howbeit Man having transgressed this Divine Principle , and his Mind being alienated from it , and blinded by the God of this World : God having Bowels of Pitty still remaining , he hath been pleased so far to commiserate poor lost Man , as to afford and extend those pretious Promises , as the more eminently to declare , shew forth and renew his Love Light and Power , for man's Recovery out of his Lost and Dark Estate : As that the Seed of the Woman should bruise the Serpents Head ; and this did Christ in general ( and doth in particular ) by the Power of the Father , which can no wayes lessen nor detract from his Light within , nor be any Inconsistency with its directing Men to the same Power of God , for the subduing and bruising Satan under their Feet , which in their own particulars they must experience , whoever attain to Deliverance or Salvation from the Power of Sin and Satan . As also God hath promised to make a New-Covenant with his People ; It s new , not as opposed to the Light within , as implying its waxing old ( but new ) as that the old Covenant without , ( which the Jews broke ) was to decay and vanish , this New-Covenant being a Covenant of Light , Life and Peace , a Covenant whereby he takes away and forgives Sin ; This they only have a Part in , who obey the Universal Light of the Son of God within , which no Way differs in Nature from the Covenant it self , nor can it oppose the Ends of it ; but is a Light of the same Life and Fulness that is enjoyed in the Covenant or Agreement with God , moving and conducing to the very same End and Agreement as ob●…ed and waited in ; and as the Jews outward had a Rule directory , and Law in the Letter without ( though that alone could not give Life ) so the Jew inward hath his Rule directory , and Law inward in Spirit which can give Life . And this New-Covenant is the last Dispensation of God in Christ to Man , wherein his Highest , Spiritual and Saving Knowledge is to be received , by all that truely obey his Light ; and though this be new as to his renewed glorious Discovery herein ; yet he who is the Life of this Covenant , and given for a Covenant and Salvation , is the first and the last , the Rock of Ages , whom God hath decreed to anoint or set up upon the Hill of his Holiness , even the Holy Hill of Sion , that he may subdue and rule the Nations , and be the Salvation of God to the Ends of the Earth , more abundantly to be manifest in these last Ages , wherein his Church cometh out of the Wilderness , and the Holy City New Jerusalem is discovered from Heaven as a Bride prepared for the Bridegroom , and the Lord God and the Lamb ( as promised ) is the Light thereof , and the Nations of them that are saved shall walk in the Light of this City , and for this End is the Gospel made known and preached again , after a long Night and Reign of Anti-Christ , Beast , false Prophet , Dragon and Whore , whose Judgment is revealed , even against all the dark Whorish Spirits , and Hypocritical Envieus Agents of Anti-Christ and Satan , who do not only envy , oppose and gain-say the Truth , and undervalue the True Light , as its an Universal Principle in man , but also resist and strive against the Glorious Breaking forth and Discovery thereof in our Dayes ; for which the Lord will rebuke them , and he that sits in Heaven hath them in Derision . And all such Babylonish Builders , and Envious Agents ; as divers of these Men , called Anabaptists , or Dippers , now shew themselves to be , whose Malice , Madness and Folly shall be manifest to all Men ; why do they rage , and fret , and revile , but because the Light is sprung up , and the Over-spreading Day of God is broken forth , who hath said , as truely as I live , all the Earth shall be filled with the Glory of the Lord , Num. 14. 21. The Stone cut out without Hands , that s●…ites the Image shall become a great Mountain , and fill the Earth ; the God of Heaven is setting up his Kingdom which shall never be destroyed , as is prophesied in Daniel : Yea , Truth is sprung out of the Earth , which strikes at Satan's and Anti-christ's Kingdom , and again bruiseth the Serpent's Head , who hath lodged and covered himself under their empty Forms , Shaddows and Liveless Professions ( as he did among the persecuting Jews of old ) The Lord hath lifted up a Standard against their Hypocrisie and Deceit , who have been covering an Envious Spirit with a Pretence of Christianity ; And he is exalting his Gospel-Dispensation , in setting up his Light above their Darkness , his Power above their empty Forms , the Substance above the Shaddow , the Spirit above the Letter , and his Worship in Spirit and Truth above Will-Worship in Hypocrisie . At this Satan is offended , and his Agents are angry ; These our present Opposers vent forth their Confusion , Envy and Strife , though it be against the Stream ; they are wearying themselves for very Vanity ; the Fire ( which they have kindled in their Envy against the Lord's Heritage , wherein they are labouring ) shall devour them . 1. These Anabaptists Babylonish Confusion greatly appears about the Light , which is in every Man , as Men whom Enmity hath blinded , and whose Minds are alienated from it into gross Darkness ; Though the Controversie between us is not upon the Question , Whether there be a Light , or any Light in every man ( for thus far we both agree in the Affirmative ) but whether God hath given a Divine or Sufficient Light to every Man , to shew and direct him out of Sin and Evil , to God who is Light , and the Giver of Light for Life and Salvation ? which we affirm , but these Dippers deny , especially such of them who are particular Electioners or Predestinarians , whose partial Doctrine doth not really place the Cause of Men's Condemnation upon their Neglect ( or Disobedience ) of the Light given them ; but originally upon God's secret Decree against them , and his with-holding saving Light or Grace from them ( as they both falsly and partially imagine ) however it s confest to be tendered to all , in preaching the Gospel without Exception or Respect of Persons . But under what Terms or Names do these our Opposers represent this Light , which they confess is in every Man to prove it Insufficient , either for a Rule or Guide to Salvation . Sometime they call it a Creature , sometime a Natural Light , sometime the Substance of the Law , or first Covenant , which they grant ought to be improved . Sometimes , after a more gross manner , they blasphemously represent it as a Mis-guiding Light , directly opposing the Covenant of Grace , and to be rejected ; but how well this agrees with its being a Light given of God to be improved ( surely sor a good End ) I leave to the Serious Impartial Reader to judge , of which he may see further about in the following Answer to Thomas Hicks . And as touching these Men's Envy against us called Quakers , as being offended at our present Liberty and Prosperity , H. Grigg endeavours to clear them , in his Epistle ( to the Baptists , not Babylonish ) by this Passage , viz. I have not the least Enmity nor Hatred in my Heart against the Persons of any of these People called Quakers , nor are we offended or troubled at their present Liberty , ( as he seems to charge us ) though we cannot deny but their Principles and unsound Doctrines tend to the wounding and grieving of our Souls , because we see daily more and more the dangerous and damnable Nature thereof . Mark , that while hypocritically they pretend to clear and quit themselves from having the least Enmity against our Persons , or Offence at our present Liberty ; It appears they would be gratified or pleased , if the Powers would do them that Favour , as suppress us , and restrain our Liberty for them , as their bitter Invectives and invet crate Clamours plainly import and intimate their persecuting Spirit and Implac●…ble Ma●…ice , as while they are complaining against our Principles & Doctri●…es as ●…amnable , & 〈◊〉 us Cheats , Impostors , Romish 〈◊〉 , &c. Th●…ugh their Charge herein they have never proved against us , nor can they ; this doth not only bespeak a Willingness or ●…esire to have our Principles suppresse●… , but our Persons likewise : As also T. Hick's proclaiming to the World , p. 62 ; that the Quaker's Religion is a meer Cheat calculated to the Service of the Devil ; and wickedly infianating against our Sufferings , that the Satisfaction of our Wills and Lusts , the promoting our Carnal Interest , Respect only to something to be enjoyed here , Carnal Advantage , Outward Gains , &c. may be our chief Motive , Inducement and Encouragement to do and suffer as we do , Dialogue p. 75. And he questions , whether we are not really acted by some Romish Emissaries , to insinuate covertly many of their own Heresies , to distract , deform and declaim the Protestant Profession , &c. p. 76. Judge , Candid Reader , whether these malitious and false Insinuations do not savour of a persecu●…ing Spirit , though they would not be seen to envy our Liberty ; yet how do these Invectives tend to stir up Persecution , and to incense the World , and instigate the Rulers against us sor our Suppression ? ( Their pretended Alegations sor them are hereafter answered and refuted ) and how absurd they are in these Accusations . 1st , To insinuate that our Sufferings have been either for Carnal Advantage , Temporal Gains , or to satisfie Lusts ; whilst in our resigning up our selves to these many and deep Sufferings , we have often offered up our Lives , and consequently ( with them ) all our Temporal Enjoyments and Advantages , us many this Day can testifie , together with those many Innocent Person 's Lives that have been laid down among us in and by Imprisonments , Exilements and other Sufferings . 2ly , How ill it doth become these Anabaptists to endeavour to make the World believe , that we are either influenced or acted by Romish Emissaries , either to distract , deform or defame the Protestant Profession , which is not only a Popular and deceitful Insinuation against us ( as if the Dippers had the chief Care of Protestant Religion , or were the most Catholick therein ) but most notoriously false and wicked ; and I challenge Thomas Hicks , and all therest of his Fratcrnity to prove it , or else forever to be ashamed thereof . Have they not more cause to look back at home , and reflect upon themselves , since that divers of their Brethren ( even some of their Preachers ) have turned Papists of late Years , whose Names being so well known , I need not now mention them ; but when or where did any Preachers owned among us turn Papists , or were any such Emissaries ? Oh the great Enmity that 's in these our Opposers , and their great Disingenuity and Immoderation that appears among them ( as will further be manifest to their Shame , and the Lord will certainly rebuke them , and all their feigned Coverings will be too narrow for them , and they shall see and be ashamed of their Envy at his People . But I must proceed to give the Reader a short view of some of Thomas Hicks Doctrines that past at a Dispute , and in a Paper of his , before his Fictitious and Unchristian Dialogue came forth as some Introduction to my following Answer , which was writ quickly after the said Dialogue came forth . London the 4th . 1st . Month 1673. I am a Well-Wisher to all Men , even desiring my Enemies Repentance , G. W. Some of the Doctrines and Contradictions of Thomas Hicks declared at a Discourse between him and some of the Quakers ( so called ) in Alderman-Berrey London , the twentieth of the third Month 1672. FIrst , He owned the Baptists above other People . That is no Honour to them . 2ly , That he did not own Water Baptism to be necessary ( or of Necessity ) to Salvation . True , but contrary to many of his Brethren . 3ly , That the Quakers err in Fundamentals , denying the Person of Christ , denying the true Christ and Resurrection . These are Impudent Slanders . 4. That the Life or Light spoken of , John 1. 4 , 9. is not supernatural , because it is the Light of the Word as Creator . A Blasphemous Inconsistency . [ This was noted down at the Interim of the Discourse before him , but snacht away by one of his Companions ] So that h●… concluded , the ●…ight in every Man is but Natural , and not sufficient to guide to Salvation . False Doctrine , the Light of the Eternal Word is supernatural and sufficient 5ly , That the Life which is in God , which is the Light of Men , John 1. 4. is divine as it is in God , but natural as it is in Man. Blasphemy , that Life is Immutable because Divine . 6ly , That the Light that is given in common to Men is not able to apprehend things supernatural . A false and inconsistent Doctrine . And yet able to apprehend ( and bring Men clearly to see ) the Invisible things of God , even the Eternal Power and Godhead , Rom. 1. 19 , 20. A true Concession , but a Contradiction to the former . 7ly , [ Evasion ] That it is able to discern the Eternal Power and God head , but not the things that are supernatural that are in God. A gross Contradiction , the Eternal Power and GodHead are supernatural . 8ly , That it was a Natural Light , a Light of Conscience , and a depraved renewed Nature , by which the Gentiles did those things contained in the Law , Rom. 2. 14. Absurd Inconsistencies and Falshoods . 9ly , That the Light in the Heathen , in Philosophers and others was able to apprehend God and his Divine Power , but not those things that are in God. A gross Inference ; are those things higher then God ? 10ly , That it cannot discover the human Nature of Christ , or the Body that he took upon him , nor his Suffering nor Death ; And yet it can discover the divine Attributes of God , his Wisdom Power , Goodness , Love , and direct Men to love him . A manifest Contradiction ; can it discover the greater , and not the lesser ? 11ly , But the Light in the Quakers cannot discover the Person of Christ , nor his human Nature , Sufferings , Death , &c. Yet it is the Life and Light of Christ. 12ly , That the Quakers deny the Person of Christ , his Offices , Satisfaction , and the Resurrection of the Body , &c. Lyes and Slanders forged and brought forth in Envy and Darkness . 13ly , That it s their Principle that whosoever believes in that Christ that suffered at Jerusalem , and expects Salvation by him , they are deceived in their Faith , and shall be damned , &c. This he spake of James Nayl●…r's Love to the Lost , near the Beginning of the Discourse . This is an Abuse , the true Christ is but one , and the same yesterday to day and forever . 14ly , Also at the Beginning he said , that the Baptists and Presbyterians agree in Fundamentals , and there are good People among Presbyterians ; therefore they might joyn against the Quakers , for they err in Fundamentals . Answ. First we thought that Water-Baptism had been a fundamental Point with the Baptists ; and do they and Presbyterians agree therein ? 2. Have not the Baptists , whom Presbyterians call Anabaptists , been accounted Hereticks by the Presbyterians ? Why do they now joyn against the Quakers ( so called ) ? 3. Dare he say there are no good People among the Quakers , that he makes good People's being among Presbyterians a Reason of his joyning with them against us ? Is it not easy to see a manifest Dissimulation and feigned Confederacy therein among these our Opposers ? If our Opposer saith , we have not inserted his Explications upon his Assertions . Answ. That 's his Work , he hath Liberty to do it himself . [ But he hath not done it , nor vindicated these his Assertions in his Pamphlet . ] Christ's Light within asserted , as it is Divine ( and therefore a sufficient Rule of Life unto Salvation to all that truely obey it ) and vindicated from Tho. Hicks his dark Exceptions ; fallasious and impious Arguments ( consisting of manifest Ignorance , Confusion and Ranterism ) which are here inserted as they were exhibited in a Paper , afterwards owned and signed by him . HIs harge against G.W. That George Whitehead affirmed , that there was that Light in every Man , if followed , that was sufficient to Salvation . T. Hick's Assertions against this . 1. In Answer to which it is asserted , that the Light in every Man could not understand the Doctrine of Instituted Worship . 2. That the Light in every Man could not understand the Doctrine of Jesus Christ , concerning his coming to save Sinners . 3. The Light in every Man could not bring him to the Understanding how Sin came into the World. 4. The Light in every Man cannot acquaint him with the Knowledge of the Doctrine of the Resurrection of the Dead . Reply , G. Whitehead still affirms , that God hath gratiously afforded that Light to every Man , which he ought to follow , and is sufficient to guide him to Salvation . To his four first Assertions , I query , Is that Life which is the Light of Men , John 1. 4. divine in it self ? the Light of Jesus Christ as the Eternal Word ? able to apprehend and bring Man clearly to see the Invisible things of God , even his Eternal Power and Godhead ? ( as confessed from Rom , 1. 19 , 20. ) And yet is this Light neither able to understand the Worship that 's due to him , the Doctrine of Christ Jesus concerning his coming to save Sinners , how Sin came into the World , nor yet to acquaint Man with the Knowledge of the Resurrection ? can the Light apprehend or bring men to see God's Eternal Power , and yet neither bring them to understand the Cause of Man's Separation and Death from God , nor his Duty or Restoration to God again ? How manifestly in consistent and contradictory are these ? and how plainly doth he charge men's Ignorance ( and Defects for want of Obedience ) upon the Light within ? And then , what is it given for , and what can it do ? But these Assertions are grounded upon his taking it for granted , that it is not a Light of Grace , but of Nature , when that Life which is the Light of Men is granted to be divine in its own being , able to discover the Eternal Power and Godhead , then which there is not a higher Power ; but how this divine Light should become Natural as a Creature , we are still to enquire , as that which neither T. H. ●…or his Brethren have ever yet proved . That the Light within every Man could not be a Rule , for it must be a Light of Nature or of Grace ; This Light cannot be understood the Light of Grace , because the Scripture doth suppose a time when Men are without it : It is said , after those Dayes I will put my Laws in their Hearts , and they shall know me ; that must be the Light of Grace . Answ. Where doth the Scripture say , that the Life of Christ , which was with and in the Father , which is the Light of men , is the Light of Nature , and not a Light of Grace ? The man in taking this for granted most filthily begs the Question , and that contrary to his own Concession before ; neither doth the Scripture suppose a time wherein Men have no Light of Grace in them , as he insinuates ; but a time when they are out of the New-Covenant , and Strangers in their Minds to it , as not being come into that Agreement with God or Union with his Light , which this Covenant doth import . And because the State and Tenour of it is both the having God's Laws written in his People's Hearts and Minds , their knowing him to be their God , and they to be his People ; and it s a Covenant of Mercy and Forgiveness of Sins past ; It doth not therefore follow , that none of his Law is in them before they come to this Holy Attainment and Blessed Agreement ; though his Laws are not so universally written or deeply engraven in their Hearts before , for it s now granted by divers of our Opposers , who are of the more moderate . 1. That the pure or holy Law which God placed in man's Hearts before Transgression , was never wholy abliterated , though much clouded by man's Disobedience . 2. Some of these Anabaptists do confess to a Light in man which reproves for Evil and excites to good , which they say is the Substance of the morral ●…aw , or first Covenant , which enjoyns Man truely to love and worship God , and to love our Neighbours equally with our selves , to do justly , &c. That this the very Heathens or Gentiles have in them . And then I ask , if this Law doth not appertain to the New-Covenant as one principle Law thereof also ? and never intended to be destroyed by Christ , but fulfilled and renewed in his Followers , who have Union with it , as having a more deep impression , and being more fully discovered in the Hearts of Men , when become Children of this Covenant then before : Was not Love the fulfilling of the Law ? and was not this preached by Christ's Ministers ? and was not love one to another both the Old and New Commandment ; yea , the Old Commandment renewed and established ? If not a Light of Grace in every Man , then it must be the Light of Nature ; but the Light in every Man cannot be sufficient to Salvation , Acts 11. 18. When they heard these things they held their Peace and glorifyed God , saying , then hath God also to the Gentiles granted Repentance to Life ; then they had it not before . Answ. His Argument still depends upon his former Fallacy , that 't is not a Light of Grace , but a Light of Nature that is in every Man , as also in putting Repentance for the Light of Grace , he puts the Effect for the Cause , as if no man had saving Grace or a Light thereof before Repentance or Conversion ; whereas his Argument doth not at all prove that those Gentiles who received the Word of God , had not a Light of Grace , but only of Nature in them , before Peter preached Jesus Christ to them ; but rather the contrary , that it was a Light of Grace , a Light of Jesus Christ and secret Power of God that moved in them , and opened their Hearts , and seriously inclined them to hear the Gospel preached , and which Light in them closed with the lively Testimony thereof , which did concur with the Light to the opening their Understandings , and turning their Minds from Darkness and Sin to the Light shining in their Hearts , and when those of the Circumcision heard how well the Gentiles were prepared to receive the Gospel , and the Effect of it , Act. 10. and 11. Chap. They were then convinced of God's Graciousness to those of the Uncircumcision , as well as to themselves , their contending with Peter for going unto , and eating with men uncircumcised was then stopped ; when they heard these things they held their Peace , and glorified God , saying ; then hath God also to the Gentiles granted Repentance unto Life . And its evident , that Cornelius and the rest that received the Word as preached , had a Work of saving Grace in their Hearts before , which prepared them , and begot true desires in them after Life and Salvation . Also when Barnabas come to Antioch , and had seen the Grace of God , he was glad , and exhorted them all , that with Purpose of Heart they would cleave unto the Lord , Act. 11. 23. So this Light of the Grace of God both to and in them was great Encouragement to him so to exhort them ; but if there had been no Saving Grace in their Hearts , what Effect could such Exhortation or Preaching have been of unto them ? If the Light within be sufficient to save Men , then it renders Christs Coming and Suffering needless . This is a blind Inference , still opposing the Light of Christ within ( yea , and all that is of God in Man ) as Insufficient , and so as neither discovering Christ's Coming , nor the Effect of his Suffering ; or as i●… Men might be saved by his Coming and Suffering , without Respect to his Light within , which shews gross Darkness ; as if there were not a Concurrence between the Light within , and the End of Christ's Coming and Suffering ; and he might as well say , that if the Ingrafted Word which is within be able to save the Soul , then Christ's Coming and Suffering was needless ; he should rather have sai●… , that Christ's Coming and Suffering without , was because men were turned from his Light within ; for if all had walked in his Light within , he had not been persecuted and murthered ; but this man's Argument supposeth Christ's Coming and Suffering to be for the Supply of some great Defect or Insufficiency of his Light within ; * as if man had so well improved it , and found it too scanty or Insufficient ; and therefore ( by this ) Christ must suffer and die for his own Light within to supply it ; whereas Christ dyed for the Ungodly , for all men that were dead in Sin , who had disobeyed and transgressed his Light within ; and though there be a Reconciliation by his Death , yet , the being saved is by his Life , whose Life is the Light of men , which for men to be turned to in themselves , and therein to live to God , varies not from the Blessed End of Christs coming and Suffering , while he works in man by his Light and Power within , both in shewing him Sin , & saving him from it , as he believes in the Light , becomes a Child of the Light thereof , as Christ exhorted , and if we walk in the Light ( of God ) the Blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all Sin. The Light within cannot be a sufficient Rule , because then there would be no certainty of Truth or Error , of Sin or Duty ; for that which one Man maketh Light to Day , the same Man will call Darkness to morrow ; one Man calleth one thing a Sin , another calleth it a Duty , by this there will be no such thing as Sin , but only in the Opinions of Men. Answ. 1. If there can be no Certainty of Truth or Error , Sin or Duty by the Light within ; how is he certain that there is any real Light at all in him . 2. His placing such uncertainties and those various and contrary Opinions of men upon the Light within , and rendring it an Insufficient Rule , either to distinguish between Truth and Error , Sin or Duty ; this is contrary to both Christ's and the Apostles Testimony ; as namely , that it is a manifesting Light both of good and Evil , both of those deeds wrought in God , and those that are reproved , Joh. 3. 20 , 21. Ephes. 5. 13. wherefore the Light of Christ within is a sufficient Rule . 3. And what Proof is it against the Light , if one man calls it Light to day , and the same call it Darkness to morrow ? or that one man calleth one thing a Sin , another calleth it a Duty ? doth this therefore prove the Light not a Sufficient Rule ? Or doth it prove any more then that there are those that put Darkness for Light and Light for Darkness , and that call Evil good , and good Evil , Isa. 5. 20. or those that call that a Sin which others call a Duty ; If it must ●…om hence be argued , therefore that there is no such certain Discovering Light or Rule in man to distinguish these ; may it not aswell be argued , that therefore there is no such thing as Truth or Duty to be distinguished from Error and Sin ? And doth not this directly lead into Ranterism , and finally into Atheism ? let the Serious Reader judge . If the Light within be a sufficient Rule , then I have a sufficient Rule within me , because you say every Man hath it , and I am bound to obey it : In Obedience to this Rule , I oppose your Errors , and in opposing your Errors one of our Lights cannot be a sufficient Rule , because such a vast difference between us ; then one of us hath not a sufficient Rule . Answ. However he hereby grants the Light in one of us to be a sufficient Rule , pretending that he obeys this Rule , and here he hath found another Rule for a Christian besides the Scriptures , and then they are not the only or sole Rule of Faith and Practice ; though its evident he doth not obey the Light within , while he represents it so variable and uncertain , and the Opposition and difference between us to arise from Light in both , whereas the Light is but one , and changeth not ; that divine Principle of Life which is the Light of men is immutably pure , and cannot err , however the Creature doth ; therefore it follows that both of us cannot be led by the Light in such direct Opposition ; for its Darkness that opposeth the Light. After his so grosly and impiously slighting and invalidating the Light within , he does not at all tell us what good it can do or understand , nor what good End or Use God hath given it for to Man-kind , nor what shall be the End of them ( of what Nation soever ) that walk up to the Light within them , nor what Condition or End do the Dictates and Leadings of it tend to ; this he has not at all resolved ; but ( in his Darkness ) dealt most corruptly and disingenuously against the Light within ; but I ask T. H. if the Light within him doth not at some times reprove him for his Passion , Envy and Railing , which ill becomes a Man professing the Patience and Sufferings of Christ ? No Man can have a sufficient Light to guide him to Salvation , that hath not the Spirit of God , because no man can understand the things of God , but he that hath the Spirit of God ; but all men have not the Spirit of God ; therefore all men have not a sufficient Rule to Salvation , because all Men have not the Spirit . Answ. By this he hath granted the Spirit of God and Light of it to be a sufficient Guide and Rule to Salvation , and to bring man to understand the things of God ; but how well this agrees with their Doctrine [ That the Scriptures are the only Rule of Faith and Practic●… , and not the Spirit nor Light in man , and that the Bible is the means of knowing God ] I refer to the understanding Reader to judge of : And what though all men have not the Spirit , either in the Union or Possession of it as their Rule , can no man have it that thus hath it not already ? Seeing he concludes , that no man can have a sufficient Light to guide him to Salvation that hath not the Spirit ; what , can no man have it ? Is it not then to be had ? and yet 't is granted to be the Saint's Rule ; whenas that which is the Saint's Rule ought to be every man's Rule , because every man ought to be a Saint ; wherefore God hath afforded some divine Light to every man , whereby he may be led out of Darkness , call upon God , obtain Life , receive the Spirit ( which he giveth to them that ask ) and become Saint ; for God is ready to give the Spirit to them that truely ask it , which only man can do by a Light of it . His Argument , that all men have not the Spirit , is no Proof that every man is not enlightened by Christ ; for those are said not to have the Spirit , who live not to God in it , but in Sensuality , Jude 19. and yet such were said to be twice dead , ver . 12. which they could not have been , if they had never been quickened , yet being twice dead , pluckt up by the Roots , they are become sensual having not the Spirit , i. e. in the Knowledge , Rule , Exercise and Union of it ; But whether shall I go from thy Spirit ? or whether shall I flee from thy Presence , Psa. 139. 7. and upon whom doth not his Light arise , when every man that cometh into the World is enlightened by Christ. The Light within cannot be ae sufficient Rule , because it is made the Character of a wicked Man , to do what is right in his own Eyes , and to walk after his own Imaginations ; then that which they do account their Duty , may be their Wickedness , & highest Wickedness , and an Argument of God's severe Curse upon them ; it s said , he gave them up to strong Delusions to believe a Lye. Answ. Doth then the wicked man follow the Light within him , as his Rule in doing , what 's right in his own Evil Eyes , and in walking in his own Imaginations ? Or doth God bring such a severe Curse ●…pon any ( as the giving up to strong Delusions ) for walking after or following the Light within ? How horribly blasph●…mous is it either to suppose or imply these things against the Light within , to prove it an Insufficient Rule , as this man argues ; placing not only Uncertainties , the various Opinions , Thoughts and Imaginations of wicked men upon the Light within , but their Wickedness , and highest Wickedness ( if they own it their Duty ) his Argument blasphemously places it upon the Light within , most blindly confounding wicked men's Imaginations & Wickedness which the Devil is the Author of ) with the Light in every man , without distinction , wherein Ranter like , he puts Darkness for Light , and Light for Darkness , which wo is to them that doth , Isa. 5. 20. Whereas they that follow their own vain Imaginations , and are given up to strong delusions to believe a Lye ( as T. H. doth ) are such as have rebelled against the Light rejected the Truth , have not glorified God as God , nor liked to retain him in their Knowledge , see Job 24. 13. Rom. 1. 21. 28. because they obeyed not the Gospel , no●… received the Love of the Truth , that they might be saved , God gave them over to strong Delusions , and took Vengeance on them , 2 Thes. 1. 8. and Chap. 2. 10 , 11. Therefore God did afford both a sufficient Light , Rule , and tendred the Love of the Truth to them , as he doth to all , else how should they be left without Excuse ; seeing it is a Righteous thing with God to recompence and render Vengeanc●… on them that know him not , for their disobedience ? It cannot be consistent with his Righteousness in Judgment , to bring Tribulation and Anguish upon every Soul that doth Evil , or to judge the Secrets of Men by Christ , according to the Gospel , without ever affording them a Lght of the Gospel , or Gospel Nature sufficient to discover Evil , and direct to Good ; and how can Indignation and Wrath come upon them that are Contentious , and obey not the Truth , but obey Unrighteousness , if the Truth did never reach to , or enlighten them ? or how should their not obeying the Truth , but Unrighteousness , be charged upon them , if the Truth were never afforded them ? Therefore by the same Reason that its confest that God wil render to every man according to his Deeds , & that there is no Respect of Persons with God ; it ought to be also confessed or owned , that he doth afford to every man a Light of Truth & Righteousness sufficient for a Rule to escape Sin and Evil , and the Wrath that 's due for it , and to direct man unto patient continuance in Well doing , to seek for Glory and Immortality , that he might obtain eternal Life & Glory ; see & consider , Rom. 2. throughout , which sufficiently signifies ; 1. The Goodness of God to Man ; 2. His dispencing of his Grace and Truth to all ; 3. How Impartial he is & Righteous in his Judgment against the disobedient and rebellious , who despise his Goodness , and thereby bring Wrath upon themselves ; 4. The acceptance of the Gentiles , who obeyed that Law or Light given them , though they had not the Law in the Letter of it . Wherefore now , moderate Reader , take notice that the very Ground of our asserting the universal Extent of Saving Grace & sufficient Light to Man-kind , is ; 1. The unspeakable Love and Goodness of God , as in himself , he being Love in the highest . 2. His unwillingness that Man should either live or die in Sin , he having no Pleasure in the Death of Sinners , but rather that they should return and live . 3. That he so loved the World , that he sent his Son into the World , that whosoever believes in him might not perish , but have Everlasting Life ; & in that he sent not his Son into the World to condemn the World , but that the World through him might be saved . These weighty Considerations we have all along respect to in our asserting sufficient Grace or Light to be afforded of God to Mankind . If the Light within be a sufficient Rule , then no Man ought to repent of his Ignorant worshiping of the true God , or of his worshiping a false God ; Nor ought men to repent of their Acts of Cruelty against the Saints , wherin they think they do wel , & act according to their Light ; Nor ought the Quakers to repent of their Inhuman Actions of walking naked ; for they think in so doing they do well , and act according to their Light ; therefore the Light within is not a sufficient Rule . Answ. Still the man goes on in an absolute Strain of apparent Ranterism , gross Inconsistencies and Blasphemous Inferences against the Light within , while he renders it neither a sufficient Rule to discover Truth or Error in matter of Worship , nor to lead men to repent of Idolatry , Wickedness or Acts of Cruelty against the Saints ; but their thinking they do well therein , this he deems according to their Light ; and all this to shew that the Light within which the Quakers preach , is an insufficient Rule ; But it s then Non-sense in him to account it any Real Light at all by those his Discriptions of it before , which one while renders the Light within so defective , so mutable , and so insignificant , as a meer Nullity , another while no better then Darkness it self , another while , the Author of Sin and Wickedness , as being according to their Light. What horrible Madness and gross Darkness hath the Devil led these Opposers into ? His accusing the Quakers with Inhuman Actions of walking naked . 1st , As it s in general its fals , ●…or its neither a general Practice among us , nor the constant Practice of any ; It was only some few particulars that have had a peculiar Burthen laid upon them to go naked for a Sign to such Hypocritical Professors ( as oppose and rebell against the Light within , and are covered , but not with the Spirit of the Lord ) that God would rent their false Coverings , and discover their Shame and Nakedness , as it is manifest at this Day : So that its evident , that some who have been made such Signs , as before , were therein true Prophers against a Generation of Envious Hyppocrites and Persecutors . 2. His asserting that walking naked is an Inhuman Action ; as his Charge is general , it s not true that all going naked is Inhuman ( but where corruptly intended for some Evil or Inhuman Act or End ) for , 1st . Were Adam and Eve Inhuman in their being naked , when they were not ashamed , being Innocent ? Gen. 2. 25. for the Shame came after Transgression , from which came the Inhumanity . 2ly . When the Spirit of God was upon Saul , it s said , he stript of his Clothes also , and prophesied before Samuel , and lay down naked all that Day , and all that Night ; wherefore they say , is Saul also amongst the Prophets , 1 Sam. 19. 23 , 24. It appears then that going naked was not counted such an Inhuman Action among the Prophets ; see also how Esaiah was made to be a Sign and a Wonder upon Aegypt and Aethiopiah , Esa. Chap. 20. and so what know you but that the Lord hath made some of his Servants Signs and Wonders against many in Spiritual Aegypt and Bondage ? however covered with a Profession and Pretence of being redeemed , as true Jews , Partakers of Gospel and Church Priviledges , of Spiritual Canaan , whilst yet in Spiritual Sodom , Aegypt and Babylon , where both our Lord hath been Spiritually crucified , and the Blood of his Prophets sound . Here follows T. H. his after-Charge . 1st . And that the whole Religion and Principles of that People , called Quakers , wherein they difference themselves from others , is of the Devil , witness my Hand , Thomas Hicks . This Charge is not only General but also very dark and most disingenuous : For if by [ OTHERS ] he means ALL OTHERS , he should have specified those Principles wherein we differ from all others , and produced his Proof . But if ( by others ) he mean only his own Sect , called Anabaptists , then he hath made a very rigid Conclusion against all others differing from them , that their whole Religion and Principles ( wherein they differ from Anabaptists ) are of the Devil . 2dly . They that deny the Resurrection of that Body that was committed unto Dust overthrows all Religion ( he saith ) To which I say , these Baptists that affirm it of the same Carnal Body , after turned to Dust , and yet that it cannot be a New-Created Body , and that the Body which God giveth to every Seed is the same Body ( as T. H. in his Dialogue doth , Pag. 58. 59. with others of his Brethren ) they affirm they know not what , and that which they can never give a reasonable or a convincing Demonstration of ( being also contrary to that Scripture , 1 Cor. 15. 37 , 38 , 40 , 50. ) and while they make this their Opinion the Ground of their Religion and future Happiness , their Religion is Carnal , and their Opinion Non-sensical , and their Foundation Sandy , being grounded upon Dust , and they themselves are very Ignorant of the Mystery of the Resurrection , as will further appear hereafter upon the full Disquission of this weighty matter . THE CHRISTIAN-QUAKER AND HIS Divine Testimony VIDICATED , In a more particular and direct Answer to the Baptist's Dialogue . Section I. The Light Within proved Divine and Saving , &c. FIrst , That there is a divine Light in every man , which is of a saving Property in its self ; and therefore sufficient to guide and direct man to God , and so to Salvation . And for its being a divine Light , I have urged Joh. 1. 4. In him was Life , and the Life was the Light of Men. Secondly , That this Light is the certain Guide and Rule to true Believers in matters of Faith , Spiritual Worship and Obedience to God [ and therefore that which can give a right Understanding of the Holy Scriptures . ] These our Assertions are chiefly quarelled at by T.H. and some of his Brethren , though he very smoothly pretends , not to cavil , but that he may understand the Truth , as desiring to know . First , What this Salvation is ? 2dly . What this Light is ? 3dly . Who they are that do obey this Light , and in obeying attain Salvation ? pag. 2. To which I answer , It both hath appeared , and will appear against thee T. H. that thy Envy and Cavilling hath kept thee from the right Understanding and Knowledge of the Light and Salvation , that thou art now to seek at this time of Day : And yet sayest , that all thou intendest is my Conviction and Recovery , as in thy 10th p. when as yet the Darkness covers thee , and keeps thee from the right understanding of Truth . But if thou hadst obeyed the Light of Christ within thee , thou wouldst have known both its Power and Sufficiency unto Salvation , and that this Salvation which it leads to is Christ , who is both Redemption and Salvation to them who follow him in his Light , from Darkness , Sin and Defilement of Conscience ( and so consequently from Wrath ) which thou art yet highly guilty of , and from which thy Water-Baptism has not washt thee . T. H. You express your selves with great Varity ; sometimes you say 't is Christ , * another time its only a Measure of Christ , anon its only of the Divine Essence ; this is a very uncertain Sound , p. 3. Answ. Thou shewest thy self a dull cavilling Baptist ; must we be tied up to one Word to express a Principle by , when the Scriptures allow of Varieties for Demonstration to divers Capacities , which doth not alter the Matter ? This divine Light in man is exprest in the Scripture with as much Variety of Words as we do . As it s called the Life , the Light , a Gift , Manifestation , Seed , Kingdom of Heaven within , a measure of the Gift of Christ , the Grace of God , &c. yet one and the same spiritual and divine Life or Light. T. H. Notwithstanding thy most diligent Attendance to the Light in thee , that which thou callst the Light in thee hath in many things mis-guided thee , p. 3. Answ. Now thou beginnest to be mad again the Light within ; that which I call the Light within , is the very same that Christ and his Witnesses did witness to ( to wit ) In him was Life , and the Life was the Light of men ; therefore thou hast blasphemously accounted this a misguiding Light. And in thy 7th . pag. hast plainly contradicted thy self herein , where thou appealest to the Light in me , and grantest it ought to be obeyed : See how thou hast broke the neck of thy corrupt cause ; if it were a mis-guiding Light , how dost thou for Proof appeal to it ( as Rule ) and grantest it ought to be obeyed ? ought that which is mis-guiding to be obeyed ? But the Light within ought , therefore it will not mis-guide . T. H. saith , G. W. in his Discourse upon it urged that text Joh. 1. 4. In him was Life and the Life was the Light of men . If the Life ( said he ) be the divine Essence ( my Words were , If that Life be of the divine Being ) the Light must be so also . Answ. This Argument thou didst never answer to purpose yet , but cavillest , and draws what Absurdities thou pleasest upon thy own Forgeries , as will further appear , only sillily thou argued against it thus , viz. T. H. That the Life or Light spoken of , Joh. 1. 4 , 9. is not supernatural , because it is the Light of the Word , as a Creator . Answ. To which was answered , that its false and inconsistent Doctrine ; For the Light of the Eternal Word is supernatural , because the Light of the Eternal Word the Creator . See here the Reason thou rendrest for its not being supernatural , proves it super-natural ; for because it s of this divine Relation it must be divine . And thou shifts but very sorrily to come off here , when thou tellest me , that the Life and Light commnuicated to every man from that Eternal Word , is not supernatural , Eternal and Divine . But for this , we have only thy Say-so , contrary to what thou hast granted before , to wit , as being the Light of the Eternal Word . Neither could thy other Shift serve thy turn , viz. T. H. That the Life which is in God , which is the Light of Men , Joh. 1. 4. is divine as it is in God , but natural as it is in man. Answ. The Conclusion of this is Blasphemy ; for that divine Life is Immutable because divine , it did not loose his Divinity by being given to man ; for being divine , 't is no more subject to mutation than God is . Remember here , how thou wast nonplust , and how thou art in a Laborinth ; and of this thou dost not clear thy self in all thy perverse cavilling against us . Sect. II. The Life which is the Light of Men , not a Creature , or meer Effect , &c. WHereas on the Behalf of God's immediate Illumination or Shining in man's Heart ; for the Divinity thereof , I alledged , that the Cause thereof being divine , this Effect thereof must needs be divine and supernatural , as in my Narrative . But instead of taking notice of the Words , his Immediate Illumination or Shining , thou art pleased to quarrel upon the Words , such as is the Cause , such the Effect must be ; and thus thou proceedest upon it , viz. T. H. From this kind of Reasoning we may conclude not only the Light within , but every Creature both Beasts and Trees are God , these being the Effects of Infinite Wisdom ; dost thou not tremble at this Consequence , p. 4. Answ. How causlesly dost thou quarrel ? Are both Beasts and Trees Immediate Effects of God's Power ? Did he not cause both Plants and Trees to grow out of the Earth ? 2ly . Were these Immediate ? To be sure I never affirmed so many Gods as there are Effects of Infinite Wisdom . But be it remembred , that I never called the divine Life , which is the Light of men , a meer Effect , but admitted of the Word Effect with reference to the Immediate Illumination or Shining of God in the Heart , as being of a divine Nature , because God is the Enlightener and Shiner : And thou denying the Light to be of the divine Essence , because communicated , I urged this Argument ; That if the Life be divine , or of the divine Being , then the Light in man must be divine , because the Life that was in God was that Light ; and such as is the Cause , such is the Effect , in some sence holds true , in all the Effects of Infinite Wisdom , true in all Creatures as they were made good ; God , the Cause being the chiefest Good , who beheld all that he had made , that it was very good , And God who is Light is the Fountain of Life and Light , whose divine Life or Light it self ( which is the Light of men ) I never intended to be a meer Effect , strictly taken as an Act of Power or thing made or created ; but as the Illumination or Immediate Shining in man , immediately and naturally flowing from God the Fountain of Light , ( its Envy makes thee carp and cavil ) and was not the Effect of the Law written in the Gentiles Hearts , of the Nature of the Law. Canst think thou art Ingenuous ? Dost think that I do not own Varieties of Effects from the Infinite Wisdom and Power of God , as not only supernatural but natural , both mediate , providential and immediate Effects , as well as Increated , Immediate Products of Life , Light and Vertue , flowing naturally from him ? Yet though divine Illumination as manifested in man , be an Immediate Act or Effect ; the Light or Life which doth illuminate is greater ; for it is the Cause which is more then the Effect , though this Illumination hath a Living Vertue and Resemblance of the Cause in it , and they are inseparable : So that the Life which is the Light of Men , Joh. 〈◊〉 . 4. being divine , and of the Being of God himself , who is Light , it is not proper to call it , a meer Effect , as a thing made , or a Creature as thou blindly calls it , and would have it ; wherein thou dost meerly beg the Question and builds a false Structure thereupon . Again thou leavest out part of the Controversy between us , whichw as thus . viz. T. H. The Light in every Man cannot be the divine Essence in God ; for God is in Heaven , and his Divine Essence is not communicable , &c. G. W. What is this but to deny the Omni-presence of God , and to endeavour to confine him 〈◊〉 is Infinite and not limitable . We ask if the Holy Ghost , or the Eternal Spirit be not God ? And if this Holy Spirit be not communicable ? This Question in the Narrative T. H. is willing to wave , as that which pinches him , and thus does he reply to the Words before , viz. T. H. Then it seems that the Lightwithin and the Omni presence of God is one and the same thing . Is this your Champion . a. 4. Answ. Thou scoffs , but durst not answer . God's Omnipresence divine Light and Spirit are inseparable ; God is Light , whose Presence fills Heaven and Earth , and upon whom doth not his Light arise ? And in what Country or People does not his Spirit come , if an Infinite Spirit ? Whether shall I go from thy Spirit ? Or whether shall I flee from thy Presence ? Psal. 139. 7 , 8 , 9 , 10. His Infinite Spirit is not tyed up to a few Predestinarian Electioners , who only conceit they are elected , and saving Grace only free for them , though in Vertue and Uprightness they be far short of many called Heathen , who were a Law to themselves in Truth and Uprightness towards God and man. Sect. III. The Baptist's Quarrel grounded on his Mistake about the Light , and our Testimony of it . T. H. THough it be granted , that God is an Infinite , Immutable and Perfect being ; will it therefore follow , that every thing he created and communicated is his own being ? What man but a Quaker would dare affirm this ? Answ. Thou wrongst the Quakers ( as thou callst them ) its none of their Argument , that because God is Infinite , therefore every thing that he creates is so : But because of his Infiniteness and Omni-presence he is near unto all men , even shining in their Hearts . But it is thy gross Error to take for granted , that his Light in every man is Created ; See 2 Cor. 4. 6. God hath shined in our Hearts , and that Christ that enlightens every man that cometh into the World is God , in worshipping of whom we do not worship a Creature , as thou falsly insinuates against us , p. 6. But thou shewest thy self against the Light , as an Agent of the Son of Perdition , who exalts himself above all that is called God , or that is worshipped ; so that he as God sitteth in the Temple of God , shewing himself that he is God , 2. Thes. 2. 4. Is not man this Temple of God by right ? And hath not this Son of Perdition or Mystery of Iniquity been exalted in Apostates above all that 's called God ? And what was that that was called God and that was worshipped , above which this Son of Perdition exalted himself ? Was it not a Manifestation of the divine Life and Light ? And what was the Apostles Rule to try and reveal this Son of Perdition by , when he wrought in a Mystery , and as God did sit in the Temple of God , shewing himself to be God ? Is it not the Day of Christ that reveals , and so God himself that makes manifest this man of Sin ? And is not God then the Saints Rule to discover this Mystery ? T. H. Let me tell thee that thy Light is very imperfect , forasmuch as it hath not yet instructed thee by what Name to call it , whether Christ , or only a Measure or Gift of Christ , p. 6. Answ. Thou hast wronged my Light ; sor God is my Light and my Salvation ; and Christ is my Life and Light who is perfect ; and this Christ we preach , as the Light of the World , that enlightens every man that comes into the World ; though we do not say that he is revealedly or manifestly the Light in every man , or by Way of Union , nor yet that Christ ( considered as thou describes him , p. 11. ) as to his outward Birth and Person is in any , much less in every man ; Yet this hinders not , but that as God , or as with Relation to his divine Life and Light , he is Infinite over all , and through all , and in all ; yet to those only revealed and united , who truely obey and follow him in the Measure of his Light which is universally given unto Man-kind . T. H. The Apostle did needlesly exhort the Corinthians to examine themselves , whether Christ were in them or no ( viz. If he were in every man ) p. 7. Answ. Nay , he bad them examine themselves whether they were in the Faith ; for saith he , know you not your own selves that Jesus Christ is in you except you be Reprobates . And if thy Mind were not reprobated and estranged from his Light in thee , thou mightst know him revealed in thee . But as Christ the annointed is a Mystery , he is hid from thee and many more , though his Light be in thee and others that is sufficient to reveal Christ , and leave you without Excuse , and to condemn you for Iniquity . Sect. IV. Christ guides to Salvation by his Inward Light , and the Baptist confounded in his opposing it . T. H. I Grant that every man is enlightened , has a Light in them ; but this doth not prove that this Light in every man is Christ , nor yet sufficient of it self to guide to Salvation ; Christ is sufficient ; but I say the Light in every man is not sufficient , p. 7. Answ. First , If Christ hath given to every man a sufficient Light to leave them without Excuse ( as he hath ) then it is sufficient to guide and direct them unto Salvation ; for if they could justly charge this Light with Insufficiency for this end , this would be an Excuse . Secondly , That Light which is sufficient to convince of Sin , and lead out of it , is sufficient to guide to Salvation ; but such is the Light of Christ in every man. Thirdly , God offers a good end to man , in giving him Life and Grace , Job 10. and this Grace tends to his Salvation , if obeyed ; otherwise mans Destruction is of himself for his Disobedience , and not Designed by the Lord in his giving him Life and Grace . 4thly , Thy denying the Light in every man to be sufficient to guide to Salvation , is plainly enough contradicted by thee , in thy confessing Christ to be the Life and Light of men , p. 22. whose Life and Light is sufficient . And for what end is his Light in every man given , if not to direct unto Salvation ? Thou art not so ingenuous as to relate , though thou both appealst to it , and grantst it ought to be obeyed ; this will stand in Judgment against thee , for thy false Judgment given against it in other Places , as also what thou further acknowledgest , viz. T. H. There is something within that checks for many Evils , and excites to many good things , and that I ought to shun those Evils , and to do that good , p. 8. Answ. If thou didst obey this something , or Light within ( thus acknowledged by thee ) in shunning those many Evils thou art checkt for , and performing the good to which it excites thee , thou wouldst both know and speak better of it then thou dost , as that which both moves and leads in the Way to Salvation , which is from Sin here , and from Wrath hereafter , and so unto Christ , who is the Giver of it . But it is probable thou thinkst thou art an elect Person , and so in thy Presumption slites the Light within , as not only Insufficient of it self to guide unto Salvation , but also as a mis-guiding Light : And this Doctrine herein opposeth thy Maker , and his Universal good to Man-kind ; How then thinkest thou , that the Rebellious can be left without Excuse , or God be known to be clear , when he judges ? Sect. V. The Dipper proved a Blind Guide , and in gross Confusion in undervaluing the Light within . T. H. DId the Light in Saul reprove him for persecuting the Church ? Doth not he himself confess that he verily thought he ought to do many things against the Name of Jesus ? Yea , doth not Christ tell his Disciples , that some would kill them , and yet think they did God Service ? But how could they think so , if this Light in them did reprove for it ? p. 8 , 9. Answ. Thou having asserted , that there are some Sins which the Light reproves not , among these thou instancest , namely , persecuting the Church , doing many things against the Name of Jesus , killing the Disciples , and therefore concludes it no sufficient Rule . O! thou blind Guide , how darest thou thus accuse and undervalue the Light of Christ within , contrary to thy many Concessions elsewhere ? Is Christ the Life and Light of men ? And yet does not his Light reprove Persecution and Murther ? If it reprove not these , what are the Evils it checks for ? What rational Man cannot see thy manifest Folly herein , thus to confound Persecutors , evil Thoughts with the Light within , and to conclude the Light within no sufficient Rule , because of some mens Wickedness , who have rebelled against the Light ; and therein thou hast put Darkness for Light. And what were the Pricks that were hard for Saul to kick against ? And where was that Holy Ghost which the Persecutor alwayes resisted , Act. 7 ? Their Envious and superstitious Minds , and dark Thoughts were not the Light , but such as clouded and obscured the Light in them , yet the Kingdom of Heaven was in those Jews ; and so much divine Light in those Heathen as shewed them , that there was a true and unknown God to be worshipped ( with sincere Hearts and pure minds ) and that in him we live and move and have our Being , had they waited in that Light , and listened to it , they would both truely have known God , his Way and Worship , as some did . If all things that are reproved , are made manifest by the Light , how dost thou exclude those gross Sins of Persecution and Murder from being reproved by the Light ? And why dost thou argue against it , from mens persecuting and murtherous Thoughts , which arise from their Enmity and Rebellion against the Light ? But further I argue against thee on the Behalf of the Light , viz. That its manifesting all things that are reproved , is in order to guide men out of all reprovable Wayes ; which if they be guided out of , they are in their Duty ; For where man is not reproveable for any thing , he is in his whole Duty , and so in the right Way . T. H. Did the Light in the Heathen-Philosophers check them for multiplying their Deityes ? and for not believing that Jesus is the Christ ? Or did it reprove them for their manifold Superstitions ? And were they thereby directed to the right Way of worshipping the true God ? I demand an Instance among the many Thousands of Man-kind , &c. p. 9. Answ. That which might be known of God , which was manifest in the Heathen , and which did open the Eyes of many clearly to see the eternal Power and God head , Rom. 1. that was able to direct them into the right Way of worshipping the true God ; for the reason why many run into Superstition , and to multiply Gods , was because that when they knew God , they Glorified him not as God , but became vaine in their Imaginations , Rom. 1. which was their Sin , and not any Defect of the Light given them from above ; for that Light which gave them the Knowledge of the true God , was therefore able to direct them into the right Way of worshipping him . And whereas thou demandest an Instance , among the many Thousands of Man-kind that hath been convinced or reproved for not believing Jesus to be the Christ , by the meer Light within , before any Light of Revelation was brought unto them . p. 9. Thou still persists in thy dull course of begging the question , while thou takest it for granted , that the Light within is but a Creature or natural , and so not any absolute revealing Light : But this I cannot grant thee , while it is revealing God and his eternal Power to man , that waits in it ; However , thou slites it under thy frequent Phrase , Meer Light within , though it be neither opposed to the Spirit nor Revelation , as thou wouldst have it , while it is Divine and Spiritual . And that thousands of Man-kind are reproved for not believing in the Son of God , is evident by the Spirit of Truth , reproving the World of Sin , because they believe not in the Son of God , in that they do not believe in his Life or Light within , they do not believe in him , who is the Giver of it , and therefore reproved by the Spirit ; and surely many Thousands are comprehended in this World of Unbelievers . Sect. VI. His Ignorance of the Divine Principle . T. H. I Grant that the Light in thee may reprove for those Sins the common Light in all Man-kind will not , because thou hast borrowed much Light from the Scriptures , p. 9. Answ. It s evident thou understands not the Principle of divine Light within , from what thou hast borrowed from the Scriptures , with thy Imaginations perverting them , wherein is thy great Darkness ; thou egregiously mistakeest a litteral Notion and Historical Faith , for the divine Light within ( which is given to all ) which is a pure , Incorruptible and Unchangeable Principle of Life and Truth ; immediately given , and shining from Christ the Eternal Word ; and not mens acquired Notions from the History of Christ's outward Manifestation in the Flesh. But in thy gross Ignorance thou exalts such Acquirements of men above the Principle of Light within : And so mens Historical Profession of the Scriptures as their only Rule , though they much differ in their meanings therein , which they make their Rule many times above the Scriptures , and above the Gift of God ; this is a great Error of you , Litteral Professors . Thou wouldst not be pleased , should I alledge your various Opinions upon the Scriptures , to prove them no sufficient Rule , though thus thou art pleased contradictorily to deal with the Light within . Had the Princes of this World obeyed the Light of Christ within , they would not have crucified the Lord of Glory ; for it would have given them a Sence and Knowledge of him ; there were those that grieved and vext the Holy Spirit within ; would it therefore be a good Argument to say , that his Spirit was no sufficient Rule ? And to what thou sayst of Jesus Christ , as come in the Flesh , a Person prophesied of , born at Bethlehem , p. 11. we never said the Light in every man was Christ under these Considerations , though Christ considered as the 〈◊〉 , enlightens every man Spiritually and Divinely . Both John the Baptist and John the Evangelist gave a higher Proof and Testimony of Christ , then this you Baptists give . When John Baptist said , he is preferred before me , for he was before me ; and John the Evangelist saith , In the beginning was the Word , &c. this was Christ. Sect. VII . His Madness and Self-Contradiction about the Light. TOuching our obeying the Commands of the living Word in us ; for this thou accuseth us with a mental and mystical Reservation , which thou sayst , indeed is no other then a meer mystical Romance , p. 10. For which the Lord rebuk ethy Prophaneness and Irreligious romancing against the Word and Light within . Also thy Blasphemy is very manifest , in accusing what we said of the Light within , as to the Miracles , Wonders or Works wrought by it , to be no more then what the Apostle spake of the man of Sin , 2 Thes. 2. 9. and also , what may as well prove Mahomet to be the true Christ , as the Light in us , p. 11 , 12. Here again thou actest the Part of a Bedlam against the Light in us , which else-where thou hast confest to be Christ , for that he is the Life and Light of Men ; and is not this Christ the Messiah ? They that have believed in his Light within , and so truely made Tryal of it , do know that wrought by it , which never was wrought either by the man of Sin or Mahomet ; for to believe in this Light , is the Way to become Children of it ; the Way to see Darkness and the Power of it to vanish , and so to have Sathan overcome by the Power of Christ received in the Light , and this did never the Man of Sin nor Mahomet ; therefore thy Instance herein is most Blasphemous . And if we be accountable for every Dispensation of Light , according to its kind and degree , p. 13. of what kind is this Dispensation of Light that 's given in common unto Mankind , thou hast sufficiently answered to thy own utter Overthrough in pag. 36. viz. T. H. Yet all this is no Disparagement to the Light within , to say , that God doth make any thing more known of his Will , than is or can be known by this meer Light within ; for 't is but to say that each degree of Light is serviccable to its End. Reply . Where now Mark , that the Difference about the Light that is given in common to all ( and more peculiarly manifest to some ) is not in the Nature and Kind of it , but in Degree , and surely the Degrees of the Light do not alter the Property of it ; The divine Light is one and the same Throughout all Ages , both in the time of the Law & Prophets , & of Christ coming in the flesh ( which was to exalt his mannifestation in Spirit ) And now in the fulness of time , shining forth in a more glorious and powerful Manifestation , the same Light hath shined forth more and more , throughout the several dispensations of God , which were all for the Exaltation and bringing forth of the Light in its degrees and Manifestations of Glory and Power . But what Account wilt thou give to God , for thy so much undervaluing that Degree of Light that he hath given unto all Mankind , as thou hast done . One while in judging it a misguiding Light , another while comparing our Tstimony of it to the man of Sin , Mahomet , &c. Another while , it is so dis-esteemed by thee , as not sufficient to discover or reprove Persecution , and killing the Disciples , and yet we must be acountable to God for it . What mean and confused Thoughts thou hast of it , the Impartial Reader may easily judge by the tenor of this thy most contradictory Discourse . But they who experienced the Increase of Light in them , the Superaddition of divine Revelation , p. 12. the shining of the Light more and more unto the perfect Day . ; & their being changed from Glory to Glory , it was through the diligent Improvement of that Degree of Light , that sure Word of Prophesie shining in their hearts ; and not by opposing and disparaging of it , as thou hast done in thy Pride and Darkness , which covers thee , who art one that stumbles at the Ingrafted Word through thy Disobedience ; In which thou wouldst have us to believe the Light within to be not sufficient to guide unto Salvation ; while thou hast not followed it , to experience the good End of its Guidance , as we have done . Thou pretends to know what it cannot do , but ●…elst us not what it can do , and to what end it will lead if truely obeyed ? Nor what will become of those that improve it , who have not the Scriptures or Historical Relation of Christ , as come in the Flesh ; wherein thou art deficient and difingenuous in all thy Work. Sect. VIII . Christ as the Rock of Ages , and the Intent of his coming in the Flesh not known to Baptists , while they oppose his Light within . T. H. JEsus Christ was a Person of whom there were many Prophesies , which should be fulfilled in him , p. 11. If this Light within be the true and only Christ ; then why was there so many Sacrifices in the time of the Law tipifying Christ to come , since Moses and the rest of the Children of Israel had a Light in them ? If you say , the Light within was not the Messiah , then you deny your Principle ; If it were , what Significancy could there be in those Types , respecting Christ to come , p. 12. Answ. Thou thinkst thou hast caught us in a learned Dilemma here ; but what amounts the tenour of it to , but to tell us , either that the true Christ was not in being in Moses and Israels time , or that he was not in them ; for if he were , thou questionest what Significancy could there be in those Types . But here thou art very dark ; for though Christ's Manifestation did differ both in degree and manner of Appearance ; and though , when in the Fulness of time he came to fulfil the Prophesies and Types of him ; the Power and Glory of the Father was more fully and eminently and signally manifest in him , then in any before ; and the Light more shone forth exemplarily in him ; yet it follows not , that the true Christ was not in being in Moses and in the Prophets time ; or that his Light was not in some Degree manifested , both before , under , and since the Law. If the true Christ was in being , and in any degree manifest , his Light needs must ; but the true Christ was in being from Everlasting , and in time universally shining and manifest in some degree throughout all the Generations of the Righteous , since the World began , being the Rock of Ages , that spiritual Rock whereof all Israel drank , 1 Cor. 10. 4. who said , before Abraham was I am ; this great and most eminent Prophet God promised to raise up unto Israel of their Brethren , which was in a more familiar Appearance , even in the Flesh , though his spiritual Out-goings were before from of old , and he was called the faithful and true Witness , the beginning of the Creation of God , Rev. 3. 14. who faith , behold I stand at the door and knock , if any man hear my Voice and open the Door , I will come in to him and will sup with him and he with me , ver . 20. Now I ask , what and where is that Door that he so universally knocks at ? And is not this the true Christ that thus knocketh ? And was not his Light or Word in Israels Hearts , and his Spirit in the Holy Prophets , by which they fore-saw his Coming in the Flesh , his Sufferings and Glory that should follow ? Now though the pure Light and Glory of the Father was more fully , eminently and signally then ever before manifest , and shining forth in him , as coming in the fulness of time to consummate and end the Types and Shadows of the first Covenant ; whereby he gave a more eminent and signal Testimony of God's Universal Love and Power to man ; this is no Argument to prove that either the true Christ or his Universal Light was not in being , and in some degree discovered before ; for without this no Soul could ever be saved ; it was his divine Light that could minister Life unto the Soul , and not Shadows . Sect. IX . The Dipper plung'd in a Laborinth of self-Contradictions , and the Light within proved a Rule above the Scriptures . T. H. IT will be our Wisdom , yea our Duty , not only to attend the Light within ; but specially to those Revelations of God's Mind and Will in the Holy Scriptures , p. 13. Answ. In thy granting its part of our Duty to attend to the Light within ; thou hast plainly contradicted thy Blasphemy in opposing it in other places as a mis-guiding Light ; and comparing it with the Man of Sin , Mahomet , &c. and judging our following its Conduct as a subverting and anihilating the Covenant of Grace , and that this Light doth directly oppose it , and ought to be rejected , as appears , p. 38. Is it part of our Duty to attend upon that that subverteth and opposeth the Covenant of Grace . O! that thou wouldst consider and see thy Blasphemy , and what a Laborinth of Contradictions thou art fallen into ; as also in thy Concession of attending to the Light within , thou art defective , whilst thou dost not place the special Attention to be upon it , but upon the Scriptures ; whereas the Light within is specially to be attended to , as that which both opens the Understanding in the Scriptures , and discovers the several Conditions which they relate to ; otherwise men are apt to pervert and mis-apply the Scriptures to their own Destruction , turning the Truth of God into a Lye , as they did who turned their Backs upon the Manifestation of God in them , Rom. 1. 19 , 21 , 25. T. H. I conceive enough hath been said to evince , that the Light in every man neither is the true Christ , nor a sufficient Rule to guide us unto Salvation , p. 13. Answ. While Thou are following thy own Conceptions , thou dost not follow the Guidance of the Light of Christ within , and therefore conceivest amiss of it ; for it is a true and perfect Rule , unto which he that loveth & doth truth cometh and bringeth his Deeds that they may be manifest that they are wrought in God , Joh. 3. 21. it is a convincing Rule , that pure and inward Law or Light which converts the Soul ; It doth not onely convict man of Sin , but upon Repentance evidenceth unto him Remission : And this doth not the Scriptures without , to men particularly , though they testify of the several Conditions , which the Light guides the Soul through . The Scriptures testifie against all Sin , but do not shew unto men their particular Sins ; many read the Scriptures , who over-look the Deceits of their own Hearts ; but if they Eye this Light of the Son of God within , it will manifest unto them their particular Evils , and shew them their Thoughts , Motions and Actions , and the Tendance of each ; so do not the Scriptures , they cannot of themselves convince any , as the divine Light can . And this divine Light within discovers all the Temptations , and mysterious Workings , and Depths of Satan to that Soul that waits in it , as they are met withall , and as Satan attempts to insnare , that the Soul may shun his Snares and Wiles upon all Occasions and in all Tryals ; and this does not the Letter without . This Light within also , as a perfect and immediate Rule of Faith , directs the Soul in all the Operations of Faith , against all the Innumerable Temptations , and Tryals , and Besetments of the Enemy , and it opens an Inward Eye of Faith , and is the Immediate Guide to see him who is Invisible through all , but so is not the Scripture : All which being seriously considered , the Light within is the Rule of Faith , and not the Scripture . But if it be objected , That the Scriptures being the Rule of Faith , is not intended without the Help of the Spirit or divine Light in the Soul. I answer , This granteth that the Scriptures are not the Rule of Faith alone , therefore that they are not to be taken as the Intire Rule of Faith , they not being effectual without the Spirit , whereas the Spirit is effectual without the Scriptutes , and able of it self to lead into all Truth . The Spirit or Heavenly Unction considered as a higher Degree , Gift or Effusion of divine Life than that degree of Light that is given in common to all , is attained unto only by those that faithfully improve the Life or Light in its less Appearance , which in some degree appears in every man's Conscience . T. H. I query , whether all the Generations of Christians , since Christ's time until within these very few Years , be not eertainly lost and damned , forasmuch as they acknowledged not this Light within as the true Christ , p. 12. Answ. This shews , thou hast very little Sense of all the Christians , and their Acknowledgments , who thus queriest of them . Did not they acknowledge Christ in them , the Immortal Word of Life and Light in them ? And was not Christ both their Life , Light and Salvation ? And was not the Apostle Paul sent to turn the Gentiles from Darkness to Light ? And did not all the true Ministers preach Christ as God's Covenant , given for a Light and Salvation to the Ends of the Earth ? But in thy dark Thoughts , thou seest not the Drift of rheir Testimony ; but queriest whether all the Generations of Christians till within these few Years be not certainly lost and damned ? And yet thou wouldst be accounted a Christian in this thy Unchristian Work. Sect. X. The Subject Understanding and Obeying the Light within , unknown to the Cavilling Baptist. T. H. WHo or what is it that obeyeth this Light , and in Obedience of it is saved ? Or if this Light be the Rule , it doth suppose a subject capable of understanding it , and of yielding Obedience to it , p. 4. Answ. It s placed in the Heart and Conscience of man , that he ( with his whole Soul , Mind and Spirit ) may understand , and obey it , and come to Life and Salvation in Christ , being guided by his Light in the Conscience . T. H. What then is the Principle ? Either the Light must obey it self , or Darkness must obey it ? Answ. Thy Darkness makes thee talk thus darkly and scribble thus nonsensically , the Spirit of man is to obey every degree of this divine Light given of God , that the whole man may be in Subjection ; for which End God hath given man a spiritual Capacity and Power to obey by the Vertue of Grace , that the reasonable Soul in believeing in the Light , and obeying it , may find Relief and more Power from God , comfortably to subsist in the Way of Life and Peace with him . And though it be not a Scripture Phrase to tell of two such Lights in every man , as thou mentions , p. 14. Yet as the Light of the Body is the Eye which seeth the object of Light , and there is a single Eye which causeth the whole Body to be full of Light ; So in man hath God placed the Eye of the Understanding and Mind , and a Conscience in the reasonable Soul , which is capable of receiving the divine Light , as both the supream Rule and commanding Light ; and they that are translated out of Darkness into it , are become Children of the Light. And if thou wert come to this Estate , thou needst not question who is the subject of Obedience to the Light , whether the whole Person or only a part , for the whole man ought to be the subject ; and where the Eye of the mind is single , the whole Body is full of Light , and no part dark : But for the whole person to be subject to the Light , is inconsistent with thine and thy Brethrens Doctrine for Sin and Imperfection during Life . Why then dost thou now suppose the whole Person to be the Subject , when thou art not real in what thou implyest of the whole Persons being obedient ? p. 15 , 16. And thou dost but play the Fool and Caveller , whilst thou art drawing such a Conclusion upon us , as that by our Principle , the Light must obey it self ; and in so doing be saved ; this is only inferred from a Fiction of thy own Framing , or a Quaker of thy own making , to speak as thou pleasest ; for the Light is given for the Benefit of Mankind , that they that truely follow it and throughly obey it , with Subjection of both Soul , Spirit and Body , may know Salvation from Sin here and Wrath her●…after . And so man ( in his spiritual being , both in Soul and Body spiritual ) as changed or translated from a State of Mortality , may forever enjoy a State of Immortality in Glory hereafter ; as they who are led by the Counsel of God shall afterwards be received into Glory ; for man as translated into that Celestial Spiritual State , is most capable of the full Enjoyment of Glory with God hereafter . Sect XI . Concerning the Soul of man , as under divers Considerations and States , and G. Fox ' s VVords so considered with ; ●…ight Queries added . COncerning the Soul of man , thou vehemently accusest us with Fancies , Conceits , Absurdities , Nonsence and Error , p. 16. Thy Instance for this is , viz. That G. F. mentions in his great Mystery , &c. p. 68. and 100. That the Soul is part of God and of his being , and that it is without beginning , p. 91. and also infinite . p. 29. Whence thy Inference is , viz. Which is as much as to say the Soul is God — then God sets up a Light in himself , which he himself is to obey , and in so doing he shall be saved , p. 16. Answ. We cannot expect any impartial or fair Dealing from thee , while Prejudice and Envy do possess thee , who hast both falsly and ignorantly represented G. F. and both curtayled and perverted his Words and the Sence of them . And all these things mentioned by thee , he does not speak of the Soul or Spirit of man , as made or formed in him , though composed of Spiritual Parts , nor use these Expressions , that the Soul or Spirit of the Creature Man , is a part of God without beginning ; neither was the Phrase ( part of God ) originally G. F's but his Opposers , only admitted of by him by Way of Question , as plainly appears , p. 100. with Relation to that which came out from God , that immediate Spirit of Life , which gives Being Life and Subsistance to the Soul , and he doth distinguish between the Soul and Christ the Bishop of it , between the Soul and the Saviour of it , as plainly appears in many places of the said Book , and the Soul could no otherwise be deemed infinite , then as Man is said to be the Image and Glory of God , namely by a Participation thereof ; so he speaks of the Soul in a two-fold Sense ; as , First , With reference to that which came out from God ( which is the Original Life or Soul of every Man's Soul ) Secondly , With Respect to man , as being made a living Soul by Vertue of the Spirit of Life proceeding from God. And so with Relation to the first , he questions ; Is not that of God , which comes out from God ? Great Mystery , p. 68. But with Relation to the latter , viz. Man , he speaks distinctly of the Soul , as neither God nor Christ ; neither doth he confound the Being of man with the Infinite Being of his Creator , as is implyed in our Opposers angry Charge ; for as every Spiritual Being or Existence is not divine ; so the Spirit or Spiritual Parts of Man are not God , though a divine Light and Capacity is placed in them . And G. F. doth not only speak of the Soul in a two-fold Sense , viz. with Relation to its original Life , and with Relation to man in his Spirituality , but of the Soul of man as in several States ; as , First , Of the Souls being in Death in Transgression , man's Spirit unsanctified ; the Soul being come into Death , transgressing the Law , &c. Great Mystery , p. 91. Therein he cannot intend the infinite Essence , Being or Life of God or Christ , which is immutable , and unchangeably pure and holy , though thereby the Soul is upheld in its Being and Immortality , whether in Comfort or Misery . Secondly , Of the Soul and Spirit of Man as sanctified , living to God in his Life , through a diligent hearkening to the Counsel and Voice of God , and feeling of his Hand , which brings up out of Death , and restores the Soul , that it may live in Christ the Preserver and Overseer of it , to praise God the Saviour , being one Soul ( in that State ) as they that are joyned to the Lord are one Spirit . As also G. F. adds , viz. Every Man that cometh into the World having a Light from Christ Jesus , the Way out of the Fall , the second Adam ; receiving the Light , they receive Redemption and Sanctification , whereby their Spirits , Bodies and Souls are sanctified , Great Mystery , p. 91. Note here still , that he plainly distinguisheth between the Soul and him that redeems and sanctifies it ; so that the Soul or Spirit of Man , is neither God nor Christ ; but as much inferior in Subordination to God and Christ , as the Creature Man is to the Creator , or that which is saved and redeemed to him that saveth and redeemeth . The sum of what 's said amounts to this candid Account about the Soul , viz. That the Soul and Spirit of Man is not the very Being of God , nor a part of God , though the original Life of the Soul which came out from God is immutable and infinite ; there is a divine and infinite Life in the Soul of Man ( which we would have you be sensible of . ) This is the Life of Lives , the Soul of Souls , the Being of Beings ; by which the Soul of man is made to subsist in its Being and Immortality , whether in the Kingdom of Glory or Pit of Darkness ; although this original or divine Life in the Soul stands clear and free from both the Guilt , Torment and Anguish , that comes upon every Soul of Man that does Evil. Every Soul must appear before the Lord in its own proper Image and Nature , which it hath born , been under , and received while in the Body ( having been subject either to the Spirit and Power of God , or to the Spirit and Power of the wicked one ) wherein it s capable of either being a Vessel of Mercy and Love , or a Vessel to hold Wrath and Anguish , according to what it doth here love and effect , and contract to it self whether Good or Evil. Therefore as it s commanded , Take heed to thy self and keep thy Soul diligently , &c. love the Lord thy God with all thy Soul , &c. and then thou wilt know Christ to be the Salvation of it . The Scripture speaks variously of the Soul , and as in divers States and Conditions , viz. 1. Of the Soul of God which is Immutable . 2. Of the Soul of Man , and that , 1. Of the Righteous , which really pertake of the divine Nature . 2. Of the Wicked , which pertake of the Nature of Enmity : And these differ in their Affections , the one being to Good , and the other to Evil. Mention is made of the Soul , as under the Power of Sin , Death and the Grave by man's Disobedience and Fall , and of the Soul as quickned , raised up , and delivered or saved by the Power of Christ , the living ingrafted Word . Sometimes the Soul is mentioned , as including the whole man ; sometimes , as distinguished from the Body ; sometimes it s esteemed as the Life , and sometimes the Spirit or Breath of Life , and an active Soul inspired , and there is a State wherein the Word of the Lord is said to divide asunder betwixt the Soul and Spirit . Now if you do not own a divine Seed , or unchangeable Principle of Life in the Soul ; I query of you . 1st . Do you , or did you ever know your own Souls ? 2ly . What the Soul is in it self , and distinct from the Body . 3ly . What and where is that to be known , that is to change the Souls , and so the whole man's Affections from Evil to Good , while man remains in this Life ? 4ly . Do you own the Souls Immortality , that it doth not dye with the Body ? Do not some of you Baptists hold that the Soul dyeth with the Body and sleeps in the dust of the Earth untill both arise together . 5ly . Whether Man doth not subsist in his spiritual Being and Parts , with a spiritual Capacity and spiritual Sences , having a Sense of perpetual Gain or Loss when his Earthly Tabernacle is put off ? 6ly . Whether the Spirit of Man doth not return unto God that gave it , to receive its Judgment and Reward ? 7ly . Whether Man must not be born again here of an Immortal and Incorruptible Seed in him , if ever he enter into God's Kingd●…m , or enjoy Glory hereafter ? 8thly , Whether it be not more necessary for you to wait in humilily , to know this immortal Seed in you , and to be born thereof ; then to puzzle your Brains , and to busie your Thoughts , either about the Quest●…on how and with what Body are the Dead raised ? Or how your Souls shall be invested hereafter ? If you remain here in the Enmity , slighting and contemning the Light within , or the immortal Principle , or incorruptible Seed within ( as T. H. doth scoff and ridiculously droll at our Testimony for it ) you 'll be clothed with perpetual shame and Contempt hereafter : God knows how to reserve the Unjust to the Judgement of his great Day to be punished ; as both Divels , fallen Angels , and wicked men are reserved . You need not question in what Bodies or Vessels ; for that you shall be vessels fit to hold inevitable Wrath , if here in time you repent not . But if you repent and return to the Lord God , and love and serve him with all your Souls , it will be well with you hereafter ; God will provide well for you ; And the Glory wherewith his sanctified Ones shall be invested ; And of that House wherewith Righteous Souls shall be cloathed upon , is beyond the reach of humane Capacities Thoughts or Imaginations of men . And you who are contending and quarrelling about your carnal Bodies , have not had so much as a Vision of the Glory of the Saints hereafter , nor of the Gloriousness and Spirituality of their Body , who are as the Angels of God in Heaven . Sect. XII . The Neck of the Baptist's Cause broken by his own Concession to the Light within , in which Christ and his Testimonies are effectually received . T. H. HOw could you call the Light within Christ , if some Scriptures had not mentioned Christ in you , & that he is the Life and Light of Men ? Give me an Instance of any Person in the World ( that never had Acquaintance of the Scriptures ) that ever called the Light in every Man by this Name : If none can be produced , then the Scriptures must be your Rule for this , p. 22. Answ. Thou hast said enough in not only granting the Light within to be Christ , but also in confessing that he is the Life and Light of men , which while he is really so to men , this is sufficient for them , to call him as he is ( and appears ) to them : Is it not therefore great Ignorance to imply him an insufficient Rule , for men to give Testimony of him while he is a sufficient Rule and Light to them , for their Supply and Life in him ? And what if they cannot call him by all those Names by which he is called in Scripture , while they feel him in Vertue and Power to be really what he is called , according to their Enjoyment of him . It s true , we having the Knowledge of him as our Life and Light ; we must needs reverently own and make use of those Testimonies in Scripture which concur with our Knowledge of him , and that to evince the Truth concerning his Light to them that pretend a Belief of the Scriptures , while yet they are opposing his Light testified of therein . As there are those that pretend to believe Moses and the Prophets , and think to have Eternal Life in the Scriptures , while yet they really oppose that Life and Light testified of in them . And such profess the Scriptures to be their Rule , while yet they are perverting them against the Life and Light from whence they came ; and this Hypocrisie many of you are guilty of ; and therefore with Abraham we refer you to the Scripture Testimony in this Case , which if you believe not while you profess them , you will not believe if one rise from the Dead . The Scriptures are not our only Rule for our refusing to swear , our not breaking Bread with you , &c. for which thou falsly accusest us of arguing against the Institutions of the Gospel , p 23. for , 1st . We stand for the Reputation of Christianity , and that Love which injures no man , in our res●…sing to swear , which the Prohibition without us did not bring us to , but the Power of Christ when it begat us into that Love , wherein we know the fulfilling of Christ's Command . 2ly . O●…r Experience of Christ Jesus the Living Bread which comes down from Heaven , hath shewed us the Uselesness of your breaking Bread , as being but a Shadow ; while we are come to the Substance ( to wit ) Christ Jesus , the Bread of Life come down from Heaven , which if thou knowest him so come , as that his Flesh and Blood were thy Meat and Drink , thou wouldst not be doting about the Shadow . We do not grant that Christ is so come and revealed in all men , and yet own some degree of this Light to be in all : Thou hast no Reason to accuse us for Lyars in this matter , as in p. 23. But thy slanderous Tongue and Pen is at Liberty in this and many other things . Thy Malice also plainly appears , in charging us of denying the Person of Christ , whereas we have fully confest the Man Christ according to the Scriptures , both with respect to his Sufferings and Glory . Sect. XIII The Baptist's Impious Forgery upon the Quakers about the Scriptures , which are in Reality owned and used by them . AFter thou hast erroniously accused that of God in us , as not sufficient to direct , thou proceedst in thy false fictitious Dialogue thus , viz. Chr. Is it ingenuous and honest in you to deny the Scripture to be a Rule to others , and at the same time you make it ( though by mis-interpreting it ) a Rule to your selves ? Are not you ashamed of this Deceit and self-condemned of plain Partiality . And then he most falsly personates the Quaker . Qua. Thou mistakest us ; for when we make Use of the Scriptures , 't is only to quiet and stop their Clamors that plead for it as their Rule . Reply , Who but an Ungodly Man would have brought forth such a lying Forgery as this in the Sight of the Sun , as the Quakers Words , which is not the Speech of any real Quaker so called , but one of thy own making to speak as thou pleasest for thy own wicked ends ; and thy Lye upon the Quakers is manifest herein : Is this the Way thou proposest for our Conviction , to make Lyes thy Refuge ? Was it not known unto the World , that we have a better and more serious Esteem of the Holy Scriptures then here thou represents , as knowing them to be profitable to the man of God , who is come to know that eminent divine Rule of the Spirit which opens them , and to make use of them in Subjection thereunto . As also our denying that they are the Rule of Faith is no Proof that we deny them to be any Rule at all , while in Subserviency to , and Proof of the greater , we make use of them as the Spirit of God teacheth , and for the Information and Conviction of them that have a Belief concerning them ; for the End still that they may eye that Light and Spirit of Truth which gave them forth , and come to know that Inspiration of the Almighty which giveth the Understanding . As for Deceit , Impudence and presumptuous Conceit , which thou T. H. accusest us of , thou art highly guilty thereof thy self , or else thou couldst never forge such Lyes against us as thou hast done . And we wish thou didst in Reality own the Scriptures , as ( feigndly in Words ) thou pretend'st : So far are we from strenuously endeavouring to take People off of the Scriptures ( as falsly thou accusest us ) that we desire all might come to know the Righteous Ends for which they were given forth , by that divine Light which opens them . Much of thy dirty stuff is gathered out of other dirty lying Pamphlets , which have been long since answered . Sect. XIV . His impious Abuse about Revelation , Light within , Scriptures , &c. ANd why dost thou quarrel against us for owning Revelation , or Perfection as attainable ? What hast thou against Immediate Revelation ? Instead of confuting the thing it self , thou tellst us of some personal Mistakes or Weaknesses of some particulars , as , First , Of one being mistaken by Paul Hobson's speaking through a Trunk [ though that was no Quaker who was thus cheated . ] 2ly . Of others being mistaken about the Persons to whom they should have declared some Message . 3ly . Of a notorious Falshood being taken for a Revelation . 4ly . Of the Opposition of some professing the Light and Revelation , p. 26 , 27. together with several other Stories , and Personal Reflections , which I have very much Cause not to believe . But suppose many of these Stories were true against private Persons : Hast thou herein dealt ingenuously , thus no inveigh against Principles , from personal Failings of such as profest them ; Is there no such thing as divine Revelation , or the Guidance of an Infallible Spirit to be known , because some do err or are mistaken that profess them ? Or no such thing as an infallible Light , because some have differed in some particular Cases that have profest it ? Wouldst thou thus be dealt by concerning thy Water-Baptism , or pretended Gospel-Institutions ? If it should be argued , that because the Dippers are greatly divided among themselves , and that about Principles and Doctrines ; and some of them have been grosly corrupt and debaucht in their Lives , therefore their dipping or Water-Baptism is no Institution of Christ : wouldst thou look upon this as a good Argument ? Nay further , Do you not much differ among your selves in several principal matters ? As about personal Election and general Redemption , and so about the Death of Christ , whether for all or some , and about Free-Will , the seventh Day Sabbath , and laying on of Hands , and about the manner of administring your pretended Lord's Supper , and about the Immortality of the Soul ; as also some affirming Water-Baptism to be of Necessity to Salvation , others not , with several other things ; and yet most of you that thus differ , profess the Scriptures to be your Rule . If then I should from hence argue , that therefore the Scriptures are not the Rule , because you that profess them to be so are so repugnant one unto another , thou wouldst readily reflect Absurdity upon me , though to the undermining of thy own Cause . Why dost thou so much slite the Light within , and insinuate against Revelation , or Perfection from personal mistakes , Weaknesses or Failings of some particulars , supposed . Nay , I may further except against thy Impertinency herein , who durst not produce one Argument against the Principle upon this Occasion when thou wast desired ; for that an occasional Mistake , Slip , or circumstantial Difference is no general Argument to prove a man a false Prophet or Minister never called of God ; seeing that , An Eli and a Samuel might be mistaken , 1 Sam. 1. 13 , 14. and Ch. 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8. and Ch. 16. Verse 6 , 7. A young Prophet seduced by an old , 1 King. 13 , 18 , 19 , 20 , 22 , 23 , 24. A Paul revoking his Reflection , Acts 23. 5. A Paul and a Banabas in a Contest , Acts 15. 39. A Peter withstood by Paul , Gal. 2. 11 , 12 , 13 , 14. Yet these are no Arguments , that therefore these men were never called of God , nor had divine Revelation to prophesie or preach . Neither on the other Hand does it argue that they fell short of Perfection or Infallibility , when they came to see into the Depths of Satan , and how any of them have been overtaken ; for through that which is perfect they out-grew Imperfections and Weaknesses . I must yet take notice of what thou speaks of a Revelation that came from Paul Hobson , who on Purpose to try them spake through a Trunk , yet could they not distinguish his Voice from the Immediate Voice of God , p. 27. Reply , Thou hast herein grosly belyed the Quakers , neither were they either thus tryed or cheated ; howbeit dost thou think that this adds to the Credit of thy Cause ? Was not Paul Hobson an eminent Dipper , or Brother Baptist of yours , who ( when he grew weary of a poor shattered whimsical man in his House , who was no Quaker ) your Brother Paul did feign a Call as from God through a hollow Trunk to the poor man to get rid of him ; as I have also heard the Story credibly related in the County of Durham . Now was not this a horrible Deceit and Cheat of your Brother Paul to presume such an Invention , as in the Name of God ; whether was he the Deceiver or the poor man deceived most to be blamed ? Let the ingenuous Reader and thy own Conscience judge . And so how dully and sorrily thou hast come off , to bring this as an Instance either against the Quakers or Revelation ? How hast thou manifested thy Folly herein ? And wouldst thou and thy Brethren be thus dealt by , to be all reflected upon , or disparaged by the Miscarriage of any particular Persons supposed among you , thou wouldst be ill pleased if I should speak in earnest ; behold what Deceivers the Baptist Preachers are , seeing Paul Hobson their Brother did so impiously deceive and cheat the poor shattered man. And so what Advantage hath thy envious Reflection upon us , been to thee or thy Cause . Again thou bring'st an Instance against the Light within , thus , T. H. Above all , that eminent Difference may not be omitted between J. N. and G. F. at or after J. N's publick Entrance into Bristol , when they called each other the Children of the Devil , and departed from the Light ; A great Party adhered to both in this Opposition of their Lights and Revelations , p. 27. Answ. First , This is a false Relation , the Words were not so between them , nor was the Opposition at Bristol . 2. Nor was the Opposition from the Light in both . 3. It s true , that J. N. was witnessed against by several for turning aside from the Light at that time ; and therefore it is most unjust in thee to cast his Failings upon the Light , or instance it as an Argument against us . 4. J. N. came by the Light to a Sence of his Loss and repented of it ; therefore unjustly imputed either to the Light , to G. F. or us . 5. Seeing there was Opposition between them , it is a most malitious Conclusion of thine , from hence to call us Cheats and Impostors , p. 28. as also in thy 17. pag. thou calls our first fundamental Principle a meer Cheat. Thus thy wicked Design is not only against the Persons , but against the Principles ; whereas our first fundamental Principle is the true Light , against which thou hast thus blasphemed ; for which God will rebuke thee , not only as an impertinent but a most malitious Opposer . And to prove thy Lye , that we endeavour to beget in the minds of men an ill Opinion of the Scriptures , thou dost instance my Saying , that which is spoken from the Spirit of Truth in any , is of as great Authority as the Scriptures and greater . p. 28. But leavest out my Explication , viz. as received , and immediately proceeding from the Spirit and spoken in the Sence thereof ; that is , in the living Demonstration of the Spirit to the Conscience . This I still testifie is of greater Authority then the meer Letter or Writing , though containing the same Words so spoken as I did then instance and explain thus , viz. As Christ's Words were of greater Authority when he spake , then the Pharisees reading the Letter , &c. But do not you Baptists deem your Preaching of equal Authority with the Scriptures , when you say , what you preach is the Word of God , ( however intermixt with your own uncertain Meanings . ) In thy 35. pag. to prove thy calling me a Knave , a false and deceitful Man ; thou sayst , I give not the least hint of thy Explications of thy Positions ; whereas I writ thy Doctrines for thee to give thy own Explications , least thou shouldst say I wronged thee ; yet to this Day I must confess , that some of thy Positions were so absurd and incongruous that I could not hear thee give the least rational Explication upon them , as those mentioned upon Joh. 1. 4. viz. First , Of the Light being natural , because the Light of the Eternal Word . Secondly , That 't is divine as in God , but natural as in man ; for this thou didst not shew so much as the least Colour of Reason or rational Explication . And must I be accounted a Knave , guilty of Deceit , a false deceitful Fellow for not writing all thy Impertinencies ? And yet thou takest the Liberty to leave out my Explication which was most material to my Position ( for the powerful Demonstration of the Spirit ) while it was set down in Print before thy Eye . Oh! what gross Hyocrisie art thou guilty of , thus to rail and revile such as wish thee no Harm , when thou hast no Occasion given thee ; and yet art guilty of that which thou falsly accusest another for . An other dark Accusation of thine is , of a Servant Maid , that should say the Bible is a good honest thing , but she lik't our Friends Books better , p. 29. If thou hadst mentioned the Name of this Maid , and proved the Accusation , what is this to the Body of the Quakers ? Though I suspect this Accusation not true ; but if it were , doth thy inference follow , that our Proselites are thus taught ? O abominable Wickedness ! Where or when did we ever preach such Doctrine ? We utterly deny it , and never heard any of our Friends held or owned it ; knowing in our Conscience , the eminent and reverend Esteem we have of the Scriptures or Bible , as the principle Book extant in the World , though we may not slite but esteem all other Books dictated by the Spirit of Truth in their Places , and for the good ends intended . Another Accusation is , that Fox and Hubberthorn said , the Scriptures are no standing Rule and that it is dangerous for ignorant People to read them , p. 29. Reply , First , As for being the only and standing Rule , they no where call themselves so , but refer us to God and Christ or Spirit within . 2ly , Thou hast wronged and mis-cited their Words in a more general terms then they are ; their Words not being 't is dangerous for ignorant People ; but to their Adversary they say , The Letter which killeth is dangerous ; for thou takest it here to war withal against the Saints , giving out thy carnal Expositions upon it — you read with Danger who make a trade of Scripture — but blessed is he that does read and understand , &c. as in the same page and Book cited by thee , Entit . Truth 's Defence . Mark here , they neither slite nor oppose the sincere reading and perusing of the Scriptures : Now seeing thou abuses and mis-renders ( as hinted before ) such Passages as we find apparent in our Books to correct thee : It s no Wonderment if thou dost abuse divers of our Fri●…nds in thy Stories upon meer Reports and private Discourses , as thy manifest Deceit in mis-citing our Words , which renders thee very suspitious in many of those Stories . Now let the ingenuous Reader take notice of thy Abuse herein . B●…t , 3ly , That it is dangerous for some ignorant or unlearned People to read them , is evident , while unstable and prejudiced in their Minds , not regarding the Spirit or Light that gave them forth to learn by , and give them the right Understanding ; for 't is such as are unlearned who wrest them to their own Destruction . Is not this dangerous for any to pervert them to their own Destruction ? Is it therefore just in thee to compare them to Jesuites and Romanists who thus intend ? Yet 't is not dangerous but useful and profitable to read the Scriptures in Honesty and Simplicity of mind , having regard to that divine Light and Inspiration of the Almighty that gives the true Understanding of them . Another Story is of one Holbrow that should say , that the Scriptures were no better to him then an old Almanack . Answ. This verifies the old Saying , that the Devil will play at a small game rather then stand out . But we utterly deny any such gross Comparison concerning the Scriptures . I am credibly informed of a Ranter that spake these Words above twenty Years ago ; what 's that to the Quakers ? And we have heard of some Ranters that have thus grosly slited the Scriptures , but never any real Quaker . Howbeit thou art not wanting in Envy to brand us with such Calumnies , how utterly soever the things be disowned & abhorred by us : Some Baptists have turned Ranters , and others have mantained Ranterism , and others of them Poligamie ; others again , eminent among them ( as namely of their Leaders ) have turned Papists . Now wouldst thou take it well , if I should endeavour to render you all odious upon their Account ? 'T is probable when they turned Ranters they had a very mean Esteem of the Scriptures . And if I should take this Course of arguing against the whole Body of you Baptists and Dippers ; I might make a large Narrative of the gross Wickedness of many that have been eminent among you ; but that is not my Way of confuting mens corrupt Principles , though sufficient to spoil the Credit of the guilty , and to render them unmeet Guides to others . Yet far be it from me to asperse all amongst you therewith , believing many called Anabaptists to be far more honest and sincere then thy self , or divers of thy Brethren . Elizabeth Marshal saith in answer to the Dialogue , pag. 27. THat about sixteen Years ago I was pressed in my Spirit to v●…sil the People called Baptists in Taunton , and at their Meeting which was then in Taunton Castle , I spake amongst them what was given me of God , which the Meeting with Attention received , and many of them came forth with me lovingly to a neighbouring House , this is true ; but that I should ever say or pretend I had a Message from the Lord to deliver only to Thomas Mercer at Taunton , this is utterly false . And also that Thomas Mercer as an old Acquaintance hath been several times to visit me , this is true ; but that I should say to him or any other person , that it was revealed to me that he was come to deny his Principles , this is also a false forged Lye ; and I think when I shall speak with Thomas Mercer , he will not abuse me with such a Lye , not did he ever reprehend me for such a Saying ; So it is a Lye proceeding from the Father of Lyes , who through his Servants would suggest such things on purpose to render the Truth and those that profess it odious , but the Pit the wicked hath digged for others , they fall into themselves , and the Truth is Clear , and I am Innocent therein , who am yet alive to give this my Testimony under my Hand . Elizabeth Marshal . Sect. XV. His partial Relation against John Story . AGain thou givest a very scanty and partial Relation concerning John Story about the Sufficiency of the Light in every Man , to guide to Salvation without any other Counceller , upon their excepting against the Priest's Book , out of which the Position was read , and refusing to be catechised by thee , &c. p. 30. As for that Contest between thee and John Story , I have heard a more full and impartial Account then thou givest , and how thou wast sufficiently baffled at it , and proved a false Accuser of the Principle of the Quakers , as leading from Christianity to Heathenism , which could not be supposed to relate to those Gentiles that walked up to the Light or Law of God in their Hearts ( for that was really pious and therefore Christian ) but to the impious idolatrous Part : And though John Story and his Friends might justly except against the Priest's Book , as being an Adversary to us , perverting our Principles and representing them to our disadvantage ; yet John Story never receded from the sufficiency of that divine Light of Christ in every man , to guide them to Salvation who believe in it and are obedient to it ; not excluding the Counsel of such faithful Ministers where they are sent , so to direct and turn mens minds from Darkness to the Light , wherein they still submit to the Light of Christ , as the Ground of their Ministry , and the sufficient chief Rule and Guide , which implies no defect in Christs Light , but on the Creatures Part , whose mind is alienated from the Light ; the Insufficiency is not in any degree of the Light it self as a Rule , but they that are turned to it ought solely to depend upon it , in it to know and receive the Light of Life , and Power from Christ against Sin and the Devil . As for John Story and our Friends refusing to be catechized by thee when thou hadst accused them , they might very well , while thy catechizing argued want of Proof for thy Charge , and a Willingness to draw out some Occasion from them ; therefore they had the Advantage to discover thy foolish Rashness . And thou hast made use of divers other lying Pamphlets to prove thy Falshoods against us in many things , and hast raked up in thy Dialogue Slanders out of our Adversaries Writings , which have been long since answered . Reader be pleased to view over these two Accounts ( touching the Controversy between Tho. Hicks and John Story ) that It may be understood how Sillyly Tho. Hicks came off about his false Charge against the Quakers , Devizes the 21st of the 11th Month , 1672. THe Occasion and Substance ( as I remember ) of what past between John Story and T. Hicks at Bromham - bo●…se was as followeth , viz. A Friend of ours visiting some of her Relations that were Baptists in the Vize ; some Discourse passed of the Fewness that was converted of late Years ; to which Tho. Hicks said , it is not now a time for Conversion ; the Friend answered , she believed otherwise , for many had been converted within these few Years by the People called Quakers , the Quakers , said Hicks , their Conversion is but from Christianism to Heathenism , which the Friend said was not so ; but he pretended he would prove it , and came to the Meeting , where John Story layd his false Accusation hard upon him either to prove it or confess his Lye , but he sought many Wayes to evade it — at length Hicks , and an outed Priest that came with him , produced a Book , a Priest's Book ( as was conceived ) in which as they said was contained many Errors collected out of our Friend's Books . John Story replyed to this Purpose , that we shall take no notice of what is printed or mis-represented of our Principles , but we shall claim that Priviledge to state our Principles our selves and to present them as we understand them : And in some Discourse about the Light , John Story laid it down as our Principle , that the true Light that lighteth every man that cometh into the World is sufficient for Salvation , &c. But Hicks not willing to be beat out of his own Road raised many Intergatories , which some Friends of ours reproving , said , they ( needed not , or ) did not come to be catechiz●…d of him , but pressed him to answer the matter in Controversie , and not permitting their Arguments out of the Book they brought , Hicks and his Company rose up and went away with a Lye in their Mouthes , which was that our Friends did deny their Principles . Samuel Noyes . Chippenham the 15th of the 11th . Month 1672. IT s known here that the matter to be disputed , was Hicks ' s own Assertion under his Hand , which he promised to p●…ve , viz. that the Quakers converted from Christianism to Heathenism , and John Story to make an Introduction into the Dispute ) ( after the People understood the matter to be disputed ) opened to the People what must be understood by Christianity according to the Saints Testimony , and what by Heathenism according to holy Scripture , as to both their Wayes and Worships , by that Hicks found himself at a loss , and surely felt his own Words his Burthen , and strugled much to avoid the proving his Charge , though given under his own Hand ; but Truth bruised his Head and held him fast , God's Power and Wisdom was manifested above the Serpent ; then he pulled out a Priest's Book , and read that which he called the Quakers Tenet , which either the Priest had wronged in his Book , or Hicks in reading , or the Printer in printing , viz. that the Light in every man is sufficient without any other Councellor to guide unto Salvation , leaving out the two Words [ of Christ ] it should have been ( the Light of Christ ) or that true Light which lighteth every man that cometh into the World is sufficient ) So our Friends answered they came not there to be catechised by him , but to hear him to prove if he could , that the Quakers converted from Christianism to Heathenism , and said that Book in his hand was a lying Book ; so the Weight of Judgment in the Truth came upon him . These are the Heads of the matter , and manner of the Dispute so far as Friends here at present remember . Take this at present , lest John Story 's Information come not in time . Thomas Neate , William Dyer . Sect. XVI . The Baptist's Disparagement of the Light within contrary to his own Pretence . AFter thou hast pretended no Disparagement to the Light within to say , that God makes any thing more known of his Will , &c. for each degree of Light is serviceable to its end , p. 36. wherein though thou hast granted the Difference to be but in the degrees of Light , and not in the kind ; yet mark what thou sayst afterwards in thy 38. pag. viz. T. H. What intollerable Pride and Arogancy have you arrived to ? And all this in following ( as you pretend ) the Conduct of the Light within , improving it to the subverting and anihilating the Covenant of Grace , which is the only Way God hath revealed ( since the Fall ) for the Salvation of Sinners : Surely then this Light , which instead of directing what you do in a Way of Subserviency to the Ends of this Covenant , doth directly oppose it , is in that so far from being a sufficient Rule , that it ought to be rejected . Answ. Are all these no disparagement to the Light within ? let the ingenuous Reader judge . Hast thou not herein manifestly opposed and deny'd what thou sayst before , for the Serviceableness of each degree of Light to its end : But what Service , if the following or Improvement of any degree of the Light doth either anihilate or oppose the Covenant of Grace : What dark , mad and blasphemous Work hast thou here made against the Light within , which if it ought to be rejected , what account will be given to God for it ; And he , should he give a Light so repugnant to his own Covenant ? Hast thou not told us , that man must be accountable to God for every Dispensation of Light ? But now thou sayst it ought to be rejected : And hast thou not told us , that Christ is the Light and Life of men ? How easie is it to see thy lamentable and blasphemous Contradiction , which thou art fallen into , as a Judgment upon thee for thy opposing the Light. But let us understand how thou discribes this Covenant of Grace , and way for the Salvation of Sinners , since thou dost not own it to be obtain'd by following of the Light within , but the ●…ight within to be Rejected , where thy Christianity comes to be embraced ? We are sure that God hath not planted a Light in man that opposeth the Covenant of Grace , nor is the Light of C●…rist repugnant to 〈◊〉 Christianity , neither can the least degree opp●…se the greater . Thou proceeds thus . T. H. How comes it to pass that Jesus Christ as to the great end of coming into the World , is so much neglected , and the Stress of many men's Hopes laid upon something in themselves ? Hence the Hope of the Hypocrite is compared to the Spiders Web , being spun out of their own Bowels ? Do you not see this in your selves who are the greatest Admirers of the Light within , p. 38. Answ. Still thou runs upon thy gross mistake of the Light within , whereby thou falsely reflects upon us for relying on it : for , First , Our Hope and Dependance upon the least degree of the Light of Christ in us , which is the divine Life of him , as the Eternal Word ; this can neither oppose nor neglect the great ends of Christ's coming into the World in the Flesh , any more then John's bearing witness to the Life of the Word , being the Light of men , could oppose the Word becoming or taking Flesh. 2ly , What were those great ends of Christ's so coming into the World , but evidently to shew forth and exalt that divine Light and Salvation in a greater Fulness and Manifestation , which in some degree did before universally shine throughout all Ages ; or otherwayes how could Christ be the Rock of Ages , or his Outgoings from of old from everlasting ? And whence in the dayes of his Flesh shewed he Light through his innocent Life , Ministry and Miracles , but from that divine Power and Glory of the Father in him ; for God did work them by him ? 3ly , After it s testified concerning God the Eternal Word , that in him ( or in it ) was Life , and the Life was the Light of men , Joh. 1. 4. It s said , that the Word was made Flesh and dwelt amongst us ( or tabernacled in us ) and we beheld his Glory , as of the only begotten of the Father , full of Grace and Truth , ver . 14. and of his Fulness have all we received Grace for Grace , ver . 16. Now mark , this discovery of his Glory , Grace and Fulness was a divine discovery , being as of the only begotten of the Father , of whom John said , he that cometh after me is preferred before me , for he was before me , verse 15. The divine Light of the Word was that by which they had this discovery of Christ , which was beyond that of the outward or fleshly Appearance , which might be seen with a visible Eye , but the other only seen by the Eye invisible and Spiritual ; So that this coming of Jesus Christ into the World , was so far from lessening or destroying his spiritual Light of him as the eternal Word in men , that it was to increase the Knowledge of it , and in order to bring it forth in its Brightness and Glory for the Revelation of the perfect Day of Salvation , And herein he came to render the Appearance and Testimony of his Light within the more valid and effectual , men having erred and been estranged from it . Now is it consistent with the Hope of the Hypocrite to obey the measure of the Light of Christ within , in order to receive more ? Is it not rather consistent with the Hope of the Hypocrite to hope that their Sins are pardoned and they justified by the Righteousness and Obedience of Christ wholely without them , while they are rebelling against , sliting and rejecting his Light within them , and so living in their Sins and Impurity ? And this is thy State and Hope as will further appear ; for who have received Power to become the Sons of God , whom the World knoweth not , because it knew not him ; they have that Hope and Expectation of being made like unto Christ , through his Appearance , and every man that hath this Hope in him purifieth himself even as he is pure , 1 Joh. 3. therefore this Hope which they have in them is both living and effectual , and to be fore it is not placed upon Darkness , but upon the Light. For it is the Inlightening of the Eyes of the Understanding , whereby a Soul is capable of seeing what is the Hope of his calling , and the Power that wrought in Christ , when God raised him up from the dead : Therefore thou who rejects the Light within , thy Eye is blind , thy Hope is the Hope of the Hypocrite , thou neglects the great ends of Christ's coming into the World , which was not only to condemn Sin in the Flesh , as his Light within effectually doth , but also to shew and increase Light , and to manifest the day of God's Salvation by his divine Power in delivering man from Sin and Wrath. Sect. XVII His Slander about the Person , Offices , Sufferings and Blood of Christ and continued Abuse of the Light within . T. H. WHat contemptible Thoughts you have of the Person , Offices and Sufferings of Jesus Christ , that you account his Blood no more than you do the Blood of a common Thief , p. 38. Answ. 'T is no new thing for thee to slander us , while by opposing and rejecting the Light within , thou art become hardned and seared in Conscience . These are such notorious Slanders that thousands can witness against thee therein . When did ever any of us express such contemptible Thoughts of Christ , his Offices or Sufferings ? If we had never exprest any such thing , how comest thou to judge our Thoughts to be such ? And where did ever any of us express such an Account of his Blood that was shed , as no more then that of a common ●…hief ? The Lord rebuke thee for this thy abominable Slander , as I doubt not but he will. T. H. And esteem Justification by that Righteousness which Christ wholy fulfilled in his own Person without us , to be a Doctrine of Devils , p. 38. Answ. Though these are not our Words , we do not own the Doctrine , viz. That men are justified wholy without them , by what Christ fulfilled in his own Person only ; for this is not the Language of the Scriptures which thou pretendest to be thy Rule , Christ fulfilled the Righteousness of the Law in his Person , but here thou makest no Exception , but that Justification is by that Righteousness which Christ wholy fulfilled in his own Person without us , men will only believe this when they reject the Light within , as thou hast taught them . But we are not justified by the Righteousness of the Law , nor by any Act of Christ , meerly as done in his Person , but by the Righteousness of Faith in which we are interested in Christ , as we are Partakers of living Faith which are inseparable . But what is this Justification thou wouldst advance , as wholy wrought without thee ? Is it either in Reallity a making men just , or an accepting of them as Just and Righteous who are so in Reallity , or is it a reckoning of them so , who are actually sinful ? If the former , then 't is not wholy wrought without , but the inward Effect of the Blood of Christ in cleansing from Sin is witnessed in order to bring forth this justified State. If in the latter Sence ( as thy Words import ) then all must be in a justified State for whom Christ dyed ; If their Justification was wholy wrought without them in his Person ; and then all men must be in a justified State ; for Christ dyed for all men ; and then what hast thou to do to revile or condemn any as thou hast done ? those whom thou severely opposest must be in as justified Estate as thou canst think thy self . But if men receive the Pardon of Sin through true Repentance , and Justification through living Faith in the Name of the Son of God , and by his Vertue and Blood , then are not all men justified , nor the Justification of any effected nor fulfilled wholy in his Person without them ; for , First , Men are not in a justified State while their Sins are unremitted . 2. They are not in a justified State while the Wrath of God abides upon them : And mens Sins are unremitted while they impenitently persist in Transgression , and the Wrath of God abides upon them who bclieve not the Son. Again we do not affront either the Grace or Wisdom of God in adding what more Light he pleases to any measure that he hath given , while we are witnessing against mens affronting that measure of Light and Grace which he hath already given to Man-kind . T. H. This Light within directs not our Actions to those Holy and Spiritual Ends which the Scripture does : Alas , whereto do the best of mens Actions naturally tend , p. 37 , and 38. Answ. Here like a dull and dark Opposer still thou endeavourest to confound the Light within with man's corrupt Nature ; whereas thou hast confest it to be not only such a Light as can discover God , and that he is to be worshipped , but also that Christ is the Life and Light of men ; and also that it can discover morality , that its serviceable to its end , and that God's Soveraignity over man , and man's Inferiority to God ought to be acknowledged . And doth not this extend to the same holy and spiritual Ends which the Scriptures direct to ? What more holy then God's Soveraignity over man , and man's Subjection to , and Adoration of God ? But according to Scripture , is it not an holy and spiritual End truely to ●…ear God , work Righteousness , and do Good ? which in every Nation he that doth is accepted : And this the Light teacheth , and Glory , Honour and Peace to every man that worketh good , to the Jew first , and also to the Gentile ; for there is no respect of Persons with God , Rom. 2. 10 , 11. Besides , 't is most natural and proper to a spiritual and divine Light to direct to sacred and spiritual Ends. And if thou didst not vary and waver in thy Confusion from thy Concession to the Divinity of the Life and Light of the eternal Word , which is the Light of men , thou wouldst have spared much of thy Babylonish Work to the contrary , who in thy 39 pag. sayst , that thou opp●…sest not the Scriptures to the holy Spirit , but to the Light within . And why dost thou oppose the Scriptures to the Light within ? Or imply such a Difference between the Spirit and the Light within , while thou hast granted that the Light within is not only serviceable , but ought to be improved , as that which chccks for many Evils , and excites to Good : And does not this agree with the Testimonies of the Scriptures ? And will thy reviling of G. Whitehead , as dealing deceitfully for but asking a sober Question , excuse thee in thy Malice and Confusion ? The Question being , By what Rule shall we be convinced that the Scripture is the Rule , and hath Preheminnece above the Spirit ? Apology pag. 48. which instead of answering directly to , thou revilest me , as in pag. 39. not at all telling me by what Rule shall we be so convinced ; but asks this Question . By what Rule shall we be convinced that the Light within is the Rule , and hath Preheminence above the Scriptures ? pag. 39. Answ. Every one that doth Truth brings his Deeds unto the Light , which Light within being divine is sufficient to evince it self as supream Rule in the Conscience : And as it is so manifest where it is not withstood , but obeyed , it s own Brightness , Vertue and Operation sufficiently discovers it self ; but where Enmity is lived in , and Darkness loved rather than Light , the Excellency of it cannot be known . Concerning the Rule that the Patriarchs or Holy Men had before the Scriptures , thou tellst us , they were instructed by Dreams , Visions and Angels , pag. 40. But were these the standing Rule ? Had they these Dreams and Visions to instruct them in the sole Course of their Lives , or rather on particular Occasions ? Surely these were neither the standing , nor yet their chief Rule : They had a Rule to know the Truth of those Visions ; and whether those Angels were good Angels or no ; a Rule of divine Light to discover whether they were good Angels or evil Angels transforming themselves into Angels of Light , which nothing but that which is divine can discover ; for the Saints in this Light shall judge Angels . And Peter , James and John had both a Vision and Voice ( when in the Mount ) from Heaven ; yet Peter himself testifieth , We have also a more sure Word of Prophecy ●…nto ye do well that you take heed , as unto a Light that shineth in a dark Place , until the Day dawn and the Day-Star arise in your Hearts , 2 Pet. 1. 19. Though the former Vision and Voice were true , yet not so universal and abiding , as this shining Light was . That Vision and Voice was only seen and heard by a few , the other was seen and known by all who attained to the dawning of the Day , and the arising of the Day . Star in their Hearts ; for it did shine as in a dark Place for that end . It s evident that this Light or Word so shining was a Light of the same holy Ghost which moved the holy men of God to speak forth Scriptures , ver . 21. and therefore the Apostle prefers it before the Scriptures , as the Cause of their being given forth . Sect. XVIII . The Baptist's Quarrel against S. Crisp removed . THou makest a great Pudder against S. C. about knowing the Beginning and Date of thy Christ , whom to confute thou pleadst his Deity , p. 44 , 45. having before told us of expecting to be saved by Jesus , as being in a Person without ; what Scripture hast thou for this Creed ? Is Christ the Object of Faith only as a Person without ? But dost thou believe in thy Conscience , that he could intend any such thing with reference to the Deity of Christ ? Why art thou so wilfully quarrelsom ? And though the Appearance of Christ in the Flesh , or as man when upon Earth , was within the Compass both of time and date , that is , as to his coming into the World and going out at his Ascension ; yet still the same man Christ is in being glorified with the Father , in the same Glory that he had with him before the World began . But the true saving Knowledge of whom is spiritual and divine , and inwardly received in his own Light and Life within ; and saving Faith is in his Name and divine Power as inwardly revealed . Stephen Crisp's Answer to T. H. THomas Hicks , I having seen thy Book called a Dialogue , &c. and finding my Name mentioned in page 44. and 45. have very seriously taken notice of thy manner of Rehersal of my Words , and thy own spoken at that Conference which we once had at Bartholomew-Close , and that I know of , I never saw a Narrative of a thing past , given forth with more Falshood and Hypocrisie then that is , and with a known and witting Purpose to deceive the Reader , and to abuse me ; and I am perswaded Thomas thou hast in thy self a Knowledge of it ; and surely except thou repent , and obtain Forgiveness , it will one Day be heavy to thee . The Business or matter upon which we treated was , about our holding and believing Christ to be the Light of the World , or that the Light which lighteth the World , and every one that cometh into the World , was and is the true Christ , which was then proved by plain Scripture ; and whereas I do not intend a Narrative of the Discourse , but only to dis-abuse the Reader , and to make known the Occasion of these Words of mine thou hast mentioned ; therefore I shall pass over most of our Discourse , and come to the matter relating to Christ. And that thou didst say ( as thou mentions in thy Book ) that no Spirit nor Principle was capable of Suffering and being Crucified , is true , thou didst say so , but how faise the matter it self is let the Scriptures be judge . Do they not speak in many places of the Sufferings , Pressures , Vexings , Burdenings , Grievings and Quenchings of the Spirit ? and do they not speak of crucifying afresh , killing and slaying the Lamb of God , the Lord of Glory , the 〈◊〉 One , from the Foundation of the World in the Streets of Sodom and Aegypt , & c ? which Sayings cannot have Relation to that Body that hanged upon the Cross , which was not from the Foundation of the World , nor was ●…ot in Sodom , nor never hanged upon a Cross in Egypt , but he whom the Saints called our Lord , and the Lord from Heaven a quickning Spirit was capable of suffering these things , besides those great Sufferings which he suffered in that Body , in which he conversed with men in the Form of a Servant in the ●…arts of Judea and Jerusalem , whom the Jews took and hanged upon a Cross without the Gates of Jerusalem , who I believe dyed for Sinners , and is raised up again by the Power of God , & exalted therein above the Power which caused him to suffer , and sitteth now at the right Hand of God , and maketh 〈◊〉 for the Saints , and is the Ruler over the true Israel of God , who destroyes his Enemies with the Spirit of his Mouth and the Brightness of his coming : New this Christ of God thus truely considered , I neither said nor thought I knew the Date or Beginning of , as thou dost wickedly suggest ; for I know he is without beginning of Dayes or end of Life , and such an high Priest becometh us to have , and blessed are they that believe in him and are faithful to him : and now having answered what thou malitiously wouldst have the Reader believe , which I am perswaded thou thy self dost not believe , viz. That it is my Judgment and Belief that Christ hath a Beginning and Date . I shall now declare the Occasion of such Words , when I was about to prove to thee , that this Principle of Light was that 〈◊〉 of Ages in which the Fathers and Prophets believed , and that it was that Word which came unto the Prophets , and which was known to Abraham to his rejoycing , &c. thou madest me this Answer , That the Names Jesus and Christ were not proper unto any Spirit , Word or 〈◊〉 whatsoever , either in Heaven or in Earth , but unto that Body or Person which was born of the Virgin ; to which I replyed , I remember John Newman hath written so in his Book , but I had thought you Baptists had not owned him in it , but now I see you do , and thou saidst , yes thou didst ; for though thou grantedst , that the Word and Spirit was from the beginning , yet that was not , nor could not properly be called Christ , or Jesus , but that Person that was born of the Virgin , that only was Jesus and Christ ; where uppon I 〈◊〉 then I know the date and beginning of thy Christ ; upon which thou criedst out Blasphemy , to which I replyed and asked thee , if thou thoughtst I did not know how long it was 〈◊〉 he was born as well as thou or another man , &c. and after that did prove to thee by plain Scripture , that the very Assertion was false , to say there was no Jesus nor Christ before , and did mention the Rock of which the Fathers did drink , and which followed the Jews in the Wilderness , which Rock saith the Apostle , was Christ , not is now become Christ , but was Christ ; and the same Apostle saith , that God made all things by Jesus Christ ; mark , Thomas , if this be so , then he was before Mary was , or besore he became Flesh , or took that Body made of a Woman ; for the Prophet testified , that he that should be born in Bethlehem his Out-goings was from of old . I say the more concerning this , because thou endeavour'st to cast the Socinian Leven ( of which thou didst appear that night too full ) upon me , as if I looked upon Jesus Christ as a meer Creature , whose beginning and date I knew , when as those Words were only spoken with Detestation of , and in Testimony against thy corrupt Socinianism that Night uttered , who also made a great Stir with me for saying , the Eternal Son of God. Thy Foundation is manifest , Thomas , thou canst not hide it this Way ; and as concerning thy foolish pratling in page 45. that if I knew his beginning then he was not God ; and if I knew his date , or when he ceased to be , then he is not man ; this is not all worth the answering , the pretended Foundation thereof being taken away , and thou left naked in thy Folly and Perverseness , having shewn thy self but as one who makes a Likeness of a man , and sets it up , and then beats it down again , and goes away and boasts of Conquest . But for a Conclusion , I shall ask thee and thy Reader a Question : Suppose that a man should affirm to me that all things come by Nature , and that there is no universal Spirit of Life to quicken them ; and I should answer thereuppon and say , Then there is no God. I query , were this sufficient Reason to charge me , that I were an Atheist , & that I held there was no God , or ought it not to be taken as detecting the Atheism of the first Assertor ; this is my case with thee , which I refer to that of God in all Consciences , and let that judge in and amongst men ; and thee I leave to receive the reward of thy work at the hand of God , who is just & will not let the guilty go unpunished . Whereas thou ( T. H. ) seemest offended at us for saying , Christ is within ( in whom as such we have living Faith ) as opposed to their Faith who know not him within , but expect to be saved , as believing in a Person without them , as thy Phrase is , p. 44. It appears this is the manner of thy Expectation and Belief , expecting to be saved by Jesus as a Person without thee , though thou hast no real Knowledge of him as such . But it is to be minded , how plainly before thou hast contradicted thy Faith , as thus declared , where in thy 24th . page upon 2 Corinth . 5. 16. thou dost thus paraphrase , viz. Though I Paul when a Jew , and in my unconverted State only knew Christ after a fleshly manner , to be a King of the Jews , and to deliver only from outward Bondage and Captivity , yet henceforth , from the time of my Conversion I know him so no more ; for now I know him according to that design of infinite Grace and Love , which he came to carry on in the World , in being a Saviour of Sinners from Sin , Death and Hell , which before I knew not . Thus far thou . Mark , here thy Contradiction is plain , one while believing in , and expecting to be saved by him , as a Person without ; another while , from the Time of my Conversion , I know him no more after a fleshly manner ; for now my Knowledge of him in being a Saviour from Sin , &c. is not after a fleshly manner , but according to the design of infinite Grace and Love : From whence it follows , that he is not now known to be the absolute Saviour from Sin , as a Person without , or as considered after a fleshly manner but after a spiritual , ( though he was truely a Saviour in the Dayes of his Flesh , by the Power of the Father , by which the Saving Work alwayes was and is inwardly effected ) And indeed his going away or dis-appearing after the Flesh , was , that his Appearance and Knowledge after the Spirit might be the more revealed ; and the Disciples might the more know and rely upon the Comforter , even Christ's Spiritual Appearance within . Sect. XIX . The End of Christ's Coming , Example and Suffering more truely owned by the Quaker then the Dipper . AGain thy implying by Way of Question , as if we owned that the Word did take Flesh , and that the Flesh was crucified for no other End and Purpose then meerly to be an Example , p. 47. is very false against us ; for our owning Christ in the Flesh to be a living Example , does not argue that he took Flesh , and was crucified for no other End and Purpose , then meerly to be an Example ; for he came into the World , both to bear witness to the Truth , to shew Light , to do the Works the Father sent him to do , to war against the Power of Darkness and Wickedness , to exalt the Divinity , the Power of the Father , and to glorifie him upon Earth , to pass through and fulfil the first Covenant , and end the Shadows thereof ; and to set up the new and the living Way , that the second Covenant or Testament might be established and confirmed ; that the Living Ministry thereof might have its free Course , being inforced above and beyond all the former Types , Shadows and Vails under the first Covenant . And so in offering himself up freely , both to do his Fathers Will , and to suffer for Man-kind , he gave himself a Ransom for all to be testified of in due time . As also he was an eminent Example and Pattern of Innocence and Piety through all , which they that slite his Example , have no Benefit in his Sacrifice , nor are concerned in the Ends thereof otherwise then to their own Condemnation ; for Christ's Innocency and Righteousness , even in the Dayes of his Flesh , as openly manifest , do both judge and condemn all the Hypocritical Professors of Christianity , who refuse following his Example , while they are applying the Ends of his Coming and Suffering . Sect. XX. The Baptist's Ignorance and Cavil about Redemption and the Spiritual Discoveries of Christ and his Seed . WHereas thou makest a peice of thy Dialogue , p. 47. run thus viz. Qua. He ( viz. Christ ) comes to work Redemption . Christi . I query , for whom or what did he work this Redemption . Qua. There is a Seed to which the Promise of Redemption is , which only wants Redemption : Thus Nayler in his Book , Love to the Lost. Answ. Thou perverts his Words ; for they are not , That this Seed only wants Redemption , but wherein only it s seen and received , viz. that in the promised Seed Redemption is only seen and received by Man or the Creature , as he fully after explains . Chr. Nayler saith , that Christ is the Election , and the Elect Seed ; and Fox in his great Mystery , the Seed hath been laden , &c. which Seed is the Hope Christ. Answ. If God was so prest as a Cart with Sheaves , and his Spirit grieved by mens Sins , is it otherwise with his Seed in them ? And it thou wert not willfully blind and hardened , thou wouldst not raise such a Consequence from the Words before perverted by thee , while the Scripture mentions the Seed under a two-sold Consideration . 1st . As to Christ , to whom the Promises originally are , as being Heir of all . 2ly . As to the Children of Promise the Children of the Kingdom , the true Believers , who are truely Israel , and of Abraham's Seed according to the Faith. Now know that Christ , the promi ed Seed , hath entred into Sufferings and Travel of Soul to bring forth his Seed : as it s written , He shall see his Seed , he shall see of the Travel of his Soul , and shall be satisfied So he came not to redeem or save himself ( as absurdly thou infers ) but to bring forth and redeem a Seed which shall serve him , and be counted for a Generation . And the Life of Christ as manifest in mortal Flesh , hath pertaken of the Afflictions of the Upright in all Ages ; and the Spirit of God is grieved , the just Principle oppressed and offended with mens Iniquities and Transgressions : So Christ considered as a Seed , and in that low Estate is capable of being formed in man , both of being raised up in man by the Power of the Father , of growing up as a tender Plant , and as a Root out of dry Ground ; and so of receiving Power and Help from him , as indeed every Seed that 's sown , and every Plant that takes Root is capable of receiving Vertue and Nourishment according to its kind , or else it cannot be quickned to Life , grow or bring forth Fruit : And such a Growth of the immortal Seed was both in Christ and in his People , which must be owned , if the Seed of the Kingdom within , and the Spiritual Birth or forming of Christ within ( or he as a Seed or Plant of Renown ) be known and owned , or a Suffering , Crucifying , Dying and Living with Christ be witnessed by man. For Christ's Suffering , Cross , Death , Resurrection , Life and Dominion are spiritual , known in the true Believer , who is of that Seed which Christ took upon him ; yea , his spiritual begetting , spiritual forming in man , and spiritual birth is known within ; and all for the Redemption and Salvation of man to God , or else he falls short o●… L●…e and Glory ; and he that brings up the Soul out of the horrible Pit first descends thither . And though it s not true to say , he only comes to redeem , raise up or save himself ; yet it may be truely said , he doth arise to scatter his Enemies , and to bring man out of the Pit ; and in conquering his Enemies , his own 〈◊〉 brings Salvation to him , Isa. 63. 5 , 9. And thus saith the Lord , in an acceptable time have I heard thee , and in a day of Salvation have I helped thee ; and I will preserve thee , and give thee for a Covenant of the People , to establish the Earth — that thou mayst say to the Prisoners go forth , and to them that sit in Darkness , shew your selves , Isa. 49. 8 , 9. which Promise is of a general Extent . So mark here , He that redeemeth the Prisoner , and calleth forth them that are in Darkness , he hath his help of God that sent him ; we are not to conclude that he helps not others , because he is helped himself : And Christ's Sufferings both inward and outward ( for they were two-sold ) were for man's Benefit ( as is testified in the said Book [ Love to the Lost ] accused by thee ) The Creature is blessed of God for the Seeds Sake , and Redemption from the vain Conversation , as Christ gave himself for us , that he might redeem us from all Iniquity , &c. So if thou wert thus redeemed , thou needst not enquire for the Subject of Redemption , nor accuse others for owning the Seed of God , both in an oppressed State , and as raised up by the Eternal Power and Glory of the Father ; for wor thy is the Lamb that was slain from the Foundation of the World , to receive Power , and Wisdom and Glory and Might , &c. However T. H. slites our Testimony of the Seed of God within , as in several States ; and so the spiritual Resurrection of Christ in man ; his Brother H. G. confesseth thereto in his Book , p. 54. where he saith , Praises and Halelujahs to God for ever , who hath given us that Witness in our selves of which thou speakest , that we can experience the Power of Christ's Spiit risen in us for our Sanctification and Renovation , as well as Christ was raised from the Dead , &c. Thus far H. G. Is it not here evident , that he hath confest to Christ's arising in man , for man's Restoration ? What thinkst T. H. of this ? Is this Canting or Gibberish ? as his Words are against us , p. 47. Moreover , as the elect Seed is spoken of in the Scripture , both with respect to Christ the Anointed , and with respect to his Seed and Heritage ; so also the Seed is Christ , not only as in himself a●…ointed with the Oyle of Gladness above his Fellows , but also as in Union and Conjunction with his Church or Members : As the Body is one , and hath many Members , so also is Christ ; and so Christ and the Body comprehensively is one ; he is the Anointed , and we are anointed in him , and he that hath anointed us is God. By all which it is understood , that we are Partakers of the Life , Redemption and Priviledge that is in Christ , as we are in him , and grow up in him ; so that all our Opposers Cavils ( which render our Principle as only including Christ and God in the Redemption , and not man ) do fall to the Ground , as Groundless and Frivilous . As for his groundless Cavills in his p. 48. The little Understanding he hath either of the Measure of God's Gift , his Seed within , or of Redemption by Christ , the Elect Seed , is very intelligible from the Tenour of his impertinent and contradictory Discourse throughout his Pamphlet . By all which we see the Nature of his pretended Christianity , and how Un-christian he is in his appar●…nt Oppositions against the divine Light and Seed within . Sect. XXI . The Baptist's Imperfect Work against Perfection . COncerning Persection which we say is attainable in this Life , he attempteth to confute us , though very feebly here , as will appear . T. H. I perceive you are forced as much as any others to borrow from the Scriptures , without which you can no more prove any thing , either concerning Christ or Perfection , then a meer Indian , p. 49. Answ. Touching which it appears , while thou grantst something for Perfection we proved from Scriptures , how consistent with this thy after Work is , against Perfection , will ●…rther be manifest : But while thou concludes , that we can prove no more of Perfection then a meer Indian without the Scriptures . How agrees this with thy former confessing , that Man was alwayes under an Obligation , that God's Soveraignity over him , and his Inferiority unto God might be acknowledged . Now if this be truely to be acknowledged by Man or Mankind in general , why are Indians excluded ? And if God's Soveraignity over man , and man's Subjection thereto be known , doth not this extend to Perfection ? If either the Rule be perfect that thus obligeth man , or if in God's Rule Power or Soveraignity ( as over man ) be Perfection , which we affirm is able to evince it self , where true Fear and Subjection to God is lived in , or Sincerity and Uprightness towards him retained : Though to such as thou art , who opposes Sin-less Perfection as attainable in this Life , there is a need especially of producing Scriptures to prove it , while you pretend a Belief of them ; for the perfect Light or Gift of God within you do not believe in . Yet thou hast granted to Perfection , as sincere and upright , p. 50. and is not this Perfection of Sincerity and Uprightness without Sin ? Were it good Doctrine to say , that Persection , as it respects the Sincerity and Uprightness of Saints is sinful ? But that a perfect Freedom from all Sin in this Life is attainable , we intend is by the all-sufficient Power of Christ ; and no true Christian doth dissent from us herein : Nor doth this cause either Pride or Presumption , as thou falsly insinuates ; but the contrary Sin-pleasing Doctrine that 's for Imperfection and Sin while in this Life . And while thou confessest a holy Fear , Humility , Watchfulness and Industrious Endeavours to persevere in a Holy Course to the End , p. 50. Either thou dost hereby grant Perfection , or a perfect Freedom from all Sin attainable in this Life ; or else thou excitest People to be industrious , and endeavour for that which thou believest is not attainable ; which is as much faithless Inconsistency as to say , use your industrious Endeavours to persevere in a holy Course ( that is sinless ) to the End , but it is not attainable : Were not this a sad and Heartless Way of Preaching , to put People upon Impossibilities . Again upon Phil. 3. 15. as many as are perfect , be thus minded . Thou sayst , By Perfection , no more can be understood in this Text , then Sincere and Upright , accompanied with an earnest reaching after Perfection , as Paul did , p. 51. Answ. What ever Perfection with respect to a full Apprehension or Knowledge was prest after by Paul , as Phil. 3. 12 , 13. yet this his Perfection granted of Sincerity and Uprightness was sinless ; it was pure in Nature , wherein he was capable of attaining a perfect Growth in spiritual Understanding : And this is implyed in his pressing after Perfection , while he was perfect , as appears in his own Words . But if in this Sence sincere and upright Men do earnestly reach after a sinless Perfection , and that Paul did so , then it is attainable , otherwise both Paul and the rest did ●…rnestly strive after an Impossibility ; and this renders both their Praying , Striving and Preaching in valid as yours is , who put on People earnestly to reach after Per●…ction , and yet tell them it is not attainable . Upon Mat. 5. 〈◊〉 . Be ye perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect , thou presumest , We intend not that we should be perfectly powerful wise and good as God is . Answ. 1st . We do not intend that we should be God , but holy , just and good men , renewed after his own Image which is perfect . 2ly . Though not so perfectly powerful and wise as God is , yet while thou withal excludes being good as God is , thou art contradictory in saying , the meaning of the Text is , Be Merciful , as your Heavenly Father is Merciful , that is , Love your Enemies , do good to them that hate you , p. 51. these are not intelligibly consistent , That we must not be good as God is , and yet Merciful as he is , that is , love our Enemies , &c. I would know if that Soul is not endued with the Goodness of God , that is endued with his Mercy and Love , so as to do good to enemies : Was it not a plain Caracter of being his Children , when they did so love their Enemies , and do good to them that did hate them ; See Math. 5. 44 , 45. But this perfect Resemblance of the Heavenly Father , such Sin-pleasers and pleaders ( as T. H. ) will not admit of in this Life , who is so far from this Love and Goodness towards Enemies , that his Enmity leads him to abuse , bespa●…ter and defame such of us , who never owed him or his Friends ever any ill-will in the World. But when doth he expect this divine Resemblance of God , or sinless Perfection to be brought forth ? It doth appear in Answer to the Question stated by him thus , viz. Where wouldst thou be perfectly free from Sin , if not in this Life ? His Answer is , in Heaven , p. 50. Reply , He would be perfectly free from Sin in Heaven , as he pretends , but opposeth Perfection being attainable in this Life , accounting that it causeth much Pride , Presumption , hinders all holy Fear , Humility , Watchfulness and industrious Endeavours to Persons in a holy Course ; whereas this all tends to a perfect Life : But sufficiently hath he contradicted this his sinful Doctrine against a perfect Freedom , where he confesses , p. 24 , That Christ came to carry on in the World the Design of insinite Grace and Love , in being a Saviour of S●…ers from Sin Death and Hell. Note here , he hath given a deadly Blow to his own Imperfect lame , and Sinfull Cause ; for if Christ came into the World to save Sinners from Sin , and to redeem us from all Iniquity ; then to be so saved is attainable in this Life ; for Christ is able perfectly to do the Work which he came for , that is , to save from Sin , and to redeem from all Iniquity . Again T. H. in his Forgery deals very corruptly according to his ●…onted manner , in stating the Christian and the Quaker thus speaking viz. Chr. If thou canst prove a perfect Freedom from Sin 's Inherency , &c. remember thou must prove it by Scriptures or Instances , Qua. I will prove it by both . First , By Scriptures , Phil. 3. 15. Math. 5. 48. Secondly , By Instances , Many of our Friends do witness it , p. 50 , 51. Reply , Herein most falsly and abusively he hath acted the Quakers , speaking his own Notorious Forgery as Proo●… . They have no Reason to chuse him for their mouth ; for what needed they bring any Instances of themselves for any Proof , when they are left to prove Perfection by Scriptures , or Instances , while the Scriptures plainly prove it . And let me tell him , it is not our manner of arguing with our Opposers , to tell them , that many of our Friends do witness Perfection , knowing , not only that to be the thing which they seek to reproach us by ; but also that to plead the Verity of Principles from the meer Credit of Persons asserting them , to be no prevalent Proof , nor Effect any Conviction , while the Persons themselves are slited and abused . But our Adversary having thus falsly acted the Quaker as before , as saying , many of our Friends witness Perfection , he declines the Scriptures for it , and falls upon personal reviling ; and to express to the World some wrong Expressions and Mistakes of Persons . If he rightly state them , which I much question because his many notorious Abuses . Sect. XXII . Tho. Hicks his groundless Calumny and malitious Railing against G. Whitehead . NOw we come to his Railing and Sla●…der against G. Whitehead , viz. That he is guilty of Deceit and Falshood in matter of Fact ; and that he told him he was a Knave , that is , he was a false deceitful man , p. 53. Answ. Here I shall take leave to answer for my self ; therefore understand , Reader , what he pretends as his Reason for this abusive Language to me . I find two things he pretends for it . First , He accuseth me with denying mine Opinions , when charged with them . 2ly , He that shall give a false Relation of what another man asserts , and does it wifully , is false and Deceitful : But th●…s he accuseth me ; and why so ? But because I acknowledged Explicatio●…s to be given to his Propositions , yet gives not the least him what t●…ose Explications were , p. 53. Reply , To the first , what I did deny , I still do deny , as none of my Opinions , as stated by T. H. in his accusing the Quakers , That they deny the Person of Christ , his Offices , Sati●…action and the R●…surrection of the Body . I do recharge these upon him , as his Lyes and Slanders forged and brought forth in Envy and Darkness , as I did in the Paper and publick Debate between us ; and in so doing I do not deny any Opinion or Tenent of mine or my Friends : And he dealt most dis-ingenuously in not laying down my own Words to prove that I denyed the Person of Christ , or his Offices , Satisfaction and the Resurrection . But instead thereof was it either ingenuous or honest to bring my ●…dversary T. D. his Pamphlet , stiled a Sinopsis ( which falsly accuseth me with saying , there is no Resurrection from the Dead ) for Proof ? Most falsly instancing my Answer to W. Burnet , in which Answer ( quite contrary to what I am accused o●… ) I have given a plain Confession to the man Christ , his Offices , Satisfaction and the Resurrection according to the Scripture , though 't is probable not in my Opposers Words and Terms ; for note that his Charge which I denyed , was not that the Quakers deny the raising again of this very Body of Flesh , &c. but the Resurrection of the body ( in this general Phrase . ) Is it therefore ingenuous that I should be thus accused in these general Terms ? And when I cannot in Reason or Conscience own T. H's manner of stating things , as my Opinions in his own Words , both besides and contrary to what my Words were or are , must I therefore be called a Knave , a deceitufl Fellow , & c ? Whereas my Conscience bears me witness , that if he had stated either my Affirmations or Denials in any Case in my own Words , Books or Writing , I would not in the least have disowned or receded from them as mine ; but either have stood by them , or upon plain Scripture Evidence to the contrary , should have fallen ●…nder Conviction and Reprehension , according to the nature of the Error or Mistake , if truely detected or proved guilty thereof . As concerning the Resurrection , I am so far from bauking my Testimony , or receding from what I have and do hold concerning it , that I am intended ( if God permit ) to speak further thereof , according to the Sence and Understanding given me , and that before I have done with my present Opposers . But whereas T. H. takes the Liberty to be the Quakers Mouth , and to present them as speaking those impertinencies and Falshoods which are meerly his own Forgeries , and ●…ever believed nor intended by them : Let the unprejudice●… Rea●…er judge , whether he be not highly guilty of Falshood and Deceit herein , as in divers things hath been signi●…ed in this Discourse . And as for his second Accusation , admitting that I did not write down all his Explications upon his Positions ; 't is no Proof , that the Relation of what I gave was false , as very sillily he accuses me ; Neither hath he proved that I have given a false Relation of any one Position of his . Besides , in some of his Positions , the very Substance of his Reason or Argument , is therewith inserted in my Paper ; others of his Positions are so absurd and gross , that he could not make so much as the Colour of a reasonable Explication upon them ; and therefore I did endeavour to induce him upon more deliberate Conside rations , to produce what Explications he could for his Doctrines ; for which these were my Words , If our Opposer say we have not inserted his Explications upon his Assertions ; our Answer is , that 's his Work , he hath Liberty to do it himself . Now if for this he must revile me in the open Street , calling me Knave , and shaking his Stick at me : If the Baptists will prove men Knaves at this Rate about Principles or Opinions , they will make all Knaves that oppose them , who do not relate all Circumstances of Words , as well as their Assertions , how impertinent soever . Though I am unwilling to reflect upon all of them for this outragious and uncivil Carriage , and defaming Language of their Brother Hicks ; for his Brother W. Kiffin did somewhat ingenuously shew his Dislike thereof openly ; yet when he attempted to prove it , adding thereto against me such Language as this , viz. impudent Fellow , audacious Fellow , deceitful Fellow , &c. To excuse him herein , some of his Companions said , it was his Zeal ; but this Cover was too narrow ; such hypocritical and false Excuses will not hold up the Credit of T. Hicks and those his Adherents . And be it reminded , that in divers things he hath both curtail'd and wholy left out my Explications , particularly of that Passage cited by him in his 28. pag. viz. That which is spoken from the Spirit of Truth in any , is of as great Authority as the Scriptures , and greater ; here he stops and leaves out , As received and proceeding immediately from that Spirit , and as Christ's Words were of greater Authority when he spoke , then the Pharisees reading the Letter , as before hinted : See here he hath called me a Knave for that which he is more manifestly guilty of ; and so is condemned out of his own Mouth , in that which he allows himself in . And I desire that Tho. Hicks may look at home , and examine his own Conscience , whether he was not in himself detected for that his Passion and Fury towards me ; I would not have him go on wronging his own Conscience , nor withstand that Light in him , which in secret would shew him his Infirmity and Evil , in this matter of Passion and calumnious Railing , whereby he will never gain upon the Spirits of any , who are tender and sincere to God. But instead of repenting thereof , he brings the same Language over again in his Postscript , after he has had both reproof and deliberation to have learnt better , but it appears he is disturbed and royl'd in his Spirit , as a man guilty , and therefore shuffles to ease himself , by telling us again thus , viz. I told G. W. he was a Knave , wherefore I did then , and do so still esteem him , &c. really false and dishonest , p. 91. To which G. W's reply is , the Lord forgive him ; howbei●… I am at defiance of my Adversary's implacable Enmity , and do challenge him and all the World justly to detect me of dishonesty , or of acting against my Conscience , or to the Injury of any one living , knowing my own Peace in the Testimony of a good Conscience towards God and Man ; I do really defie the Envy of the Devil and all his Agents . And T.H. cannot hide his Passion and 〈◊〉 , by his begging the Question , viz. Doth not that Quaker who wrote that Book called the lying Wonder . p. 9. endeavour to fasten these terms of Fool and Knave upon J. G. Whereas his Case was not the same with mine , nor is he positively so charged , for his Brother J. G. attempting to attest the Anabaptist's lying Wonder out of Lincolnshire , upon the meer Credit of his Brother Ralph James ( the Fomentor of it ) as having been an Elder of a Congregation many Years , from whose Mouth J. G. had the Relation of a great Miracle done by the Prayers of their Church ( though contrary to their Faith , who affirm that Miracles are ceased long since ) and yet in his Letter to his Elder R. J. to desire a Reason why this great handy Work of God hath been so long concealed from Publication , when he himself knew of it some Months before , as also Ben. Morley , as J. G. affirms ; to which the Words are added by T. R. thus , viz. Whether J. G. be not as much Fool as Knave by his own handy Work , let his Brethren judge . See here it s referred to his Brethren to judge in this Case , which was , 1st , His deposing the lying Wonder under his Hand from the Credit of the Forger . 2. His pretending to desire a Reason of its being so long concealed , when he himself knew of it some months before ; though they have not judged his Folly ( at least ) in this ; but T. H. hath positively called me a Knave , a deceitful Fellow , &c. 1. For not writing all his Explications upon his Doctrines ( which are false ) 2. For rejecting his Charge against the Quakers ( of denying the true Christ and the Resurrection , &c. ) as false and slanderous , being we own both according to the Scriptures , Judge candid Reader this mans Shuffling to cover his Envy & malitious Railing . ct . XXIII . The Baptist's Abuse against G. W. about a Meeting with them at Devonshire House , the 18th of the 7th Month , 1672. and T.H. taking part with a Socinian Pamphlet . HIs accusing me of so much Partiallity as renders me Guilty of very Great Imperfection , p. 54. about a Relation of what happned betwixt him and me , at a Meeting in Devonshire House , the 18th of the 7th Month , 1672. This is of little value to me , while I and many others know the contrary : and while he neither proves his Accusation ; nor gives either a true or impartial Narrative thereof himself . But his chief pretended Proof against me , is our saying , the Baptists seemed more like Beasts then Men , several at once making a bawling and hideous noyse , &c. The truth whereof many were eye and ear . Witnesses ; and he cannot clear them herein : But instead thereof , falsly says , the Quakers manifested as much Rudeness , as the worst of men are wont to do to their Opposers . But in this also , he hath very grosly belyed the Quakers : And he may know in his own Conscience , that he himself was a pattern of Incivility towards us ; stirring up his Proselytes into Rudeness by his Passion and ill Language , as Knave , deceitful fellow , audacious fellow , impudent fellow , &c. whereas he had no such Language , nor Behaviour from me , or my Friends . Besides , there were many of his Friends , and but very few of mine had notice ; Because some of the Baptists pretended before , to me , that there should be but a few of their friends , and therefore I acquainted but very few of mine ; otherwise , I should have made it more publick , if they had but dealt ingeniously by me , which I must say , they did not herein . And for him , thus to charge the Quakers with manifesting as much Rudeness , as the worst sort of men . He doth not so much herein , as ex e pt common Revilers , Drunkards or Persecutors ; so that his slander is the more gross and notorious . He saith that they called to speak directly to the Question ( viz. ) Whether this Body of Flesh and Bones shall arise again ? To which Whitehead answered , he saith , that this Body of Flesh and Bones , shall not arise again . Herein again he hath wronged my Answer ; sor it was not stated in these words , but in the very words of the Apostle Paul , 1 Cor. 15. 35 , 36 , 37 , 38. as in the Narrative is fully related ; for being aware of their carping , caveling , spirit , I kept close to the plain Words of Scripture in my positive answer , How be it when W. Kiffin , said , That the Seed , that 's sown , is this same Body of Flesh and Bones which shall arise , though otherwayes qualified , viz. more glorious , &c. This being upon my Question about the Seed , to which God gives a Body as it pleaseth him : I did deny that the terrestrial Body , or Body of Flesh , Blood and Bones , as dead and buried , is the Seed intended by the Apostle , to which God gives a Body , as it pleaseth him ; And that the very same Carnal Body , should arise again : I say , it hath not yet been proved to me ; nor am I satisfied therein , from any who have obtruded this Question and Controversie upon me . To which I now add , nor am I resolved by these men ; but the Question may be further examined hereafter . Again , after I am accused for leaving out of the Narrative the a●…oresaid Answer , viz. About this Body of Flesh and Bones , falsely obtruded upon me , the pretended Omission is supposed to be either from a bad Conscience , or a defective Memory , p. 54. wherein my own Conscience doth clear me ; and my Innocency concerning the first , and Experience of the latter is better known and judged of in my self then by an envious and salse Accuser , that neither knows my Conscience , nor Capacity . And yet after thus doubtfully he hath accused me , either for an evil Conscience or bad Memory , he presently saith , hence I conceive it to be more proper for him to be angry with himself , for being deceitful , then sor another to tell him that he is so , p. 35. See here what a positive Judge he makes himself over my Conscience , when as before he is so doubtful and wavering in his Charge . For suppose any Omission through defect of Memory ; Is this sufficient ground to conclude a man deceitful ? Mark the Inconsistency of this mans Work of Envy against me : And I do not only reflect his false ill Language upon him ; but also testifie against his Malice and slandering of me , ( as he doth divers others ) And particularly his Outrage against G. F. most malitiously and falsly reproaching him as a Blasphemer and Deceiver ; and for instance tels us , he has been publickly detected , as namely by a Book called , The Spirit of the Quakers tryed , p. 55. Concerning which I would have the Reader to take notice , that the Book he here cryes up , is a Socinian Book , wherein the Divinity of Christ is denyed ; and that G. F. is chiefly opposed sor asserting the Divinity of Christ , and particularly , for his confessing , that Christ was in being , and in Glory with the Father before the World began . See here , from hence it is observable , this Adversary of ours makes little Conscience , whom he takes part with , so he finds them to be Enemies to us . He now questions whether to attain to Perfection , be the Priviledg of any on this side Death , p. 55. When before he hath opposed its being attainable here , and put it off till he be in Heaven , p. 50. But now he is uncertain whether Perfection be attained by any on this side Death . He should have appeared thus ingenious at first ; and not positively opposed that which afterwards he questions ; But this is according to the Tenour of his uncertain confused Work. Lux Exorta Est : OR THE LIGHT SPRUNG UP IN THE Despised Quaker , With Evident Testimony against the Darkness and Prejudice of the Old Anabaptist IN ANSWER To Henry Grigg's Book , stiled , Light from the Sun of Righteousness , ( but proved an Effect of Smoke and Darkness , proceeding from the Pit of Enmity and Confusion . ) Unnaturally published against his own Natural Sister in Barbadoes , chiefly , because of her owning the People of God called Quakers , and their PRINCIPLE , Which is herein further Vindicated ; AND His Erronious Doctrines are Examined His Self-Contradictions are Compared His Impertinent Exceptions are Overturned By G. W. — Neither do the Aged understand Judgment . Night is come upon you , and the Day is become Dark over you . Printed in the Year , 1973. THE CONTENTS . About 1. The Light within . 2. Justification , &c. 3. The Lord's Supper . 4. Baptism . 5. The Anointed . 6. Jesus and his Body , Man and the Body of Man , &c. 7. The Resurrection . 8. The Light , the Sufferings and Work of Christ. 9. The Baptists Ordinances Shadows , &c. 10. Knowing Christ , and his Coming , Reign , and Deity . 11. Their Erroneous and Groundless Distinction between the Light of God and the Light of Christ. 12. Turning to the Light within . 13. Christ as at the Right hand of Power . 14. Perfection . 15. The Light within distinguished from an Historical Knowledge . 16. The Baptist's unlearned Question . TO THE READER . Serious Reader , THe implacable Enmity of divers Baptist Teachers against us , our present Liberty and Prosperity is very obvious , by their several perverse confused Pamphlets ; although the sad Experience and Fruitlesness of Coertion has not been shewn by their Valour : They have Cause rather to be abased and humbled for their timerous obscuring themselves ( many of them ) in the late stormy times , then now either to boast , or thus come croaking out in warm Weather , with Blasphemy and Revilings against the Light of Truth , or us its Children : As also for their many Divisions among themselves , contrary to this Man's pretended Order and Communion of him and his Brethren of their baptized Churches , as in pag. 53. being divided about Principles and Doctrines ; as some of their Leaders and Chieftains preaching up a personal Election ; others general Redemption ; some for Christ's dying for all ; others for his dying but for a few ; some for the Jews Seventh-Day Sabboth , others opposing it ; some holding the Souls mortality with the Body , others the Immortality : They should have been reconciled among themselves , before they had thus appeared in Print against us called Quakers ; for as yet we have no consistent matter from them to deal withall . Lux Exorta Est : OR THE LIGHT SPRUNG UP IN THE Despised Quaker , With Evident Testimony against the Darkness and Prejudice of the Old Anabaptist I. Concerning the Light within . THe Light or Life of the Eternal Word , which is the Light of men , Joh. 1. 4. is spiritual and divine , as is that Word ; and therefore able to direct man his Way out of Sin , and to give him Power against it ; what Cruelty and Partiallity doth he therefore ( like the partialminded Electioners ) reflect upon God in saying , that this Light or Illumination of the Eternal Word , leaves man like the Priest and Levite in his Blood and Wounds ? and yet how manifestly is this contradicted in his granting , That by this Light Mankind may come to understand there is a God , and also their Duty as he is their Creator ? Now this their Duty is both truely to love , obey and sear him ; as also the man grants , the Light to convince them of Sins , and teach them to do unto all men , as themselves would be done unto ; and that if the Heathens do follow the Light ( they are enlightened withal by the glorious Creator ) they would shine forth in the Principles of Morality and just Living , p. 9. Now then it appears that this Light in all men , can both teach them their Duty to God and one another ; so then it would teach them both to begodly and just : Then the Question is , whether all that are so taught , and are such , be they called Heathens , or others , be not in Reality Christians ? Can a man be godly and not a Christian ? Surely if the Heathens do mind and follow so much Light as God has given them , they shall be saved ; for is there any more required then what is given ? Or doth God condemn Men for not improving more then he gives them ? How can they then be inexcusable , or left without Excuse before him ? Observe again , that this Opposer is not only cruel , in leaving men in their Blood and Wounds , though they follow so much Light as is given them ; but he is greatly confounded about the Light in all men ; one while calling it , The Substance of the Law of the first Covenant , p. 11. another while saith , That Law was a more glorious Ministration , and did convince of Sin more clearly then this Light , p. 10. ( whereas the inward Convincement or Conviction does not arise from the Law , meerly as written without ; but from the Law or Light as received from God in the Heart ) another while he calls it , the Spirit that God has formed in man , Zach. 12. 1. The Candle of the Lord , p. 9. Let the ingenuous Reader judge how this man is shattered in these his Contradictions , Inconsistencies and Variations , and how plainly he hath broke the Neck of his own Cause in confessing that the Lord Jesus , as the eternal Word , enlightneth all men ; for Jesus Christ and his Light as the eternal Word , is the divine and highest Light. II. Concerning Redemption Justification , &c. HE is very inconsistent in his Saying that , Redemption and Justification have been fully compleated and finisht by our Lord Jesus for ●…s once for all , and that the Debt is paid , and Satisfaction made , p. 14. while yet he grants that Ignorance and Unbelief as Chains and Fetters bind many in Satan's Kingdom , p. 14. for did you ever know of any so fully in a redeemed and justified Estate , while so actually under Satan's Chains and Fetters in his Kingdom ? Or that any should be thus detained in Prison , so long after the Debt is paid , and Satisfaction made , as he imagines ? But in this Notion of Satisfaction , he appears very short and shallow , though it be not a Scripture Phrase , as T. Danson grants , Synops. p. 19. and though it depends but upon some Notions of Law , as Dr. Owen saith , Declar. p. 150. Now that all mens Debt should be so strictly payed , or such a severe Satisfaction made to vindicate Justice by Christ in their Stead ( which God never imposed upon the Son of his Love ) and that for Sins past , present and to come ( as some say ) how inconsistent is it ? Besides the gross Liberty this gives to Sin ; how agrees it with his teaching them to pray , Forgive us our Debts ? Math. 6. 12. for what needed that if they be all fo strictly paid in their Stead ? Howbeit that Christ in another or more acceptable Sence , was a most satisfactory Offering and Sacrifice for Man-kind , for a sweet smelling Savour to God , Ephes. 5. 2. this we confess and own ; and that he tasted Death not only for some , but for every Man , and is a Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World. And that Men are not justified , nor all their Debt payed in their Stead , while they are actually in Chains in Satan's Kingdom ; see this Man's Concession to his own Confutation , touching the Power of true Conversion that is taught by Christ and his Ministers , viz. That a man must repent , that true Repentance is a through Change of the mind , and that it consists in ( 1 ) A clear Sight and Sence of Sin ( 2 ) Godly Sorrow in the Sence and Burthen of it ( 3 ) In utter Abhorrence and forsaking of it : And also — Faith is required and must be wrought with Power in the Hearts of the Penitent , &c. p. 15. 16. Mark then , here is some Debt for men to pay through the Help of Christ's Power and Work within ; but to go round again , he is sliting that inherent Holiness which is wrought within , and accusing his Sister for not having a deep dependency on that Sacrifice of Christ's Crucified Body without , p. 14. The Truth on 't is , she or they that believe Christ to be risen , and know his Power in their Hearts may think it improper to have their Dependancy on that his Body , as crucified without , but rather on him that lives for ever , as knowing the blessed Effects of his Sacrifice , to wit , the Relief and Redemption which his Flesh and Blood affords . His saying , The Debt is paid , and yet fearing his Sister 's remaining in Prison and Darkness , notwithstanding her Teacher near , p. 14. proves no more against the Light , the inward Teacher , then against Christ's Sufferings : She may as well say , Brother for all thy Dependance upon the crucified Body without thee , I fear thou art yet dead in thy Sins and in gross Darkness , and thou takest not the Course to convince me , nor at all to draw my Heart towards thee and thy Brethren , by such sad and wicked Work as thou makest against the Light. Concerning his Water-Baptism , it s not Reasonable in him , either to impose it , or judge us Transgressors in not submitting unto it , p. 18 , 27. until he prove his Call , or himself or any of his Brethren commissionated from Heaven , as John was , to administer it ; for we do not own it to be Christ's Baptism , and till they prove themselves so called , they should let us alone without it , we being content with the one Baptism of the Spirit . III. Of the Lord's Supper . THe drinking of the Fruit of the Vine in the Fathers Kingdom , and the eating of the Living Bread which comes down from Heaven , Joh. Chap. 6. Luk. 22. 18 , 30. Mat. 26. 29. We are come to witness and so to partake of the heavenly Passover , and the Communion of the Body and Blood of Christ , which wise men can judge of , 1 Cor. 10. 15 , 16. And the Power and Coming of our Lord Jesus Christ we have been Eye Witnesses of ; so as we cannot dote about Signs and Shadows , as you carnal Professors do , whose pretended Lords Supper is but Bread and Wine , and no more then a Sign , Type or Shadow , which the clear Light of the Gospel and its Dispensation is beyond ; and in it there 's no need of those Shadows for a sacred Memorial of Christ's Death ; for the supposed Use and End thereof is better supplyed by the divine Light and Spirit of the everlasting Gospel , which hath not only begotten in us a living Memorial and Sence of the Death of Christ , and blessed Effects thereof ; but hath also brought us to know the Power of his Resurrection , and our being risen with him ; so as we are not only dead with him from the Rudiment of the World , and from touching , tasting and handling those things that perish with the using after the Commands and Doctrines of Men , but also being risen with Christ , we are come to set our Affections on things above . Where are those his Words written in Scripture , viz. That Bread and Wine remain in full Force until Christ's second coming in Person , p. 19. where doth the Scriptures call his second Appearance , a coming in Person ? Which was a coming to Salvation , Hebr. 9. 28. but this man saith , he is not so come the second Time , which doth both conclude that all the primitive Believers or Christians , who so look●… for his second coming , both fell short of Salvation , and mist and were dis-appointed of their Hope and Expectation , which is a sad Mistake . His saying , He dare not be wise above what is written , p. 29. contradicts his asserting that which derogates from what 's written , viz. That Christ's second coming to Salvation is in Person , or a personal Coming , whereas ( nigh his Departure ) he said , I am no more in the World , Joh. 17. 11. and yet a little while and the World seeth me no more , but ye see me , Ch. 14. 19. his spiritual Appearance was to be in the World , and he universally to be seen in Judgment . As for that which Paul received of the Lord , 1 Cor. 11. 23. proves not that he received outward Bread and Wine of the Lord , to deliver to them , till Christ's supposed coming in Person again ; but he received of the Lord , not only the Relation how Christ took Bread and the Cup , &c. And so of the Administration of the Sign or Shadow ; but the Communication of the Mystery , viz. the Body and Blood of Christ : See 1 Cor. 10. And this was that Bread and that Cup spoken of 1 Cor. 11. 28. And he further shews what he received , and what he delivered concerning Christ and his comings , 1 Cor. 15. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8. 2 Cor. 13. 5. As for the Corinthians , many of them were carnal , and their minds too much in outward Things and Shadows , and some lyable to run into Idolatry : And the Apostle in some things condiscended to them as Weaklings below the spiritual and manly Understandings ; wherefore their Practice and Example is not in every thing binding to spiritual men . IV. Of Baptism . H.G. FRom Math. 28. 19 , 20. The Baptism here spoken of is that of Water , p. 23. to baptize with the holy Spirit , is the alone Work of Jesus Christ ; and it never was in the Power of any Apostle or Disciple to do it . p. 24. Answ. This man contrary to his Pretence , here makes himself wise above what is written , in adding to the Command , That it was the Baptism of Water , which is not mentioned in the Command ; but rather it appears to be a spiritual Baptism , which the Disciples were impoured to administer , in that they were to teach , baptizing them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , into the Name , &c. which 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 imports the Authority and Power of Christ , and sometimes Christ himself , and sometimes Reverence and Worship ; see T. C's Lexicon : The man is very rash in his concluding , that it was never in the Power of any Apostle to baptize with the holy Spirit : I ask him if the true Ministers were not endued with Power from on high , to turn and convert People from Darkness to Light , and from Satan's Power unto God : And if so , what 's this short of the Spirit 's Baptism , I pray . His meaning from Paul's not being sent by Christ to baptize , but to preach the Gospel , 1 Cor. 1. is , that he gives us to understand , that to baptize was not the alone or chief Business he was sent to do , p. 27. [ alone or chief Business ] is his own Addition to Paul's Words ; what needed he give them to understand , that to baptize was not his alone Business , while they knew he was more a Preacher . 'T is not to be supposed , that the Corinthians should think that Paul was to do nothing else , but baptize or plunge them in Water ; but he himself gives it as the chief Reason why he baptized none but those few mentioned ; namely , for Christ ( saith he ) sent me not to baptize , but to preach the Gospel : So he did not thank God for neglecting part of his Commission , in baptizing so few , but partly to prevent their wrong Use thereof , and chiefly because his Commission did not extend to Water-Baptism . And as to his Allegation , to prove that the Word not is not alwayes used as an absolute Negative , p. 27. he cites , Joh. 6. 27. Labour not for the Meat that perisheth , but for the Meat which endureth , &c. If the Occasion of these Words be minded , not will prove an absolute Negative in this Place ; Jesus speaking to them that sought after him , because they did eat of the Loaves , ver . 20. and were filled , for which end they ought not to have sought after him . And admitting his Instance in Adam , that he was not deceived , namely , that he was not first deceived , taking in the Word [ first ] from the Verse before ; this is altogether impertinent unto his Purpose , about Paul's not being sent to baptize , there being no such Discovery , that Paul was sent at all to baptize , as there was of Adam's Transgression , but the contrary , in that Paul expresly said , Christ fent me not to baptize , but to preach the Gospel . V. Of the Anionted TO his saying the Word Christ signifies one Anointed , accounting it absurd to say , the Spirit or Anointing is Christ , p. 37. I answer , are not the Father , the Spirit and the Word one ? Christ as the Son of God is God's anointed : And is it not granted that he was the Son of God by eternal Generation ? And fo was ( before he took upon him that Body prepared for him ) called the Lord 's anointed , Psal. 2. 2. which Word Anointed , sometimes relates to his being set up ; or exalted as King ; yet have I set ( or anointed , Hebr. ) my King upon Sion , the Hill of my Holiness , ver . 6. As also to his being endued or anointed with Power from on high , which Power is that divine Unction , and in that Christ is called the Power of God , and the Wisdom of God , 1 Cor. 1. 24 He may as properly be called , the Anointing , as where the Spirit of the Lord is , there is Liberty , now the Lord is that Spirit ; this Anointing is not an outward Unction , nor outwardly received upon the Flesh or Body ; but being a divine Unction of Glory and Power from above , it s inwardly and spiritually received by an immortal Seed and Birth born from above , as that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit . As for his Term , Humane Nature , and Glorious Unity between the divine and human Nature , p. 36. he talks he knows not what , besides Scripture-Language : the Word human is not applicable to Christ in Glory by the Scriptures , but originally relates to the Earth , and so to the Body of man as coming thence . But Jesus Christ was the Anointed , as he was the Son from the Father's Substance ( which he was before he came in the Flesh , or took upon him that Body that was prepared for him ) and the Anointed and Saviour by the divine Power given him , when in that Body upon Earth ; though more highly exalted or anointed , as ascended far above all Heavens , and exalted in the Father's Glory ; the Anointed and Saviour also , as revealed and formed in the Saints , Gal. 4. 19. the Anointed as set up from Everlasting ; the Anointed both in Sufferings and in Glory ; the Anointed both as he came in Flesh , and as coming and revealed in the Spirit in his People ; and his Name by which Life and Salvation comes , and is given , is his divine Nature and Power , to which his Name relates that is above every other Name . One thing this man H. G. and his Brethren stumble at , and at which his Soul is wounded ( as he saith ) p. 30. is , that Christ was never seen with an outward ( or rather carnal Eye ) which H. W. is accused of , sor saying , The Eternal Son of God was never seen with any Carnal Eye ; to which I say , they should have been so ingenuous , as to have considered the Intent of these Words , and more candidly to have construed them thus , Christ as the eternal Word , the Lord from Heaven , the only begotten of the Father in his spiritual Discovery , as the Image of the invisible God and Brightness of his Glory cannot be seen with a carnal Eye , Flesh and Blood hath not so revealed him ; the saving Light of Christ never was nor can be reached with the carnal Eye ; he that seeth the Son and believeth on him hath everlasting Life , Joh. 6. 40. and as saith the Son of God , he that seeth me seeth my Father also , Joh. 12. 45. and 14. 9. but none can see the Father with a carnal Eye , therefore none could ever see the eternal Son with their carnal Eyes in this Sence of seeing , which extends to true Knowing , Joh. 8. 19. and 14. 7. though many did see the Body or Person of Christ in the Dayes of his Flesh , wherein he was crucified and put to Death ; the Jews ●…nd Persecutors saw him in that Sence with their outward Eyes , when they did neither truely see nor know him to their Salvation , it being the Spirit that quickneth , and such a Sight of Christ as that of his Body or outward man , no reasonable man can be so absurd as to say , it was not obvious to the Bodily Eyes , and as absurd for any to imagine , that any of us should intend otherwise . Now these Baptists Faith concerning the Son of God , according to their carnal Discourse of him , may be modelized into this or the like Argument , viz. If Jesus Christ , the Son of God be also the Son of man glorified on the right Hand of God in Heaven , then he consists of human Body of Flesh and Bones , as some say ; or of a body of Flesh , Blood and Bones , as others say . But he is the Son of man glorified , &c. Ergo he consists of a human Body , either of Flesh and Bone , or of Flesh Blood and Bones in Heaven . Ans. I deny their varied Consequence as inconsequent ; for Christ was called the Son of man in a higher Sence then this human , earthly or carnal Sence , which they represent him in , in that he himself said , no man hath ascended up to Heaven , but he that came down from Heaven , even the Son of man which is in Heaven , Joh. 3. 13. and what if you shall see the Son of Man ascend up where he was before ; it is the Spirit that quickneth , the Flesh perfitteth nothing , Joh. 6. 62 , 63. who will affim , that as he came down from Heaven , or as he was before in Heaven , he so consisted of a carnal human Body , either made up of Flesh and Bone , or of Flesh , Blood and Bone in their gross and carnal Sence ; John the Baptist had not such mean Thoughts of Christ , as these carnal Baptists have ; for John said , he that cometh from above is above all , he that is of the Earth is earthly and speaketh of the Earth , he that cometh from Heaven is above all , John 3. 31. and the Flesh of the Son of man , which he gave for the Life of the World is that Bread which came down from Heaven , Joh. 6. 50 , 51. Except ye eat the Flesh of the Son of Man , and drink his Blood ye have no Life in you , ver . 53. Yet that the Name Son of Man was applyed to him as a Sufferer , and as he said , so shall the Son of man be three Dayes and three Nights in the Heart of the Earth , Math. 12. 40. I deny not ; but this doth not limit him from being called the Son of Man in a higher State , also each of God's Prophets might be called ( as divers were ) a Son of Man ; but Christ the great Prophet , the Son of Man , the Apostle distinguisheth between the first man and the second man thus , The first man is of the Earth earthly ( or human ) the second man is the Lord from Heaven , 1 Cor. 15. 47. therefore the second man is not human in their Sence , nor consisting of a human or earthly Body as the first man , and Ephes. 4. 9 , 10. now that he ascended , what is it , but that he also descended first into the lower Parts of the Earth , he that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all Heavens , that he might fill all things , and Phil. 3. 21 , who shall change the Body of our Lowness , that it may be fashoned like unto his glorious Body , &c. Now if it should be read according to these Baptists Sence , it must be , who shall change our vile Bodies , that they may be fashoned like unto his human Body , as if they were not such already , and how disproportionable is it to say , Christ consists of a human Body of flesh , blood and bones in Heaven ; but the Saints must have a spiritual glorious Body in the State of Glory hereafter ; yet to prevent these mens Scruples concerning our owning the man Christ , or the Son of man in Glory ; I tell them seriously that I do confess both to his miraculous Conception by the Power of the holy Spirit overshadowing the Virgin Mary , and to his being born of her according to the Flesh , and so that he took upon him a real Body ( and not a fantastical ) and that he was real Man , come of the Seed of Abraham , and that he in the Dayes of his Flesh preached Righteousness , wrought Miracles , was crucified and put to Death by wicked Hands , that he was buried and rose again the third Day according to the Scriptures ; and after he rose , he appeared diversly , or in divers Forms and Manners he really appeared to many Brethren , 1 Corinth . 15. and afterwards ascended into Glory , being translated according to the Wisdom and Power of the Heavenly Father , and is glorified with the same Glory which he had with the Father before the World began , being ascended far above all Heavens , that he might fill all things , whose Glory is Incomprehensible , and beyond the Apprehension of Human Capacities . VI. Of Jesus and his Body ; of Man and the Body of Man. WHereas H. G. cavils at my speaking distinctly of the Body of Jesus , in that Joseph of Arimathea begg'd the Body of Jesus , and to confute me herein , he instanceth that of the body of Saul , and saith , that the Case is the same , and the body of Moses which the Devil disputed about , p. 39 , 40 , 41. but in this I cannot see any valid Matter to his purpose , nor wherein he can intend it , unless he believes that the Soul or spiritual Existence of man dyes with the body ; and the Devil did appear wiser then he , concerning this distinction , in that his disputing about the body of Moses does imply a distinction between Moses ( as to his immortal Existence ) and the body of Moses ; and that he did not confound them as this man doth , who concludes Jesus Christ to consist of a human Body of Flesh and Bone , which the original Being of no man properly consists of , though to prevent Cavils and for 〈◊〉 sake I 'll grant him thus much , that the Name Jesus Christ is indifferently and mutually applyed both to his spiritual being , and to the body he took upon him , and that distinctly in Scripture , although the Names Messiah , Jesus Christ , the Anointed , the Image and Glory of the invisible God , the Word , the Light , the Life , &c. do more eminently , and more originally belong to him , as he was before he took that body upon him , which he called this Temple , and it was called the body of Jesus . Whereas H. G. sayes , What a strange Epitath would this Man write upon a Tomb-stone , he cannot write , here lyes the Body of Thomas or William , &c. but rather thus , here lies the Thomas of Thomas , p. 41. Reply , This more properly falls upon himself in not admitting that distinction touching Jesus and the body of Jesns ; but their concluding and confining Jesus Christ , as to confist of the meer body of flesh and bone , and that he could not be Jesus Christ the Saviour before he took upon him that body ; by which this man cannot write , Here lies the body of Thomas or William , &c. ( which implies a belief of an Immortality of the man , as to his Spirituality ) but rather , here lies the whole man Thomas or William without admitting of any such Immortality ; and yet I will grant him as before , that the Word Man is indifferently applyed to either the spiritual Being or Body of man , as there is an inward man and an outward man , 2 Cor. 4. 16. And as God created man in his own Image ; and yet it s said , he formed man of the Dust of the Earth , Gen. 1. 27. and Chap. 2. 7. and it s said , That the rich Man dyed and was buried ( which was his Body ) and in Hell he lift up his Eyes , &c. ( which could not be that Part which dyed and was buried , but the immortal part or Soul ) Luke 16. 22. 23. yet the Word Man , most properly and originally ( as God created Man in his own Image ) belongs to his spiritual Existence or Being ; for the Earthly Body was not the Image of God. But farther , let the Reader observe how evidently H. G. has contradicted his foregoing Stuff , for a human Christ consisting of a Body of meer Flesh and Bone , against my distinction ( concerning Jesus and his Body that was put to Death and buried , which was also raised ) as where he speaks distinctly of Jesus and his Body , p. 33. and confesseth that Christ came in the Flesh , p. 36. that he hath an outward glorisied Existence — that he hath a body , p. 46 , 47. Christ's crucified Body , p. 50. the Body that was prepared for him , p. 79. He did assume our Nature , p. 80. He had the very Form , Shape and Fashion of a Man , p. 81. And what He or Him was this he speaks of ? Was it not Christ , the Son of God , the Anointed . And to his arguing , That if Jesus Christ continues a man for ever , then he hath a Body of Flesh and Bone forever : This doth not follow , but is falsly deduced as before is proved , that Man both did and doth exist when he hath not such a carnal body as he intends ; although I do own Christ to be the heavenly and spiritual Man glorified , and ( in a more sublime and heavenly Sence ) his flesh and bone , of which the Saints are Members , and that the true Christ is not without Blood to communicate , which the Spiritual Communicants drink of . H. G. also further adds , Unless it can be proved , that Man can exist and have a Being without Flesh and Bone , which I suppose , all will conclude is impossible , p. 47. To which I say , This is not only confuted by what I have said before , but also by himself , where he confesseth the Coming of the Spirit into his Heart , for the binding of the Strong Man Satan , p. 16. here he hath found out a Man , and that a strong one to , too wit , Satan , whom I suppose he deems not a man made up ( or consisting ) of flesh and bones , though he be called the strong Man ; but the Heavenly and Spiritual Man Christ Jesus is stronger then he . VII . Of the Resurrection . AS for his insinuating against us , as denying the Resurrection of the Dead , or of the Body , p. 41 , 42 , 43. This Accusation is not only in general Terms , but also it is notoriously false , as may be evinced , not only in many of our Books and Writings , but also by our deep Sufferings for Christ ; so that if in this Life we had Hope only , we were of all men most miserable : It s true , there hath been and is a Controversie between us and many of the Baptists , and some others about that , or the like unlearn'd Question , which they have been busie to obtrude upon us , viz. How are the dead raised , and with what Body ? Which we have answered , as the Apostle did such , Thou Fool , that which thou sowest is not quickned except it dye , and thou sowest not that body that shall be , but bare grain , it may chance of Wheat , &c. but God giveth it a body as it pleaseth him , and every Seed his own body , or its proper body , 1 Cor. 15. 35 , 36 , 37 , 38. &c. But to prove the arising of the same Bodies buried in the Graves , he perverts and miscites Phil. 3. 21. thus , He will change our vile bodies , and fashion them like unto his glorious body ; whereas that Phil. 3. 21. is in the singular , vile Body , or rather , he shall change the body of our Lowness , or our suffering body , that it may be ●…ashoned like unto his glorious body ; now the body of their Lowness or Humility , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 comprehended the whole Suffering Estate of the Church : And I do confess that the Resurrection , Change and Translation or Transfiguration ( as some renders it ) of the Just or Righteous , extends not only to a Resurrection from Sin , Corruption and Weakness , but to an arising out of a Suffering State into Glory : And as God knows how to deliver and raise up the Righteous , out of Temptations , Tryals and Sufferings ; so he knows how to reserve the Unjust unto Punishment , and unto the day of Destruction ; for both shall rise to their several Ends and Rewards ; yea , the Sea , Death , Hell and the Grave shall deliver up their dead to be judged , &c. and he giveth to every Seed his own proper body , as he pleaseth ; and we know , that if our earthly house of this Tabernacle be destroyed , we have a building given of God , that is , a House not made with Hands , but eternal in the Heavens : Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God , 1 Cor. 15. 50. H. G. sayes , By Flesh and Blood the Apostle doth intend Corruption , p. 44. whereas the Apostle spake of them distinctly , viz. flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God , neither doth Corruption inherit Incorruption ; to say that by flesh and blood he doth intend Corruption is no Answer to their Question , with what body are the Dead raised , &c. Which though reproved as foolish , yet not so foolish as to ask whether Corruption be raised ? And more absurd it is to imply , that by flesh and blood he doth not intend Body , but only Corruption . Again H. G. to prove the rising of the same Bodies cites Job 19. 25. In my Flesh shall I see God , whom I shall see for my self , and mine Eyes shall behold , &c. p. 44 , 45. By this his Instance it appears what gross Apprehensions he hath of God , while he thinks to see him with his bodily or carnal Eyes , which no Being nor Thing is visible or obvious unto , but what is of an outward or corporeal Substance or formal limitted matter , which an infinite eternal Spirit is not ? for God who is that Spirit is invisible ; therefore Jeb did not speak of his bodily Eyes , but of his spiritual , who afterwards said unto the Lord , I have heard of thee by the hearing of the Ear , but now mine Eye seeth thee , Jo. 42. 5. which cannot be understood of his seeing him with his bodily Eye ; H. G. pretends to know the State or manner of the Saints being in Glory , telling us that all deformity shall be done away , p. 44. and that these vile Bodies shall be fashoned like unto Christ's glorious Body : How then shall they be these very same earthly and numerical bodies ? many whereof are not only deformed , but greatly defective , both as to Infants and Aged that dye ; as also his confessing to 2 Cor. 5. 1 , 2. doth appear a Contradiction plain enough to himself , if righly considered ; its probable this Man has as strange Conceits about the Resurrection , as Tho. Vincent in his Book of the Coming of Christ to Judgment and the Resurrection ; but I cannot look upon either him or the Baptists to be such divine Philosophers , as either to know or define the manner of the Saints Existance or Beings in Heaven and Glory ; but rather that they are Imaginary and Intruders therein , though it would better become them to acquiese with God s Will and Pleasure concerning such Mysteries as are beyond their Capacities ; I expect some of them in their busie minds , will give me farther Occasion to speak to this weighty Point of the Resurrection , though it be a matter I never desired to make publick Controversie of , it being beyond human Capacities . VIII . Of the Word , the Light , the Sufferings of Christ and his Work within . H.G. THere is a great difference between the Essence & Body of the Sun and its Beams or Rayes : for though the Sun by its Rayes doth give Light to all , yet is not the Essence or Body of the Sun in them ; so in like manner , though the Word be the true Light which lighteth every man , yet is he not essentially in their Hearts , p. 48. 49. Answ. He hath strain'd his Simile too sar , and thereby hath denyed the Omni-presence and Infiniteness of God , whose Presence filleth Heaven and Earth ; the Sun and its Rays and Beams are finite and limitable ; so and in like manner is not God and his Illumination , and thus to limit and circumscribe God and his Light or Shining to be so , and in like manner as the Sun and its Beams , doth mani●…est such gross Apprehensions of God , as he did before , in expecting to see him with bodily Eyes : And this relates to the old Heresie of the Anthropomorphites or Monks in the desarts of Aegypt , as also to that of the present Mugletonians , who imagine God to be a personal or bodily Existence circumscribed as to place , denying him to be an infinite Spirit ; yet thus far I will admit of his Simile , by a Reason of the contrary , that as the natural created Sun immediately sends forth its Beams or Rayes which are natural , and do influence the Earth with the Vertue of the Sun ; so the eternal increated Spi●…itor Word doth shine and shew forth its own immediate , increated divine Light and Vertue in the Hearts and Souls of Man-kind ; as the Sun is natural and created , so is its Light or Shining ; and as God the eternal Word is increated and super-natural , so is his immediate Shining or Light in the Hearts and Souls of Man-kind ; and as a man's Eye is directly set towards the Sun , in the least Beam thereof , shining through any Crevis into any Dungeon Cell or other oscure place , it sees directly to the Sun it self ; so the Eye of the Soul being directe dtowards God by the least Appearance of his divine and immediate Shining or Illumination , therein it hath a Sight of God , and the Soul thereby comes to seel of his Vertue and Power in waiting upon him . And for this man to conclude , that this Light of the eternal Word cannot teach and reveal unto man the Lord Jesus Christ , p. 50. is to deny Jesus Christ to be the Word , or that true Light that enlightneth every Man , whereas his Illumination directs man immediately to himself as its eyed and minded . As also he is as narrow , shallow and partial , in concluding the Light will not reveal unto man his Saviour without the Help of the Scriptures p. 50. this is a strange undervaluing of the Light of Christ ; what then did the Scriptures proceed from ? Was it not the Light ? And what shall become of all those Nations and People that have not the Scriptures , if this be true ? It is none of our Assertion , that Christ in his Death and Sufferings , was but only a Pattern or Example of that which must be wrought over again in us ; for though we own him to have left an Example , yet he was more then an Example , and he did not only end the Types , but was a Sacrifice and Offering for Man-kind , and opened the new and living Way , giving Testimony of God's free Love towards all , and making Way for the enforcing of the new Testament or Covenant of Life : But yet that either all or any men are cleansed , or justified , or saved meerly by the outward Sufferings , Crucifixion , Death or Blood shed of Christ , the Scripture proves not ( but by Christ himself , and his Blood , Life , Spirit and Power ) nor yet that men are acquitted or saved by their outward Application thereof : And this man to his own Confutation confesseth to the Power of Christ s Spirit being risen in us , for our Sanctification and Renovation , as well as Christ was raised from the dead for our Justification , p. 54. then all is not fully doneby his Death without them , but both the End and Mystery of the Cross , Sufferings and Death of Christ without , 〈◊〉 be known and fulfilled within , see Philip. 3. 10. although this man seems not willing to hear of Christ's being a Pattern or Example of that which must be wrought over again in us , p. 50 yet in Contradiction to this he saith , The Lord Jesus Christ hath wrought Red●…mption and Salvation for me , and revealed this by his Word and Spirit , and 〈◊〉 it in me , p. 52. it s well that in any Measure he is made to grant to this inward Work of Christ. IX . Further about their Ordinances . His pleading for their shadowy and carnal Ordinances to continue under this Notion , viz. Under his Shadow I have with the Spouse sat down , and his Fruit is and hath been sweet unto my t●…ste , p. 53. This is a very impertinent Instance , and altogether improper , to reckon Bread , Wine and Water-Baptisin that Shadow of the Souls Beloved , to wit , Christ , that the Spouse sat under , seeing the Lord himsel●… saith , I will be a Shadow from the Heat , and a Refuge from the Storm : And we are so far from believing these his carnal Ordinances to be the direct Shadow of the Souls Beloved in that neer Sence , that we look upon him , he is yet to prove them Appointments , Institutions and Ordinances of Christ , or of Necessity to continue in the Church , notwithstanding his spiritual Coming and Revelation , which he hath not , much less that they are spiritual or of a Spiritualness , as he saith , p. 59. and 60. which he hath manifestly contradicted , in granting , They are but the Sign , the Shadow , the Shell , and Christ the Substance p. 53 , 54. For my part , I don't look upon either John's Baptism , or the Supper of Christ and his Disciples ( at which they had the Passover ) to be Institutions and Ordinances originally appointed by Christ , or enjoyned to all that should succeed in the Gospel and true Church ; but rather , though they were not directly enjoyned by the Law of Moses , as we say , modo & forma ; yet that they did more naturally relate to that former dispensation of Shadows , then to that of the Gospel and new Covenant ; and that John's Baptism was rather for a Consummation of the Jews divers Sprinklings and Washings under the Law , comprehending them in order to end them , and Christ's eating of the Passover and drinking with his Disciples , Luke 32. to be as a Consummation of the Jews Feasts under the Law , viz. that of the Passover and others , according to the Relation given at large concerning the Ecclesiastical Rites of the ancien●… Hebrews , by T. Goodwin in his Antiquities of the ●…ews , called , Moses and Aaron , p. 86 , 87 , 88 , 89 , 90 , 91. and 〈◊〉 , and Christ saying , As often as you do this , is not a ●…ommand , and This do in Remembrance of me , and 〈◊〉 the Lord's Death till he come , does limit a time for its Discontinuance ; for till he come must either respect his next Coming , or render not only his coming after he was risen , but his spiritual Coming and Revelation in his Saints no Comings , which were absurd and Auti-Christian , and there was a time to shew forth his Life as well as his Death . Hi●… saying , The Sign and thing signified God hath joyned together , p. 54. is again contradicted by his granting a Personmay find a Shell and have no Kernel in it , p. 54. To which I add , That God hath so joyned the Sign or Shadow and the Substance together , as so to continue , I deny , or that the Scripture any where so saith ; but as for these Baptists Shells , Husks and Shadows they are both dry and empty , and the Lord is departed from them , so as neither Life nor Substance is to be found in them , but a dark Spirit of Enmity and Opposition against the true Power and Life is centered in them ; Yea , the same Spirit which walketh in dry Places : I wish they were truely sensible of it . X. Of knowing Christ and his Coming , Reign and Deity . UPon 2 Cor. 5. 16. Though I have known Christ after the Flesh , yet from henceforth know I him so no more . H. G's Exposition is , That the Word [ know ] here , doth hold forth to esteem , regard , allow or to approve by Way of Preference , p. 58. Now if we read his Exposition herein upon the Text , it runs thus , viz. Though I have known or esteemed , regarded or approved Christ after the Flesh by Way of Preference , yet from henceforth do I esteem regard or approve of him so no more ; and then how must I regard and prefer him , but after the Spirit and in his spiritual Manifestation , as I know him in me to be my Hope , Life and Stay : But how does this agree with his Discription of Jesus Christ ( as the alone Saviour ) * As consisting of a human Body of Flesh and Bone ( as before ) p. 31. and 55. and with his saying that the Spirit or blessed Comforter cannot be the Saviour and Mediator , p. 46. But this he hath also eminently Contradicted , in confessing that * The Power of Christ's Spirit risen in us , is for our Sanctification and Renovation , p. 54. To which I add , that the Apostle witnessed that the ingrafted Word is able to save your Souls , or the Word that is grafted in you ( as some have it ) Jam. 1. 21. and see 1 Pet. 1. 23. and the Spirit is Life , giveth Life , quickneth , sanctifieth , it self maketh Intercession : And if ye through the Spirit mortifie the Deeds of the Flesh ye shall live , Rom. 8. Therefore the Word and Spirit ( which are one ) do save the Obedient . Whereas H. G. saith , Some of those Cazers and Waiters ( viz. that look for Christ's personal Reign ) was Paul , Peter and John , yea , all the primitive Saints , though Christ was come in Spirit to them as gloriously , &c. p. 60. I deny that they were any such Gazers , after Christ's Ascension and glorious spiritual Appearance and Revelation in them ; he hath herein asperst Paul , Peter and John and all the primitive Saints with gazing for Christ's personal Reign , which he reckons his second Coming to Salvation ; wherein he hath not only rendred all the Saints and former Witnesses of Christ to be such uncertain Gazers abroad ; but their Hope , Expectation and Faith ineffectual and fruitless as to such a Coming , and they to be disappointed of Salvation ; for a personal Coming and Reign of Christ ( as this man speaks of ) they attained not in their Dayes , neither is it yet , nor are Baptists like to see such a personal Reign , though he has rendred all the primitive Saints Gazers and Waiters for it ; whereas Christ said unto his Disciples , Verily I say unto you , there be some standing here , which shall not taste of Death , till they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom , Math. 16. 28. or till they have seen the Kingdom of God come with Power , Mark 9. 1. As for H. G's human personal Christ , consisting ( or meerly made up ) of Flesh and Bone , finite , weak , subject to Passion as we are , who as such he deems the alone Saviour with his unscriptural Expressions he puts upon him , as outward Existence , personal Existence , personal Subsistence , human Nature , second Person of the Trinity , &c. p. 46. and 83. and 94. And yet in Contradiction he is made to confess him to be the most high God , p. 80. Jesus of Nazareth truely God , the most high God as is the Father , and of the same Substance and Essence , yet distinguished from the Father , as touching his personal Subsistence , p. 83. I cannot but look upon this Relation to be non-sensical and confusedly intermixt with those unscriptural Terms , of which let the ingenuous Reader judge , that can distinguish between the Body which Christ took upon him and the divine Being ; this Relation of his tends farther to stumble and keep distant both Jews and Others , thus to represent Jesus Christ as a meer Body , consisting of Flesh and Bone , human Nature , finite , weak , &c. and then saying , He is the most high God of the same Essence , &c. And his rendring him only a Saviour , after this his own imaginary , human or earthly manner , he hath sufficiently confuted by these Reasons , wherewith he proves Jesus Christ his Deity or Being God ( and as such the Saviour , orgiveth Power unto others to become the Sons of God. ) 1st . From his Name , the mighty God , the true God , the only wise God , God blessed for ever , Isa. 9. 6. 1 Joh. 5. 20. Jude 25. and Rom. 9. 5. 2ly , His making and creating the World , Joh. 1. 1 , 3. Col. 2. 16. Heb. 2. 10. 3ly , His upholding and preserving the whole Creation , Heb. 1. 3. Col. 1. 17. 4ly , His knowing all things , Joh. 12. 17. and 2. 24 , 25. Psa. 139. and 4. 10. Job 36. 4. and Ch. 38. 5ly , His searching the Heart , Jer. 17. Rev. 2. 23. 6ly , His being the fist and the last , Isa. 44. 6. and 48. 12. Rev. 2. 8. 17. 7ly , His having spiritual Worship or divine Adoration due to him , Mat. 8. 2. and 28. 17. Luke 24. 52. Joh. 8. 38. Heb. 1. 6. Phil. 2. 10. 8ly , His having Power to forgive or pardon Iniquity , Mat. Ch. 9. and Mark 2. 5. Luke 5. 21. 9ly . In that the Saints ought to pray to him , Act. 9. 14. Rom. 10. 9 , 10. 1 Cor. 1. 2. 10ly , His having Power to give the Holy Spirit and Saving Graces , Math. 3. 11. Mark. 1. 4. Ephes. 4. 8 , 9. 11ly , His being equal with God , Phil. 2. 6 , 7. Zach. 13. 7. 12ly , His having Power to lay down his Life and to raise it up again . Joh. 2. 19. and 10. 18. 13ly , His being the Object , Author and Finisher of the true Believers Faith , Joh. 14. 1. and 9. 35. Heb. 12. 2. 14ly , He who can by his own Name , proper Power and Authority , give Power unto others to become the Sons of God , must needs be God himself ; but that Christ doth and can do this is evident , Joh. 1. 11 , 12. He doth adopt , regenerate or make others the Children of God , by the effectual Working of his blessed Spirit in the Hearts , by which they are interested in all the Priviledges of the Covenant of Grace , which none can do save God alone , p. 91 , 92. Thus far H. G. to his own eminent Confutation and Contradiction , hath assented to Truth in Words ; and how Jesus Christ is the Object of Faith , and Giver of Power to men to become the Sons of God ; and how he makes them his Children by the effectual Workings of his blessed Spirit in their Hearts , even because he is God Eternal , in that none can do those but God alone , according to Isa. 43. 10 , 11 , 12. and 45. 14. and 49. 26. and 63. 〈◊〉 . Jer. 14. 8. Hos. 13. 4. 1 Tim. 1. 1. and 4. 10. Jude 25. But how doth H. G's Confession and these Scriptures agree with the Discription he gives of Jesus Christ as Saviour , and as the only true Christ , viz. That he consists of a Body of Flesh and Bone , human Nature , being finite , weak , subject to passion as we are , saith he , p. 94. Let the Reader judge how gross and confused he is in these matters , and whether the true Christ and Saviour doth either consist of an earthly Nature or finite being , or was subject to Passion as fallen men are ? The Truth of it is , this Man hath confest more to the Deity and divine Power of Christ , and so to save and beget men to himself , as God alone , more then most of the Baptists that I have met withall before ; for one of his Brethren , to wit , W. Burnet ( a Preacher ) saith , That Christ as he was the Word , which was God was not a Saviour , as he was God he could not save Man , in his Book stiled the Capital Principles , p. 35. which denyes the Omnipotency of God ; but this Baptist H. G. grants that it is the Power and Spirit of God himself , or God alone that doth regenerate and make men his Children ; whence it follows that then it was not meerly the outward Body of Jesus that was the Saviour , though he was a Saviour in that Body , but it was by the Divine Power or Holy Spirit of the Father in him . XI . His Erroneous Distinction about the Light. BUt whereas H. G. accounts the Light and Knowledge of God as Creator , that was given to the Gentiles , Rom. 1. 19. and Chap. 2. 14 , 15. But the Light of the Moon to guide their Paths , and so much inferior to that of a crucified Jesus , as that it leaves them utterly void of the saving Knowledge of the Gospel , and of a crucified Jesus , p. 68 , 69. Mark here , how he hath undervalued the Light and Knowledge of the glorious Creator whom before he has in Words exalted above all , in the Work of Regeneration , and Christ as man , but as finite weak , &c. But now alass ! with him the Light and Knowledge of the glorious Creator , is but the Light of the Moon in comparison of the Light and Knowledge of Christ as man , though in that Weakness as crucified ; how egregiously he is involved in gross Consusion and self-Contradiction in these things ; he that runs may read ; and no such distinction nor contrariety between the Light of God and the Light of his Son is owned in Scripture ; ●…or I and my Father are one saith Christ ; and the Father , Word and holy Spirit are one . And the same Life which was in him was the Light of Men , Joh. 1. 4. and this Life which in due time was manifested , was the same eternal Life which was with the Father , 1Joh . 1. 1. 2. which Light or Life they that obey a●…d follow , in its Appearance and Guidance , it brings them to a Fellowship with the Father , and with the Son ; and this is not the Light of the Moon , as our Opposer blindly and unscripturally terms it : But seeing he saith ; this Law or Light is given to guide their Paths , by which the Gentiles are taught their Duty to God in Morals . I ask him , whether will this Light guide their Paths , if not in the Way to Salvation ? And whether will they go , and to what End , if they obey and follow it ? Does not the Apostle for a Proof of a justified State , instance it in the Gentiles , shewing the Effects of the Law written in their Hearts ? Rom. 2. 13 , 14 , 15 , 16. And what Nature was that by which those Gentiles did those things contained in the Law ; surely it was not the corrupt Nature , for that is inconsistent , the Law being holy , just and good ; and though these Gentiles had not the Law in the Letter of it , as many now have not the litteral Discription or histotical Relation of Christ's outward Sufferings , must they therefore be damned to Hell ? What Cruelty were this , to condemn Nations for want of the Scriptures ? But as those Gentiles who had not the Law in the Letter , and yet had and obeyed it in the Spirit , were both therein a Law to themselves , and excused in the Sight of God , in the day when he judgeth the Secrets of Men by Jesus Christ according to the Gospel , Rom. 2. 16. So those Gentiles and Peoples who obey the Light and Life of the Son of God in them , though they have not the historical Knowledge and Profession of Christ as he was Man , and suffered Death in the Flesh , &c. Yet they are truely accepted of God , and more real Christians inwardly then many of you , that have the Scriptures , and an historical Faith and Profession of the Man Christ , and of Christianity outwardly ; for in all Nations , every one that fears God and worketh Righteousness is accepted of him . Depart from Evil , and do Good , and dwell for evermore . And this the Light of the Son of God implanted in the Hearts of all Nations teacheth ; and herein the Grace of God that bringeth Salvation hath appeared unto all Men , Tit. 2. 11. But it is the Error and Mistake of these Men , to put their historical Notions and Profession of the Man Christ , for the Light of Christ in Man , whereas their Notions and Professions are neither any real Knowledge of the Man Christ , nor the Principle of his Light in Man ; for the one is traditional and acquired by Man , and so but dark ; the other is the immediate and divine unchangeable Gift of Christ in Man , which indeed is the Light of the Eternal Word , the glorious Creator ; but as these men's pretended Light and Knowledge of the man Christ , is what they get out of Scriptures ( with their own private Interpretations on them ) so they hereby render Christ and his Light , as limitted only to such Places and People as have the Scriptures , opposing his divine Omni-presence and denying him his Right , which is the Heathen for his Inheritance , and the uttermost Parts of the Earth for his Possession , Psa. 2. Now as for that Morality ( as he calls it ) which the Law of the first Covenant , and Light implanted in the Hea●…ts of all Man-kind teacheth , in the true Nature and Inten●… thereof , it falleth no more short of Christianity then Godliness doth ; for this Law and Light teacheth Man to love the Lord God with all his Heart and Soul , &c. and his Neighbour as himself ; this do ( saith Christ ) and thou shalt live , in answer to the Question , what shall I do to inherit Eternal Life ? Luke 10. 25 , 26 , 27 , 28. This is the highest Morality or Duty of Man-kind , even this Love to God and one another , which is the fulfilling of the Law : And this is both taught by the Light within , and Power given by the Grace of God to fulfil it , which the Law without in the Letter cannot do : Now if the Jews Way to inherit Eternal Life was ( through the Grace or Help of God ) to fulfil what was written ( as before ) then if a Heathen , that hath not this Law outwardly written , should ask the same Question , what shall I do to inherit Eternal Life ? He may truely be answered , Obey the Light or Law of thy Maker in thy Heart which tells thee , Thou must love and honour him above all , and do Injury or Wrong to no Man ; this do and thou shalt inherit eternal Life ; for this End the Grace of God is free for thee . XII . Our Doctrine for turning People to the Light within justified . H. G. NOne of the true Gospel-Preachers did ever teach such a Doctrine as this is which the Quakers preach , namely , bid People turn to the Light within , * p. 63. 64. H. G. Contra. That God who commanded Light to shine out of Darkness hath shined in our Hearts , 2 Cor. 4. ( Concession ) Who doth deny that Holy Men did endeavour to turn Men and Women from Darkness to the Light , to leave their Sins , to turn from all their wicked Abominations , and Unfruitful Works of Darkness to God and Christ ? p. 67. What may be known of God is manifest in Men , Rom. 1. pag. 68 , 69. Anim. If God hath shined in our Hearts , and what may be known of God be manifest in Men ; must they not turn to his Shining and Illumination ? For God is Light , whose inward Light ( which we testifie to ) is become the main stumbling Block and Rock of Offence to these dark Opposers : And where was the Darkness which holy Men endeavoured to turn others from , was it not within ? And the Light shines in Darkness , the Light of God and Christ which their Minds were to be turned unto , it was not an outward created or natural Light , but inward and Spiritual , and so rceived ; God hath shined in our Hearts , see 2 Cor. 4. 6. his Concession to this overturns him : And if the Quakers do not prove these very bare Words in Scripture , to wit , turn to the Light within ; it doth not therefore follow , that they cannot prove the Matter of such a Doctrine , as turn to the Light within ; see Deut , 30. 1. 2. ( both in Tindal's Translation , and in the Bible in folio , London printed in the Year 1576. Thou shalt turn into thy Heart — and shalt return unto the Lord thy God , &c. As also to the Question , wherewith shall a young Man cleanse his Wayes , the Answer and Direction is ( saith H. G. pag. 64. ) by taking Heed thereto according to thy Word , Psalm . 119. 9. And did not David hide this Word in his Heart , that he might not sin against God. And both Moses and the Apostle say , the Word is nigh thee in thy Heart , Deut. 30. Rom. 10. And did not Jesus say , There is yet a little Light in you ( as some Copies have it ) Joh. 12. 35. And while you have the Light , believe in the Light , that you be the Children of the Light , ver . 36. Many other Instances of this Doctrine might be urged XIII . Of Christ as at the Father's right Hand . &c. I May not well omit one Passage of H.G. which had like to have been buried in the bulk and heap of his Rubbish , that is , after he denies the Spirit to be Saviour , though present , to prove the Saviour absent , he saith , He is ascended into Heaven , and hath a real outward Existence at the Father's right Hand , p. 46. an outward glorified Existence in the Kingdom , of his Father or Glory above , p. 47 To which I say , The Saviour is not absent from them that are saved ; for Christ said , He that is with you shall be in you : His ascending into Heaven , yea , and far above all Heavens , was not , that he might remain absent from his Church ; but rather that being departed from them in his outward Presence or Body , he might be the more present with them , and in them , in the Spirit and Power of the Father . And Christ being exalted at the Father's right Hand , is no Proof that he is remote , separate or absent from his People and Members , any more , then that the Father's right Hand of Power is absent and remote from them ; though we see what gross Apprehensions some Men have of God and Christ ; who thus would exclude , limit or circumscribe them , yea , God and his right Hand of Power only to a Place distant from his People and Children , which doth not only strengthen gross Apprehensions in the Ignorant , to keep them in Ignorance , dark Thoughts and car●…al Imaginations concerning God and his right Hand , as if he were a Body or Person like themselves ; but also opposeth his Infiniteness and Omnipresence , and so Christ's Divinity ; whereas the Heaven of Heavens cannot contain him . We may in a Sence be said to be absent from the Lord , while at home ( or Strangers in the Body , in Comparison of that Enjoyment of him hereafter to be had , which yet proves not him nor his right hand absent ( as circumscribed or only far distant ) from us ; his right hand of Power is where he is ; and Christ inseparably with and in the Father , glorified with the Father 's own self , even with the same Glory which he had with him before the World began , which Glory is divine , invisible and incomprehensible ; and therefore human or Earthly Nature is not capable of that divine Glory and Power , wherewith the Son of God was anointed , dignified and exalted at God's right hand : And David said , O thou that savest by thy right hand them which put their Trust in thee , and thy right hand hath holden me up , Psa. 17. 7. and 18. 35. and 20. 6. and 60. 5. and 63. 8. and 73. 23. So that neither the infinite God , nor his Son , nor his right hand of Strength can be circumscribed , or limitted into a Separation or Remoteness from the Children of Light , who are saved by the right hand of God , whose Hand and Power is spiritual . And if Saul was struck down and blinded by the Light that shone from Heaven above the Brightness of the Son ( which he calls the heavenly Vision in Acts 26. 13 , 19. In which Jesus did speak unto him , whose Voice the Men with Saul heard not , Ch. 22. 9. How much further doth Jesus himself in the Father's Divine Glory transcend this Vision , though glorious ? And how far is his own Being , his spiritual and glorious Body beyond the reach of these Men's earnal Thoughts and mean Conceptions , as this Man represents Christ , at God's right hand in Glory , as consisting of Flesh and Bone , human Nature , outward Existence , &c. And so to have appeared to Paul at the time of his Conversion , p. 46. and which John saw in that Vision , p. 56. Rev. 1. 13 , 14 , 15. Whereas Paul and John gives no such account of Christ's Appearances to them , as that it was in a human Body of Flesh and Bone ; much less , that he consisted meerly of Flesh and Bone ; but the Cause of the Martyr Stephen his seeing Jesus standing on the right hand of God was , his being full of the holy Ghost , Acts 7. 55 , 56. And it is in the same holy Ghost , that the truely sanctified and Spiritually minded come to see the Glory of God , and Jesus or the Son o●… Man at his right hand . XIV . Of Perfection . H. G. WE do not believe 't is possible to attain to such a Degree of Perfection , as to be as pure from Sin as Jesus Christ was , p. 62. I know not what such should call one the Name of the Lord for , &c. p. 63. H. G. Contra. We can experience the Power of Christ's Spirit risen in us for our Sanctification and Renovation , p. 54. He doth adopt , regenerate , make others Children of God , by the Effectual Workings of his blessed Spirit in their Hearts , by which they are interrested into all the Priviledges , Promises and Blessings of the Covenant of Grace , p. 91 , 92. Anim. We believe that the Spirit and Power of Christ working in our Hearts , is able to sanctifie throughout , and his Blood to cleanse from all Sin , and that in Christ who is the Covenant of Grace , all the Promises of God are yea and amen ; and that Covenant is both a Covenant of Forgiveness , and therein Sin is taken away , as God hath promised , Jer. 31. I will cleanse them from all their Iniquity , Jer. 33. 8. Ezek. 36. 25. All things are possible with God ; and we can do all things through Christ that strengthneth us , Phil. 4. 13. who commanded , Be ye perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect ; and its possible through his Power & Aid to keep his Commands otherwise for what End are they given out to his Church and People , and for what End should they pray to take away all Iniquity ? On whom ( we believe ) he does not impose Impossibilities ; but to such as dwell in the Love of God , his Commands are not grievous but joyous . XV. The Light within above an Historical Knowledge . WHereas to undervalue the Light within which all Men have ; H. G. affirms , that none can make appear that ever any Heathen , Aethiopian , Moor or Infidel , in any remote Parts that never heard the Scripture , &c. That ever did attain , meerly , by that Light within , to the Knowledge of one Jesus of Nazareth that was crucified without the Gates of Jerusalem , that meerly by the Help and Guidance of that Light within , came to find out so much as the Name or historical Knowledge of a cruciefid Jesus , p. 70. Answ. 1. As an historical Knowledge and Profession concerning Christ and his Sufferings in the Flesh cannot save you ; so it s very uncharitable in you Baptists to condemn all Nations that have it not , meerly for want of the History or that historical Knowledge . 2. Though you have a historical Faith and Profession of Jesus , as he came and suffered in the Flesh ; I deny that this Faith will either save you ( for they have as much Faith at Rome ) or that you have from thence any real Knowledge of Christ , either as in the Flesh or in the Spirit , either as crucified , as put to Death , or as living and reigning : It s still your Mistake to count your dark Opinions and litteral Notions the Light of the Son of God : Nay , if you have no further Faith and Knowledge of him , then what 's meerly historical and litteral . If you have not a spiritual and divine Knowledge of Christ , as inwardly revealed , you 'll dye in your Sin , and perish for lack of Knowledge : And many of those called Heathens who follow the Help and Guidance of the Light of Christ within , shall come from the East and from the West , and from the North , and from the South , nd shall sit down with Abraham , Isaac and Jacob in the Kingdom , as Children of Faith and Heirs of Promise , who have believed God , and obeyed his Light in them , when you and such like litteral Professors shall be utterly rejected , unless you return to Christ's Light within , and believe and wait in it to know Christ's inward and spiritual Appearance and Revelation . 3. In the Gospel preacht to Abraham ( in whose Seed all Nations should be blessed ) It was foreseen , that God would justifie the Heathen through Faith ; and accordingly , Christ was absolutely promised and given for a Light to the Gentiles , to be God's Salvation to the Ends of the Earth ; that he might say to the Prisoners , go forth , and them that are in Darkness , shew yourselves , Isa. 42. and Ch. 49. Now observe , that the Promise of Christ , both for a Light to the Gentiles , and Salvation to the Ends of the Earth , and himself to speak to the Prisoners to go forth , &c. it s absolute , and not restrained or limitted to the spreading of Scripture , nor to any such Condition , as to be a Light and Salvation ( or to speak ) only to such as get the Bible , and have the Scriptures or an historical Knowledge and Profession of Jesus Christ ; but he is given both for a Light to the Heathen , and Salvation to the Ends of the Earth , and so to call forth the Prisoners where the Scriptures are not ; he being in himself absolute and perfect , and so able to be whatever he is promised of God ; and this Salvation is absolutely placed upon the Son of God , who is given both for a Light , a Leader , God's Covenant and Salvation ; and therefore he is to be followed , obeyed and depended on for Life and Salvation . 4. Moreover , It s possible to have both the Sufferings and Glory of Christ revealed by his Light and Spirit without the Scriptures ; seeing the Spirit of Christ shewed and testified aforehand unto the Prophets of his Sufferings and of the Glory that should follow , 1 Pet. 1. 11. to be sure , they who first wrote Scripture of these things aforehand , had them first discovered or opened unto them by the Spirit . 5. And when Nebuchadnezer said , Lo , I see four Men loose walking in the midst of the Fire , and they have no Hurt , and the Form of the fourth is like the Son of God , Dan. 3. 25. How came this Heathen to have any such Impression or Similitude of the Son of God in his Mind , as thus to speak of the Son of God , or of the fourth , as represented to him like the Son of God ? And what Scripture could he have for this pray you ? Or for Nebuchadnezer and Darius to speak so truly and admirably as they did of the Kingdom and Dominion of the most high God , Dan. 4. 3. and Chap. 6. 26. Let the narrow-Spirited Litteralists , and partial Predestinators ( who would place all true Knowledge upon the Letter , and confine it within the Compass of a few Professors of Scripture ) consider these things . 6. But seeing that Christ dyed for all Men , tasted Death for every Man , and gave himself a Ransom for all ; God doth therefore ( no doubt ) afford a Way for the universal Conveyance of the Vertue and blessed Effects inwardly of his Death and Blood to Man-kind , and that is his divine Light , though many have not the outward Description thereof . XVI . His unlearned Question . AS to H. G's Question , p. 70. viz. I shall only ask this one Question ; what things and other Signs were those which Jesus did that are not written , Joh. 20. 30. and Joh. 21. 25. To this I say , It s an easie matter for Intruders to ask unlearned and unnecessary Questions , whereof this is one ; of those many other Signs and Things that Jesus did , it s said , If they should be written every one , I suppose that even the World it self could not contain the Books , Joh. 20. 25. how then should this Querist be capable to contain them ? I suppose he doth not think himself able to contain more then the World it self : If he saith , it is an hiperbolical Expression , then is his Question hiperbolical to be sure . And if we cannot give him Account of all those Signs and things in particular , while we are not sollicitous to know them , nor do we think it needful ; is that any valid Plea or Proof against the Sufficiency of the Light within or Spirits Teaching ? Would such an Argument against the Scriptures being the Rule please him , because they contain not all that was done ? God gives us to know what 's sufficient and necessary for Life and Salvation by his Light within : But if the Word contain 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , be taken for , to understand as Mat. 19. 11. to comprehend , Job . 21 25. Then in that Sence there 's far more written in the Scriptures already , then either our Opposer or his Brethren can either comprehend or understand ( and therefore it s a busie Intrusion and Cavil in them to query for more ) while they oppose the true Light within , and will not believe in it , nor depend upon the Immediate Teachings of the Spirit of Truth , from whence the holy Scriptures proceeded ; but dark they are , and more grosly dark and confused they are like to be , who persist in that gain-saying Spirit of Prejudice and Enmity against the Light of Truth , which I desire the Lord to give them a Sight and Sence of unto Repentance , rather then they should perish in their perverse Gain-sayings . THE Angry Anabaptist Proved BABYLONISH , IN Answer to Henry Grigg's Pamphlet , stiled , The Baptist not Babylonish . Wherein , Whilst he endeavours to reconcile his Contradictions ( in his Book Entituled , Light from the Sun , &c. ) Charged upon him in a Paper , Entituled , The Babylonish Baptist ; He is run into more Contradictions , Absurdities and false Accusations against the People of God , called Quakers , and their Principles . By G. W. Ex ore tuo te judicabo . Printed in the Year , 1673. The Heads of the following Treatise . I. OF the Light of the Eternal Word in Man , and the Anabaptist confounded about it . II. The Sufficiency of the Light within to reveal God , Christ , &c. III. The Effect of Christ's Sufferings only known in his Light within . IV. The saving Work of the Spirit . V. How the Light in Man is a Gift , and H. G' s Distinction between the Meritorious and Instrumental Cause of Salvation examined . VI. The Lord's Supper in the Type and in the Anti-Type ; the Shadow and Substance distinguished . VII . The Anabaptist's Imposition about their Shadowy Baptism . VIII . Their Definition of the true Saviour and his Being . IX . The Hypostatical Union . X. His Charge against the Quakers Principles and Doctrines ( of the Light within ) proved impure , vile and ignorant ; and the Spirituality , Divinity and Sufficiency of the Light within further asserted . XI . His sad and impious Prayer against the Light in all , which Light is proved of the same Nature ( or kind ) with the Witness in Believers . XII . His groundless Comparison and Distinction ( between the Light of God in man , and the Light of Christ or Gospel ) further refuted . XIII . His belying us with denying the Man Christ Jesus , to ●…loak his own Absurdity and Ignorance of Christ and his Being . XIV . That scriptural Distinction between the Eternal Son of God , and the Body prepared for him further maintained , and the Anabaptist's persecuting Spirit , reviling and traducing the Inocent reproved . XV. A Warning and Reproof to Hen. Grigg , &c. XVI . The Baptist's nine Questions answered . THE Angry Anabaptist Proved BABYLONISH , IN Answer to H. G's Pamphlet , stiled , The Baptist not Babylonish . WHereas H. G. pretends he hath set down my Animadversions ( upon his Contradictions ) in order exactly , after my own Fashion , pag. 1. I say , this is not true , he hath left out the latter part of five of them which it appears did pinch him . Therefore I shall represent to the Reader his Contradictions with my Animadversions , and the Stress of his Exceptions , whereby he would endeavour to make People believe he hath not contradicted himself , but that we must refer to the Impartial Readers to judge of in the Light of Truth . I. Of the Light of the Eternal Word in Man , and the Anabaptist confounded about it . HEnry Grigg saith , viz. I utterly deny that this Light which all Men have from the Glorious Creator is a saving Light , pag. 8. of his Book called , Light from the Sun of Righteousness . H. G. [ in Contradiction ] saith , I really believe that the Lord Jesus Christ , AS the Eternal Word , hath given Light or enlightneth all Men and Women that come into the World , p. 8. G. W. his Animadversion , The Light or Life of the Eternal Word , which is the Light of Men , Joh. 1. 4. is spiritual and divine , as is that Word , and therefore saving to all that truly obey it . H. G. replyes , It seems to me as if this Man had lost his Common Reason — because I deny that the Light which is in all Men is a saving Light ; and yet say , I really believe all have a Light in them from Christ considered as Creator — This cannot be a Contradiction , unless he can prove there is no Light proceeding from the Eternal Word as Creator , but what is saving , p. 2. G. W. answereth , Whilst he would insinuate that the Light in every Man is created , or a Creature , he meerly beggs the Question , and still remains in his self-Contradiction ; for he dare not say , That AS the Eternal Word Jesus Christ is a Creature : Neither is his Light that proceedeth from him , as that Word created , any more then that Life which was in him , which Life was the Light of Men ; will they say this is either created or natural ? As the Eternal Word is divine , so is the Light or immediate Shining thereof in Man's Conscience . H. G. What though it be granted , that the Light which all Men that come into the World are lighted , which flows from the Eternal Word , and so is spiritual ; must it needs therefore be a saving Light ? Was not the Law given forth on Mount Sinai , a Light of , or come from the Eternal Word , and doth not Paul say , that the Law is spiritual , Rom. 7. 14. and yet a Ministration of Death , 2 Cor. 3. 7. and that killed , and in other places that there was no Justification by it ? G. W. Answer , 1. If it be a spiritual Light in Man , proceeding and flowing from the Eternal Word ; it must therefore be the Eternal Word that immediately shineth in Man's Heart ( which is not created nor natural ) for all have not the Law in the Letter , or as outwardly written ; And if this Immediate Light be not of a saveing Property what Light is ? And for what end is it given universally to Man-kind ? That they may be saved ; or onely to condemn them ? 2. Christ's enlightning all men as the Eternal Word and that with a spiritual Light flowing from himself , ( as the Eternall Word Enlightening ) It is not with the Letter which killeth and Cannot give Life but with an Immediate Illumination or Influence of Light from himself which can both kill and make a live ; it hath both the Law , or sentence of Death in it to the transgressor , and quickning Vertue and Gospel in it to make alive to God , and minister Life and Justification from God to them that truly obey it . 3. This immed iate Light or Shining from Jesus Christ , as the Eternal Word , is neither the Letter of the Law , nor created , nor yet natural , as Anabaptists use to say ; but as the Eternal Word enlightning man , and the Life which was in him being the Light of Men ; is therefore a Light and Law which can give Life ( which the Law , as in the Letter could not ) it being the Life it self that was in the Eternal Word . H. G. The great Darkness of these Men who cry up Light and Power within ; this Wile of Satan , and Cheat of Anti-Christ , p. 31. H. G. [ Contradiction ] The Lord Jesus Christ , as the Eternal Word enlightneth all Men ; this Light is the Substance of the Law , the Candle of the Lord , it doth convince of Sin , p. 8. If Heathens follow it they would shine in just living ; the Work of Faith with Power ; I do mantain that Faith is required and must be wrought with Power in the Heart , p. 15 , 16. G. W. Animad . What horrible Blasphemy is it then to term our crying up the Light and Power of Christ within the Wile of Satan , and Cheat of Anti-Christ , and how plainly hereby confuted : We have Cause to look upon those Heathens that follow the Light or Gift of God within to be more godly and better Christians then many of these Baptists . H. G. Rep. Your Lyes and Ignorance — I say , the Darkness of these Men who cry up Light and Power within , is great ; and I did say in p. 31. I should make appear this Wile of Satan , and Cheat of Anti-Christ ( that is to say ) the Evil Doctrine , and Principles of yours — And do I contradict this in affirming there is a Light in all Men , called , the Candle of the Lord , and in owning the Inward Work of Faith with Power upon the Heart , &c. p. 4. G. W. Answer . Hath he not before evidently made their crying up Light and Power within , the Character of the great Darkness , and this the Wile of Satan , and Cheat of Anti-christ ? You that understand Grammer and common Sence , mark the Tenour of his Words , and how he shuffles to cover this Blasphemy and Contradiction , to his confessing that the Lord Jesus , as the Eternal Word enlightneth all Men ; and this is our Principle , though now he placeth the great Darkness , Wile of Satan , and Cheat of Anti-Christ upon our Doctrine and Principles ( without Exception ) concerning the Light within ; and thus still ensnares himself in his Confusion ; as also in one while affirming that this Light in Man is the Substance of the Law or first Covenant , another while , that it is the formed Spirit in Man , Zach. 12. 1. which is called the Candle of the Lord , as in his 9th pag. of his first Book . Where note that by seeking to obscure his gross Contradiction before , he is run into another , viz. One while calling the Light ( of the Eternal Word ) in every Man , The Substance of the Law of the first Covenant ( yea , now the Ministration of Death or Letter that killeth , from 2 Corrinth . 3. 6 , 7. cited by him ) another while he calls this Light in every man , A Spirit that God hath given or formed in Man ; you who can distinguish between the Law ( or Letter of it ) written in Table of Stone , and the Spirit of Man : Judge , if this Anabaptist be not plainly contradictory to himself herein ; for is the Spirit of Man , and the Law written both one and the same thing ? And while the Spirit of Man is confest to be the Candle of the Lord , it s lighted by his Divine Word or Fire , The Lord hath lighted my Candle . II. The Sufficiency of the Light within , to reveal God , Christ , &c. HEnry Grigg again shuffles and beggs the Question thus , viz. Do not you say , that this Light which is in every Man that cometh into the World , is God , is Christ , is the Holy Spirit or Blessed Comforter , and a Saving Light , and that it will convince a Man of every Sin and Transgression , and lead into all Truth , &c. Answ. He here questions the things which in his 18th . pag he affirms , The Quakers speak of the Light within , viz. That it is the Divine Essence , the Lord Jesus Christ , the holy Spirit , &c. But I ask him , where , or in what Book and page do the Quakers speak all this of that Measure or Gift of Light that is in every man ( he deals disingenuously in not citing our own Books and Pages for these Words , that we might consider further thereof , seeing the Stress of his Charge lies so much on them , which though we assert it to be a divine Light of God , and Christ , and holy Spirit , which are one , and omni-present , filling Heaven and Earth , over all , and through all , God unlimitted in his Presence , which to man is an Enlightning Presence ; yet God and Christ is not revealed in all ; for he was in the World , and the World was made by him , and the World knew him not , yet his divine Light or immediate Shining in Man is manifest by measure or Degrees , as man is capable to receive it ; the least degree whereof is saving to them that obey it , and tends to direct and draw Man towards God , who is the absolute and alone Saviour , and he and his Light in men are inseparable , whose Salvation is manifest by degrees , as his Light or Grace in man's Heart is , which hath taught us to wait and to look for that blessed Hope , and the glorious apprearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ. The Measure or Manifestation of this Light and Grace , which immediately directs and leads to this Appearance of the great God and our Saviour , must needs therefore be saving : And because God or his Son , in his infinite Fulness and Knowledge , as in himself , cannot be contained in man , in that the Heaven of Heavens cannot contain God ; it follows not therefore , that the Measure and Manifestation of his Light in Man is not convincing , sanctifying or saving , whilst it is confest to be a Light or Illumination of Jesus Christ , as the Eternal Word , enlightning all Men and Women . If the infinite Fulness or Giver of this Light cannot be contained in Man ; yet God hath promised to tabernacle with Men ; and to dwell in them ; it follows not , that a little degree of the Light , Vertue and Knowledge thereof is not saving or sanctifying . A small Stream can wash , and a little Fire kindle and increase to more , and a little convenient Food nourish and satisfie , and a little Water quench one's Thirst , or a small Seed grow and bring forth great Increase ; and so a little Light from Christ can increase and shine more and more till it discover the Glory of God in the Face of Jesus Christ the anointed ; these things are truely known in the Mystery through true Obedience to so much Light or Illumination as God hath given man ; for he ( the Glorious Creator ) hath given a Light to all men sufficient to save , or else they could not be left without Excuse ; but it would reflect upon him for condemning them for Sin , if he did not afford them a Light sufficient to guide out of Sin unto Salvation . But for our asserting the Light of Christ that is in every Man , to be convincing , sanctifying and saving ; H. G. concludes as followeth , p. 5. III. The Effect of Christ's Sufferings only known in his Light within . H. G. IN this appears your great Darkness , and herein you are beguiled and cheated by the Devil , to the invalidating of the Meritorious Death and Sufferings of our Lord , as if there were no need of his Blood to be poured forth , nor of his Intercession , p. 5. Answ. Can either Christ's Light within , or our following of it , invalidate or make void his Sufferings without ? Or deprive us of the End thereof , or of the Vertue of his Blood ? When they that crucified , murthered Christ were turned from his Light within ? Or can any receive the Benefit of Christ's Sufferings and Blood without ( or out of ) his Light within ? Or are the Sufferings and Death of Christ absolutely meritorious for Man's Justification without any Dependance upon his Light within ? If so , how can any be deprived of Justification for whom Christ dyed ? Which was for all Men ; but what Proof hath he from Scripture , That the shedding Christ's Blood was the Meritorious Cause of Justification ? Seeing it was shed by wicked Hands ; and surely , had the Jews and Gentiles obeyed and walked in that holy and just Light that was in them , they had not crucified nor murthered the just One , the Son of God , whose giving up to the Death of the Cross ( though of Necessity ) yet it was occasioned because of Sin and Death that was come over all , which man must only be convinced and truely sensible of by the Light of Christ within ; and it s such only as walk in his Light , who come to know the Blood of Christ to cleanse them from all Sin. And there is a certain Congruity and Oneness in being sanctified , redeemed and saved by his Life , Light , Blood , Power , Arm , Ingrafted Word , Spirit , Fire , Water or by Grace ; these do not oppose Christ as Saviour , he being in all the great Workman of God , through whom God hath saved us by the washing of Regeneration and renewing of the holy Ghost , Titus 3. 4 , 5. These being one in Substance with him , and of himself , as the Spirit , the Water and the Blood agree in one : And as his offering up himself , being a Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World , pouring out his Soul to Death , and making Intercession for the Transgressors was by the Eternal Spirit , so the blessed Effects thereof are spiritually and inwardly received by them that obey and walk in the Light of his Spirit ; wherein his Life and Vertue of the Blood of the Covenant is received unto Cleansing , Sanctification and Reconciliation with God : The great Sufferings , Burthens and Afflictions of Christ were occasioned by man's Sin , Disobedience , and turning from his Life and Light within ; and this brought Darkness and Death over Man-kind ; and therefore Christ deeply travelled in the Spirit of Prayer and Intercession , through all his Sufferings , to bring forth his own Life and Light for man's Deliverance out of Death and Darkness , that he might see his Seed , and the Travel of his Soul , and be satisfied . And this is the Seed that shall serve him throughout all Ages , which shall be counted unto the Lord for a Generation ; and this serves him in his Light , and worships him in Spirit ; therefore they that oppose this Light of Christ to the End of Christ's Coming , Death , Sufferings , Blood or Intercession , as if his Light in Man did invalidate these ; they are darkned and cheated by the Devil , and not these who obey Christ's Light within for Life and Savation in him . IV. The saving Work of the Spirit . HEnry Grigg observes from John 16. 7. That the Spirit or blessed Comforter cannot be the Saviour , pag. 46. H. G. Contradiction ) Till the Coming of his Spirit and Grace with Power in my Heart for the binding of the strong man Satan , and killing my Corruptions , my Soul was not brought out of the horrible Pit , p. 16. having wrought this glorious Work of Regeneration , p. 17. G. W. his Animadversion . Then it s the Spirit and Power of Christ that effects Salvation through the Work of Regeneration , Tit. 3. 5. which is not meerly by Christ's outward Sufferings , though we cannot believe that Satan is bound in this Man , while he is in Satan's Work , blaspheming Christ's Light within , and belying us . H. G. replyes , What sober Christian Man can find any Contradiction here against H. G ? Is not G. W. the Lyar and false Accuser ? I say the Spirit or blessed Comforter cannot be the Saviour or Mediator , p. 6. G. W. Answer , The Contradiction is very obvious to say , the Spirit cannot be the Saviour , when it can save the Soul out of the horrible Pit ; can it save and not be a Saviour ? Or can it bind the strong Man , or kill man's Corruptions , and yet not save him ? And if the Father , the Word and the holy Spirit be God , cannot God be the Saviour ? When as Christ's being the Author of Faith , giving Power to others to become the Sons of God , is a Proof of his being God , Light from the Sun , p. 91. And Christ said , The Son can do nothing of himself , &c. The Father that dwelleth in me he doth the Works , Joh. 5. 19. 30. and 8. 28. and 14. 10. And the holy Spirit where received , also maketh Intercession according to the Will of God , and by this Spirit Christ prayed unto the Father ; but to say , the Spirit or blessed Comforter cannot be the Saviour , is also to deny Christ in his spiritual Appearance , to be a Saviour , and so to confine the saving Work to him only , as man , or in the Flesh without ( or separate from ) us , whereas he said , I will not leave you comfortless , I will come to you , John 14. 18. which plainly denotes him to be the Comforter in that Spiritual Appearance , wherein he that was with them promised to be in them , and as revealed in them ; his Appearance was another or diverse to his outward Appearance in the Flesh , whereas H. G. saith , Are there not three that bear Record in Heaven ? I say yes , and these three are one ; and is not Christ ( the Saviour ) that Word , which is one of the three , which are but one divine Being , Thing or Substance , though revealed under several Considerations and Diversities of Manifestations , and Degrees of Discoveries ? yet all one divine Life and Being , as God is the Word , the Life , the Light , and so is Christ ; and the holy Spirit is Life to the Righteous , and so is Christ the Way the Truth and the Life : In him was Life , and the Life the Light of Men ; the Life affordeth Light to all , and the Light Life to all that obey it , and in it follow Christ , such receive the Light of Life , and come to walk in the Light of the Living , as the Light of Life is received unto Justification and Peace , the holy Spirit is received in that glorious Ministration as Comforter , after a State of Desolation and Sorrow of whom Christ said , He shall receive of mine and shew it unto you , Joh. 16. 13. H. G. Did the true Saviour die on the Cross or not ? Answ. Yes , as concerning the Flesh , but not as concerning the Spirit or most noble Principle , by which he was impowred to his Work of Salvation . H. G. I affirm once again , That neither the Comforter , viz. the holy Spirit , nor the Deity of our Lord Jesus distinct from his Manhood or human Nature , could be the Saviour and Mediator which dyed on the Cross , &c. pag. 7. Answ. This is a meer impertinent Shuffle to prove the holy Spirit could not be the Saviour ; he now tells us , that neither the holy Spirit , nor the Deity distinct from his human Nature ( as he calls it ) could be the Saviour that dyed ; who of us ever affirmed that his Deity or holy Spirit dyed ? But seeing the holy Spirit or Deity dyed not with the Flesh of Christ that was crucified , then the whole Saviour did not dye , but what he calls the human Nature : But if we take his Words according to his Doctrine before , for Proof ( that the holy Spirit or Comforter cannot save or be the Saviour ) only thus , viz. Neither the Comforter the holy Spirit , nor the Deity of our Lord Jesus distinct from his Manhood or human Nature could be the Saviour . This were all one as to tell us , that God cannot be the Saviour , or that God cannot save , if the holy Spirit or Deity be God ; he should rather have said , that the Manhood could not save without the holy Spirit , divine Power or Deity , which alone is sufficient ( and only that which is felt and experienced in Man ) to effect his Salvation and Deliverance from the Power of Sin and Satan : Ye are my Witnesses saith the Lord , and my Servants whom I have chosen , that ye may know and believe me and understand that I am he , before me there was no God formed , neither shall there be after me ; I even I am the Lord , and beside me there is no Saviour , Isa. 43. 10 , 11. There is no God else beside me a Just God and a Saviour , Chap. 45. 21. And we both labour and suffer Reproach , because we trust in the living God , who is the Saviour of all men , specially of those that believe , 1 Tim. 4. 10. And how is God especially known to be the Saviour , but in saing man from Sin , Unrighteousness and all Guile ? I will mention the loving Kindness of the Lord , &c. For he said , Surely they are my People , Children that will not lye ; so he was their Saviour , Isa. 63. 7 , 8. Now consider whether it be not grosly erroneous to suppose the holy Spirit o●… Deity cannot save , or is so deficient distinct , or in it self , whereas though God was manifest in Flesh , God was in Christ reconciling the World to himself ; the Divinity and human ( or earthly ) Nature were alwayes distinct ; and is not God omnipotent ? To the only wise God our Saviour be Glory and Majesty , Dominion and Power , now and ever , Amen . V. How the Light in Man is a Gift , and H. G' s distinction between the Meritorious and instrumental Cause of Salvation examined . H. G. ARt thou not able to distinguish between the Giver and the Gift , between the Fountain and the Stream , p. 7. Answ. Yes , I do distinguish between the Giver and the Gift , between the Fountain and the Stream , between the Fulness and the receiving thereof Grace for Grace ; bu●… while the Distinction between God and the Gift of his Spirit , or between Christ and his Light within , seems to be no more then between the Fountain and the Stream ; how grosly erroneous is it to conclude , either that the Spirit cannot be Saviour , or that the Light of Christ is not saving ? For that 's all one as to say , that either the Stream is not the same Water with the Fountain , or that the Stream cannot wash because not the Fountain or Fulness ; who in his right Wits will believe this ? H. G. But again it appears thou distinguishest not between the meritorious Cause of man's Salvation , and the Instrumental , the killing of the Sacrifice , and the sprinkling of the Blood , &c. p. 7. 8. Answ. Where doth the Scripture make this Distinction , or say , that the killing of the Sacrifice ( which he must mean of Christ ) is the meritorious Cause of man's Salvation ? Such like blind distinctions are fit to darken Knowledge and blind Peoples Minds ; and how gross and unchristian is it to place such a Merit or Worth upon that murtherous Act of killing the Sacrifice if he mean ) Christ as his Discourse implies ? For though Christ Jesus ( by that inherent Holiness , and original Righteousness , and Grace of God in him ) offered and gave himself up to suffer , and tasted Death for every Man ; yet the crucifying and killing him , according to the Flesh , was an Act of Murtherers and Persecutors , who by wicked Hand put him to death ; so that the Dignity and Worth was in Christ and on his Part through all his Sufferings , and not in the Act of killing him by wicked Hands , nor on their Parts ; howbeit the Sufferings and Death of Christ were of great value with the Father , and his Power did appear through all to the bruising the Serpents Head. And if it be the Work of the Spirit to sanctifie and renew us ; is not this a saving Work ? And doth not this bring us to receive the Attonement , and to enjoy Peace ? Who follow and obey this Spirit for a Reconciliation ( through the Death of Christ ) and being saved by his Life ; and so the Work of Christ in saving and redecming man from Iniquity , and in making Attonement Peace and Union between God and Man ( however these be directly pointed at , made way for by the Suffering and Death of Christ ) yet they were inwardly revealed , effected and fulfilled by the Spirit or Life of Christ , where the Word of Reconciliation is received in the Heart . For Christ's Appearance and Suffering in the Flesh did really and directly point at those spiritual Ends ( which are for man's Eternal Advantage ) to be fulfilled by his Appearance in Spirit . VI. The Lord's Supper in the Type and in the Anti-Type , the Shadow and Substance distinguished . H. G. THe Ordinance of the Lord's Supper you call Bread and Wine , p. 19. H. G. [ Contradiction ] The Sign , the Shadow ( speaking of their Ordinances the Substance being Christ , p. 53 , 54. G. W. his Animadversion , Your pretended Lord's Supper then is no more then Bread and Wine , the Sign the Shadow , and therefore their Continuation of no Necessity in the true Church , which hath received Christ the Substance [ Thus far he cites my Words , and leaves out what follows ] The living Bread , who spiritually communicates his Flesh and Blood , or Fruit of the heavenly Vine without your Shadows ; and this is our Lord's Supper that we pertake of ; and our Baptism is spiritual , 1 Cor. 12 , 13. Ephes. 4. 5. and as in 1 Pet. 3. 21. It s said ; to the which also the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Anti Type , that now saveth us even Baptism agreeth . His Contradiction before is between his calling their Bread and Wine the Lord's Supper , now remaining in full Force , and yet confessing them to be the Sign , the Shadow , and that the Substance is Christ. If that you call the Lord's Supper be a Shadow , as of Christ to come , it cannot be that Lord's Supper which remains in full Force , where he is come to sup together with them who have received him in , as being the Substance which ends the Shadows ; but H.G. Attempts to reconcile his Contradiction by speaking of sitting down under Christ's Shadow , p. 9. When as its very obvious , that his Sence of Christ's Shad●… here much differs from his Sence of their preten●…ed Supper , being a Shadow of Christ the Substance as to come , whereas Shadow is metaphorical in the one , real in the other ; for were it good Doctrine to say , You must sit down under Christ's Shadow till he come ? Or that Christ is not come to his Church , while she sits down under his Shadow ; or that your Bread and Wine , as a Sign and Shadow of Christ the Substance , is that very Shadow of his that the Church is alwayes to sit down under , while upon Earth : Whereas what he saith of sitting down under his Shadow , is taken out of Canticles 2. 3. As the Apple-Tree among the Trees of the Wood , so is my Beloved among the Sons ; I sat down under his Shadow with Delight , and his Fruit was sweet to my Tast : See how plain it is , that the Simile here is take●… from sitting down under the Shadow of an Apple-Tree , and eating of the Apples . Were it good Sence to say , I must sit down under the Shadow of an Apple-Tree , and eat the Fruit thereof until the Tree come , when both Tree and Fruit are then present ? And so is Christ with his Church , when she sits down under his Shadow , and pertakes of his living Fruit , where then there is no Necessity of your outside Shadows . And yet H. G. ( in contradiction to his confessing their Ordinance to be the Shadow ) he is still imposing upon his Opposer , That the Practice of it is to be kept up in the same manner as Christ the Night before he ●…e was betrayed instituted , p. 9. But I ask , do you Baptists observe and keep a real Supper in the very same manner that Christ then did with his Disciples ? Be plain and ingenuous herein ; have you the Passover at a real Supper ? And have you the Cup both before and after Supper as Christ and his Disciples had , Luke 22. 15 , 16 , 17 , 18 , 19 , 20. And was all this either an Institution of Christ , or of Necessity to continue in the Church ? When as what Christ saith of the Passover , to wit , I will not any more eat thereof , until it be fulfilled in the Kingdom of God , verse 16. The like he saith of the Cup , I will drink no more of the Fruit of the Vine , until I drink it new with you in the Kingdom of God , Mat. 26. 29. Mark 14. 25. and Luke 22. 16 , 18. Doth not this shew as much a discontinuance of he Cup as the Passover ? And there 's no mention of Christ's taking Wine , or the Cup , after his Resurrection , either to continue , confirm or re-inforce it ( as a commemoration of his Death ) when he sat at Meat with them , and took Bread and blessed it , and brake , and gave them that their Eyes were opened , and he was known of them in breaking of Bread , after he was ●…isen ? Luke 24. 30 , 31. Jo●… . 21. 13. Howbeit H. G. is pleased to cite Acts 2. 42. and Chap. 20. to prove , that the Lord's Supper and the Practice of it is to be kept up in the same manner as Christ did the Night before he was betrayed ; I ask again , do you Anabaptists practise it in the same manner ? And have we not the more Reason to deny your Practice , if it be not in the same manner as pretended here ? Whereas in Acts 2. 42. its said , They continued stedfastly in the Apostles Doctrine and Fellowship , and in breaking of Bread , and in Prayers ( wherein is no mention either of the Wine , the Cup , the Supper or Passover ) also it s then said that all that believed were together , and had all things common , and sould their Possessions and Goods , ver . 44 , 45. Now if what they did must be binding to Posterities because practiced ; why do not the Baptists imitate those Believers in this of selling their Possessions , & c ? But were it not a very preposterous Way of arguing , to conclude a continuance of Commands and Duties from Practices . And in Acts 20. 7. Upon the first day of the Week the Disciples came together to break Bread , and that Paul had broken Bread , ver . 11. ( according to Christ's Practice after he was risen ) And in 1 Cor. 11. Paul gives a Recitation both of the Bread and Cup that Christ gave in the Figure to shew the Lord s Death till he did come ; as also of the Substance , to wit , the Body and Blood of Christ , which he was a Partaker of in the Mystery ; but as the Corrinthians were too carnal , and Envying , and Strife , and Divisions were amongst them , and some lyable to Idolatry , 1 Cor. 3. 1 , 3. Chap. 10. 14. and 11. 17 , 18 , 19. the Apostle said , I could not speak unto you as unto spiritual , but as unto carnal ; so as then they had not the clear Sight of Christ as the Substance , or Mystery of his Body and Blood ; and the very Stress , Drift and Scope of the Apostles Testimony was to exalt the Substance and Mystery , and to bring them into a spiritual Mind and State ; for which see also , 1 Cor. 10. 14 , 15 , 16 , 17. and in 2 Cor. 13. 5. he saith , Examine your selves whether ye be in the Faith , prove your selves ; know you not your own selves how that Jesus Christ is in you except ye be Reprobates . Now Jesus Christ is confessed to be the Substance , when your pretended Lord's Supper is but the Sign , the Shadow or the Figure : If his saying , This is my Body be but a figurative Speech , according to the Martyrs , p. 9. And I require this Man to prove that Gospel-Ordinances are a Shadow , as he hath confessed their Supper to be . H. G. I would know of this Man , where he reads of any thing called the Lord's Supper , but this which we contend for , pag. 10. Answ. You are contending but for the Shadow , but there is the Lord's Supper in the Mystery , for saith the faithful and true Witness , the beginning of the Creation of God , Behold I stand at the Door and knock , If any man hear my Voice and open the door , I will come in to him , and will sup with him and he with me , Rev. 3. 20. Is not this the Lord's Supper that 's above the Shadow ? And Christ said , I appointed unto you a Kingdom , as my Father hath appointed unto me , that ye may eat and drink at my Table in my Kingdom , Luke 22. 29 , 30. Verily I say unto you , I will drink no more of the Fruit of the Vine , until that day that I drink it new with you in my Father's Kingdom . Is not this the Lord's Supper in the Mystery or Anti-Type ? And I am the Bread of Life , I am the living Bread which came down from Heaven , if any Man eat of this Bread , he shall live for ever , and the Bread that I give is my Flesh that I give for the Life of the World ; He that eateth my Flesh , and drinketh my Blood , dwelleth in me , and I in him , Joh. 6. Is not this living Bread from Heaven conf●…st to be the Substance , and the ontward Bread the Shadow thereof ? H. G. I do affirm , That this is spiritual , ( to wit , the Lords Supper ) the Baptist , p. 10. Answ. The Lord's Supper in the Mystery is spiritual , but not your Bread and Wine , unless they be transubstantiated which we utterly deny . H. G. The Ordinance of Water-Baptism was given forth by Christ after his Resurrection , Mat. 28. 20. Answ. There 's no mention of Water but baptizing them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 into the Name of the Father , Son and Holy Spirit , and this Baptism was saving , so is not your dipping . H. G. And this of the Lords Supper Paul received of Christ sometime after his Ascension , 1 Cor. 11. 23. Answ. 1st . Paul received of Christ the Lords Supper in the Mystery , not in the Shadow , 1 Cor. 10. 15 , 16 , 17. yet he delivered unto them the Relation how the Lord Jesus took Bread and the Cup the same Night in which he was betrayed , ver . 23 , 24. which he applyed to a spiritual End , ver . 28. explained before , Chap. 20. 16. and he delivered the Gospel , as well touching Christ's Resurrection as his Death , 1 Cor. 15. 3. and for their being baptized into his Death , and raised in the Likeness of his Resurrection , which was more then a Remembrance of his Death , in ( or by ) the Shadow , which could not be positively enjoyned by , [ as oft as ye do this , ] 2. That which the Apostle received of the Lord , was the Gospel , and a Gospel-Discovery of the Substance , which was beyond and above the Shadow . And his Recitation of the Shadow was directly to point at the Substance , viz. that Bread and that Cup which was the Body and Blood of Christ , and the spiritual Communication thereof ; he was a Minister of the Gospel , the Dispensation whereof was not a Dispensation of Shadow , but of Substance . H. G. The end of this Ordinance doth remain , notwithstaning the pourings forth of the Spirit , and therefore the Ordinance must needs remain , which is to confirm our Faith in the true Saviour , and to keep up our Love to him , p. 21. G. W. What Faith and Love are these of theirs , which are confirmed by Bread and Wine , and what Idolatry and Diversion from the Spirit doth their Doctrine tend to herein ? Surely the holy Spirit can best supply the said End , Gal. 5. 22. H. G. Rep. This Ordinance tends to increase our Love to him , and our Faith in him ; therefore the end remains , unless you can prove Christ is come the second time without Sin unto Salvation ; do you suppose there is no need of this Ordinance because the Spirit can best supply the said End ? p. 11. Answ. There 's no need of the Shadow where the Substance is enjoyed , and whilst thou ( Henry ) hast confessed your Supper as ( its called ) to be the Shadow , the Substance being Christ , thou dost but contradictorily begg the Question , calling it a Gospel-Ordinance , the Lords Supper in full Force , the Ordinance , the Ordinance . 2. Thou dost but imagine a Confirmation and Increase of Faith in , and Love to Christ by your Bread and Wine , which they cannot do , true Love and Faith being Fruits of the Spirit ( which in that it can best and only supply this End , which idolatrously thou proposest to reap from thy pretended Supper ) There can be no Necessity of this thy Shadow for any such End to the Soul ; can there be any need of that which cannot supply the Soul , when that which best can do it is manifest ? Is there Necessity where there 's Plenty , or a full Supply ? 3. Whether those Believers in the Apostles dayes who hoped and looked for Christ's appearing the second time without Sin unto Salvation , Heb. 9. 28. did not accordingly come to experience his Appearance unto their Salvation ? H. G. Darest thou say the Spirit can best supply those Ends without making use of the means God in his Word doth direct unto ? The Usefulness and Sufficiency of the Spirit in fulfilling of its Work doth not dis-annul Christ's Precepts , p. 12 Answ. 1. I would know where the Word of God hath dictated that your shadowy Supper of Bread and Wine is the means to confirm true Faith in Christ , or increase your Love to him , or else confess thy Error ; for the means thou talkst of must have reference to what we were upon before , about your pretended Supper , or else thou art insignificant and impertinent in thy discourse . 2. If the Spirit be sufficient to fulfil its Work and Office , which is to bring forth its own Fruit , what Necessity of your Shadow which cannot do it , nor so far help man , as in the leasts supply those Ends the Spirit is given for , much less help the Spirit therein which is al-sufficient ? VII . The Anabaptist's Imposition about their shadowy Baptism . AGain H. G. is very fierce and rash for thei●… Water-Baptism ( or plunging People in Water ) where he saith , Whosoever brings any other Gospel let him be accursed , p. 〈◊〉 : G. W. Hereby he hath cursed all the People of God and sincere minded , both Protestants and all others in the World , who oppose and come not under the Baptists dipping or plunging People in Water . The Lord sorgive him he is very uncharitable herein ; for our parts , we cannot believe their Baptism to be either the Baptism of Christ or Gospel , or of Necessity and available to Salvation . H. G. Rep. Thou hast in this manifested thy Imperfection and false Anti-christian Spirit ; hast thou no more Care nor Conscience , that thou goest about thus to belie the Innocent ? Have I affir●…ed that Baptism or plunging Men and Women is Gospel ? Have I said , it is of Necessity to Salvation ? p. 13. Answ. 'T is both dishonest and false in thee to accuse me of an Anti-christian Spirit and belying the Innocent , for stating thy own Words and the Consequence thereof from the very Tenour of thy Discourse ; hast thou not accounted your Water-Baptism or dipping Gospel , or at least part of Christ's last Will and Testament , and them accursed that bring any other Gospel ? See thy other Book , pages 24 , 25 , 26. and have not thy Brethren declared it for the Remission of Sins , and the only Way of gathering Churches 1. To teach , and then to baptize or dip them ? See their Confession of Faith ( Article 11. ) presented to the King , and subscribed by above 40. of them . And have not some of thy Brethren affrighted many simple People into Water , to be dipt , formerly by such Language , as , dip or damn ; and what hast thou said less , if they be accurst that own it not : Some of thy Brethren have positively affimed it necessary to Salvation on that Scripture , Except a Man be born again of Water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God , falsly deeming that outward Water there spoken of . H. G. All that are accursed , are only those who bring another Gospel besides that which was given sorth by Christ , as he is King and Mediator of the new Covenant , p. 14. Answ. And your dipping thou reckons to be given forth by Christ , thy pretended Proof being Mat. 28. 20. as before mentioned , wherefore thy case is against all that own 〈◊〉 , or deny to be dipt ; for our parts we will not be dipt by you . H. G. I doubt not but all sincere-minded Protestants are of my Perswasion touching this matter , though we may differ about the Form and Subjects of Water-Baptism , p. 14. Answ. Here thou insinuatest and flatters the Protestants , like a temporizer and decliner of your former Testimony , and contrary to thy Brethrens said Confession of Faith , which is wholy against that scriptureless thing of sprinkling Infants , Article 11. ( as their Phrase is ) and have not divers of thy Brethren deem'd it Anti-christian ? H. G. False it is and a Slander to say , that we make it essential and of absolute Necessity to Salvation , though we believe it essential to Church Communion , p. 14 , 15. Answ. Is it not essential and of Necessity to Salvation , if part of Christ's last Will and Testament , as before thou sayst ? And such to be accurst that oppose it , or if the same Baptism of Christ , mentioned , Mat. 28. and Mark 16. which is annexed to believing in order to Salvation : But if not of Necessity to Salvation , then not the Baptism into the one Body or Church-Communion ; and then it s not that one Baptism or Anti-Type which doth save ( viz. The Baptism into the Name of the Father , Son and Holy Spirit ) for without that Name or Power Men cannot be saved . VIII . Their Definition of the true Saviour and his Being . HEnry Grigg denyes the true Saviour to be the Light and Power . I afsirm ( saith he ) that Jesus Christ is a Man consisting of Flesh and Bones p. 30 , 31. human , finite , weak , subject to Passion as we are , 94. p. 33. the true Christ consisting of a Body of Flesh and Bone , p. 31. 34. H. G. Contrad . John declared plainly that Christ was before him , being from everlasting , before Abraham , the Son of God by Eternal Generation , truly God , David's Lord , p. 35. The Lord Jesus , the Eternal Word , p. 8. The Emanuel , p. 32. Christ the Son of the living God , p. 33. G.W. [ Animed . ] Therefore it s both unscriptural and absurd to assert , that Jesus Christ consisteth of a human Body of Flesh and Bone , or is finite ( seeing he was before all things , and by him all things consist , Col. 1. 17. and inconsistant both with the Eternal Glory of the Son of God , which he had with the Father before the World began , wherein he is glorified , and his Body Glorious and Spiritual : They should have said , that he took upon him that Body prepared for him , and not that he ( Jesus Christ ) consisteth or is made up of Flesh and Bones , but at length they are made to grant to the Deity of Christ more than formerly ; though to their own Confutation as before : And I further add , Is there not a plain Contradiction between Jesus Christ consisting of Flesh and Bone , human Nature , and that the Lord Jesus Christ is the Eternal Word from Everlasting , &c. Besides , after his Resurrection he said , a Spirit hath not Flesh as ye see me have , Luke 24. 39. now for Jesus Christ to have Flesh and Bone , and for him to consist of Flesh and Bone ( in his Sence ) are two differing things ; for to have Flesh and Bones , implies a Distinction between him the Son of God ( as to his Being ) and the Flesh and Bones which he had , but to consist of Flesh and Bones implies he could not have a Being without them , but that he is made up meerly of human Flesh and Bones . H. G. Doth he not evidently declare to the World , that it is a Contradiction and absurd to assert , that Jesus Christ is God and Man , subsisting in too real distinct Natures — because I said , he is Man , and that the Divinity distinct and apart from the Humanity is not the Christ , and yet also said , he is God everlasting and the Son of God by Eternal Generation , p. 16. Rep. 1. It is remarkable how the Man shuffles , evades and useth a Subterfuge , besides my Objection , which was not at all against Jesus Christ being God and Man ( take Man , as Christ is the heavenly , spiritual and glorified Man ; being ascended up where he was before ) but it was against his affirming that Jesus Christ consisteth of human Flesh and Bone ( I distinguishing between consisting and having ) seeing Christ was srom Everlasting . 2. And now also to say , he subsists in two Natures ( divine and human contradicts his saying , he consists of Flesh and Bones , human Nature ; for these do not consist of two Natures , the human Nature is not two Natures , both human and divine , as human or earthly Nature cannot be the heavenly also . 3. If Christ consisteth ( or is made up ) of human Flesh and Bones , and be the Christ only as so considered ; then how is he the Son of God by Eternal Generation , even before ( as well as since ) he took upon him that Body which was prepared for him , or pertook of that which the Children had ( to wit , Flesh and Blood ? ) If the Son of God before , was he not then Christ before ? Or was he the Son of God when he was not Christ ? IX . The Hypostatical Union . BUt H. G. instead of clearing himself in this matter he sillily ( yet perversly ) begs the Question thus , Doth he not deny his human Nature and glorious hypostatical Union ? p. 21. This being consider'd , together with his severe Conclusion against us , of horrible Heresies , Delusions and vile Impostures , as in p. 17. shews , that he has a design to render us as odious and as obnoxious as he can ; for if he can influence the Powers with his own and his Brethrens implacable Enmity , and inveterate Spirit , and possess them , that the Quakers are horrible Hereticks , and vile Imposters , and that they deny the Man Christ Jesus , and the Hypostatical Union ; we must be no objects of Mercy , nor fit to live among Men , but Subjects of Ruine & Destruction ; we cannot herein but take notice of the persecuting Spirit , implacable and deadly Envy that is in some of these Anabaptists , tending to Persecution in the highest . But to the Question , Whether I do not deny his human Nature and glorious hyp●…statical Union ? 1 ●…nswer , 1. That if Hypostatical signifie Substantial from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Substance ; I do confess and own that the Father , the Word and holy Spirit are one Substance , or that the Oneness of Substance is applicable to all the three in Heaven ; ●…or they are not three Substances . And that the Son of God is the Brightness of his Father's Glory , and the express Character of his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Substance , Heb. 1. 3. And that therefore the Father and the Son are one Substance . 2. But that either the Son of God doth consist or is made up of human Flesh and Blood , or that these and the divine Nature are one Substance , I deny , as contrary to the Son being the Brightness of his Glory & the express Character ( or Image ) of his Substance , Heb. 1. 3. for human Nature and divine are not both one ; though still the one Hypostacis or Substance is in all the three divine Witnesses in Heaven ( whose glorious hypostatical Union we never denyed ) this is further opened in our Books , viz. The Divinity of Christ , &c. Serious Apollogy , 1. Part , Chap. 3. Howbeit if we cannot own these to be Scripture-Language , viz. 1. That Jesus Christ consisteth of human Flesh and Bone. 2. That the glorious hypostacical Union consists of a human and divine Nature , or that they are hypostatically one ; he should bear with us , till he produce us plain Scripture for those Positions and Words . X. His Charge against the Quakers Principles and Doctrines ( of the Light within ) proved impure , vile and ignorant ; and the Spirituality , Divinity and Sufficiency of the Light within further asserted . ANd again H. G. is very vile and impure in affirming the Quakers Principles and Doctrines of the Light within to be impure and vile , p. 17. ( note that before he accused the Quakers Principle of the Light within , now it s the Principles , that is , all our Principles about the Light within he accuseth to be impure and vile ) which is also still contradictory to his confessing , that Christ as the Eternal Word enlightneth every Man that cometh into the World , or that the Light in every man is the Light of the Eternal Word , or a spiritual Light flowing thence : This he hath granted , and this is one of our Principles and Doctrines , which he hath accused with Impurity and Vileness , as before , which must needs strike the Principle of Light it self ( though I would believe he might not intend so badly as his Words import ) while we assert it to be what it is as manifest in Man , as , 1. That Christ as the Eternal Word enlightneth every Man , &c. 2. That as the Eternal Word , his Light is spiritual and divine , as the Word it self is , which is the true Light enlightning every Man. 3. That therefore this Light in Man being sincerely obeyed and followed , it will guide and direct man his Way out of Darkness and Sin to God and Christ the Giver of it , and so to Life and Salvation . 4. That men are not condemned , nor can they be left without Excuse for want of Light sufficient given them ; but for their Disobedience and Rebellion against the Light that God hath given them ; which therefore is sufficient . 5. By these we do deny their Predestinarian partial Principle , that concludes , That God hath not given a sufficient or saving Light or Grace , to every Man ; but that he hath refused it to the greater part of Man-kind , as having from all Eternity particularly designed their Damnation , Destruction or Preterition : This we cannot own , though it be the Doctrine upon which much of these mens oppositition is grounded against God's affording Sufficient Light to every man , the Sufficiency thereof , and our Vindication of it as it is ; for which this Opposer , and his Assisters in his work , most blasphemously , and outragiously cry out against us , in this Language , viz. The great Darkness of these Men who cry up Light and Power within ; This Wile of Satan , and Cheat of Anti-christ ; the Vileness and Impurity of which Principle , &c. And all this in his pretended Light from the Sun of Righteousness , p. 31. and 48. which he should rather have called , Darkness from the Son of Perdition . Howbeit H. G. is made to give us a little better Language concerning the Light within , where he saith , viz. I acknowle●…ge the Light which is in all , and do esteem it , and have a Regard to it in its place , and do say , it witnesses for God , and serves for the End and Purpose ( when obeyed ) for which is was given unto Man , p. 18. But for what end it serves and is given to Man ( if it be neither saving nor sufficient to lead from Sin ) he tells us not , nor to what End it can guide men singly following it ; what Esteem or Regard soever he pretends he hath to this Light within , it appears he hath made little Tryal or Proof of its Testimony for God by obeying its Directions and Guidance : We may see what Esteem and Regard this Man hath to the Light within , when he counts it great Darkness to cry up the Light and Power within , and this a Wile of Sathan and 〈◊〉 of Anti-christ . What horrible Atheistical Stuff is this , thus to cry down the Light and Power of God within ? And then deceitfully to evade and say , it was the Quakers Doctrine and Principles ; that which you Quakers speak of it is abo●…inable , and to be detested by all good Christians , p. 18. What 's now the Matter , what do the Quakers speak of the Light within that 's given to every Man ? H. G. It was never bestowed upon man to be made an Idol of , and set up in the 〈◊〉 of God. Answ. The Light of the Eternal Word neither is ( nor can be ) made an ●…dol ; for that which is divine ( as is this Light ) cannot be too much loved , esteemed , set up or obeyed . H. G. It is Blasph●… to say , it is the divine Essence . Answ. To what place wilt thou limit or confine the divine Essence ? In him was Life , and the Life was the Light of Men , is this divine , yea or nay ? If divine , is it not a Light of the divine Being . Whereas H. G. to prove the Quakers Doctrine and Principles concerning the Light within impure , and vile abominable , and to be 〈◊〉 by all good Christians , p. 18. He further adds these Positions by Way of Charge , viz. 1. It is a vile and wicked thing to say , it is the Lord Jesus Christ , the Lamb of God , the great Prophet God promised to raise up . 2. It is a vile Error to say , it is the holy Spirit or blessed Comfortor , for that Christ s●…ith , the World could not receive . Answ. H. G. should have been so ingenuous as to have cited the Quakers Books and pages , first to prove these to be their Doctrines and Principles , and that in their own very Words before he had so severely charged their Doctrines and Principles about the Light of Christ in every man , which till he doth , I must deny him to be either an impartial or true Stater of our Principles , and state them in our own Words , as , 1st . We confess that Jesus Christ ( as the Eternal Word ) enlightens every Man with his own divine Light or Life which gradually appears in Man , and shews it self by Measure ; but God gave not the Spirit by Measure unto Jesus Christ the great Prophet ; therefore we do not call every Appearance of Light the whole Christ : And according to H. G's Definition of Jesus Christ , as consisting of human Flesh and Bone , he is not in any Man ; but we knowing him after the Spirit , and that he is God over all , he is spiritually in his Saints in Union with them , and known to them , and his Presence is unlimitted ; he was in the World , and the World knew him not , whose Presence enlightens Man-kind with an immedia●…e Light from himself , which is able to reveal Christ himself , as he is only peculiarly revealed in the Saints , who have obeyed his Light. 2. The Gift , Enjoyment and indwelling of the holy Spirit as Comforter is a peculiar and glorious Manifestation of Life , only received by those that obey the Measure of that spiritual and divine Light within , which is freely given of God to all , wherein they tha●… wait upon God , obtain more Power and Vertue from him , who giveth the holy Spirit to them that truly ask him from a Sence of its Vertue and Light within , in which they are only capable of receiving the powrings forth of the holy Spirit , and abundant Shedding thereof on them , as those that receive the Measure of his Discovery or Appearance in them : And though the rebellious World doth not receive or accept of this holy Spirit , nor see his Glory as an indwelling Comforter ; yet some enlightning Appearances and Operations thereof , do at times reach the men of the World to their Conviction and Reproof , often striving with Man to perswade him out of his Sins and Iniquities . And if the holy Spirit be God , his Spirit is unlimitable , filling Heaven and Earth , &c. Whether shall I go from thy Spirit , or whether shall I flee from thy Presence , see Psa. 139. 7 , 8 , 9. and his Presence is to Man an enlightning Presence , and Thine incorruptible Spirit is in all things , therefore thou chasteneth them measurably , by putting them in remembrance of the things wherein they have offended , that leaving Wickedness they may believe in thee O Lord. 3. H. G. Abominable it is to say , 't will cleanse from all Sin and eternally save those that obey it , p. 18. Answ. The Life which is the Light of Men is both cleansing & saving in the least degree of it , to them that obey it ; and it doth not in the least deny Christ to be the Saviour , to say , that his Life or Light in Man is saving , being divine , and that by which the obedient come to know and follow Christ , and thereby receive the Light of Life and Power to become the Sons of God , and the Kingdom of God , which Christ said is within you , is compared to a little Leaven , a grain of Mustard-Seed , which therefore hath a seasoning and growing Vertue in it ; he said , believe in the Light , that ye may be the Children of the Light ; and this Light Men ought to walk in , of which it s said , as yet ye have a little Light in you ( as some read it ) walk while ye have the Light , and in walking in the Light , the Blood of Jesus Christ is received , which cleanseth from all sin . 1. Were it not a vile Error for any to affirm , that that Life which is the Light of Men , is neither Divine nor a Saving Light of Christ or Holy Spirit in any Degree of it ? 2. And art not thou H. G. vile and wickedly erronious , to give out such Language , as , This Wile of Satan and Cheat of Anti-christ , that appears blasphemously to reflect upon the Light and Power within , as before , in calling it a Wile of Satan and Cheat of Anti-christ to cry up Light and Power within : And now to refuse believing in the Light which enlightens every Man that cometh into the World for Life and Salvation , p. 19 though it be the Word which is Christ that so enlightneth every Man. XI . His sad and impious Prayer against the Light in all , which Light is proved of the same Nature ( or kind ) with the Witness in Believers . H. G. GOd forbid , that I should ever own their Principle of Light in all , that doth so clearly tend to the racing out the grand Fundamentals of the Gospel , p. 52. H. G. [ Contrad . ] Praises and Hallelujah to God for ever , who hath given us that Witness in our selves of which thou 〈◊〉 - est , p. 54 , 55. which Witness his Sister spake of , was the Light which reproves for Sin , to own and believe in the Light that enlightneth every Man that cometh into the World , p. 8. and 29. G. W. Animad . See what a sad pass these men are grown to , and what kind of Prayers they offer to God against his own Light and witness within , and how contrary to the Gospel Spirit and Light they are . H. G. Rep. G. W. belics both me and my Sister in what he saith here ; for the Witness she spoke of is not the Light which reproves for Sin , which is in every one that cometh into the World , though I confess , she bids me believe in the Light that reprov●…s for Sin , which lighteth every one that cometh into the World , 〈◊〉 contrary-wise she mentioned the Words of the Apostle John , 1 Joh. 5. 10. He that believeth hath the Witness in himself , p. 19. To this I answer , Let all moderate and impartial Readers both thy Sister and others judge , whether I have belyed thee or her in this Matter : And how quarelsome and peevish thou art ; could she intend contrary-wise or another of this Witness of God , then of that Light which enlightneth every one that cometh into the World ? Thou shouldst have asked thy Sister , if she doth not own the true Light ( that enlightens every Man ) and the Witness o●… Word , which he that believeth hath in himself , to be one and the same ? And hast not thou confest , that Christ , AS the Eternal Word enlightens every Man ? which he that believeth hath in himself , as having ( through the Light given ) received Christ the faithful and true Witness ( who stands at the door of Man's Heart and knocketh ) so as in true Union with him , and Knowledge of him to experience his Indwelling , as he dwelleth in us , and we in him , if we keep his Commandments ; and thus the true Believer hath the Witness in himself , which that thou mightst experience , was thy Sister 's wholsom Advice to thee , to believe in the Light that reproves for Sin , which enlightens every one that cometh into the World ; and so thou mightst in Love and Humility have received the Witness in thy self , which if thou hadst obeyed , thou durst never have prayed so wickedly , as , God forbid that ever I should own their Principle of the Light in all ( contrary to thy pretended Praises and Hallelujah to God for the Witness within ) neither co●…ldst thou have opposed the Witness in the Believer to the Light which reproves for sin ( which enlighteth every man ) as thou hast done . H. G. This Witness through Grace I in measure do Experience , not that I believe in that Light which every man that cometh into the World is inlightened with , for Life and Salvation that is insufficient , &c. pag. 19. Answ. If thou rejectest the Gift or Measure of the Light or Life of Christ within , thou rejectest the saithfull Witness , Christ the Giver , and canst not know him to be thy Saviour , while thou art disobedient to his Light within ; and Christ and his Light in man are so inseperable , that he who obeys and believes in his Light within , he and his Faith must needs have a dependance upon Christ the Enlightner ( who is the Object , Author and Finisher of Faith ) and so upon God , who is the Fountain of Light , who shineth in man's heart , to give the knowledge of his Glory in the Face of his Son ; and hereby is the benefit of him as the one Offering , and the vertue of his Blood known ; that both Sanctifies and makes Perfect . XII . His Groundless Comparison and Distinction ( between the Light of God in Man , and the Light of Christ or Gospel ) further Refuted . ANd whereas in thy other Book from , Rom. 1. 19. and Chap. 2. 14 , 15. thou callest the Law or Light of God in men ; The Law or Light of the Moon , to Guide their Paths , by which they are taught their duty to God in morrals , but understand nothing of the glorious Mystery of the Gospel , pag. 6●… . To this I Answer , 1. Those Gentiles mentioned in Rom. 1. had a Sight and Knowledge of the Invisible things of God even his Eternal Power and God-head ver . 19 , 20. was this but the Light of the Moon ? and was there nothing of the Gospel or Mystery of it in this , whereas the very reason of their becoming foolish , vain in their Imaginations , darkned and reprobated in their minds , was that , because that when they knew God they glorified him not as God , ver . 21. they did not like to retain God in their knowledge , ver . 28. Therefore if they had continued in the Light given them , glorified him as God , and retained him in their knowledge , they had been preserved unto Salvation out of that dark reprobate state , and out of those gross evils which they fell into . 2. Those Gentiles mentioned , Rom. 2. 15. were accused or excused according to that Light or Law of God in their hearts , and the secrets of them and all men to be Judged by Jesus Christ according to the Gospel ; but could this be , or were it Just , if there were no Law nor Light of Jesus Christ and Gospel given men ? are they and their secrets to be judged by a Law or Light which they never had in secret ? for my Part , I know none so gross and partial as to affirm it on any serious Thoughts or Consideration . 3. If the Light of God and his Knowledge be but the Light of the Moon , and the Light of Christ the Light of the Sun ; how doth he demonstrate this difference between God and Christ , and the Light of each ? and wherein the Glory of the one so far exceedeth the other ? or can any suppose there is a Light proceeding from Christ as man , that so far excels the Light flowing from him as he is God , or the Eternal Word , as the Light of the Sun doth the Light of the Moon ? what Scripture hath H. G. for this distinction ? are not God , and Christ , and holy Spirit One , and one Eternal Light and Fulness in their own Being , and so the Light immediately shining or flowing thence unto man's Heart and Conscience one Divine Light though manifest by degrees , and in several measures , being still one in kind in man. And this which H. G. calleth the Law or Light of the Moon is granted to be , 1st , The Light of Jesus Christ as the Eternal Word . 2dly , That which may be known of God , manifest in men . 3dly , That Light which gives the Light and Knowledge of God and his Eternal Power . 4dly , The Law written in the Gentiles hearts , who were a Law to themselves : to which I add , If men truely believe in , and obey the Light of the Eternal Word in them ; and retain the sence and Knowledge of God , as therein they receive it , they will find Preservation and Acceptance with God ; for is the Improvement of any more then what 's given required ? XIII . His belying us with denying the Man Christ Jesus , to cloak his own Absurdity and Ignorance of Christ and his Being . AGain H. G. To prove thy slanders , 1. That we deny the man Christ Jesus ; 2. That we are found daily in the Sight of all Persons , denying that man to be Christ , who was born of the Virgin , &c. pag. 20 , 21. Thou judgest us insolent for saying we are falsly accused and guilty of this ; If it be absurd ( as we judge it is ) to say Christ doth Consist of a human Body of Flesh and Bone , pag. 21. which is thy own absurdity . To these I say , Though we never deny'd the man Christ Jesus , nor him to be Christ that was born of the Virgin , ( according to the Flesh ) yet I must still count it absurd to say , That Christ doth Consist ( or is made up ) of a human Body of Flesh and Bone , for that , 1. because Christ the Son of God was , and had a Being before he took upon him that Flesh or Body in the Virgin ; 2. Because that when he took upon him that Body , and even in the dayes of the Flesh , he was spirit as well as had Flesh. 3. In that he is ascended up where he was before , and far above all Heavens , and is glorified with the same Glory that he had with the Father before the World began , 4. He was before all things , and by him all things consist ; this is truely our Christ and Saviour . But If your Christ doth consist of a human or earthly Body of Flesh and Bone , our Christ who consisteth of quickning spirit , and heavenly Body ( of divine Life and Light , a spiritual and glorious body ) is above you and yours ; so we must leave you Anabaptists , with your earthly Christ , consisting of a human Body of Flesh and Bone , together with your empty and lifeless Shadows ; and your darkness and enmity wherewith its you that are stirring up Smoak and Darkness with prejudice against the Truth , the true Light , and against us for bearing witness thereto . XIV . That Scriptural Distinction between the eternal Son of God , and the Body Prepared sor him , further maintained , and the Anabaptist Pers●…cuting spirit Reviling and Trad●…cing the Innocent , Reproved . AS touching that distinction of the Christ , and that Body which was prepared for him , which he took up , and dwelt in ( as hinted in a book , entitled , Some Principles of the Elect People , &c. p. 116. and 117 which he cites as a proof that the Quakers are found daily denying the man Christ ) This can be no denying of the Man Christ , as in that Body , unless either that Body alone was Christ , without the Spirit , or the names Christ , the Anointed , or Son of God , did originally , strickly and solely belong to the meer Flesh or Outside , and that the Son of God was not in being before he took upon him that Body , which I know none own but such as deny his Divinity and eternal Generation ; sor that Flesh or Body is sometimes called the Body of Jesus , this Temple , the Form of a Servant ( which he took upon him ) a Body prepared for him ; and HE Jesus Christ come in the Flesh , &c. Also in the said Book you are asked , what that is which appeared in the Body ? whether that was not the Christ , before it took up the Body , after it took up Body , and ever ? p. 117. yet far be it from us to deny Christ being truly Man , because we confess his Divinity , or to deny him in any of his Appearances either in the Flesh or Spirit , for he was truely Christ the Son of God when miraculously conceived and Born of the Virgin Mary ; and his Name was also called Immanuel , God with us ; now , dare you say , that all these eminent names and Divine Appellations given to him , when in the Flesh , did most properly and originally belong to the Flesh or Body ; and not rather to something more Eminent and Divine therein ? Again , if the Quakers were so notorious g●…ilty of horrible Heresies , Delusions and vil●… impostures , as this Opposer saith , and that they are found daily in the Sight of all Persons denying the Man Christ Jesus , and appearing to all men to be Babylonish rather then H. G. and other Baptists , pag. 17 , 20 , 21 , 22. Why then do divers of you Anabaptists and Dippers so fret , rage and turmoyle your selves against the Quakers , if they be so apparently Erronious and Babylonish in the Sight of all Persons , what need is there then of your scribling so many Books and Pamphlets against them in this time of Liberty , as if you could not demean your selves quietly , unless you see them under Persecution ? for with that you appear most quieted ; But still your striving , raging and clamouring against us doth imply you have lost ground , and you cannot inforce such a belief in people against the Quakers as you would ; thousands have secretly a Witness for us and a better belief of us then that we are such horrible Hereticks , or vile Impostors , as daily in the sight of all deny the Man Christ or are Ravening Wolves , &c. as this old angry Anabaptist would have them believe ; who also prays in his Conclusion thus , viz. The Lord deliver Christ's Poor Lambs from being preyed upon and devoured by ravening Wolves . There 's two things to be Considered in this man 's thus praying . 1. How This agrees with the Doctrine of personal election from eternity ( as held by some of his Brethren ) whether those they all count so unchangeably , and particularly elected , are or can be in any such danger of being devoured ? 2. His great Care over these poor Nations , in praying the Lord to deliver them from Horrible Heresies , and vile Impostures , p. 17. as if the●…e Anabaptists were so National In their Dipping-Church and Society , or as if they were either devout members of the National Church , or these poor Nations were mostly Anabaptists , or ready to be dipt by them ; Is it not easie to see these Men's temporizing Hippocritical Insinuations , and all in the height of their Envy to persecute and run down the poor despised Quakers , if it were possible ? but the Lord God who hath stood by us in our Tribulations and Sufferings will disappoint their malitious Design , and frustrate the Tokens of Lyars ; and the Pit which they have digged for us , they shall fall into themselves . As for H. G. his saying , He never saw yet any distinct solid Answer given by G. W. to any Book which hath come out against them , pag. 2●… . I must leave that to God's Witness to judge of , and to those that are free from Prejudice and Partiality against me , which I am sure . H. G. with some of his Brethren are not , who hath little cause to boast of his Answer as any Sollid Piece , that so much savours of Envy and Reviling . XV. A Warning and Reproof to Hen. Grigg , &c. Hen. Grigg IT s high time for thee to Repent , Lest in thy old Age thou beest cut off in the Guilt of Enmity and Falsehood , who hast turned thy back of the Light of Truth in thee , which through Judgment would have reformed thee , the testimony whereof thou art now turn'd against : Repent , Repent , Lest thy dayes and visitations from God be Extinct in utter darkness and thou have thy Reward therein among Hypocrites and such as contentiously resist the Truth . Thou sayest thou art outwardly decayed , and the time of thy departure is at hand : Light Sun p. 73 , 74. And concludest , Now ( Reader ) if thou hast received any spiritual Benefit from what hath thus occasionally been written , by a poor Worm , Weakling and nothing Creature , &c. p. 94 , 95. To all which I say , 1st , It is high time for thee to be better Prepared for thy Departure , by a true and unfeigned repentance of all thy Prejudice and hard Speeches against a People fearing God and their Principle ( which is on the behalf of the true Light in man ) 2dly , Thou hast entered into a War troublesome , and Contest against that which will be too strong for thee and thy Assistant , when thou shouldest rather prepare for a Rest. 3dly , What thou hast written savours too much of Flesh and fleshly Conceits ( which are against the Spirit and Light within ) to afford spiritual Benef●…t to the Reader . 4thly , [ Occasionally written . ] What occasion to print and publish such a Book , so much reflecting thy natural Sister ? Was a private Letter from her such a great Occasion to print both it , and perverse Commentaries upon it against her ? Didst thou herein do like a natural Brother ? or didst thou and thy Brethren think this would be a good Expedient to work a Conviction upon her , Infamously to notifie her to the World , in print for a private Letter , wherein was much wholesom Advice to thee ? Oh , shame upon such a Procedure as this of thine against thy Sister ! 5thly , [ A poor Worm , Weakling and nothing Creature ] What is this to shew thy Humility and self-Abasement ? thou hadst shown more of that in Silence ; a Fool is sometimes counted a prudent Man by keeping silent , who otherwise bewrayes his Folly , in uttering words , as some men shew their Pride and Hypocrisie by endeavouring to appear humble . 6thly , [ Nothing Creature ] Should another tell thee so in earnest ( in shewing the Nothingness of thy Work ) thou hast produced ; ●…t is probable thou wouldst not take it well : Some , while they discommend themselves , would have others commend them and their Work : But to thee [ nothing creature ] and thy Brethren ( that have assisted and encouraged thee in thy Work against the Light within , and against us who believe in , and confess to it ) we may say , Produce your Cause , bring forth your strong Reasons ; behold ye are of nothing , and your Works of nought , and Abomination is he that chu●…eth you , Isa. 41. 21 , 24. Lay aside your Envy , Pride , Hypocrisie , vain Imaginations and Conceits ; and come down and stoop to this Light within , which at times convinceth and reproves you of your Iniquities , that you may be Reformed , and the Reproofs of Instructions may be the way of Life unto you : Otherwise the Light within will pursue you to your Condemnation . XVI . The Baptist's nine Questions Answered . THat the Reader may perceive the man is uncertain , and argues Doubt●…ulness in his severe Charge before ( of horrible Heresies , Delusions , vile Impostures , ravening Wolves , &c. ) against the Quakers — note , that at last he puts Questions to us about the same Things whereo●… he hath accused us , which he needed not have done , had he either been certain , or had any such plain or real Advantage against us , as he hath pretended . His Questions ( to which he desires direct and distinct Answers ) are as followeth . First , Was he the Christ and true Saviour that was born of the Virgin yea or nay ? Answ. Yes , he was the true Christ , the Son of God , both then and before he took on him that Body , or was so born . 2dly , If you say he Was , I query , whether that same Christ be in the Heart of every Man and Woman ? Answ. The same Christ is spiritually in ( yea , revealed and dwelling in ) the Hearts of true Believers and Saints , and they in him , but not so in every man , though he enlightens every Man , and in his Light he is to be revealed and known . 3dly , Whether he that you own to be the Christ , and true Saviour was put to death , or Crucified on the Cross ? Answ. As concerning the Flesh he was . 4thy , Whether you believe there is any other Christ then what is in the heart of man , yea or nay ? Answ. The true Christ is but one and the same forever , though variously manifested , as both in the Flesh and in the Spirit , both In his Flesh or Body Intirely ( wherein he came unto his own , the Jews , who received him not ) and spiritually in his followers who have received him ; for he said to his Disciples , he that is with you shall be in you ; and to his Father , I in them , and thou in me , &c. that the Love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them , and I in them ; but thus not universally In Man , though in some Degree and Sence he appears universally in man. 5thly , If that Body that was nailed to the Cross , was but as a Garment , which the true Christ did wear , or as a House in which he did dwell : why may not any other Man in whose Flesh Christ is manifested , and doth dwell , be called the Christ , as well as Jesus of Nazareth ? Answ. There 's not the same Reason for any other man to be Called the Christ. 1st . Because of his divine Pre-existence , both before he took upon him that Body or Flesh , and before man or other things were made , which God created by Jesus Christ. 2dly , Because of his Miraculous Conception , as Concerning that Body . 3dly , Because he was anointed with the Oyl of Gladness above his Fellows . Lastly , He that compared that Body or Flesh , which he took upon him to a Garment or House , intended no Detraction from the Honour or Dignity of the true Christ ; for his Flesh was called the Vail , his Body , the Body of Jesus , this Temple , the Form of a Servant , and his Saints are his Members . 6thly , If you own the man Christ , why do you affirm it a Contradiction to say , he is God , of the Substance of the Father and yet truly man , made like unto us in all things , sin only excepted ? For either he must be meer Man or 〈◊〉 ; or else it cannot be any Contradiction . And if you say , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Man , then you seem to side with those Jews that 〈◊〉 Saviour for Blasphemy , in that being a Man he made 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , Joh. ●…0 . 33. and if you say , he is meer God ; doth it not then clearly follow you deny the man Christ ? Answ. Thou hast herein Queried like a disingenious Shuffler , to obscure thy own self-Contradiction , and to reproach us ; whereas thy Contradiction was not between Jesus Christ's being of the Substance of the Father , and yet truly Man in time , but between his being from everlasting the Son of God by eternal generation ( or of the substance of the Father ) and thy asserting , that Jesus Christ consisteth of human Flesh and Bone , which ( to be sure ) the Substance of the Father doth not consist of . But Let H. G. and his Assistants Shuffle off this Contradiction if they can . But 't is no Contradiction to say that the Son of God in his divine being , is God , and that he took upon him the pure being of Man , and a body prepared for him , and is the heavenly Man , the Anointed of God. 7thly , I query , whether you own any other Resurrection then what ( you say ) you experience within ? Answ. We believe and own a farther Attainment of the Resurrection ( which with respect to a future State in Glory may be called another ) then what we yet experience , though we have attained to a good Degree and Experience of our rising in and with Christ , who is the Resurrection and the Life , and in him is the Saints everlasting Rest and Glory . 8thly , Whether you believe that that body of Flesh and Bone , which is laid in the Grave ( respecting the Matter or Substance of it * ) shall by the mighty Power of God be raised from the dead at thelast day ? Answ. As Flesh and Blood shall not inherit the Kingdome of God ; so I query , how the same Flesh and Bone 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●…lood should inherit the Kingdome of God ? or how 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be the same ( Flesh Blood and Bones ) after 〈◊〉 to dust without any new Creation , as some Baptists affirm ? 9thly , Whether that man ( whosoever he be ) doth not deny the Refurrection of the dead , who doth deny the same IT which is sown ( and shall rise ) mentioned 1 Cor. 5. 38. 〈◊〉 Intend the same Body ( respecting the Matter or Substance of it ) which was buried and laid in the Grave ? Answer plainly without Equivocation . Answ. There is an Ambiguity and Fallacy in this Question ; for in some Sence a Man may deny that the self same IT which is sown shall rise ( as the Apostle did , where he answered such Querists as thou art ; Thou Fool , thou sowest not that Body that shall be : for which he Instanceth Wheat or other Grain ) and yet not deny that IT which is raised , nor the Resurrection of the dead ; though that IT which is the natural Body , and that IT which is the spiritual Body , are not both one and the self same ; neither are celestial and ●…errestrial Bodies one and the same . * And what that IT is , to which God giveth a Body as it pleaseth him ; ( and to every Seed his proper Body , ) And what is that body given to it these Baptists have not yet resolved ; nor given a sensible Answer to ; Although Thd. Hicks , faith , That the Body given to it is the same , for Substance the same that was sown , ( viz. the body of Flesh and Bone●… In this many of them agree . ) But their Elder Brother , Thomas Collier appears of another mind in his Marrow of Christianity ; where concerning the Resurrection , he saith This Truth is by some denyed , and by others too carnally looked upon , some thinking that our Bodies of Flesh shall be raised , in the same Form in which it dyed , &c. p. 93. And further he saith ; That the Form in which they shall be raised that is in a Spiritual Form , not in a Fleshly , for as the Spirit of Christ raiseth us up in the S●…irit , while we are here ; so it shall raise up our Bodies in the Spirit at the Last Day ; it is Sown a Natural Body , it is raised a Spiritual Body , &c. p. 94. Col. 3. 3. When Christ , who is our Life , shall apear , we shall appear with him in Glory , all Flesh shall be swallowed up in Spirit and our Bodies shall be changed and made like his Glorious Body ; all things that offend shall be done away , and we shall be made Eternal , one in the Father and in the Son , and in the Spirit , &c. One in Glory , this for the Saints is enough to know ; besides , what shall be we do not know , it is an Height and Depth , a Length and Breadth unsearchable , p. 95 . Thus far Tho. Collier . These passages of his , I desire that Henry Grigg , Thomas Hicks , and William Burnet , &c. may consider , and compare with their own carnal Conceits and Doctrines , about the same Flesh ; and see how Inconsistent they are : It s evident that : Thomas Collier , did aim at more Spirituallity in the Resurrection , then these men do , he confessing , It should be in a Spiritual Form , and not in a Fleshly ; and that it is by some too carnally lookt upon , &c. And Indeed , it is too much Carnality , and Grosness of Opinions and Thoughts : that darken too many from a spiritual Apprehension and divine Understanding of Things Eternal and States Immortal ; which are only and truly seen in the Light , which is Divine , and Revealed by the Eternal Spirit , through which ●…nly the things of God are Truly Known . THE CONTENTS OF A Bill of Excommunication , Exhibited by the Baptists at CHICHESTER ; Together with a Brief Answer thereunto . THe Evils for which the Church of Christ Meeting at Chichester have cast out of her Communion John Richardson . Answ. We deny you to be the Church of Christ ; you do but presume and beg the Matter in Controversie ; you are in Envy and Darkeness , as will further appear from your Blasphemy against the Light ; for if we say , we have Fellowship with God , and walk in Darkness , we lye and do not the Truth ; but you pretend your selves to be his Church , consequently , to have Fellowship with him , and yet both walk in Darkness , and slight the Light within , and dispise Exhortation to harken to it ; therefore you lye ( in saying you are the Church of Christ ) and do not the Truth ; so that in the Name and Power of the Lord Jesus Christ , we deny your pretended Power and Authority of Excommunication and Condemnation . First , For withdrawing himself from the Church of Christ refusing to come to her Assemblies which practise is sin . Answ. You blind and confused Men ; did you not say just before , that your Church had cast him out of her Communion : but now you excommunicate him for withdrawing himself from you : It seems then , he excommunicated himself , there was no need of your Excommunication . 2dly , For siding and taking Part with William Steel , in some of these things for which the Church did deal with W. S. Answ. What these things are , will further appear hereafter , together with these Baptist's Envy and gross Ignorance . 3dly , For siding , owning and mixing with the People called Quakers , who are of diabolical heritical Opinions , who under Pretence of Preaching up , that all Persons should harken to a Light within , do say , that Light is Christ. Answ. Oh you malicious Blasphemers , you dark Cheats , and blind Guides : is it either diabolical or heretical to preach that all Persons should hearken to a Light within ? Or , that Christ is that true Light , that enlighteneth every Man coming into the World ? For that 's the Quakers Doctrine ; and that in him was Life , and the Life was the Light of Men ; is it diabolical , that they should take heed to this Life or Light which is both supernatural and divine ? Oh you dark , sottish , NightDreamers , when will you come out of your gross Darkness ? In which saying of theirs , there is these two abominable Lyes , first Lye , is their saying , that Christ is in every Man that cometh into the World , whereas the Scriptures say , where Christ is in Persons , the Body is dead to sin , &c. there is a People without God and Christ — in a reprobate State , in a Course of Life unapproved of God — though under a Profession , as the Church at Corinth was — surely then may such be accounted without Christ , that are neither under a Profession nor Practice . Answ. 1 You might as well deny Christ's Divinity and Deity , or his being the Eternal Word , as deny him to be that Light that enlightens every Man , or his Life to be the Light of Men. 2. Again , It s not our Doctrine to say , that Christ is so in every Man , prevailing or ruling , as that the Body is dead to Sin , nor is he revealedly or unitedly in every man ; which the Phraise , Christ in you , or Christ dwelling in you , imports and includes the Saints being in him , as he saith , I in them and they in me ; yet in some Sence , he is in all , and through all ; or else he could not be God , nor Omni-present ; and some Baptists themselves have confest , that Christ in Respect of his divine Nature , is every where ; therefore he must needs be in Man ; and in Respect to his divine Nature , he is God , and God is Light , and in him is no Darkness at all : They that are without God , and without Christ , and Reprobates , &c. Ephes. 2. 11 , 12. 2 Cor. 13. 5. 2 Joh. 9. they are without God and Christ , or as being Strangers to both , and without the true and living Knowledge of them not as if God or his Light were limitted to a Distinct or Remoteness of Place from them . For then , how were he either infinite or omni-present ? But , as he was in the World , and the World was made by him , and the World knew him not , so some are without God ; and know ye not how that Jesus Christ is in you , except you be Reprobates ? But you know not either Jesus Christ or his Light in you , who are blaspheming against his Light that is in every Man. And having taken up the diabolical Conceit of having a Christ in every Man ; then followeth the next notorious damnable Heresie ; namely , That Persons are to hear this their new conceited Christ , viz. The Light within ; and so by this mears , preach down the Authority of the Scriptures ; and so end●…avour to undermine the true Gospel-Faith and Practise of Gos●…el Appointments . Answ. 1. If it be a diabolical Conceit , that Christ is in some sence or degree in every man ; then your own Brethren are guilty thereof , whose Concession is , that his divine Nature is every where ; but I deny your Charge , it being blasphemous . 2. Your calling the Light within , a conceited Christ , and notorious damnable Heresie , that persons are to hear the Light within . This containes a two-fold blasphemy , both against the divine Principle of Light , and Doctrine directing to it ; for the Life which was in the Eternal Word , is that Light of Men which we affirm they ought to turn to , fear and obey , or else they perish ; and so will you , if you continue in your Darkness , Envy and Blasphemy against the Light within . 3. You grosly bely us , in accusing us with preaching down the Authority of the Scriptures , underminding the Gospel Faith and appointments in our preaching up the Light within ; for without the minding and following the Light within , Men can neither truly understand the Scriptures , nor come into the fulfilling of them , nor acceptably practice the Lord's Requirings or Appointments in the Gospel and new Covenant : And now comes into the true Gospel-Faith ; but they that obey and believe in the Light , as Christ commanded , when he said , believe in the Light , that you may be the Children of the Light , you theresore who term this either damnable Heresie , or a conceited Christ , are guilty of damnable Doctrine against Christ's Doctrine and Light within : Had you been in his Dayes , its probable you would have joyned with the hypocritical Jews who persecuted Christ , with your Bill of Excommunication against him and his Apostles . By such a Scriptureless Notion as is [ Harken to the Light within ] which Saying , is not only Scriptureless , but against the Scriptures , or the Way of God noted in the Scriptures of Truth . Answ. You have said your worst against the Light within before , shewing that you do not harken to the Light of Christ within , but to your own Darkness within ; however that you may see your Ignorance , & be convinc'd , that to harken , to obey , or believe in the Light within , is neither against the Scriptures , nor any Scriptureless Notion , as you falsly call it : See , Joh. 1. 4. 9. Act. 26. 18. Joh. 12. 36. Psa. 56. 13. Job . 25. 3. 1 Joh. 1. 7. Isa. 2. 5. 2 Cor. 4. 6. Rev. 21. 24. 1 Joh. 2. 9 , 10. For when Saul ( who afterwards was called Paul ) was converted , the Lord did not say , harken to the Light within thee ; but go to Ananias , &c. Nor when the Angel was sent to Cornelius , did he Say , Harken to the Light within ? but send for Peter , &c. Nor those that enquired of the Apostles what to do , the Connsel was not , Harken to the Light within , but Repent and be Baptized , Act. 2. Answ. How grosly , silly and false is your arguing Assertion ( which is but Mat. Caffin's old Stufflong since answer'd ) for was not Paul converted to the Light within , when he was sent to turn others from Darkness to Light ? and what was that that prict him before ? and could either hehave a Vision of Ananias , or Ananias a Vision of him as praying , or could he be filled with the holy Ghost , as Ananias told him without respect to the Light within ? How could he receive the pouring forth or Gift of the holy Ghost without regarding the Light within ? And what is that in the Conscience , which the Preaching of the Gospel is manifest unto ? And did not Peter preach him and his Name to whom all the Prophets gave Witness ? Act. 10. 43. And was not he that Light of the Gentiles promised ? And did not Peter bear witness to the Light shining in a dark Place ? 2 Pet. 1. 19. But your councel excludes the Light , and is not to harken to it , and yet exhort People to repent and be Baptized ; it seems then they must do both these in Darkness : Oh Ignorant Men ! how do you lead silly Women Captive blinsdold , and in darkness into your Water-Baptism you never knew the Nature of true Repentance ( nor the Spirit 's Baptism ) through which the Mind is changed from Darkness and Sin to Light and Righteousness . And when the Man that came to Christ to know what to do to Inherit eternal Life , Christ did not say , Harken to the Light within , Mar. 10. 17. Nor when Christ sent the Gospel to be preached to all Nations , he did not say , that such as harkened to a Light within should be saved , but he that believed and should be baptized should be saved , Mar. 16. 15. 16. Answ. This Argues still your continued Darkness , that is to be felt ; Can men believe , in herit eternal Life , keep the Commands of God , or be saved , and yet continue in Darkness , as you do who shut out the Light , and divert Peoples Minds from it , as much as in you lyes ? Besides , you bely both Christ and the Apostles ; for they preached up the Light within . As for your Water-Baptism , it is not the saving Baptism , as you Imply contrary to divers of your Brethren's Confessions , and to Peter's Testimony 1 Pet. 3. 21. But you are for believeing and being baptized ; but not to harken to the Light within , wherefore we deny your dark and dead Faith , and your Night-Dipping ; for you are in the dark in all you do , you are out of the Righteousness of Faith which directs man to the Word that is nigh , even in the Heart , to obey it and do it . For his not only taking that Scriptureless Liberty to go to a People that he before knew to be a people , who preach down the Way of Gospel Appointments , but doth now himself plead for a Light within , as that which he is to be guided by , and not by the Scriptures , to judge whether that be Light or Darkness within him . Answ. 1. Your Charge of preaching down the Way of Gospel Appointments is false ; yet we deny , that you have a Commission from Christ to Baptize or plunge People in Water . 2. To be guided by the Light within , is that you still boggle at ; but is this Matter worthy of Excommunication ? the Darkness wherein you walk is sufficiently manifest , and therein you undertake to judge by the Scriptures , without the Guidance of the Light , that gave them forth , though the Light be most sufficient to discover it self and to make manifest all things that differ : for whatsoever things are reproved are made manifest by the Light. Though Christ said , take heed least the Light within thee be not Darkness . Answ. There were those that put Light for Darkness , and Darkness for Light , as you do ; in which Sence Christ gives this Caution , if the Light that is in thee be Darkness , how great is that Darkness ? Therefore it could not be really Light , neither can real Light be properly counted Darkness . And for the Rule by which Christ saith , we shall be tryed at the great and last Day , is what he had spoken to the Sons of Men when in Person among them , Joh. 12. 48 , 49. but now saith . J. R. we must try the Scriptures by the Light within . Answ. The Words should rather be [ We must make use of the Scriptures by the Light within ] but Christ doth not say , that the Rule by which you shall be tryed at the last Day , is the Scriptures ; you pervert his Sayings ; but he sayes , he that rejecteth me and receiveth not my Words , hath one that Judgeth him , the Word , &c. Joh. 12. 48. For God will judge the secrets of Men by Christ Jesus ; and his living Word ( Christ being the universal Judge , and by his Law in them , their own Thoughts and Consciences bearing Witness in that day , for or against them : Howbe it , the Jews that sinned in the Law , were also Judged by the Law ( o●… Scriptures ) for rejecting Christ , and so are you also , for contemning his Light within . Oh horrible Prophanness ! that ever any should dare to set up their own whimsical Imaginations above Christ's Sayings ; and not only so , but condemn them where their erroneous Opinions cannot own them . Answ. We perceive you have not one good Word for the Light within ; you have called it as bad as you can ; one while a diabolical Conceit , another while Damnable Heresie , another while their new conceived Christ , another while scriptureless Notions , another while Darkness , and now tels of whimsical Imaginations ; but erroneous opinions and ●…phemous , too are your own ; and you have most 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 us ; for Christ's Light within cannot lead us either to slight or condemn his sayings , but to fulfil them . For refusing to hear the Counsel of the Church , wherein the Churches Endeavours have been to convince him of his Errors and to reclaim him . Answ. It is easy to see what a Church you are , that blasphemes against the Light within , and do not admit of it in any Duty : a sad Church , thus to shut out and contemn the Light you are in thick Darkness until now ; your Envy greatly blinds you ; Therefore it is well not to hear your Counsel , seeing that it is to perswade us , not to harken to the Light within , and we will never harken to your darkness , nor be led blindfold by you blind Guides . And for the Churches Authority to Excommunicate Persons guilty as aforesaid , see 2 Thes. 3. 6. Rom. 16. 17. Mat. 18. 17 , &c. The Apostles Way was one and the same in Every Church , 1 Cor. 4. 17. Written by me W. Flecher , W. Claton . Answ. The true Church's Authority was given her by Christ , who is the true Light , and this we own , and reverence the Power the Apostles had ; but you falsly assume a Power , and pretend their Authority to excommunicate Persons for professing and owning his Light within ; and ( it seems ) to cast out such as you needed not , who with-draw themselves from you ; whereas the true Church never cast out nor excommunicated Persons sor owning the Light within , but for running into the Deeds of Darkness : theresore in the Name and Power of our Lord Jesus Christ we deny you , who are called Baptists and Anabaptists , to be the Church of Christ ; we deny your Authority ; we deny your Excommunication ; we deny your blasphemous and scornful Doctrine against the Light within , and Exhort you to leave your Envy , and turn from your Darkness ; and condemn your Blasphemy , and imbrace the Light of Christ within ; lest you perish in your Darkness and Gainsaying . Note that some of the Baptists and Apostates have upbraided us for Excommunicating persons out of our society ; but we never Excommunicated any for owning the Light within , but for their unfruitful works of Darkness . Hereafter follows a Rebuke to the Baptists and their Zion , or Church , from some of their Own Ministring Brethren , given out when they were more tender and free from Prejudice then now they are ; and have confessed to those Truths ( viz ) the Immortal Seed , the Light , Trembling at God's Majesty , Travil of Soul , the Inward work , and Perfection , which now divers of them deride and oppose ; also their reigning Abominations are confessed , which since are greatly increased against the Light , which then made some of them 〈◊〉 of their Iniquities , and to bewail them . And this is recited , for these Baptists and their Hearers , to Remind them of the former Tenderness and Desires in some of their Brethren after an Amendment among them , and that these our present Opposers may consider and see how greatly they are declined , hardened and Apostatized from th●… good that formerly was stirring among them : 〈◊〉 all which I desire their Return , Repentance and Conversion to the true Light , that they may have regard to the Inward Work of God , to break their Hearts , and work out their Abominations , Pride and Envy , &c. Some Confessions concerning the baptized Churches , made by their Messengers in their bewailing Epistle from Twerton , dated the 18th Day of the 7th Month , 1657. and signed in their Names , and by their Appointments , by Thomas Colliar , Nath●…niel Strange and Thomas Glass , and directed , viz. TO all the Churches of Jesus Christ , called to be Saints , through the Immortal Seed (a) which dwelleth in you , and shall be with you forever . A few poor Worms — we would labour night and day , warning every one of you , striving with you , and together with God for you , that every one of you may be presented perfect (b) in Christ Jesus — The several Weights that lie upon you and us — we have been ready to cry out , we are cut off from before thine Eyes — while we carryed the Yoakes and Burthens of Zion , and have been as the Souls under the Altar , crying , how long Lord , holy and true — The Lord hath lightned us , while we thus looked unto him — we could not be satisfied with Life for our selves , (c) Some Revivings have attended our Souls — and now , as we have been faithful for you to God ; So we would now be faithful for God to you . We have been arraigning the Abominations of Zion besore the Bar of the most high ; we have been crying for Justice from the Throne upon every Sin , for Strength and Light , (d) to purge our every persisting impenitent Sinner , as Enemies and Traitors to the Crown & Dignity of our Lord Jesus : More particularly , we have made Confession of those reigning Abominations (e) in our own Souls , and in the Churches , of that light Spirit living short of the true Sight and Sense of God's Majesty , in his Churches , and among his Saints , from whence proceeds that Vanity and Carelesnes which doth so much attend them . We have bewailed that wretched , worldly Spirit , that plucks down the Saints from their Excellency , and leaves such Blackness upon them (f) which renders them so uncomely in the Eyes of Men. We have bewailed that Coldness and Deadness that is upon our selves , and upon the Churches ; that Formality in holy Duties , that Indifferency , and that Laodicean Spirit that is fallen in upon us (g) while we have been crying , let him make Speed and hasten his Work , that we may see it ; let the Counsel (h) of the Lord come that we may know it ; and all this while , we have been drawing Iniquity with Cords of Vanity , having been in a great Measure , as without the Sense of the Work ; so without the true Travil of Soul (i) which this Work should put us into — the Crown is fallen from Sion's Head by Reason of her Iniquity ; we have been bewailing personal Iniquity , Congregational Iniquity , National Iniquity , Family Iniquity , Closet Iniquity ; we have by Search found poor Sion , as it were without Soundness (k) from the Crown of the Head to the Sole of the Foot , ful of Bruises and putrified Sores ; your own poor Souls are in Distress , Heaven and Earth seem to frown — Oh! come down , sit in the Dust — and weep bitterly before the Lord for all your Abominations (l) you have but as it were , played with God ; you have not trembled in his Presence (m) you have been wanton before him , having been without the Terrour of his Majesty ; therefore you have confessed , and have delighted to word (n) it out with the Lord — Oh! how often have you mocked God ? — It appears already how God takes it at your Hands ; We have begged him to save us , yet this once more , and truly we tremble — the Hope that is in Isra●…l — lies in your putting from you that accursed Thing ; Oh! now if you would pursue this Worldliness , this Coldness and Sloathfulness , your personal Neglects , your Family Neglects — how doth the World , as a Canker , eat out your Affections to the Lord Jesus , eat out your Time , your Strength , your Zeal , while you have been asleep in the Lap of this Da●…ilah , your Locks have been cut off , and you are but as other Men (o) whoever beholds you may say , what singular thing do ye ? Now then lay to Heart these crying Abominations — the World is too beautiful — this hath bewitched — you have fallen before your Enemies (p) — this Iniquity hath been apparently written upon your Fore-heads , witness your Remissness in Meetings , your Neglect or the poor Saints & Ministers of Christ , whose daily Complaints and Addresses (q) are living Monuments of this reigning Abomination , your Cruelty to Servants , Children , exacting all their Labours , but take no Time to counsel them , instruct them that are without Christ , that miserable Estate wherein they are — this hath made Professors Families so dry (q) useless and unprofitable — this Sin eats out all of that divine Sweetness of regenerating , sanctifying Grace : We have mourned (r) in that we have had so great a hand in this Trespass , in not bearing so faithful a Testimony against it in our Ministry ; but slavish Fear of being accounted selfish , or the like , hath stopt our Mouth (s) until the Mouth of this Iniquity hath almost devoured the poor Churches of Christ — That of Sloathfulness and Carelesness , another reigning Evil — They are Evils rooted deeply in the Heart ; it is hard to get them out (t) They are Sermon-Proof and Epistle-Proof ; so strong , that they have wrested all Weapons out of the hands of Saints and Ministers , that have been formed against them : Now we desire we may no longer rest in a Testimony of Words , but proceed to take some effectual Course , that Sin or Sinners may be purged out (v) of the house of God ; in order to this , we desire the Churches , that they would set some day or dayes a part , wherein they may bewail the Iniquities and Pollutions o●… Zion before the Lord — also , that the Ministring Brethren would without Respect of Persons (w) bear their constant Testimony — warning every one to f●…ee from these Abominations — Another Evil we had Thought to have spread before you (x) for want of Opportunity , we shall now omit , yet desire you to lay it to Heart . THE Presbyter's Antidote TRYED , Or Stephen Scandret ( with his Antidote against Quakerism ) Proved a PHYSICIAN of No Value ; AND The Truth plainly asserted and vindicated in divers Weighty Points , against both the Imperfect and corrupt Work of S. S. and his Masters , the Assembly of Divines ( so called , who sat at Westminster in the long Parliament's Time ) and of the general Assembly of the Kirk of Scotland , about their Confession of Faith , which was first printed at Edenburg , and after reprinted at London , Anno 1651. G. W. Ye are all Physicians of no Value , Job . 13. 4. Printed in the Year 1673. THE Presbyter's Antidote TRYED , &c. CHAP. I. A Comprehensive Account concerning the Rule , the Light , and Scripture , Explaining both ●…ur sense of the terms and S. Scandret's ; together with the Assemblies Confession about the Scriptures . BY the word [ RULE ] we understand , 1st , The Power of Government , and Authority to order and rule , in the Sense that in the first Creation the greater Light was set to rule the Day , Gen. 1. 16. or for the Rule and Order of the Day : So in the new Creation the divine Light of Christ , the Son of Righteousness , doth govern and rule in the Order of his Everlasting Day in the Souls of the Righteous ; the Path of the Just being this shining Light , which shineth more and more until this perfect Day . 2ly , So this divine Light is truly the only Rule , for its being most eminent ( above all outward Rules and Prescriptions ) ●…or its Power , Glory , Virtue , Order , and Government ( as Rule of Life ) in all the Children of Light. The only trying and discovering Rule , for its manifesting whatsoever things are reproveable , Ephes. 5. 13. whether they be Spirits , Works or Words ; and he that doth Truth , cometh to the Light , that his Deeds may be made mani●…est , that they are wrought in God , Joh. 3. 21. 3dly , By only Rule , An universal , manifest , publick Standard ●…or Truth and Righteousness , in the Consciences , of all People and Nations , and against all Sin , Wickedness and Unrighteousness ; and so is the S piritual and Divine Light of the Son of God , in whom was Life , and the Life was the Light of Men , Joh. 1. 4. whose Life is Supernatural , Increated and Incorruptible , Christ the divine Word being that true Light that inlightens every Man coming into the World , vers . 9. 4thly , Concerning that heavenly Gift , or divine Manifestation within , which was the Saints Rule of Life , the Apostle Paul thus speaketh , 2 Cor. 10. 13. But we will not boast of things without our Measure ; but according to the measure of the Rule , which God hath distributed to us , &c. ver . 15. not boasting of things without our Measure , that is of other mens Labours ; but having Hope when your Faith is increased , that we shall be enlarged by you , according to our Rule abundantly , vers . 16. not to boast in another Mans Line of things made ready to our hand ; And Philip. 3. 16. whereto ye have already attained , let us walk by the same Rule , let us mind the same thing , Gal. 5. 15. and 16. for in Christ Jesus , neither Circumcision , nor Uncircumcision availeth any thing , but a new Creature ; and as Many as walk according to this Rule , Peace be on them . By all which note , that there was an universal , divine and spiritual Rule , dist●…ibuted of God to the true Believers , and new Creatures in Christ , in whom stood their several Attainments and Growths ( and this was not other mens Lines nor the Letter ) wherein they were mutually enlarged : nor could the Letter be this Rule , for that required Circumcision what then was Paul's Rule , for denying it , but the Spirit of Li●…e , the new Covenant , the Immediate Dictates of the holy Ghost ? see Act. 15. 24 , 28. Heb. 8 , 9 , 10. By the Word Scriptures we understand , not only Writings in general , but particularly all the holy Scriptures contained in the Bible , not excluding those many Writings of Prophets and Apostles , which are not inserted in the Bible , which contain a Plurality of Words of Truth , Commands , Prescriptions , Precepts , &c. ( and in that Sense ) Rules or Directions , relating to both the old and new Covenant ; and to divers States , Occasions and Dispensations , many of which are abolisht with the old Covenant , which therefore cannot properly ( in the Singular ) be called the Rule , or one Intire full Rule , much less the only Rule ( with Exclusion of all others , as falfe as S. S. very blasphemously doth ) the Chiefest and highest Rule , as he unscripturally and erroneously calls them ; for the Spirit or Light that first gave them forth with its Immediate Illumination , Motions , and Directions , being both before and higher then the Scriptures or Writings , how true soever they be . So , though we confess the holy Scriptures to contain true Words , Commandments , Precepts , Directions ( and so Rules ) yet it 's no more proper to call them the only highest Rule and Guide to Heaven and Glory ( as S. S. doth ) then to call them the only highest Word , Commandment and Light , which they are not : We can neither call the Scriptures God , nor Christ , nor the Light , nor the Spirit , nor the Power of God ; but Innocently and simply as they term or call themselves , owning them in the true Light given us , according to the true Intent , Purpose and End , for which they were first given out from divine Inspiration ; for which none that are Ingenuous will Blame us : for , the Word lives forever ; It 's setled in Heaven ; It 's also to be known and felt nigh in the Heart ; and it is the holy and living Commandment of Power , which is called Life Everlasting , and this is Immediate . This Word was to David a Light , and Lanthorn to his Paths ; and therefore his only Way and Rule to Felicity : Yea , for its Eminency it may be truly esteemed the Word of Words , the Commandment of Commandments , the Rule of Rules , that divine Light , wherein consists the Government , Rule and Order of the Everlasting Day of Salvation , Glory and Life , to all the Children of the Day , who in order to that Attainment , have obeyed and followed the Degree and Measure of this true and divine Light in its Manifestation in them . The Scriptures also ( or Bible ) contain many various Passages , as well Historical as Doctrinal , even of the Examples of Men in the fallen State , of things done in the time of Ignorance , and of the Failings and Weaknesses of divers , of things transacted and do●…e in a Time and State not sutable to that of Man in the beginning , nor to that of the Gospel or new Covenant : As for any Man to have divers Wives , or many Concubines at once ; it was not so in the Beginning , nor ought to be so now , yet such things are recorded in Scripture of divers ; Therefore 't is both Gross , Impious , and Contradictory for any to count the whole Bible the Rule of Life , and Duty without Exemption , according to our Opposer , p. 61. Moreover , for his Asserting the Scriptures Infallibility , and as so being the highest Rule , * He neither puts a Limitation of what part of the Scripture or Bible he intends , nor yet tells us in what Language , Copy or Translation they are infallible ; for every Rule whether moral or artificial , ought to be infallible , otherwise 't is n●… Rule , but therein lyes obscure under Ambiguities : Howbeit , we may suppose he means , according to his Masters , the Assembly of pretended Divines , Confes. Chap. 1. where having declared , that the holy Scriptures are given by Inspiration of God to be the Rule of Faith and Life , they add Artic. 8. The old Testament in Hebrew ( which was the Native Language of the People of God of old ) and the new Testament in Greek ( which at the time of the writing of it was most generally known to the Nations ) being immediately Inspired by God , and by his singular Care and Providence kept pure in all Ages , are therefore Authentical , so as in all Controversies of Religion the Church is finally to appeal to them ( thus far the Assembly ) From hence it follows , that when Steph. Scandret and these his Masters tell us , that the Scriptures are the chief and highest Rule , the only Infallible Rule to Heaven and Glory , or the Rule of Faith and Life , and to decide Controversies , we are to understand it is as they are in Hebrew and Greek , and as in the first Copies as given by Divine Inspiration , by which these men still lead people in the dark and in Doubtfulness , at a Distance from Life and Glory , and Ignorant of the Rule , and Way thereto ; implying this Difficulty , that they must first learn Hebrew and Greek , and be ascertained of the truth of the Copies , as concurring with the first ; And this must be from their own knowledge ( not from the Priests Interpretations and various Meanings ) and yet the Assembly and S. S. still fall short of clearing the matter of the Greek , not resolving which is the true infallible Copy , there being divers Greek Lections or Copies of the new Testament : But further , if they could produce or evince the first Copy , or that which most agrees with it , while they prefer the Writing as the chief or only Rule of Faith and Life , they leave people in Darkness and Death , in not referring them to the Inward Divine Light or Inspiration of the Almighty , as the chief and only Rule , which gave forth the holy Scriptures , and without which they cannot be truly understood in any Language . Moreover , concerning the Hebrew W. Tindal ( of whose Translation we have one ancient English Bible without Verses ) in his Prologue prefixt in some Bibles , he saith thus , viz. W. Tindal unto the Christian Reader . If ought seem Changed , or not altogether agreeing with the Greek , let the Finder of the Fault consider the Hebrew Phrase , or Manner of Speech left in the Greek Words , whose Preterperfect Tense and Present Tense is oft both one ; and the Future Tense is the Optative Mood also ; and the Future Tense is oft the Imperative Mood in the Active Voyce , and in the Passive ev●…r ; likewise Person for Person ; Number for Number , and Interrogation for a Conditional ; and such like is with the Hebrews and Common usage [ and he further adds ] if I shall perceive , either by my self , or by the Information of others , that ought be escaped me , or might be more plainly Translated , I will shortly after cause it to be amended ; howbeit , in many places , me thinketh it better to put a Declaration in the Marg●…nt then to run too far from the Text. Now , from hence considering the Difficulty of truly translating the Scriptures from the Hebrew , both as to Time , Manner , Voice , Person , Number , and Condition , &c. how easily herein may the Sense be greatly changed , and how this ingenuous Translator himself doth not place Infallibility upon his Work or Translation from the Hebrew , but ingenuously proffereth Amendment of it , if either by himself or an others Information he shall perceive a Deficiency in which he hath done ; and also considering what Irreconcileable Controversies have been among many counted Learned , about the Translations in divers Places of Scriptures , and how many Amendments have from Time to Time been made upon them , and even how many various English Translations we have , what Dubiousness and Uncertainty are both Priests and People in , both as to Rule , Faith , and Foundation of their Religion , who neither know nor own the Principle of true Knowledge , and divine Understanding ( which is God's Gift ) while they have no regard to divine Illumination — as the Rule of Faith , before the Scriptures ; but do cry and set up , one while a meer Translation or Reading ( which to them may be dubious ) as their only highest infallible Rule of Faith ; another while their own uncertain Meanings , private Conceptions , and fallible Interpretations upon the Scriptures , they set up as the Rule and Judge over them , ( as their Phrase hath been ) to Reconcile the Scriptu●…es , which ( as given by divine Inspiration ) cannot be broken . And while still their Work tends to divert peoples Minds from depending upon the Spirit of Truth , and its Inlightning , as the chief and only infallible Guide and Rule , where will they center ? and what a Babylonish Structure do they erect upon their uncertain Conjectures and dubious Interpretations , from their fallible Spirits and Judgments ? And to place Infallibility upon the Letter , or Writing , or English Translation ; whereas W. Tindal , a Translator himself did not attribute this to his Translation , nor divers others in their putting many marginal Notes upon some English Bibles , as from the Hebrew and Greek ; and even their learned D. Ce●…l , set forth a large Book in Folio , entituled , An Essay to the Amendment of the Last English Translation of the Bible , wh●… he finds fault with , and corrects several noted Places ; and what less is signified in their ample Annotations , and manifold Notes upon some Bibles ? And moreover , when some of the Clergy have made that of Job 2. 9. their Texit , viz. that Job's Wife said unto him , Curse God 〈◊〉 dye ; they have told People , that that Hebrew Text signifieth , Bless God and dye ; and some take it so , as to desire humbly of God , that he might dye ( which arguing Impatiency was reproveable ) others , that it was , Curse God and dye ( which was much more reproveable , not only as Foolishness but Wickedness ) And concerning that of Saul and the Witch of Endor , his bidding her bring him up Samuel , it 's said , And when the Woman saw Samuel , ver . 12. and Saul know , that it was Samuel , vers . 14. And Samuel , said unto Saul , why hast thou disquieted me , &c. ver . 15. then said Samuel , ver . 16. So the matter runs in Samuel's name ; Whereas those of the Clergy have told us it was Satan , and that Saul spake according to his gross Ignorance , not considering the slate of the Saints after this Life , and how Satan hath no Power over them , it was Satan who to blind Saul's Eyes took upon him the Form of Samuel , &c. Now seeing this Interpretation is so plainly contrary to the Words themselves ( for which I blame them not in this , though in many others I do ) I query , how the●… agrees this with their placing Infallibility upon the Scriptures , not only on the Doctrinal , but on the Historical Part , when they are minded to oppose the Sufficiency of the Light of Christ within ? Many more Instances might be brought to shew their vast Variations from the Letter of the Scriptures in their Interpretations : By the Tenor of all which Discourse before of this Import , it 's evident , that their Confession ( at least of many of them ) is , that a●…l the Scriptures are not Infallible ; but some Corrupted in the various Translations , ●…hers , not to be taken meerly as the Words import . Howbeit for all this , many Priests and Professors , for their own Ends , if they be about to oppose the Light within or divine Illumination , and the Sufficiency of the holy Spirit 's Teaching , denying it to be either the Rule of Faith or Life , or sufficient to guide to Heaven without the Scriptures ( which argues their gross and carnal Diffidence and sinful Unbelief ) then in plain Contradiction , they place all the Infallibility and sole Sufficiency therein upon the Scriptures , as the only highest Rule of Faith and Life , the only Rule and Way to Heaven and Glory , the only Rule totry both Doctrines and Spirits by : And here they most Idolatrously , and in a most pre●…sterous Manner , prefer the Scriptures before Christ , and set them up above the Spirit that gave them forth , while they slight and cry down the Light of Christ within , as not any Rule , &c. though it both manifests all things reproveable , and be the Prover of Deeds , whether they are wrought in God ; for which End , he that doth Truth bringeth his Deeds to the Light , Joh. 3. 19 , 20. But as Christ said to the unbelieving Jews , so it may justly be said to these Opposers of his Light within now , Ye search the Scriptures , for in them ye think to have Eternal Life , and they are they which testifie of me ; but ye will not come to me that you might have Life , Joh. 5. 39 , 40. Mark , ye will not come to Christ , that ye might have Life ; and now , the Scriptures do not direct Men to themselves for Life and Salvation , but to the Son of God , who is both the Life , the Foundation , the Way , and so the only Rule , Guide and Teacher and not the Scriptures . But why do the Presbyters of our Times so often exalt their own divers Meanings and Interpretations , as the Rule above the Scriptures , contrary to the great Stress , which at other times they lay upon the Scriptures ? So that finally , they deny both the Spirit & the Scriptures to be the Rule , setting up their own Meanings over both , being ignorant of the Scriptures and the Power of God. We may believe , that the Truth of it is , It is more consistent with their Gain and Trade of Preaching , that their Meanings should be the Rule over or above the Scriptures , then that the Scriptures should be the only or highest Rule to Heaven ( as sometimes they pretend ) for that Bibles are had at a great deal cheaper Rate , then their Trade of Preaching can be had : But then for their own Ends on the other Ha●…d , they can ( in plain self-Contradiction ) cry up the Scriptures , as the only 〈◊〉 Rule to Heaven , when their Design is to divert Peoples Minds from depending upon the DIVINE LIGHT and IMMEDIATE TEACHING OF GOD WITHIN ( for Life and Salvation ) Seeing , that it 's evident , they can more easily avoid the Scriptures Infallibility ( for their own Ends , that they may be Masters , both over the Scriptures and Mens Faith , for their Lucre and Gain ) than they can get any of the Children of Light to assist their Trade ( or any to maintain them therein ) who are turned from Darkness to the LIGHT , to wait upon the Immediate Teachings of God ; it 's easier for them to evade or dispense with the Scripture's Infallibility , then to hinder the true LIGHT WITHIN from shining in Mens Hearts ; for that is impossible for them . Again , the Scriptures were not the Presbyterians sole Rule of Faith and Practice , when they set forth their 〈◊〉 , Confession of Faith , and Scotch Covenant , agreed upon by the Kirk of Scotland and the Assembly at Westminster , which was of no small Charge : It 's easie to see , that their sole Rule ( as they have pretended the Scriptures to be ) they can easily dispense with , add to , or vary from , for their own Ends at their Pleasure , both in Doctrine , Discipline and Practice , as might be instanced , not only for their unscriptural Sprinkling Infants , but in many othe●… Traditions and Babylonish Reliques . S. Scandret ' s Sense about the Points in Controversie examined . S. S. BY the Light in every Man understand — not the Light of the Gospel , 2 Cor. 4. 4. lest the Light of the glorious Gospel should shine , &c. p. 1 , 2. Answ. The God of the World hath blinded the Minds of them that are lost , lest the Light of the glorious Gospel should shine unto them , 2 Cor. 4. 4. And this Man's Work is of the same Tendency , viz. to blind Peoples Minds , which implies , that the Light of Christ Jesus ( which is Gospel-Light ) is given to all ; but the Minds blinded by Satan oppose it . The Subject which Satan works upon and prevails with , is their Minds , not the Light. S. S. Mark , 't is not said the Light , but ( God ) hath shined , p. 7. Answ. A frivolous Exception ; Can there be such divine Shi●…ing without his divine Light ? God hath shined in our Hearts , &c. and God is Light. S. S. ( Upon Phil. 3. 16. ) The Saints were to walk according to their several Attainments what they had got out of the Scri●…s , by the same Rule , &c. p. 9. Answ. What Scriptures ? They were to walk in the Spirit , which directed their Minds to God ; that he might reveal his Mind to them : And here was the same Rule , the same Thing , the same Principle ; their several Attainments being according to their spiritual Growth in the Light. Was the Rule mentioned in 2 Cor. 10. 13. and Gal. 6. 15 , 16. to be got out of the Bible ? See this Man's gross Ignorance . S. S. Innocency , man's perfect Light must not be the whol●… his Rule , p. 11. Answ. A gross Error . God was then his perfect Light and Rule in his Teachings ; and is not that Light which is perfect whole ? S. S. We need no infallible Spirit to help to discern the Counsels of Light and Darkness in Scripture ; for all there comes from God , p. 27. Answ. He is not told this by an infallible Spirit ; for many Counsels of Darkness , Serpent and wicked Men , both against God , Christ and his People , are recorded in Scripture . And it is the Spirit of Christ which is Infallible , that truly opens and reveals the Truths in Scripture , to the Understanding of the Children of Light. S. S. The Spirit dwelling in all Believers , is sometimes a sweet Mo●…r to Duty , though no indwelling Spirit , p. 38. 〈◊〉 . Gross Ignorance and Confusion ; What! no indwelling Spirit , and yet dwelling in all Believers ? Did you ever hear such Doctrine before ? S. S. God's Commands cease not to be God's Commands ; either because the Spirit doth not within put Men on to obey them , &c. p. 38. Answ. A gross Inference against the Spirit ; for the Spirit of Truth leads true Believers into all Truth , from which no true and necessary Commands can be excluded ; unless he will say , some of them are no Truths S. S. We are to obey them , though the Spirit 〈◊〉 puts not on — otherwise , some wicked men in living contr●…ry to the Scriptures , do not sin , cannot be dam●…ed for so doing ; for s●…e have sinned away the Motions and Strivings of 〈◊〉 Spirit , p. 8. Answ. What will become of such poor ●…eople , that are fed with such Chaff and Darknes , as this ? And what is the Tendency of it , but to set 〈◊〉 on , to work in their own Wills , to set up their own 〈◊〉 , without the Movings of the Spirit of God ? ( And what will that profit them ) though without this Spiri●… , they are carnal and selfish in all their Acti●…gs and can●…t truly obey : Nor can wicked Men ( who have 〈◊〉 away its Strivings ) escape Damnation , withall S. S. ●…is pressing them to obey the Scriptures , wi●…hout the Guidance of the Spirit ; for without him we can do 〈◊〉 ; but all things through him that strengthneth us . S. S. Because a Thing is written in the Scripture , are we to do it ? — I will in God's Assistance , rowl my self , and act Faith on God and Christ , because I see the sweet Words in the Scriptures , &c. p. 38. Answ. This is a Faith of his own making , a Will acting ( that is not grounded upon the Spirit of God , and its Perswasion within ) an imperfect Imitation of the ●…etter wi●…hout the Spirit ; for he hath not an infallible Spirit o●… discerning between the Counsels of Light and Darkness in the Heart ; nor to discern those few Truths it doth reveal ( as he confesseth , p. 27. and 31 ) So that this Book of his against us , pr●…ceeded from his Darkness and fallible Spirit . But if God s Spirit teach us by the Works of Creation , and the Light in every Man propounding the Creation to be considered ; and he helps us to conclude a God thence , that he is to be worshiped , &c. for in him we live , move and have our being , as is largely confessed , p. 53. Then there is a twofold Testimony afforded of God to Mankind , viz. Immediate and Mediate , as namely , First , his Spirit or Light. 2dly , His Works of Creation , thr●…gh which his Light gives Men to consider and see God and his eternal Power , Rom. 1. and to worship him : And this Light and Works are ( and do preach forth the Power of God and his Wisdom ) where the Scriptures are not ; And therefore God affords a Sufficiency , even to the Heathens , both of Light inward , and Evidence outward , of his Power , &c. They that have the holy Scriptures in the Bible may thank God for those good Testimonies in them , as his Light within opens their Understandings in them to the Right Use of them ; A●…d they that have not the Bible , have the Book of the Creation to read in ; and the Light within to open it , and to read and understand a Deity and Divine Power through all and over all . And they that are born Deaf and Blind shall not be therefore damned ; God having afforded an invisible sufficient Light to save , being obeyed , to leave them without excufe , being disobeyed . And if by the use of Reason , the Spirit of God teacheth the Heathen moral Duties , as in p. 54. which Duties as he explains , are to love and worship God , and to love our Neighbours as our selves ; then have the Heathen , First , A supernatural and Divine Light , to wit , that of the Spirit . 2dly , His Spirit with the Teaching and Reason of it in that degree it is in them , is a Rule of Life to them that have not Scriptures ( who obey it ) And this confutes and overthrows the greater part of S. S. his Book or bundle of Confusion . S. S. Most falsly obtruds upon R. Ludgater this Concession , viz. That the Will of God , as much of it as is revealed by the Light in every man without the help of Scripture , is not the only Rule to Heaven , p. 23. And this ( sayes S. S. ) fetcht out of the very Heart-Blood of Quakery , Epist. This is a gross Abuse and Lye ; for R. L. hath a better Knowledge and Esteem of the Light of Christ in every man , and its own Sufficiency to guide the Obedient to Heaven : In him was Life , & the Life was the Light of Men , Job . 1. 4. This Life and Light of Christ being divine is therefore a sufficient Rule . Also S. S. hath abused G. W. in several places , perverting his Words , and setting down words in G. W's Name , which he never wrote nor spoak ; and in particular these words about Christ's Coming , viz. He hath tarried above Sixteen Hundred Years , p. 86. quoting Divin . of Christ , p. 49. and then to back this Abuse , and to lay Judgment 〈◊〉 G. W. brings those Scriptures , 2 Pet. 2. 3 , 4. and Mat. 4. 48. Whereas G. W's Words were quite contrary ; ●…nfessing both to Christ's Outward and Inward Coming , which ●…is Disciples did not put afar off , as you do ; it being above ●…ixteen Hundred Years since they both waited for and receiv'd ●…is Coming . Here is no such Word as that , He hath tarried so long ; we refer the Reader to the Book and Page before mentioned to see S. S's Abuse in this ; as also many more might be instanced , where instead of answering , he hath wronged and belyed our Words and Books . S. S. in p. 32. saith , though the Counsels of God's Spirit in Believers Hearts , be IN themselves as certainly the Truth of God as are his Counsels in the Scriptures ; yet are they not to Believers so certainly the Truths of God. Answ. What 's this but to tell us that the Scriptures can better ascertain us of the Truths therein then the Spirit that first gave forth those Truths ? ( or that the Spirit of Christ is Insufficient assuredly to manifest his own Counsels to Believers ) which is contrary to Christ's own Testimony , He shall guide you into all Truth ; He shall abide with you forever ; and the Sons of God are led by his Spirit ; and hereby know we that we dwell in him and be in us , because he hath given us of his Spirit , 1 Joh. 4. 13. Chap. 3. 24. Therefore this Spirit is our certain and highest Rule . And as to his pudder he makes about Water-Baptism , 't is very confused and silly ( as at the Dispute ) not plainly asserting whom he would have the Subjects of it , whether Infants or Believers ; yet brings some of the Anabaptists Arguments , though we still suppose he intends Infants , but durst not tell us whether it be his Practice now . So see what a Laborynth and Loss his Work tends to bring People to ; neither plainly telling them the Subjects , nor showing who are the Ministers of this imposed Water-Baptism , whether himself , or such as he , or who ? and yet injoyns it as a Means of Sanctification , a Means of Salvation , which we do not believe . As also he explains not his terms of the Lord's Supper , what he means by the Lord's Supper ; whether the Shaddow or the Mystery , and what is his own Practice therein ? whether he ministers Bread and Wine as a Figure , or the Substance ? And whether the Mystery or thing signified , be attained by any in this Life ? This is unanswer'd : Nor whether Shaddows be essential to the Gospel Dispensation . Concerning Justification . He hath in some degree granted to truth , that the word [ Justifie ] the Scripture sometimes useth it , to signifie [ to make Just ] by inherent Holiness , or [ to Sanctifie ] Tit. 3. 5 , 7. He saved us by the Washing of Regeneration , that being justified , &c. Herein he hath assented more to Truth , then many of his ●…rethren ; but 't is much contradicted again in his handling the matter of Imputation of Adam's Sin to those that are not Partakers of it ; and so of Christ's Obedience , p. 96. As if Adam's Sin and Christ's Righteousness , were so imputed to them who partake not of them : This we cannot own , and hath been often answered in our Books ; and much we have against this his Sense of Imputation , as also against their Opinion about personal Election and Reprobation , and the Cruelty , Partiality , and ill Consequence of the Presbyters Opinion therein ; And against S. S. his shallow and absurd managing the matter , whose manifest Contradictions were long since published , which we do not understand that he hath made any Publick Essay to reconcile : also his work about the Scriptures , Baptism and the Supper , are more particularly and fully answered elsewhere , which there hath not been ( for some time ) an oppo●…tunity to publish . CHAP. II. About JUSTIFICATION and IMPUTATION . S. S's Quest. WHether we are justified by the Righteousness of Christ imputed ? The Question would better reach the Controversie , as thus stated , viz. Whether Impure ( that is , unsanctified Persons ) while 〈◊〉 , be justified by the Imputation of Christ's Righteousness ? [ Thus I stated the Question at first , which S. S. evaded with this , viz. Whether Justification be by the Works of the Law , 〈◊〉 by the Righteousness of Christ through Faith ? No●…●…enying the former , and granting the latter , this Question will not find out the Controversie ; but rather ] Whether Christ's Righteousness be imputed unto Persons in a disobedient , unsanctisied or unconverted State ? Or , Whether Christ's Righteousness be imputed of Co●… to Persons who are not in some degree really and inwardly Partakers thereof , by the inward Work of Christ , through Faith and Sanct●…fication ? I am for the real Participation of Christ's Righteousness , and against a false Imputation of it ; but con●…ss the true Imputation of Christ's Everlasting Righteousness to true Believers , who inwardly are Partakers o●… his Work , Nature and Image , which the true Seed of Abraham in all Ages were Partakers of , whose Faith was reckoned to him ( as the Faith of all his Seed is to them ) for Righ●…ness , which was and is both real and inward . By [ the Righteousness of Christ ] I understand his everlasting Righteousness , Holiness , Faith , Nature and I●…ge , from whence his active & passive Obedience ( as in his own Person ) sprung , and that true Believers , as Partakers thereof , are accounted or esteemed of in the Sight of God , being Partakers of his Holiness , divine Nature , and renewed therein to God ; in this they are pr●…sented unto God in an absolute j●…stified State : and S. S. proceeds thus , viz. By the Word [ Justifie ] the Scripture sometimes ( but very rarely ) useth it to signifie , to make Just by inherent Holiness , or to sanctifie , Tit. 3. 5 , 7. He hath saved us by the Washing of Regeneration , that being justified , &c p. 89. Reader , Be pleased to take Notice here , how far this his Concession is to Justification in the Reality of it , as springing from the inherent Holiness or Image of Christ in a Soul ; and how this is effected through Sanctification ( and it must be from hence that the real Imputation ariseth ) and note , how herein he hath granted to the Truth of our Principle ( in the first Part ) though much of his ●…ollowing Work be contradictory to this , as will appear ; for this is to make Just by inherent Holiness , or to sanctifie ; the other is , to impute , or reckon Guilty or fallen Creatures Just : So that this Man's Imputation of Christ's Obedience , must be opposed to the real and inward Participation thereof . S. S. [ Justifie ] It is used in Contradiction to Sanctification , 1 Cor. 6. 11. but ye are sanctified , but ye are justified , &c. an●… 〈◊〉 mostly , we are therefore to take it in this latter Se I se , p. 89. Though [ Justifie ] be often in Scripture taken to declare Just or Righteous , or to accept of , as such ( as well as to make Just ) in which Sease there is a Distinction ( not a Contradiction nor Severation ) between Sanctification & Justification ; yet God never declares , accounts or accepts any as Just and Righteous , but such as are really ( in some Degree Partakers of his Righteousness in themselves , by a living Faith and Subjection to him ( there being also a time of justifying before Men are justified ) for 't is they who are of Faith that are of Abraham , whose Faith or believing God ( wherein was Obedience ) was imputed or reckoned to him for Righteousness : And true and living Faith is of the same Na●…ure still , and so is the real Imputation , which 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 God , and is evidenced unto the Soul by his S●…irit : 〈◊〉 the Truth o●… this is further confirm'd by the very Proof which 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 cit●…d be●…ore , which proves that Sanctification is previous to and joyned with Justification ; and that 't is such a 〈◊〉 ●…shed and sanctified that are justified , and t●…t in the Name of the Lord Jesus , and by the Spirit of our God , 〈◊〉 Cor. 6. 11. It was not the Unrighteous , Unconverted or Unsanctified that were justified , but the Sanctified ; and therefore it is not the guilty and unsanctified Perso●…s , applying or imputing to themselves Christ's active and passive Obedience ( as performed in his Person ) that will justifie , make or declare them just in the Sight of God ; out the inward Operation of his Spirit , sanctifying , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 changing them from Sin and Impurity , into the Image , Name and Nature of Christ Jesus , that A S they have born the Image of the Earthly , S O they must bear the Image of the Heavenly which must be in Reality . S. S. [ Justifie ] Signifies , to declare just , Luk. 7. 35. Wisdom is justified , &c. Psal. 51. 4. that thou mayst be justified , &c. to absolve , acquit or discharge , Rom. 8. 33. It is God that Justifieth , &c. Proverbs 17. 15. He that Justifieth the Wicked , and he that Condemneth the Just , are both Abomination to the Lord , p. 89. He sayes true in the Definition of the term [ Justifie ] but whether his after Application or Imputation thereof ( as to the Creature ) doth agree therewith , or not , will further appear ; However , his Definitions ( being compared ) intimate thus much to us , that to justifie , is both to make Just by Inherent Holiness , and to declare that Thing or Person Just which is really so ; as Wisdom is declared Just of her Children , God is declared Just when he speaketh , who Justifieth his Elect , acquitteth and declareth them Just , to whom there is no Condemnation , Rom. 8. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4. and ver . 33. But on the other hand ( as conc●…rring with the Definition before ) He that Justifieth the W●…cked , that is , he that declareth the Wicked Just , and so the Unrighteous Righteous , the Impure Pure , absolveth or acquitteth the Wicked or wicked Workers ( while such ) and he that condem●…s the Just , are both Abomination to the Lord. And then the next t●…g to be enquired is , Whom doth S. S. declare Just , and in what State are the Persons , whom be Just●…s , declares Just , absolved , acquitted or pardoned ( as his terms are ) ? S. S. This Acquittance to us fallen Cre●…es , is a propor Absolution or Pardon ; we are guilty in our own 〈◊〉 — p. 91. Now Moses , or the Law of God , is the true Accuser of everyone of us , Joh. 5. 45. There is one that accuseth you , even Moses in whom ye trust ; the only Defence is , though I am guil●…y , yet Satisfaction hath been made for that Guilt , p. 90. [ Yet ] God pronounceth us Just , and absolves us , for the Satisfaction or Righteousness of Christ , p. 91. Rep. Without Faith 't is Impossible to please God ; and without Holiness none shall see him to their Justification or Comfort : our Pardon and Absolution from Sins past , must be received in our Rising out of Sin and the Fall , and by the Power of God Renewing us into the Image of God , through a Living Faith in Christ , Repentance , or a real Change of the Mind and Heart from Evil ; and so by a true Separation of the Creature from Enmity and wicked Works , wherein men are Enemies in their Minds ; for in that state , while you stand as fallen Creatures , guilty in your own Persons , Enemies in your Minds by wicked Works ( and in the State of those unbelieving Jews , whom Moses accused , as before confessed ) God doth neither pronounce you Just , absolve nor pardon you ( in that Condition ) And while you so pronounce or declare your selves Just and acquitted , you are but Justifying the Wicked , wherein you are an Abomination to the Lord , as is proved before . It 's true , he that confesseth and forsakes Sin finds Mercy upon true Repentance and Conversion ; the Creature obtains Remission of Sins past , and that through Faith in the Name and Blood of Christ , which hath a secret Influence upon the Soul , and sprinkleth the Conscience from dead Works , in order , both to Pardon and Justification , upon the Act of living and true Faith in Christ ; yea , Christ as the one Off●…ing , Sacrifice and Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World , which puts away Sin , consecrates , makes true Believers holy , and declares God's Coming near to Man in Kindness ; I say , Christ as thus considered , hath an inward Influence and Effect upon the believing and penitent Soul , to bring it near to God , and render it capable of receiving Mercy and Forgiveness , and of seeling the Pardon and Peace , upon true Conversion from Sin and Evil ; yea , I further testifie , that God looks upon ( and hath a regard to ) every Appearance and Effect of his Grace and Spirit in the Heart & Soul , even from the very first Act of Faith , springing up and budding of Grace to the highest Growth thereof ; even , from Davids Repentance to his Songs of Deliverance ; from Niniveh's believing God and repenting to his Peoples walking in Newness of Life ; from the Prodigal's Return to his Father's House , to his abiding therein ; yea , the first Appearance of true Tenderness , Remiss and Brokeness of Heart , or godly Sorrow for Sin , the Lord hath Regard to the Creature for the sake thereof , still from the Respect he naturally hath to his Grace and Spirit , that works these in Man : To this Man will I look , saith the Lord , that is poor and of a contrite Spirit , and trembleth at my Word . The Work of Christ or Grace in the Heart , from the Beginning to the Accomplishment thereof , is acceptable to God , because of the Dignity of him that worketh it , and not from any Dignity or Worth of the Creatures own ; but only the Creature is accepted , as in Christ ; we are accepted in the Beloved , and it is for Christ's sake that God forgiveth us , and not meerly for our own : Howbeit , it is so far as we are related to Christ , and have an Interest in him and his Righteousness , by a living Faith , that God owns and looks upon us in a Way of Acceptance ; he respects his own Image in us , and doth not justifie , acquit or accept Men only upon the Account of Christ's Sufferings and Acts of Obedience , as done in his Person ; for if he did , then were all Men justified for whom Christ dyed , and that was the whole World , all Men in general ; he tasted Death for every Man ; yet his Obedience and Sufferings in the Flesh had a good End and Effect ( be being through all , both acceptable and prevailing with God , for the good of Mankind ; & we must needs partake of the Benefit and Effects thereof in our Souls , so far as they have an Influence upon us , by the Life and Power of Christ , considering the Travel of his Soul , through all his Sufferings ( which were inward as well as outward ) his Soul being made an Offering for Sin , and his making Intercession ●…or the Transgressors , was , that Men might be influenced with a real Sence and Sorrow under their own Sin , and be made sensible of Christ's Sufferings and Travil of Soul , and know the Fellowship thereof , and so be made conformable to his Death , through the Operation of his Spirit and Life in them , as that they may be raised up in the Likeness of Christ's Resurrection , in Dominion and Triumph over Sin and Death , and not plead Christ's Satisfaction and Righteousness ( only as in himself ) in their ●…ead , to absolve or justifie the Guilty , whom God will not clear , nor acquit the Wicked : Christ's Righteousness will not excuse any in Unrighteousness ; for he was a holy Example , as well as a Sacrifice and Propitiation ; and he that saith , he hath an Interest in Christ's Rightcousness , or that he abideth in Christ ought to walk as he walked . Now the Question is not , Whether Christ was a most Satisfactory Sacrifice , or well-pleasing to the Father ? for that is undeniable : He was the Delight of the Father's Soul , who gave himself for us an Offering and a Sacrifice to God , for a sweet smelling Savour , Ephes. 5. 1 , 2. But , In what State and Condition are we acquitted , pardoned and justified of God , and in what Nature ; whether as fallen , sinful , guilty Persons in our selves , and that meerly by the Sufferings of Christ in his own Person ( which were finite ) without respect to his Work in us ? Or , as Converted , Believers , Sanctified , Obedient , new Creatures in Christ , accepted ( and so justified ) in his own Righteousness , as real Partakers thereof ? The latter is the Justification and Imputation which I plead for , and not the former ; I would not have Men flatter themselves , nor one another , in Sin and Darkness , with Christ having done all , paid all , satisfied God for all Sins past , present and to come , and that in their stead ; nor to think themselves thereby absolved , acquitted and justified in their Sins and fallen Estate ; for such Doctrine hath stre●…gthned the Hands of many Evil-Doers , and made many Hypocrites , who are yet to undergoe a Sence of the Judgments and Terrors of the Lord , and to know Repentance from deadWorks , before they receive Forgiveness of Sins past , or Jesus Christ , as the Attonement or their Peace ; for he came in the Likeness of sinful Flesh , that he might condemn Sin in the Flesh , before Man be justified from it . If the Question be , What is it that gives us Interest in Christ's Righteousness ? Or upon which it is imputed or reckoned to us ? He answers , Our Faith , Rom. 10. 10. If the Question be , What will evidence our Faith to be living and sound Faith ? He answers , Our sincere Obedience to the Law , Jam. 2. 24. You see then , how that by Works a man is Justified , and not by Faith only ; we are Justified by Works , as Evidencing our Faith , living by Faith , as giving Interest in Christ's Righteousness by Christ's Righteousness , as constituting ●…s Righteous , &c. p. 91. The Reader may see , I take the better part of his Confession , as well as the worse ; He hath truly confest here , 1st , That it is our living and sound Faith that gives us Interest in Christ's Righteousness , and upon which it is imputed or reckoned to us . 2dly , That our sincere Obedience to the Law ( or Works of Faith ) doth evidence our Faith to be living and sound ; from whence it follows , that none are Justified , but who are in a living and sound Faith in Christ , and sincere Obedience to his Law : Therefore Justification was not effected or compleated without us by Christ's Sufferings ( or Death ) in his Person ; for he dyed for our Sins , but rose again for our Justification , which is effected even in bringing forth in us the Answer of a Good Conscience ; nor art thou either Justified or pronounced Righteous in the Sight of God ( whoever thou art ) who art a guilty Person , a fallen Creature , accused by Moses , unsanctified , unregenerate , Impure ; see how manifestly the Man hath contradicted himself in these Passages , one while in Justifying the guilty ( or disobedient ) another while , only those who have a living and sound Faith , and are sincerely obedient , who thereby are interested in Christ's Righteousness ; With this I agree , but not with the other , which declares the Guilty and Disobedient , Just or Innocent , p. 91. and what then ? must the Guilt be charged upon Christ , who offered up himself a Lamb without Spot to God , and was a sweet smelling Savour to him , of whom all our Obedience ought to savour , that by him we may Offer up living Sacrifices unto God ? Both we and our Actions must Savour of his Unction , and not of Pollution , Sin or Guilt , if we be Justified or accepted in the Beloved : Whereas he accuseth G. W. with teaching Justification by Faith in Christ , and the Works that follow Faith , without Christ's Righteousness Imputed , p. 91. The End of his Charge is false [ without Christ's Righteousness imputed ] are his own Words , and Forgery against me , and not mine ; for I have both owned and confessed the Real and Scriptural Sense of Imputation in the 65th Page of Divin . of Christ. ( first Part ) and several other Places therein : The blessed Man's partaking of Christ's Righteousness through Faith ; and that Justification is in the Righteousness of Christ , by Faith in him ; and that this true and living Faith and the Righteousness of it , is reckoned ( or imputed ) to the true Believer ; yet we do not grant , that Sinners or polluted Persons in that State , are cloathed with this Righteousness , or that it is imputed to them , as theirs , whilst they are out of it : These were my Words , which clear me from his Charge ; although he adds thereto , that I say , Faith in Christ , and Works that follow , without any mention of Christ's holy Life and Sufferings , p. 92. which is false again , and the contrary may be often seen in my said Book , Divin . of Christ. For , 1st , Living Faith in Christ cannot be without the Participation of Christ's holy Life , Vertue and Effects of his Sufferings and Blood , which sprinkleth the Conscience , cleanseth from Sin , &c. 2dly , We are by Faith in him spiritually influenced with a Sence of his Sufferings , Travil of Soul and Fruit of his Intercession , therein , I bear in my Body the Dying of the Lord Jesus , that the Life also of Jesus may be manifest in my mortal Flesh. 3dly , In spiritually eating of his Flesh , and drinking of his Blood , we receive of his Life in us , do come to live to God in his Love and Favour ; and so we partake of Christ AS the one Offering , Sacrifice or Propitiation , that makes holy , in whom God comes near to us in Mercy , and we to him in a holy Life ; and this is the one Offering , by which he hath forever perfected them that are sanctified , whereof the Holy Ghost beareth Witness unto us , Heb. 10. 15. Object . You have not from the Beginning of your Life to the End perfectly obeyed the Law ; what have you to say why you should not bear the Curse ? p. 92. Answ. This is an impertinent Objection , and unsutable for him that does not believe perfect Obedience to Christ attainable in any Part of our Life , either Beginning or latter End●… But God will not bring this Charge against them , whose Sins are forgiven and blotted out , to be remembred no more in the new Covenant , who since they have received Remission and Justification of Life , have the Answer and Testimony of a good Consciense to plead , which gives Boldness in the Day of Judgment , the Heart being sprinkled from an evil Conscience , there is a drawing near to God in full Assurance of Faith , if our Heart condemn us not , then have we Considence towards God : Howbeit , Upon the Charge before ( as S. S. his chief Objection ) depends much of his Work , and what he pleads to this , as his only Defence , is , Christ's Holy Life and Sufferings , Obedience to the Death , &c. not Sanctification , nor Christ's Righteousness ( or Life ) inherent in us , or the Answer of a Good Conscience , &c. And why so ? why thinks he , cannot this acquit us or render us acceptable to God ? S. S. In justifying God doth judge us by the Law , though by the Gospel also ; To be Righteous in a legal Sense , is , to be invested with a sinless Righteousness , from the Beginning of Life to the End thereof ; this the Law requires , it doth require Perfection , not only in the End of our Lives , but in the middle also , and in the Beginning , p. 92 , 93. But the Breach of this ( sayes he ) will be the Accusation or Charge that the Law ( or Justice ) will bring against us at the Day of Judgment , p. 50. Rep. The Man runs upon a Mistake , and thereupon makes his Apologies and Defence ; for there will be no Occasion for God , to bring this Charge against his Elect ( or those whom he hath justified ) at the Day of Judgment ; for , 1st , Against a Righteous Man there is no Law ; neither doth the Gospel judge such as Transgressors all their Dayes , as is vainly imagined : And how should you be justified , while you are judged both by Law and Gospel ? Doth not the Gospel acquit and clear such as ( in the Faith ) receive it , from the Condemnation of the Law , that being justified by Faith , they may have Peace with God ? 2dly , They who are pardoned of Sins past , and justified by Christ from all those things , from which they could not be justified by the Law of Moses , are received into a Covenant of ●…ace , Mercy , Forgiveness , Love , Peace and Union with God ( for such is the new Covenant , wherein God will remember their Iniquities no more . 3dly , They who are thus justified and received into Covenant with God , have passed from Death to Life , from Condemnation to J●…stification , through the Law are become dead unto the Law , that Christ might live in them ; and the Life they live , is by the Faith of the Son of God , which Faith purifies the Heart , and the Mystery of it is held in a pure Conscience . 4thly , The Gospel is preached to them that are dead ( viz. in Sin ) That they might be judged as Men in the Flesh , but justified after God in the Spirit . And God's sending his Son in the Likeness of sinful Flesh was , that Sin might be condemned in the Flesh , that the Righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in us , who walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit , Rom. 8. Therefore Justice will not ( at the Day of Judgment ) charge us with Transgression and Imperfection from the beginning of Life to the End. They that are come into Covenant with God ( who therein are in a Justified Condition ) have this to plead , We have known and believed the Love that God hath to us ; God is Love , and he that dwelleth in Love dwelleth in God , and God in him ; Herein is our Love made Perfect , that we may have Boldness in the Day of Judgment , because as he is so are we in this World , 1 Joh. 4. 16 , 17. And doth not this perfect Love and Conformity to his Image ( which gives this Boldness in the day of Judgment ) spring from the Life and Work of God in us ? And is not this our Love ( or such Conformity ) inherent in us , as we dwell in God , and God in us ? 6thly , What the Law saith , it is to those that are under the Law ; but we ( true Believers ) are not under the Law , but under Grace ; and shall we Sin because we are no more under the Law but under Grace ? God forbid ; for how can we that are dead unto Sin , live any longer therein ? But , whereas this Opposer's main Charge is , You have not from the beginning of life to the end perfectly obeyed the Law , or been invested with a sinless Righteousness , Perfection , &c. This is not stated according to his own Doctrine and Principle , which concludes , that there is no such Perfection attainable in this Life , either in the beginning , middle , or end of Life , so that according to his own Doctrine he should have stated it thus ( and it may justly be charged upon these Sin-Pleasers ) viz. You have lived in Sin and Disobedience all your Life long , and have preached to others , that perfect Freedom from Sin and Corruption is not attainable in this Life by any , either in the beginning or end of Life ; but have preached many into more Loosness & Liberty of Sinning by telling them , that 't is God's good Pleasure not to remove the being of Sin in this Life , but to suffer Corruptions to remain in his Saints to keep them humble : so no part of your Life is pure or clean , but corrupt & sinful : What have you to plead or say for yo●…r selves , why Sentence of Damnation ●…hould not pass upon you ? The Sin-pleasi●…g Presbyter pl●…ads , viz. Christ's holy Life and Suffering , is our only Defence or Apology , against this Charge , p. 9●… . Though I am Guilty , yet S●…tisfication hath been made for that Guilt ; because therefore the same Fault cannot b●… twice 〈◊〉 after Satisfaction ; t is as if it never were : This is the only way of Defence we have at God's Tribunal , p. 90. Christ s Sufferings are they for which God will Justifie us , they have fully satisfied Justice for our Sins ; We may be confident they will secure us from Condemnation , it being agai●…st Justice to punish those Sinners a second time that h●…ve been punished to the full already , p. 106. To all which it may be justly replyed , and reflected upon you who are thus pleading and maki●…g your Apology in your Si●…s & unholy Life : This will not cover nor excuse you in your Sins , if you live and dye in Sin ; your Mouths will be stopt , you will not be able to plead Christ's holy Life and Sufferings to resc●… you from Condemnation ; except you Repent , ye shall all likewise perish : What Influence or Effect hath Christ s holy Life or S●…fferings upon you , only you pro●…ess and plead them ? So it may be said , Christ was ever Holy ; but you were never holy : Christ was a Sacrifice of a sweet smelling Savour to God , which neither your Life nor Actions seem any thing of ; but contrary wise are a b●…d Savour to him : Christ was an holy and perfect Example which you never followed , no●… ever intend to follow so long as you live ( for you do not believe it is attainable ) Christ came to condemn Sin in the Flesh , which you keep alive ( and plead for ) in your Flesh as long as you live : Christ also came to fulfil the Righteousness of the Law in us who walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit ; but you do not own nor believe its-Fulfilling to be in your Persons , but only in Christ's Person : Christ's Blood was not only for R●…mission of Sins past , but is to cleanse from all Sin , & to purge the Conscience , sanctify , &c. This you reject , and in your Sins and defiled Con●…iences trample the Blood of the Covenant under Foor , and add to the Sufferings of Christ and the Sin of his Persecutors , by adding Sin unto Sin , and so grieving his Spirit all your dayes , and pleading his Holy Life for your Defence therein ; and so the Guilt of his Blood will be charged upon you in the day of Judgment , if you repent not . And surther you 〈◊〉 charge divine Justice with punishing your Sins to the ●…ull in Christ , or punishing him that was ever Innoc●… to the full sor your Sins ; so that you count it against Justice to punish your Sins again i●… you , though you live and dye in them ; and yet you think it an excellent piece of Justice to punish the Innocent to the full for the Guilty : But your Mistake herein is g●…oss , as will further appear , and you will not be acquitted , nor clear'd hereby ; This will not prove you invested with Christ's everlasting Righteousness ; nor will this cover your own Filthy Rags , or hide your Shame . A●…d while you think that you are secured in your Sins from the Stroke of Justice , as having been fully executed and that by way of Revenge upon the Innocent Son of God , in punishing your Sins to the full upon him ; I say , while vou state this as the Nature of the Satisfaction by Christ's Suffering in your stead , the whole World may as well acquit it self from Punishment thereby as you ; for he dyed for all , and is the Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World ; and therefore if this must be lookt upon as the full Punishment of Sin laid upon Christ , and that the Sin cannot be twice punished after such Satisfaction , this may make a merry World in Sin ; once punisht to the full in Christ , never to be punished again upon the Offender , which the Law directly takes hold of . Oh Sinner's soothing Doctrine ! to make the wicked World rejoyce in a Sinful State , and say , Oh Admirable Justice , that was pleased thus to Revenge thy self upon an Innocent Man , that never sinned , & to punish our Sin to the full upon him ! O transcendent Mercy , that hast found out this expedient , that we might be fully acquitted , pardoned and discharged from the Penalty that is Just and due to us for all our Sins past , present , and to come ! Oh! what Glad Tidings are these to the Hypocrites and Drunkards ? &c. And how merry they are apt to be in their Sins , upon their Ministers Proclaiming such an Act of Indemnity of all Offences and Injuries past , present and to come , not only against their Neighbours , but against God himself . But if it be objected , That without Sound Faith ( which is a working Faith men have not an Interest in Christ's Obedience , Righteousness or Satisfaction ; nor are we Invested with any thing for which God should pronounce us Righteous , &c. p. 93. 94. From hence it follows then , that if they remain in Unbelief , they have no Interest in Christ's Righteousness or Satisfaction ; and then the Consequence is , Christ did not make Satisfaction in our stead ( nor was punished ) for the Sin of Unbelief nor for the Effects of Unbelief , to acquit us therein ; for what Sins then was he punished to the full ? But above all it appears wonderful strange , that God could not remit or pardon Offences past , without such a severe Payment and Satisfaction ( as is implyed ) because ( as some say ) he dispenseth not with the Act of Law : If he could so punish his Innocent Son to the full , who never offended , was not this a Dispensing with the Act of Law , when the Law was made for Offenders , and added because of Transgression , and to punish such ? for it was not made to punish an Innocent or Righteous Man , against whom there is no Law. But if to pardon former Transgression upon true Repentance , and to save Man from Sin and Wrath , be not inconsistent with the infinite Goodness and Mercy of God himself ; and to be both a just God and a Saviour , were not Inconsistent ; then his divine Justice consisted not in such Severity , as to obliege him from shewing Mercy witho●…t such a rigid Satisfaction and Payment , as that of punishing his Son to the full , and pouring out his Wrath upon him , for the Sin of Mankind : Whereas , where Remission of Sin is obtained , there is both a Relaxation of the Severity of the Law , and a manifest Effect of the Propitiation , or sweet smelling Sacrifice of Christ , as Mediator and Advocate , and not as the Object of Wrath , Revenge and full Punishment from God , that is due to Sin , and that to acquit the Sinners continuing therein ; And his not sparing his own Son , but delivering him up for us all , and his being made a Curse for us , was neither equivalent to that of Eternal Death , Curse and Damnation , which Sin and Sinners have deserved ; nor doth it absolve Man from his Obedience to the Law of the new Covenant or Spirit of Life in Christ , though it was for a Relaxation of the Law , as to the Bondage thereof , and in order to abolish and end the first Covenant and the Curse thereof ; yet not to pardon or justifie Men in Sin against the second : Nor is it any Loosening , but a Reinforcing of the Terms thereof ; for he took away the first , that he might establish the second ; he removed , ●…nd ended the Shadows , that he might exalt the Substance that was vailed under them ; he blotted out the Hand-writing of Ordinances , & nailed it to his Cross , that he might reinforce the Law of the new Covenant written in the Heart , that we might not be without Law to God but under the Law to Christ : He did both fulfil the Law in hs Person , and doth fulfil the Righteousness of it in them that walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit ; he did not only remove the shadowy Part of the Law and the Curse thereof , through his Suffering and Sacrifice ; but also , he actually delive●…s the Soul from the inward Terrors , Condemnation and Wrath of the Law ( upon true Repentance and Contrition of Heart ) in Remission and Pardon , through Faith in his Blood , being virtuously felt , and efficaciously evidenced by his holy Spirit unto the Soul that hath a Part in Christ , as the Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World , whose Blood bears Record in the Earth , agrees in one with the Spirit , sprinkleth the Consci●…nce from dead Works , speaketh forth Mercy and Forgiveness , better things then that of Abel : Besides , Christ was as well exemplary , as propiriat●…ry or gracious in his Sufferings , which had both a blessed Accep●…ance and Eff●…ct with G●…d , and a spiritual Influence upon them that follow him in Spirit , further then the Historical Faith and Relation thereof , as he said , If any Man serve me , let him follow me , and where I am , there shall also my Servant b●… J●…h . 12. 26. And thus far is his Example spiritually fulfilled in them that follow him , as namely , * Jesus Christ was outwardly c●…rcumcised , baptized , crucified , put to Death ( as concerning the Flesh ) buried , quickned , raised up by the Power of God , &c. His Followers or Servants are spiritually circumcised , baptized into his Death , or crucified with him , buried with him by Baptism ( as Partakers of the Fellowship of his Suff●…rings ) quickned by his Spirit , raised up by his Power into the Likeness of his Resurrection , and having suffered with him , shall reign with him . And now in Opposition to the Doctrine of such a rigid and Severe Satisfaction , as is by divers asserted ; 〈◊〉 must tell my Opposers , that though the Chastisement of our Peace was upon him , and by his Stripes we are said to be healed ; this is neither of the Nature of Revenge from God , Wrath or Punishment to the full , that is due for Sin ; nor doth it exempt or free them , who come to be his Followers , from being liable at all to God's Chastisement or Correction in their own particulars , when there is Cause for it ; for whom he loves , them also he doth correct , which is not Revenge , as 't is said , If my Children forsake my Law , and keep not my Commandments , then will I visit their Transgressions with the Rod , and their Iniquity with Stripes ; nevertheless my loving Kindness will I not utterly take from them , &c. Psa. 89. 30 , 31 , 32 , 33. This concerned David ( and his Seed ) who notwithstanding did so undergoe the Chastisements of the Lord , that he went often in a bowed down and mournful State , as when he complained , My God , my God , why hast thou forsaken me , &c. Psa. 22. which were the same Words Christ u●…tered in his deep Suffering , Mat. 27. 4●… plainly i●…timating , how he took upon him the Sufferings and Bur●…en of his People , and his bearing the Sin and 〈◊〉 of many wherein it 's evident , that they that ●…ollow Christ through the Work of Regeneration , and obtain the new Birth , do spiritually pass through the Fellowship of Christ's Sufferings , and do partake of their due Shares thereof , both for their Remission , and to obliege them to follow him in his own Way of Light and Life , whereby they who are faithful to him , witnes the Blood Cove●…ant the Coverant , that cleanseth from Sin , and an Interest in that everlasting 〈◊〉 This is the Way a●…d Passage of the Ra●…somed o●… the Lord , who through his Judgment and Chastis●…ments have 〈◊〉 a Ransom , received the Attonement and an Interest in the Everlasting 〈◊〉 of Li●… and Glory . Having thu●… 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the Matter in general , I come further to 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 particular Passages , that chiefly concern me to 〈◊〉 . S. S. Th●… La●…●…ver a●…ows us to sin ; if at ten Years of Age a Person commits M●…er , a●…d then lives according to the Law of the Land in ev●… 〈◊〉 ●…rty Years , then arraigned for this , the Judge cannot pro●…ounce him Innocent , and so acquit him , because the Law did not allow him to commit Murther any Part of his Life , p. 93. Answ. A Truth in both . 1st , The Law never allows us to sin , no more doth Grace , or the Gospel ; Shall we sin , because we are no more under the Law , but under Grace ? God forbid , for how can we that are dead unto Sin live any longer therein ? 2dly , Justice cannot pronounce a Guilty Person Innocent , upon the Cessation from the meer Act of Unrighteousness , but God's lovin●… Kindness and tender Mercy can , and doth afford Remission upon true Repentance ; and his Justice can pronounce him ●…nocent , that is purged from the Nature & Root of Sin , & washed from Iniquity : Have Mercy upon me , O God , according to thy loving Kindness ; according to the multitude of thy tender Mercy blot out my Transgressions , wash me throughly from mine Iniquity , &c. Psa 51. 1 , 2. They whose Transgressions are thus blotted ou●… , who come thus to be washed and saved , through the Washing of Regeneration ; such come thus to be justified by his Grace , & can be pronounced Innocent , as being washed and sanctified ; and such have the Demand of a good Conscience : And though Pardon and Justification look not back at the unconverted State with Severity , but with Remission upon Conversion ; yet they require what God's Covenant doth afterward , to the End of our Dayes ; that is , not to live in Sin , but in Christ's Righteousness : The Grace , or Favour of God , teacheth us , that denying Ungodliness and wordly Lusts , that we should live godly and soberly in this present World , Tit. 2. 12. To be invested with Christ's Everlasting Righteousness , p. 93. is the very Thing I plead for , and if in Reality the Man stood to this , the Controversie would soon have an End. And he further assents to Truth , viz. If this Righteousness be not put on by Faith , we are not invested with any Thing , for which God should declare or pronounce us Righteous . From whence observe , That we must be invested with Christ's Everlasting Righteousness , if God pronounce us Righteous : Take Justification and Imputation in this Sense , and then we differ not in this Matter ; but how well this agrees with imputing and reckoning Guilty , Condemned , Fallen Creature , JUST or INNOCENT , only on the Account of Christ's Sufferings and Death , while such condemned Creatures are invested with Sin and Guilt , and not with Christ's Everlasting Righteousness ? Will his telling us of Christ's Death imputed , p. 97. make up the Matter ? 'T is true , Christ is our Surety , and that of the new Testament or Covenant , 1st , For that without him we can pay no Debt , nor truly obey or fulfil the Terms thereof on our Parts , but in and through him that strengthneth us . 2dly , Of the New Testament also , in fulfilling the Promises belonging thereto ; for all the Promises of God are Yea and Amen in him . David describes the Blessedness of the Man to whom God imputes Righteousness without Works , saying , Blessed is he whose Iniquity is forgiven : But then S. S. is not pleased to take notice of ( but overlooks ) the following Words , viz. Blessed is the Man unto whom the Lord imputeth not Iniquity , and in whose Spirit there is NO GUILE ; See Psal. 32. 1 , 2. If it were only a Man thus qualified , that the Imputation of Christ's Righteousness and Justification were pleaded for , we should not have this Controversie ; but should agree , That the Man in whose Spirit is NO GUILE , is blessed ; He is the Man whom God pronounceth Just and Innocent ; his Transgression is forgiven , his Sin is covered : And though it is said , God imputes Righteousness to him without Works ; yet 't is to be understood , it is not without a sincere Obedience , because that in his Spirit there is no Guile : and then without what Works ? 1. Not without the Work of living Faith. 2. Not without yielding true Subjection or Obedience unto God in his spiritual Requirings or Law of Faith ; for Abraham did not only believe God , but by Faith yielded ●…o obey him : Without what Works then ? but the Work of the Law of Works ( as wrought by the Flesh or st●…nly Jew ) by which no Flesh shall be justified . I mentioned C●…rcumcision , and others , that were Types or Signs , wherein the Righteousness of Faith doth not consist ; see Divin . of Christ , p. 64 , 65. in which this Point is opened and cleared : But to this S. S. objects , viz. He errs , calling the Ceremonial Law a Law of Works ; in giving this , the Lord gave a Law of Grace to his People , p. 94. Rep. If the Ceremonial Law be not a Law of Works , but a Law of Grace ; he should have been so Ingenuous as to have told us , what the Law of Works is , which the Apostle distinguisheth from the Law of Faith , Rom. 3. 27. as he d●…th between justifying Faith and the Deeds of the Law ( as wrought and boasted in by the literal Jews ) And whether the Law of Works be some Law inferiour to that of Circumcision & other Types ? But to shew S. S. his Error , in denying the Ceremonial Law ( as he calls it ) to be the Law of Works ; let him consider , that after the Apostle excludes Boasting , not by the Law of Works ; and concludes a Man is justified by Faith without the Deeds of the Law , he saith , Is H●… the God of the Jews only ? Is He not also of the Gentiles ? and that it is by Faith that God justifies both the Circumcision and the Uncircumci●…on ; and that Faith was reckoned to Abraham ●…or Righteousness , not in Circumcision , but in 〈◊〉 ; and that he received the Sign of Circumcision , a Seal of the Righteousness of the Faith which he had , yet being Uncircumcised , that he might be the Father of all them that be●…ieve , though they be not Circumcised , &c. See Rom. 3. 28 , 29. and Ch. 4. 10 , 11. Gal. 2. 16. and 3. 2 , 5. and 4. 10. And ●…urther , If ye be circumcised , Christ shall profit you nothing , ch . 5 2. From all which 't is plain , 't is no Error to say , the Law of Works ( as opposed to the Law of Faith ) is that enjoyning Circumcision and other Signs and Shadows , & these the Works which are not imputed unto Justification ; nay , I shall further grant , that all Man's Works or working whatsoever before a living Faith , are neither available nor accountable unto his Justification with God , and on the other Hand , that a true and sanctifying Faith , and believing in God ( from a Sence of his living Word or holy Command in the Heart ) is accounted for Righteousness to him that so believe●…h , before he hath performed his actual Obedience ; even while in the Faith he is passively waiting upon God ( as being ceased to do Evil ) that he may receive Strength to act Good , even while he is so believing , and waiting , and breathing to the Lord , and saying , draw me , and I will come after thee ; lead me , and I will follow ; give me Strength , and I will walk in thy Wayes ; come , let us walk in the Light of the Lord , &c. knowing that it is the Power of God that begets living Faith , and thereby changes and sanctifieth the Mind unto a living and sincere Obedience ; and this Faith is the Gi●…t of God , a Fruit of his own Spirit , and therefore accounted of by him , and reckoned unto us : I would not make the Scriptures speak , that God imputes Works wrought by us , without Works by us ( as S. S. falsly accuseth me , p. 94. ) But rather , that God imputes his own Works in us , without any self-Works wrought by us , and accepts us in the Beloved , in whom we are created again unto good Works . How can Christ's sinless Obedience from the beginning of Life to the end , ( which takes in his Conformity to the Law ) be imputed to the Guilty and fallen Creature ; or that Conformity be the Everlasting Righteousness wherewith the true Believer is invested , when as 't is not the Works of the Law , but the Righteousness of Faith that Justifies and Recommends to God ? And this is inwardly poss●…ssed , where true Faith and the Obedience thereof , is injoyed and Lived in ; it is not Christ's Conformity to the Law that Justifies us , but his making us conformable to his own Image and Partakers of his Everlasting Righteousness , for which God pronounceth us just ; for men are not imputatively Righteous or Just , when actually condemned as Guilty , Sinful , Fallen Creatures . And further , I deny that Christ's Conformity to the Law , whilst on Earth , doth either constitute or reckon us righteous from the Beginning of Life to the End ; for that God according to his Grace and Mercy forgiveth Sins that are past ( before Faith ) and after his Visitation and Mercy is received , the Law and Righteousness of Faith enjoyns us to Newness and Holiness of Life , without which he will not acquit us : He will not acquit the Wicked ; If I sin , thou markest me , and wilt acquit me from mine Iniquity , Job . 10. And then , shall we sin , because we are no more under the Law , but under Grace ? God forbid , &c. His saying , But were the Works of Faith perfect , yet could they not be a justifying Righteousness , p. 95. Though Righteousness in the Abstract , and as it is everlasting , doth not consist ( or is not made up ) of any Work outward , or temporal Acts ; yet to conclude that the Works of Faith , ●…hough perfect , cannot be justi●…ing , is contrary to the Apostle's Testimony of being justified by Faith , whereby we have Peace with God ; and you see ●…hou that ●…Y WO●…KS A MAN IS JUSTIFIED , and n●…t by Faith only : Was not our Father Abraham justified by W●…ks , when he offered up his Son Isaac ? A●…d God will ordain Peace for us ; for he hath wrought all ●…ur Works in us , Isa. 26. and then are not his Works in us , ●…ding to our Justification and Acceptance , being recko●…d ours , as wrought in us ? Are not these accounted of wit●… the Lord from the Dignity of himself that worketh them ? For to him it is said , thou hast also wrought all eur Works in us . To that Question , Will he say that Abraham did not in Faith circumcise his Son ? Answ. But he was Justified before that ; for Faith was reckoned to Abraham for Righteousness when he was in Uncircumcision : Though every Act of true and living Obedience , both before , under , and since the Law , was done in Faith ; yet are they not made Righteous by the meer Works , but by that Power and Spirit of Faith that works them . And If A S we are made Sinners and condemnable by One Man's Disobedience , we be S O made Righteous and Justifiable by the Obedience of One ; then we must be as really made Righteous in the second Adam , as we were Sinners in the first Adam : A S in Adam all dye , S O in Christ shall all be made alive ; A S we have born the Image of the Earthly , S O we must bear the Image of the Heavenly ; which is not from a meer Imputation o●… either without a real Participation : They are not Innocent or Clear in themselves who are either made or reckoned Sinners by one Man's Disobedience ; nor are they without the Participation of Christ's Righteousness in themselves who are made Righteous by his Obedience ; They that receive abundance of Grace and of the Gift of Righteousness , shall reign in Life by Jesus Christ : Death hath passed upon all men , for that all have sinned ; Sin hath really reigned in man unto Death ; and so must Grace reign through Righteousness , unto Eternal Life . God's Imputations or Reckonings to Man are true ; whom he reckons Sinners are inherently such , and whom he reckons Righteous are so likewise ; but the Hypocrite , who can Justifie the Wicked , is an Abomination unto God , Howbeit , contrary to what I have said , S. S. reasons , viz. We are not Partakers of this by our actual Commission of it : I●… cannot be said we are Par●…ers of Adam's Sin in that we are personal Offenders ; it must be therefore by Go●…●…mputation . Obs. By this he hath explained his ●…se of the Imputation of Ada●…'s Sin and Christ's 〈◊〉 , and s●… of 〈◊〉 and Justification ; and ●…o by this , Rom. 〈◊〉 . ●…9 . is thus to be read , AS by One man's Disobe●…ience many were made Si●…ners that were not actual Sinners , SO by the Obedience of One many are made Righteous who never actually obeyed ; an easy , pleasant and Sin-pleasing Doctrine for the Ungodly , Sinners , and Hypocrites ) ●…rom whence also it follows that they are condemnable by Adam ' s Disobedience ( Children are not excepted , he saith ) who never committed actual Transgression ; and so they are Justified by Christ's intire Obedience , who never actually obe●…yed him : and what 's this but still the old Abomination , to Condemn the Innocent , and Justifie the Guilty or Wicked ? S. S. adds , Let the words be weighed [ by one man's Disobedience many were made Sinners ] it is not here said , By many Personal Disobediences we are made Sinners , though this be true , &c. p. 96. Rep. By one man Sin entered into the World , & Death by Sin ; yet it is not Adam's Sin intirely ( as a particular Person ) that is imputed , though from one Offence sprung many ; ●…or Death reigning in Man is an Effect of his own sinning & being in the Nature and Image of the first Man , in whom all dye ; Death hath passed over all Men , for that all have sinned , even over as many as have not sinned after the Similitude of Adam's Transgression , which still implies , they have sinned after some Similitude or Manner ; yea , many in a more gross Manner then Adam sinned , * that yet think themselves Imputatively Righteous : It was not only the Offence , as committed by him alone ; but the Offence or Sin , and Nature of Enmity continued and committed by men themselves , and also springing up into many Offences , which makes many Sinners ; As it is not the Father's eating sower Grapes alone that sets the Childrens Teeth an Edge ; but every Man that eateth the sower Grape , his Teeth shall be set on Edge ; the Soul that sinneth it shall dye ; every man shall dye for his own Iniquity . And further , Why should Adam , as a particular Person be so very much exclaimed against and blamed ( whereby many Hypocrites think to ease themselves , and over look their own Iniquities ) seeing that you know not , but that Adam found Repentance and Forgiveness ? However , since Adam sinned , there were Righteous Generations left , namely Seth , whom God appointed unto Adam as another Seed in stead of Abel , Gen. 4. 25 , 26. and 5. 3. and afterward Enoch came forth , who walked with God , Gen. 5. 24. and Noah and his Family , with whom God renewed his Covenant , that was made to Adam , Gen. 1. 28. Chap. 9. 7 , 9. and there were Righteous Generations after the Destruction of the UNGODLY WORLD by the Flood , though many turned to Iniquity again : But all Men are accountable for their own ; It will not be either their crying out of Adam's sole Offence , or their pleading Christ's intire Obedience , that will excuse them in the Day of the Lord , wherein every man shall give an Account of himself to ●…od , and be rewarded according to his own Deeds done in the Body , whether they be Good or Evil. S. S. God doth not punish that Person , in whom he doth not first see a Transgression , p. 96. Answ. True ; But how agrees this with his Sense of Imputation ? Let the competent Reader judge : hence it ●…ollows ( and that by his own Rule of Contraries ) that A S God doth not punish a Person in whom he doth not first see a Transgression ; SO God doth not justifie a Person , or repute him Righteous , in whom he doth not first see a real Righteousness , and that through Faith and Sanctification : And this plainly overthrows his Notion of Imputation before . S. S. We are made Righteous , not by Conversion only , as G. W. would have it , p. 96. Answ. However , this [ Not only ] grants thus far , that we are not made Righteous without Conversion ; and then we are justified , made Righteous or declared just ( in the true Sense of Imputation ) when converted , in which State we are inherently or inwardly Partakers of Christ's Righteousness , and not in the unconverted : So that S. S. his reiterated contradictory Opinion , as stated by him , ( viz. AS the Disobedience Adam wrought in his own Person on Earth makes us Sinners ; SO The Obedience Christ wrought in his own Person on the Earth makes us Righteous , p. 96. ) is still opposed by the Light of Truth , which manifests how far Men are Partakers of the Nature and Disobedience of the first Adam , and how they come really to partake of the second Adam in themselves , without which God doth neither justifie nor reckon them just . It being also confest , That God doth not punish that Person , in whom he doth not first see a Transgression ; and then it follows , No more doth he justifie that Person , in whom he doth not see his own Image . His Phrase [ Christ's Sufferings imputed ] is not a Scripture-Phrase , though much of his Work hangs upon it ; yet his being made a Curse for us , was not in vain , being to remove the Curse of the Law ( as generally pronounc'd for not continuing in all that 's written , &c. ) to abolish the Shadows of the first Covenant , and to establish the second , that both Jew and Gentile might be reconciled in one Covenant , wherein Christ is the Blessing to all , having been both a perfect Example and Sacrifice , who travilled that he might see his Seed , and suffered that he might reign : Though he suffered and tasted Death for every Man , as an universal Offering for Sin ; yet Men are neither acquitted thereby in their Sins , nor interested in the second Covenant ( which he dyed to establish ) unless they come under the Condition and State thereof , namely , an Agreement and Friendship with God ; for Men will be condemned for disobeying the Gospel , though there be a Relaxation and Change of the Law , touching the Curse thereof , as 't is threaten'd on those general Terms , for not keeping all : But what the Law saith , it is to them that are under it ; It was the outward Jews that it was imposed upon in the Letter of it , though it be universally to be fulfilled in Spirit in the true Christians or Jews inward : And though God hath shewn a Mitigation of the Severity ( which hath been incurred by Sin ) and a Pacification and coming nigh to Mankind with Kindness in his Son Christ Jesus ; yet still , if men reject the Love of the Truth , the Terms of Friendship and Agreement with God , and obey not the Gospel , they miss and fall short of the Benefit of Christ and his Sufferings , and the blessed End for which God sent his Son : And though the Curse of the Law doth not rest upon men for not continuing in all the Letter of it , or shadowy Part ( including both Circumcision , divers Washings , &c. ) yet if their Hearts be not circumcised to the Lord , nor they inwardly washed or sprinkled from an evil Conscience , they have no Part with Christ , as he said , If I do not wash thee , thou hast no Part with me ; Except ye be born again , ye cannot enter into the Kingdom of God : Notwithstanding God doth greatly shew himself propitious and kind , in his Son to Mankind , in that upon any Condition ( viz. his own Terms ) he will admit Man to approach unto him , or come into actual Friendship with himself . Argum. What was typified in the Ceremonial Law is certainly accomplished ; but the Imputation of Christ's Sufferings was typified , Exod. 24. 8. Heb. 9. What did this Sprinkling typifie , but the Imputation or Application of Christ's Sufferings to us . Answ. He varies uncertainly in his Words [ Imputation or Application ] which are different ; the Imputation being supposed to be God's ; the Application Man's : And M●…ses's taking the Blood and sprinkling it on the People , Exod. 24. 8. was neither a Type of this Man's Imputation , nor his Application of Christ's Sufferings unto unsanctified Persons , for their Justification ; but a real Type of Sanctification , and Remission by the Blood of Christ sprinkled upon the Conscience for that End , which is more then unsanctified Persons Application thereof , and thence imagining their Justification : The Scriptures cited by himself prove what I say against him , 1 Joh. 1. 7. But if we walk in the Light , as he is in the Light , we have Fellowship one with another , and the Blood of Jesus Christ , his Son , cleanseth us from all Sin : And Hebr. 9. 14. How much more shall the Blood of Christ , who offered himself without Spot to God , purge your Consciences from dead Works , to serve the Living God ? And Hebr. 12. 24. And ye are come to the Blood of sprinkling : From whence [ Mark ] that this cleansing , purging , sprinkling the Conscience , &c. was a real Act or Effect of the Blood of the Covenant , unto the Sanctification of them who walked in the Light , and not a meer Imputation or Application of Christ's Sufferings for the Justification of Impure and Unsanctified Persons : Moreover , it was when the People said , ALL that the Lord hath said will we do , and be Obedient , that Moses took the Blood and sprinkled it on the People , and said , Behold the Blood of the Covenant , &c. Exod. 24. 7 , 8. To which Type answereth what the Apostle Peter saith , Elect according to the fore-Knowledge of God , through Sanctification of the Spirit ●…to OBEDIENCE and SPRINKLING of the Blood of Jesus , 1 Pet. 1. 2. And he hath washed us from our Sins in his own Blood. This is the Blood of the Covenant that doth sanctifie , Heb. 10. 29. And he shall sprinkle many Nations , Isa. 52. 15. Where Christ is known to sprinkle & purge the Conscience by his own Blood , He really & effectually thereby applies it both unto Sanctification , Remission and Pardon ; but this Effect hath not Mens Imaginary Application o●… it in their Sins and Pollution : It is one Thing for Men in their own Wills to apply the Sufferings , Death and Blood of Christ to themselves ; 't is another to know him to apply it in sprinkling the Conscience . And seeing it is Christ's Work , it concerns us all to obey & follow him in his i●…hining Light for that End ; it being only those who are sanctified by his Blood , of whom it may be truly said , Much more th●…n , being justifi●… by his Blood , we shall be saved from Wrath through him , Rom. 5. 9. To his saying , To be justified is to be pardoned , p. 97. I grant , that to receive Pardon of Sins past upon true Repenta●…ce , is to receive a Degree of Justification so far as from the Condemnation ; but to be absolutely justified to the End of Life , a●…er Pardon is received , is more then Pardon of Sins past before ; for this is not without a Perseverance in the Grace , Rom. 11. 22. Heb. 6. 4 , 5 , 6. Chap. 10. 26. His saying , We are pardoned for the sake of Christ's Death imputed , p. 97. is no Scripture-Phrase or Language : why is not the whole World for whom he dyed then pardoned and justified ? If he replies , because of Unbelief , or that they have not Faith in his Blood ; It follows then , that Men are pardoned and justified through Faith in the Blood of Christ , and not by their Application or Imputation of the Death of Christ ; for it is said , that he was delivered for our Offences , and was raised again for our Justification , Rom. 4. 25. therefore not by the meer Imputation of his Death : Neither do these cited Scriptures ( Col. 1. 14. Ephes. 1. 6. Rom. 3. 24. Mat. 26. 28. ) prove his Doctrine of Imputation ; but Redemption or Remission through his Blood , Redemption in Christ ; and Ephes. 1. 6. We are accepted IN the Beloved : These real Scripture-Truths are never doubted of by us , and 't is true , that the Children of Israel bringing their Sacrifices to the Priest to offer ( or otherwise Blood was to be imputed to them ) doth typifie , that we must offer our Services by Christ our high Priest. S. S. If we think to have the best Services that we are enabled to perform , accepted immediately as from us , and not for the sake of Christ presenting them , &c. for this God will cut us off ; he will as soon accept of Murther from us , as such a Service , p. 98. Rep. As herein he would represent the Condition of Believers or justified Persons , he non-sensically mistates the Case ; For , 1st , Such are not apt to ascribe either the Dignity or Acceptance of their best Services to themselves ; but unto Christ who enables them to perform . 2. As their Sufficiency is of Christ , and in him , and not of themselves ; so he hath the Glory thereof , and they the Acceptance and Peace in him , as they continue faithful in him , serving the living God. 3. Christ's Priesthood is an holy Priesthood : It is also said of them , Ye also as lively Stones built up a spiritual House to offer up spiritual Sacrifices , acceptable to God by Jesus Christ , 1 Pet. 2. 5. And these are not polluted or unholy Sacrifices which this holy Priesthood offers by him : But , 4. You who are of an Unholy and Polluted Priesthood , are offering polluted Services ; sinsul and wandring Prayers , which are but Dreams , sinning in your best Duties , committing Iniquity in your holy Things ( as many of you have often confessed ) and are all as an unclean Thing , and that God will as soon accept of Murther from you , as of such a Service ; and yet presume , that those your unclean , polluted Sacrifices and Services are presented by Christ to the Father , and accepted in the Merit of his Sacrifice ; but herein you are deceived and deluded : Christ doth neither present , nor doth God accept any of your sinful Services or polluted Performances ; but will Po●…e Contempt upon you in them , and return back your polluted Prayers and Services , and with Indignation spread them as Dung upon your own Faces ; therefore Repent , Repent , and be converted to Christ , the true Light and Way to the Father , and to the Spiritual House and Holy Priesthood ( which yet you are much short of ) to offer Spiritual Sacrifices , acceptable to God by Christ. CHAP. III. About Christ's Justifying Righteousness , the best Robe ; the Necessity of its Inherence ( or being inwardly enjoyed ) not to invalidate but to fulfil the blessed Intent and Ends of his Sufferings , in Reply to S. S. S. S. If the Righteousness we are justified by is a Garment , a Arg. Robe , even the best Robe , then we are justified by a Righteousness wrought without us ; for our Garments are not wrought within us , but without us . Rep. This justifying Righteousness then is a Garment to be put on ; but whether its being a Garment , and to be put on , doth prove that it is not within , but without only , let them that have put it on judge : It appears , that this Opposer hath disputed and pleaded so long for the Being of Sin to remain within , that he has no Room ●…or Christ's Righteousness within : But I would enquire of him ; Is every Thing that is to be put on therefore not within but without ? Is this a good Argument ? As , P●…ye ye on the Lord Jesus Christ ; Put on Strength , O Sion ! Put on thy beau●…iful Garments , O Jerusalem ! Put on the whole Armour o●… God , &c. Must these therefore not be within , but without only ? And so he might as well say of Salvation , with which the Meek are cloathed ; or of the Zeal of the Lord , which the Upright do put on for a Cloak , and Righteousness ●…or a Garment . But to give him his due ; After he hath concluded that the Righteousness for which we are Justified is wrought without us , is a Garment , &c. He confesseth that the holy Ghost doth not alwayes ( using this Similitude ) intimate to us , that that Righteousness which is put on , is wrought without us , p. 99. And what Righteousness is that which is put on that is wrought within us ? Do we both put on a Righteousness that is within us , and a Righteousness that is not within us ? what Scripture has he for this Distinction ? And what Confusion is the Man fallen into , to conclude that the Justifying Righteousness is not wrought within but without , because put on as a Garment ; and yet that there is a Righteousness put on which is not wrought without us but within us ? See what a profound Logician this man would shew himself ; but thus he confounds the Minds of the Simple , and darkens Counsel by Words without Knowledge . To Luk. 15. 22. Bring forth the best Robe and put it on him , he saith , By this Robe the holy Ghost understands Christ's Obedience unto Death ; not to speak of Increated Righteousness , even the essential and incommunicable Righteousness of God , which never was wrought within or without , but is the eternal Godhead , pag. 99. Rep. However he hath sufficiently confessed that the Righteousness by which we are Justified must be put on ; but while he denies it either to be within or Essential , he denies our Participation of the divine Nature ( which is essential to God himself ) or of Christ , who is God's Righteousness , who was delivered up for us all , and with whom the Father will give us all things ; Is He then Incommunicable or not to be given , whenas they that are Christ's have put on Christ ? Is not He the best Robe ? And is not He then within us ? And He that obeyed and suffered for us ( who wrought Righteousness ) Greater then the Act of Obedience ? Is not the Worker above and Greater then the Work ? But while this Opposer endeavours to exclude or shut Christ and his Righteousness ( or the Robe which the Saints put on ) all out of his Members , and counts Christs Obedience unto Death without them this Robe , and not a Robe within them ; because a Robe put on , as he argues , we are to understand that by [ Put on ] he must ●…ean Christ's Obedience without ( unto Death ) is imputed 〈◊〉 reckoned theirs , when there is nothing of it in them either of the Nature , Spirit , Virtue , or Effects of it unto the Crucifying of the Old Man , or mortifying of Sin ; or else own that Men are not accounted Righteous , nor Justified only by Christ's Dying or Obedience without them , but through the Operation of his Spirit within them , who dyed for our Sins , but was raised for our Justification ; and then only they that dye and live with him are accounted Righteous and blessed with God ( being Partakers of the Heart-purifying Faith ) and not they that live to themselves without the Possession or Enjoyment of Christ's Nature and Life in them , which is Divine and Increated : But he tells us of a four fold Righteousness . 1st , The sincere Obedience of an upright man. 2dly , The perfect but loosable Righteousness of the first man in Innocency . 3dly , The perfect but confirmed Obedience of blessed Angels . 4thly , The perfect everlasting and Infinitely Pretious Obedience of the Lord Jesus Christ ; this last , the best Robe ; the Righteousness of God himself , p. 99. Rep. What is it we contend for but Man's being invested with the perfect and everlasting Righteousness of God himself , his own Nature and Image ? And is not this in the renewed Man ? 1st , Was not this in Man while in Innocency in the Image of God ; though he then not Immoveably Confirmed in it , however accepted while he stood in it ? 2dly , Doth not the fincere Obedience of an upright Man in Christ , flow from his Inward Participation of the Divine Nature and Image in him , and therefore accepted from the Excellency of that Divine Root and Seed from whence his Fruit Springs ? 3dly , Are not the blessed Angels accepted in their Obedience to God , which from a Sence of his divine power they are exercised in ? Still the everlasting Righteousness is but one , and the Life and Excellency thereof is infinite both in Christ and in his Members , who are of his Flesh and of his Bone ; as he that sanctifieth and they that are sanctified are all of one ; and Christ is the First and the Last ; and in all things must have the Preheminence . 4thly , The man mistakes , if he suppose that we plead either the Righteousness of a Creature , or man 's own Righteousness which he himself is inabled to perform , as the Cause of Our Justification ; for Christ that strengthens us and enables us by his Power and Spirit dwelling in us to do the Fathers Will , He is the Ground and Cause of our Justification , and in him who is the Beloved are we accepted , not meerly for our Works or Obedience , but for his sake who worketh in us and enables us to do those things which are well-pleasing in his Sight . That God bestows Righteousness on a returning P●…odigal as the best Robe , is true ; but to exclude this Righteousness , or best Robe , that God bestows , as not to be within , but only without , because , to be put on , is not true ; for if the Mind , Heart , or Soul within be not cloathed therewith , how is it put on ? or how should good or acceptable Fruits be brought forth to God , if not from an inward and Everlasting Righteousness ? And though Man doth not partake thereof from the beginning of Life , Can this Man think that Christ's Death or Obedience without , doth Justifie Men , or make them be deem'd Righteous from the beginning of Life to the End ? howbeit , when Men are converted and become the Righteousness of God in Christ , and come to Live and Dye ( or end their Dayes ) in him , they are accepted and blessed ; yea blessed are the Dead which dye in the Lord , for their Works follow them . Mark the Perfect Man , and behold the Upright , for the End of that man is Peace : But all this Man's Imputation of a Righteousness and best Robe ( which he sayes , is a Righteousness wrought without us , there being none wrought within us ; so God , &c. p. 99. ) depends upon his Doctrine for Sin and Imperfection term of Life , which he & his Brethren have not only concluded must continue in the best of Men and their best Actions all their Dayes ; but Imperfection even in Christ's Work or Righteousness wrought in his People , which therefore he disclaims from being concerned in our Justification ; but sayes , we are Justified by that Righteousness which Christ wrought without us , though he cannot deny , but that Christ wrought the Righteousness of the Law without us ( and conformed to the Law in the Dayes of His Flesh ) which I suppose will not be deemed our Justification : But if I ask , By and to Whom was this Obedience , Righteousness or Satisfaction made without us , to be Imputed unto us as ours , or men thereby Justified while Unjust , Imperfect and Sinful , without the Robe of Righteousness in themselves ; or rather accounted Just from the beginning of Life to the End ? ( whether all or some of these for whom Christ dyed , he tells us not ) You may take this for his Answer , viz. God in our Nature obeyed God ; and this is Righteousness of Infinite Value , the very best Robe , p. 99. Rep. 1. Is this the Compensation , Payment and Satisfaction in our stead to vindictive Justice , so much pleaded by our Opposers ? Were it good Doctrine to say , either that God obeyed , and satisfied his own Revenge by obeying himself ( as if he were divided and at Variance with himself ) or that he was revenged on himself , considered as Christ in our Nature or Flesh ? I cannot own this Doctrine , that such a rigid Payment and Satisfaction could be required in the Nature of the great Propitiation and Sacrifice for Sin ; but a Pacification or Attonement and a Condescension to Forgiveness of Sin past , to be receiv'd on true Faith and Repentance . 2. That Christ in the Flesh did by his divine Power perfectly obey the Father agendo & patiendo , i. e. by doing and suffering ; and therein was an acceptable and satisfactory Sacrifice for Sin , is not any Matter in Question or Doub●… with me ; but that God obeyed God by way of a rigid or strict Payment ; made to himself , as a Satisfaction to absolute Revenge or vindictive Justice , thereby to acquit Man continuing in his Sin and Imperfections : This I utterly deny , as repugnant to the very Language and Tenour of the holy Scriptures and Testimonies of the holy Men , which require Obedience and Faithfulness to God ( and a walking in his Light ) on our Parts . 3. As also your Continuance in Sin , and yet thinking your selves absolved or justified by Christ's Dying for you , is contrary to the very Intent of Christ's Dying for all , which was , that as many as live , should not live unto themselves , but unto him that dyed and rose again . 4. While he shuts out Justification , as done or effected by God obeying God , as he saith ; how is the Creature to put this on as a Robe , seeing these Men like not to be concerned in Christ's inherent Righteousness or Holiness , as a Matter of Justification ? Which while they are not Partakers of , nor cloathed with , they are cloathed with Sin and Iniquity , the Rags of old Adam and self-Righteousness , ●…vered with a Covering , but not of God's Spirit ; and how then should they be invested with the best Robe upon these filthy Garments , or while unstript of those old Rags ? Surely they will find it otherwise . 5. For they will find , that if they appear before the Lord , not having on the Wedding-Garment , the white Linnen , the Righteousness of Saints , they will be found speechless , and be turned out as unmeet Guests ; their own Guilt will stop their Mouths that they will not be able to plead and say , O God , thou hast obeyed thy self in our Nature for us ; or , Christ's Obedience , Suffering and Death is imputed to us for our Justification ; we are very fit Guests , only on that Account ; though we be all our Dayes disobedient , polluted and sinful in our best Actions : This will be no Plea for you ; neither will God say then , bring forth the best Robe and put upon these mens filthy Rags and polluted Garments ; but Friend , how camest thou hither , not having on the Wedding-Garment take this evil Servant and cast him into utter Darkness ; Devart ye Workers of Iniquity , I know you not . God will take Vengeance on all them that know him not , who obey not the Gospel , but obey Unrighteousness ; and Tribulation and Anguish will be upon their Souls . 6. The Prodigal's coming to himself , and returning to his Father's House with Regreet and Bewailing himself to his Father , saying , Father , I have sinned against Heaven and in thy Sight ; I am not worthy to be called thy Son ; and the Father's meeting him with Compassion , and then calling for the best Robe to put upon him , and allowing him sumptuous and joyful Entertainment upon his Return and Repentance : This makes for our Purpose ; The Prodigal did not remain in his Extravagancy , nor among the Swine from his Father's House , confidently telling his Fellows , That though I be an Unfaithful and Disobedient Son , and thereby am become poor and ragged ; 't is sufficient that I believe , and apply my Father's best Robe and Entertainment that he hath in his House at this Distance , and in this my Rebellion ; Nor did he say to his Father when he met him , Father , thou hast been faithful , and hast perfectly obeyed and fully paid thy self in my stead for me , which I must look upon as my Absolution and Acquitment from all thy Anger , Frowns and future Punishments , though I continue a Disobedient & Rebellious Son all my Dayes ; thy Obeying thy self is my whole Discharge for all my Iniquities past , present and to come , &c. Surely this was not the returning penitent Prodigal 's Song ( though it be the impenitent Presbyter's ) but Father , I have Sinned , &c. make me as one of thy hired Servants : His inward Remorse and Penitency spake sorth it self as his acceptable Plea , and there is Joy in Heaven over one Sinner that repenteth ; not over impenitent , unmortified Hypocrites , and Boasters of Christ's Righteousness without them , and they living in the World without it or him either . I have often granted and confest , that neither by the Deeds of the Law , nor by mens own Actions are any justified with God : But the Man's concluding , that our personal Obediences to God's Will and in God's Strength are the Deeds of the Law , whether we obey from Faith or without Faith , they are the Deeds of the Law ; and what is the Consequence ? Therefore not justifying , or our Obedience by Faith to the Will of God , and that by his own Strength , is not concerned in our Justification : And both these I must deny as unsound and unscriptural ; for 1. The Deeds or Works of the Law , by which no Flesh shall be justified , are not that Obedience of Faith which the Apostles preached , which was and is acceptabl●… to God ; nor that justifying Faith or Belief in God , which is Obedience itself , and without which it is impossible to please God or be justified : Dare he deny that this believing is Obeying ? 2. To conclude obeying the Will of God from Faith , not to be of a justifying Tendence , is repugnant to plain Scripture , Jam. 2. 24. And note , that if all Works and obeying God , even from Faith , must be counted the Deeds of the Law , by which none be justified ; then this makes the Apostle James's Testimony void , as thwarting Paul's , where James said , Was not Abraham our Father justified by Works ? &c. And Abraham believed God , and it was imputed to him for Righteousness , Jam. 2. 21. 23. And was not this Believing of God a real Obeying ? though not those Deeds of the Law spoken of Rom. 3. 20. For the Obedience or Works of living Faith , which justifie in James his Sense , and the Works of the Law ( not of Faith ) which Paul mentions , are two differing States and Things , otherwise there would be a Clash between them . Again , If Abraham's believing God , was imputed to him for Righteousness ; and so the Righteousness of true andliving Faith be imputed to them also , who walk in the Steps of the Faith of Abraham , who was faithful & obedient ; for any to oppose the Imputation of this Righteousness , as to its being within , or endeavour to exclude this Righteousness of Christ and Faith from true Believers , as only wrought without them , and not within them , because imputed or reckoned theirs ; it were as good Doctrine to exclude true Faith and Obedience of it , as all wrought without us , not within us , and yet say , t is imputed to us ; for living Faith which worketh by Love , and the Righteousness of it , are inseparable . But the Man is greatly confounded in a self Contradiction , where he grants that Christ's Justifying Righteousness ( that is Imputed ) is the same that redeems our lost Souls ; p. 100. ( which is true ) And yet he shuts out , not only Believers personal Obedience to the Will of God , through Faith and God's own Strength ; but also Sanctification and Holiness ( and so the Inward Work of Christ ) from being our Justifying Righteousness or Redeeming our lost Soul , p. 100. Where then and how is the Soul redeemed ? Is not the Soul within ? And is not Christ made unto true Believers Wisdom , Righteousness ; Sanctification and Redemption ; and all these inwardly received ? and hath not this man confessed that we are saved by the Washing of Regeneration ? &c. and so Justified or made Just by inherent Holiness , from Titus 3. 5 , 7. Can we be both saved and Justified through this inward Washing of Regeneration , and yet not redeemed nor Justified through it ? Oh! Confusion and Darkness to be seen and felt . Arg. II. No Righteousness wrought by us , is of that Worth as to redeem our lost Souls , nor for that are we Justified ; therefore the Sufferings of Christ only , &c. This Argument ( sayes he ) God enabled me the first Dispute to press with full Enlargement on the Consciences of the People to secure them from the Soul-destroying Error of this man. Rep. This Accusation upon me is both groundless , false and malitious . For 1st , I never affirmed any such Doctrine , as that any Righteousness wrought by the Creature , doth redeem man s lost Soul to God ; nor place any such Infinite Worth , Price or Merit upon any temporal Act or Work of Man ; but Christ Jesus , who is God's Righteousness , is the Redeemer , Deli verer , and so the Redemption of the Soul to God , by whom also the Soul is enabled to true Obedience : It is by Grace in him , through Faith , that we are saved ; not of our selves , it is the Gift of God ; nor of Works , lest any Man should boast ; howbeit , Good Works are ordained of God that we should walk in them ; for we are his Workmanship , created in Christ again unto good Works , see Eph. 2. 8 , 9 , 10. 2dly , I never undervalued the Worth of Christ's Sufferings in the Flesh ; far be it from me so to do , though yet I cannot own this man's placing mens absolute Justification on them , and from thence shutting out Christ's Inward Work of Sanctification ; yet thereto both the Travil of his Soul. Intercession , Sufferings and Sacrifice had a lively Tendency , seing that both Remission and Sanctification is known through Faith in his Blood , which both purgeth the Conscience , sanctifieth and justifieth . I do confess that as the Redemption of the Soul , or its Salvation , is of infinite Value ; so the Price that procures it must be equivalent and nothing short of infinite . But I further perceive my Opposer is confounded in this matter of Satisfaction and Justification as he states it ; for one while he reckons , t is only by God obeying God in our Nature ; an other while , ' t is only by the Sufferings and Death of Christ ( which he calleth his Righteousness imputed ) wherein also he contradicts divers of his eminent Brethren , who say , that Christ could not satisfie divine Justice as Man simply , by temporal Death and Suffering , because Infinite Justice must be answered with an infinite Satisfaction , Price or Payment for Man's Redemption : Others again are of the mind , that God Being Infinite and Perfect in all his Attributes both in Goodness , Love and Mercy as well as Justice ; and Omnipotent in Power , he could forgive or pardon Sin , upon true Repentance ( without such a strict and severe Payment as before , as to be sure he both can and doth . To his pressing with Enlargement on the Consciences of the People viz. That they are Justified and Redeemed only by the Suffering of Christ , and not by his inward Work of Sanctification and Holiness , any more then by their own Works or Righteousness wrought by them . The Unjustness and Unrighteousness of both such Teachers and People that follow them , do manifest what little Effect such Preaching hath upon Conscience ; neither indeed doth it tend to any reall in ward Conviction or Remorse in order to a true Conversion ; but to make them believe they are already secure and saved in their Sins , and pure in their own Eyes , when they are not washed from their Filthiness , ( which is to Justifie the Wicked , or declare them , Just ( and to condemn the Just , or declare Christ as the Subject of his Fathers Wrath , in Man's stead ) How falsly and corruptly have many Defiled and Guilty Consciences unjustly acquitted and eased themselves on this account ? But had he in Truth pressed the Necessity of Turning to the true Light in the Confidence , Repeatance , Regeneration , the new Birth , Obedience of Faith , perseverance in Grace , &c. this might have had Impression on the Consciences in order to a Reformation , and so have manifested and demonstrated the blessed 〈◊〉 and End of Christ's Coming , Suffering and Sacrifice for Sinners , and God s holy Design therein , and his condescending to make a Covenant in his own terms with them , to receive them into his Kingdom , Government and Protection ; none of whose Terms or Covenant , is Continuance in Sin or Disobediance term of Life ; for to be received in Covenant with God is , to be received into Agreement and Union with him . But after this Man hath shut out both Obedience to the Will of God through Faith , Sanctification & Holiness , from being our justifying Righteousness , or to redeem or acquit , &c. he essaies to mend the Matter , saying , It doth not shut it out , either as inconsistent or a needless thing , &c. And wherein is Sanctification consistent and needful ? Is it consistent and needful to Justification , y●…a or nay ? Take his Answer . It is so far from being inconsistent , that they are inseparable , and the one a Means to the other . Well said ; Is Faith and Justification consistent , and Faith a Means thereof ? This overthrows his shutting 〈◊〉 Sanctification therein ; for there can be no living and justifying Faith without Sanctification ; But then he goes round again , viz. Flying out of our selves , as seeing nothing but Matter of Condemnation nation in ourselves to Jesus Christ by Faith , and apprehending the Purity and Holiness of our Saviour's Heart and Life , &c. Whether do you fly out of your selves to Jesus Christ ? And by what Faith can he be seen , laid hold on , or his Purity be apprehended to your Justification , while there is nothing seen but Matter of Condemnation in your selves ? For 1st , The true and living Faith is not enjoyed without some Degree of Sanctification within ; and if without this Faith you cannot be justified , then not 〈◊〉 inward Sanctification ; true Faith , and Love by which it worketh , are Fruits of the Spirit , and the Mystery of Faith is held in a pure Conscience ; and he that believeth in the Son of God 〈◊〉 Life . 2dly , The Righteousness of Faith doth not bid us fly out of our selves to Christ's Sufferings without only for Justification ( and that while there is nothing to be seen within but Matter of Condemnation ( which is to impute Christ's Susfering to mens Justification , while they are under Condemnation in themselves , as if they were imputatively just and righteous , even when really and actually damned , which is a sad Imputation , and none of God's nor Christ's ) but the Righteousnes ; of Faith , rather bids us return to the Word of Faith that is nigh in the Heart , to obey it and do it , which Word is both saving and justifying to them that obey it : Say not in thy Heart , who shall ascend ( or fly up ) into Heaven to bring Christ down ; or who shall descend into the deep to bring Christ again from the dead ; but the Word is nigh thee , &c. Rom. 10. And 't is by this ingrafted Word that the true Faith is wrought in the Heart , and the true Application , Benefit and Confession is made to the Soul of Christ's Sufferings , Death and Resurrection , and the real Intent , blessed End and spiritual Advantage thereof , experienced by true Believers , who are Obeyers and Doers of the Word , and not meer outside Hearers and Talkers . Again , this man in Contradiction to his excluding Sanctification before , and saying , that Holiness is not needful to constitute a justifying Righteousness ; and to his Doctrine for Imperfection and Sin , and his justifying Persons condemned in themselves ; He grants thus far to the Effects of Faith , viz. Our Hearts turning to God , we dislike our Sins . We are sweetly engaged to please God in all things . That thus God purifies our Hearts by Faith. That thus we are sanctified by Faith which is in Christ. And a lively Faith will work by Love. It is needful to testifie our Love to God and Christ , and to please and honour God , and be a good Example to our Neighbour , &c. Come on ; Good Doctrine ! Well said S. S. And is not Faith needful to Justification ? And can we be justified without pleasing God , or please God without Justification ? or is not that of a justifying Nature which pleaseth God ? Pray consider it ; the Apostles Experience was , being justified by Faith , they had Peace with God , Rom. 5. ●… . And whatsoever we ask we receive of him , because we keep his Commandment , and do those Things that are pleasing in his Sight , 1 Joh. 3. 22. But S. S. and his Brethren expect to be accepted and justified , because Christ kept the Fathers Commandments , or because God obeyed God ( as his Phrase is ) and on the same Account to be heard and answered of God , while they break his Commands , and do those things that are displeasing in his Sight . Again , John the beloved Disciple said , Hereby we know that we are of the Truth , and shall assure our Hearts before him ; for if our Heart condemn us , God is greater then our Heart , and knoweth all things ; but if our Heart condemn us not , then have we Confidence towards God , 1 Joh. 3. 19. 20 , 21. to the End. But S. S. and his Brethren pretend Faith , Justification and so Confidence towards God ( because of Christ's Sufferings only ) when their Hearts do condemn them ( from the Evidence of the true Light bearing Witness against them ) and when they see nothing but Matter of Condemnation in them ; and indeed this their dead Faith , Confidence and false Imputation are of the same Matter . The true Apostle said , Let us draw near with a true Heart , in full Assurance of Faith , having our Hearts sprinkled from an evil Conscience , and our Bodies washed with pure Water , Heb. 10. 22. But our Sin-pleasing Presbyters think to draw near unto God in a justified Condition on the Account of Christ's Sufferings only , with such a Faith as doth not purifie the Heart ; and having both a polluted , sinful Heart , and a defiled or evil Conscience all their Dayes . The Apostle Johns Testimony was , Herein is our Love made perfect ( viz. in our dwelling in God , and God in us ) that we may have Boldness in the Day of Judgment , because as he is , so are we in this World , 1 Joh. 4. 16 , 17. But the Imperfection and Sin pleading Presbyters think to have Boldness in the Day of Judgment , because Christ was perfect and suffered in the Flesh , although they remain all their Dayes imperfect and sinful , seeing nothing but Matter of Condemnation in themselves ; and so are not at all like God nor Christ in this Present World : They think it will be a Sufficient Plea , that Christ was Perfect and Sinless in their stead ; that God obeyed God , and so was like himself , how Imperfect and unlike him soever they be on this side the Grave ; they conceiting themselves Elect Persons Christ said , If ye love me keep my Sayings , Joh. 14. 23. and John said , By this we know that we love the Children of God , when we love God and keep his Commandments ; for this is the Love of God that we keep his Commandments and they are not Grievous , 1 Joh. 5. 2. 3. But our Opposers , the Presbyters and others , will pretend they love God and his Children , while they are daily breaking and violating his Commandments , and will not believe it possible for any to keep them in this Life , though assisted by the Power of Christ. The Apostle Peter testified , That even Baptism doth now save us , not the putting away of the Filth of the Flesh ( or outside Washing ) but the Answer or ( as some have it ) Demand of a Good Conscience towards God by the Resurrection of Jesus Christ , 1 Pet. 3. 21. But our Opposers Belief and Principle is , That 't is only Christ's Obedience , Sufferings and Death in the Flesh imputed to us , that doth save and Justifie them ; and on this is only their Plea and Demand , and not from his Spirit 's Work of Sanctification or spiritual Baptism , nor the Answer or Demand of a Good Conscience towards God ; they have both shut out Sanctification and Holiness , ( and so excluded Good Conscience ) from being needful to Justification , or to constitute a Justifying Righteousness , * for they herein hold , or at least imply two Righteousnesses of Christ , the one Outward to Justifie , and the other Inward to Sanctifie ; the one Imputative , and the other Inherent ; the one Perfect , and the other Imperfect : And so the Sufferings and Death of Christ in the Flesh ( however inflicted on him by wicked Hands and Murtherers ) must be imputed by these men as the Perfect Justifying Righteousness ; but Christ's own Everlasting Righteousness of Sanctification in the Saints must be deemed Impersect , and not accounted unto Justification ; nor the best Robe , though it be the white Linnen , the Saints Righteousness , whose Garments are washed and made white in the Blood of the Lamb. Whereas Christ's everlasting Righteousness , Holiness , Love , Faith , Patience , &c. ( wherein he perfectly obeyed the Father , and resigned up to his Will both in Doing and Suffering ) were inherent in him ; and therein , and for that Cause his Obedience and Sacrifice was most acceptable and a sweet smelling Savour to God ; not with respect to the Murtherous Act of those that crucified and slew him ; but with respect to that Inherent Holiness , everlasting Righteousness and eternal Spirit , by which he offered uphimself a Lamb without Blemish , and spotless Sacrifice to God , and alwayes did those things that pleased him , Joh. 8. 29. And of the same everlasting Righteousness must every true Believer partake in himself , by the same eternal Spirit by which the Saints were both Washed , Cleansed , Sanctified and Justified , 1 Cor. 6. 11. Through the same eternal Spirit , the same Power , the same Righteousness , the same Holiness , the same Faith , the same Love , the same Patience , &c. that was in Christ , do they partake of , who truly follow him and walk in his steps , having his Life manifest in them , and received the Spirit of the Son , which receives of his things , and giveth unto them who walk after the Spirit , not after the Flesh : But , Quest. What can we give to God for our Souls , proportionable to so Great a Loss , to so great Sufferings ? Sanctification and Holiness ; or a little Faith , and the Works that follow ? This is likely to do ! Answ. A groundless Question in the first place ; no man can redeem his Brother , nor give to God a Ransom for him ; for the Redemption of the Soul is pretious , and so pretious , as that which cannot be procured without a Price of Infinite Value : Christ gave himself a Ransom for all ; 't is Christ himself that ransoms , saves and redeems the Soul to God , and that through Sanctification , or washing of Regeneration ; and Christ is made unto us who believe in him , both Righteousness , Sanctification and Redemption : however , this man undervalues Sa●…ctification and a little Faith ; and though it be the Gift o●… God to us ( and not ours to him ) and the Saints Victory , we have not given to God the Ransom nor the Price ; he Loved us first , and therefore we Love and believe in him : and in this was manifested the Love of God towards us , because he sent his only begotten Son into the World that we might Live through him , 1 Joh. 4. Again , though the Phrase [ Merit of Christ's Blood and Sufferings ] be not a Scripture Phrase ; yet the Worth and Value thereof , with respect to man's Salvation , we never disesteemed , since we knew the true and spiritual Application , Virtue and Effects of his Blood , &c. through his Light and Spirit , to the purging our Consciences , cleansing and justifying , which yet is an inward Experience , not shut out nor put afar off by the true Church , whom God hath purchased with his own Blood , not redeemed with corruptible thing , but with the pretious Blood of Christ , ( which therefore is incorruptible ) Act. 20. 28. 1 Pet. 1. 17 , 18. cited by S. S. But then he egregiously mistakes in saying , viz. Let us then with Paul abhor all Sanctification in us , all Holiness , all Works of Faith whatever is wrought by us , in Comparison of what we spie by Faith in Christ. Answ. A very gross Mistake and Perversion ; an Abuse of Paul and of those Hearers to whom S. S. preaches such impious Doctrine : It was not Sanctification or Holiness within ; nor yet the Works or Obedience of Faith that Paul either abhorred or rejected for the Excellency of the Knowledge of Christ , or that he might win Christ ; but it was his former Confidence in the Flesh , his own self-Righteousness , which was of the Law , and all those things that had been deemed as Gain to him , that he counted Loss for Christ , and for whom he suffered the Loss of all those things , and counted them but as Dung , that he might win Christ , which he could not so account of all Sanctification or Holiness , wrought by Christ within , nor of the Works of Faith : Can it be any less then Blasphemy ( as in this man's Sense ) thus to present and read Paul ? viz. I abhor all Sanctification within , all Holiness and Works of Faith ; and I count them but all Loss for the Excellency of the Knowledge of Christ Jesus ; and have suffered the Loss of all my inward Holiness , Sanctification and Works of Faith , and do count them but Dung , that I may win Christ ? &c. How unlike Paul , odious and gross were it , thus to pervert his Words , as to say , Let us with Paul abhor all Sanctification in us , &c. neither doth Paul make any such Difference or Repugnancy between Christ's inward Work of Sanctification , and the Excellency of his Knowledge ; nor between being in the Faith or Obedience thereof , and being in Christ and his Righteousness ; but really desired that he might be found in Christ , not having ( said he ) mine own Righteousness , which is of the Law ; but that which is through the Faith of Christ , the Righteousness which is of God by Faith , Phil. 3. 9. so far was he from either putting the Righteousness of Faith afar off , or abhorring Sanctification within , that he desired to have it and be possessed with it , as one found in Christ. For that only doth God justifie us , which doth suffice to turn away his Wrath from us , and satisfie his Justice for our Transgression ; but Christ's Sufferings only , &c. Answ. I deny his minor , as it depends on the Word only ; for then , why are not all Men in the World justified , for whom Christ suffered and dyed ? which was for all Men ; he tasted Death for every Man , for the Sins of the whole World : And yet , he that believeth not on the Son hath not Life , but the Wrath of God abides upon him ; therefore without Faith , Repentance and Conversion ( which are Effects of Christ's inherent Righteousness and Work ) the Wrath is not turned away , nor are Men justified . Obj. Let us then place no Confidence in Sanctification , Holiness , Faith , and the Works that follow , as if these ( laying aside Christ's Death on the Cross ) could turn away God's Wrath , &c. Rep. Herein he varies from his Argument before , which was , that Christ's Sufferings only can turn away Wrath , justifie , &c. Note , It is not Sanctification , Holiness , Faith , &c. only can do it , without Christ's Death ( or laying it aside ) But while here he implies , that Sanctification , Holiness , Faith , &c. ( with respect to Christ's Death ) can turn away Wrath , he hath contradicted his own Argument before of Christ's Sufferings only , which also cannot be slited ; nor his Death made void , where true Faith & Sanctification in him are enjoyed ; for therein Christ himself is enjoyed , and we dare not preach nor own such Doctrine , as to abhor all Sanctification in us ; nor the having no Confidence in Faith and Sanctification , which are wrought in the Soul by Christ Jesus . CHAP. IV. Of Satisfaction ; some serious Considerations farther opening the Doctrine and Sence of our Opposers . Obj. GOd will not Justifie us without full Satisfaction to his Justice for our Sin. Rep. And what Kind of Satisfaction is it , he thinks this Justice requires ? ( We confess a Satisfaction , or answering his Good Pleasure in and by Christ Jesus ; but about the Manner of it , as supposed and stated , we differ ) See how the man states it ; He concludes , it must be a Punishing our Fall. 1st , From God's Judgment . 2dly , God's Truth . 3dly , God's Will and Purpose . Quest. What is his Ground from these ? see his Answer , viz. 1st , God hath said in the Day thou eatest thereof thou shalt Dye . 2dly , Cursed is he that continues not in all , &c. Rep. God's Truth is concerned in his gracious Promises ( both absolute and conditional ) as well as in his conditional Threats : And let it be considered , 1st . That Man's Dying in the Day he so eat , was the Fruit of his Fall into a State of Misery , in dying from that State of Righteousness and Felicity he was in before ; and it was the Natural Effect of his Transgression ; and yet not so as that God was absolutely bound to bring eternal Death on Man in that day , no , no ; nor was divine Justice so narrowly tyed up or short sighted , as not to reserve a Remedy , for God had the Seed of the Woman in his eye ; and divine Justice doth not require that eternal Death or the second death , shall remain upon any , but on the finally Impenitent , who continue in Sin under the Power of the first Death ; for all they who return to God and receive Christ the promised Seed , he proves to them both a Just God and a Saviour : neither Justice nor the Curse of the Law can limit him from shewing Mercy , Remission or Salvation to the Creature , upon true Repentance and Faith in Christ Jesus , who overcomes the World and the evil Nature ; from whence those cursed Actions have sprung , mentioned Deut. 27. 15. to the end of the Chapter . And t is true , the Jews outward , who rejected the Righteousness of Faith ( that is received in the Spirit ) when Christ was set forth , and fetcht their Righteousness from the Letter of the Law , they did strictly and formally bring themselves under the Curse thereof , when they continued not in all that was written ; But there is no Condemnation ( or Curse ) to them that are in Christ Jesus [ my Opposer leaves out what follows ] viz. that walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit , Rom. 8. 1. Yet what the Law saith , it saith to them that are under the Law , that every Mouth may be stopt , and all the World may become Guilty before God : This Law therefore ( as thus convicting ) is Spiritual and tends to man's Conversion , in that it is to prepare him for Mercy , which divine Justice doth not hinder , nor detain the World under the Guilt ; divine Truth being concerned in the gracious Promises , which are Yea and Amen in the Promised Seed that ransoms Man , slayes the Enmity , crucifies the Transgressors or first Birth which must dye , upon which the Law and its Sentence of Death must pass ; and Man that is guilty must feel this in himself before he be delivered into that State wherein there is no Condemnation , or be united to the Lord who Kills and makes Alive : So that neither Justice nor Truth in the Law are frustrated ; the Law is not made void through Faith , but established in the Spirituality and Purity of it ; the Righteousness of the Law being fulfilled in them that walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit ; And 't is said , that the Righteousness of God without the Law is manifested , being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets , even the Righteousness of God , which is by the Faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe , Rom. 3. Christ came to condemn Sin in the Flesh ; and is the End of the Law for Righteousness , to all them that believe ( and not for the Continuance of Unrighteousness ) and where Sin is put an End to by Christ , the Curse and Condemnation of necessity ceaseth with it , and the Righteousness of Faith takes place in the Soul. Obj. Adam hath sinned — We are by Nature Children of Wrath in our own Persons ; We have failed , hence God's Wrath is up against us , God burning in his Wrath is ready to condemn us , to take Vengeance on us , to consume us as Fire ; not to Justifie and acquit from our Ill Deserts , &c. If Burning ten thousand millions of Years in Hell is not enough to turn away his Wrath , &c. Rep. Thus he hath defined divine Justice , as he thinks ( which is further spoken to hereafter ) but upon whom must it be thus satisfied , supposeth he ? S. S. Justice is satisfied upon Transgression , p. 103. Rep. Then upon Rebellious Transgressors , and not upon Christ , who was alwayes Innocent and did the things well pleasing to the Father ; and therefore divine Justice could never burn , nor take such Vengeance on him for Satisfaction , and let the Guilty go free ; for so to do could not be Justice ; the Satisfaction whereof ( as it intends the Undergoing the Penalty of the Law due for the Injury done ) Justice can only require it of the Offender and Guilty , for whom the Law was made ; not of the innocent or Righteous , for whom the Law was not made : But where then were the Mercy or Forgiveness to the poor Creature that hath sinned , if God were so engaged to burn in his Wrath , and take the full Vengeance upon lost man ? S. S. His Truth engageth him to execute his Justice in punishing Sin ( yea to the full ) should Mercy offer to pronounce any man absolved , his Sin unpunished , Truth would stop the Mouth of Mercy , and say , Hold , I have Cursed , &c. Rep. What strange and lamentable Division would this make in God! and how variable and in Contrariety with himself ? And how Contrary to the Testimonies of his Faithful Witnesses hath this Man rendered God ? As if absolute Revenge and Wrath towards all Mankind did bear the sole Sway in him over all , both his Love , Goodness and Mercy ; Oh sad ! Is not his Mercy over all his Works ? and hath he not Forgiveness in store ? unto whom it is said , who is a God like unto Thee , that pardoneth Iniquity and passeth by the Transgression of the Remnant of his Heritage , he retaineth not his * Anger forever , because he delighteth in Mercy , Mica . 7. 18. The Lord God merciful and gracious , forgiving Iniquity , Transgression and Sin , Exod. 34. 6 , 7. So that even in the Law Gods Mercy and Forgiveness ( as well as his Threats ) were signified , which his Truth must needs be concerned in . Is it not evident , that God is not engaged under Revenge ( nor his Mercy and Truth divided or opposite ) as this Man renders him ? For both must be received , and have their place where Judgment and Mercy meet , and men through the Law become dead unto the Law , so as to know Christ to live in them , and through God's Judgment and Chastisements to find a Ransom and an Attonement ; and God hath Power to turn away Wrath , as he doth upon men's true Repentance , Humiliation and Return to him ; as when the King humbled himself , the Wrath of the Lord turned away from him , 2 Chron. 12. 12. And also Hezekiah seeing the Wrath of the Lord upon Judah and Jerusalem for their doing Evil in his Sight , and turning their Backs , &c. He said , Now is it in mine Heart to make a Covenant with the Lord God of Israel , that his fierce Wrath may turn away from us , 2 Chron. 29. 8 , 10. And ( in the King's Letters ) be ye not stiff necked but yield your selves unto the Lord ; serve the Lord your God , that the Fierceness of his Wrath may turn away from you , 2 Chro. 30. 6 , 8. The King did not conclude , that the Curses pronounced before in Deut. 27. against Offenders , did obliege God to perpetual Revenge , or not to turn away his fierce Wrath , if the People turned from their Iniquities : And said the Lord unto his Church ( that was to be gathered of the Gentiles ) In a little Wrath I hid my Face from thee for a Moment ; but with Everlasting Loving Kindness will I have Mercy on thee , saith the Lord , thy Redeemer , Isa. 54. 8. And concerning Israel , whose Heart was not right with God , neither were they stedfast in his Covenant ; 't is written , But he being full of Compassion , forgave their Iniquity , and destroyed them not ; Yea , many a time turned he his Anger away , and did not stir up all his Wrath ; for he remembred , that they were but Flesh , &c. Psal. 78. 37 , 38. Yea , in the midst of Judgment and in Wrath he hath remembred Mercy ; Righteousness , and Equity are the Stablishment of his Throne ; Mercy and Truth go before his Face , Psal. 89. 14. See how well consistent his Mercy and Truth are : also Psal. 57. 3. and 61. 7. and 98. 3. and 103. 8. and 115. 1. and 119. 64. and 130. 7. Dan. 9. 4. Therefore neither his Justice , Law nor Truth could intend ( or be ) any Limitation or Tye to his Power or Soveraignity , not to turn away his Wrath , or shew Mercy to them that turn away from Evil ; and Mercy rejoyceth against Judgment ( or Condemnation ) Jam. 2. 13. His Truth is so far from stopping the Mouth of Mercy ; yea , 't is most evident to the spiritual Travellers , that though God hide his Face , and send forth his Terrors because of Mens Iniquities and Sins , he hath Power to turn away his Wrath , extend Pardon , and shew the Light of his Countenance ( as he really doth ) when Men turn from Iniquity , and depart from Evil , and with broken Hearts submit themselves to his Power , who keepeth Covenant and Mercy toward them that love him , and them that keep his Commandments , Dan. 9. And for any to deny him this Power and Soveraignity in himself , to shew Mercy and Forgiveness , is 1st , To deny the true God to be God. 2dly , To deny his Love and Goodness . 3dly , To deny his Omnipotency , Infiniteness and Perfection . 4thly , To render God less gracious and kind then his Son. 5thly , To debase God's Power , Glory and Soveraignity below the Prerogative of Earthly Princes , which is best shewn in mitigating , rather then in exacting the Rigor of Laws ; in Acts of Pardon or Grace , rather then the Severity of Revenge upon the Subjects . 6thly . To conclude , That God cannot forgive Sin or Debt , but must have full Payment , or use the utmost Revenge or Rigor ( for Satisfaction ) ( whether on the Debtor or Surety ) is contrary to Christ's Similitude of the Kingdom of Heaven , as likened unto a King that had Compassion on his Servant , when he 〈◊〉 down and worshipped him , and forgave him all his Debt o●… ten thousand Talents ; and blasphemously renders God like the same Servant , in his Want of Patience towards his fellow Servant , taking him by the Throat and casting him into Prison for his hundred Pence , so that the Lord was wrath with this unmerciful Servant , and delivered him to the Tormentors , &c. See Mat. 18. 7thly , To represent God thus Cruel and Revengeful , either to Man or to Christ in his stead , as that he cannot otherwise pardon Sins past before Conviction ( without such a rigid Satisfaction or Payment ) is to deny him to be a Just God and a Saviour , when besides him there is no Saviour ; or as if to be a Saviour were inconsistent with his being a just God , contrary to his own plain Testimony ; See Isa. 45. 14 , 15. Chap. 43. 10 , 11 , 12. and 49. 26. and 63. 8. Jer. 14. 8. Hos. 13. 4. 1. Tim. 1. 1. Chap. 4. 10. Tit. 3 , 4 , 5. Jud. 25. And thus saith the Lord God ( unto the Seed of Jacob ) I , even I , am the Lord , and beside me there is no Saviour : I , even I , am he that blotteth out thy Transgressions for MINE OWN'SAKE , and will not remember thy Sins . Now our Opposer having justified the Wicked , and rendred God cruel ; we must now take a View of his condemning the Just One , for whose Dig●…ity I thus appear on the behalf of God and the Son of his Love. The Man having taken Pains to justifie such as have nothing but Matter of Condemnation in them ; Let us now take notice what Honour he hath ascribed unto the Son of God , and what Entertainment he allows him , while ( to justifie the condemnable ) he condemns him as with Wrath & Vergeance ( which some call Justice vindictive ) whereby he reckons , the Sins of the World were punisht in 〈◊〉 . He alledgeth Rom. 8. 32. He that spared not his own Son , but delivered him up for us all : What made God's Just●…ce lay on so ? Did Christ ever by Sin provoke to this ? Will God punish where there is no Sin ? This is an ocular Demonstration . Rep. God spared not his own Son from what he was to do and suffer , but delivered him up for us all ; yet not to his own Revenge or burning Wrath incurred by Sin , but to be a Sacrifice for Sinners : It could not be , that Christ should be the Subject of the Wrath that is due to Sin , he being the Mediator between God and Man that had sinned ; No more could the Act of those wicked Hands & Murtherers that crucified him , be counted an Act of Gods Justice , laying on so , as fully punishing the Sin of the World in the Son of his Love ; for this is contrary to his Mediatorship , and to his being a Sacrifice of a sweet smelling Savour to God , both for a Pacification and putting away Sin : It behoves a Mediator and Advocate , to be a Man of Interest and Favour with the King , and not an Object of his Hatred , else he could not prevail for others , if himself were so out of Favour . S. S. The Faith of a Believer that is justified can here see Justice punishing his Transgression , and that he is not justified without full Satisfaction to Justice ; God hath punished then the Sins of all that are justified in Jesus Christ. Rep. See here how the Man hath condemned the Just that never sinned , unto the Punishment due to Sin : See how he has thundred it out against Jesus Christ ; the burning Wrath and Hell-Fire incurred by Sinners , must now be Christ's Punishment : Oh , wonderful Justice ! there was never such divine Justice known or heard of from just Men or justified Persons , How God ever could be thus angry with his ever Beloved , Innocent Son , whom he both freely gave and upheld in his Love through all his Sufferings ; for God was in Christ , reconciling the World to himself , bearing , forbearing , and as sympathizing with him in Spirit in his Sufferings , wherein Christ , as Man , was accepted a most acceptable Sacrifice ; howbeit , his bearing the Sin of many , rasting Death for every Man , was not by Way of Revenge or Wrath from the Father , nor the Punishment due to the World's Sin ; for tasting Death is far short of eternally dying : The Prophet said , Surely he has born our Griefs , and carried our Sorrows , yet we did esteem him stricken , smitten of God and afflicted ; but he was wounded for our Transgressions ; he was bruised for our Iniquities ; the Chastisement of our Peace was upon him , Isa. 53. It was man's Transgression that was his Burthen and Cause of his Grief and Suffering ; however , some esteemed him smitten or plagued of God ; He hath born our Griefs and carried our Sorrows , &c. Such as suffer with Christ , and lie under the Sence of their Burthen do not lay all , both the Sorrow and Punishment O●… Sin upon Christ ; such do not say , Christ was sorry or repented for us , therefore we need not ; or , Christ was chastised and afflicted in our Person for us , therefore we need not be chastised nor afflicted ; for Sin past Christ made Intercession , therefore we need not pray : This were not to know the Fellowship of his Sufferings , nor to be conformable to his Death , nor baptized with his Baptism . Besides , the Chastisement of our Peace upon him , was not Revenge nor burning Wrath from God : Chastisement and Vengeance are two things ; God's Chastisement is in Love , not in Revenge ; it pleased the Lord to bruise him ( who had done no Violence ) Isa. 53. by delivering him up to suffer and bear our Sorrows and Griefs [ AN ACT OF HIS GOOD PLEASURE , NOT OF REVENGE OR WRATH ] how could it be Justice , fully to punish the Innocent for the Wicked's Offence ? Were it not Blasphemy to charge God with such Cruelty and Inj●…stice . Obj. Every known Sin is a wilful Rejection of Infinite Goodness , a free Choice of Infinite Displeasure , &c. It therefore carries Infinite Demerit with it ; and nothing short of Infinite Punishment , or Sufferings of Infinite Wrath , can possibly suffice to satisfie for it . Rep. Wo unto them that persist in Sin , and reject Christ's inherent or inward Righteousness for such a Satisfaction as this of Infinite Punishment , &c. or that believe , their Sins were thus punisht in Christ , and thereupon continue in Sin ! Wo unto you that thus justifie the Wicked & condemn the Innocent ! God's Controversie is against you : you are afflicting , oppressing and crucifying the Just with your Iniquities , treading under Foot the Son of God , rejecting the Blood of the Covenant , you are Guilty of the Body and Blood of Christ , as much as they were that condemned him , and said , he was Guilty of Death ; your Doctrine imputes the Sin , Guilt and Punishment thereof to Christ ; you have esteemed him plagued of God , but you have pierced him and grieved him by your Iniquity and Hypocrisie : Take Heed of wilful sinning , and rejecting the Goodness of God , lest there remain no more a Sacrifice for you : Repent , repent , repent ; Return , return , return to the Lord God , before his Wrath sweep you away into Perdition . Further he saith , None but God's Equal , and this is God himself in our Nature , that is capable to satisfie God for Sin — Christ received the Stroak of God's Justice , &c. Rep. While he states this Satisfaction to be only by Way of punishing men's Sin in Christ , and now it is God himself that satisfies God ; this is of an absurd and blasphemous Tendence , as if God punisht himself ; or as if God satisfied God with Infinite Punishment or suffering of Infinite Wrath : and what is this but to divide God against himself ? Yet we may find out a better Sense for the Words before , that God and Christ were one & inseparable in the Suffering & Affliction ; That his Soul bore , as the Spirit of God was burthened , afflicted and grieved under the Weight and Pressure of Man's Iniquity and Sin ; howbeit , this was not of the Nature of strict Payment , made to God by himself in Man's stead , much less to punish man's Sin in Christ with infinite Wrath. Quest. Can Faith and the Works that follow , without the Imputation of Christ's Sufferings satisfie God's Majesty for our Sin ? Answ. Here he misseth the true State of the Controversie or Question , which should rather be , Can your Imputation of Christ's Sufferings without true Faith and the Obedience ( or Works thereof ) either satisfie God's Majesty for Sin , or justifie Men ? while he implies No , he hath given away his Cause , by granting , That the Sufferings of Christ alone can not justifie Men without true Faith and Obedience to him . By so much was Jesus made the Surety of a better Testament , Heb. 7. 22. This is no Proof that your Sins were imputed to him , as punish'd in him by the suffering of Infinite Wrath , which to affirm , renders him no better then a Transgressor , guilty of your Sins ( as your Brother T. D. hath affirmed ) which is much beneath his being Mediator or the Surety of the new Testament , which he was made the Surety of , to ensure and make good the Promises and Priviledges thereof to true Believers ( which are all Yea & Amen in him ) and to enable us to obey and perform those Terms and Conditions of the new Testament or Covenant , which concern us ; for we cannot receive the Promises but in him , nor discharge or pay our Duty without him ; therefore he is the Mediator of the new Covenant ; he is our high Priest , made with the Oath of God , and continueth forever ; and he is able to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him , seeing he ever liveth to make Intercession for them , Heb. 7. 24 , 25 , 28. But if God's Justice be fully satisfied for your Sins by the Sufferings of Christ , and for them only God justifie men , and secure them from Condemnation [ It being against Justice it self to punish those Sins a second time , that have been punisht to the full already ] he saith , How then shall God render to every Man according to his Works ? Indignation and Wrath to them that are contentious & obey not the Truth , but obey Unrighteousness ; Will they be able to plead this Doctrine before his Tribunal , Lord , thou hast punisht our Sins to the full in thy Son Christ : It is against Justice it self to punish them a second time ; for Christ dyed for all Men , tasted Death for every Man , gave himself a Ransom for all for a Testimony in due Time ? But if this were a Punishment of their Sins to the full , then how could Justice punish them again with Indignation & Wrath ? But Glory , Honour & Peace to them that do Good , to the Jew first , and also to the Gentile , to them that through Patient continuing in Well-doing , seek for Glory and Immortality eternal Life : see Rom. 2. Such do not plead Christ's doing Good and suffering only for them in his Person to justifie and excuse them in Sin in their Persons , or to cloak their doing Evil all their Life long , though Sin-pleasing Hypocrites thus endeavour to indulge themselves and others in their Iniquities : But be not deceived , God will not be mocked ; such as you sow , such shall you reap . Whereas S. S. accuseth G. W. with saying Satisfaction is not needfull ; Quoting , Divin . of Christ , pag. 62. And then cryes ; Such Blasphemy is this Man not affraid to utter ; the Lord Convince and Humble him . To thee S. S. I say , Thou hast wronged me ; those are none of my Words ; the Lord humble thee for thy belying me , thi●… is not the first time : If thou or any Reader , do but moderately view my Book and Page quoted by thee , it will plainly appear , that to say , Satisfaction is not needfull , are none o●… my Words ; for t is very plain , that I have not denyed , that Satisfaction that was in Christ ; but have objected aga nst the manner of their stating it , and sinful tendence of their Notion about it : as 1st , Against their making Satisfaction the Effect of God's full Revenge , or the Execution of Vindictive Justice ( as their Phrase is ) on his Innocent Son , thereby to clear the Guilty . 2dly , I have distinguished between God's Chastisement and Revenge . 3dly , That the Intent and End of God's Peoples undergoing his Chastisements or Correction ( according to Jer. 10. 24. Heb. 12. 9 , 10 , 11. And their partaking of the Fellowship of Christ's Sufferings ) is that they might be Partakers of his Holiness , live and reign with him . 4thly , I have plainly told my Opposers , That if Man continue in Rebellion against Christ , rejecting his Love and Grace , his Sufferings and Satisfaction will not free them from the Severity of God , nor from the Execution of his Judgment , which is committed t●… Christ , &c. Divin . of Christ , p. 62 , 63. The Truth of what I have written in the said Book in the Plaineness and Simplicity of it , stands over the Subtility of my Opposers , and remains unanswered ; and instead of an honest or moderate Answer , this Man does but pervert , curtaile , tautologize , nibble and pick at my Words , and abuse me ; He doth not so much as seriously take notice of the stress of my Objections , but over and over imposeth his Opinion , and brings a very unfit Instance for God's judging it meet to punish all Sin ( or that all our Sin is punished ) in his Son without Cruelty , &c. where he saith , If God doth damn the Impenitent , if he damns the fallen Angels , he is cruel . We say , No ; he is Just : But is this and his punishing your Sins in his Son to the full , a fit Parallel ? Let the unprejudiced Reader judge . And then he grosly imposeth and begs the Question again , viz. And for that person who is God , to suffer a temporal Death ( though in his human Nature only ) this is of infinite Value , an infinite Abasement , a stroke of Infinite Wrath ; for had not God's Wrath against Sin been Infinite , he would not thus have struck a Person of infinite Worth and Dearness to him , interposing as a Surety between him and us miserable Sinners : for ●…od in our Nature to suffer what he did , this is more then for Men or Devils , to suffer God's Eternal Wrath or Revenge ; this Wrath more clearly shines in the Infinitude of it in thus smiting * the Brightness of his Glory and Express Image of his Person * then in the eternal Damnation of Men and Devils in the unquenchable Flames of Hell. Rep. This strange Language against God and Christ , I shall need to ●…ay little about ; let them that know the holy Scriptures see how unlike them it is ; only I may query and demand of him , 1st , Where do the Scriptures say , That God suffered a Temporal Death as a Stroak of Infinite Wrath ? 2dly , That in Infinite Wrath he struck a Person of Infinite Worth and Dearness to him . 3dly , That this Wrath more clearly shines in the Infinitude of it in thus smiting the Brightness of his own Glory , &c. then in the Eternal Damnation of Men and Devils , &c. If I should conclude this both Blasphemous and Unscriptural Language , that thus sets God at variance with himself , or as smiting and punishing himself , &c. S. S. perhaps would be ready to cry out , Oh Blasphemy ! and charge it upon me , though it be his own , the very Tendence & Nature of his own Doctrine : The Matter is fully answered and refuted before . Again , Where do the Scriptures say , that God punished the Surety , Christ , for our Sins , and for a time poured forth his Wrath upon him for our Iniquities ? p. 108. I am sure the Scripture he cites , sayes the contrary of him , Isa. 42. 1. viz. Behold mine Elect in whom my Soul delighteth . Could he then pour forth his Wrath upon him for your Iniquities ? Oh! be ashamed of such Doctrine ; Could either the Chastisement of our Peace on him , his bearing the Sin of many , or carrying our Griefs , be the Father's pouring forth Infinite Wrath upon him ? That it is for Christ's sake that God doth pardon upon Repentance , is very true ( 't is well he Grants this upon Repentance ) and it is for Christ's sake ; for all the Good that is revealed or wrought in us , that is acceptable to God ( as true Faith , Repentance , Obedience , real Righteousness , &c. ) is all of Christ , and brought forth by him in that Soul that is pardoned and Justified in him , or accepted in the Beloved : But , how God's Forgiveness of the ●…ebt , or Pardon of the Offences , agrees with the Surety's full Payment and Suffering the Punishment & Wrath deserved , I leave to the understanding Reade●… to judge . Or , how Christ should make Intercession for them that come unto God by him , if all their Debt were payed and Punishment undergone , appears not ; especially where the Surety's Payment and Suffering is supposed in this case to be Infinitely of more Value then if the Debtor himself had payed and suffered all , because of the Surety's Infinite Dignity ; and when , if the Payment and Satisfaction of Law were thus strictly and severely made , neither Law nor Justice could admit that the Debtor should lye in Prison ( as many do under Satan's Chains of Darkness , lyable to Wrath and Vengeance ) but he should be both discharged and delivered ipso facto ? But we see it otherwise : Many are yet in the Prison-House in Satan's Chains , who yet may be loosed ; and Christ ever lives to make Intercession for them that come unto God by him . The Man mends not the matter in what follows . Obj. Christ Having purchased Salvation for us at the Hands of Justice by his Intercession , he Obtains the Purchase at the Hands of free Grace , and so applies it to us . Rep. Oh strange ! Justice ( or rather Revenge ) fully paid & satisfied , but Grace yet to be so much interceded or solicited to ; this renders Grace more Severe then the Condemnation of the Law , and Inferiour to Revenge . And what Division would this make in God ( and between Christ and Grace ) ? it renders him Inferiour to Earthly Princes , and his Grace below Common Justice among Men ; For supposing , a Subject had forfeited his Inheritance to his Prince by Rebellion , and after a full Satisfaction and Payment made to the Prince in his stead by a Person of Intrest with him , Could it be Just in the Prince to detain his Inheritance from him ? Or Suppose , the Surety hath made full Payment and Satisfaction in the Debtors stead , both to what Law and Severity could demand ; Could the Creditor justly detain the Debtor in Prison for some great and ear●…est Solicitation to be made by his Surety for him ? Or , were it proper for the Person for whom the Satisfaction is thus made , to cry out , Good Sr. forgive me my Debts , &c. if all past , present and to come be fully payed by the Surety ? And yet those Persons that are of this Opinion pray to God , to forgive them their Trespasses or Debts as they forgive others , &c. but is their forgiving of Debts , either a Casting the Debtors or their Sureties into Prison till they have payed the uttermost Farthing ? Surely that is not Forgiveness . ; whereas the Intercession made to God doth acknowledg his Dominion , Power and Justice , as having been offended , and a Subjection due to him ; and also his Grace , as that which Man oweth due Obedie●…ce and Respect to : Notwithstanding , this man , who has pleaded such a kind of Satisfaction , by Justice or Wrath punishing their Sins in Christ , he is not only Rigid or Severe , but Partial in his Opinion ( like a Sect-Maker ) limiting this Satisfaction and the Extent of saving Grace only to a few ; and yet that few not allowed the Priviledge , to be delivered from the Being of Sin in this Life . In his saying , That This Satisfaction was designed for all them , who through special Grace in time believe ; these all are delivered here from the Guilt and reigning Power of Sin , and so are out of their Fetters , and shall hereafter be delivered from the Being of Sin. Rep. That Satisfaction that was made , and Testimony of God's Love and Mercy that was given by the Sacrifice and Death of Christ ( and as he is the Propitiation ) it was for ALL Men ; by the Grace of God he tasted Death for every Man , for the Sins of the whole World ; he dyed for ALL MEN ( not only Presbyterians or a few particular Predestinarians , but all Men or Mankind in general ) That as many as live , should not live unto themselves , but unto him that dyed and rose again , 2 Cor. 5. 15. Who his own self bare our Sins in his own Body on the Tree , that we being Dead unto Sin , should live unto Righteousness , 1 Pet. 2. 24. And see verse 21 , 22 , 23. It is plain , that Christ's Suffering under the Burthen of Sin , and Dying for all Men , pointed at an other End , and had another kind of Embleme in it , then Mens living in Sin all their Dayes , or their not expecting Freedom from the Being of Sin till after Death ; this is not to suffer or dye with Christ , nor to come to the Blood of Sprinkling , which only frees from the Guilt of Sin , by sprinkling and purging the Conscience from the Being of it : The Ignorance and Absurdity of the contrary Sin-pleasing Doctrine is sufficiently detected before . And why [ Presbyterians ] Satisfaction of Revengeful Wrath in your stead , or the Death of Christ , as Satisfaction in your stead , to free you from everlasting Burning , and forgive your Sins ? Why for you more then the whole World besides ? Did not Christ dye for all Men as well as you ? And yet none are pardoned or in a justified State , until they come Christ to ease them , and they to have true and living Faith in his Name and Power , and so to be led by that eternal Spirit , by which he offered up himself a Lamb without Spot to God. Obj. Nor can this Writer nominate one of us , that encourageth Men to take Liberty of sinning from the Consideration of Christ's Satisfaction — the Lord convince and humble Slanderers . Rep. What ever you think or pretend , your Doctrines are Sin-pleasing , and give Liberty therein ; your disputing for Imperfection and Sin all your Dayes ; your justifying the Sinner or the Unjust , while justly condemned in himself by the Light of Christ ; your setting sorth Christ , as made the Subject o●… God's Wrath and Revenge in your stead , and saying , that divine Justice ( which you term vindictive or revengeful Wrath ) was satisfied in your stead , by punishing your Sin to the full in Christ , and that thereby you are secured from Hell , &c. though you continue in Sin , or uphold the Being of it all your Dayes , and deserve to have your Failings and Infirmities cast as Dung into your Faces ( as is confest ) and yet you count your selves imputatively Righteous , pardoned and justified , &c. even while you are saying , Let us with Paul abhor all Sanctification in us , &c. S. S. p. 102. Let us place no Confidence in Sanctification , &c. p. 103. The very Nature and Tendence of these and such Doctrines is Sin-pleasing , and soothing , and grateful to Hypocrites , encouraging them to take Liberty of Sinning all their Life time , if they can but be so credulous or self-confident , as to believe they are Elect Persons , and secured from Damnation on the Account of your Notion of Satisfaction , that pretends and imputes Revengeful Wrath and Severity to Christ , but Ease to your selves in your Sins : But this your empty , devised Notion will prove neither your Justification nor Security in the great approaching Day of God , which shall declare every man's Work , & wherein he will judge the Secrets of Men by Christ Jesus , according to the Gospel ; and every Man must give an Account of himself to God , and be Rewarded according to the Deeds done in the Body , whether they be Good , or whether they be Evil , AN APPENDIX , Wherein The Controversie is summed up and resolved , partly by Way of Question and Answer , with a plain Intimation of my Sense thereof , as relating unto the 2d , 3d and 4th Chapters before . Quest. 1. WHat was the Nature and Extent of Christ's Sufferings ? Answ. Not an undergoing infinite Wrath or vindictive Justice ( so called ) at the Hands of his Father ( for that is the just Reward of Rebels against God , Christ and free Grace ) but , 1st . The Weight and Burthen of Sin and Grief of Soul because thereof , as seeing the Punishment and Wrath incurred by the Rebellious . 2. The Fury of his Persecutors , in his undergoing that cruel Death of the Cross , inflicted on his Body by wicked Hands and Murtherers ; so that his Sufferings were two-fold , both inw●…ard and outward . 3. His real Desire , Travil of SouI and good Will through all , was for the Benefit and Good of all Mankind , even for the whole World ( for whom he suffered and dyed ) that all ( who receive him ) might be spiritually influenced with his holy Life , and partake of his Mind and Will , which stood in subjection to the Father . Quest. 2. What was the true Signification , Intent and Ends of Christ's Sufferings ? Answ. 1. To evince God's long Suffering towards all men ( for whom Christ gave himself a Ransom for a Testimony in due Time ) 2. The Appeasement of Wrath and Severity , so far as to grant Remission on true Repentance . 3. The End of the Law and first Covenant , and the Shadows and Curse of it ( as threatned to impose the Terms of it ) 4. To introduce the new-Covena●…t Administration , Christ being the Mediator of it . 5. To shew God's great Condescension to receive poor lost Man again on the Terms of this new Covenant , reinforced by the Death of his Son , that Man coming into this new Covenant , he might experience a real Agreement with God , even in the Son of his Love. Quest. 3. How far the Light in Man is necessary , and answers the Intent and Ends of Christ's Sufferings ? Answ. It is absolutely necessary to Salvation , being that divine Principle of Light within , which directly guides all them that obey it , into the Way and Dispensation of the new Covenant , whereby they secretly experience the real Intent , Virtue and Ends of Christ's Sufferings and Blood. Quest. 4. Whether the Light of Christ within ( in each Degree of it ) be not the New-Covenant Light in Nature and Kind , and the certain Guide into this Covenant ? Answ. It is ; being it was the Life that was in Christ ( as the eternal Word ) that was and is the Light of Men ; which Life or Light is therefore divine and spiritual , as the New-Covenant Dispensation is . Quest. 5. Whether the Word within , the Law within , the Commandment within , the Kingdom of God within and the Light within , be not one and the same thing , and so the Life of the New Covenant ? Answ. They are : The Names , Degrees and Manifestations do not alter or vary the divine Nature or Life thereof . Quest. 6. The Satisfaction , what ? and in what did it consist ? Answ. 1. Not rigid Payment from Christ to God. 2. Not of the Nature of Payment , for all Sins past , present and to come ( as stated by Sin-pleasers ) 3. Not Christ's undergoing infinite Wrath or Revenge from his Father ( for these were never exacted nor required of him ) But the Satisfaction was in Christ , as the Son of the Father's Love , the Delight of his Soul , and as he was a Sacrifice of a sweet smelling Savour to him ; both the Father and the Son condescended in one and the same Infinite Love for Man's Recovery out of Sin and Death , and for his Deliverance from Wrath to come , being confessed to be equally kind to Man , and equally angry at Man's Sin ) God so loved the World , that he freely sent his only begotten Son , &c. And in the same Love the Son freely gave his Life , yea , even himself a Ransom for all , for a Testimony in due Time. Quest. 7. What is true Justification ? Answ. It is properly and strictly a making Man Just ( viz. through the Washing of Regeneration ) It is also not only God's pardoning Sins past for Christ's sake , through Faith in his Name ; but also God's absolute accepting , owning and blessing all them who faithfully obey , persevere and walk in the Light and Law of the new Covenant . Q. 8. What is the true or real Imputation of Righteousness ? Answ. It is the same with Justification ( as it relates to God's reckoning or esteeming that Man Righteous that partakes of the everlasting Righteousness of Christ by a living Faith in him ) and so the same Righteousness and Holiness of Christ as inwardly revealed and brought forth in the new Creature that is made conformable to his Image ; and so all the blessed Fruits and Effects of Christ's Power and inward Work of Righteousness , as true Faith , Love , Obedience , Sincerity , Holiness , Integrity of Spirit to God , are acceptable to him , accounted of and reckoned unto his People for Righteousness , and all still for Christ's sake , who is the Author and Finisher of true , living , saving , justifying Faith ; as , Abraham believed God , and it was reckoned to him for Righteousness ; We say then , that Abraham's Faith was so reckoned or imputed to him : It has been by some confest ( as between God and the Creature ) That there can be no liking one another without Likeness of Disposition ; nor doth God receive Man into actual Friendship with himself , without being renewed after his Image . Quest. 9. Who are the Subjects of everlasting Wrath and Vengeance ? Answ. Wicked and Rebellious Persons , who reject the Love of the Truth tendered to them , such as tread under Foot , crucifie or contemn the Son of God , sleight the Blood of the Covenant , and do Despite to the Spirit of Grace . Quest. 10. Whether it consists with divine Justice or Truth in God , to shew Mercy and to be an absolute Saviour , after so much Injury done against him and his Commands by Adam's Fall , and the actual Disobedience of his Posterity in the Fall ? Answ. Yes ; It is not inconsistent with divine Justice , sor God to be the absolute Saviour of all that return to him and believe in him , he being a just God and a Saviour , besides ( or without ) whom there is no Saviour : Absolute divine Justice in God doth not limit him , nor withold Mercy from the Creature in the first Place ; nor doth it produce Severity or Revenge , until his Goodness be rejected and wholy slighted ; for he saith plainly , I am a just God and Saviour , &c. I , even I , for my own sake do pardon Transgression . Quest. 11. Whether Divine Justice did properly and strictly require a full Payment and Punishment upon Christ in man's stead , for all the Debt contracted , and Injury done by fallen Man ? Answ. No ; Christ's Sufferings were not of that Nature or Intent ; but as it was by the Grace of God that he tasted Death for every Man : They shewed God's Patience , and proclaimed his Mercy , in Order to pardon all that return to him from the Evil of their Wayes . Quest. 12. Whether God as Rector and Judge , could dispense with the Act of Law , and not rather with the immediate Object ? Did he not substitute an Innocent Person to undergo the Punishment or Severity of the Law due to Sin and Sinners ? Rep. This is objected by some of our Opposers , which m●…st needs imply a great Dispensation with , and Digression from the very Intent of the Law : If the severe Punishment of it be removed from the Unrighteous ( for whom it was made , and who have incurred it ) and fully inflicted upon Jesus Christ , the Righteous One that never Sinned , Could God thus far dispense with the Intent of the Law , and yet not forgive Sin , without such a kind of Satisfaction and Payment supposed ? Oh , sad Blasphemy and Inconsistency ! And seeing it hath been confessed by some of our Eminent Opposers , that Satisfaction is not a Scripture-Phrase but a Notion of Law , and made agendo & patiendo , viz. by Christ's Obedience in Doing , and Subjection in Suffering the Penaltey , which the Law should have inflicted upon Offenders , I propose these three Questions to our Opposers . Q. 1. Were it Reasonable or true to say , the Creditor has forgiven both the Debt and Injury , if it be all paid and fully punished in the Surety ? Q. 2. Were it Justice in the Creditor to detain the Debtor in Prison , if his Debts be all paid by the Surety ? or to suffe●… the Surety to wait long soliciting or interceeding for his Pardon or Deliverance ? Q. 3. Doth not your Doctrine of such Rigid or Severe Satisfaction oppose Christ's Intercession ? Howbeit we still confess , the Man Christ was greatly acceptable and most eminently satisfactory , considered as a Sacrifice of a sweet smelling Savour to God , and as the first Fruits . Quest. 13. What did the Blood of Christ that was shed , bespeak ? and what is our Sense of Christ's Blood ; and for what End owned ? Ans. 1st , It did bespeak Remission of Sin past to all that truly repent and believe in him . 2dly , Our Sense of the Blood of Christ is a living and spiritual Sense of the Virtue and Efficacy of it , as through it we receive Redemption , even the Forgiveness of Sins . 3dly , We really own and confess to the Blood of Christ , both in the History and in the Mystery , as most significant to express his Life which he gave a Ransom ; and the Value of the one Offering , we do in the sight of God confess , and own the Blood of Christ both as shed for us , and as sprinkling and purging our Consciences from dead Works : And this We are come to know by his Light shining in our Hearts , which as we walk in [ the Light ] we have Fellowship one with another , and the Blood of Jesus Christ cleanseth us from all Sin , 1 Joh. 1. 7. Heb. 9. 14. To come to the Blood of Sprinkling ( which speaketh better things then that of Abel ) is an Attainment and Mystery , only obtained by true Believers , in and through his divine Light and Eternal Spirit , by which Christ offered himself without Spot to God ; and by One Offering God hath perfected sorever them that are sanctified , whereof the holy Ghost is a Witness to us , Heb. 10. 14 , 15. For if a Literal Knowledge and Application of the Blood , could either Sanctifie or Justifie without having the Conscience sprinkled with it , then how could it be as the AntiType answering and ending the Type or Pattern under the Law , where all the People were sprinkled with the Blood of the Offerings ? see Heb. 9. and 10. Chap. And the Leaper was cleansed by seven times sprinkling upon h●…m the Blood of the Bird that was killed , Lev. 14. 6 , 7. but the Blood of Christ , which sprinkles and purgeth the Conscience , far excels all those under the Law ; and therefore , as it redeems from the vain Conversation , 't is called the Pretious Blood of Christ , as opposed to , and beyond all Corruptible things , 1 P●…t . 1. 18 , 19. Thus in the Blood of Christ there is a Mystery , and a spiritual Consideration and Application , absolutely necessary beyond the Historical Profession and Faith thereof ( as well as in the Cross , &c. ) as Christ said , Except ye eat my Flesh and drink my Blood , ye have no Life in you , Joh. 6. It is the Spirit that quickneth , &c. The holy Ghost is Witness to us of the Virtue and blessed Effect of the One Offering ; Blessed be the Name of the Lord our God forever , who by his divine Light hath opened our Understandings in the Mystery of Christ Jesus and the saving Knowledge of him which is after the Spirit . All these Scriptures relating to Christ's Sufferings , as Isaiah 53. Zach. 13. 17. Rom. 8. 32. Phil. 28. 2 Cor. 5. 14 , 15 , 21. Gal. 3. 13. and 4. 5. Heb. 2. 9. do all intimate God's great Kindness and Condescension in Christ Jesus , and his Humiliation , and deep Suffering under the Weight and Burthen o●… Sin ; and as by the Grace of God he tasted Death for every Man : all which fall greatly short of proving our Adversary's ●…harge against him , viz. That God poured down his Wrath or Revenge upon his Innocent Son , for Satisfaction to divine Justice in Man's stead that had done the Injury : I say , all the Scriptures alleged by them , can never prove this ; but rather , 1. That Christ's Sufferings were of another kind , both as he was delivered up by the Father , in his Patience to suffer and bear the Burthen , Sorrows and inward Griefs , by reason of man's Sin , for which his Soul also was made an Offering . 2. And as the Reproaches , Suffering and Death of the Cross that he sustained from the Wicked & Murtherers , were temporal or had an End ; and not as infinite Wrath and Revenge from God , due to wicked Men. 3. Yet Christ was rendred a Curse , and as made to be Sin ; This he could not properly be a in his own being for Sin , and a Curse ( in this abstract Sense ) couldnot strictly relate to his pure and sinless being ; but so made or reputed with respect to his bearing the Reproach and Sin of many , the outward Punishment Crucifying , Death , and Blood-sheding : And all that was in him , which in any sense might be said to Suffer , was offered and given for the Advantage and Good of Mankind ; and that which he so gave and offered , was called his Life , Himself , a Ransom , and all some times in Scripture comprehended and expressed under the Phrase The Blood , the pretious Blood of Christ , that redeems from the vain Conversation , purgeth the Conscience , &c. and even the outward part of his Suffering , most Innocent Example , his Cross , Death , Blood of his Cross , his reviving again , were so far from yielding either an Indulgence or justification to men as in Sin and Disobedience , that they did very eminently preach and openly proclaim to Mankind , both the Condemnation of Sin in the Flesh , Repentance , Mortification , Remission , and Man's reviving again to real Righteousness and Justification therein ; and all to be experienced through Faith in the Name and Power of Jesus Christ , the Son of the living God ; in sending of whom the Father's Love was manifest , that we might live through him . And , as Christ's Travil of Soul was inward , and so his Suffering inward , as well as outward , what is more obvious to the spiritual Eye and Mind , then that his Travil and Sufferings , and his holy Design therein , were to have an inward Effect , and inwardly to be fulfilled by his Word and Power , even in them who receive and believe in the same ? as that Instance of the holy Evangelist is very plain and pertinent , where 't is said , They brought unto him many that were possessed with Divels , and he Cast out the Spirits with his Word , and healed all that were Sick , that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaiah the Prophet , saying , Himself took our Infirmities , and bare our Sicknesses ; see Ma●… . 8. 17. Isaiah 53. 4. And moreover , as to Christ's being the Lamb of God , that taketh away the Sins of the World ; This taking away the Sins was not only fulfilled by that general Expiation or purging ( which he made ) by Way of Sacrifice ; but also inwardly by his real Cleansing , purging the Conscie●…ce , and purifying the Soul from the Nature and Being of Sin. And God's Reconciling us by the Death of his Son , whose putting away Sin , is said to be by the Sacrifice of himself , his [ by himself ] purging our Sins , the Will of God sanctifying us through the offering of the Body of Jesus Christ once for all , &c. as being a Sacrifice of far more Value then those Typical ones under the Law , which he fully answered and ended , though they were said to make Attonement & Reconciliation for Sins of Ignorance , that they might be forgiven ; and the Scape-Goat to bear away the Iniquities and Transgressions of the Children of Israel , Lev. 4. & 16. & 23. ( And did not the killing and sacrificing of Bulls , Goats and Heifers typifie or figure forth the killing and destroying that corrupt , beastly Nature and Enmity in man , which is for Death and Destruction , and which those Beasts were as a lively Embleme of ? ) Seeing hereby God was pleased in a Way of Condescension to their low Capacities , to shew a Pacification or Expiation , to express his Forbearance , suspending the severe Execution of the Law , and Willingness to pardon Iniquity , and to pass by former Transgressions , and be reconciled , when they afflicted their Souls , and offer'd up burnt-Offering in the Day of Attonement [ as both were required ] much more hath God declared himself reconciled to us , in commending his Love , to us in that while we were Enemies , Christ dyed ; and so he hath shewed forth his Kindness and free Love , as willing to pass by and pardon the Sins of the World upon true Repentance , in his setting forth his Son to be a Propitiation , through Faith in his Blood ; and in his being in Christ reconciling the World unto himself , not imputing their Trespasses unto them , which was both in his Forbearance , commending his Love and Good-Will in his Son unto the World , and sending his Son that the World through him might be saved . Let it be seriously here minded , 1. That those Scriptures relating to Christ's Death , Reconciliation , Sanctification , and putting away Sin , as by Way of Sacrifice , &c. as Joh. 1. 29. Rom. 5. 10. Heb. 10. 10. Chap. 1. 3. Col. 1. 22. which intimate the Work , as if universally done ; yet it is with respect unto the general Favour and Good-Will of God in Christ , as by the which Will , we ( Believers ) are sanctified through the Offering of the Body of Jesus ; and so we are said to be reconciled in the Body of his Flesh through Death : Withall note , that it was the manner of the Hebrews , Prophets and Apostles , to speak many Things in the Spirit of Prophecy , as done or past before they were accomplished in the proper Subjects , God having an Eye of Pitty and Compassion open to lost Man for his Redemption , even before it was fulfilled , whereby he saw and lookt beyond the former Transgressions , Sins and Infirmities ; for the Sin of the World is not actually taken away , purged out or put away , as to its Nature and Be ing ( nor are Men in a State of Reconciliation or Friendship ) while actual Sinners and Enemies in their Minds , but as they come to be converted and sanctified by the Spirit : Therefore God's reconciling the World in and by his Son , shews his gracious Will , and was intended conditionally to be fulfilled in them ( viz. Upon Faith and Obedience ) It was done so , as with respect unto Christ as the first Fruits , and with an Eye to the Condition , before it was actually fulfilled in them ; and what was outwardly signified as to the Good of Man by Christ's Sufferings and Death in the Flesh , as our great Exemplar ( in his Obedience and Holiness ) is inwardly to be fulfilled and answered in Spirit , as to the Principle , End and Design of God therein : as for Instance , God was in Christ reconciling the World to himself ; yet the Apostle added , We pray you in Christ's stead , be you reconciled to God , 2 Cor. 5. 19 , 20. And to the Saints at Colos. You that were sometimes alienated , and Enemies in your Minds by Wicked Works ; yet now hath he reconciled in the Body of his Flesh through Death , to present you Holy , and Unblameable , and Unreproveable in his Sight , If ye continue in the Faitle grounded and setled , &c. Colos. 1. 21 , 22 , 23. Mark , on this Condition they were reconciled and to be presented to God ; Not as being Enemies and in wicked Works , But as made Friends by Conversion to and continuing in the Faith : And God shewing forth Mercy to all , and universal Pardon of Sin past , in and for the sake of his Son Christ Jesus ( he being the Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World ) declares his not imputing their Trespasses unto them according to Severity ; but his being reconciled to them , that they may be reconciled to him . Finally , Because God was in Christ reconciling the World to himself ; and because he commended his Love to us , while we were Sinners , and we reconciled , &c. by the Death of his Son , as our Representative : If from hence any infer , That their Sin being not imputed , therefore they are justified by the Imputation of Christ's Death and Blood , though they continue in Sin and Disobedience to him , and remain Unsanctified , I must deny their Consequence , and tell them , that there is a two-fold non-Imputation of Sin ; or , under a two-fold consideration Sin is said not to be imputed : 1st , with respect to God's Forbearance , while he suspends Execution , and doth not cut off 〈◊〉 in their Sins , when yet the Nature and Being of Sin is not destroyed , nor purged away , expecting their Repentance , &c. In this Sense David , when he said , I have sinned , Nathan to●…d him , The Lord hath put away thy Sin , Thou shalt not dye , 2 Sam. 12. 13. Yet this proves him not then at that time in an absolute and compleat Justified Estate , or his Sin blotted out ; for a●…ter this he both implored Mercy , intreated Forgiveness , and passed through great Judgment , Difficulty and Trouble , under the Weight and Burthen of his Iniquity . 2. A Non Imputation of Sin in a better and higher State , as where the Mi●…d and Spirit is sanctified and cleared , and Sin really done away and wholy blotted out , where the Lord Imputeth not Iniq●…ity , but Righteousness ; as , Blessed is he whose Transgression is forgiven , whose Sin is covered ; Blessed is the Man unto whom the Lord Imputeth not Iniquity , and in whose Spirit there is NO GUILE , Psa. 32. 1 , 2. It were unreasonable to think , that all to whom Sin is ●…ot imputed i●… the first Sense , are in a Justified State ; for then were the whole World Justified ; for God was in Christ reconciling the World unto himself , not imputing their ●…respasses : But in the latter Sense they are Justified , being Washed , Sanctified and Justified in the Name o●… the Lord Je●…us , and ●…y the Spirit of our God , 1 Cor. c. 11. and such as in w●…ose Spirit there is no Guile ; And so no Condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus , who walk not after the Flesh , but a●…ter the Spirit , Rom. 8. 1 , 2. Therefore Justification . And if it be further queried ( viz. ) Quest. How doth it consist with God's Justice and Truth ( which alwaies required perfect Obedience ) either to Pardon or pronounce Man Just upon the account of an Inh●…rent Righteousness , Sanctity or Reformation wrought by the Spirit , without Satisfaction to vindictive Justice for Sins past ; seeing those who are the most inherently Holy have not perfectly obeyed God s Law from the Beginning of Life to the End ? Answ. 1. Both God's Justice , Truth and Mercy have a share in Man's Reformation and Restoration to himself : and it is in his u●…iversal Love in Christ Jesus to Mankind , that he makes know●… his Truth that makes free ; and the Grace and Truth concurring in Man's Conversion and Restoration ( and so in making him a New Creature ) it must needs be consistent with God's Truth , to Pardon and pronounce Man Just , as ( he becomes and is ) God's own Workmanship , in whom he beholds his own Image renewed ; for he blessed the Works of his Hands , and still blesseth them . 2dly , Without such a Satisfaction he doth pardon , &c. And yet Justice and Truth are not violated nor destroyed , but have their place and share in Man's Reformation , both in God's Judging , Reproving and Correcting Man for Sin , Co●…demning , Crucifying and Slaying the Transgresfing , Earthly Nature and Birth : and Christ came not to destroy , the Law , but to fulfil it ; He came to condemn Sin in the Flesh ( and to Save Man ) that the Righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in them , who walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit : The Law forbids Adultery ; Christ forbids and removes the Evil Lusts and Desires , which are the Ground of it : The Law forbids Covetousness ; Christ removes It : The Law forbids Murther ; Christ forbids Envy . 3dly , But , from the Beginning of Life to the End , who can say , he hath perfect Righteousness inherent in him ? Answ. He that is born of God , the New Creature , to whom Christ is made Righteousness , and who being God's Workmanship is made the Righteousness of God in Christ Jesus ; He that is attained to this New Creature 's State hath crucified and put off the Old Man with his Deeds , whom the Law 〈◊〉 , that hath been the Offender and Sinner from the Beginning of Life to the End : as , The new Birth and new Cre●…ture in Christ , hath No Guile in his Spirit ; but is alwaies inwardly Righteous from the Beginning of Life . And that ●…or this End God is pleased in his Son , to shew forth his For●…earance and Favour to Mankind , and for a time to suspend the ●…evere Execution of his Law , as not to execute Judgment ●…peedily , but in giving Man Grace and Space to Repent , be Converted and Renewed in Righteousness , This answers the 〈◊〉 of his sending his Son into the World , to be both a Sa●…ice and a Saviour : So his Forbearance or Suspension of the ●…verity o●… the Law for Christ's sake , can be no making void 〈◊〉 Law , Justice or Truth , which Christ came to fulfil and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . The Difference between the Terms or Tenour of our Opposers Gospel and ours . I. AS to the Sense or Substance of our Opposers , the Predestinarians ( according to their Traditional Faith , partial , harsh Opinions , repugnant to God's universal Grace and Love in Christ Jesus to Mankind ) their Gospel runs on this wise , or in such Terms as these , viz. We tender Grace and Salvation to all ; but believe it is only free for a few Elect Persons , for whom only Christ dyed : Therefore believe you are Elect Persons , and that Christ dyed for you ; apply his Blood and Merits , and you shall be saved , though you be Sinners all your Dayes . Believe that you are Justified by Christ's Death and Sufferings only , though you have nothing but Matter of Condemnation in you ; believe that you are Imputatively Righteous by Christ's Sufferings and Righteousness without you only ; and in Comparison thereof , do you abhor all Sanctification in you , or inherent Righteousness wrought in you by the Spirit . Believe that it is God's good Pleasure , Sin should be in you all your Dayes , to keep you humble ; and that Christ hath satisfied for all your Sins past , present and to come . Believe that God hath poured out all his Wrath upon his Son Jesus Christ , and punisht your Sin to the full in him , to satisfie Justice for your Injury done him ; Therefore there remains no more Wrath behind for you , being Elect and Justified Persons : Though you commit Sin , as did David , and have Corruption remaining in you all your Dayes , and and daily Sin in your best Duties , and have Sin mixt with your Graces ; your Salvation is eternally secured for you , as Persons whom God has had in his Eye to save ; you need not fear any final Fall , or falling away from Grace , once in Christ and ever in Christ. [ Thus far Presbyterians ] II. The Sense and Terms of our Gospel , according to what follows . From the Sence and Experience we have of God's free Love and Grace in Jesus Christ to all Mankind , We preach in the Spirit of the Gospel ; The Instructions and Conditions thereof are on this wise : viz. Be converted that your Sins may be blotted out . Turn ye from Darkness and Sin to the true Light that shews It , and reproves Evil ; And so turn from Satan's Power to God , and receive the Remissions of Sins . Believe in the Light that ye may become the Children of Light. Labour to make your Calling and Election sure . If ye walk in the Light the Blood of Christ cleanseth from all Sin. If ye be Crucified , Dye and Suffer with Christ , ye shall Live and Reign with him . Believe and Obey the Gospel , and be saved . Christ Jesus is the Author of Eternal Salvation unto all them that obey him . Confess and forsake Sin , and ye shall finde Mercy . Depart from Evil and do Good , and dwell forevermore . Wash you , make you Clean , put away the Evil of your Doings , &c. Except a Man be born again he cannot enter in the Kingdom , &c. If I do not wash thee ( saith Christ ) thou hast no part with me . [ And to them in whose Hearts the Work is begun ] Look diligently to your Standing , lest any of you fall from the Grace of God. Abide in his 〈◊〉 , that you may not fall into the hand of Severity . [ To Unbelievers and Rebellious ] If ye believe not in Christ , you shall dye in your Sins ; and where He is ye cannot come . The Wrath of God is revealed from Heaven against all Ungodliness and Unrighteousness of Men , who hold the Truth in Unrighteousness ; and his Wrath abides upon them that do not Believe nor Obey his Son. Thus far Quakers so called . Now , serious Reader , judge which of these , whether the Presbyterians or the Quakers Doctrine tends to stir up and excite People to Righteousness , to true Fear and Watchfulness : And whether the Presbyterians doth not tend to beget People into a Self-Confidence and false Liberty in Sin , upon a partial Opinion and Conceit ; But the Quakers Desire , Aim and End is , To turn People from Darkness to the true Light , and to true Fear , Diligence and Faithfulness to God. CHAP. V. Concerning ELECTION and REPROBATION . THE CONTENTS . A brief Introduction , with the Assemblies Opinion ; and Stephen Scandret's uncertain Proposition for it . His Abuse of divers Scriptures in his State of the Case for a personal Election , answered , and the Way of God's ●…hoosing resolved . The Weakness of his two first Arguments touching God's Decree and Promises . His gross Ignorance of those Names written in the Lamb's Book , Arg. 3. His Impertinency and ignorant Allegation and mis-understanding of divers Scriptures , concerning God's Choice and Ordination ; and the Cause of Mens Destruction opened , against Argum. 4. Persons being chosen proves not their Eternal Election ( as Persons ) Concerning Jacob and Esau ; Christ's Sheep , those that come , are drawn , and given unto him of the Father , Arg. 5 & 6. Election explained . God's loving Jacob and hating Esau ; their Posterities concerned therein : And how far the two Births were figured in Jacob and Esau. Our Opposers blasphemously placing a partial Resolution upon God ( as creating Persons with Intention to leave them to Destruction ) contrary to his universal Call and Tenders of Salvation . The Unchangeableness of God's Election in what State ; and our Opposers Ignorance and Error concerning God's Purpose . My unanswered Objection of setting Life and Death before Men , and warning them of Destruction . The Cause of God's hardning Pharoah , Judas and others , not grounded upon meer Will and Pleasure , but for their Rebellion . Touching the Fall of particular Angels and Men ; the Tendence of God's long-Suffering towards the Wicke●… , and my Opposer's Confession to Truth , to the ●…tter Overthrow of his Opinion . Presbyterians M●…ckery in their Warnings & setting Life & Death , conditional Promises and Threats , before People , contrary to their partial Opinion of an eternal personal Election and Reprobation . The sad Consequence of their accusing God with decreeing to deny saving Grace to particular Persons , yea , to the greater Part of Mankind ; shewing that divine Justice it self hath not so decreed . Grace differing from Debt . The Reason why God finds Fault with Men. The Question , Who hath resisted his Will ? resolved . Their urging all to for sake Sin , contradictory to their Opinion , and not in true Eaith . Their Flattering many with fair Pretences , contrary to their own Intentions ; the poor Encouragement and cold Comfort , that their Doctrine of a personal Reprobation yields to the greatest Part of Mankind . The wise God , the just Judge , is the Ordeiner of the Punishment , not of the Fact ; nor the Author of Sin , or their Wickedness who persecuted Christ. Hypocritical Priests , making and strengthning Hypocrites , by deceitfully daubing them up in their Sins , and flattering them with a [ You are not fallen from Grace ] while they are guilty of gross Wickedness . Concerning God's Convenant with David , and his Seed and the Mystery typified in him . To all which is added a short Postscript . A Brief Introduction TO The following Discourse concerning Election and Reprobation . STephen Scandret begins with an absolute false Charge against me , as Depraving God's Truth ; whenas according to plain Scripture , without any Depravation thereof , I examined their partial and graceless Opinion , as their making God the Ordeiner of whatsoever comes to pass ( both as to the States and Ends of Men ) and their placing his Decree thereof from all Eternity upon particular Persons , and no●… upon the two Seeds and Conditions , wherein Election and Reprobation do originally consist , which in time extends to Persons , only as related to the good or evil Seed , and not from a partial , absolute and meer voluntary Decree and Design to particular Persons , as their narrow and silly Opinion imports ; which I opposed , and that from the Scriptures of Truth , testifying , 1. God's Good-Will and Grace to Mankind in general . 2. The real Causes ( on their Parts ) of his Severity towards them and their Reprobation : I ●…aid down the Presbyterian Principle and Opinion , as it may be seen in their Confession and Catechism , agreed upon by their Assembly of Divines ( so called ) at Westminster , and approved by the general Assembly of the Kirk of Scotland ; as where they say in their 3d Chapter , That God from all Eternity did by the most wise and holy Counsel of his own Will , freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass * And that by the Decree of God , for the Manifestation of his Glory , some Men and Angels are predestinated unto everlasting Life , and others fore-ordained unto everlasting Death — and that these Angels and Men thus predestinated and fore-ordeined , are particularly * and unchangeably designed ; their Number so certain and definite , that it cannot be either encreased or diminished , &c. And also upon the same Principle , they add in their tenth Chapter , That all those whom God hath predestinated unto Life , and those only he is pleased effectually to call by his Word and Spirit ( out of the State of Sin and Death , in which they are by Nature ) to Grace and Salvation by Jesus Christ , enlightning their Minds , spiritually and savingly to understand the things of God , &c. And in their eleaventh Chapter , God did from all Eternity decree to justifie all the Elected ; and Christ did in the Fulness of time dye for their Sins , * and rise again for their Justification . The Consequence of this Doctrine , with a plain and scriptural Answer and Confutation , are laid down in the latter End of our Book , entituled , The Glory of Christ's Light within expelling Darkness , which Book yet remains unanswered by S. S. both as to this and other Heads , wherein he and his Brethren are concerned ; though now , in order to vindicate this Doctrine , he layes down the Proposition thus , S. Scandret , That God did most freely , and unchangeably , and from all Eternity choose some particular Persons to partake of saving Grace , &c. from whence it will necessarily follow , That he hath reprobated or passed by others : I must manifest this by Parts . Answ. In Opposition to this Partiality unjustly charged upon God , I must assert this Proposition , That God's eternal Election stands originally in his own Seed of Promise , and free Grace thereby freely tendered to all Mankind , both Jews and Gentiles , and all Men in the first place left free for a Share therein , and none are reprobated , but who first reject this Grace , and like not to retain God in their Knowledge ; his words [ that he hath reprobated or passed by others ] are very doubtful , being as much as to say , that either God hath from all Eternity reprobated particular Persons , or left them to Reprobate themselves : It is then either God's Act or the Creatures , which ( as appears ) this Man's Masters ( the pretended Divines ) could not resolve ; and we do not expect him to be a more pro●…ound Divine then his Tutors : However , their Opinion at least reflects upon God , as passi●…g by the greater part of Mankind without a●…ording them any Saving Grace , or the least Spiritual Assistance of Divine Light or Life ; so as if he thus takes no notice of them at all , but passeth by them , they must inevitably be left to Destruction and eternal Misery by this Graceless and Uncharitable Opinion , which tends greatly to ●…cclipse the Glory of God and his free Grace , and renders the Tenders of it to Mankind in general , and preaching Salvation by it conditionally to all , no better then a Mockery to the greater part of the World : And this neither S. S. nor his Assembly of Divines have answered , nor can they clear themselves herein . S. S. begins to vindicate his Opinion by parts thus : sect 1 1. God's Act , which Essentially takes in the Object thereof ; he hath chosen some particular Persons , 2 Thes. 2. 13. God hath Chosen you , Joh. 15. 19. I have Chosen you , Ephes. 1. 4. He hath Chosen us ; This being directly denyed , I shall add Arguments . Answ. The Scriptures are not denyed by me , as most falsely is here insinuated ; but I deny that these prove their Proposition for a Personal Election or Reprobation from all Eternity : as also I deny , that God ●…rom all Eternity did unchangeably ordein whatsoever comes to pass ( as they most grosly asserted ) or that his Decree or Act , is so absolute from all Eternity to particular Persons , as strictly eying and unchangeably designing each Person to his End ; a certain definite Number unto everlasting Life , and others to everlasting Death : This I still oppose , and find this Man's Vindication thereof very ●…eeble , and his Proofs impertinent . For that 2 Thes. 〈◊〉 . 13. He hath left out the following words ; after [ chosen you ] he leaves out [ through Sanctification of the Spirit , and Belief of the Truth ] which , as they clearly explain , how they were chosen to Salvation , even the Conditions on which God's Act of Chusing them depends , to wit , Sanctification of the Spirit , and Belief of the Truth : So this makes clearly against my Opposers Opinion , for they were not capable of this Belief of the Truth and Sanctification , before they had personal Beings , which sure they had not from all Eternity ; and so seeing the Way and Act of God's chusing Men , must be through Sanctification , and of the Spirit , and Belief of the Truth ( which Condition answers this Decree ) he hath not designed nor ordeined the contrary Condition ( of his Wrath against Man ) as Sin and Unbelief , though they are come to pass upon many , whose Repentance and Return God rather willed , then their Death or Destruction . But if S. S. might have pleaded a little further from the words , God hath from the Beginning chosen you , if he had insisted on the Words [ from the Beginning ] I might answer , That does not signifie from all Eternity ; much less that he hath had you particular Persons in his Eye , as unchangeably designing you to Salvation , meerly as particular Persons , without having Relation to any such Conditions or Qualifications , as Faith , Sanctification , &c. ( which may be rejected by Man ) 2. The Words [ from the Beginning ] are so far from signifying from all Eternity , that in this place they reach not so far as to the Time of the Beginning of the Creation ; but rather to the Time of their first Reception and Belief of the Truth , according as they import in divers other places , as 1 Joh. 3. 11. This is the Message that ye have heard from the Beginning ; and 2 Joh. 5. Though [ Beginning ] in the highest Sense , relateth to Christ ( as the divine Word ) who is the Beginning and the End. And also note , that S. S. deals with that of Joh. 15. 19. as he doth by the other , leaving out both the foregoing and following Words , which still make against him ; setting down only [ I have Chosen you ] whereas Christ said thus , Because ye are not of the World , but I have Chosen you out of the World , therefore the World hateth you , Joh. 15. 19. And then it is plain , they were both of and in the World , before they were chosen out of the World ; for could they be chosen out of that-which they were never in ? So that Christ's Chusing his out of the Corrupt Wayes and Spirit of the World through Faith and Sanctification , is the Reason why the World hates them , which it did not while they were Conformable to the World. By [ the World ] here is understood , those who are in the Natural , Unbelieving State , and also such as hate the true Believers and Disciples of Christ ; whence it follows , that you Presbyterians ( how highly soever you conceit of your selves as Elect Persons from all Eternity above all others , yet ) are not in the Election of Christ , nor in a State of Election so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the Spirit o●… Persecution Rules in you ; as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 shewed it self in many of your Leaders and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . And to that of Ephes. 1. 4. He hath Chosen us 〈◊〉 him ; These words [ In him ] to wit , in Christ ) S. Scandret , hath left out , like one that both shuts his own Eyes , and seeks to keep others in a blind Belief of his partial Principle : The very Ground and Principle of Election being in Christ ( which the man overlooks ) God hath Chosen us ( the true Church , which is Elect ) in him , before the Foundation of the World , that we should be Holy and without Blame before him in Love , Ephes. 1. 4. For as we are in him , and become so well qualified in Holiness , and thus nearly related to him , as to be without Blame , in due time we shew forth the Effects and Fruits of that Elect Seed and Principle , wherein our Life and Ground of Election stood before the Foundation of the World ; not merely as we are particular Persons , or Natural men ; but as his living and Royal Of-spring , his Church and peculiar People sprung from his own Seed , now in due time chosen by him out of the World and the Corruptions thereof , through Sanctification of the Spirit , and Belief of the Truth . S. S. Arg. 1. Particular Persons in time , receive Mercy , are converted , sect 2 made to p●…rsevere are saved : Therefore God did Decree this beforehand ; for God worketh according to the Counsel of his own Will , Ephes. 1. 11. Answ. Particular Persons in time receiving Mercy , being converted , and persevering in Grace ; doth not argue that Mercy was but only proffered and shewed to a few particular Persons ; nor yet that it is so absolutely and Eternally Decreed of God , that all ( to whom Mercy and Grace is shewed ) shall so inevitably persevere in it , as that there is no Possibility of their Declension and Falling from it after the time of their receiving Grace , while yet unestablished ; for 1. He hath concluded all under Sin , that he might shew Mercy upon all . 2. Those particulars who sincerely receive Mercy and Goodness , upon them he will have Mercy , both in a way of Continuance and Increase , and unto them Goodness who abide in his Goodness , Rom. 11. 20 , 21 , 22. It is true , God worketh all things after the Counsel of his own Will ; his gracious and good Will counsels him to shew forth Goodness and Mercy to all in the first place , and Severity or Damnation to none without Cause : And his Will is alfo Believers Sanctification , in order to which he graciously counsels and perswades Men by his Spirit , to forsake Sin , and be converted ; which manner of working in Man by his Counsel , is not an inevitable or forceable Act of his Will ; for Counsel and Force are much different , as is a●… absolute Decree to Act himself alone , and a Perswasion of the Creature to Act with him , by the Power and Assistance that he gives it : So the Perswasion on Men to Repentance & Perseverance in Faith and Grace cannot be an irresistable Forcing them thereto ; for what Reward can Men expect of God for any thing they are unwillingly forced to ( as by some supposed ) whereas God works upon that Reason and Conscience which he hath placed in Man , to perswade , induce , and move Men to forsake Sin , from a real Sence of the Evil of it , that they may leave Iniquity from a true Zeal and Hatred ( stirred up by the true Light ) against it : I drew them with Cords of a Man , with Bands of Love , &c. Hosea 11. 4. S. S. Arg. 2. God hath made Absolute Promises of the first Saving Grace , Ezek. 26. 25 , 26. I will sprinkle clean Water upon you , and you shall be clean ; a new Heart will I give you , Chap. 11. 19 , 20. and he quotes Jeremy 31. 33. and Isai 54. 13. All thy Children shall be taught of the Lord. These Promises are but a Declaration of his Decree , and they are not made concerning all , but particular Persons whom God hath in his Eye to save . This Argument is grounded upon his Mistake , and is very dull and impertinent , as not reaching his Principle he intends to vindicate by it : For 1st , It imports absolute Promises of the first Saving Grace to be but to particular Persons . 2. That God had only a few particular Persons in his Eye , & that from Eternity in his Promise of the first saving Grace , contrary to plain Scripture , which sayes , The Promise is to you and your Children , and to all them that are afar off , even to as many as God shall call ; and this Promise is Christ Jesus , who is God's Everlasting Covenant and Light , to which Men are called . 3. This Man mistakes the first saving Grace , confounding it with the Effects of it ( which it brings forth where it is received and obeyed ) As mens being made Clean , having a new Heart , &c. Ezek. 36. 35. and Chap. 11. 19. which are Effects of the Grace ; these he puts for the first Saving Grace and Promise of it ; as also his blind Argument supposeth these Effect●… to be unavoidably or forceably brought forth in some particular Persons , supposed to be designed for that End , without respect to their accepting of , and Concurrence with the Tenders and Appearance of saving Grace ) which in the Light of Christ is given them ) whereas it hath appeared unto all Men , Tit. 2. 11. And the Promise of the Everlasting Covenant , though freely and absolutely tendered to 〈◊〉 ; yet as it is made with any particular Men and confirmed ●…o them , they are such as are serious and penitent , retur●…ing and obeying , and hearkning to the Voice of God , abiding in his Love and Grace , &c. upon which he enters into Covenant with them & they with him , both in the Agreement o●… Li●…e ; Hearken unto me , and I will make with you an Everlasti●…g Covenant , even the sure Mercies of David , Isa. 55. 2 , 3. The Willing and Obedient shall eat the Good of the Land , Cha. 1. 19. ( not the Unwilling and Disobedient ) And I wi●…l give them an Heart to know me , that I am the Lord , a●…d they shall be my People , and I will be their God ( mark the Reason ) for they shall return unto me with their whole 〈◊〉 , Jer. 24. 7. Note , that this was foretold or prophesied ●…rding to the Fore-Sight that God had of the Willingness and Compliance of his People with his Grace and Spirit , a●…er it was proffered and given to them , to invite , perswade and draw them ( as many other Prophecies are , which ●…elate to his everlasting Covenant , for its Establishment with the Creature , on these and the like Conditions ) which is not a forcing Men to Conversion , to have new Hearts , to be clean , &c. For Grace from God is given , and Love shewn Men , to perswade and induce them to Love & Good. Will towards God ; he loves them first , that they may love him ; he opens unto them a Fountain and pours clean Water upon them , that they may wash in ; he works in them to WILL and to DO , that they may obey him , and by his Power and Aid work out their Salvation with Fear and Trembling , Phil. 2. 12 , 13. He puts his Laws in their inward Parts , that they may read and meditate Day and Night therein ; he teacheth his People , that they may hear , and learn of him , and obey his Voice ; and the Ministers of the new Covenant that was promised , preached Obedience and exhorted Persons to the Obedience of the Spirit , and of the Son of God , he being the Author of Eternal Salvation to as many as obey him , Heb. 5. 9. not to them that presumptuously hazard their Salvation upon a lazy Expectation of being driven by some irresistible Impulse or forceable Motion of Power , beyond what they are capable of . Arg. 3. Persons by Name , are particular Persons ; but Go●… hath sect 3 chosen Persons by Name , Rev , 13. 8. All that dwell on the Earth shall worship the Beast , whose Names are not written in the slain Lamb's Book of Life from the Foundation of the World. Answ. What great Ignorance & wonderful Darkness doth his Man shew in this Argument , both of the Book of Life , and of those Names which are written in it ! which belongs to Men in the new-born State , as related to the Seed of Election , to every one that hath a new Name given him , having overcome Sin ; and not the traditional Names given to Persons by natural Parents : But this Argument makes no Difference between the Old Birth and the New , nor between the old Name and the new ; nor between the old Nature with its Name , and the new Nature & its Name ; but saith , Persons by Name , are particular Persons ; but God hath chosen Persons by Name , as if he should tell us , That S. Scandret , Nath. Barnard , Hen. Coleman , with the rest of ●…resbyterians are chosen Persons by these and such their Names from all Eternity ; and that these Names , S. Scandret and Nath. Barnard , &c. are written in the Lamb's Book of Life ) but George Whitehead , Ro. Ludgater , Geo. Witherly , with the rest of the Quakers , are reprobated by Name from all Eternity . But what then doth he imagine this Lamb's Book of Life is , and what is it made up of ? Ah Lord ! free poor Souls from such Ignorance , and deliver them from such blind Guides as this Man ; against whose dark Argument and partial Opinion , let them read Jer. 17. 13. O Lord , the Hope of Israel , all that for sake thee shall be ashamed , and they that depart from me shall be written in the Earth , because they have forsaken the Lord , the Fountain of living Waters : So here being signified a Possibility to fall ; and many do forsake and depart from the Lord , and because thereof to be written in the Earth ; therefore it follows , that if People abide with the Lord , he will both abide with them , and their Names shall not be blotted out of the Book of Life , nor shall they be written in the Earth : And this also evinceth , that they are not by Name , as particular Persons , either absolutely elected to Salvation , nor reprobated to Damnation , but on Condition of abiding with , or forsaking the Lord. Arg. 4. All that are chosen do infallibly believe in time , and partake of Christ's Righteousness , Acts 13. 48. As many as were ordeined to Eternal Life believed , Rom. 11 , 7. The Elect have obtained it ; therefore some particular Persons were elec●…ed ; for if all were Elected , all would infallibly believe , &c. Answ. This is also a very frivolous , dull and impertinent Argument , and wholy misseth the State of his Proposition and the Controversies between us : In the first place he begs the Question , while he intends it to particular Persons , as eyed , and absolutely designed particularly from all Eternity to Salvation , &c. whenas the Question is not , Whether those that are chosen ( through Sanctification ) do infallibly believe ? nor , Whether Election ( which i●… in the Seed ) doth not in due time extend to particular Persons ? For those Persons ( or People ) who are true Believers , are come into the Elect Seed , being ingrafted into the tr●…e Root , are in the Election which obtains the Inheritance : And as true Belief , Faith , and Obedience are the Terms , upon which Life Eternal is promised and received ; so on the same Conditions Life is freely te●…dered in the Son of God to all Man-Kind , yea , to the whole World : God so loved the World , that he gave his only begotten Son , that whosoever believeth in him should not perish , but have everlasting Li●…e ; for God sent not his Son into the World to condemn the World , but that the World through him might be saved , Joh. 3. 16 , 17. This plainly cuts off that Opinion of a secret Decree and absolute Design from Eternity against the greatest Part of Mankind for their Destruction ; for it cannot be consistent with him to have so decreed Damnation from all Eternity , ●…or those he ●…roffereth in time to save by his Son , upon Believing & Obeying ; and therefore , as to that of Acts 13. 48. some have it thus , And they believed , even as many as were ordeined ( or fitted ) for Eternal Life , which may not oppose Christ's Testimony before , Whosoever believeth on the Son , shall have Eternal Life ; which is promised , not as meerly respecting particular Persons , but that Condition on which 't is universally tendered , as namely , to be accepted in a living Faith and sincere Obedience : But some more Ingenuous , and as much learned as this Man , affirm , that the Word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which is translated Acts 13. 48. ordeined , signifies well appointed , set in good Order , prepared or disposed : So as many whose Hearts were prepared or well-disposed ( viz. in a Willingness of mind and right Order of Spirit , having true Desires sor eternal Life ) believed as the good Ground , or honest Heart that received the good Seed , so as it took Root . And as when Lydia heard the A●…ostles , God opened her Heart , that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul , Acts 16. 14. And as Barnabas exhorted the People , that with Purpose of Heart they would cleave unto the Lord , Acts 11. 23. Here was a true Preparation in them , both for Believing and Eternal Life . And further , from that of Acts 13. 46. it is evident , that both the Word of the Lord was preached , and Life Eternal tendered to those Jews who rejected it , or put the Word of God from them , and judged themselves unworthy of Everlasting Life : Wherefore , surely God did not from all Eternity either absolutely design them ( as particular Persons ) to Damnation , or to pass them by for that End ; for he did not pass them by without taking notice of them ; but gave them notice of the Way of Life and Salvation , tendring it to them by his Spirit in his Messengers , which had been a Contradiction to himself , if he had from Eternity absolutely decreed the contrary : But the envious Jews opposing and rejecting the Word of God , judged themselves unworthy of Everlasting Life , wherein they rejected their Hope which was of the Lord , & therefore their Destruction was of themselves , whereupon Paul and Barnabas said , Lo , we turn to the Gentiles , for so hath the Lord commanded us , saying , I have set thee for a Light of the Gentiles , that thou shouldst be for Salvation unto the Ends of the Earth ; and thereupon the Gentiles were glad , &c. vers . 47. So that here was universal Grace and Salvation preached and tendered to all , as that which God had foretold and promised , who did not exclude any from the Benefit thereof ; nor was any hindred from Life and Salvation , but who excluded themselves , being such as judged themselves unworthy of Everlasting Life . Arg. 5. Jacob was a particular Person , and loved before he sect 4 had done any Good , according to God's Purpose of Election . Answ. He hath herein wrested the Scripture ; for it doth not say , that Jacob was then loved and Esau hated , before they had done Good or Evil ( as he renders the Words ) for then it may be asked , what he hated Esau for , before he had done Good or Evil ? Did he hate him for nothing ? Surely no ; but what was said before they were born , or had done Good or Evil , was by Way of Prophecy , The Elder shall serve the Younger ; what is this to their Eternal States ? Jacob had no need of Esau's Service in Hell. And then to the following Words , as it is written , Jacob have I loved , but Esau have I hated ; where was it written ? and how doth it relate to Jacob and Esau ? Doth it relate to them meerly as particular Persons , under such a Limitation of Election and Reprobation from Eternity ? or rather to their Posterities , as under such different Qualifications of Love and Hatred ? Could God absolutely determine to hate any particular Persons , meerly as Persons , without respect to either the good or evil Qualifications or Works , as before they had done Good or Evil ? This were blasphemously to render him in Enmity against his own Works , as if he had made Man , or forced him into the World unavoidably , to destroy a●…d damn him to all Eternity ; whereas the Mercies of God are over all his Works , a great and principal Part whereof is Mankind . And as for that which is written o●… his loving Jacob and hating Esau , it is in Malchie 1. Their Posterities were called by their Names , that People of the Edomites , who succeded Esau ( who was called Edom ) * both in Name and Nature , Gen. 36. 19. whom Men should call the Border of Wi●…kedness , which could not be , till they were wicked and ha●… acted Wickedness : These were they against whom because of t●…eir Wickedness ) God had ( and against such st●…ll 〈◊〉 , Indignation forever ; and hereupon his . Decree is ab●…olute against the Wicked , who are Rebellious against him , and reject his Grace by rebelling against his gracious Light and Spirit in them : And also it was said unto Esau ( as 〈◊〉 the Wicked of his Posterity , or the earthly Edonites , and carnal , envious Persecutors ) Shall I not , saith the Lord , even destroy the wise Men out of Edom , and the Understanding out of the Mount of Esau , Obed. 8. That every one of the Mount of Esau may be cut off , ver . 9. For the Viol●…ce against thy Brother Jacob , Shame shall cover thee , and thou shalt be cut off forever , ver . 10. Thou shouldst not have looked on the Day of thy Brother , &c. neither shouldst thou have spoken proudly in the Day of Distress : See ver . 12 , 13 , 14. to the End : Are not here plain Causes sh●…wn why God hated Esau ? Arg. 6. God knows his Elect from others , and this not only after , but before they are called , 2 Tim. 2. 19. The Foundation of God standeth sure . The Lord knoweth who are his , Joh. 13. 18. I know , whom I have chosen , Joh. 10. 14. I am the good Shepherd , I know my Sheep , ver . 16. Other Sheep I have that are not of this Fold , them also I must bring , and they shall hear my Voice : Therefore are they particular Persons ; These , and not others , that the Lord hath chosen , Joh. 6. 37. All that the Father giveth me shall come to me . Answ. This Argument signifies nothing at all sor his Purpose , nor would it help him one whit if it were all granted ; for who questions God's Omnisciency ? God knows all alike considered meerly as Persons ; but in a near & peculiar Relation to himself , he knows his Elect ; he knows who are his ; Christ knows them both Men and Women , whom he hath chosen out of the World , and he saith , I am the good Shepherd , and know my Sheep , and am known of mine , Joh. 10. 16. But these latter Words [ and I am known of mine ] S. S. is pleased to leave out and quietly to pass by , for that Christ is known of his Elect , his Sheep ; but surely he could not be known of them before they were born , or had a Being : and as for those other Sheep which are not of this Fold , which Christ foretold the Gathering or bringing home of , they were such as had a Remainder of Innocency , in whom Jacob was not wholy destroyed through Rebellion and Wickedness ; but such as had been seeking Rest , where they could not find it ; but when the Truth and Way of Life came to be manifest to them , they were ready to receive and comply with it , and hear the good Shepherd's Voice and obey him . There were such lost Sheep both among Jews and Gentiles , who when the good Shepherd appeared , were so well disposed , as willing and ready to come to him , receive and follow him , and obey his Voice , which were distinguished from the Murtherers of the Just one in themselves , who were Wolves and Persecutors of Christ & his Witnesses , as he the good Shepherd was distinguished from the Hireling that fleeth , Joh. 10. 13 , 14. And they that come to Christ out of a true Hunger and Desire after him , as the Bread of Life , are those whom the Father hath given to him , who come to him in that which is given to him , of which he looseth nothing , but will raise it up at the last Day , Joh. 6. 37 , 39. And they whom the Father giveth to the Son , are given in a true Desire , Willingness and Love in themselves to the Truth , to follow & obey Christ ; the Father's Drawings not being resisted by them , but having an Influence and Prevalency with them , and upon their Spirits for that End as he said , Every man that hath heard and learned of the Father cometh unto me , Joh. 6. 45. so the Father's Teaching or Instruction was the Way of his drawing to the Son ; and this was not a Forceing them ( whether they will'd or nill'd ) to the Son ; but a gentle Perswading them to hear and learn of God ( in his Light ) that thereby they might come and ( in a sence of his Love therein ) be given to the Son. Arg. 7. This appears from the very Nature of Election ; for sect 5 where all are taken , or all are left , there can be no Election . Answ. Election rightly considered and truly stated , according to Scripture , I never questioned ; the Nature of which ( as is by this Opposer implied here ) is a being chosen out of or from imong ; and so the Elect , or true Believers , are chosen out of the World , from among Men , chosen out of Kindreds , Nations and People , as the Royal Offspring and Priesthood of Christ : But what proves this of a Personal Election and Reprobation particularly decreed and designed from all Eternity ? But still the quite contrary , far from the Nature of Election , or chusing a Church or People out of the World or from among Men , and that through the Sanctification of the Spirit and Belief of that Truth ; it follows that they were first in the World , in the Unbelief , and scattered among Men and People , before this Act of Election or chusing out , was fulfilled in them : He hath chosen us that we should be Holy and w●…thout Blame , that we might partake of Salvation by Jesus Christ , Ephes. 14. 1 Thes. 5. 9. and those thus cho●…en for this end , were the Saints , the Faithful in Christ Jesus , Ephes. 1. 1. who first trusted in Christ , ver . 12. who , alter they believed , were sealed with the holy Spirit of Promise , ver . 13. their Faith was in the Lord Jesus , and Love unto all Sai●…ts , ver . 15. who believed according to the working of his mighty Power , ver . 19. A●…d that th●… Esta●…e might be attained , Faith is offered to all ; the Power of Believing is given in the free Grace and Gi●…t of God's eternal Spirit and universal Light of his Son ; It bei●…g the World's Sin that they do not believe in Christ , of which the Spirit reproves them , sor which they would not be chargeable or reproved , if he had not afforded them Light and Power sufficient ●…or them to believe and obey Christ. S. S. Jacob have I Loved , and Esau have I hated . Though these last Wor●…s were spoken when Esau's Posterity was the Border of Wickedness , Mal. 1. yet what ever G. W. saith , were they spoken , to 〈◊〉 the free Choice that God long before had made os Jacob and his 〈◊〉 , pag. 112. Answ. As he intends Jacob after the Flesh ( and so his Seed ) who was called by the Name of Israel , this is still grounded upon his Mistake , and doth not at all make for his Opinion , but against him : For , though I grant a free Love to and Choice of Israel , so of the Seed of Jacob , as a peculiar People ; yet this did not secure them as to their eternal States , without their Perseverance in the Way of God : Neither was the Seed of Jacob , as after the Flesh , under an absolute Decree of Election to Eternal Life , that being known only in the Seed after the Spirit ; for the contrary was and is manifest in them , that did back-slide and rebel against the Spirit of God , and became Persecutors of the holy Prophets , and fell into gross Evils , many to their Destruction , which caused the Prophets often to complain against them , and Severity from God to come upon them that fell : On them that fell , Severity ; but on thee Goodness , if thou abide in his Goodness , Rom. 11. And it is said , The Lord was Wrath : So a Fire was kindled against Jacob , and Anger came up against Israel , Psal. 78. 21. Who gave Jacob to the Spoil , and Israel to the Robbers ? Did not the Lord against whom they had sinned ? For they would not walk in his Wayes ; neither were they Obedient unto his Law , Isa. 42. 24. and Chap. 43. 22. But thou hast not called upon me , O Jacob ; but thou hast been weary of me , O Israel ; thou hast made me to serve with thy Sins ; thou hast wearied me with thine Iniquities , ver . 24. Thy first Father hath sinned , and thy Teachers have transgressed against me , ver . 27. I have given Jacob to the Curse ; and Israel to Reproaches , ver . 28. Was Israel or Jacob's Seed then after the Flesh eternally Elected and Loved ? Was not his saying , I have loved Jacob , intended , to reprove the Ingratitude and Unfaithfulness of those his Posterity ? Mal. 1. 2. I have loved you , saith the Lord ; yet ye , say , wherein hast thou loved us ? &c. ver . 6. O Priests ! that despise my Name , &c. ver . 7. Ye offer polluted Bread upon mine Altar , &c. Thus those of Jacob or Israel ( after the Flesh , both Priests and People ) were reproved sor their Abuse of God's Love and Kindness ; and can any People now be said , to be so absolutely chosen to Salvation , meerly because God doth shew Love to them ? when now his Love in his Son is universally extended to the World : God so loved the World , &c. Joh. 3. Did he theresore decree the whole World to be saved ? See the Narrowness of the said Opinion of a Personal Election and Reprobation from all Eternity , and that impertinent Allegation of God's sree Choice of Jacob , and his Seed ( as it is intended to sute that Proposition , how false it is ) But further , the Apostle explains who are truly in the Election of the Seed of Promise , and who are the true a●…d spiritual Israel , ( and so in the Election which obtains ) See Rom. 9. 6. They are not all Israel which are of Israel , ver . 7. neither because they are the Seed of Abraham , are they all Chil●…ren ; but in Isaac shall thy Seed be called , ver . 8. That i●… , They which are the Children of the Flesh , these are not the 〈◊〉 of God ; but the Children of the Promise are counted ●…or the Seed : see also Gal. 4. 28 , 29. For Illustration whereo●… , the Apostle alludes to those Instances of Jacob and Esau , ( Rom. 9. 10 , 11 , 12. ) who were instanced as Figures of the two opposite Seeds , the two contrary Births , two differing People and Nations : as the Earthly and the Heavenly , the Natural and the Spiritual Seed , and Birth , are contrary in the very Nature and Ground ; and so are the Generations of each , as namely those in the first Adam , and those in the second ; those after the Flesh , and those after the Spirit : And so the Righteous and the Wicked , how contrary are they bo●…h in Nature and Spirit ? yet not simply as Creatures or Persons ; but as influenced with contrary Pri●…ciples , Spirits & Powers , which bring forth their own co●…trary Seeds , B●…rths and Images in Men and Women . Now whereas it is sa●…d , being no●… y●…t born ; neither having done Good or Evil. that the Purpose of God according to Election might stand , not of Works , but of him that calleth , it was said unto Rebecca , The Elder all serve the Younger ; or , the Greater hall serve the Lesser : Note , that this cannot oe a●…y 〈◊〉 of any 〈◊〉 or eternal Election and Reprobation of J●…cob a●…d Esau's Persons ; for what Service need Jacob in Heaven srom Esau in Hell ? or , what Service could Esau in Hell do Jacob in Heaven ? Howbeit , the Purpose of God according to Election stands sure originally in the El●…ct S●…ed , and so not of Works : Esau was a Worker ; and so the first Birth would of it self be a Willing , Running and Working for Li●…e eternal , which can be no Procurement of God's Purpose thereof : But a Seed is freely given of God to Mankind , and Power to bring forth Righteousness , and the living Works , as Effects of Grace ; and God freely calls Men thereto out of his free Grace and Love to all ; By grace are ye sav●…d , through Faith , and that not of your selves , it is the Gift of God ; not of Works , lest any Man should boast , for we are his Workmanship , created in Christ Jesus unto good Works ( mark this ) which God hath before ordained , that we should walk in them , Ephes. 2. 8 , 9 , 10. And Note , That this saving Grace hath appeared unto all Men , Titus 2. 11. It is not limited , or bound up to that Narrowness as the particular Electioners Opinion would bind it , as only to a particular designed small Number of Persons from Eternity , with an eternal Exclusion of all the World beside to everlasting Damnation , without Remedy ; which is a most partial and cruel Doctrine , ecclipsing the Glory and Soveraignity of God , which is most manifest in shewing Mercy , rather then meer partial Severity on his poor Creatures . Whereas S. S. teacheth , that the making this Vessel to Honour , that to Dishonour , is God's creating such a Person with a sect 6 Resolution to recover him out of his fallen State , by Saving Grace ; such a Person , with an Intention to leave and never recover him out of his fallen State , by renewing Grace , &c. p. 112 , 113. Answ. The Man runs still upon his first Mistake , placing such a partial Resolution and Intention upon God towards his Creatures , or particular Persons , in creating them as absolutely to recover one , and leave the other in the Fall : and why then doth this Man , or his Brethren , preach and tender Salvation upon Terms to all Sorts ? They cloak this partial Reserve with general Tenders of Good , imagining God to be as partial in his Intentions , and both as slighty and Contradictory in his Call and Proffers as themselves ; as if he should call all to Repentance and Life , and yet to have created them with Intention to leave the Greater Part in the Fall for Eternal Death ( or rather , to have from Eternity reprobated them ) or as his Masters of the Assembly say , He hath before ordained them to everlasting Death ; the Contradiction of which Doctrines both to God's universal Love , Grace , and Call , as also to themselves , how manifest is it ? That he should from Eternity ordain them for Reprobation , whom in due time he gives Light unto , and calls to Repentance , how plainly inconsistent are these and contradictory ? One while to say , he hath reprobated them ; another while , he passeth by them : One while , he hath before ordained them to everlasting Death ; another while , he creates them with Intention to leave them without Recovery ; which though all in curreth the same End ( as is supposed to a certain fore designed Number of Persons ) yet the State of the Case ( as it reflects upon God ) is as much opposite and contrary , as to say , God doth absolutely , eternally decree Man's Destruction , or did reprobate them from Eternity ; and then that he purposely passeth by , and leaves them to destroy or kill themselves ; whereas his good Will , and Kindness , and free Proffers of Grace and Salvation to lost Man admits of neither , to wit , neither of such Cruelty to , nor Carelesness of his Creatures ; his Mercies are over all his Works , and his Grace and Mercy in the first place extending to all : And that saying , He will have Mercy on whom he will , is no Limitation to the first extent of his Grace and good Will ; But that he will have Mercy , both by way of Encrease and Continuance to the Upright-hearted , even to them that fear him , who Love and obey him ; but those that are destroyed , their Destruction is of themselves , as it is written , But my People would not hearken unto my Voice , Israel would none of me ; Therefore ( mark the Cause ) I gave them over to their own Hearts Lusts , Psal. 81. 11. and as S. S. ( in Contradiction to himself ) saith , Nor doth God consume any Man meerly as his own Workmanship ; but ( he adds ) God endureth with much long Suffering unregenerate men , and they fit themselves for Destruction , pag. 113. See here , how the Man breaks the Neck of his own Cause : Is his Opinion of God's Eternally reprobating and ordaining partiticular Persons to Destruction come to this , That now while he sheweth long Suffering towards them , they fit themselves for Destruction ; that is , they rebel against God , resist his Spirit , and despise the Riches of his Grace , and slight his long Suffering and Patience , till they bring swift Destruction upon themselves ? And this God is not the Cause of ; He doth not unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass : Sin and Rebellion in the Wicked , and their Striving against him , Isa. 45. 9. are come to pass , which he is not the Author of ; Wo unto him that Strives with his Maker ; thou hast hid thy Face from us , and we are consumed , because of our Iniquities ; which God is neither the Author nor Cause of . S. S. God's Election is unchangeable ; he will certainly bring in , never finally reject that Soul he had taken Liking to — Nothing sect 7 can fall out , not Sin it self , causing God to alter his Purpose ; he foresaw all , &c. p. 113. Answ. His Election and Purpose thereof , where made sure and confirmed by his Spirit in his Sanctified ones ( who are established in his Grace ) is unalterable : But 1st , There are Degrees and Growths in a State of Election before Establishment ; as those to whom Peter wrote his first Epistle , were called Elect , according to the fore-Knowledge of God through Sanctification of the Spirit unto Obedience , &c. 1 Pet. 1. 2. These though Elected ( so far as they were chosen out of the World , through Sanctification and Belief of the Truth ) yet he both wrote unto them , to stir up their pure Minds , 2 Pet. 3. 1. and exhorted them , to give Diligence to make their Calling and Election sure , that they might never fall , 2 Pet. 1. 10. But what need of this , if they were personally elected ( from an absolute Purpose of God ) from Eternity ? Needed , or could they make that more sure , which God had made so absolute ? If so , then the Exhortation had more properly run thus , viz. Brethren , believe that God hath made your personal Election sure from Eternity ; and then what needed he warn or admonish them concerning the Apostacy of those who denyed the Lord that bought them , who had forsaken the right Way , or of such , who after they had escaped the Pollutions of the World , through the Knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ ( which sure was saving Grace ) yet were again entangled therein , that their latter End was worse with them then the Beginning , 2 Pet. 2. Did not then their Sin , their falling from Grace , and so their Disobedience hinder their Establishment and Security in a State of Election , or keep from that Diligence ( in the Spirit ) whereby they should have made their Calling and Election sure . 2dly , His saying , That Sin it self cannot cause God to alter his Purpose , is not only a gross Mistake ( as in this Case ) but also gives a great Liberty to Hypocrites ( who believe they are eternally elect Persons ) to continue in Sin and Presumption : But in Reproof to such , and Confutation of the Mistake , see what the Prophet Jeremiah saith in the 18th Chapter , where having first declared the Power God had over them , by the Instance of the Potter , ver . 3 , 4 , 5 , 6. He further shews his Purpose and the Manifestation of his Power , both in Judgment and Mercy , and the Condition on which his declar'd Thought or Intention may be alter'd , as where he saith , v. 7. at what Instant I shall speak concerning a Nation & concerning a Kingdom , to pluck up and to pull down and destroy it , v. 8. If that Nation against whom I have pronounced , turn from their Evil , I will repent of the Evil I thought to do unto them , v. 9. And at what Instant I shall speak concerning a Nation , and concerning a Kingdom , to build and to plant it , v. 10. If it do Evil in my Sight , that it obey not my Voice , then will I repent of the Good , wherewith I said I would benefit them : See also ver . 11 , 12. to the 18th . Object . If any should thus object , That these conditional Alterations of God's Purposes did but concern their temporal Conditions , not their eternal , &c. Answ. It may be answered , That it is a Mistake ; they concerned both ; except Men repent they shall perish eternally : Their persisting in Evil-doing and Disobedience to the Voice of God , i●…currs eternal Condemnation , as well as temporal Punishments ; so contrary wise , through true Repentance , &c. both have been escaped by many , and Godliness is great Gain , which hath the Promise of the Life that now is , and of that which is to come , 1 Tim. 4. 8. & 6. 6. Again , my unanswered Objection was and still is , Were it not impertinent and vain , to warn Men of Destruction , sect 8 eternal Death , or Perishing , if from Eternity they were secured from any such Danger ? Or on the other Hand , in time to set before them Life and Death , that they might chuse Life , & refuse Death , &c. as Deut. 30. 15 , 16 , 17 , 18 , 19 , 20. If God had particularly designed them for Death and Destruction , how should they then chuse Life ? Were not this to mock them with a dissembling Proffer of Life , if the contrary be so unalterably designed for them ? S. S. ( After his fashion ) answers , God that decrees their Salvation , decrees by such Warnings to work in them his Fear and an holy Caution , to keep them in his Wayes , that they may be saved , p. 114. Rep. What Fear ? A Fear of that which there is no Danger of , or that from a Fear of Destruction they may fear him , when they are from Et●…rnity unalterably secured from Destruction , or of Salvation ( as is supposed ) What Non-sense and impertinent Preaching and Warning is this , to dissemble People into a Fear and Cautiousness of that which they are out of all Danger of incurring , especially , if God's Purpose in the Case be so unchangeable ( as to particular Persons ) that Sin it self cannot alter it ? Is this Way of Presbyterians warning Men of Destruction ( being compared with their partial Opinion ) any better then frighting Children with fond Conceits and Fancies of things that are not ? But we are sure that the Warnings that both Moses , the Prophets and Apostles gave , were real and serious , both as to their Tendence and Consequence , and not with such partial and contradictory Reserves and Opinions , as this of the Presbyterians eternal Election and Reprobation of particular Persons . Object . Whom he will he hardeneth , Rom. 9. Peter deserved sect 9 hardening as well as Judas ; That God hardeneth Judas , not Peter , proceeds from the meer Pleasure of his Will , p. 114. Rep. The Man most egregiously mistakes in this his placing such a severe Act of God's Will ( as hardening any that are rebellious ) upon meer Will and Pleasure ( in our Opposer's Sense ) as the Cause of such a Judgment , whereas it cannot be the meer Will and Pleasure of God to use such Severity , as to harden and destroy his Creatures ; for he delighteth in Mercy , Micah 7. 18. and hath no ●…leasure in the Death of him that dyeth ; and he willeth not the Death of a Sinner , but rather his Return , Ezek. 18. 23. & 33. 11. So that when he will harden , or give Persons up to the Hardeness of their Hearts , Justice ( as being provoked ) is of Necessity the Reason of his so acting , and not meer Will and Pleasure ; neither doth he harden Men from Eternity , but in Time , because of their Rebellion , resisting and gain-saying him in the Time of his long Suffering and Warnings to them , which doubtless he fore-saw in Pharaoh , who was in himself a proud , imperious , cruel Rebel against God , and Tyrant over his People , which appeared when he was warned in his saying , Who is the Lord that I should obey his Voice , to let Isra●…l go ? I know not the Lord ; neither will I let Israel go * Exod. 5. 2. As also Pharaoh's Rebellion appear'd when he hardened his own Heart , when he saw there was Respite , Exod. 8. 15. So God's giving him up to Hardeness of Heart , was not upon meer Will and Pleasure ; for that is all the Reason that the severe Actions of such Tyrants as Pharaoh , yields , as namely , Will and Pleasure : their Will is their Law ; they will be cruel and oppress , because they will do so : But all the Judgments of the Lord are just and righteous , respecting the Merit of the Fact or Cause more then meer Will and Pleasure ; therefore it was his Will to give Pha●…aoh , Judas , and many others , up to Hardeness , because it was Just so to do , for that their Rebellion and Provocation was exceeding great and high against him ; when as rigorous and cruel Tyrants use their Power in their Cruelties and Oppressions ( and seek to temporize and draw out their Subjects into Irreligiousness and Debaucheries ) only upon Will and Pleasure ( which to affix upon God , as the Reason of hardening any , is no small Degree of Blasphemy , as is this Man 's accusing God with the meer Pleasure of his Will , as the Cause or Reason of hardening Judas , not Peter ; & his accusing Peter with deserving hardening as well as Judas , is his manifest Error , making no Difference between Judas his Offence and Peter's , nor between their States and Conditions ; As the State of Peter , who through Weakness and Fear denyed Christ , which he presently repented of ; and that of Judas , who wilfully betrayed Christ , and delivered him into the Hands of Murtherers : Was not here a vast Difference between Peter and Judas ? ( what say you Professors to it ? ) and a great Reason for the Judgment of God upon that Traytor Judas more then meer Will and Pleasure . S. S. Arg. As there are particular Angels , whom God suffered sect 10 to fall ( though he could as easily have preserved them as he did the rest ) so there are particular Men and Women ( whom God endures with much long Suffering to fit themselves for Destruction ; therefore from all Eternity did God decree thus to do concerning them in particular ; for known to the Lord are all his Works from the Foundation of the World , p. 114 Answ. God's suffering Men and Angels to fall , or to fit themselves for Destruction , doth much differ from eternally decreeing them particularly for Destruction ; for if he had so decreed concerning them ( meerly as particular Persons ) what needed he endure t●…em with much long Suffering ? that being both a Testimony of his Grace or Favour towards them , and of his Unwillingness to destroy them ; for his long Suffering and Goodness leadeth some to Repentance , and his Judgment is according to Truth upon them that despise the Riches of his Goodness and Forbearance , Rom. 2. And concerning the Fall of those Angels that fell , 1st , God did neither particularly design it ; nor was he the Author of it , no more then of Men's Transgressions in general ; he hath ordained the Punishment of the Ungodly , not their Ungodliness ; for in Jude 6. it is said , The Angels which kept not their first Estate ( or Principality ) but left their own Habitation , he hath reserved in everlasting Chains under Darkness , &c. To that Saying , God could have preserved them , I answer , They provoked him , which was their great Sin and Loss to themselves ; Therefore he saw it not meet to continue his Love and Favour to them which they had so abused : Neither is it his Will or Way to detain or restrain any forceably in his Way , whether they will or not ; nor to preserve any without their Diligence in attending upon him , and keeping their Habitations . 2dly , So likewise concerning those that were ordained of old to this Condemnation , Jude 4. ( or as it may be read ) who were of old prescribed to this Judgment of the Ungodly ) however they as Ungodly Men , were so ordained for Condemnation ; not meerly as particular Persons , but as such , who were so far fallen from the Grace of God , as to transfer his Favours unto Luxury , denying the only Lord God ; They were also Trees whose Fruit wither d , twice dead , &c. Jude 12. Surely they could not be twice Dead , if they had never been Quickned ; but their Ingratitude and Abuse of the Grace of God that had quickned them , caused their Condemnation ; as , God spared not the Angels that sinned , but cast them down to Hell , they having left their own Habitation ; and spared not the old World , nor the Cities of Sodom and Gomorrah , whom he condemned with an Overthrow , making them an Ensample unto those that after should live Ungodly , 2 Pet. 2. This sufficiently declares the Reason & Cause of Condemnation , both to Angels and Men to be their Sin , in forsaking the Lord , and living Ungodly . But whereas S. S. renders God's fore-knowledge of all his Works , as the Reason or Proof , That he from eternity decreed particular Angels and Men for Destruction ( which appears Contradictory to his Masters of the Assemblies confessing , viz. That God hath not decreed any thing because he foresaw it as future , Confess . Chap. 3 ) This Proof is as impertinent as the rest of his shallow Arguments ; for his fore-Knowledge being infinite , it is no Proof that he hath absolutely decreed or ordained all things that come to pass , because he foresaw all ; for he hath not ordained that Men should live in Sin , though he hath designed their Punishment who do so live ; yet known unto the Lord are all his Work 's , both those of his Creation which he wrought according to his absolute Pleasure , both in Heaven , and in Earth , and in the Sea , &c. Psal. 135. 6. and Man was not capable of resisting his Maker in forming of him ; he was as the Clay in his Hand ; as also , the Lord foreknew his work of Sanctification and saving of man from Sin and Death ; but this is not effected without a Subjection to his Will , and a Compliance with his Spirit , and Power in his Work within : They are not Partakers of Salvation from Sin , who wilfully gain-say the Truth , resist the holy Ghost , and act Despite against the Spirit of Grace . But further , I find S. S. so uncertain in the Management of his partial Proposition for a personal Election and Reprobation , that he is made sometimes to grant and confess to Truth to his own absolute Confutation , and the Break neck of his graceless Cause ; As by his Confessing , That God hath no Pleasure in the Death of him that dieth ; considered barely as his Creature ; for he is willing to receive to Mercy every returning Sinner , yet if a Person perseveres in Wickedness , as such God will laugh at his Calamity , &c. Thus far S. S. From whence it follows , 1st , That God did not from Eternity decree the Damnation of particular Persons , contrary to his declared Pleasure . 2dly , That persevering in Wickedness is the Cause of Men's Calamity , 3dly , A●…d their Perversness and Obstinacy in rejecting Wisdom's Reproof and Counsel , the Cause that God will laugh at their Calamity , and mock when their Fear cometh . Now the Doctrine of Election and Reprobation , as universally sect 11 and equally laid down in the Scriptures of Truth , and as accordingly by us asserted ( for that there can be no Repugnancy either in God's Actions , or in his Will , whether secret or revealed , as some vainly imagin ) cannot be inconsistent with God's Prohibitions , Eat not of the Tree of Knowledge . His conditional Promises , If thou dost well , shalt thou not be accepted ? If you Seek the Lord , he will be found of you . Whosoever believeth shall not perish ; shall not abide in Darkness . His conditional Threats , If thy Heart turn away thou shalt Perish : If ye for sake him he will for sake you . His sending his Son into the World , not to Condemn the World. He should have added [ Christ's Dying for all Men , tasting death for every Man ] his giving his Spirit to instruct them ; His Setting Life and Death before them , in the Promises and in the Threats , or giving Men up to their Lusts for Sin , This cannot be inconsistent with God's Election or Choice of true Believers and Obedient , nor with his rejecting the Rebellious * unto Reprobation , for they evince the Truth thereof ; But the Presbyters partial Doctrine of Election and Reprobation of particular Persons , and certain definite number of Men and Angels , and their most grosly Asserting , that God from all Eternity did freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass , This is both inconsistent with those and such his Prohibitions , conditional Promises and Threats ; His sending his Son not to condemn the World , but that the World through him might be saved ; his dying for all Men ; his giving his good Spirit to the Disobedient to instruct them ; his setting Life and Death before them , to chuse Life , or perish , Deut. 30. 15. to the end ; but Alas ! if from Eternity God had reprobated them , or absolutely ordained and designed their Damnation and Curse , how should they Chuse Life or Blessing ? Or , if particularly & unchangeably ordained to Life and Salvation from all Eternity , Could there be any such Danger of their perishing , or that they should thus need to be threatned with Cursing and Perishing , if their Heart turned away from the Lord ? For had they been unchangeably designed of God for the one End ( whether Life or Death ) were it not very inconsistent to propose both conditionally to them ? as namely , to exhort them to chuse Life ; or if they refused , to threaten them with perishing &c. do not you partial-minded Presbyters and Calvinists by such kind of Preaching , and Propositions so contrary to your partial Principle , most grosly dissemble with People , and mock them contrary to your own Belief ? whenas Moses , the Prophets and Apostles in such like Conditional Promises and Threats believed what they spoak ; they believed and therefore spoak from the Spirit of God , which cannot lie nor dissemble . If you say , God hath decreed particular Persons Salvation by such Warnings , you thereby tell us that he hath decreed it by Threatning them with Damnation , and thereby you affix your non-sense & incongruous Doctrine upon God , rather then you will confess your own nonsensical Contradiction therein , which runs thus , That God hath from all Eternity unchangeably designed some Persons eternal Salvation , and yet that he warns and threatens the same Persons with eternal Damnation or Perdition , if they refuse Life , or to ●…earken to him and obey him , or if their Hearts turn away from him : pray , mark , how inconsistent and contradictory this is ; like as to say , It is unchangeably designed of God that you must live for ever ; yet take heed you do not dye eternally . And to S. S. his adding , All these are subservient to the Soveraign Design of God's Decrees : The Magnifying his Mercy and Grace in the Salvation of all the Elect ; his Justice or Wrath in the Reprobates , &c. pag. 115. Ans. If by the Words [ All these ] as we may take him ) he intends , according to the Assembly's Confession , That God from all Eternity did most freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass ; then it may be understood , that all these things , those Conditions or States , both Good and Bad , which he mentions before , are subservient to the soveraign Design of God's Decrees ( as he words it ) But if by [ all these ] he intends all these conditional Promises and Threats , are so subservient ( as I think he doth ) then God's Decrees of Men Salvation or Damnation , are also conditional accordingly : as first , If you seek the Lord he will be found of you ( and then as all are called to seek the Lord , he hath also given Liberty and a Capacity to all to seek him that they may find him ) this I grant to be according to his good Will , and subservient to his Decree , as his sending his Son into the World , not to condemn the World , but that the World through him be saved ; for he verily was fore-ordained before the Foundation of the World , 1 Pet. 1. 20 , 21. But then I deny , that God hath either decreed or ordained that men's Hearts should turn away from him , or that they shall forsake him ; or love Darkness rather then the true Light ( which is come into the World ) whereby many cause their own Condemnation : How dare any say or think , that all these are subservient to the soveraign Design of Gods Decrees , as they must who say , that he has unchangeably decreed whatsoever comes to pass ? which renders him to be the Author of those and such Sins and Abuses against himself and his Love , and that in order to serve his own Decree ; which is very blasphemous against God , who hath testified otherwise , as namely , Thy Destruction is of thy self , but in me thine Help , saith the Lord , Hoseah , 13. 9. and why will ye die , O house of Israel ? &c. God is not the Author of Sin , nor willing that any should perish therein ; he doth actually damn none but the finally ●…mpenitent ( as is plainly confessed ) So , thus his Decree Justly stands against the finally Impenitent ; therefore do not continue in your Impenitency , that you may not incurr final Damnation . God is neither Partial nor Cruel , in decreeing to deny saving Grace sect 12 to some , whilst he decrees to give it to others , p. 115. Answ. That God doth so decree is but Petitio Principii , and sufficiently confuted in the whole Tenor of this Discourse ; and let the Ingenious Reader Judge , whether this doth not render him both Partial and Cruel , to conclude , he hath unalterably decreed to damn some , and to deny them saving Grace ; but decreed to give it to others , who were by Nature Children of Wrath as well as the rest , and yet all God's Creatures and Workmanship , as Man and Woman , both the saved and the damned , are all inevitably brought into the World. This partial Doctrine of God's eternally decreeing to save some and to damn the rest ( who by Nature are rendered as all a like ) is enough to make many despair , and curse God that ever they had a Being , and to * destroy themselves , as many have donc upon this Principle , as by Satan's seconding it by perswading them , That God hath decreed to deny them saving Grace , on purpose to damn them forever ; which is ●…o small Reflection upon God and the Glory of his Soveraignity and Grace , and tends more then a little to ecclipse the Glory of his divine Justice , to render it so vindictive and cruel , as not in the first place to regard his own Workmanship in general ( to wit Mankind ) but to decree eternal Vengeance for the greatest part thereof , without affording them the least Degree of saving Grace , to help them out of the sallen Estate . Oh , What a cruel , dark Spirit is that in Electioners , that thus reflects u●…on a most gratious and Merciful God , who delighteth in Mercy and not in Destruction ! Neither is his divine Justice so Inconsistent with himself and his gracious divine Nature , as not to respect poor lost Man and Woman in general , or as not to allow Grace and Light sufficient for the Help & Salvation of Mankind in general , seeing that his being a Savour is not inconsistent with his ●…vine Justice ; for he said , I am a Just God and a Saviour ; there is none besides me , Isa. 45. 21 , 22. Divine Justice cannot be so partially cruel to the Creature , as either to make void divine Goodness , or withhold it from Mankind . S. S. Who can prove that converting , confirming Grace , is a sect 13 due Debt to every fallen Man and Woman , who hath first given to him , p. 115. Answ. What an impertinent Question is this ? Who of us ever asserted Grace to be a Debt to any Man ? Grace being so contrary to Debt in the very Nature of it , Rom. 4. 4. & 11. 6. God loved us first ; so that his Grace or Favour in the first Place is free to all Men , without Exception or respect of Persons ; and this condemns the Cruelty and Partiality , which the particular Electioners ( or Predestinarian ) Opinion would lay upon God , to limit and tye up his Grace in such Narrowness as it doth . Why doth he yet find Fault ? Rom. 9. may be justly objected against that erroneous Doctrine , That God hath unchangeably ordained whatsoever comes to pass ; for why should he find Fault , either with his own Works , or with the Effect of his own Design or Decree ? But he doth not find Fault , either with his own Works of Creation ( as made by him ) no●… yet with any Vessel , as made , renewed o●… clea●…sed by him , but as polluted or corrupted with Sin ; and so with Man , not as his Maker is the Potter or Framer , but as the Devil is the Potter , having framed Men up in his own Nature and Image of Sin and Unrighteousness ; and so , W●… unto him that striveth with his Maker , Isa. 45. 9. to which that of Rom. 9. 20. relates . And likewise , Who hath resisted his Will , or the Might of his Pow●…r ? is a Question ( of some ) supposing that God absolutely Wills and Effects whatever comes to pass from an unchangeable Purpose or Design , both as to the particular States and Ends of Pe●…sons : but herein ma●…y partial Minds and narrow Spirits are greatly mistaken ; for though the Will of God , and the Might of his Power , both in creating Man , and in many times convicting , judging and condemning the Wicked and Rebellious for Sin , be absolute and irresistable ; yet his Will , as manifest in the Tenders o●… Good , in Counsel and Perswasion to Man , in the Strivings of his Spirit with the Wicked ( All which have a tendence to draw Men out of Sin and Evil , and to induce them to Righteousness ) His Will , as thus considered , many do resist , in rejecting his Counsel , rebelling against his Commands , quenching his Spirit , resisting the holy Ghost , despising his Law , casting it behind their Backs , striving agai●…st their Maker in the time of his Patience and long Suffering towards them , till for their Rebellion he bring his Severity and heavy Hand upon them ; for if Men did not resist the holy Spirit , it should not need to strive with them ; God wills not that any should perish , but that all Men should come to Repentance , 2 Pet. 3. 9. Who will have all Men to be saved , and ●…o come unto the Knowledge of the Truth , 2 Tim. 2. 3 , 4. And yet all are not saved ; all do not know the Truth ; and what hinders them ? Not any Decree of God ; but their resisting his Good Will , Counsel and Motions of his Spirit . O Man ! thy Destruction is of thy self ; but thy Help is of me , saith the Lord. S. S. All fallen Men and Women are not reprobated ; this is sect 14 some Comfort , and it importunately urgeth all in Compassion to their own Souls , to turn from Sin to God in Christ , and to seek after good Scripture , Evidence of their Election , p. 116. Answ. The Matter would have been more congruous thus , for that no fallen Men nor Women are reprobated for Everlasting lasting Destruction , until they have first slighted the Kindness of God , abused his Grace , rebelled against his blessed Light , rejected his Knowledge , as not liking to retain him in their Knowledge ; this importunately urgeth all in Compassion to their own Souls , to turn from Sin to God in Christ , while his Grace and Good Will extends to them , and a time of Love is afforded them ; while he maketh his Sun to rise on the Evil and on the Good , and sendeth Rain on the Just and on the Unjust , Mat. 5. 45. Now this is Matter of Comfort , that God doth shew Love and Kindness towards all ; and that he universally extends Light and offereth Salvation by his Son ( who indeed is his shining Sun ) to the Ends of the Earth ; and that he willeth not ( or desireth not ) the Death of any in their Sins ; but rather their Return and Repentance , that they may live . But alas ! What a mani●…est Contradiction is it for the Man , one while to conclude , that God hath from all Eternity reprobated the greatest Part or Number of ●…allen Men and Women , or unchangeably designed their Eternal Damnation ( poor Encouragement ) another while , to tell of importunately urging all in Compassion to their own immortal Souls , to turn from Sin to God in Christ ? How should they have Compassion to their immortal Souls , if God hath no Compassion nor Love towards them ? Or how should Reprobates turn from Sin , if eternally reprobated ? This were but putting them upon an Impossibility , and so a flattering and mocking them with a pretended Kindness , never intended for them . As the Opinion ( which I oppose ) vainly supposeth , by such specious Pretences Presbyterian Priests , &c. have flattered many out of their Money , which is like as if a Priest in his preaching to a People , should bid them all have Compassion upon their Immortal Souls , and turn from Sin ; and then tell them it is impossible they should ever turn from Sin , or be saved , God having unalterably designed the Destruction and Damnation of the greatest Part of them ; what Comfort would this Contradiction and cruel Partiality administer to them , I pray you ? It would be but cold Comfort to tell a great Congregation , That God had fore-design●…d them all , except two or three of them , to be damned eternally . This is not the Word of Faith , nor any preaching in the Faith ; this is not Yea & Amen , but a saying and unsaying ; a pretending to comfort and encourage them all , and to discourage and lead m●…ny into Despair : And how then should they seek Evidence in Scripture for their Election or Salvation ? The Scriptures of themselves do not evidence to particular Perso●…s their Election from Eternity ; the Seriptures do not tell S. Scandr●…t & Nat. Barnard , &c. that they are Elect Persons ; B●…t to them that believe in Christ , and in him have obtained Power over their Corruptions , and whose Hearts are truly and spiritually tender towards God , his Spirit beareth Witne●…s w●…th their Spirits , and evidenceth to them ( according to Scripture ) that they are the Sons of God , chosen in Christ Jesus , through Sanctification of the Spi it and Belief of the Truth ; and so are adopted through the Spirit of Adoption , to be the Children of God , and Coheirs with Christ of Eternal Life and Peace . S. S. Is the Judge cruel that hangs up a Murtherer ? sect 15 Answ. No ; but neither the Judge , nor yet the Law doth ordain or prescribe , that this or that Person shall be a Murtherer ; for the Fact is forbidden , and the Punishment is prescribed , as is the judgment and Punishment of ungodly Men in general . S. S. God doth actually damn none but the finally Impenitent . Answ. Then their Impenitency is the Effect of their own Disobedience and Rebellion , not of God's Decree ; and this sufficiently con●…utes their accusing God with fore-designing or ordaining the Sin or wicked Actions of Men , or particular Persons , ●…or such and such Wayes and Ends , Act. 2. 23. Christ , being delivered by the determinate C●…unsel and fore-Knowledge of God , after you had taken with wicked Hands , you hav●… crucified and slain , p. 116. There was a Necessity of his being delivered to suffer , as God fore-knew , because of the Sins of the World : Christ was given up in the Counsel of God on his Part to suffer ; but their wicked Hands , that God permitted to take and murther him , were against God and Christ , not subject to his Counsel of Love and Mercy ; but to the Devil and their own wicked Hearts , malicious & murtherous Spirits ; and therefore they were by God's Counfel call'd to repent , to be converted , to turn from their Iniquities , Acts 3. 14 , 15 , 19 , 26. But surely God did not call them to re●…ent of obeying his holy and just Counsel , but of their Iniquities , having murthered the Just one . Acts 4. 27 , 28. Against thy ●…oly Child Jesus , Herod & Pontius Pilate with the Gentiles and the People of Israel , gathered themselves together , to do whatsoever thine Hand and thy Counsel had determin'd before to be done . But see ver . 25 , 26. concerning the Gentil●…s Rage , and the Kings of the Earth , and the Rulers standing up , and gathering together against the Lord and against his Christ ; the Rage and wicked Consultations of whom God was not the Author of ; for when God by the Mouth of his Servant David asked , Why did the Heathen rage ? ver . 25. Would it have been a good Answer for any to have said , Lord , why dost thou ask ? Hast not thou ●…ore - ordained them to rage & imagine vain things ? Surely no ; sor th●…n he would not ask , why ? but when thereby they had provoked him , having rejected his Counsel and Good Will , they were given up to work Wickedness and Injustice , and so their own Ruin , like those who brought Wo upon their Souls ; for they had rewarded Evil to themselves . As God's Counsel fore-saw and perceived , as the Jews or People of Israel rejected Christ , and would not be gathered by him , he said , O Jerusalem , Jerusalem ! how oft would I have gathered thy Children , even as the Hen gathereth her Chickens under her Wings , and you would not ; he therefore said , Ye are the Children of them that murthered the Prophets ; fill ye up the Measure of your Fathers , &c. Serpents , &c. Mat. 23. 31. to the End : This was not from an Eternal Decree irrespectively against their Persons , but in Judgment and Wrath against them because of their Ungratefulness , Envy and Wickedness ; and so likewise all who receive not the Love of the Truth , whereby they might be saved , but have Pleasure in their Unrighteousness , God gives them up both to strong Delusions and Hardness of Heart for their Iniquity , 2 Thes. 2. 10 , 11. S. S. Is Cod the Author of Sin in determining or fore-ordaining the wicked Actions of these Men ? It is one thing to decree the Permission of Sin , another to commit it ; between God's fore-ordaining the Sin , and the actual Commission of it , came in the Will and wicked Hands of Men : The Will and these wicked Hands were the Author and Cause of Sin , and not God's fore-Ordination . Answ. How S. S. can clear himself from rendering God to be the Author of Sin , while he accuseth him of determining or fore-ordaining the wicked Actions of these Men , of fore - ordaining the Sin , let the unbyas'd Reader judge whether this be not an Unjust Charge against God : And I ask , Did God determine and fore-ordain the Wicked Actions of Men , and yet warn and counsel them to turn from Iniquity ? What Inconsistency is this ? How will these hold together ? Doth not God first counsel , and desire the 〈◊〉 before he lets them alone , and gives them up to their Lusts and Hardness , to Work their own Ruin ? How like the Ranters Principle ( that all Actions are of God and by his Power ) is it to say ( in these general Expressions ) That God hath determined or fore-ordained the Actions of wicked Men ? For then , how should they reform , as he counsels them by his Light in their Consciences ? and what need of Reforming what God hath fore-ordained ? But how contradictory to this Fore-ordination of wicked Actions ( which the Man hath unjustly accused God with ) is his P●…rmission of Sin ? although he doth not alwaies permit Sin to go unpunished , yet in this we agree , that the Will and wicked Hands of Men , as acted by the Divel , were the Author and Cause of Sin , and the Commission of it ; and therefore not God , nor any Fore-ordination of his ; for he hath fore-ordained his Son Jesus Christ to call Sinners to Repentance , to offer Life and Salvation to all , before he g●…ves up any to a reprobate Mind , or to work their own Ruin. S. S. to those he counts Elect , saith ; You are now afraid sect 16 you have lost all ; for you have greatly fallen as did David * your Faith is even giving up the Ghost , yet are you not fallen from Grace ; God hath not forsaken you , Psal. 89. 30. Answ. Although I confess that in the Lord is plentious Redemption , and Forgiveness to all that unfeignedly repent , and turn from Iniquity ; yet as this Man placeth all upon a personal Election ( even David's Forgiveness and Redemption ) not so much taking notice of his Repentance , Judgment and Terror that he under went , under which David often asked God Forgiveness for his Transgression : This pretended personal Election , and telling Men , they are not fallen from Grace , when guil●…y of horrible Wickedness , gives them a large Scope and gross Liberty to Sin and Wickedness , if they can but in the first place conceit they are elect Persons ; and be but such Hypocrites as out-face their own Consciences , and murder the Just Witness , and evade the Conviction and Reproofs of Truth therein ; and be so self-confident as to perswade themselves they are not fallen from Grace , when they have committed Adultery or Murther , and acted as badly as Reprobates can do , and then flatter themselves with that Imagination , That Christ hath payed all their Debt , and satisfied the Justice of his Father ( which they call vindictive ) for all their Sins past , present and to come . This is an easy way to make Hypocrites , for them to continue in the Sin of Whoredom and other Abominations . But this is too broad a Way ever to lead them to Heaven ; and the Wicked had not need thus to have their Hands strengthened in Sin , nor thus to be encouraged in a course of Impioty by a Pretence of an Impossibility of falling from Grace , seeing there is a just Man that perisheth in his Righteousness , and then where shall the Wicked and Ungodly appear ? and what manner of Persons ought we to be in all holy Conversation and Godliness , 2 Pet. 3. Will it avail Persons any thing before the Just God , for a Company of daubing Hypocritical Priests to tell a few conceited Electioners , Though you have fallen very foully , as did David , or into Adultery or Murther ; yet have a good Heart on it , believe still you are elect Persons , chosen and designed of God for Salvation from all Eternity ; you are not fallen from Grace , when you are guilty of Whoredom and the like ; as if Grace had such a great Affinity with them in this their Wickedness . A pleasant Doctrine for the Devil and his Children to feed upon , as Hypocrites , Whoremongers , and abominable Workers ; who , though as bad and filthy as those they count Reprobates , yet do imagine that God respects their vile Persons , Eternally to mak●… Choice of them only more then others , who it may be , ar●… not so bad as they ( as if they were such choice Jewels in their Filthiness ) which is no small Blasphemy , and Reflection upon God , thus to render him partially-indulgent to the Wicked , and unequal in his Way towards Mankind , as eternally to design such great Favour and Indulgence to a small part thereof ( which is as bad as the rest ) and inevitable Cruelty ( as eternal Wrathin Hell ) to the greater part thereof ; whereas all Mankind in general is God's Workmanship by Creation , all made of one Earth , one Blood , &c. surely he is no such Respecter of Persons . As concerning God's Covenant with David and his Seed , sect 17 Psa. 89. It is said , His Seed also will I make to endure for ever , and his Throne as the Dayes of Heaven : If his Children for sake my Law , if they break my Statutes , then will I visit their Transgressions with the Rod , and their Iniquity with Stripes ; nevertheless my Loving Kindness will I not utterly take from him : I ask , From Whom ? Was it not David that is beloved , who as he entered into Covenant and Agreement with God , he was his Servant anointed with the holy Oyl ? There remained a true and tender Seed in him which the Name Beloved most properly related to ; though the Man passed through great Judgment and Tribulation , he obtained Forgiveness , and God had such regard to him for his own Name and Seed sake , and the Sincerity that had a Root in him , that his Children fair'd the better in some respects for his sake , 1 Kings , 11 , 12. howbeit , this proves not that all the Seed of David after the Flesh , kept their Covenant with God , or stood in his Grace , so as not at all : to fall from it ; for , however God for a time retains Favour , Kindness and Patience to Revolters , who have tasted of his Grace and Power , as very unwilling they should be utterly lost , yet in departing from the Lord into Iniquity , they do in themselves turn from and abuse his Grace , not being stedfast therein with the Lord : So that the Instance proves not , that his loving Kindness did always continue unto such as run into Adultery , Idolatry and Abominations , and continuing in Rebellion , after their many gentle Chastisements , though the Lord is long suffering , and keepeth Covenant and Mercy with them that fear him ; his Faithfulness fails not ; he is ready to fulfil the terms of his Covenant and Promise on his part . I Would ask our Opposer ( who reckons it not a falling from Grace , for those he counts Elect Persons , as David and his Children , with others of his own Opinion now , to sall into the Guilt of Adultery and Murther , &c. ) whether or no did not his Son Solomon fall from Grace when he loved the outlandish Women , so as they turned away his Heart aster other God's ? 1 Kings 11. Did he stand in the Covenant of Grace , or in God's Favour all this time ? Was not the Lord angrv with him ? See ver . 10 , 11 , 12. And surther that of Psal. 89. Concerning David , his Seed and Throne , it extends further then meerly a literal Relation of him and his Seed , according to the Flesh ; for David is beloved : I have sound David my Servant ; with my holy Oyl have I anointed him , ver . 20. his Seed also will I make to endure for ever , and his Throne as the dayes of Heaven , ver . 29. his Seed shall endure forever , and his Throne as the Sun before me , ver . 36. Herein David was truly a Type of Christ , the Anointed of God , to whom these Promises relate , which were typified in David ; as also that saying , I will make him my First-b●…rn , higher t●…en the Kings of the Earth , ver . 27. This is a Mystery beyond a meer Literal Acceptation ; and I may say in this , as the Apostle said in his Instance of Abraham and his Seed , That , as they that were of Faith , were of Abraham and his Children ; so they that are spiritually anointed of God , and his Beloved Children and Faithful Servants , are of David's Seed , even such who incline their Ear to God , and obey his Voyce ; for it is written , Hearken diligently unto me , and eat ye that which is Good ; and let your Soul delight it self in Fatness : Incline your Ear and come unto me ; hear , and your Soul shall live ; and I will make an Everlasting Covenant with you , even the sure Mercies of David , Isa. 55. 2 , 3. A POSTSCRIPT about the Will of God , Election and Reprobation . Concerning the Will of God in its Manifestation , both 1st , as unresistable . ●…dly , as resistable . sect 1 FIrst , On what Considerations it may be said to be unresistable , shewing forth the Might of his Power ; as , 1. In bringing forth the Works of Creation ; Whatsoever he pleased that did he , Psal. 135. 6. 2. In fore-ordaining his Son to be set forth in him , to tender Grace and Salvation in due time to Mankind ( Who could hinder his first Ordination , though many reject the Tenders ? ) 3. In extending his Light and Power universally to the final Conviction of Impenitent Evil-doers for their Rebellion ( which Light and Power unavoidably at times seizes upon their Consciences , reproving and convicting them while they have a Day ; and though they may shun being reformed thereby , yet they cannot alwayes avoid the Torment and Trouble thereof in themselves ) That God may shew himself clear when he Judgeth . 4. In bringing and executing his Judgments and Wrath as he sees Cause , upon the Wicked and Rebellious , who are finally Impenitent . By all which God hath manifested his Power ( or Soveraignity ) which on these Considerations hath irresistably shewed it self for the fulfilling his Righteous Will , so far as it hath absolutely extended it self from an Intention or Design of God , to shew forth his Wisdom , Justice , and the Greatness or Might of his Power , without the Creature Complyance ; as , 1. God's Work of Creation . 2. His Fore-ordination , to bring forth his Son into the World , &c. 3. His Power in finally Convicting Rebellious Sinners . 4. The Execution of his Judgments upon the Rebellious . In all these who shall say to God , What doest thou ? Who shall let what he will do , so far as his Will inevitably and unresistably hath acted , or doth act in any thing without Man's Complyance , as it was in Making Man ; in Convicting and Condemning the Rebellious and Stubborn ? But Secondly , The Will and Power of God as condescending and reaching gradually to the Creature 's Capacity , it is possible ●…or Men to resist the Manifestation thereof to their own Condemnation : As the Will of God is manifest in a Way of Friendship and Kindness to Mankind , as , 1. In a way of Counsel , Commands , Instructions , Invitations , Perswasions and gentle Reproofs ( which have a tendence to draw Men out of Sin ) and 2. In his Patience and long Suffering towards them , waiting to be gratious , desiring their Return , striving with them by his Spirit : Thus his Will is , That all should know the Truth and be saved , 1 Tim. 2. 4. 2 Pet. 3. 9. But Mens Conversion and Salvation is not wrought without their Subjection , Obedience and Complyance with the Spirit and Power of God , co-operating by Faith. Reprobation What it is ? A Reproving , Disallowing , Rejecting . sect 2 Reprobate is , Wicked , Base , Dishonest , Corrupt , so as to be cast out of God s Favour , &c. And the Cause of Persons being given over to a Reprobate Mind , is their Rebellion against Light given them ; their rejecting the Knowledge of God , till their Minds became so reprobate or corrupt , as to be void of true Sence and Judgment , Rom. 1. As they who w●…re called Reprobate Silver ( or as corrupt , drossy , false Coyn ) were rejected of the Lord , Jerem. 6. 30. The Word Election explained . Election is Choice , which respects both : sect 3 I. The chusing of some from amongst many , as Christ said to his Followers , I have chosen you out of the World , Joh. 15. 19. II. The Excellency or Choiceness of that which is chosen ; And this relates , First , To Christ , the Elect Seed , of whom it is said , Behold my Servant , mine Elect , in whom my Soul delighteth , Isa. 42. 1. And He is also called a chief Corner-Stone , Elect , Pretious , 1 Pet. 2. 6. Secondly , To the true Church or Elect People , who ( being chosen through Sanctification of the Spirit and Belief of the Truth ) are the faithful Followers of Christ ; these are choice and pretious in God's Sight , and therefore are called the Elect of God , Holy and Beloved , Col. 3. 12. a chosen Generation , a Royal Priesthood , an Holy Nation , a peculiar People , &c. 1 Pet. 2. 9. They that are with the Lamb , are Called , Chosen and Faithful , Rev. 17. 14. the Pretious Sons of Sion , comparable to fine Gold , Lam. 4. 2. This God's Election or Choice of his Church or People , is gradually manifest and experienced in them : as , 1st , When they have known the Work of God by his Grace begun it them unto their Separation from the World , through a Decree of Faith and Sanctification , are called Elect , that is , as chosen out of the World , or from among Men , being more peculiar to God then others ; while yet they are not perfectly grown and established in the Truth : as Israel of old was Elect , and Jerusalem chosen ( before their Estrangement from God , Esa. 44. 1. 1 Kings 11. 13. ) Paul was a Chosen Vessel , when first he had received and obeyed the heavenly Vision and Call , Acts 9. 15. and Chap. 26. 19. Who notwithstanding after that said , I keep my Body under , and bring it into Subjection , left that by any means , when I have preached to others , I my self should be a Cast away , 1 Cor. 9. 27. and those whom the Apostle Peter , in his first Epistle calls Elect , in his second Epistle he exhorts to give all D●…ligence to make their Calling and Election sure , that so they might never fall , 2 Peter 1. 10. Exhorting or warning them from divers Examples of them that fell from Grace , denyed the Lord that bought them , backslid , and became Enemies , Chap. 2. throughout ; And this second Epistle was to stir up their pure minds , Chap. 3. 1. 2dly , Election in the heighth or perfection of it , as attained to in the full Growth of the Elect Seed , and Establishment of the Children of Light , in and by the Grace of God ( through Diligence and Faithfulness on their parts ) this admits not of being deceived , nor of falling , nor of backsliding , as Christ intimates an Impossibility that the very Elect should be deceived , Mat. 24. 24. And they who through Diligence have made their Calling and Election sure , shall never fall , 2 Pet. 1. 10. being grown up in the Life , Nature a●…d Image of the Elect Seed , which the Prince of the World hath nothing in . Oh! All you in whom there yet remains a Sincerity and Breathing after the Lord , labour in the Light of Christ by the Assistance of his Grace in you , to make your Calling and Election sure , in this Elect Seed , and none conceit your selves secure out of it : For , God's Fore-knowledge and Fore-appointment of his People sect 4 unto Life and Glory , is in this his own Seed ; in this they are known of him , related to him , in this chosen of him , and Choice to him , and in his sight as his peculiar Treasure ; in this he did fore-know , and doth predestinate or appoint them to be conformed to the Image of his Son , that he might be the First-Born in many Brethren , Rom. 8. 29. ( yea and the sanctified Children of believing Parents ) Their Growth and Security was to be in this Elect Seed of Life , or otherwise they might degenerate , as Israel of old did , after they were planted of a Noble Vine , and an holy right Seed . If it should be said , that this of Rom. 8. intimates some special Fore-knowledge * and Purpose of God , concerning these many Brethren thus Conformed , as unto Witnesses chosen before of God , Christ s Resurrection was manifest for them to preach , Act. 10. 40 , 41. To this I say , Grant it doth ; We confess both God's Fore-sight and Fore-knowledge of his own , and deny not his Omniscienc●… , nor limit his Power or Omnipotency from shewing forth it self both how , after what manner , at what time , and in whom soever he pleaseth , as sometimes he doth miraculously upon Eminent Occasions , and for peculiar Works , Ends and special Services , as is that of true Prophets , Apostles , Ministers of Righteousness ; or those many Brethren unto whom in their Day Christ was first manifest , and in whom he was first revealed , formed and born , who in their Day were first raised up to witness forth his Power , as the Prophet Jeremiah was sanctified before he came forth of the Womb , for his peculiar Service , as an Eminent Prophet ; and John was filled with the holy Ghost from his Mothers Womb , that he might be a Witness to the Messiah ; and Paul was miraculously stopt from Persecution by a Heavenly Vision , which he obeyed , and was called into the Work of a Faithful Apostle , God having separated him from his Mothers Womb , and called him by his Grace , to shew forth his Universal Kindness and Love to others , to turn People from Darkness to the Light : and many other Instances might be shewn of God's taking particular notice of his Witnesses and Servants for peculiar Services ( yet the Growth , standing and Security of all was by Faith and Obedience in the Power of God ) who , though in their Age and Times were as the first ( and so Choice ) Fruits to God ; yet , this neither hinders his second Fruits ( but rather to further them and his Work , so as his Name might be the more spread ) Nor do these Instances prove any Limitation of God's universal Love in Christ ( as only to a few ) Nor frustrate the free extent of his Grace ; nor yet hinder Salvation from being common in the Freeness and free Tenders of it to Mankind . CHAP. VI. Whether PERFECTION , that is , a State sreed from all Sin , be attainable in this Life ? Let the Reader observe the State of the Question , which is not , Whether the Saints had Failings , or upon extream Tryals , might not be tempted into Impatiency ? but , Whether such a State of Perfection be attainable in this Life ? which we affirm . Attainable , chiefly , because of the Aid and Assistance of God's Power afforded unto them who wait upon him , and trust in his Name and Power ; for , Greater is He that is in us , then he that is in the World : Christ is stronger then the Devil ; therefore the Devil is not an invincible Enemy ; and we can do all things through Christ that strengthneth us . 2. A Sinless State is attainable by true Believers , because God hath commanded it ( who doth not command Impossibilities ) to Abraham and his Seed , and said , I am God Almighty , walk before me and be thou perfect ; Sin not . Be ye perfect a●… y ur h●…avenly Father is perfect . 3. Because he hath promised it to his peculiar People ; Thy People shall be a●…l Righteous ; they shall do no Iniquity that trust in the Name of the Lord ; Christ shall thorowly Purge his Floor . 4. Christ's Work and Ministry is , to destroy the Work of the Devil ; to present men perfect ; to bring them to a perfect man in him ; to subject every Thought unto his Obedience , &c. Therefore , to affirm the contrary , or that a State free from all Sin is not attainable in this Life , is to oppose the all-Sufficiency of God's Almighty Power , and t●… set the Devil's Power above it ; as also to oppose the Ends of God's Command , Promise , the Work of Christ and his Ministry , which to oppose or render frustratious , by pleading or arguing for Sins Continuance in this Life , is Impious and Antichristian : And , how far this Opposer is herein concerned , will further appear . Whereas he puts two differing Senses on the word Perfection ; viz. a State free from all Sin , as that of the Spirits of Just men , Heb. 12. 23. And yet that it doth not alwayes sig●…ifie free from all Sin , &c. I ask then , What Christ maketh true Believers perfect in ? Is it in any thing consistent with Sin ; or in himself in whom is no Sin , whom he that abideth in , sinneth not ? I cannot understand that Perfection , as it is the Effect of Christ's Work in true Believers , can admit of the Continuance of Sin all their Dayes , while it signifies both the Reality and Compleatness of his Works . His Instance for P●…rfection not free from all Sin , is Job 1. 1. Job was a Perfect man , yet not without Sin ; for he Cursed his Day . It is evident that Job's Perfection had none of this Extream in it , nor did it consist with Sin ; for it is thus explained , He feared God & eschewed Evil. — And upon his Loss of Goods and Children , being told him , it s said of him ; in all this Job sinned not , nor Charg●…d God Foolishly , Chap. 1. 22. and when smitten with sore Boyls , and tempted by his Wise ; it is also said in all this did not Job si●… with his Lips , Chap. 2. 10. But , he Cursed his Day , Chap. 3. He was then under an extream Tryal and Grief divers wayes aggravated ; the most that can be reasonably inferred from thence , is , that a Perfect or Upright Man that fears God , a●…d eschews Evil , may possibly through great Tryals , Temptations or Provocations , be drawn into an extream to express his Grief : but this only , if God suffers Satan so to affict , or deeply to try : for , he could not have so afflicted Job , if God had not suffered him , in that he saw the Lord had hedged him about . From whence observe , that what is granted hereupon , and what he argues , is not in pursuance of the State of the Question , as to grant , that a Perfect Job may be tempted into some extream Expressions , if God Suffer Satan so deeply to afflict him : but , Whether it be not possible for such a one to be delivered as well from all Failings or Sin , as from the Tryal or Temptation ? For was not Job a Perfect Man both before and after his Deep Affliction ? and is not his Patience highly commended of , who said , when I am tried I shall come forth as Gold ? Now , when I affirm that this refined State was attainable in this Life , were it not absurd to object , that it is not , because Job cursed his Day ? for did Job do so all his Life time ; or did his Perfection reach no higher ? His Instance , That God took six Dayes to create the World , when he could have done it in a Moment , is no Proof that he is only a mortifying Sin more and more in this Life , and that he will remove its Being in the next , pag. 63. Neither do the Scriptures any where say , that the Being of Sin ( yet mortified in part ) shall remain in the Saints till , the next Li●…e ; though we grant , God took six Dayes to create the World , and rested the seventh ; and so he carrieth on his Work gradually in the true Believer for the perfecting of the new Creation ; the six I ayes Work thereof , as also the Seventh Day of Rest , are to be experienced in this Life : the Work o●… Holiness is to be perfected while in the Body , and he that believeth enters into his Rest or Sabbath , to injoy the holy Day in that inward retired waiting upon the Lord in his own Light , wherein Man must not think his own Thoughts , nor speak his own Words : And as for God's Work , it is perfect ; each Day 's Work was perfect ( as such ) the first Day 's Work not mended on the sixth Day ; and he that hath begun a good Work in the Soul is able to perfect it . Whereas S. S. states the Question and Answer thus , viz. Quest. But why will he not in this Life ? ( viz. remove the Being o●… Sin ) He answers , It is his good Pleasure . I Reply , A damnable Doctrine to affirm that it is God's Good Pleasure , that the Being of Sin should remain in his Saints all their Life time , or till the next ; when he hath no Pleasure in Evil , therefore doth prohibit all Sin. Quest. Can he see the Continuance of Evil good ; or that his Command should not be kept ? To this he answers . He sees good to suffer Corruptions in par 〈◊〉 in his Saints , to keep them humble , drive them to his Blood and Righteousness , &c. Reply , Let the so●…er Reader mark the Nature and Tendency of this Do●…rine . First , How Impiously he reflects upon God ; as seeing it Good to suffer Corruptions , either but in part mortified , or in part unmortified in his Saints ( in this Life ) for his Doctrine bears the same Sense on both Hands , as that God sees it good to suffer Corruptions ; if but in part mortified , then in part unmortified in his Saints . And then 2dly , What a great Use and Service doth he place upon the remaining of Corruptions in the Saints , as namely , to keep them humble , exercise and drive them to his Blood and Righteousness , which is as good Doctrine , as to say , There is a Necessity for the Saints to sin , that they may be humbled , ; to do Evil , that Good may come of it : and by this , the more they sin , the more humble ; the more Unrighteous or Corrupt , the more Partakers of the Blood & Righteousness of Christ ; which are gross I●…consistencies : Shall we sin that Grace may abound ? God forbid . Christ's Blood cleanseth us from all Sin , as we walk in the Light ; and his Righteousness admitteth of no Iniquity to continue : For us to feel the Remission of Sins past , through the Blood and Righteousness of Christ , when we are come to the lively Act and Operation of Faith , therein doth sufficiently render the infinite Perfection of Pardoning Grace both splendent and glorious ; and not to say , That God sees good that Corruptions in part should continue in his Saints to keep them humble : for this is a manifest pleading for Sin , and a Commendation given to it , as to those good Effects ( vainly supposed ) of Corruptions , viz. To keep the Saints humble , to drive them to his Blood ; whereas when they are truly humbled , and Partakers of the Blood and Righteousness of Christ , and living in the Sence thereof , they withstand all Sin and Iniquity , and dare not give way thereto , that they may be righteous : They that will teach men true Humility , must not teach them to be Proud , that they may be Humble ; nor tell them , that it is God's good Pleasure that the Being of Sin and Corruptions must remain in them all their dayes , or till the Life to come , to keep them humble ; neither is a perfect or holy State so void of true Humility as this Sin-pleasing Doctrine implyeth . But this is something like the Papists high Commendation of Man's Fall , where , in their Saturday-Mass , in the Deacon's Hymn are these words , O 〈◊〉 necessarium Adae peccatum quod Christi morte deletum est . O felix culpa quae talem ac tantum meruit habere redemptorem . O vere 〈◊〉 nox , quae sola meruisti scire tempus & horam , in qua Christ us ab inferis resurrexit . i. e. O surely the Sin of Adam was necessary , which by Christ's Death was blotted out . O blessed Fault , that hast deserv'd to have so great and such a Redeemer . O truly blessed Night , which alone hast deserv'd to know the Time and Hour , wherein Christ rose from the Hells . Again , To prove it God's good Pleasure not to remove the Being of Sin in this Li●…e , that he sees good to suffer Corruptions , &c. And in answer to my Objection , That his Pleasure is not contrary to his Command , which requireth us to be perfect , he saith . God commands to offer Isaac , he purposeth Isaac shall not be offer'd ; this shews he doth not efficaciously will every thing he commands , p. 64. Rep. First , This Instance is not pertinent in this Case , it being a peculiar Command and Act to Abraham , and not common to the Saints , nor relative to those Commands injoyning Holiness of Li●…e , which they are all concerned in . 2dly , He is mistaken in saying , He purposeth Isaac shall not be offered ; for the Scripture saith , That by Faith Abraham , when he was tryed , offered up Isaac ; and he that had received the Promises , offered up his only begotten Son , Hebr. 11. 17. It is evident , that neither God's Command nor Purpose was , to kill Isaac ; but that Abraham's Faith should be tryed in offering him up , which by Faith he did ; in which he said , God would provide himself a Lamb for a Burnt Offering , Gen. 22. 8. And he accounting , that God was able to raise him up even from the Dead , from whence also he received him in a Figure , Hebr. 〈◊〉 . 19. But this is no Proof , that it is not his Pleasure , his Commands requiring perfect Love & Obedience , s●…ould be kept ; and they that enter into the Covenant of Grace , enter into an Agreement with God in Christ , which though it remits Sins past , yet gives no Liberty to continue in Sin ; neither is it any Condition of this Covenant , that the Being of Sin should remain to keep the Saints humble ; for , by this Covenant God taketh away Sin , not only by Remission , but by Receiving the Soul into Agreement with himself . Jesus Christ is our Surety , Mediator and Advocate , both in his being a Propitiation or Sacrifice for the Sins of the whole World , that upon the Act of Faith in his Blood , and believing in his Name , Sins past may be remitted ; as also in his inabling us to obey the Conditions and Obligation of the Covenant of Grace ( or Law thereof ) which we are under , and in fulfilling the Promises thereof to us ; for without him we can do nothing , we can obtain ●…o P●…iviledge but in him , in whom the Promises of Cod are all Yea and Amen : And seeing God receiveth true Believers in Christ into Agreement with himself , Christ being their Surety , doth not exempt them from the Payment of what is their due Obedience , but inables them thereto ; for , to be in Covenant or Agreement with God , is neither consistent with disagreeing with him by Transgression or sinning against him . When or where Sin shall be removed after Death , he resolves not : He tells us not , How long a time shall be between Death and the perfect Removal of Sin ; for a Purgatory he seemeth not in words to own , how nearly related soever his Doctrine be to it in his saying , It sufficeth me to be assured from God's Word , it ( Sin ) is not done away in this Life ; it shall in the next . But where and what that God's Word is , that so assureth him , That Sin is not done away in this Life , but in the next , he hath not yet demonstrated nor proved ; nor doth he clear himself of the Pope's Doctrine of a Purgatory , but confesseth , That no unclean thing shall enter the Kingdom of Heaven ; since Christ is to present us holy , unblamable and unreprovable in his Sight , a glorious Church , not having Spot or Wrinkle , p. 64. Mark here , how he hath manifestly contradicted his pleading for the Being of Sin in the Saints , and saying , It is not done away in this Life , and yet the Church must be holy , unbl●…mable and unreprovable in his Sight , not having Spot or Wrinkle ; but then he addeth further , as a part of what Christ hath merited touching this Point , and in pag. 67. He hath perfected forever them that are sanctified meritoriously . To which I say , Hath Christ merited or purchased the Church's Beauty and Perfection , even perfect Sanctification ; and yet is it his Father's good Pleasure , that the Church shall not receive such Perfection here ? Or that the Being of Sin shall not be remov'd in this Life ? Were it not Blasphemy to suppose , That Christ hath bought for man that which his Father will not allow him ? But I must suppose his Sence of Christ's Merit , Dignity , Righteousness and Obedience , as not to be really partaken of and inherited by true Believers in this Life , but only in their Sence of Imputation , which can be neither real nor true , to reckon themselves Holy , Unblamable , Unreprovable , without Spot or Wrinkle , while yet spotted with Sin and inherent Corruptions ; though still I grant , that every Degree of Real Righteousness , true Faith and Sincerity to God , springing up from his own Life in his Children , is owned and accounted of in his Sight ; for the Lord is well-pleased for his own Righteousness sake , Isa. 42. 21. and the Fruits of his own Spirit are acceptable to him , from the highest Growth and Maturity to the least Appearance , breathing and breaking forth thereof in the Soul , yea , from Israel's Tryumphing and Glorying in the Lord , to Niniveh's believing God and repenting ; and God commands us nothing but what he inableth us to perform , although against this S. S. objects , that he commands from the Beginning of Life to the End of Life , to continue in all things written in the Law to do them ; but where this is commanded us in Scripture , he shews us not : We are satisfied , that God layeth no more upon man , as to doing or performing , then he inableth man ; for his Commands are gradually and orderly imposed to be obeyed , according to the Ability that he giveth the Creature ; he doth not command a Child to do a Man's Work ; he is no hard Master : So in the Covenant of Grace there is a Growth from one Degree of Strength to another , 〈◊〉 Faith to Faith , from Little Children to Young Men , &c. and so according to their Growth and Capacity God requires Obedience , and doth not impose Impossibilities o●… them . And if so be that the Power and Glory of God be more manifest in the Second Covenant ( or in the New Covenant of Grace ) then in the First Covenant ; by how much the greater man's Priviledge is in this , by so much the more he is inabled by the same Power cheerfully to live in Obedience and Faithfulness under it . Therefore S. S. his being assured , That Sin is not done away in this Life , and his Con●…ession , That a Believer dyes unto Sin by degrees , and so AT his Death the whole of Christ's Merit is immediately applyed , whereby Sin is forever totally abolished : These are not consistent , neither doth he write as a man of Experience of the Work of God , what Assurance foever he pretends ; sor to say , That his Sin is not done away in this Life , or that it sh●…ll in the next ; and yet to say , It is totally abolished AT his Death : These are as Contradictory as to say , That S●…n is done away At Death , and yet it is not done away till After Death , which is ( saith he ) to the last Trump will Sin be in the Saints , p. 64. and when that shall be he explains p. 85. at his Coming in the End of the World , quoting 1 Thes. 4. 17. Mark Reader here , how plainly he contradicteth his Saying , That At Death Sin is forever totally abolished : Now , it is in the End of the World , when Christ cometh Personally ( as he supposeth ) to Judgment ; So by this confused Work , one while Sin is Not done away in this Life ; another while , it Is done away At Death ; another while , it Is done away After Death ; another while , it is Not done away Till the last Trump or End of the World ; whereas there are many Believers and Saints deceased in the mean time , and many long since dissolved as to their outward Man , what becomes of their Souls between the Time of their Departure , and the End of the World ? for he hath confessed that No Unclean Thing shall enter the Kingdom of God : So then , if the Saints deceased be not throughly cleansed from Sin before , nor Sin to be done away till the E●…d of the World , what other Place besides Heaven , ca●… he provide or think of for the Saints deceased ? How can he avoid the Pope's imagined Purgatory , unless he hold the Mortality of the Soul , that it dyes or sleeps in the Dust with the Body ? To his alledging , That the Ministry is to continue to the last Trump ; and to the last Trump will Sin be in the Saints ; but then in a Moment will the Saints be changed and perfected . If he intends that the Saints have their Benefit and part in the Ministry , each in their Life time and several Ages , how doth this clear his concluding , that to the End of the World or last Trump , Sin will be in the Saints ; that then in a Moment they shall be changed ? for many of the Saints are deceased many Hundreds of Years since , which if Sin be in them still , they do not particularly partake of the blessed End of Christ's Ministry and Gifts , which were for the Perfecting of the Saints , till all come into the Unity of the Faith , and of the Knowledge of the Son of God , unto a Perfect Man , &c. and yet those deceased Saints are not now under the Ministry of Apostles , &c. From Ephes. 4. 13. he saith , That perfect Man is Christ with all his Members ; for he consists of many : and he is thus to be a perfect Man in the other World , not this , pag. 46. Whereas the Benefit of God's Gifts did as well extend to the particular Saints and Members of his Body , as to the whole Body , to wit , till we all come in the Unity of the Faith , &c. That we henceforth be no more Children tossed to and fro , &c. Ephes. 4. 14. There is no Danger of their being tossed in the other World with Windy Doctrines ; Both their Perfection , and Establishment , and Growing up in Christ in all things , being Effects of his Gifts and Ministry , which were experienced and obtained in this Life . S. S. The Ministry and Scriptures were perfecting the Saints as long as they live , Deut. 17. 19. The King shall read therein all the Dayes of his Life , that he may Learn to fear therein the Lord his God : If he is to Learn to fear God all the Dayes of his Life , &c. pag. 65. Answ. Are the Saints then but a Learning to fear the Lord God all the Dayes of their Life ? or , Doth that King in the time of the Old Covenant represent the best State of the Saints in the New , the King that was forbidden to multiply Wives , Horses , Silver or Gold to himself ? Are the best of Saints in the New Covenant in Danger of these things , and therefore to be restrained by an outward Law , that their Hearts turn not away from the Lord ? whereas he hath promised , I will put my Fear in their Hearts , and they shall not depart from me : and this is a Condition of his Everlasting Covenant . That there is a time of Perfecting Believers or Saints before they are Perfected , I confess ; as , while God was Creating the World , it was not Created ; but I differ with him in his counting it God's good Pleasure , that Sin should remain in the Saints , and that to keep them Humble , either till Death , till after Death , or to the End of the World : and it were more absurd to say , That Sin will remain even in the Saints deceased till the End of the World , to keep them Humble . It is true as he saith , That whilst a Carpenter is building an House , the House is not builded , pag. 65. but then , if the Carpenter undertakes to build a House , and bargains for a Price to build it , and then doth not build it , or tells a Man whose Money he hath got , It is true I took your Money to perfect this Building , but I can get but little of it builded , you must not expect to have it builded while you live ; Would not the Man reply then , Give me my Money again ? But Carpenters do not use to cheat men thus ; They that are Honest do not use to serve People as you pretended Ministers do , who say , You are sent for Perfecting the Saints , and for this take Money , and Gifts , and Rewards , and yet tell them , Perfection is NOT attainable in this Life : Honest Carpenters would not deal thus with them . In Psalm 119. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4. Blessed are the Undefiled in the Way , he saith , In Point of Justification , Believers are in Christ their Head , clear as the Moon , fair as the Sun ; In Point of Sanctification , through the Renewing and Assisting Grace they do not allow themselves in any known Sin , but in God's Fear oppose all , pag. 65. He hath said enough to break the Neck of his own Cause , 1st , Unless to be In Christ Spotless , Clear as the Moon , and Fair as the Sun , be a Spotted or Sinful State. 2dly , Unless that there must remain some Sins in those that are in Christ , which cannot be known to them ; whereas he that abideth in Christ sinneth not : And He hath left us an Example , that we should follow his Steps , who did not sin . And the Word Justifie sometimes useth to signifie to make Just by inherent Holyness ; or to Sanctifie , as he confesseth pag. 89. Upon Titus 3. 5. 7. But if to evade this , he renders Justification in their sense of Im●…utation ; then it is , to reckon them Spotless , Clear as the Moon , Fair as the Sun , who are yet Spotted , Corrupted and Defiled with Sin : But if in the Fear of the Lord true Believers , through Renewing and Assisting Grace , do not allow themselves in any known Sin , but in God's Fear oppose all , then if a Discovery of all Sin by the Light be attainable to them , not only to Oppose , but to Overcome all Sin through assisting Grace , is attainable in this Life ; for , Resist the Devil , and he will flye : And we can do all things through Christ that strengthneth us ; knowing our Faith in him , which is the Victory , and also obtaineth actual Dominion over Sin. Whereas Psal. 119. 3. They also do no Iniquity , was further urged against him ; And he that abideth in Christ sinneth not , doth not commit Sin , in whose Spirit is no Guile : To this he answer , So far as Regenerate , and acting from the Regenerate part , they do no Iniquity . This is such Tautologie , or as good sense as to say , they do no Iniquity so far as they do no Iniquity ; whereas the Words are positive and plain , They are undefiled in the way ; they keep his Testimonies ; they walk in his wayes . Whereas he still insers , the Saints are not perfectly free from Sin ; for when Paul did NO Iniquity Sin dwelt in him ; and yet in that State Paul said , The Evil that I do I would not : Did he do Evil , and yet no Iniquity ? or was Victory over , and Freedom from that Evil not attainable by him in this Life ? What Evil did he live and dye in ? or what Sin must remain in him , now being deceased , till the End of the World ? S. S. Nor will G. W. say , I suppose no Man is Regenerate , but who is perfectly free from Sin ; To this I say , according to his own words before : As while the Saints are Persecting , they are not perfected ; so there is a Regenerating and a Travailing in Birth before Regenerated and born again . Of Rom. 8. 1. he saith , This intimates there is Flesh in such though Guilt is Removed . Herein is a two-fold Error couched : 1st , Implying the Guilt removed , while the Sin it self remains ; as if a Man could commit Sin and not be Guilty of it . 2dly , He confounds Sin and Flesh , and renders them Inseparable ; whereas he grants in the Scripture before , there is no Condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus , who walk not a●…ter the Flesh , but after the Spirit . He perverts , Job 9. 19. and 1 J●…h . 3. saying , If I sin , as do the wicked , with Allowance , here he adds [ WITH ALLOWANCE ] for it is plain , if I Sin then thou markest me ; whosoever is born of God doth not commit Sin : It is not , Doth not commit Sin with Allowance as do the Wicked : And the Saints on Earth enjoying Communion with God , and Saints in Heaven ( as he saith ) is not a Communion in Sin ; neither is the Being of Sin according to the Will of God in Heaven , which is prayed for so to be done in Earth . If he grant it our Duty to be Perfect , or perfectly to obey , while he denyes Power or Possession for that End , his Work is Weakness it self , and inconsistent with it self ; God is no such Hard Master , as to enjoyn . Impossibilities upon us , or to require Obedience beyond the Power he gives . Will he say , None are Sanctified that have any Sin in them ? I say , according to his Concession before ; There is a Time of Sanctifying as well as Perfecting before the Work be effected , which ought to be throughout in Body , Soul and Spirit . If he cleanseth away all Guilt from Believers , and the reigning Power of Sin in this Life , Why should the Being of Sin remain till the next ? He hath wa●…hed us from our Sins in his own Blood , before which there is a time of having Sin , 1 Joh. 1. 8. yet said he , My little Children , These Things write I unto you that ye sin not , chap. 2. 1. Can the Work of Faith and Grace be sinful ? He answers , Faith it self can be imperfect ; therefore the Work of Faith : Lord , I believe , help my Unbelief ; Imperfection is Sin , Perfection is Duty , p. 67. Rep. By the same Reason Unbelief is Sin ; but Faith is Duty : They ought not thus to be confounded ; nor Unbelief , which is the Creatures Defect , imputed to Faith , which is the Gift of God , a Fruit of his Spirit ; therefore pure , as he confesseth to his own plain Confutation , The Work or Thing wrought is alwayes perfect for its Part , Nature or Kind , the least Draghm of Grace true , p. 68. From whence it follows , that true Faith is pure in its kind , and not sinful , nor having Sin mixt with it , though it doth grow and encrease . Degrees of that which is of a pure or perfect Nature , do not alter its Property ; And the saving Work of the Spirit is carried on by degrees . His citing 1 Thes. 3. 10. praying that we might see your Face , and perfect that which is lacking in your Faith , p. 68. This proves not true Faith to have Sin in it ; but that in some there might be something lacking in it , as to Growth and Increase of Effects ; and which some read thus , FULFILL that which is lacking . It is not that we might add more Purity to your Faith , but more Joy , Comfort , Refreshment , Edification , &c. unto you in the Faith for Imperfection ( where it imports only the Want of full Growth or Maturity of that which in its kind is pure ) is not Sin ; and Imperfection and Sin have not the same Signification ; for Imperfection , as it relates to a Thing or Work not fulfilled or finished , it implies a Work begun ; and they who have known the Work of God begun in them , and Faith in his Power , they dare not plead for Sin , nor cast it upon God , as his good Pleasure , that the Being of Sin should not be removed in this Life , but know that the good Pleasure and Will of God is their Sanctification ; and therefore wait upon him for the perfecting of it . His accusing David with having Failings in the End of his Dayes , and asserting the Perfection of his War-like Attempts , not of his Graces , p. 68. This Accusation against David , he hath neither proved by Scripture , nor shewed what Failings he had in the End of his Dayes ; nor yet that his Graces were imperfect ; for God was the Lise and Grace of all his Graces ; and he said , God is my Strength and Power , and he maketh my Way perfect , 2 Sam. 22. 23. And were not his inward War-like Attempts against his Soul's Enemy , both perfect and succesful , as well as his outward ? Did he not confess to the Lord , Thou hast also given me the Shield of Salvation ; and said , He is the Tower of Salvation ; and in his last Words , He hath made with me an Everlasting Covenant , ordered in all things and sure ; for this is all my Salvation , 〈◊〉 Sam. 23. The Means for a Man to have his Way made per●…ect , is to know the Lord to be his Strength and Power , a strong Tower , and Salvation : Thus he is known to them that truly wait upon him . If in this Life our Work be not to let Sin reign , not to obey it in the Lusts thereof , p. 68. why should we either commit Sin , or the Being of it remain in us , when we have received Power , so far to subdue it and bring it under ? And if the Lusts of it be not obeyed , but watched against , they will be subdued so far , as Sin may neither be brought forth , nor have a Being . If the Operation or working of the Spirit ●…e alwayes perfect , he working by infinite Wisdom and Power , p. 68. though the saving Work thereof be not presently fulfilled in all those Degrees of Perfection , it is to attain unto ; nor the Being of Sin forthwith excluded , p. 68. yet by Degrees it comes fully to be effected and Sin put an End to , as there is a waiting in Patience and Diligence upon him , who hath begun a good Work , who will also perfect it . That the Righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in us ; on this he thus paraphraseth , Fulfill signifies sincerely to obey the Law , 1 Chron. 22. 13. that is , sincerely to obey every Precept , so far as we attain to understand it : Thus far he contradicts his pleading for the Being of Sin and Corruptions in the Saints , and his denying perfect Obedience to be attainable in this Life ; yet I assert , that Man in his own Will & Strength cannot attain sincerely to obey the Law of God ; but through the Power and Aid of Christ Jesus , he may attain to the Righteousness or Substance of the Law , to be fulfilled in him , being led by the Spirit of Life ; for the Law thereof in Christ makes free from the Law of Sin and Death : But when this Opposer adds , Thus in the other World God's People shall attain to fulfil the Righteousness of the Law , p. 69. Herein he perverts Scripture , and puts Christ's Work afar off , who is the End of the Law for Righteousness ( not to indulge Men in Sin ) to them that believe ; and he came to condemn Sin in the Flesh , that the Righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in us , who walk not after the Flesh , but after the Spirit ; which State the Apostle did not put off to the other World. And if the Gospel , or Law of the Spirit of Life , free us from the Law of Sin and Death ; and Christ was sent to condemn Sin in the 〈◊〉 ( which Words he turns thus , viz. Condemned our Sin in him ) I say , First , Why should we be subject to the Law of Sin a●…d Death , or 〈◊〉 believe a Freedom from the Being of Sin , when its Power , Law , and Rule is taken away ? These are inconsistent : Must Men needs subject themselves to that , which is brought under by the Power of Christ , and Law of Life in him ? His saying , He condemned our Sin in him , will not excuse him from being condemned with Sin , if he doth not come to find Sin condemned and destroyed in himself ; and Man's Disobedience to the Law of God within will not be excused by what Christ hath done and suffered without ; neither will your Application cause you to be lookt on , as if from the Beginning of Life to the End to have obeyed the Law as Creatures , to have satisfied it as Sinners , p. 69. Surely God doth not so look upon you while you continue in Sin , and his Spirit striving with you , and reproving of you for Sin and Corruption : God and his Spirit do not so oppose on another ; and yet he is Gratious and Merciful , ready to pardon and forgive Sins past upon true Repentance , and that for Christ's sake , who is the Propitiation , &c. but the Notion of Satisfaction , as it is taken in the severe Sense of strict Payment in Law ( by undergoing the full Punishment ) It is not consistent with the Gratiousness of God , in forgiving Sins past on unfeigned Repentance ; but sufficient is said to that Point . He is offended that we should say to him and his Brethren , You plead for Sin ; he calls this an opprobrious and gross Slander ; but hath not cleared himself thereof , but verified it , as appears in this Discourse of his : And his saying , Who do more call Men off from sinning then we ( If he had added ) Who tell People , that to come off or be free from Sin , is not attainable in this Life ; and that it is God's good Pleasure , not to destroy the Being of Sin in this Life ; and that he sees good , Corruptions should remain in his Saints , to keep them humble , Then the World might easily have judged how heartily they call Men off from Sin , or rather , how they impiously plead for Sin as necessary . He sayes , Their Light without the Scriptures will help to call men off from Lying , Injustice , Uncleanness , &c. They should then obey it ; for then it necessarily calls unto Truth , Justice , Purity , &c. and consequently to Heaven : Depart from ●…vil and do Good , and dwell for evermore . We urge Men to the Observance of the Christian Sabbath , p. 69. And what is that Christian Sabbath ? And how do you urge men to Observe it ? Was not the Jews Sabbath a Type of the Christians Sabbath , or Rest ? And do they not cease from their own Works , and Thoughts ; being not to think their own Thoughts , on this Sabbath , or holy Day . We press to repent of the very Being of an evil Thought in us . But do you press it in the Faith ? Do you believe that the Being of evil Thoughts can be remov'd in this Life ; else what signifies your pressing to repent thereof ? Your Denouncing against men's Allowing themselves in Sin & Wickedness , Your saying , It is the Duty of all to be Perfect , to Press after it , to watch against all , even the least Sins , p. 70. What avails all this , when you press and preach thus in your Unbelief ? You unsay what you here pretend , when you tell people , It is God's Good Pleasure that the Being of Sin and Corruption should remain in his Saints to keep them humble : What Incouragement do you here give People to press after Perfection , and to watch against all Sin , when you tell them , A Sinless Perfection is not attainable ? But he brings an Instance for their Encouragement , as he thinks , viz. If two Companies of Children were to run a Race , and one should say to this Company , There are strong Men at the End of the Race ; if you run as strong and as fast as they can run , you are to enjoy a rich Inheritance ; but if not , you are to dy . By the way observe , he very egregiously doth mistate the Case and Doctrine of those called Quakers ; for they do not propose Heaven and Salvation upon these Terms , as for Children to run as fast as Men ; but that Children may become Men , and in the mean time act according to their Abilities , beyond which God doth not impose upon them , nor require of them ; but that the Race that is set before us may be run with Patience , which ought to have her perfect Work , that we may be perfect and intire , wanting nothing . It is certain , that they who have begun in the Spirit , and spiritual Journey , who are diligent , using their best Endeavours , and hold out , shall enjoy an Everlasting Inheritance : And this is not to cut off their Endeavours by Despair , as falsly is supposed against the Quakers , upon the said Mistating of their Case ; but your Preaching tends to Despair , when you press People after Purity and Perfection , and then tell them , It is Not attainable in this Life . He further adds against us : There must be no Sin at all in you , and then you shall obtain Salvation 〈◊〉 I must be quite free from all Sin here , or burn in Hell to all Eternity , pag. 70 , 〈◊〉 . Let it be understood , that we do not fall thus abruptly upon People , to surprise them with such Threatning them with Hell , as if we would fright them into Perfection , or drive them into Despair : He hath not herein proposed our Method in order to Freedom from Sin and Salvation ; for , first We preach the Grace , the Light , and Power of God , to be believed and patiently waited in ; and that Patience may have her perfect Work in order to Perfection and Freedom , which is not all wrought on a suddain , or presently upon Conviction ; for it will require both Faith , Patience , Diligence and Travail , to obtain it ; and we know that to obtain Salvation is to obtain Deliverance from Sin , and this is by Jesus Christ who saveth his People from their Sins . It is not our Method , first to say , There must be No Sin at all in you , and then you shall attain Salvation : Nor barely to say to People at first , You must be quite free from All Sin here , or burn in Hell hereafter ; for this ( though it hath a Truth in it ) is not a proposing the Ground and Foundation whereby to obtain Freedom , but an abrupt Threatning , tending to make Men look more at the Difficulty of the Condition , then at the Power of Christ to aid them for that End : And thus have the Papists misrepresented our Method in their Indefatigable Seeker , as if we presently imposed such a Difficulty , as the setting Men strictly to keep the Law , obey punctually in every Title , or else be damned : But this is to make way for their Purgatory ; and may be taken as if we set People on work in their own Wills and Power , to a most strict severe Life without the Power of God , whenas without that we can do nothing acceptably , and yet all things by that Power , or through him that strengthneth us . But whereas this man takes it for granted , that to be quite Free from all Sin here , or to keep the Commands of God , is Not attainable ; Let it be minded , that since he hath confessed , No Unclean Thing shall enter into Heaven ; And Christ proposed the Keeping the Commandments ( as namely , Thou shalt love the Lord thy God , with all thy Heart , &c. and thy Neighbour as thy self ) as the Way to inherit Eternal Life ; this Man doth render it impossible , either to enter in to Heaven , or inherit eternal Life , while he will not believe , that to keep the Commands of God ; is attainable ( though God assist his own thereto ) for to keep the Commands was , in order to inherit Eternal Life : So to say with Christ , if thou wilt enter into Heaven , keep the Commandements●… , and a Presbyter answers , No ; It is not possible to keep the Commands ; The Consequence is then , It is not possible to enter into Heaven : Or , it may be as well proposed , If thou wilt enter into Heaven , make thy self Wings and fly thither , or go and stop the Sun in its Cou se , or take the World on thy Back ; but God's and Christ's Commands imply no such Impossibility , but that they may be performed . We should not speak an idle Word ; we should not have one vain Thought in us , not one wandring Thought in Prayer , Eccl. 5. 3. We should not have one inordinate Desire , nor evil Imagination against our Neighbour , p. 71. He asked , If a State of Freedom from all these Sins were attainable in t●…is Life ? and that I had the Face to tell him it is ; but the Consciences of all enlightened Persons , Observers of their own Hearts , will bring in Testimony against me : Thi●… still shews his Presumption and Unbelief , while he grants it our Duty to for sake all these Evils , as , idle Words , vain Thoughts , wandering Thoughts in Prayer , inordinate Desires , evil Imaginations , &c. Where then is the Christian Sabbath in which Man is not to speak his own Words , nor think his own Thoughts ? And are not the Weapo●…s of the spiritual Warfare mighty thorrow God , to the pulling down of strong Holds , and the bringing every Thought into Subjection , into the Obedience of Christ ? And the Thoughts of the Just are right Thoughts : If the pulling down of Satan's Strong Holds , be attainable by the spiritual Weapons , much more the subjecting of wandring Thoughts , being watch'd against in the Light that discovers them : But , while he doth not believe that a Freedom from wandering Thoughts in Prayer is attainable , and yet confesseth that the holy Ghost calls a wandering Prayer a Dream , we are to understand that when you Presbyters bring forth your wandering Prayers with your wandering Thoughts in them , you are but dreaming ; and so meer Dreamers : you do not pray with the Spirit ; for that does not bring forth any such Wandering Prayers and Dreams . And be it further minded that his granting enlightned , Observers of their own Hearts do see wandering Thoughts and Imaginations , herein he hath given Concession to the inshining Light* as the Rule to discover wandering Thoughts , which is more then the Scriptures do , Therefore he and every one should attend and watch in the Light against Imaginations and wandring Thoughts , and not to suffer them in Prayer . From Job 9. 21. he concludes , That Job abhorreth to entertain such a Thought as being Perfect , pag. 72. Herein he hath wronged Job , for he counted it not consistent with Self-Abasement and Humility for him to say , I am Perfect , especially upon a Self-Justification , as his words before plainly intimate , If I Justifie my self , mine own Mouth shall condemn me , &c. Job 9. 20. Though I were Perfect , yet would I not know my Soul , vers . 21. Which proveth not , that Job abhorreth to entertain such a Thought as that of Perfection ; but rather , that it was not so proper for him to speak it in his own Justification ; for surely he did entertain such a Thought as that of Perfection , when he said , When he hath tryed me I shall come forth as Gold , Job 23. 10 , 11. The man 's gross Confusions about Job's Perfection , is hinted in our Paper , entituled , the Presbyters Antidote choaking himself . That saying , If our Hearts condemn us , God is Greater , doth not prove these holy Men knew God saw something in them which ought not to be , for which their Hearts condemn'd them so long as they lived ; for it is as well said , If our Hearts Condemn us not , then have we Confidence towards God. S. S. Thoughts prevailed against , and cast out , return again ; and their being in us , is Sin , Act. 8. 20. Thou thoughtst that the Gift of God might be purchased with Money , p. 72. Answ. A very pertinent Proof for the covetous Presbyters , the quondam Hireling Parish Priests ; but no meet Instance to prove , the Being of Evil Thoughts remain in all the holy Men of God ; nor an equal Comparison , to mention the corrupt and erroneous Thought of Simon the Sorcerer , as a Proof , that Thoughts preva●…led against and cast out , must return , and have their being in the Lord's People all their Dayes ; but while he grants that evil Thoughts are prevailed against and cast out , why doth he conclude they may not be kept out ? or that the keeping them out is not attainable in this Life , unless he will charge a Want of Diligence upon all the Faithful , or accuse them with neglecting their Watch ? for I affirm , that to keep out evil Thoughts is attainable through Diligence and Watchfulness in the same Light and Power that discovers them , prevails against th●…m , and cast's them out . To prove that such a State , as to be wholy free from all evil Principles , is not attainable in this Life , 〈◊〉 cites John 15. 2. Every Branch in me that beareth Fruit , he 〈◊〉 it : from whence he argues , If the Father purgeth him , he hath evil Principles to be purged out , p. 73. Rep. What I said to this doth not yet appear to be answerable by him , which was , because it is the Father's purging out Sin or evil Principles ; they must needs be perfectly purged out by Degrees , though it is true , a Man is not perfectly purged while he is a purging : I did not conclude , as he saith , that Freedom from all Sin is instantly , but in God's due time , who is the Purger , and who perfects his own Work : In the same Scripture before cited , Christ saith , Now are you clean through the Word which I have spoken unto you ; abide in me , and I in you , Joh. 15. 3. 4. Without me ( or severed from me ) ye can do nothing , ver . 6. If ye abide in me , and my Words abide in you , ye shall ask what you will , and it shall be done unto you , ver . 7. & 16. From hence observe , here is enough to confute S. S. his concluding , that Evil Principles cannot be wholy purged out in this Life ; for in Christ there is both Power and Sufficiency ; and if his Followers ask in his Name to be throughly purged , it shall be done ; or if they sincerely pray , that the Will of God may be done in Earth , as it is in Heaven , It shall be answered . Now I would ask S. S. if it be not a Duty of true Believers , when they see any thing that is to be removed or purged out , to pray to the Father in Christ's Name to remove it , and throughly to be purged , and their Hearts made clean in this Life ? And shall they not then be answered herein ? Did not Christ say , What soever you ask in my Name , believe that you shall have it , and you shall receive it , or it shall be given you ? And he that abid●…th in Christ sinneth not ; and is not the Branch of the Nature of the Vine ? He answers , We are Partakers of the divine Nature ; and how do we partake thereof , but by escaping the Corruptions of the World ? But as without Christ we can do nothing ; so it is not our Phrase to say , I have made my Heart clean ; for it is he that worketh all our Works in us . His concluding , that no Man hath perfect Knowledge ( viz. either of the Will of God , or of his own Errors ) and that this Ignorance remaineth during Life , from Psal. 19. 12. 1 Cor. 13. 9 , 11. and therefore that there cannot be perfect Practice , p. 74. We have Reason to conclude , he is very imperfect and mistaken herein ; for , 1st , The Will of God with respect to our Duty to him is to be known : It is revealed by his Spirit , that it may be obeyed ; and he that will do the Will shall know the Doctrine . 2dly , Both secret Errors and Faults are discernable , and to be known by the Light , which makes manifest whatsoever Things are reproved ; and therefore secret Faults are not alwayes to remain in this Life , if David and others , when sensible thereof , prayed not in vain , when they prayed to be cleansed from secret Faults ; & that secret Sins & Errors are to be discovered & known , is evident , & that the Lord at his Appearance or Coming , will bring to Light the hidden things of Darkness , and will make manisest the Counsels of the Hearts ; and it is he that reproves the Wicked , & sets man's Sins in order before him ; he that telleth unto Man what his Thought is , the Lord God of Hosts is his Name : Therefore , as he doth perfectly shew Man his Sin , and by Degrees mani●…est his Duty , and afford Light and Power sufficient to forsake Sin , and obey fully ; both are attainable in this ●…ife , though gradually . Still his concludi●…g , that the perfect Man , if on Earth , he sinneth , ●…rom 1 Kings 8. 46. There is no man that sinneth not ; and Ecclesiast . 7. 20. There is not a just Man upon the Earth that doth Good and sinneth not ; I ask him then , If there be no higher Attainment in this Life , then for the best of Men to sin in doing Good , as some of his Brethren interpret those last Words ? But if he will please to read D. Gill's Essay to the Amendment of the last Translation of the Bible , he will find , that he doth not render the Words in the Indicative Mood [ That sinneth not ] but in the Potential [ That may not sin ] as there is no man that may not sin , or but that he may sin ; there is no man just in the Earth that doth Good , and may not sin ; which much differs from positively concluding , that every just man sinneth in doing Good : And he further intimates it to be but in a legal State of Justness , wherein a legal just Man may sin , and not in an Evangelical or Gospel-State in Christ. Neither do the Words as ren●…ered in 1 King. 8. 46. There is no Man that sineth not , agree with the Words before , If they sin against thee ; but rather , there is no Man , but that he may sin , and then it is possible for them not to sin ; and for a good Man that is one in Christ , beyond the State of the Law , to act , and speak , and walk in Christ the true Light , and not to sin in doing Good ; but as of Sincerity , but as of God , in the Sight of God , so speak we in Christ : Such are not sinning in their Preaching and Praying nor do they bring forth wandering Prayers or Dreams , as you do , who are pleading and di●…puting ●…or Sin Term of Life , because it is said , the Imagination of Man's Heart is Evil from his Youth , S. S. saith , This is not spoken of the Old , Wicked 〈◊〉 , b●…t of Noah and his Family , p. 74. If he intend this according to the Tenour of his Discourse , as the State of Noah and his Family , and that all their Life time , I must tell him , that it is contrary to the Testimony given of Noah , viz. That he was a Just Man , and Perfect in his Generations ; and Noah walked with God , which was not with an Evil Heart or evil Imaginations ; for that is not a State of walking with God. His saying , that this is not spoken of the old World , but of Noah , is a Mistake : for God saw that the Wickedness o●… Man was great in the Earth , and that every Imagination of the Thoughts of his Heart was only Evil continually : This is as well mentioned in Gen●…sis 6. 5. as Chap. 8. 21. and relates to Man as in the unrerenerate State , estranged from God , and not to him as walking with God : I must needs conclude this Man a Pleader for Sin ( with many others of his Brethren ) A Pleader for Sin , whilst he thus confounds States and Attainments ; and his Doctrine to be Antichristian and Impious , while he accounts it God's good Pleasure , that the Being of Sin and Corruptions in part must remain in the Saints , to keep them humble ; and that Job abhorreth to entertain such a Thought as that of Perfection , and that to be wholy Free and purged from Evil Principles , is not attainable in this Life ; let the impartial Reader judge , whether there be not in these Doctrines a Pleading for Sin : And while he and his Brethren contend against the Quakers for Evil Principles , they contend to no purpose , while they r●…ckon that neither themselves , nor any else can be purged from Evil Principles in this 〈◊〉 ; but they should not thus dispute and contend for Sin and Imperfection for term of Li●…e , ●…eeing they say , It is the Duty of all to be Perfect , and to press after it ; to watch against all , even the least Sins , pag. 70. and tell men , It is needful to forsake Lying , Injustice , U●…cleaness , &c. which the Light calls them off from , pag. 69. I say , their pleading for Sin Term of Life , is inconsistent with this , and God will require it at their Hands , for their strengthning the Hands of Evil Doers , that they may not forsake their Sins by these Sin-pleasing Doctrines . They cannot be altogether ignorant how apt Transgressors are to lay hold on every Doctrine that is of such a Tendence as suites their Evil Minds , as much of Stephen Scandret his Work doth . Therefore , as it is high time for the Wicked to repent of their Wickedness , so it is time for you pretended Ministers , who are contending for Sin and Imperfection , to repent thereof , and of your Sinful Doctrines , for the Being of Sin and Imperfection Term of Life , whereby you have strengthned many Thousands in Iniquity , made their Bands more strong , and exposed them to Ruin and Destruction . THE ANSWER TO Tho. Hicks , AND HIS BRETHREN , About the RESURRECTION . HIS Absurdity , Confusion and Carnal Conceits about it Discovered . The Resurrection Owned by us , and Scripturally Asserted ; with the Future and Distinct Existences of Men and Angels . And the Eternal Advantage of the Righteous after Dissolution . Joh. 11. 25. Jesus said , I am the Resurrection and the Life , &c. 1 Cor. 15. 38. God giveth a Body at his Pleasure . Ver. 44. There is a Natural Body , and there is a Spiritual Body . 2 Tim. 2. 23. But put away Foolish and Unlearned Questions . Serious Reader , OUr Opposer appearing altogether utterly void of any spiritual Sence or divine Under●…tanding in this great and sublime Mystery of the Resurrection , his Work is the less to be regarded ; and we having very little of so much as seeming Argument●…tion from him , I need say the less to his Work ; only take notice of a few of his Absurd●…ties and Abuses . What further , as is opened in the Discourse following , is chiefly for the sake of others more honest and free from Prejudice , and in order to incline them from gross Conceptions , into a spiritual Apprehension of this Mystery , and th●…t they may be mindful of their present Concernment , of Acceptance with God in his own Life and Righteousness ; and not be diver●…ed from obtaining the End and future Felicity of the Righteous , by Uncertain , Vain and Gross Thoughts and Notions of carnal Minds , which are but depending upon their own Imaginations of a future State , and not upon a divine Principle or spiritual Understanding thereof . God is my Record , that it is a sp●…ritual Eye and divine U●…nderstanding , that I desire may be opened in these weighty Matters treated on ; for which End in the S●…ght o●… God , I am open and free in my Spirit in what I write on this Occasion ; which I desire to i●…prove only for the Glory of God and Good of Souls . THE ANSWER To Tho. Hicks about the RESURRECTION , &c. First , T. H. accuses us from what one Tarner should say ; but answers not what he said , or his Argument . 2dly , He accuseth us in general words , with manifest Denial of the Resurrection of the Body . For which his Instance is our saying , That Flesh and Blood shall not inherit the Kingdom of God. Observe hence , That 't is no marvel that he reviles and slanders us , and thinks we have some reserved Meaning , like the Jesuitical Equivocation ; * p. 56. when he hath accused us for making use of the Apostles plain words , which he hath not answered : Would it be well taken if he should positively say , That the Apostle denyed the Resurrection , when he saith , Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God , 1 Cor. 15. 50. It s one thing to deny Men's carnal gross Thoughts about the Seed , Resurrection and Body : And it is another thing wholely to deny the Resurrection of the Body in those general Expressions . 3dly , He pretends to desire Information what the Body is we believe shall arise again ; when before he hath positively accused us with manifest Denyal of the Resurrection of the Body , that is , of any Body , if he meant as his words import . And here again he is obtruding upon us that Fool 's Question , which the Apostle reproved , when in answer thereto he said , Thou Fool , that which thou sowest is not quickened except it dye : And thou sowest not that Body which shall be ; but God gives it a Body as it pleaseth him , 1 Cor. 15. 35 , 36 , 37 , 38. For which again he queries , Whether we do not tacitely deny the Resurrection of the Body ? For all this man's Pretence of Scripture being his Rule , he is not content with the Scripture-Language , nor yet willing to resign up himself to the Pleasure of God , in giving to every Seed it s own Body , as it pleaseth him . But such busie Intruders will be inquisitive concerning the manner of God's executing his Pleasure in this thing : Whereas men's present Concern should be rather to wait to know , and submit to the good Pleasure of God in this Life ; and to find a part in Christ Jesus , who is the Resurrection and the Life , that they might be assured of the good Effect and Fruits of God's good Pleasure hereafter . For it is a Design of Satan to busie and puzzle men's Thoughts about their Existences in Heaven , while he keeps them in Sin and Darkness , in the Way to Hell : Whereas if they would faithfully serve God in the Way of his Grace here on Earth , they would freely trust him with the Manner how he will Glorifie them hereafter . And my saying , We ought not to be Curious in these Matters , to inquire into God's secret Pleasure in things beyond our Capacity ; neither do I desire to make my self wiser then I am ; nor to appear wise above ( or besides ) what is written ( viz. in this Case . ) Doth this argue that the Divine Light within is not the Rule above the Scriptures ? as is implyed in his 57th page ; when I confess it to be that , that gives the true Understanding of them ; and to be wise according to what is written , And not to pretend the Scriptures for Proof of what they prove not . As for Instance ; When I am called to answer an Unscriptural Question , by such as profess Scripture to be their Rule ; I think it most meet to answer them in the Scripture-Language , which while they are not satisfied with , they inquire but to Cavil , and for Advantage , as my Opposer and some others of his Abettors did . As for a more particular Instance , when they query about the Resurrection of the Body ; as desiring I would inform them , what Body that is , that shall arise again ? which being the same with that which the Apostle reproves for , 1 Cor. 15. 35. it deserves the same Reproof for Answer , vers . 36 , 37. Again , Though I really confess the Universal Resurrection of the Body of Mankind , or of the whole Adam ; which implieth , First , A general Fall and Death ; and that they shall come forth , some to the Resurrection of Life , and others to the Resurrection of Damnation ; yet for the very Phrase , namely , The Resurrection of the Body of Flesh , &c. I find not in Scripture ; But the Resurrection of the D●…ad , the raising and arising of the Dead , &c. 2dly , Upon my Answer in the Apostle's very words , 1 Cor. 15. 35. the feigned Christian saith , This Answer Whitehead said , is sufficient for such busie intruding Fools , p. 57. By which he hath contradicted what he saith , before Whitehead answered in p. 54. But then he adds , The Apostle calls Fools , not they that believed ; but they that deny the Resurrection of the Body , Persons of the same Perswasion with the Quakers in this Point , p. 57. That the Corinthians did positively deny the Resurrection , he hath not proved ; But that some questioned like him , How , and with what Body are the ●…ead raised ? &c. whose Folly the Apostle reproved : And this is not Quakers Perswasion thus to question , much less to deny the Resurrection in the true Sense and real Mystery of it ; For so to question , With what Body are the Dead raised ? is not a Question necessary to Salvation , nor essential to the being of a Christian , who knows a part in Christ , who is the Resurrection and the Life . Now come we to examine T. H's Meaning upon the Text , 1 Cor. 15. 37 , 38. wherein he proceeds thus , Concerning this Mortal , viz. That the Body given it , is the same for Substance , the same that was sown , &c. only called a Body given to it , because it is so changed from its Accidents of Corruption and Mortality . Thus far T. H. What reasonable man can make Sense of this piece of Oratory , as to say that the Body given to it , is the same for Substance : Like as if he had said , This same mortal Body is the same It which is given it , or it is the same It that is sown , that is given it self ; or the same Body for Substance is given to the mortal Body . What rare Rhetorick is this ? And so his Brother Kiffin saith , That the Seed that 's sown , is the same Body of Flesh , &c. which shall arise , though otherwise qualified : If so , what is that Body that God giveth to it , as it pleaseth him ? For if it be lookt upon in the Nature of a Seed , it must be supposed that it is another Body , that 's given unto it , as is to every Seed sown , according to its kind : For it is plain Non-sence to say , That that which is sown , is the same Body that is given to it . Besides , that which is not quickened except it dyes ( which may be spoken of every kind of Seed , that hath Life in it first ) doth not dye be●…ore it is sown , but after 't is sown ; as Christ saith , Except a Grain of Wheat fall into the Ground and dye , it abideth alone ; but if it dye , it bringeth forth much Fruit : Now the Fruit or Ear brought forth , is the proper Body given to it , which is not the very same which wa●… sown in the Earth . But I pray , how holds this dying aftersown , with these men's fleshly Opinion of the carnal Body in the Grave being the Seed ? for that being Dead before , doth not dye after 't is buried ; neither do these men intend to be buried alive . And seeing every Seed hath its own proper Body , what Body can be proper to the Terrestrial Bodies ? which if every one of them must be lookt upon as the Seed , to have each a proper Body given , what a plurality of Bodies must there be besides what are ? And will it not amount to this , That every man shall not only have these very Terrestrial Bodies , but each a Body besides ; and so every man two Bodies , and those of the same Substance that these are now , to wit , Terrestrial or Carnal ? He cites Phil. 3. 21. thus , He shall change our vile Bodies . Herein he mis-cites and perverts the Phrase ; For 't is not Bodies in the plural , but Body in the singular : And 't is to be read thus from the Greek , He shall change the Body of our Lowness , that it may be fashioned or trans-figured like unto his Glorious Body . But doth not this evidently make against him ; considering that Christ's Glorious Body is not a Carnal , Terrestrial or Earthly Body , but a Spiritual , Transcendent , Glorious Body ? And the changing of our Low Body , in fashion to be like his , implieth not the same Terrestial or Carnal Bodies , or to be of this Fashion and Substance , as now they are ; For Celestial , Spiritual and Glorious Bodies are much different from Terrestrial , Carnal and Mean Corruptible Bodies . Again , T. H. addeth from Phil 3. 21. This cannot be meant of a new created Body ; because such a Body cannot be said to be either vile or changed . If then this IT be not the Body which dyed , but another , how can that be called a Resurrection ; for that supposeth the same ? If another , then it is more properly a Creation of a new Body , then the Resurrection of the Body , p. 58. Repl. Mark here . 1. He is for a Resurrection of the very same T●…rrestrial Bodies of all men , but no new Creation ; for that opposeth his Thoughts of the Resurrection . 2. What a strange Inconsistency is it , that the self-same Earthly or Carnal Bodies of all should arise again after they are turned to Dust without any new Creation , and yet rise compleat , the same they were sor Substance ? What Sense or Congruity can be made of this ? Many Thousands being dissolved , and turned to as real Dust of the Earth , as man was at first formed of , how should Living and Compleat Bodies be raised out of that Dust , without Creating anew first ? But if it cannot be a new created Body , it is not the same Natural , Carnal or Terrestrial Body for Substance after dissolved : It is not this very same corruptible Flesh , Blood and Bones , that is given to every Seed as it pleaseth God , or that shall inherit God's Kingdom . Howbeit , As to be Quickened , implieth a Death first ; and Resurrection , a Fall before ; and to be Changed , that there was either a vile , corruptible Suffering , or low Estate before : So all that come to know Christ in them , and the Body dead because of Sin , know the Spirit to be Life because of Righteousness : And if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the Dead dwell in you , he that raised up Jesus from the Dead shall also quicken your mortal Bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you , Rom. 8. 10 , 11 , 12 , 13. And this plainly is a quickening unto Righteousness , by the Spirit dwelling within , which is far from being a Proof of T. H's Opinion , though cited by him . And as in the first Adam is both the Fall and Death come over all men ; so in the second Adam , who is the Resurrection and the Life , all are made alive , and that unto Righteousness , who first come to see the Body dead because of Sin , and the Deeds of the Body mortified , Rom. 8. 13. or who come to know Christ , and the Power of his Resurrection , and the Fellowship of his Sufferings , being made conformable unto his Death , these attain unto the Resurrection of the Dead , Phil. 3. 10 , 11. Such do not strive for a Notion thereof , but to attain to it . As to the manner of Existences or Beings of all men in the World to come , there is no Necessity for any to be taking thought or busying their Minds about them ; it being in the Pleasure and Wisdom of God , to reserve all to their due and deserved Ends in an immortal Capacity . Our present Concernment is , so to know and esteem of Christ , as that we may be found in him , not only mortified to the Corruptions of this World , through the Fellowship of his Suffering and Conformity unto his Death ; But also interessed in that blessed Resurrection , which is only attained to in Christ , who is the Resurrection and the Life ; that he may be magnified in our Body , whether by Life or Death . To what he saith in his 59. pag. about the B●…dy that was dead ; about that It which is raised ; about the So●…l and the Seed of God ; the Matter is answered else where ; yet , First , All that know the Body dead because of Sin , having mortified the Deeds of the Flesh and being conformable to the Death of Christ , as dead with him , shall alfo be quickned and raised up by his Spirit that dwells in them , which is Life , because of Righteousness ; and such only can speak experimentally of the Seed of God , and the Soul. 2dly , That there is a Seed of God , and a Seed of the Serpent in Mankind , according to G. F. Junior's relation , he further tells you , that they that discern the Body of each Seed , are not the Fools which are questioning , how the dead should be raised and with what Body ; for they know that all Mankind will be found in one of these two Seeds . By which it is plain , he doth not exclude men from a future Being or Immortality , nor confound them with the very Being of God ; though it is by his invisible Power , that all are upheld in their respective Existences , in Immortality , whether they be found in the Nature and Image of the good Seed , or of the evil . T. H. And since he calls them Fools , that is , the Apostles and all true Christians that say , This Body of Flesh and Bones shall arise , pag. 59. Rep. He should have produced his plain Scripture for the Apostles so saying : where are these Words to be found in all the Scriptures of the new Testament , that this Body of Flesh and Bones shall arise again ? Doth not the Apostle say the contrary , Thou sowest not that Body that shall be ? And Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God ? But must we then suppose , as some Professors do , That these Bodies of Flesh and Bones , shall inherit the Kingdom of God , without any Blood in them ? Or , that after they are returned to Dust , they shall arise again the self same as they are , without any new Creation ? I confess , this is such kind of new Philosophy as I have not read of before . The man has run himself into such strange Confusion ; and wholy misses the Sense of the Resurrection and the Life ; and over looks the true Seed and Root of the Matter , while in his vain mind he is imagining , muddling and Devil-like disputing about the Body , which in Comparison of the immortal Existence and being of Man , is but an outside Case , earthly Shell or Husk that disolveth . Again he saith , If this Seed of the Serpent be only Sin , and the Seed of Christ only Grace , it is only Sin and Grace which shall arise again , p. 60. Oh the gross Darkness and Ignorance of this Man ! He knows not the Seed of the Serpent , from whence Sin springs ; nor the Seed of God , from whence Grace and Life flows : But falsly supposes , that our Principle extinguishes the future distinct beings of Men , though it hath been plainly told him , that all Mankind will be found in one of these two Seeds . As also we testifie , from that Sence of Life and Immortality , that is brought to Light in us through the Gospel , That the Soul , whole spiritual Man , and spiritual Body , shall exist in Immortality ; yea , though our outward Man perish , yet the inward Man is renewed day by day , and in order to possess an eternal Weight of Glory , 2 Cor. 4. This inward Man is neither extinguish'd by the perishing of the outward Man ; nor thereby deprived of that Advantage , which is an eternal Weight of Glory : And that God giveth it a Body as it pleaseth him , and to every Seed his own Body , or his proper Body . The Man would know what this It is , shewing his Dubiousness of his own Assertion before , viz. " That it is a mortal Body of Flesh and Bones ( whether it shall be raised and go to Heaven with any Blood in it , he tells us not ) and that the Body given it is the same for Substance ; that is as good Sense as to say , the Body of Flesh and Bones shall ( when it is raised ) have the same Body of Flesh and Bones given to it ; whereas it is to every Seed his proper Body , which is comprehensive both of the Seed of the Righteous , and the Seed of the Wicked ; of the Seed of God , and the Seed of the Serpent : and so comprehends and takes in the whole Body of Mankind under those two Relations and Natures ; not to dissolve or extinguish their Rational , Intelligible Beings , with the perishing and dissolvable Earthly Outside or Case , but that all shall be reserved for their due and proper Ends , according to the Seed , Nature and Image , which their Soul carries with it when it parts with the Earthly Cloathing . And whereas it is said , that It is sown a Natural Body , it is raised a Spiritual Body ; the great Stress is laid on the particle [ IT ] which may as well be applyed to Wheat or other Grain ; It is sown , and It is raised , when the Body , or outside of that very Corn that is sown is dead , though the innate Virtue or Life , doth not in it self dye , nor fruitlesly expire : Thou sowest not that Body that shall be , &c. yet in these two relations , It , is used as relative both to that which is sown , and to that Body that shall be , while in the very next Words to those before cited , it is said , there is a Natural Body , and there is a Spiritual Body , 1 Cor. 15. 44. and these can no more be the self-same , then Celestial and Terrestrial Bodies can ; or then the first Adam and the laft Adam , or the Earthly and the Heavenly , which the Apostle plaiuly distinguisheth between , as he doth betwixt the Natural and the Spiritual . But whereas T. H. and his Brethren so much argue from the word It [ as , It is sown a Natural Body , It is raised a Spiritual ] they take this It for Idem corpus , the self-same Body in both : Their Mistake is evident ; they have not this either from the Greek or Latin : see 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , seminatur corpus animale , surgit corpus spirituale , i. e. a Natural ( or Animal ) Body is sown , a Spiritual Body riseth ; it is not Idem surgit : Nor would this agree with the next Words , There is a Natural Body , and there is a Spiritual Body . This admits of no such Transubstantiation , as that the self-same Natural Body should become Spiritual , or be the Subject of such an Accident . And it is sown 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , an Animal Body ; or as having Life , a Living Body , which therefore cannot be the Body as dead , and laid in the Graves ; for in that Condition they are not Corpus Animale ; for that relates to the Earthly Adam , or Body of Mankind , as having a natural Life : ●…nd must not even the Animal or Natural Man dye before the Spiritual Man be risen , or Immortality in Christ be put on ? And is not the Natural ( or Animal ) Man doposed to the Renewed Man ? 1 Cor. 2. 14. And the Seed which is sown in Weakness must needs have some Degree of Life in it , when sown ( whether Natural or Spiritual ) and the Weakness and Corruption doth relate to the Subject in which it is sown , if the Seed it self be incorruptible . And as the First Man is of the Earth , Earthly , the second Man is the Lord from Heaven ; and As is the Earthly , Such are they also that are Earthly ; and As is the Heavenly , Such are they that are Heavenly , ver . 47 , 48. which if this be owned , it must be granted , that they that are Heavenly must have Bodies sutable , viz. Heavenly or Spiritual Bodies ; this Heavenly being the second Man , the Lord from Heaven , ver . 47. And mark , As is the Heavenly , Such are they that are Heavenly ; which cannot be the same with Earthly any more then the Image of the Heavenly can be the Image of the Earthly . And as to our being asked , what this Mortal is that must put on Immortality ? Though Mortal in this place implies a dying Condition of Man ( as the Effect of Sin ) as in Adam all dye ; yet it cannot ( as having put on Immortality ) be relative to Flesh and Blood , but as admitted in a Heavenly and Spiritual Sense ; for the Apostle plainly tells us but a little before , Now this I say , Brethren , that Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God ; neither doth Corruption inherit Incorruption : Behold , I shew you a Mystery ! We shall not all Sleep , but we shall all be Changed , ver . 50 , 51. And so by that Life and Immortality which is brought to Light , we see beyond Death and Mortality ; and we ( though as in a dying State , yet ) behold Immortality , being quickned by the second Adam , and renewed again into the Image of the Heavenly ; being made alive in Christ , who redeems Man from Death , & ransoms the Soul from the Power of the Grave ; who swallows up Mortality and Death in Life and Victory , and saith , O Death , I will be thy Plagues ; O Grave , I will be thy Destruction , Hos. 13 , 14. Isa. 25. 8. by whom also Death being so swallow'd up into Victory , & the Sting of it , which is Sin , taken away : They who thus have their part in Christ , who is the Resurrection and Life , can truly say , Thanks be to God , who gives us the Victory through our Lord Jesus Christ , 1 Cor. 15. ●…7 . And to take off further Surmisings against us , I tell my Opposer , that this Resurrection , or Change , extends not only to a Raising of Man up from Sin to Righteousness , but also to an Eternal Glory : And 't is not only the Raising up of the Seed or Grace in Man , as he supposes ; but the Raising up of Man from Sin , Death , Hell and the Grave , even in the Seed and Life , which is the Ransom ; and this answers his Cavils in his 6●… . and 61. Pages , only where he fictitiously makes us speak thus , viz. Qu. We believe the Resurrection of the Body , though we know not what that Body is which shall rise : And then he absurdly makes a Christian to answer thus , viz. Chr. Thou saidst before , the Light within was the divine Essence : either then thy Light within thee is not God , or God knows not all things , &c. Reply , First he feigneth the Quacker , though we will never own him to be our Mouth ; for the Words were not so spoken by me , or us ; but that we ought not to be too Curious or Inquisitive in things beyond our Capacities , as to the Manner of the Existences hereafter ; or how Men shall be reserved unto their several Ends and Rewards ; for God knows how to do it : but we being sensible of the different Seeds , we cannot be altogether ignorant of the Nature of each Body being proper to the Seed it belongs to : Yet , if with John , we say , it doth not yet appear what we shall be ; it is Satisfaction that we know what Manner of Love the Father hath bestowed upon us , that we should be called the Sons of God ; for such are Sons of the Resurrection . 2dly , T. H. abuses the Christian by making him speak absurdly that which implies , that if Man have a Divine Light in him , he must needs know all that the Light knows , or else either conclude , that the Light is not Divine , or else God is not Omniscient ; and then it follows from hence , that none have either a Divine Light , or God dwelling in them , unless they know as much as God ( which was a Temptation to Man at first ) and by this he hath shut out all , not only the fallen World , but God's People also from having any Divine Light or Power of God in them . He scoffs at some of our Friends , saying , We own the Resurrection ; that is , We witness it : and then adds , But what is it you witness ? the Resurrection of the Seed ? 'T is Christ in you . Ans. Is this a matter to be taunted or scoffed at ? Hath he truly acted the part of a Christian thus to slight the Arising of the Righteous Seed in any ; or Christ's Arising , who doth appear , reveal himself , and arise in the Souls that believe in him , to raise them also up with him ; yea , and that which the Father hath given him he will loose nothing o●… it , but raise it up at the last Day ? And if you do not come to know a Righteous Seed raised up in you , and Truth to spring up out of the Earth and to witness Christ to be your Resurrection and Life , you remain dead in your Sins , and short of the Glory of this Resurrection . But in witnessing Christ to be the Resurrection and the Life unto us , we do not assert that it is only the Seed or Christ in us that doth arise , as is vainly imagined ; but we are revived , and do arise in and with him , as those that have believed in his Name , as he said , I am the Resurrection and the Life , he that believeth in me , though he were dead yet shall he live ; and he that liveth and believeth in me , shall never dye : wherein he doth not take notice of the putting off of the earthly Body or Cloathing , as his dying , or Death . And , as in Adam all dye , even so in Christ shall all be made alive ; but every man in his own order , Christ the first Fruits , afterward they that are Christ's at his Coming : and this is not to exempt Man from the Benefit of the Resurrection ; nor to say , That Christ and the Light within is sown Natural , Mortal and Corruptible , as T. H. most malitiously and falsly accuseth us by way of Question , as asserting Blasphemy : To which he farther adds , that we intend the Resurrection of something past , and witness in our selves : What is Falsehood and Deceipt , if this be not ? p. 61. And further saith , Thus do you undermine the very Foundation of Faith , Hope and Holiness of Life , like Hymneas and Philotus , 2 Tim. 2. 17. who said the Resurrection is past already . To which I answer , first , What we witness in ourselves of the Resurrection , it is this Man 's horrible Blasphemy , to call it Falsehood and Deceipt , for that we do witness to Christ as being the Resurrection and the Life revealed in us , so far as we have a living Knowledge of him , and Experience of being by him raised up from Sin and Death that came by it , in order to attain to a future Glory . 2dly , 'T is a Gross Slander , that we either intend or say , like Hymneas and Philotus , that the Resurrection is past already ; for that it is not yet ( as to Man ) compleatly ; we are not yet raised to what we shall be , as namely to that Fulness of Glory and absolute Joy and Tryumph , which shall be incessantly possest after our Labours and Sufferings are ended , and our Earthly House dissolved ; for the more we are drawn up into absolute Spirituality , the more capable we are of that full Fruition of an eternal Weight of Glory in the Heavens ; in order to which let us be Spiritually minded , and walk in Holiness of Life while here in our earthly House . As also we cannot hold that the Resurrection is past already , while we , or any of us , are suffering with Christ , and travailing in order to attain unto the Resurrection of the Dead , that is , perfectly to be raised up with Christ ; who is the Resurrection and Life ( in some Degree at least ) of all that truly believe in his Name and Power : Neither is this to undermine the Foundation of true Faith , Hope or Holiness of Life , while we confess Christ to be that Foundation . But to argue for Sin and Imperfection term of Life , and so to put off being Perfect till in Heaven , as this Opposer hath done , this is repugnant to the Foundation of living and purifying Faith and Hope ; and so excludes Holiness of Life : howbeit he thinks to arrive at Heaven with the same Carnal Carcass or Corruptible Cask he now beats about with him ; only he thinks , it will be new drest up and polisht after it is turned to Dust : But the greatest Miracle is , that it must not be Created a new , nor a new Created Body ; and unless we grant him this , he reckons our Religion a meer Cheat , calculated only to the Service of the Devil and our own Lusts , and that it denies any Eternal Advantage ; and therefore be opposeth the Christian to the Quaker , p. 62. And what is the Marrow of his Matter for this severe Conclusion upon us ? But , First , he accuseth us of a palpable Denyal of all future and distinct Beings and Existences after Death , pag. 62. which is a palpable and notorious Untruth : for as we confess to the distinct Beings of Angels in Heaven ; so we confess the future distinct Beings and Existences of the Saints and Children of the Resurrection , that in the World to come they shall be AS the Angels of God ; yea , They which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that World and the Resurrection , &c. They shall be equal unto the Angels , and are the Children of God , being the Children of the Resurrection , Luk. 20. 36. And what Bodies have these Angels of God ? Terrestrial , or Celestial ; Carnal , or Spiritual ? let that be considered . 2dly , The Man 's other Pretence is , If the Soul be a Part of God , Divine , Infinite ( as before ) and returns into God , being God it cannot miscarry , he saith . His Abuse concerning this hath been answer'd before , both in this Treatise , and in my Book of the Nature of Christianity . And it was never asserted by us either of the Soul of Man , or of the Spirit or Existence of Man , or the Creature which may vary in its Affections to Good or Evil , according to the Power that acts Man : Neither can it be conceived in Reason ( but Envie ) that any of us should look upon the Infinite God , to be Divisible into so many Parts or Particles as there are Entities or Existences of Men ; yet that there is an Infinite Life , Principle or Seed in the Soul of every Man , This we confess , as that by which the Soul immortally subsists in its being ; and therefore this may be counted the Soul , or Life of the Soul ; for without this the Soul of man could not subsist in an Immortal Capacity . And this I and divers others can testifie , that G. F. did not intend or asscribe either Immutability , Infiniteness or Divinity to the meer formed or created Spirit , Soul or Being of Man , but to the divine , immediate Inspiration or Breath of Life , flowing from God himself , who inspired into him an active Soul , and breathed in a living Spirit , Wisd. 15. 11. whereby Man became both a living and reasonable Soul , indued with Rational , Intellectual and Spiritual Parts . 3dly , I know no other Reason he can pretend for his Charge against us and our Religion , as a Cheat , and as denying an eternal Advantage , but that we do not own his gross and carnal Sense of the Resurrection , though it be none of our Phrase , to say in these general words , That the Body perisheth forever ; but hereby he plainly implies man's Incapacity of an eternal Advantage , unless his Carnal or Terrestrial Body that now is , partake thereof ; and how shall it partake thereof after it is dissolved and turned to Dust ? He tells us , It cannot be a new Created Body , but a Resurrection ; Of what ? he would have it of the self-same Body for Substance : But if there must be no new Creation , but a Resurrection of these Carnal Bodies , opposed to Creation , it must only be a raising of the Dust of these Bodies ; and then what a sad Garment would this invest the Souls of the Righteous with ? But if on second Thoughts , he will admit of any new Creation of Bodies out of the Dust , this cannot imply , that they shall be the very self same that now they are in Matter and Form. But if any of them shall yet say , They shall be specifically the same Bodies , That varies from their Principle of being the self-same that now they are . What is now become of this Man's Religion ? and whereon do his Expectations of a future Advantage depend , but upon his Ignorant and Carnal Conceptions , and not upon any living Sence of Christ , or any spiritual or divine Understanding of the Mystery of the Resurrection , whose Work is gross Body , and not Spirit ? He reckons our Religion and Suffering to be for a Carnal Interest , while his empty Faith and Profession is for the same to be sure , being so much for the Promotion of his Carnal Body in eternal Glory , which 't is not capable of ; nor he in the Way to it . Such is the course of some carnal Cavillers , who while contending about Bodies , and musing how they shall exist in Heaven , they are now neglecting the Way thither , more busying themselves about their carnal Bodies , then regarding their poor Souls ; or minding the Spirit of Holiness , thereby to become Sons of God , and of the Resurrection ; or to be converted from Sin and Pollution to Holiness ; or turned from Satan's Power to God , which is the Way to Glory . And now in short to answer what we and our Religion are charged within the Conclusion of our Adversary's bitter reviling Dialogue : First , We testifie that the Resurrection is not past . 2dly , That the Soul of Man is not God , nor Christ ; but God is the Saviour of it ; and so we ( alwayes since we knew our own Souls ) have distinguished between the Soul and the Saviour of it . 3dly , That we confess future and distinct Beings after Death , as well of Men as of Angels ; and that the Children of God and of the Resurrection shall in the World to come be as the Angels , yea , equal to them . 4thly , Though it be said , Thou sowest not that Body that shall be ; and Flesh and Blood shall not inherit the Kingdom of God , 1 Cor. 15. It doth not therefore follow , that our Religion denies any eternal Advantage that is to be reaped ; much less that it is a Cheat , or Calculated to the Service of the Devil , as most wickedly and malitiously T. H. hath reviled and blasphemed that Religion and Testimony which we know , is given us of God ; for we have not by distinguishing between the Natural and Spiritual Bodies , denyed the Saints , their proper Existences , Spiritual Body , or House eternal in the Heavens , when the Earthly Tabernacle is dissolved : and unless the Man holds the Mortality of the Soul , that it dyes with the Body , or the extinguishing of the spiritual Being of Man , I do not see how he can suppose a denying of any eternal Advantage on our parts ; unless he place it all upon the Earthly Body . It is true that some of his Brethren do hold , that the Soul dyes with the Body , and sleeps in the Dust , till both be raised ; and this also depriveth all the Saints deceased from having any eternal Advantage , in the mean time at least : But we are not of that Faith , Hope or Religion that will expire or perish with the Carnal Body , as our Opposers will , who in his fruitless , carnal Work and Discourse consists more of and for gross Body , then Spirit ; he is too carnal & gross in his Apprehensions , to discern so much as a Vision of the future Beings and State of Saints : But both they that think they shall reap no Eternal Advantage without their Terrestrial Bodies of Flesh and Blood , as T. H. pag. 75. And they who hold the Mortality of the Soul , are not of the Apostle's mind and Spirit , who said , We know , that if our earthly House of this Tabernacle were dissolved , we have a Building of God , an House not made with Hands , eternal in the Heavens , 2 Cor. 5. 1. We are confident , I say , and willing rather to be absent from the Body , and to be present with the Lord , ver . 8. For to me to live is Christ , and to dye 〈◊〉 Gain ; but if I live in the Flesh this is the Fruit of my Labour : Yet what I shall Chuse I wote not ; for I am in a straight betwixt two , having a Desire to depart and to be with Christ , which is far better , Phil. 1. 21 , 22 , 23. Mark here , First , he expected a far better and more excellent House then the Earthly House after Dissolution . 2dly , If to dye was Gain to him , and to depart from the Flesh , desirable ; and so out of it , to be with Christ , far better , he did not place his Felicity upon the Flesh or carnal Body , as T. H. doth : neither did the Apostle so indeavour to magnifie that fleshly outside Cloathing , which is perishing and dissolvable ; but his earnest Expectation and Hope was on the behalf of Christ , and his future Gain in him , saying , Christ shall be magnified in my Body , whether by Life or by Death , Phil. 1 , 20. But T. H. his carnal Contest is for magnifying his earthly , carnal Body , and not for magnifying Christ therein ; for he scornfully slights our witnessing Christ ( and his being risen ) in us ; though it is evident the Apostle did not place his eternal Felicity and Advantage upon the Earthly House , Flesh or carnal Body that perishes and turns to Dust ; for if he set his Heart upon Man , if he gather unto himself his Spirit & his Breath , all Flesh shall perish together , and Man shall turn again unto Dust , Job . 34. 14 , 15. But T. H. sees no Eternal Advantage to be reapt by Persons after Death , unless they confess the Resurrection of the very self-same Flesh , Blood and Bones that dyes , corrupts and turns to Dust ( If he intends any Blood in it ) he will admit of no new Creation of it ; and by this , his Religion and Hope do expire and perish with his corrupt Body , and must only be renewed when the Dust of that Body shall be raised without Creating it a new Body : And if there be no eternal Advantage without this kind of Resurrection , as described by him , this doth either wholly deny the Original and Spiritual Being of Man , and comprehends the whole Man , only as consisting of a mortal and perishing Body ; or else admits not of the reasonable Soul really to injoy her self in any condition out of the outside perishing Vesture or decay'd Cloathing , which for Man to be divested of , can be no more Loss to him , as to his immortal Being , then 't is to the Wheat to dye & bring forth much Fruit , unto which [ Resurrection ] is applicable as well as to Man , though not to the Sameness of Body : And as it cannot unman a Man to put off his Old Cloathing , that he may put on New ; no more can it annihilate our Spiritual Existences to have the Earthly Cloathing put off and dissolved , but be to our far greater Advantage & Glory , to be invested with that Spiritual Transcendent Cloathing , & most Excellent House Eternal in the Heavens ; which State they only attain to , who become Sons of God and of the Resurrection , and desire Christ may be magnified in their Bodies here . And furthermore from that Belief and Discovery I have received in the true Light , of the Resurrection and future Rewards , according to the holy Scripture ; I desire it may be minded , that God commandeth all Men every where ( in their Day and Time ) to Repent , because he hath appointed a Day in the which he will judge the World in Righteousness , by that Man whom he hath ordained : So that there will be a Day of Judgment , Wrath and Perdition of the Ungodly ; unto which Day the Lord Knoweth how to Reserve the Unjust to be punished ; and this will be a Terrible Day to all that make Lyes their Refuge , and reject the universal Call of God to Repentance : And seeing that in the Great Day of the Lord a final Dissolution may be expected of all those things that are perishing and dissolvable , even of the Heavens and the Earth , and that they shall be changed , what manner of Persons ought we to be here in all Holy Conversation and Godliness ? After T. H. hath vented his Blasphemous Out-rage against our Religion , as before in his Catechism , he impudently abuseth and bespattereth our Sufferings , p. 75. where he thus questioneth , viz. Tell me what it is that doth influence and prevail with you to Do and Suffer as you do ? And then he makes us thus to answer , viz. Answ. What doest thou think it should be ? And then he thus proceeds . Quest. May not the Satisfaction of your Wills and Lusts , the Promoting your Carnal Interests , be your chief Motive and Inducement ? And then he makes the Answer thus . Answ. We deny the Flesh and the Lusts : This is thy own Dark Imagination : And then he proceeds again . Quest. May not you live in and fulfil the Lusts of the Flesh whilst you deny it in Words , since your Opinion denies any eternal Advantage to be reaped by Persons after Death in denying the Resurrection of this Body ? Must you not then have respect to something to be injoyed here as your Incouragement ? p. 75. Rep. The Malice , Falsehood and Absurdity of these Forgeries against the real Intent and End of our Sufferings , Thousands may testifie against ; and all Impartial Readers that know us , and have beheld our deep Sufferings , may perceive the Man's Envy : Considering the great Number of our Friends that have dyed in Prisons , and the many hundreds that have been ruined and spoiled in their Estates and Callings , could these be either consistent with Lusts or carnal Interest ? and the many that have been banished , and many Families undone ; besides the many that have been knocked down , Bruised and Beaten in the streets , and their Lives often hazarded and resigned up for Meeting in the Fear of God ; Could these things be endured for a Carnal Interest ? No , No ; but meerly upon a Religious and Conscientious Account ( wherein we have eyed the Glory of God , and our own Peace andfturue Happiness : If we did not own any Resurrection , eternal Advantage , or Existences hereafter , what should we suffer for ? we were of all men most miserable : If we were of that Atheistical Opinion , instead of chusing our Great Sufferings , we should have chosen this , viz. Let us Eat & Drink , for tomorrow we dye , 1 Cor. 15. 19 , 32. It may be easily judged whether we are justly reflected upon or no , as being influenced either to satisfie our Wills , or promote carnal Interest , or to fulfil the Lusts of the Flesh , or obtain any temporal Injoyment here by our Losses & Sufferings : These gross , abusive Slanders are so apparent that he that runs may read them , being also manifestly detected by our apparently often resigning up our Estates , Liberties and Lives ; also in Times of deep Suffering , when we could see no publick Appearance of such , as T. H. and many of his Brethren , before the face of Persecution ; but then they could sculke & creep into Corners , and Obscure themselves , and leave all the Burden upon u●… , there being but a few Baptists that did suffer in the late Tryal sor their Religion or Consciences : Though to give them their due , a few of them have suffered Imprisonment , some whereof have received the Benefit of our Labours among our Friends , in a late General Discharge ; but the most cowardly and base-spirited among them are now most Quarrelsom against us ; and why ? They have lost Ground by their Carnal Policy in Obscuring themselves in Stormy Times , which they are never like to regain , but still to loo●…e more by Fretting and Struggling against us ; and therefore T. H. is offended that our Number should now augment , though that he cannot hinder ; for the Hand of the Lord is in it : And many having seen the Coldness of Baptists Zeal , Night-Dipping , and their Timorous Creeping and Securing themselves in Suffering Times as also the Emptiness and Dryness of their Religion ; Divers are aweary thereof : And when they come among us to receive the Sence of God's Power , then divers of the Baptist-Teachers do fret and are Angry , eagerly besetting the Parties : And in that God hath made our Sufferings effectual for his Name & Truth sake , for the drawing many after it , T. H. endeavours ( in the Malice of Sathan ) to debase and render our Sufferings Odious , saying : He believes our Carnal Advantage is one grea●… Thing in our Eye ; And then he adds , Quest. Though you may sustain some outward Losses ; yet whether you have not a Way to augment your Outward Gain by Loosing ? pag. 75. Reply , He now questioneth that which before he saith , he believeth , as namely , That Carnal Advantage is one great Thing in our Eye . One Great Thing implyeth some thing else ; but What else , he leaves no place for in what he hath concluded before , to wit , That we have regard only to something to be injoyed 〈◊〉 ; afterward he falsly rekons Carnal Advantages to be One great Thing in our Eye , and then questions the Matter surmised and before believed by him ; as , Whether we have not a Way to augment our outward Gain by Loosing ? and thus bewrayes his own Guilt , Falsehood , and Wickedness in his Traducing a People or whole Body of us , and Reproaching our Conscientious Sufferings , though it is known that Carnal Interest and Advantage is a great thing in the eye of divers Baptist-Preachers , while they augment their Gain , Stipends and Pluralities by preaching in several Places in times of Liberty ; which Liberty their occult Creeping in times of Tryal hath not procured , but added to our Sufferings : Coertion was effectual and sruitful upon such timorous Dippers or Baptists , and not at all shewn to be fruitless by the Valour of these Opposers and Quarrelers , who now further to increase our Sufferings , reproach them as Irreligious , and only for self-intrest ; and Us , as neither Christians nor Conscientious ; and such is the Reward we have from cowardly , base & envious Spirits , who have strengthened the Hand of Persecution , and aggravated our Sufferings by their own Unchristian and Ignoble Policy , and Subterfuges for self-Security . But T. H. might have very well allowed us Conscience and Religion for our many deep Sufferings ( especially while he and his Brethren partake of the Fruits and Benefit thereof ) wherein we have resigned up all our Worldly Interests , outward Concernments , and our Lives also ) although he had judged our Conscience erronous : But what is the Tendence of all his imbittered Traducing and Reproaching our Sufferings ; as , one while Wills , Lusts and carnal Intrests being the chief Inducement thereto ; another while , Respect only to some temporal Injoyment ; another while , Carnal Advantages one great thing ; and then he questions , Whether we have not a Way to augment our outward Loss ? Thus shewing his Variation and Doubtfulness in his own perverse and most apparent Slander against our Sufferings : And finally after he hath thus perversly vilified them ( as , Carnal Interest being either the chief thing , or only thing , or one great thing ; or whether we have not such a Way to augment , &c. ) he saith , If not , then may not a Disposition to be singular , and to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to all other men , and to be noted in the World as a People of peculiar Motions and Fancies prevail very much with you , to Do and Suffer as you do , p. 76. Rep. His wicked surmising a Carnal Advantage to be our End , is now turned into a Suggestion of a Disposition to be singular and noted in the World , which , though varying from the former , is also abominably false and wicked ; and our Consciences bear us witness in the fight of God , that T. H. hath shamefully slandered the real Intent and End of tur Sufferings in these matters : And what do all his Atempts herem tend to , but to calumniate , defame and odifie us and our Sufferings to the World , and to make us so obnoxious to the Powers , and both wilfully and Irreligiously repugnant to the Goverment , as that they may fall more vigorously upon ●…us to ruin and destroy us , If they will believe this reviling , inveterate Baptist , who is so very dirty that he had need to be more dipt then ever he was , who hath shewn his implacable Enmity and persecuting Spirit , from which he hath fomed out his own Shame ( like a malitious Incendiary ) which will the more extend to the Discredit and Dis-reputation of himself & his Brethren that own him , and not to the making void the Christian Reputation which we , the People , called Quakers have on the behalf of God and his living Truth : However T. H. hath published us as no Christians , and most shamefully treated us like an Insinuating Temporizer , falslly and deceitfully accusing us of Enmity against the Ministry and Institutions of Jesus Christ , p. 76. but neither tells us , who he intends are that Ministry , nor what he means by those Institutions , whether he intends not Baptist-Preachers , and their Night-dipping , &c. Though for his Cover he would make the World believe , as if we were really acted and influenced by some Romish Emissaries to insinuate many of their Heresies , to distract , dejor●… and defame the Protestant Profession p. ●…6 . which is still slanderous and fallacious , tending to make us suffer by such deceitful and popular Insinuations ; as if to vindicate our selves & our ●…nnocent and Just Cause from the perverse Calumnies of a few peevish Dippers and Anabaptists were such an Heretical Crime to distract and deform the Protestant Professions ; and as if these distracted Anabatists were the Protestants Principal Representatives . And He having abused us after thi●… his deceitful and malitious way , and with his calumniating Language against us , our Religion , and Sufferings ; the summary Conclusion of his Method against us , runs thus , viz. Cheats , and Impostors , great Imposters , p. 27 , 28 , 62. Knave , Knave , a false and dec●…itful man and that willfully , a man false and deceitful , really salse and dishonest , p. 39 , 52 , 53 , 91. before his Words were against G. W. Deceitful Fellow , Audacious Fellow , Impudent Fellow , You are a Knave , You are a Knave : And to C. Harris , You are a Cocks-Comb ; I 'l prove you a Cocks-Comb . Such Tinkers-Rhetorick as this , he is very ready at , when his morose Cholerick-Humor is up ; also Blasphemers , or Blasphemy and Heresy , he is very ready to charge men with , when his corrupt Opinions are opposed ; and finally , that our Religion should be a mecr Cheat , calculated only to the Service of the Devil , pag. 62. This is the highest Charge proceeding from the hight of his Rancor and Malice ; as also his notoriously defaming our Sufferings , to be for the Satisfaction of Wills , Lusts , promoting Carnal Interests , Carnal Advantages , outward Gains , &c. as before : Concerning these matters as considered of together , I appeal to you , his Brethren , W. Kiffin and the rest ; let Honesty and Conscience speak , whether they do not savour of a Persecuting Spirit ; and , whether they are not of an evil Tendence , as before signified , to stir up Persecution against us : And knowing that he hath most abominably and falsly traduced our Sufferings , and so reproached our whole Body as we are a People , and that in this publick manner in his Pamphlet , we do expect that Justice and Right from you his Brethren , as that you should give out a publick Testimony against his Injury done us and our Sufferings in this Case , and allow us our Consciences and Religion therein , how erroneous and mistaken soever you think them ; otherwise , if you refuse to do us this Right , and so connive at your Brother Hicks his Iniquity , we must look upon you so far concerned in the Guilt thereof , as not doing us that Right and Justice that both Truth , Equity and Reason requires of you : So as you do intend to clear and quit your selves , be Ingenuous , plain and open in this matter , which doth so nearly concern you , Thomas Hicks being a Brother and Teacher among you , against whom we call for Judgment and Justice to be done us in as publick a manner as his Abuses and Injuries are in Print . God knows , who beareth Witness with my Spirit , and is my Record , that I bear no Ill-will nor Prejudice to you , or any of you , what ever any bear towards me : And for those things wherein your Brother Tho. Hicks hath abused and wronged me , I defire he may Repent thereof , and I wish he may find a place for Repentance ; as also that you who are concerned in Society with him , may clear and quit your selves of his inveterate Spirit and gross Abuses against us , who bear Love and Good-will towards you and all men , believing that there are some among you that are more tender and honest , and of a better Spirit then T. H. for whose sakes I have writ thus much , and not for his ; for he hath shewn himself Dirty and Wicked , who hath made no Conscience to forge , and spread many notorious Lyes and Slanders against us . And therefore however takenotice of this , that it will not be reputable for you to allow or own him as a Teacher among you , nor for you to sit . under him ( who hath no Power either over his Tongue or Passion ) unless he Repent , and as publickly Revoak , Judge and Condemn his gross Errors , Abuses , Lyes Slanders and Forgeries , as he hath broached and spread them ; and if you suffer him to go on a Preacher among you without a publick Reproof from you , and his open Recantation , it will lye upon you as Upholders of a persecuting Spirit , and rende●… you as uncharitable and unchristian Professors of Christia●…ity , for suffering such a notorious piece of Wickedness , as this of T. Hicks's , to proceed from among you unreproved . But I really desire the Lord may open your Eyes so as you may clear your selves ; and that Envy and Prejudice may cease and dye among you , that you may not dye and perish in it . A Serious Reflection Upon some of Will. Burnet's Chief Arguments , about the Resurrection of the SAME FLESH , In his Book , stiled , The Capital Principles of the People called Quakers . W. B. IF Jesus Christ did rise again with that Body that went Arg. I. to the Crave , then there is a Resurrection from the Grave of the same Body , &c. But Christ did leave the Grave empty , &c. Ergo. Arg. II. If Jesus Christ rose from the Dead with Flesh and Bones , yea with the same Flesh as was nailed to the Cross , Joh. 20. 27. then there is a Resurrection from the Grave of the same Flesh that goeth to the Grave ; But Christ did rise in the same , Ergo. Answ. This Man's Work savours of Flesh and not Spirit : The Consequence of both his Propositions is inconsistent , and so his Argument is fallacious ; for Christ's Flesh saw no Corruption , being raised the third Day it did not corrupt in the Sepulchre , much less turn to Dust or Earth as others do ; therefore the Instance and Comparison is unequal in this case , though it holds for a more Spiritual End and Advantage then this drives at , for which the Apostle did instance the Resurrection of Christ by the Glory or Power of the Father , that men might believe in that Power : He did not say that Christ's Flesh was raised up the third day , that you might believe that the same Flesh ( as gross part ) of yours that goeth to the Grave and turns to Dust shall be so Raised , as this Man argues ; for Christ's Resurrection was preached , that their Faith might be in God , who raised him up ; that Men might in this Life receive and feel the Spiritual Benefit thereof to their Immortal Souls , and so partake in this Life of the Power of his Resurrection , to be raised up with Christ , in order to reign with him in Glory hereafter●… as for ●…nstance ; Know ye not that so many of us as w●…re baptize●… 〈◊〉 ●…esus Christ , were baptized into his D●…ath ; therefore we 〈◊〉 with him by Baptism into Death , that like as Christ was raised up 〈◊〉 Dead by the Glory of the Father , even so we also should 〈◊〉 in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of Life , Rom. 6. 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8. to the end . And 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 him by Baptism , wherein also you are risen with him throu●…h 〈◊〉 F●…ith of the Operation of God who hath raised him from the 〈◊〉 . Col. 〈◊〉 . 12 , 13. As also to the same Purpose and End , read Rom. 8. 11. a●…d 10. 9. Eph. 2. 1. 1 Pet. 3. 18 , 19 , 21. 1 Cor. 15. 45. Phil. 3. 10 , 11. 1 Cor. 6. 14. 2 Cor. 4. 14. Joh. 6. ●…9 , 40 Col. 2. 20. and 3. 3 , 4. Eph. 1. 20. and 2. 6. Col. 2. 12. 1 Pet. 1. 3. 21. Heb. 11. 35. 1 Thes. 5. 10 , 11. By all which it is evident , that Christ , Death and Resurrection was not preached for a 〈◊〉 E●…d , but for a spiritual Benefit here , and an eternal Advantage hereafter . But whereas our Opposer carnally infers from Christ's arising , a Resurrection of the same Flesh that goeth to th●… Grave : His Shortness in this , and the Shallowness o●… his fleshly Apprehension , comes under this further Consideration , As First , That all Flesh and Earthly Bodies of Men do not go to the Grave , in hi●… Sense : It is said , Th●… 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of thy Servants have they given to be Meat 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Fow's of Heaven ; the Flesh of thy Saints unto the 〈◊〉 of the 〈◊〉 : Their Blood have they shed like Water round about Jeru●…alem , and there was none to bury them , Psal. 79. 2 , 3. There●…ore these were not laid in Graves of the Earth . As also it is apparent , that the Flesh of many is wasted away with Sickness before they dye , or their Bones be lai●… in the Grave : And likewise many undergo such great Sick●…esses and Calamities in their Life time , as so o●…ten doth , both corrupt and waste their Flesh and Blood , that so often as they are restored to Health again , they have new Fleth or rene●…ed Bodies thereof ; and then , what a vast Bigness would 〈◊〉 Bodies amount to , if raised with all the self 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that they had in their Life time ? Moreover through 〈◊〉 Judgment and sore Exercise David said , My ●…ones ●…leave to my Skin , Psal. 102. 5. And my K●…ees are weak through 〈◊〉 , and my Flesh faileth of Fatness , Psal. 109. 24. And as 〈◊〉 signified , when man is chastened with Pain upon his Bed , and the multitude of his Bones with strong Pain , so that his Life 〈◊〉 Bread ; his Flesh is consumed away , that it cannot beseen ; and his Bones ( that were not seen ) stick out : His Soul draweth near unto the Grave , &c. Job 33. 19 , 20 , 21 , 22. Through such Judgement , and Chastisement , they who have known the polluted Flesh consumed away , are not so much concerned for the same Flesh , as these our fleshly Opposers are , whereby they shew , they never experienced such Chastisements , nor underwent such Judgment , that God might hide Pride from them , and keep back their Soul from the Pit : Their proud Flesh would alwayes live , and be reserved to eternal Glory ; Whereas he whose Flesh is consumed away , through the Chastisements of the Lord , and who comes to see that God is gracious therein unto him , to deliver him from going down to the Pit , who saith , I have found a Ransom ; It is said of such a one , His Flesh shall be fresher then a Child's ; he shall return to the Dayes of his Youth , Job . 33. This is not the old Flesh that was consumed away through Chastisements : And as all Flesh is not the same Flesh ; so all Bodies are not of the same kind , as hath been fully shewed . It were more meet , for Baptists and others , to wait to see Judgment and Chastisement from God upon them , to the consuming and wasting away of their corrupt Flesh , then to quarrel for it , and cry , This Body , and this very Flesh , shall arise again out of the Grave , even as Christ's did , and with these very Eyes I shall see God , ( pointing at their present Flesh and carnal Eyes ) when as they do not know but that their Flesh may be divers times consumed and wasted through Judgment or Sickness before they dye ; and so often in the mean time new Flesh , or Bodies thereof restored them , as was hinted ; which if truly obtained as a Token of their inward Renewing unto God , were much better and of more Concernment , then thus carnally to quarrel for their old corrupt Flesh. W. B. Arg. III. Upon Job Chap. 19. 25 , 26 , 27. If Job had that Faith , that with his Flesh he should see God , then it was not in other Flesh ; nor yet another Eye but it was both with his Flesh , and with his Eye , that after this Life he should see God ; therefore do I conclude , that the fleshly Body of Man shall be raised out of the Dust , to see God. Answ. By all which Assertion and Conclusion , we may see and still conclude , how gross and carnal these Anabaptists are in their Apprehensions and Thoughts concerning God ; thus to render him visible to their Flesh and fleshly Eye , supposing that Job in his Belief herein , and God in his being , were like themselves ; whereas God is invisible and an infinite Spirit , not made up of Flesh and Bones to be seen with Flesh and carnal Eyes . As also the man has perverted Job's words which are ( as translated ) Though after my Skin Worms destroy This Body ; yet in my Flesh shall I see God , Job . 19. 26. ( who before said , my Flesh is cloathed with Worms . Job . 7. 5. ) It is not , that with My Flesh , or fleshly Body , I shall see God after Worms have destroyed it ; but I N my Flesh I shall see God. Neither did Job quiet himself in his Perplexity with the Belief that his Flesh should see God ( as is imagined ) but that he should see God , as afterwards he did , when he said , I have heard of thee by the Hearing of the Ear ; but now mine Eye seeth thee ; wherefore I abhor my self , &c. Job . 42. 5. Now that wherein Job was quieted , was , That he knew that his Redeemer lived , who should redeem him out of all his Troubles that he had in the Flesh ; and that after his outward Body was destroyed out of his perplexed Flesh , he should see God in an Immortal State : He had no reason to quiet himself upon any Confidence in , or concerning that Flesh , when he was so disquieted and perplexed in it ; for those words , Chap. 19. ver . 26. are differently rendered in the Margins thus , After I shall awake , though this Body be destroyed , yet OUT of my Flesh shall I see God ; see the Margined Bibles of the last Translation , with Hebrew notes and various Translation : Now there is a great Difference between seeing God With my Flesh , and seeing God Out of my Flesh after it is destroyed . But to these men that believe , that with their Flesh or fleshly Bodies they shall see God , he may say , as he said to the Wicked , Thou thoughtest that I was altogether such a one as thy self ; but I will reprove thee , and set them ( to wit thy Iniquities ) in order before thine Eyes , Psal. 50. 21. yea , thou thoughtest that I was so like thy self , as that thou mightest see me with thy Flesh and fleshly Eyes : But thy Thoughts in this were very carnal , and thy Apprehensions very gross ; thou shalt find thou art mistaken , I am an invisible All-seeing Spirit , that searches Hearts , and penetrates through the dark Spirits and Cogitations of Men , to bring their secret Thoughts to Judgment and set their evil Actions in order before them . And there were those that saw Christ's outward or bodily Appearance , that had neither heard the Voice of God , nor seen his Shape , Joh. 5. 37. And Philip said to Christ , shew us the Father , and it sufficeth us . It was not enough for them , nor yet a seeing the Father , to see Christ's Body or Person ; both Father and Son being truly and savingly to be seen in Spirit : And said Christ , a Spirit hath not Flesh and Bones as you see me have . The Anthropomorphites , who were Monks inhabiting the Deserts of Aegypt , held , That God was a Person in the Bigness and Stature of a Man , mistaking that Saying , Let us make Man in our own Jmage , applying it to the Man 's outward Similitude ( and so do the Blasphemous Muggletonians ) and therefore that God is visible to the Carnal Eye and fleshly Body ; from which these Baptists Doctrine ( of seeing God with their Flesh and fleshly Bodies ) is little Different . W. B. Arg. IV. The fourth Witness to this Truth is Martha , Joh. 11. 24. Her Brother Lazarus being dead , that She believed , that he should rise again at the Last Day in the Resurrection : If the Resurrection of dead Lazarus , or that of Lazarus laid in the Grave , was believed and assented to by Martha , &c. Answ. That Martha had such a Belief from the Jews Opinion of the Resurrection , as she intimated of Lazarus his Body ( which Christ did then raise ) is not the matter in Question : But that they and she had it from Christ , or the true and spiritual Understanding thereof , doth not therefore follow ; but rather the Contrary from Christ's own following reprehensive Diversion , after Martha said , I know that he shall rise again in the Resurrection at the Last Day ; Jesus said unto her , I am the Resurrection and the Life , he that believeth in me , though he were dead , yet shall be live ; and whosoever liveth and believeth in me , shall never dye , Joh , 11. 24 , 25. but our Opposer was not pleased to take Notice of this Answer of Christ's , but only of Martha's Words and Belief , and to argue from thence after this manner . Arg. V. The Word Resurrection implyeth to rise again . Answ. And can this be applyed to nothing , nor any other wise , then to that very Flesh or gross Body , that returns to Dust ? Is not Christ the Resurrection and the Life ? And doth not to Rise again , imply , that Man was fallen before ? and that as in Adam all dye , so in Christ shall all be made alive ? And is not Resurrection applicable to that which is quickened ? and must this be understood only of the Dust of dissolved Bodies without any Creation ? For he saith , If God give another Body , and raise not again that Body that before was in being , then it is a Creation , and no Resurrection : So that from hence it is a Resurrection of the same Dust of the gross Bodies dissolved , that seems to be expected by these men , and not any Creation ; and therein is their great Mercy and Com●…ort , though they do not acquiesce herein from Contention and Quarrelling : But in that Resurrection , Quickening , Reviving , Changing , Translation , do not signifie Creation ; therefore they are not applicable to the Dust of Bodies after Dissolution , though both Resurrection and new Creation be to Renewed man ; Behold , I make All things new ; New Man , New Creation , New Heavens , and New Earth , &c. but this is a Mystery hid from corrupt Flesh , so much contended for by our Present Opposers . The rest of his Arguments and Doctrines are mostly very weak and ignorant about this Point , yet comprehensively answered in this Book . Here follow some Passages out of a Manuscript by W. B. against me , with a Reply , detecting his Ignorance in consounding the Carnal Body and the Spiritual : W. B. INdeed , If G. Whitehead hath found out a Body for Christ that is not a Carnal Body ( which implies only a Fleshly ) It is such a Body that I never read o●… in the Scriptures ; I would know what in Scripture is called the Body , but the Flesh ? Now take but away the Flesh , and where is the Body ? Aye but , saith G. W. It is a spiritual Body ; as if a Body of Flesh and a Spiritual could not stand together : This is his Great mistake . The Apostle could have born his Testimony to this Truth , that it is the Body of Flesh that shall be raised spiritual , 1 Cor. 15. 14 , 43. It is sown a natural Body , 't is raised spiritual , here the Apostle still keeps to the Word ( It ) &c. Answ. The Non-sense and Contradiction that may be gathered from these Passages , is , that Christ's Body is a Carnal Spiritual Body , as if Carnal and Spiritual were both one ; or that the Spiritual Body that 's raised or given to the Seed , is Carnal . Let these Passages be kept in Record , as the Baptists Doctrine and Testimony ; whereas the Apostle's own Testimony proves the Contrary , and that W. B. has belyed the Apostle : For 't is sown a natural Body , it is raised a spiritual ; and there is a Natural Body , and there is a Spiritual Body : Here the Apostle clearly makes a Distinction and a Difference between the natural Body and the spiritual ; He doth not say , 't is sown a natural Body , and raised a natural or Carnal Body also , but a spiritual Body ; as he also distinguisheth between the Bodies Celestial and the Bodies Terrestrial ; as those of Sun , Moon and Stars differ from those of Men , Beasts and Fishes : Now you would count him a very blind Philosopher , that should make no Difference , but say , they are all one and consistent , or that the Bodies of Sun , Moon and Stars , were all one with those Earthly Bodies of Men and other Creatures ; and so blind and such Ignorant Divines are these Baptist's . He understands not the Difference between the Natural Body and the Spiritual , any more then if a Person should be so ignorant as ( when he sees the Sun , or Moon , or Stars ) To ask , if these were not Men , or Birds , or Beasts , or Fishes , in the Firmament ; or on the contrary , if he should see Men , Beasts and Fishes , to ask , if these are not the Sun , Moon and Stars ; or rather to conclude that they are , because he knows not which are Celestial and which Teriestrial , no more then this Baptist doth discern between Bodies natural or carnal , and Bodies spiritual : But how should he do other , or see better while his Mind is so much upon Flesh , and so little upon Spirit ; or so much upon Flesh and Blood which cannot inherit the Kingdom of God , and so little upon that spiritual Birth or Seed that doth inherit the Kingdom of Glory and Peace . And as for the Baptists Argument , That the Apostle still keeps to the Word ( IT ) as , It is sown a natural Body , It is raised a spiritual ; or God giveth it a Body as it pleaseth him , and to every Seed his own Body . Reply . How evident is it , that as the Particle It is used as a Relative to both the natural and spiritual Body , 't is a mutable * It ; for that there is a natural Body and there is a spiritual Body , which therefore are not the self-same ; the very Parable or Instance of the Wheat and other Grain may confute his Opinion herein ? For is it the very self-same Grain of Wheat that is in the Eare that was sown in the Ground ? Let the Husband-Men judge him herein . To him we may say , as the Apostle did in the same Case to such , O Fool ! thou sowest not that Body that shall be , &c. 1 Cor. 15. And now the words , It 's sown , imply a Seed sown , in order to a sprouting and bringing forth Increase : Upon which it may be queried , if that Body of Man ( to wit ) that of Flesh , Blood and Bones , ( that 's laid in the Grave , or drowned in the Sea , or devoured by Fire , and some by Beast's , &c. ) be the Seed that the Apostle intended , to which God giveth a Body as it pleaseth him , yea , or nay ? If it be answered in the Affirmative , then what Body is it that God giveth to it , as it pleaseth him ? If it be answered in the Negative , that overthrows the Baptists Doctrine of the same Flesh , Blood , and Bones , &c. which W. B. has not distinguished from a spiritual Body . THE RESURRECTION , Future Glory and Felicity of the SAINTS , Further asserted ( according to the Holy Scriptures ) Discovering , How far short of the true Vision , Sight , or Revelation thereof our present Opposers are in their gross Thoughts and Traditional Conjectures : Being An Examination of Thomas Danson ' s Arguments and Doctrines ( about the Resurrection , Future State and Glory of Believers ) in his Synopsis . THe Resurrection as plentifully asserted in the Scriptures , is not in the least question'd by us ( however we be unjustly censur'd for denying it ) Therefore there is no necessity of his Argument to evince that , which ( as he saith ) the Scripture is so plentiful in asserting of ; nor doth he evince it according to the Scriptures , but varies from them , as will appear . His Argument , If the Bodies that have done Good or Evil , must receive their Reward accordingly ; then the same Bodies that dye must rise again : But the Antecedent is true ; therefore the Consequent . Answ. This Argument ( both Antecedent and Consequent ) appears neither clear , nor grounded upon Truth , as it placeth an Eternal Reward upon the Body for its temporal Acts , in putting the Body ( on this account ) for Man that hath acted therein , who must receive the things done in the Body , 2 Cor. 5. 10. The meer Terrestrial Body being neither the Subject reteining Perpetual Love or Enmity to God ; nor is it the Original Cause of Good or Evil Actions , therefore not the Object of eternal Love or Wrath ; but Man in his Spiritual Existence or Being , as spiritually and suitably organized ( as it pleaseth God ) to receive the things done in his Body , according to what he hath done , whether it be Good or Evil , proper and natural to the Image he bears , which the Soul carries along with it out of the Earthly Body or House that turns to Dust : But see the Proof of his Antecedent , That the Bodies , that have done Good or Evil , must receive their Reward accordingly ( which Proposition is the Antecedent ) is evident by 2 Cor. 5. 10. and then the Consequence is firm , &c. Rep. He hath manifestly perverted the Text ; it doth not say , The Bodies must receive their Reward accordingly ( though in some Sense it may be granted according to their temporal Actions ) But we must all appear before the Judgment-seat of Christ , that every one may receive the Things done IN his Body , according to that he hath done , whether it be Good or Bad , 2 Cor. 5. 10. And but a few words before he saith , We are co●…fident I say , and willing rather to be Absent from the Body , and to be Present with the Lord , ver . 8. Wherefore he knew that they were Capable both of a Being , and Reward with the Lord , when absent from the Body ; and that as when in the Body they had found Acceptance with him , they received the Deeds done in the Body when out of it ; to Dye being Gain unto them . Every man's Works shall follow him ; the Nature of them shall remain in him , whether it be Good or Evil , that he Lives and Dies in : The Soul spiritually hath its proper Organ , Vessel or Body , wherein either the Habit of Good or Evil , Holiness or Filthiness cleaves to it , and wherein accordingly it retains either Mercy or Wrath , Love or Hatred from God , when the earthly Mansion or House is destroyed & turned to Dust , as it was ; there being a House or Cloathing that cleaves more closely to the Soul then Dust can : and it will come to pass that he that will be filthy , must be filthy still ; and he that is Holy , let him be Holy still : Behold I come quickly , and my Reward is with me , to give every man according as his Work shall be , Rev. 22. 11 , 12. Rom 2. 6. And therefore Wo will be to their Souls who reward Evil to themselves , and whose Souls delight in their Abominations ; and Tribulation and Anguish upon every Soul of Man that doth Evil , of the Jew first , and also of the Gentile ; but Glory , Honour and Peace to every man that Worketh Good , to the Jew first , and also to the Gentile , Rom. 2. 8 , 9 , 10. But to procced to T. D's further Proof of his Antecedent and Consequent , which to Ordinary Readers ( he saith ) may seem inconsequent ( by which then he must be more then an ordinary Writer ) The Place he cites , is Mat. 22. 31 , 32. T. D. For the surther Proof of Antecedent and Consequent , I shall first explain the Terms of Christ's Argument , &c. The Place is , Mat. 22. 31 , 32. As touching their Resurrection from the Dead , have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God , saying , I am the God of Abraham , and the God of Isaac , and the God of Jacob ; God is not the God of the Dead , but of the Living : And it is added Luk. 20. 38. for all live unto him . This Passage he thus explains , viz. 1. To be a God to Abraham , notes a Covenant-Relation . Answ. True ; and then it follows , that they who are in this Covenant-Relation , are those that live to him , whom he is the God of ; Wheresore Abraham , Isaac & Jacob , and all Partakers of the same Covenant live unto God , in Union of Spirit , and with the Spirits of all Just Men , though in a more full injoyment of Glory hereafter ; as Abraham , &c. is not dead , because God is his God , and he in Possession of Eternal Glory . 2. Not the God of the Dead : He saith , that might be meant either of them who are Dead simply , or of them that are so dead as that they shall never return to Life ; not in the former Sense , therefore in the Latter . Are we therefore ( as by this ) to read the Words thus , viz. God is not the God of the Dead , that are so Dead as that they shall never return to Life ; but of the Dead that shall return to Life ? And then what are those Dead that shall never return to Life ; Or those Dead that God is not the God of , if the Living and Dead must all be applyed to the Outward or Earthly Bodies ? But had he been sensible of his Sense before , that to be a God to Abraham ( and so of the Living ) notes a Covenant-Relation , and that Christ speaks of such as shall be accounted worthy to obtain that World and the Resurrection , Luk. 20. 35. he might have understood that the Dead , whom he is not the God of , are such as are Strangers to that Covenant-Relation , and live not to God , however their Souls be Immortal . 3. But of the Living , that is ( saith he ) of them whom God intends to restore to Life , or whose Bodies live potentially ; not only of them whose Souls live actually ; for all Live to him , &c. If the Living must intend the terrestrial Bodies of Abraham , Isaac and Jacob , then that Denomination Living , is given to those that are truly Dead ( as he saith ) and then I ask , if it be good Doctrine , or proper to say , that all those dissolved Bodies do live unto God ? Whereas in Christ's words there is no mention of their Elementary Bodies , but that the Dead are raised , and that he is the God of Abraham , Isaac and Jacob ; and these were they that Lived unto him , who were counted worthy to obtain that World , and the Resurrection . And it is further evident , that when the Saducees ( who said , there is no Resurrection , Angel , nor Spirit ) asked Christ about the Wife , whose ( of the Seven ) She should be in the Resurrection ? their Thoughts were carnal , and upon the Carnal or Earthly Bodies , which Christ's Answer did not gratifie in his asserting the Resurrection ( as to the State of the Righteous after this Life ) He said , The Children of this World marry , and are given in Marriage ; But they which shall be counted worthy to obtain that World , and the Resurrection from the Dead , neither Marry , nor are given in Marriage : Neither can they dye any more ; for they are equal unto the Angels , and are the Children of God , being the Children of the Resurrection , Luk. 20. 35 , 36. 1. Note here first , That he speaks of a Resurrection-state in the World to come , wherein the Children of God so much excel in their Beings , as that they are equal unto the Angels , whose Bodies are not such as these Earthly ones of the Children of this World , wherein they Marry ; but in that World they are in another Capacity , more Sublime and Spiritual ; even Equal unto the Angels : whereby Christ doth not only assert the Resurrection and an Immortal State ; but also the Spirituality and Glory thereof far Transcending this earthly State and Body . 2. As thus considered , it is plainly implied that there are but some that are counted worthy to obtain that World and the Resurrection , that is , the Children of God , who live unto him ; as Paul saith , if by any means I might attain unto the Resurrection of the Dead , Phil. 3. 10 , 11. Now , therefore to apply this Resurrection to the Terrestrial Body of the Righteous , and hence to argue for Immortalizing that Dust , which that Body returns to ; it implieth thus much , that Only the Bodies of the Children of God ( who are counted worthy ) shall rise : and how agrees this with our Opposers Intention ? 3. Moreover , while Christ intended by his Answer , that those that were counted Worthy , &c. even the Children of God , and such as lived unto God , were the Children of the Resurrection ; and that they cannot dye any more , &c. This agrees with his Answer to Martha , Joh. 11. 24 , 25 , 26. I am the Resurrection , and the Life ; he that believeth in me , though he were dead , yet shall he Live ; and who soever liveth and believeth in me , shall never dye . Though this be a plain asserting of the Resurrection , yea , and that of the Dead ; yet it is as plain a Diversion ( as far remote ) from the carnal and gross Thoughts and Apprehension that the Jews in that Age had of the Resurrection , as his Answer to the Saducees was from their gross Thoughts about it . Concerning the Scope of these words of Christ before cited , He * saith , There are different Apprehensions ; Some conceive , that Christ hereby proves the Immortality of the Soul ( which the Saducees denyed , as appears Act. 23. 8. for if there be no Soul of a Spiritual Nature in Man , it must needs be Mortal , as his Body ) and by Consequence , the Resurrection of the Body . The Saducees denying the Resurrection of the Body , because they denied the Immortality of the Soul ( as these Interpreters conceive ) Others , that Christ intends only to prove the Resurrection of the Body : So Calvin . Others , that Christ intends both directly : So Beza Diodati . And from these Differences T. D. differently frames his Argument several times , p. 76. From hence it is observable , that this Man not seeing with his own Eyes , proceeds to argue doubtfully from the different Apprehensions and Conceptions of others , viz. Some Conceiving , 1. That Christ hereby proves the Immortality of the Soul , and by Consequence only the Resurrection of the Body . 2. Others , that Christ intends only to prove the Resurrection of the Body . 3. Others , that he intends both directly . See how these Learned Men and Students differ and oppose each other in their Apprehensions and Conceivings ; and what Certainty can we expect from T. D. their Schollar ? And how came he to undertake such a Controversie , about such a weighty and mysterious Point upon such dubious and uncertain Grounds , as only mens different Apprehensions , Conceivings and Consequences can produce or amount to ? ( which argues more Confidence then Knowledge in him ) And T. D. to vary his Arguments thereupon ( from his uncertain Conjectures and fallible Judgment ) as with him it is either thus , or else thus ; or more plainly , thus , &c. 1. They whos 's God , God is , shall rise from the Dead : God is Abraham's , Isaac's and Jacob's God ; Therefore they ( and all other Believers ) shall rise again . Or else thus : 2. They whos 's God , God is , after Death shall Rise again , &c. 3. Or the Argument , may be framed more plainly thus , viz. If God be under a Promise to Glorifie the Persons of Abraham , Isaac and Jacob , then their Bodies must rise again : but God is under such a Promise ; Ergo , pag. 77. Answ. 1. That God is the God of the Living , both of Abraham and all Believers . 2. They all live unto God in Righteousnes here , and Glory hereafter . 3. He that liveth and believeth in me ( saith Christ ) shall never dye . These prove the blessed Resurrection of the Children of God , who are Children of the Resurrection : But what Proof hath he produced herein of the self-same Earthly , numerical Body's rising ? His Assertion being the Resurrection of the Body in general ; his Proof is the Resurrection of those whom God is the God of , viz. Believers ; and that their Body must be glorified : which so far as Christ intends , is granted . That in the World to come they are equal unto the Angels , what is this to the Earthly , Elementary Bodies of all in general , which Angels do far surmount and transcend in Glory ? Neither hath he by all that he hath said , proved , that the Promise of Eternal Glory ( he mentions ) extends to the same Earthly Body of Flesh and Blood ( that now is ) after dissolved to Dust , or its first Elements ; or that it is capable of that Glory which is Eternal , though the Believer be as in his Spirituality , or spiritual Body glorified . Now , as touching the Promise of God to Abraham and his Seed , it was not only of a Temporal Inheritance or outward Canaan ; but also of an eternal Inheritance of Life and Glory , for the Injoyment whereof they had a two-fold Capacity , an Outward and an Inward , a Natural and a Spiritual ; and so far God was their God in each . But that the Eternal Glory was promised to the Terrestrial or Natural Body of Abraham , &c. T. D. ( though he runs on with it and takes it for granted ) doth meerly beg the Question , as if Abraham in his new Spiritual and Glorious State were but a Part of Abraham ; and consequently not fully Capable of absolute Felicity , without the Dust of his dissolved Cloathing being immortalized ( I understand not that they 'l admit of any new Creation of it , to make it a compleat Body , who are of the Anabaptist's mind ) And after the same manner he may as well say , that all the Saints , who are said to be in Glory , are not perfectly in Glory , but only in Part ; as but part of Abraham , part of Isaac , part of Jacob , part of Moses , part of Elias , part of Paul , &c. are in Heaven , in Glory , or in the Rest which is Glorious ( and so of all the other ( as if , when Moses and Elias appeared with Christ in the Mount to Peter , &c. it were not proper or true to say , Moses and Elias ; but Part of Moses & El●…as appeared : And what Bodies appeared they in ? were they Human , Earthly Bodies , or Angelical ? ) and by this , that they are not as yet absolutely Happy , or at Rest , without their little earthly Mansions or Tabernacles , when they must needs enjoy far better , viz. an Heavenly Cloathing and Mansion , or House Eternal in the Heavens ; being the more Spiritualized and changed into Spirituality , they are in a higher and more meet Capacity for that Enjoyment . T. D. 2. God were not fully Abraham's God , or did not fully make good his Promise , if he Glorified one Part of Abraham , and not another . Answ. God , in his Glorifying Abraham in a Spiritual Sate , and Body that transcends all Earthly Bodies , or that part ( as he calls it ) of Abraham , which is Spiritual , and therefore most capable of an Eternal Glory , he shews himself to be 〈◊〉 God , he being the God of the Spirits of all Flesh ( and most eminently of his Children ) and who hath all Souls in his Hand . But in Answer to what he saith hereafter , let us enquire , whether the Promise of God to Abraham and his S●…ed , of eternal Glory and Happiness , cannot be made good without the Earthly and perishing Organs . T. D. 3. Nor were the Promise , to Glorifie Abraham's Soul , made good , without glorifying his Body too ; for the Happiness of the Soul is not Perfect without the Body , its dear and beloved Companion ; the Soul having a strong Desire * and Inclination to a Re-union to the Body , as the Schools not without good Ground determine : vid. Calvin Harm . Evang. in Mat. 22. 31 , 32. Luk. 20. 38. Answ. It is evident that this Man doth give this account ( that the Happiness of the Soul is not perfect without the Body ) not from any spiritual Sight of the Souls Happiness or Glory ; for in Page 81. he confesseth , that the different Disposal of the Spirits of Man and Beast is not visible to the Eye of Sence , and but dimly to the Eye of Reason and Faith ; although he has taken upon him by Tradition from Calvin , &c. to assert , that the Happiness of the Soul is not perfect without the Body : It may be understood , that they have neither clear Reason , nor perfect Faith for this ; and to be sure , while he and others assert it without either , we have no Reason to believe them . But to answer him closely ; Both Calvin , T. D. the Schools , and divers Anabaptists are mistaken in this very Matter , and see not with the Eye of true Faith , either that the Happiness of the Soul is not perfect without the Body ; Or , that the Soul hath a strong Desire to a Re-union to the Body , ●…hile they intend the Terrestrial , Elementary Bodies : for this implies the Soul to be in a kind of Purgatory or Disquietness , till the supposed Resumption of the Body ; and their Assertion and Determination herein is Contraty to what the Apostle saith 2 Cor. 5. for we know , that if our earthly House of this Tabernacle were dissolved , we have a Building of God , an House not made with Hands , eternal in the Heavens , ver . 1. for we that are in this Tabernacle , do groan , being burdened , &c. ver . 4. We are confident , I say , and willing rather to be absent from the Body , and to be present with the Lord , ver . 8. And said he , I am in a Strait betwixt two , having a Desire to depart , &c. Phil. 1. 23. See now the Stress of the Controversie where it lieth , and that it is not only between these our Opposers & Us ; but also between them and the Apostle Paul : Thus ( viz. ) Calvin , the Schools , 〈◊〉 and Anabaptists determine and conclude , That the Happiness of the Soul is not perfect without the Body ; and that the Soul ( when separate ) hath a strong Desire and Inclination to a Re-union to the Body : But , The Apostle Paul , as knowing , that when their Earthly House was dissolved , they had a far better , namely a Building of God , Eternal in the Heavens ; Therefore , in the Earthly Tabernacle they gro●…ned , being burdened , as willing rather to be absent from the Body . By which it appears , they expected a more full Fruition or Felicity in the Heavenly Tabernacle , then in the Earthly : Their Soul did not desire after the Flesh , as these Opposers imply ; neither had they any such Delight therein , as fleshly Minds , and carnal Contenders have . Moreover , the Apostle from the Visions and Revelations of the Lord , saith , I knew a Man in Christ , above fourteen Years ago , whether IN the Body , or OUT of the Body , I cannot tell ; God knows : Such an one caught up to the third Heaven — caught up into Paradise , and heard upspeakable Words , &c. 2 Cor. 12. From hence consider , that being caught up to the 3d Heaven , into Paradise , he doth not place the Sight and Sence of this Condition upon the Body ; for that he knew not whether he was In the Body , or Out of the Body , yet knew , that he was a Man in Christ , and in the Revelation of the Lord : But he did not concern himself about this Earthly Body being so glorified in Heaven or Paradise , as these Men do , and carnally think , who have neither Visions nor Revelations of the Lord concerning any such State , but Calvin and the Schoolmens Determination , contrary to the Apostles . But the presumptuous Confidence of our Opposers appears the more , in undertaking to assert or demonstrate the future State of the Soul , as not being in perfect Happiness without the Body , and as having a strong Desire after it , while yet they neither know the State of the Soul , nor have had so much as a Vision of the Glory thereof , or of the glorified spiritual State of the Saints hereafter ; for Visions and Revelations they deem to be ceased long since ; and a Disposal of the Spirits of men after Death is not visible to the Eye of Sence , and , he saith , but dimly to the Eye of Reason and Faith : However , while these Men cannot but appear themselves so Dim in these Sublime Matters ; and that , while their dim Reason cannot reach them , they cannot demonstrate to others , either that the Souls of the Just in Heaven are not yet perfectly Happy , or that they have such a strong Desire to a Re-union with the Body dissolved , the shew themselves imaginary Intruders , puft up in their fleshly Minds , exercising themselves in things too high for them ; and it were better for them to sit down in Silence , and wait in the Light to have some Sence and Knowledge of the true immortal Life , to quicken them to God ; and not thus to busie themselves with unprofitable Talk , brought forth from Imaginations of men , and not from any true Sight or Revelation of the Conditions of Saints , either here or hereafter . His telling of Abraham's Soul living actually , is true ; and as true it is , That his Soul is in perfect Felicity and Glory , and the more , being out of the Earthly Tabernacle . But his saying , that the Body of Abraham ( or Bodies of the deceased Believers ) liveth potentially ; for this we have his own Traditional Assertion , but not any Scripture-Proof or Phrase that suits it , nor rational Demonstration for it . As to his saying , That if any shall say , that Christ's Argument , and his Application of it , proves but the Resurrection of the Good , &c. I say , his Application thereof seems but to extend to the Good , as in his saying , They whose God , God is , shall rise ; yet he hath not proved the Rising of their Earthly Bodies , after they are dissolv'd to Dust , and reduc'd to their first Elements ; but that there is a Resurrection of the Good ; and who of us questions that ? The Resurrection of the Good or of the Just , being Glorious , and extending not only to Arising out of the Fall , out of Death that came by it , out of the Grave of Corruption , which hath followed , yea , out of the Dust of that Earth , and out of all Afflictions here ; but also unto an Inheritance of Eternal Glory hereafter ; as , They that be Wise shall shine as the Brightness of the Firmament ; and they that turn many to Righteousness , as the Stars forever and ever : So that they shall be so Celestial and Glorious , as that they shall incomparably excell these Terrestrial Bodies . And therefore where it is said , That the Saducees and Quakers Proposition be , that there is no Resurrection from the Dead ; This is a Falshood against the Quakers ; and their Sufferings testifie the Contrary : If a Man should say , that the Wheat or other Grain in the Eare , is not the self-same that was sown in the Earth ; doth it therefore follow , that he denies the Arising of Wheat , or any Grain at all ? Or that , when the Apostle in Answer to the Question , that some foolishly put , said , Thou Fool , thou sowest not that Body which shall be ; doth it therefore follow that his Proposition was that there is No Resurrection from the Dead ? And whereas T. D. upon Eccles. 3. 19 , 20 , 21. confesseth , That Men are said to be Beasts in respect to the Mortality of the Body , which being composed of the same Materials with brute Beasts , &c. By this the Reader may observe what kind of Body these men are contending for , and without which they reckon the Souls are not perfectly Happy ; and which they say , The Soul hath a strong Desire to a Re-union with : And with what ? but with the self-same Body , which is composed of the same Materials with brute Beasts . What! Cannot the Soul be ●…erfectly Happy without this ? O the gross Conceits of these Men ! And what do they place their chief Happiness & Glory in ? but in such a perishing Body , as is composed of the same Materials with brute Beasts , which being Dust , returns to the Earth as it was , and the Spirit unto God who gave it , Eccles. 12. 7. ( as he saith true ) to be disposed of as Justice or Mercy shall see meet . But where he saith , As for Ver. 21. If they be the Atheists words personated by Solomon , they note the Reason of his Opinion , &c. herein he appears doubtful , whether they be the Atheist's words , or Solomon's ; for he dubiously varies again , and saith , If they be Solomon ' s own words , &c. Judge Reader ; Is this man fit to discourse of the future States of Men or Saints in Glory , who ( when Solomon speaks of the Spirit of Man that goeth upwards ) knows not , whether he personates the 〈◊〉 's words ; or his own ? Whenas he further saith , The Spirit shall return unto God who gave it , chap. 12. 7. which is implied in his saying , The Spirit of a Man goeth upward : But for Men to follow their own Imaginations , and Traditions of others , concerning the future State of Man , which they have no spiritual Sight of ; as also to determine , that the Soul ( a●…ter Man's Decease ) hath such a strong Desire after the Terrestrial or Carnal Body , that it is not perfectly happy without it , this ( while they have neither Truth nor Reason to demonstrate it ) doth really tend to open a Gap to Atheism , and to make People Atheists , who are not come to know an Immortal Principle in themselves to depend upon , whereby the true Knowledge of Life and Immortality is to be revealed , without which men are 〈◊〉 in their Knowledge , as this man grants ; the Difference bet●…ixt Man and Beast as to their future State , not being visible to the Eye of Sence , as their Agreement in Dissolution is , therefore the Difference is only truly to be seen by a Spiritual Eye , opened by the Divine Light , whereby the Spiritual and Immortal State of Man is seen , and the Glory of the Righteous beheld in the Everlasting Kingdom of God , which Flesh and Blood cannot inherit ; neither can the Carnal Eye see the invisible God : And I must conclude , that while T. D. from 1 Cor. 15. affirms , the whole drift of the Apostle in a great part of the Chapter is , to shew that the same Body shall rise , &c. he doth but herein impose and beg the Question ; and I cannot at all gra●…t him his Assertion to be true , while the Apostle plainly distinguisheth between the first Adam and the Second , the Earthly and the ●…eavenly ; The Natural Body , and the Spiritual , the Celestial and the Terrestrial ; and saith , Thou ●…ool , Thou sowest not that Body that shall be ; and Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. How plainly do these Passages contradict our Opposers ? As also is it not evident that the Man opposeth himself , in granting , That the Body shall rise with so differing Qualities , that it shall be as unlike to what it was before as the standing Corn to the Seed put into the Earth , or as one S●…ar is to another in Brightness and Lustre ; how shall it then be the self-same Terrestrial Body ? For first , Is the st●…nding Corn the self-same Seed that is put into the Earth ? Secondly , Are the Bodies Celestial ( as those of Sun , Moon and Stars ) one and the same with Terrestrial Bodies , as those of Men , Beasts and Fishes ? Verily I find nothing in this Man's Work about this Subject that has any real Weight in it ; and what he hath said of any seeming Stress , it is answered here , and in my Answer to the rest . I desire the Lord may open all their Understandings , and so quicken their spiritual Sences , as that their Minds may be truly spiritualized , that they may be more upon Spirit , and less upon the Flesh , so as to be mor●…ified unto the Flesh , that they may know a Life in the Spirit , wherein they may live unto God in Righteousness here , and Glory herea●…ter ; to set down with 〈◊〉 , Isaac and Jacob , in the Kingdom of God. Finally , in these two Questions much of the Controversie is res●…lved about the ●…uture Rew●…rds of ●…ouls , or of Men after Dissolution , viz. 1. Whether the Righteous ●…e capable of perfect Happiness , or the full Frustion of the 〈◊〉 Rest , when separate from the Earthly 〈◊〉 or Terrestrial Body ; Ye●… , or Na●… ? This may be considered and resolved in this Question , viz. Whether the Angels of God in Heaven ( unto which the Children of God and the Resurrection are equal ) are in perfect Felicity and Glory , who do not exist in Terresirial Bodies , or whose Organs or Cloathing is not Earthly , but Heavenly ? 2. Whether the Wicked be capable of absolute Misery when separate from the Earthly Tabernacle ; Yea , or Nay ? Which on the other hand by the like Reason may be considered and resolved in this Question , viz. Whether the Devil and his Angels be not capable of Everlasting Fire , prepared for them without Terrestrial Bodies ? And then , Whether the cursed Workers of Iniquity ( who live and dye in Sin ) are not to be sentenced into the same Everlasting Fir●… ? But , If it be supposed that the Wicked cannot be absolutely miserable without their Earthly and Elementary Body or Outside ; and therefore they must have it again , to aggravate their Torment : Doth not this then suppose , that their Torment must be Worse then that of Devils , that have not such Bodies supposed to aggravate their Torment ? Howbe●…t though the Judgment of the Wicked be many times figuratively expressed , and set out in Scripture by Parables and Similes ; yet still there is a Reality of Judgment and Torment therein signified in apt Resemblances obvious to the Sences ; as Tophet is ordained of old ; yea , for the King it is prepared , he hath made it deep and large ; the Pile thereof is Fire and much Wood ; the Breath of the Lord like a Stream of Brimstone doth kindle it , Isa. 30. 33. and , Bind him Hand and Foot , and cast him into ulter Darkness ; there shall be Weeping and Gna●…hing of Teeth , Mat. 22. 13. As also , If thy right Eye , Hand or Foot offend , pluck it out , or cut it off , and cast it from thee , as being better that one Member should perish , then the whole Body should be cast into Hell ; where the Worm dyeth not , and the Fire shall never be quenched , Mat. 〈◊〉 . 29. Mark. 9. 49. to the end . Which still argues , that the Impenitent and Wicked are liable to meet with real ●…orment ; and that he hath spiritually his proper Being and Habit consisting of such spiritual Parts and Sences ( having an evil Eye , a polluted Mind , and defiled Conscience , covered with Guilt , pressed down with the Body of Sin , and perplexed with Horror ) wherein he both receiveth the Deeds 〈◊〉 in the Body , and is capable of absolute Misery in the Fire which shall never be quenched , where the Worm dyeth not . As also it is said , The Rich Man also dyed and was buried ; and in Hell he lift up his Eyes , being in Torments , and seeth Abraham afar off , and Lazarus in his Bosom ; and he cried & said , Father Abraham , have Mercy on me , and send Lazarus , that he may , dip the Tip of his Finger in Water , and cool my Tongue ; for I am tormented in this Flame , Luk. 16. 23 , 24. When his Body was buried , yet he had the Sence of Torments that seized upon him ; and a Sight of the other's Felicity which he himself had lost : Therefore as Christ said , I say unto you , my Friends , be not afraid of them that can kill the Body , and after that have no more that they can do , but I will fore-warn you whom ye shall fear , fear him , which after he hath killed , hath Power to cast into Hell ; I say unto you , fear him , Luk. 12. 4 , 5. A Summary of the Difficulties , in the Point in Controversie . FInally , The Controversie is run up to these Difficulties , which I object upon our Opposers Doctrines and Conceptions : 1st , How the self same Bodies should arise compleat after dissolved to Dust , without a New Creation , appears not , nor is it demonstrated by them . 2. If a New Creation of compleat Bodies of the same Dust and Elements should be conceived or admitted , it is Incredible , that God should create any corrupt , sinful or polluted Bodies thereof for perpetual Torments , seeing his Works are pure ; And as Incredible , that he should make a pure Body to be invested with the former Evil Habit of Sin and Corruption , for perpetual Torment in Hell-Fire ; and to be sure , the first Elements or Dust of dissolved ●…odies is as pure as at the first . 3. If Infants be supposed to arise at the Stature of Men , how can theirs be the self-same Bodies they were ? 4. How the Body of the Saints , and Children of the Resurrection , should be either a Celestial , Spiritual , Glorious ; or Angelical Body , and they Equal unto the Angels in Heaven ; and yet the self-same Earthly , Elementary Body that dissolveth to Dust , &c. such a strange Transubstantiation appears not , unless that the Natural Body and the Spiritual , the Terrestrial and the Celestial , the Human and Angelical be both One and the Self-same . 5. That the Soul should not enjoy her self in absolute Felicity or Misery , in perfect Glory or Contempt ( in her proper Vessel or Cloathing spiritually ) without the Earthly Cloathing , which is Dust , appears not , while the Children of the Resurrection are equal unto the Angels of God in Heaven , which are absolutely Happy ; and the Devil and his Angels absolutely Miserable . 6. We cannot believe that the Invisible , Infinite God should be seen with the Bodily or fleshly Eyes , after Dissolution ; not that Job intended he should see God with his Flesh or bodily Eyes ; It being in consistent both with his being an Invisible . Eternal or Infinite Spirit , and with the true spiritual Sight of him which Job received , Job 42. 5. 7. That the Seed to which God giveth a Body as it pleaseth him , 1 Cor. 15. and the Body given to it , should be one and the self same Earthly Body , is a non-sensical Doctrine , and an apparent Incongruity . 8. That the Terrestrial Bodies should be so desirable to the Souls of the Righteous after Dissolution ( for the compleating their Felicity , and perfecting their Glory ) appears plainly inconsistent with their desiring here , to be dissolved and to be absent from the Body , to enjoy and possess a Building of God , au House eternal in the Heavens . Or that the Souls of the Righteous should be so variable , as to desire to be absent from the Body , and presently after Dissolution to desire the Resuming of the same Earthly Body , or a Re-union to it : This implicitely accuseth the Souls of deceased Saints , with being in their Affections both Earthly , Variable and Unquiet , as in a kind of Purgatory : Which we can never assent to . Thomas Vincent's Illustrations ABOUT THE RESURRECTION , Which we may look upon as the Sense of the Rest , and as the Explication of their Doctrines and Opinions , who are Opposing the Spirituality of our Testimony about the Resurrection . [ Among which some Truths are intermixt , though his gross and carnal Conceptions about the Point we cannot close with . ] His Illustrations are in his Book , entituled , Christ's Certain and Suddain Appearance to Judgment . Collected and Placed in his own Words , as followeth [ for the Serious and Spiritual-minded Readers to judge of . ] T. V. GIve me leave to illustrate the Resurrection a little further ; and here I shall endeavour to set it forth by an Allusion to that notable place , Ezek. 37. and ten first Verses , pag. 16. some thing like this will the Resurrection be at the Last Day . Now the Bones and Bodies of all former Generations are scattered up and down in the Valley of the Shadow of Death ; some are sunk into the Deep , others are buried in the Earth ; the Flesh is consumed and resolved into its first Elements ; and the Bones of some remain , of others are mouldred into Earth : Now when the Lord Jesus Christ , the Son of God , shall come down from Mount Sion , which is above , into the Valley of this inferiour World , he will Prophesie over all the Bodies and Bones of all the Children of Men that are dead , and speak unto them to Live ; he will say unto them whilft they lie rotting in their Graves , Live ; he will say , Awake ye that sleep in the Dust : And Oh , what a Noise and Shaking will there be then in the Ground ? What a clattering of Bones together in the coming of Bone to his Bone ? If the Body hath been quartered and buried , part in one place and part in another ( as the Levite's Concubine , who was divided into Twelve Parts , and sent to the Twelve Tribes of Israel , and it is likely buried in twelve distinct places ) the Bones will fly through the Air out of all those places , and meet together in one Body : Oh! what a great part of the Air , Water , and Earth will there run into Conjunction , by the Command of Christ , and be turned into those very Bodies which were resolved into them by Death , and the Corruption of the Pit ? But with the Addition of such new Qualities as shall sublimate , spiritualize , * and refine them from all that Dreggishness , and ill humour that shall be the Foundation of any Sickness or Death forever , then the Bones will come together , & be made like Stones for Strength ; then the Sinnews will be , as it were , Iron Sinnews , and the Flesh , Brass * such Strength will be put into them , as I conceive , is not to be found in the strongest Creatures which hitherto God hath made , that they might be fitted , the Bodies of the Righteous for an Eternal Life of Happiness , and bearing the Glory of Heaven ; The Bodies of the Wicked for an Eternal Life of Misery , and bearing the Torments of Hell , pag. 17 , 18. But , what a Stirring will there be in the Earth ? Those which are alive , will wonder to see such a strange Metamorph●… of the Ground , to seel Men and Women stirring and moving under their Feet , arising and crouding for Room amongst them ? Then will the Lord bring down all the Souls of the Righteous which have been in Paradise with him many Years , and they shall find out their own Bodies : And he will open the Prison of Hell , and let out the Souls of the Wicked for a while , that they also may find out their own Bodies , pag. 19. The Book of God's Remembrance will be opened ; This we are to understand in a Spiritual Sense , not * as if there were a real Book , which God did make use of for his Remembrance of things , as Men do who have Frail and Weak Memories , pag. 22. The Spirits of all the just Men and Women made persect , shall then come down , and enter again into their Old Habitations * pag. 31. when the Soul left the Body vile to putrifie and corrupt in the Grave , and shall finde it come forth more Bright and Glorious then Gold * after it hath been resined in a Furnace . If the Love between the Soul and the Body were so great , when the Body was so vile , and the Soul so Sinful ; what will it be when both are glorified ? If the Conjunction between the Soul and Body were so sweet when the Body was so Frail and subject to Death , and the Soul a Spiritual and Never-dying Subscance , what will it be when the Body shall be made immortal and in some sort spiritual * pag. 32. No sooner are they awakened , and risen out of their Graves , but they are entertained by Angels , those Holy and Excellent Creatures , when before in the Body they were too low , and unfit for their Acquaintance ; but they will then know them , and be able to discern the Beauty of those lovely Spirits , pag. 33. They will arise like so many shining Suns * out of the Earth , pag. 34. They admired to see the Saints , and to see themselves so transformed , pag. 36. He will bring the Keys of Death and Hell along with him , and open both these Prison Doors , not to give Liberty and Release to the Prisoners : But as prisons are opened at Assizes , to bring them sorth unto Judgment * he will open the Prison of Hell and all the Souls of the Wicked shall come forth like so many 〈◊〉 cut of the bottomless Fit , and he will open the Prison of the Grave , and all their Bodies shall creep Like so many ugly Toads out of the Earth , and then Soul and Body shall be joyned together again ; and this Meeting will be sad beyond Expression : Then the Meeting of the Souls and Bodies of the Wicked will be dolesul , pag. 46 , 47. It is said that the vile Bodies of the Righteous shall be made like unto Christ's Body in Beauty and Glory * but the Bodies of the Wicked will have another Hew and Fashion ; if it were possible to fashion Bodies like Devils , those impure and foul Spirits , such spiritual Bodies the Wicked should have : Be sure their Bodies shall have no Glory put upon them ; but as they lay down Vile Bodies , they shall rise up far more Vile * — The Bodies of the Wicked most probably will be Swarthy , Black , Ugly , Monstrous Bodies , p. 48. — The Blackness and Dread of the Soul would quickly appear in their Countenance ; besides the Impressions which the Fire of Hell will have upon them — & if the Body be black , how black will the Soul be , after so long abode with foul Devils in the lower Regions of Darkness ? And when such foul Souls and such vile Bodies meet , what a Meeting ! what a Greeting will there be ! We may fancy a kind of Language to be between them at that Day ; The Soul to the Body , Come out of thy Hole , thou filthy Dunghil , Flesh ; for the Pampering and Pleasing of whom , I have lost my self forever ; who hast stolen away my Time , and Thoughts and Heart from God , and Christ , and Heavenly Things , to feed , and cloathe , and cherish thee , and make Provision to satisfie thy base deceitful Lusts , when I should have been making Provision for thine and mine Everlasting Happiness . Awake , and come forth of the Dust , thou Bewitching Dirty Flesh , who didst lull me asleep so long in thy pleasing Chains , until thou didst suddenly open thy Doors , and thrust me out , where I was awakened in Torments before I was aware ; Now I must come into thy Doors again , that thou mayst share and taste the Bitter Issue of sinful Pleasures and Delights : And , O how will the Body be affrighted , so soon as the Soul is entered , p. 49. — The Body to the Soul , And hast thou found me out , O my Enemy ? Couldst not thou have let me alone , to lie still at rest in this sweet Sleep ? Hast thou used me as a Slave , and employed all my Members as Servants of Iniquity and Unrighteousness , and 〈◊〉 thou come now to Torment me ? and is this the Fruit of all the Pleasures we have taken together ? Shouldst not thou have been more VVise , and provided better for thy self and me . ? O! what Cryes and Shreeks will the Tongue give forth , so soon as it hath recovered its Use ? p. 50. 2. The second Antecedent to the Judgment of the Wicked , will be their Meeting with Devils — to entertain them at their Resurrection ; and then they will not appear unto them like Angels of Light , as sometimes here they have done , p. 50. — but they will spit forth their Venom and Malice then in their Faces ; possibly they may buffet their Bodies , and lay painful Stroaks upon them : surely they will terrifie their Souls for those Sins they have drawn them unto the Commission of p. 51. — How will they be affrighted at the Apparition of * so many Devils about them ? — when they shall lash their Spirits with Horrible Scourges , when they shall seize upon their Bodies , and Tear them and Drag●… them to the Judgment Seat , and there is none to Rescue and Deliver them 3. The Third Antecedent to the Judgment of the Wicked will be their Meeting one with another — O what an innumerable Company of Rebels , and Traytors , and Villains will then be got together ? How fiercerly and horribly will they look one upon another ? And if they speak , what Language of Hell will there issue forth of their Lips ? They may meet with their old Companions and Fellow-Sinners ; but it will not be like such as they now call Meetings of Good Fellowship , when they get together in a Tavern , & Ale-house , or someHouse of Wickedness , to Drink , and Sing , and Daunce and Sin , and make Merry in the pleasing of their Flesh ; they shall not then have Ale , and Wine , and Women , and Musick , or any Incentives to Mirth and tensual Pleasures — O the Angry Countenances the Wicked will have on that Day ! — O the Angry Speeches ! How will they Rage and Storm at one another , p. 52. — O the Horrible Noise that will be amongst the Damned Crew , when they are got together ! It may be from Words they fall to Blows , and Tear one anothers Hair , and Spurn at one anothers Bellies , and Bite one anothers Flesh , and even Claw out one anothers Eyes * we cannot conjecture so much of the Misery of the VVicked , as will be on that Day , p. 53. — Friends will be together at that Day as at other times ; Some will be in Churches together , it may be Ministers preaching , and People hearing , as you are hearing me this Day : Suppose that the Heavens should just now open , and you should hear the Sound of the last Trumpet , then all you that are Believers , would immediately be caught up into the Clouds ; but all you that are Impenitent and Unbelievers , would be left behind : VVhat Terror would fall upon you , to see us caught away from you ? * It may be some of you might come hanging about me and others , when you see us arrayed in shining Garments ; O take us up along with you ! VVhat , will you leave us behind ? Alas ! what can I do for you then ? p. 54. — I came with Oyle often to Sell * from my Lord and Master ; and you might have had it for nothing ; you might have bought it without Money * and without Price ; but then you ●…leighted and refused all Proffers of Grace which were made , p. 56. Alas●… VVhy do you hang about me with Tears and VVeeping ? VVhat can I do for you now ? Can I carry you all up with me in my Arms ? If all of us together could hand and help some of you up into the Air with us , and bring you into the Presence of our Dear and Glorious Redeemer , with what Confidence could you stand before him ? with what Face could you look upon him , when you are so Black and Filthy ? VVould not your Looks betray you to be none of our Number ? Would not your black and Trembling Joynts speak what you are ? — Could we carry you up with us ? If you should lay hold on us , would not the Angels snatch us out of your Arms ? or would not Devils tear you away from us ? pag. 58. — The Saints are all risen , and have put on their Glorious Attire , and we are called for : It is your own Faults * that you did not help to fill up this Number , p. 59 — The whole Innumerable Company of Saints shall attend Christ in white shining Garments , with Bodies like unto Christ , more Beautiful and Glorious then the most spendid Attire can make them , pag. 66. — The Accusers of , and Witnesses against the Wicked , they will be , 1. God. 2. Men. 3. Devils . 4. Themselves . First , God's Justice will arraign the Wicked before the Judgment-Seat of Christ , p. 78. — 2. God's Goodness , and Bounty and Patience will accuse them — 3. God's Omniscience will be a Wit●… ness against the VVicked at the Day of Judgment , pag. 79. — 1. Ministers will be the Accusers and VVitnesses against the VVicked , p 80. — 2. The Godly Friends of the VVicked will be their Accusers , and VVitnesses against them — 1. The Believing Husband will then accuse and witness against his Unbelieving VVife , pag 83. — 2. The Believing Wife will then accuse her Unbelieving Hu●…band , p. 84. — 3. Believing Parents will VVitness against their Ungodly Children , p. 85. — 2. The Ungodly Friends and Companions of the VVicked will at that Day be their Accusers , and witness against them — 3. Devils will be the Accusers and VVitnesses against the VVicked , p. 86. — 4. The VVicked will be accused by themselves , their own Thoughts shall accuse them in the Day when God shall judge the Secrets of Men by Jesus Christ ; their own Consciences will accuse them , and be as a Thousand Witnesses against them : They will find all their Sins registered in that Book ; and that Book will then be opened ; and they will not be able to deny one word of what they shall find there recorded — Concerning the Conviction — Suppose that this very Day were the Day of Judgment , and in this very Church were the Judgment-Seat ; that here were a great white Throne , and the Lord Jesus Christ sitting upon it in his Glory , with Millions of Holy Angels about him , and all the Saints in white at his Right Hand ; and on his Left , all the VVicked gathered together into one Body , as it will be at the Last Day ; And the Judge should cry with a loud Voice , Bring the Prisoners to the Bar , Bring the Sinners to Judgment , p. 87. and so summon and convict particular Sinners ; 1. Come forth all ye Ignorant Persons , who have not known the Father , nor me , nor the Mysteries of Salvation ; who lived in Darkness , and loved Darkness , and hated the Light , le●…t your Deeds should hereby have been reproved — had you an Ear , and yet not hear , so as to learn ? Had you an Eye , and yet not see , so as to understand ? And if you were Naturally Blind , had not I Eye-salve ? Could not I have opened your Eyes ? was I not willing * ? Did I not stand in the Gates to call upon you ? How long ye Simple Ones will you love Simplicity , and Fools ha●…e Knowledge ? Turn unto me , and I will pour out my Spirit upon you , and make known my VVords unto you ? Have you neglected me through Ignorance ? Is not your Fault double , because you have neglected Knowledge too ? Did not you hate Knowledge , and therefore disregard●… ? Did not you love Sin , and therefore shunned the Light * which would have discovered it , and disturbed you in your wicked Courses ? Have you liked Darkness so well ? and is it not 〈◊〉 then that you should go to the Place where there is Blackness of Darkness forever ? TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . 2. Come forth all ye Sloathful & Unprofitable Persons ; Had not ye Talents committed to you for my Use and Service ? and what have ye done with them ? did you bury them in the Earth , * p. 88. 89. Did not Hell gape for you long ago , and Devils long for this time , when you should be delivered into their Powers ? TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . 3. Come forth all that have neglected Family-VVorship , and never sought after God in your closets , p. 90. If you had not Ability to Pray at first with others , might not you have attained it , had you used to Pray by your selves : VVas it Curiosity and Elegancy of VVords , that God so much looked for ? Would not Sighs and Groans have been understood ? p. 91. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . 4. Come forth all ye Sabbath-Breakers , you that have spent the Day in Sleeping , in Eating and Drinking to Excess , who instead of Holy Meditations have been thinking and contriving your worldly Business , instead of Religious Conferences , p. 93. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . 5. Come forth all ye Swearers , and Prophaners of the Name of God , p. 94. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 6. Come forth all ye Scoffers at Religion , and the zealous Professors thereof , pag. 95. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 7. Come forth all ye Persecutors of my Disciples , pag. 96. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 8. Come forth all ye Intemperate and Liscentious Persons , p. 97. Come forth all ye 〈◊〉 , pag. 98. Come forth ye Drunkards , pag. 99. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 9. Come forth all ye Adulterers : Come forth all Covetous Persons whose Treasure and Heart , and Hope , and Confidence hath been in Earthly things , who have made the VVorld your God , p. 100. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 10. Come forth all ye Unmerciful Persons , p. 101. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 11. Come forth all ye Unrighteous Persons , who have wronged Widdows and Orphants ; who have over-reached your Neighbours in your Dealings ; who have heaped an Estate together by Unrighteous Practices , who have squeezed and oppressed the Poor , * TAKE THEM DLVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . 12. Come forth ye Lyars ; you who have taught and accustomed your selves to this Sin , pag. 103. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . — 13. Come forth all ye Slanderers and Backbiters , p. 104. TAKE THEM DEVILS , BIND THEM HAND AND FOOT . 14. Come forth all ye Proud and Ambitious Persons , pag. 105. Take them Devils , Bind them Hand and Foot. — 15. Come forth all ye Envious and Malicious Persons , p. 106. Take them Devils . — 16. Come forth all ye Wrathful and Contentious Persons ; Take them Devils . — 17. Come forth all ye Civil and Moral * Persons , p. 108. Take them Devils . — 18. Come forth all ye Hypocrites , p. 110. Take them Devils . 19. Come forth all ye Backsliders and Apostates from me and my Wayes ; You that turned back to Wayes of Prophaneness , and open Wickedness , after some time of Profession , p. 111. Take them Devils . — 20. Come forth all ye Impenitent Persons and Unbelievers , p. 114. Take them Devils , pag. 115. — And when the Sentence is pronounced by the Judge upon the Wicked , O what direful Shreeks will they give forth With what Horror will they cry out , How shall we be able to endure the Devouring Flames , and Everlasting Burnings of Hell ? p. 117. The Torment of the Bodies of the VVicked will be dreadful , through the Sence of the Fire which will be kindled about them , and burn more horribly then London's Fire did , when it had got into the Heart of the City : Their Torment will be greater then if scalding Lead ( p. 135. ) were poured into their Bowels ; then if they were torn in pieces with wild Horses ; then if their Breasts were rip●…up , and their Hearts were pluckt out with Burning Pincers ; it will be worse then if they were cast into a Caldron of Boiling Pitch or Lead ; or put into Phalaris Bull , or Nebuchadnezar's Fiery Furnace , p. 136. and every Member of the Bodies of the Wicked will be Tormented : O how will their Eyes glaze ? their Tongues roar ? * their Hands and Feet fry ? their Flesh roast ? No Part will be free from the Devouring Flames of this Horrible Burning Fire , p. 137. Something for the SPIRITUALITY OF THE RESURRECTION , Being some Passages touching the NATURE of the BODY OF CHRIST After his RESURRECTION and ASCENSION ; ( Whose Glorious Body ours shall Resemble . ) Out of H. Moor's Search into the Nature of a Glorified Body , Apol. Chap. 3. ( pag. 494. of his Modest Enquiry into the Mystery of Iniquity . ) The CONTENTS . That it is a Heavenly Body of an Angelical Property , a Spiritual Body , a Celestial Body : That the Heavenliness of the Glorified Body imports the Brightness and Splendor thereof : That the Lucidity of these Bodies is also testified by Ancient Fathers : he forbears to affirm it to consist of Terrestrial Flesh and Bones ; but admits of Celestial and Spiritual Flesh and Bones , confessing to Paul's Enarration of the Mystery of the Resurrection , 1 Cor. 15. IN his Answer touching the Lucidity of Christ's Body after his Ascension , he saith , The Soul may even enjoy her self , out of her Terrestrial Body . That the Glorified Body is Organized , which he calleth Organized Light. That if the Objecter understand Terrestrial Flesh and Bones , is it a Fault to deny it ? That the Body of Christ in Heaven is not Terrestrial Flesh and Bones , but of a more refined Nature ; for the Apostle saith expresly , That Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God , 1 Cor. 15. 50. That according to Testimony in Scripture . we shall find , that a Glorified Body , or that Body wherewith they shall be rewarded , who shall attain to that blessed Resurrection , which is the most precious Hope of all true Christians , may be dignified with these three Titles , Angelical , Spiritual , and Celestial : It is an Angelical Body , because the Sons of the Resurrection are said to be in every actual Respect , that tends to any real Perfection or Happiness , equal unto Angels , Luk●… 20. 36. ( viz. ) not only in that thing of Immortality , but the Sons of the Resurrection are absolutely in all such actual Respects ( as above intimated ) equal to the Angels : nor can the Condition of the Bodies be left out as touching the Nature and Glory of them ; but a Son of the Resurrection , and an Angel must be in every such Regard all one ; our Saviour seems plainly to assert so much . That those that are once the Sons of the Resurrection , plainly become Angels thereby — for they were Sons of God in a moral or spiritual Sense before . It will conduce something to the better understanding of the Nature of a Glorified Body , if we make search into Scripture , what the Nature of the Angelical Bodies is ; it is said , Psal. 104. Who maketh his 〈◊〉 Spirus , and 〈◊〉 Ministers a Flame of Fire : Upon which Text Grot●…s doth freely and truly ( I think ) not unscilfuly comment after this manner , Esse Angelis corpora , sed subtilissima , non Pythagorae tantum & Platonis schola sensit , sed & Judaei & veteres Christians , &c. That the Fathers were of this Opinion , Agrippa in his Occulta Philosophia hath also noted . That there are many Instances how Igneous and Lucid they , namely , the Bodies of the Angels , are , with which the best of them are invested , as truly that of Exod. 3. 2. Acts 7. 30. which answers well to that of Hebr. 1. 7. The Bodies of the more Glorious Angels are Igneous and Lacid . That also is a remarkable Example of the Lucidity of the Bodies of Angels , which we have Acts 12. where , while Peter was sleeping betwixt two Souldiers in the Prison , bound in Chains , the Angel of the Lord is said to come upon him , and a Light to shine in the Prison , &c. I will add one Instance more , which is , Dan. 10. 5. where the Angel that instructed Daniel , is thus described ; Then I lifted up mine Eyes , and looked , and behold a certain Man cloathed in Linnen , whose Loins were girded with fine Gold of Ophaz ; his Body was also like Beryl , and his Face as the Appearance of Lightening , and his Eyes as Lamps of Fire , &c. This Appearance certainly of this Angelical Shape is Fiery , Lucid and Glorious : It is manifest that they are very Luminous and Glorious . Whoever is invested with such a Body , as is reserved for the Sons of the Resurrection , will be , if he please to shew himself thus Lucid and Glorious ; of which I shall want no more Examples then that one of our Saviour Christ's Body ; for all ours , at the Resurrection , are to be made like to his Glorious Body ; and how Lucid and Angelical his Body was after his Ascension into Heaven , may appear from Apocal. 1. 13. where one like unto the Son of Man , is said to be cloathed with a Garment down to the Foot , and girt about the Paps with a Colden Girdle ; his Head and his Fair to be white , like Wool , as white as Snow ; that his Eyes as a Flame of Fire , and his Feet like unto fine Brass , as if they were burning in a Furnace ; and his Voice as the Sound of many VVaters ; a sharp Two-edged Sword came out of his Mouth ; and his Countenance was as the Sun , shining in his strength . This Body , I think , is sufficiently Lucid , and expresly and almost exactly conformable to that of the Angel which appeared to Daniel , as any one may observe , that listeth to compare them . The like Appearance of our Saviour se●…meth to be also , Apocal. 10. where an Angel is said to be cloathed with a Cloud , with a Rain-Bow on his Head , and his Face to be as the Sun , &c. I will add his Appearing to an out of the Heavens , as he was going to Damascus , Acts 9. that suddenly there shined round about him a Light from Heaven , &c. above the Brightness of the Sun , Chap. 22. 6. & 26. 13. Which again doth not only assure the Reality , but the exceeding great Splendor of the Corporeal Presence of Christ ; which is also agreeable to that in Apocal. And his Countenance was as the Sun shining in his Strength . Out of all which , I hope , it is plain enough , that as our Saviour hath said , That the Sons of the Resurrection do become i●…so facto Angels in Condition , as well for the Splendour and Constitution of their Body , as their Immortality . The Body of our Saviour , after his Refurrection , being so accurately answerable in Light and Glory to the most illustrious Appearances of Angels , in either the Old or New Testament ; and this alone , one would think , might be sufficient to assure us of the Lucidity or Luminosity of the Body of Christ , as also of all our Resurrection-Bodies . For the Spirituality of this Body , see 1 Cor. 15. 44. It is sown a natural Body , it is raised a spiritual Body ; there is a natural Body , and there is a spiritual Body , &c. I think it is most reasonable to understand the Resurrection-Body to be called Spiritual , not for that it is actuated by a Spirit ( for the Soul is a Spirit , that actuates the natural Body ) but for that the Body it self is become spiritual ; which I must confess , Calvin seems abhorrent from , but meerly out of his Ignorance in Philosophy ; for he reprehends those , qui substantiam corporis putant fore spiritualem , &c. Calvin seems to be afraid of the Opinion of the Body being spiritual , as implying a substantial Change , &c. There is not any Inconvenience to admit , that the Resurrection●… Body is a spiritual Body , that is to say , that the Contexture of it is of more subtil Parts then those that constitute the Earthly Bodies , pag. 498. [ And so he distinguishes between that Terrestrial Statue , or Body that Adam had , and the Spiritual Bodies of those that are made conformable to the last Adam , and to his Glorious Condition . ] Such as are not of a stupid and Statue-like Condition of themselves , but of such a Nature as hath an Activity in it self , and doth most wonderfully contribute to the most lively and most divine and enlarged vitall Operations of the Soul. ●… [ In this Manner hath he g●…ven his Distinction upon the Words , It is sown a Natural ( or Animal ) Body , it is raised a Spiritual Body . ] The Resurrection Body is Heavenly or Celestial ; as the first Man is of the Earth , Earthly ; the second Man is the Lord from Heaven : as is the Earthly , such are they that are Earthly ; and as is the Heavenly , such are they also that are Heavenly ; and as we have born the Image of the Earthly , we shall also bear the Image of the Heavenly : And then it follows , But this I must tell you , Brethren , That Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God — not that they shall only have Heavenly Bodies in a moral Sense or spiritual Meaning ; Bodies in which they shall be Heavenly-minded [ For such Slips as these , and dilute Sences , are very Dangerous , &c. ] but that they shall have an Heavenly Body in that Sense that Adam had an Earthly , which was not called an Earthly Body , for that he was Earthly-minded in it , but because his Body was of an Earthly Substance . Really and Physically Heavenly , not only Morally ; we shall be such in our Corporeal Constitution as our Celestial Lord is in his ; we shall bear his Image of Heavenly Glory and Brightness , not only in a Moral , but Natural Sense — nor can I imagine how Interpreters could be carried so forcibly off from so obvious and true a Sense , had it not been by reason of some false Pre-conceptions in Philosophy that had corrupted their Minds , and perverted their Judgments , namely , the Hypothesis of Ptolo●…e and Aristotle . By an Heavenly Body , I would understand an Angelical Body . That the Heavens are fluid , according to the most ancient and divinest Philosophy , as the very Notation of the Hebrew word intimates . Our Resurrection-Bodies will be furnished with the Seeds and Principles of Light and Splendour , and be more Beautiful , and more full of Lustre and Glory , then the Heavenly Matter it self ; as that part of the Earth , which becomes an humane Body , is more precious and beautiful then the Earth it self before it be modified into a Frame fit for the Functions of Life : So that whether we consider the Angelicalness ; Spirituality or Heavenliness of the Body at the Resurrection , there is all Reason to conclude , that it will be of a Bright and Lucid Nature ; which is not only agreeable to Reason and the Scripture , but also to the Sayings of the Fathers themselves , as S. H●…rom , S. Macariu●… , S. Ephrem , S. Austin , as you may see in Vossius , in his Theses de corpore glorioso . But nothing more express for our Purpose then that of S. Ephrem , in his Discourse of the Resurrection , viz. Justorum corpora septuplum supra solis 〈◊〉 radios . How Angelical , how Spiritual , how Heavenly or Celestial , how refulgently Bright and Glorious the Bodies of the Blessed are , &c. and more particularly the Body of our Saviour , that shone about Saint Paul , and Saint John , as the Sun in his Strength , & c ? The first Man is of the Earth , Earthly ; the second Man , that is , the Lord Jesus , the Heavenly Man , from Heaven : And who should be intirely Heavenly if not He ? And what has Earth to do to either descend from Heaven , or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ? or what Body more radient or refulgent then the Sun in his greatest Brightness can be vitally Organized , but it must be of an Heavenly Nature indeed ? We have all Reason in the World to conclude the Body of our Saviour intirely Cele ial . T●…e Terrestrial Modifications of his Body were changed — all cloggings thereof were quel'd and abolish'd . 〈◊〉 and Blood cannot i 〈◊〉 the Kingdom of God ; and I think there is the ame Reason of Flesh and Bones , viz. I understand natural Flesh and Bones not glorified . I demand by what Creed t●…at hath the ●…ssent of the Universal Church , are we required to believe , that the Glorified Body of Christ consisteth of Flesh , Blood and Bones ? It ●…eming so contradictious to the exprestwords of the Apostle , as well as uniuitable to the Nature of the Peavens , which the Philosophers new adayes conclude to be universally fl●…d . [ He admits of a Body of Flesh and 〈◊〉 , provided they be Celestial and Spiritual Flesh and Bones , p. 503. ] If any mortal could get within this so refulgent Orb of Glory and Bright●…ss , and approach so near as to see the Fraim and Feature of ●…o Divine a Body no Heart could escape from being struck into a 〈◊〉 at the Sight of so over-coming a Beauty and Majesty , nor the Soul of the Beholder from being carried quite away in an extatick Fit of Love and Joy , and transporting Admiration , p. 503. Touching the Sameness of the Body . The Atheist makes a fresh Assault from the sense of the word Resurrectio , as it is imply'd the rising again of the very same numerical Body , in the strictest Scholastick Sense . To which is answered , first , That 〈◊〉 in Latin implies no such thing necessarily ; but that as a City or Temple , suppose being razed to the Ground , and from the very Foundations — is truly laid to be Rebuilt , and so is both deemed & called the same Temple and City again , though n●…t a Stone were used of the former Structure ; provided only , that they be rebuilt upon the same Ground — though the ●…ame numerical Matter were not congested together to make the same Body at the Resurrection , the stable Per●…onality being in the Soul , &c. [ He placeth the Samene●…s of the Body that shall be , upon its vital Union with the Soul , and faith ] T●…at Resurrectio is to be interpreted according to the Latitude of the Original to which it answers , namely , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●…is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which signifie only Vivification , or Erection into Life : but then considering it is spoken of them that have in some sense ceased to be alive , that in that sense it signifies Revivification , whence the Atheists Objection from the word Resurrectio , is utterly defeated , p. 506. The Scholastick State of the Resurrection is described , namely , That we shall have the same Numerical Bodies 〈◊〉 which we lived here on Earth ; and that these very Bod●…es , the Moulds being turned aside , shall start out of the Grave : To which I presently subjoyn , This D●…ctrine the Atheist very dearly hugs , as a Pledge in his bold Conce●… of the Falsness and Vanity of all the other Articles of Religion . But for those that take any Pleasure , or find any Ease or Satisfaction of Mind in the Conclusions or P●…raseologies of the School-Divines , touching this Point , they are left free to enjoy their own Apprehensions , and may , if they please , either fancy it necessary , that all Bodies should rise out of the Ground , the Moulds being cast aside ; or else , conceive only that God will by his Omnipotency , gather all the Particles of our Bodies , whether flying in the Air , or s●…ting in the Water , and frame them together on the Surface of the Earth , &c , concerning such things they may vary their Fancies as they plea●…e , 〈◊〉 p 508. To the second Objection he saith , I answer farther as concerning the Scripture it self ; That I dare challenge him o produce any place of Scripture , out of which he can make it appear , that the Mystery of the Resurrection implies a Resuscitation of the same * Numerical Body . The most pregnant of all is , Job 19. which later Interpreters are now so wise as not to understand at all of the Resurrection : The 1 Cor. 15. that Chapter is so far from asserting this Curiosity , that it plainly sayes , it is not the same Body ; but that as God gives to the Blades of Corn Grains quite distinct from that which wa●… sown , so at the Resurrection he will give the Soul a Body quite different from that which was buried , as different as a Spiritual Body is from a Natural Body , or an Heavenly from an Earthly , p. 508 , 509. A POST SCRIPT By way of Animad version and Counsel . SErious and impartial Reader , I have collected these Passages that thou mayst not only see how some of these learned Men differ about this mysterious and 〈◊〉 Point ; but also how unreasonable it is for any of them to be 〈◊〉 this or the like unlearned 〈◊〉 upon us ( viz. ) How , and with what Body are the Dead raised , & c ? or to seek Occasions to vilifie us about this Point which 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 are not only confounded , but liable to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . The Question is not only unlearned , but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 unnecessary unto Salvation ; it is not necessary that 〈◊〉 should imagine 〈◊〉 they shall be cloathed , or 〈◊〉 with Bodies in Heaven ; but to enquire the Way 〈◊〉 , that they may walk in it , and be solicitous to know that Power and inward Operation , whereby they may be made Sons of God , and attain to the Resurrection of the Dead , as being Children of God , and of the Resurrection . If men walk in the True Light , and so truly serve and please God on Earth , they shall not need to 〈◊〉 or dispute about their future Beings in Heaven ; Their Business is , to get thither , and 〈◊〉 will well accommodate them there : Men ought not to be too curious and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Matters beyond their reach , as to the Manner of their future Beings , or how they shall be reserved for Eternal Rewards . There are two things tend to Atheism , or to make men Atheists ( viz. ) First , Some Mens Curiosity , in studying and searching into Matters and Things beyond their Capacities and Reason ( being things of another 〈◊〉 and Principle then they are in . ) Secondly , Other Mens Self Confidence in asserting things contrary to Reason and manifest Experience ; and in particular , in their affirming , that these self-same Terrestrial Bodies of Flesh , Blood and Bones , shall be made Spiritual , Immortal and Incorruptible , and yet the same Matter and Substance as now . It is true , that Henry Moor had finer and more 〈◊〉 Notions about the Resurrection then many other learned men , and aimed at the Truth and Spirituality thereof , from the Visions of the Holy Men recorded in the Scriptures ; but if any should soar after those Notions , how fine , thin , sublime , or desirable soever they seem to be to that Aspiring Mind that desireth to feed upon the Tree of Knowledge , such are in Danger both to fall 〈◊〉 and miss of the Fruit of the Tree of Life , and of the Resurrection of the Just. Therefore , Oh breathing Souls , retire , and 〈◊〉 down to the holy Principle of Light and Life in your selves , so as that may both rend the Vail of Darkness , open you , and shew it self in its own Purity , Vertue and Efficacy unto you , that thereby you may know Christ revealed in you to be your Resurrection and Life , your Hope of Glory and Everlasting Reward , your Strength , Nourishment and Souls Satisfaction ; For this is Life Eternal , to know God , and Jesus Christ whom he hath sent ; that in him each of you may arise to Righteousness and Peace here , and to Glory hereafter : And though it appear not what you shall be , yet it is matter of Satisfaction , Stay and Comfort , that you have such Experience of the Love of God , as to be his Children , and to have his Witness and Testimony in you , That his Appearance and Work will be to your Glory and future Felicity in Immortality , where we shall have a Building of God , an House not made with Hands , eternal in the Heavens ; for in this we groan earnestly , &c. that Mortality might be swallowed up of Life : Now , he that hath wrought us for the self-same thing , is God , who also hath given unto us the Earnest of the Spirit , Glorified be his Name forever . George Whitehead . THE END . A Conclusive ADVERTISEMENT . Serious Reader , THe many Controvers●…s , the great 〈◊〉 of the Press , the 〈◊〉 Strivings of our Adversaries , and their 〈◊〉 to prejudice and divert the Minds of People with their 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and perverse Gain-sayings , from the Reception of Truth ( which required 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and speedy Answers ) have occasioned the long Delay of publishing this Book after it was writ ; but I hope it will not be unseasonable at length , but of Service to many , for the Information of such honest Minds as sincerely seek to understand the Truth about those principal Matters of 〈◊〉 between us and our present Opposers , herein unfolded . And if the Manner or Method of Wording any Passages of Reprehension , &c. seems too Harsh or Sharp in the Eye of any , who have not known , 〈◊〉 been concerned ( as we are ) with such unplacable Adversaries , let not this disgust or 〈◊〉 them from eying the Light and Manifestation of Truth aim'd at , really intended , and seriously contended for in the Matter and Substance of these 〈◊〉 ; Considering also ( in the reading ) the reprovable Occasions given us by those 〈◊〉 Spirits we have to deal withal , our Zeal being for the Truth as made known to us , and that in Uprightness and Simplicity of Heart to God , and Love to Souls , we have taken this Pains , with much more : And we must speak and write 〈◊〉 according to our several Gifts , and as we see Occasion , as they naturally 〈◊〉 and spring , even in the Simplicity of Truth received ; not as Men - 〈◊〉 , nor to gratifie Men's Curious Fancies and Affections ; but as those that must give Account unto GOD , whose we are . Upon perusal of the Answers here 〈◊〉 , I 〈◊〉 meet to give a Hint of these two Passages ; to prevent some Objection , viz 〈◊〉 in pag. 112. there is a Question upon John 12. 35. which is , Did not Jesus say , There is yet a little Light IN YOU ? Having made further 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it , I find only in the Old Latin Translation these words , Dixit ergo eis Jesus , adhuc modieum Lumen IN VOBIS est : And whether this might not be 〈◊〉 out of some very ancient Greek Copy not come to our 〈◊〉 , is to be 〈◊〉 , as being supposed by some : However , it is a Truth , 〈◊〉 the 〈◊〉 that was with them , was also IN them ; To be with them , doth not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in them . And whereas in pag. 305. lin . 6. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 [ 〈◊〉 are to dye ] these Words of S. S' s should have been inserted , viz. [ Another 〈◊〉 say to that Company , Though you are not able to run as 〈◊〉 as 〈◊〉 , 〈◊〉 as strongly ; yet if you do your best Endeavour , and hold out , you are to 〈◊〉 the rich Inheritance : I ask , which of 〈◊〉 two did speak to the 〈◊〉 of their Companies ? ] 〈◊〉 he renders the Scripture-Minister as 〈◊〉 in Opposition to the Quaker : How this Passage 〈◊〉 omitted , I know not ; for I am 〈◊〉 it was intended , being spoaken to in my Answer , as 〈◊〉 , pag. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 306. And as for the Errors or Defects , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the Press , through any Inadvertency or much Business , the Reader is desired to correct , or at least , not to reflect upon the Author therein ; seeing the most material Faults are noted in the following Errata , and how to be Corrected in the 〈◊〉 . ERRATA TO THE SECOND PART . HEre are some of the most material Faults escaped the Press , which the honest serious Reader is desired to correct as 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . read obvious to the Sight . p. 8. l. 30. for us read as . p. 14. l. 23 for filth . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . p. 15 l. 1. r. obliterated p. 19. l. 21. for Saint r. Saints . p. 29. l. 〈◊〉 . for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . p. 30. l. 4. r. Manifestation or Principle . l. 19 r that the Light is Christ. p 32 l. 10. for good read Goodness . p. 39. l. 15. r. comparing it ( as to its Work ) pag , 45 l. 29 f. effect r. affect . p. 48. l. 3 for which r. the. p. 54 l. 24 f principle r. principal . pages 66 , 67 , 68. in the Titlo blot out [ Offices 〈◊〉 ] p. 72 l. 27. 〈◊〉 meerly as a 〈◊〉 without . p. 75. l. 22. 〈◊〉 spiritual known r. spiritually 〈◊〉 . p. 77. l. 35 r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . p 80. l. 33. f. to be r. will be . p. 84. line last de●…e lux . p. 105. l. 9. f Christ saying r. that saying . p. 132. l 6. r. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . p. 133 l. 16 for he r they . p. 142. l. 5. r. strike at . p. 150. l. 22. f Body r. the Body . p. 151. blot out [ Body of ] in the 〈◊〉 . p. 152. l. 31. r. on thy . p. 162. l. 35. r. and assertion . p. 177. l 28. f. which r. 〈◊〉 . p. 178. l. 27. r. Impatiency in her . p. 183. l. 32. dele of . p. 189 l. 17. f. remiss r. 〈◊〉 . p. 195. l. 25. f. seem r. smell . p. 198. l. 37. f. my r. his . 40 f them r him . p. 200. l. 18. r. but judge . p. 202. l. 40. after [ before Faith ] add or 〈◊〉 in the State of Unbelief p 213. l. 8. f. God r. Good. p. 217. l. 24. f. yet thereto r whereto p. 231. l. 23. f. our r. his . p. 233. l. 20. r. as he saith . p. 235. in the 〈◊〉 , 〈◊〉 4. for saying read who said p. 242. l. 28. f. a great 〈◊〉 r. dispensing . page 280. l. 28. the full Stop or Breach should be placed after [ 〈◊〉 ] p. 288. l. 22. f. it r in p. 290. 〈◊〉 . 33. after [ impatiency ] add [ in a time of 〈◊〉 ] p 305. 〈◊〉 . 2. after ( incourazement ) add ( against us ) p. 308. l. 〈◊〉 . read who knew . p. 310. l. 20. read Gell's . p. 323. l 〈◊〉 . read 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 l. 42. for do read op . p. 326. 〈◊〉 37. read Philetus . l. 38. read compleated after page 334. for 135 read 335 , and so correct them to the end . page 341. l. 19 read he being out of his perplexed . p. 348. l. 3 for their read the. l. 13 , 14. read ( in Union of Spirit , and with the Spirits of all just Men ) within a Paren : hesis . pag. 354. l. 22. f. the r. they p. 357. l. 〈◊〉 . for set read sit . p. 363. l. 48. for fiercerly read fiercely . There are also divers Faults and 〈◊〉 in Letters and Points of less moment , which may be understood by the Sense of the Matter . THE END . Notes, typically marginal, from the original text Notes for div A54120-e890 Read Euseb. Evag. Socr. Ruffin . Coun. Trent . Simps . Full. Perr . Bak. Dan. Trus. Daval . Clark. Morl. Milt . &c. See Book of Mar. Luth. contr . Ecc. Zuing. Calv. Beza &c. Hayl . of Reform . Cambd. Life of Q. E. Rush. Hist. Collect. Cambd. Hist : Wars of Engl. The King's Return . See Annab . Decl. Notes for div A54120-e8170 As T. Hicks hath done . Pag. 66. Pag. 72. Pag. 73. Pag. 2. Pag. 13 , 14 , 15 , 20 , 25 , 44 , 45 , 49 , 54 , 66 , 76. Jer. 20. 7. Pag. 2. * That is the Cause . Pag. 8 , 9. Rom. 2. John 12. 16. Pag. 14. Ephes. 5. 8. Job 32. 8. John 8. 12. Joh. 12. 36 , 46. Rom. 1. Ephes. 5. John 1. John 1. 5. Rom. 13. 12 , 13 , 14. 2 Cor. 6. 14. 1 John 1. 5 , 6 , 7. Rev. 22. 4. 5. Gal. 4. 16. Tit. 2. John 14. 6. John 1. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 9. 1 Cor. 15. 45 , 47 , & 1. 24. 1 Joh. 2. 27. & 5. 6 , 7 , 8. John 6. 51 , 52 , 53. Gen. 1. 27. Deut. 30. 11. 12 , 13 , 14 , 15. 2 Sam. 22. 29. Job 24. 13. Job 25. 3. Job 29. 3. Psal. 27. 1. Psal. 118. 27 119. 105 , 102. Prov. 4. 18. * T. Hicks . Psal. 50. 19 , 20 , 21. Psal. 94. 4. Amos 4. 13. Psal. 139. 7. Vers. 1 , 2 , 3. Acts. 20. 2 Cor. 6. 16. Acts 7. 48. 49. 50 , 51. Neh. 9. 20. Genes . 6. 3. Job 24. 9. 13. * Neither is it our Construction only , but the Judgment of Men fam'd in the World , for their Exactness in the Original Text , or Letter of the Scripture . They interpret it , to be the Light of the Divine Wisdom , the Fountain of Light , yea , God himself : That Rebelling against the Light , is against God. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the Light of Israel ; alluding to the Psalmist , The Lord is my Light and my Salvation . Nay , to the Light mentioned by the Apostle Paul , Ye , who were sometimes Darkness , are now Light in the Lo●…d . And that very Light , which is said to have sprung up to them that sate in Darkness , which is the Light of Truth ( and by our Adversaries , allow'd to be the Evangelical ; and spoke of Christ's Manifestation ) Also , that the Wayes of Light , are Light , leading to the Light it self , which Wicked Men turn from , and spurn at . That this is the Light , which there is none , but it rises upon , whereby to give them true sight of themselves . See Munsterus , Vatablus , Clarius , Castellio on the 17th Verse , but especially Drusius and Codurcus , who say , All Men partake of that Light , and that it is sufficient to Manifest and Drive away the Darkness of Error ; and that it is the Light of Life ; Nay , Codurcus calls it , an Evangelical Principle , & seems to explain his Mind by a Quotation of the Evangelist's words , John 19. That was the True Light , that inlightneth all Mankind coming into the World. Munster . Vatabl. Clar. Castel . Drus. & Codurc . Crit. in 24 , 25. Chap. Ver. 13 , & 3. 〈◊〉 , P. 3283. to 3308. Chap. 25. 3. Notes for div A54120-e16560 Mat. 13. 1 , to 10. Vers. 19. Mat. 25. 14 ; to 34. John 3. 20. Ephes. 5. 13. Rom. 1. 16 , 17 , 18 , 19 , 20 , 21 , 28. Chap. 2. 8. Rom. 2. 13 , 14 , 15 , 16. Eccles. 12 , 13 , 14. Gen. 20. 4. & 21. 22. 2 Chron 36. 23. Ezra 1. 2 , 3 , 4 , 5 , 13. & 6. 3 , 12. Dan. 6. 26 , 27. Notes for div A54120-e19620 Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. He stretched-out his Hand over the Sea , Isa. 23. 11. — Sing Praises unto the Lord , to Him that Rideth upon the Heavens of Heavens , Psal. 68. 33. — For the Lord your God , he is God in Heaven above , and in the Earth beneath , Josh. 2. 11. Rev. 22. 13. God is God of the Living , and not of the Dead , Mat. 22. 32. — Now unto the King Eternal , Immortal , Invisible , the Only Wise God , be Honour and Glory forever and ever , Amen , 1 Tim. 1. 17. 1 Tim. 6. 16. — Thy Throne , O God , is forever and ever , Psal. 45. 6. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. Thou art Glorious in Holiness , Exod. 15. 4. — God had Glory before the World began , John 17. 5. — The Lord Searcheth the Heart , and Tryeth the Reins , Psalm . 7. 9. — And tell unto Man his Thoughts , Amos 4. 13 — God is from Everlasting to Everlasting , God , Psalm . 90. 2. — Without Beginning of Days , or End of Life , Heb. 7. 3. * DeLeg . 2. I alone am God , and besides Me there is not another . There is none other but One God , 1 Cor. 8. 5. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. No Man has seen God at any time , 1 John 4. 12. — Heaven is my Throne , Acts 7. 49. — The Lord's Throne is in Heaven , Psalm . 11. 4. And hear thou in Heaven , thy Dwelling-Place , 1 King. 8. 30. Jamblich . Thou must believe that God is ; and that he is a Rewarder of them that fear him , Hebr. 11. 6. — For thine is the Kingdom , 1 Chron. 29. 11. Mat. 6. 13. — Thou art Lord of Heaven and Earth , Acts 17. 24 — And the Government shall be upon his Shoulders , Isa. 9. 6 — Again , God is Light , and in him is no Darkness at all , John 1. 5 — I am the Way , the Truth and the Life , John 14. 6 — God is all , above all , and in all , Ephes. 4. 6. Just. Mart. A God nigh at hand , Acts 17. 27. Jer , 23. 23 — One God , who is above all , through all , and in all , Ephes. 4. 6 — God is Light ; and upon whom hath not his Light arisen ? 1 John 1. 5. Job 25. 3 — One God and Father of all , 1 Cor. 8. 6 — Now to the King Eternal , Immortal , Invisible , the Only Wise God be Glory , &c. 1 Tim. 1. 17. The Heaven of Heavens cannot contain Thee . 1 Kings 8. 27. 2 Chron. 6. 18 — What House will ye build me ? Acts 7. 49 — God dwells in the Light , 1 Tim. 6. 16 — To whom will ye liken God ? what Likeness will ye compare unto Him ? Isa. 40. 18 , 25 — God is a Spirit , John 4. 24. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 2. Lact. Fals. Rel. 1. 5. Cic. de Nat. Deor. 1. But to us there is but One God , the Father of all , of whom are all things , 1 Cor. 8. 6. Where wast thou when I laid the Foundations of the Earth ? read on , Job 38. 4 — And the Earth was without Form : read the Chapter , in which is declared , God's Making and beautifying Heaven and Earth , and all Living Creatures therein , Gen. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8 , 9 , 10 , 11 , 12. and so to the end . — Thou Lord madest the Heavens and the Earth , and all that in them is , Acts 4. 24. August . cir . Del. 8. Notes for div A54120-e23960 Tim. de De Anim. Mund. The Pure in heart shall see God , Mat. 5. 8. — He dwelleth in Immortality ; no Mortal Eye can approach or behold him , 1 Tim. 1. 16. One Thing have I desired of Thee , O Lord , to behold the Beauty of the Lord , Psalm . 27. 4 — The Things of God knows no Man , but the Spirit of God ; but God hath Reveal'd them to us by his Spirit 1 Cor. 2. 10 , 11. & 1. 13. — Is Christ divided ? 1 Cor. 1. 13 — And I heard a great Voice saying , THE TABERNACLE OF GOD IS WITH MEN. He that Overcometh shall Inherit all things : I will be his God , and he shall be my Son , Revel . 21. 3 , 7. Jambl. * Jamblich . * De Anim. Mund. In the Beginning was the Word , and the Word was with God , and the Word was God , John 1. 1. — The Word is nigh thee , in thy Heart and in thy Mouth , Rom. 10. 8. I dwell in the High and Holy Place , with him also that is of a Contrite and Humble Spirit , Isa. 57. 15. — Ye are the Temples of God , and that the Spirit of God dwells in you , 1 Cor. 2 16. — Whatever may be known of God is manifested within , for God shews it unto them , Rom. 1. 19. Valer. Max. 7. 2. Lay up Treasure in Heaven , where neither Moth nor Rust can Corrupt , nor Thief break through and Steal , Mat. 6. 20. — This Treasure hath God put into Earthen Vessels , 2 Cor. 4. 7. — Fear not , for the Lord thy God it is that doth go with thee ; he will not fail thee , nor forsake thee , Deut. 31. 6. — In all their Afflictions he was Afflicted , Isa. 63. 9 — . The Lord is a present Help in the time of Trouble , Psal. 46. 1. * Oedip. Tyr. Shall not the Uncircumcision that is by Nature , if it fulfil the Law , judge thee , who by the ●…etter and Circumcision dost transgress the Law. For he is not a Jew that is one Outward , implying such as keep the Law is one Inward , Rom. 2. 27 , 28. — And the Word of God ( nigh in the Heart ) shall abide forever , Isa. 40. 8. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. Plutarch . de Gen. Socr. There is a Spirit in Man , but the Inspiration of the Almighty giveth Understanding . Job 32 8. 2 Tim. 2. 22 , 25. — For as many as are led by the Spirit of God , are the Children of God , Rom. 8. 14. * In phaed. God is Light 1 John 1. 5. — In thy Light 〈◊〉 we see Light , Psalm . 36. 10 — God is not far from every one of us ; for in him we live , move and have our ●…eing ; for we are also his Off-sping , as certain of your own Poets have said , Acts 17. 27 , 28. One of whom was Arabus , whom the Apostle quotes as speaking Truth , and imployes it against them , to prove a True God , and to introduce his Gospel ; which if it shewed their Apostacy , it also implies , that there had been Heathens , rightly apprehending of God ; else surely , the Apostle would never have cited the Poets Saying , for a Confirmation of his own Doctrine . * Enead . 1. cap. 1. For the Lord God is a Sun & a Shield : the Lord will give Grace and Glory : no good Thing will he withhold from them that trust in him , and walk uprightly , Psal. 84. 11 , 12. — For God hath shewed it unto them , Rom. 1. 19. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. A Manifestation of the Spirit is given unto every one to profit withal , 1 Cor. 12. 7. — One God , and Father of all , who is above all , and through all . — The Lord is Good unto all , Psal. 145. 9. Leg. Alleg. L. 1. The Things of God knoweth no Man save the Spirit of God , 1 Cor. 2. 11. — I will put my Law in their Minds and write them in their Inward parts ; I will be their God , and they shall be my People , Heb. 8. 10 , 11. Plut. Dion . Prus. Because whatever may be known of God is manifest within ; for God hath shewed it unto them : but because they liked not to retain God in their Knowledge , God gave them up to vile Affections , Rom. 2. 19 , 26 , 28. Dis. lib. 1. cap. 14. O Lord , thou hast searched me , thou understandest my Thoughts afar off . Whither shall I go from thy Spirit , Psal. 139. 1 , 2 , 7. We have a more Sure Word of Prophesie , 2 Pet. 19. — The Lord hath shewedun to thee , O Man , what is Good , and what he doth require of thee , Micah 6. 8. — In him we Live , Move , and have our Being , Acts 17. 28. — Such as Men Sow , such shall they Reap , Gal. 6. 7. — That was the true Light , which Inlightneth all Mankind , John 1. 9. * Senec. Epist. 41. * De Benef. c. 17. * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Behold , the Tabernacle of God is with Men , Rev 21. 3. — He that d●…clareth 〈◊〉 Man his Thoughts , the Lord , the God of Hosts is hi●… Name . Amos 4. 13. — W●…ite ye have the Light walk in the Light , that you may be the Children of the Light. God is Light , John 12. 26. 1 John 1. 5. * ●…pist 8. * Epist. 31. Notes for div A54120-e26880 * If Angry Tho. Hicks will please to inform himself of the Reasons that induced Justin to turn Christian , he will find the Light Within acknowledged to be the Efficient Cause thereof ; for it was the Principle of God in his Conscience that continually pleaded the Christians Cause within him , and who at last overcoming . Justin Believes in Christ , and Dyes for him too . Now what Disgrace is this to the Light Within ? Liv'd after Christ Ann. 123. 1543. years since . Apolog. Liv'd after Christ 190. Admon . ad Gent. Strom. L. 5. Clem. Alex. in Admon . ad Gent. Liv'd Ann. 195. Liv'd about Ann. 203. Liv'd about Ann. 315. De Cult . Ver. Lib. de Ira cap. 2. Liv'd about Ann. 325. Athanas. cont . Gent. Liv'd about Ann. 3 80. Liv'd about Ann. 393. Notes for div A54120-e28720 Liv'd about the Year of the World , 3313. before Christ , about 630. years which is 2330. years since . Thou therefore which teachest another , teachest thou not thy self ? Rom. 2. 21. Love thy Neighbour as thy self , I am the Lord , Levit. 19. 18. Finally Brethren , whatsoever things are True , whatsoever things are Honest , Just , Pure , Lovely , and of Good Report , think on these things , Phil. 4. 8. Stob. 28. * That 's more then Tho. Hicks seems to do . Liv'd at the same time . Laert. Lib. 1. c. 3. * Reader , this Reflection was not without Light , nor this Man void of a very Tender Conscience . The Gentiles , who had not a Law , became a Law unto themselves , doing the Things contained in the Law ; their Consciences bearing Witness , and their Thoughts the mean while Accusing or Excusing , Rom. 2. 14 , 15. To Depart from Iniquity is a good Understanding , Job 28. 28. And the Hypocrites Hope shall Perish , Job 8. 13. Why do you not rather take Wrong ? 1 Cor. 6. 7. Stob. 28. Reader , these weighty Sayings are very Scripture it self , and that as well of the New , as Old Testament ( so called ) especially where Christ saith , SWEAR NOT AT ALL : though spoke about 700 years before he came into the World. * As Tho. Hicks , John Bunion , J. Grigg , and other Railing ●…eparatists do the Quakers . * Which T. Hicks can't do , neither to his Wife , & Family at home , nor his Friends , much less other People abroad Stob. Serm. 80. Jamblich . Let us hear the Conclusion of the whole Matter : Fear God , and keep his Commandments ; for this is the whole Duty of Man , Eccles. 12. 13. Pure Religion and Undefiled is , to keep himself Unspotted from the World , Jam. 1. 27. In this sense I fear , we may say , that Thomas Hicks has no Light in him . Who when he was Reviled , Reviled not again , 1 Pet. 2. 23. Laert. Plat. Phaed. The Fear of the Lord is the Beginning of Wisdom , Psalm . 111. 10. He that will deny himself , let him take up his Cross , and follow me , Luk. 9. 23. Xen. Mem. 3. p. 780. Clem. Alex. Strom. L. 5. Stob. 218. Reader , These sententious Expressions to have every one of them a Scripture , would be tedious and superfluous ; for they are almost Word for Word Scripture it self , as who knoweth Scripture may plainly see . Xen. Mem. 4. p. 803. Id. Mem. 1. 722. 4. 804. Id. Mem. 3. So saith Christ , Mat. 7. 2. 62. 7. Ibid. Apolog. Libanius saith , Socrates considered The Pure in Heart shall see God , Mat. 5. 8. Clem. Alex. Str. 2. 417. Laert. Stob. 46. The Fruit of the Spirit is Peace , Gal. 5. 22. Acts 24. 16. But Godliness , with Content , is great Gain , 1 Tim. 6. 6. Stob. 48. Stob. 114. This answers T. Hicks's Challenge about the Light 's showing that State , if Christ had not said so . Liban . Ap : p. 644. Nothing they could do was able to draw him out of his Endeavours to detect the loose Comedians , that sought therefore his Ruin. 1 Pet. 3. 14. * The word Philosophy hath been otherwise appropriated since those days , as many other words have been ; for it then signified a Love of Wisdom given by Pythagoras , which Wisdom was the Way of Holy Living , not Vain and Untoward Contests about Inpracticable Things . Laert. & Suid. in vit . Antish . Ye are an Holy Nation , a Royal Priesthood , 1 Pet. 2. 9. — And you shall be Kings , and Raign , &c. Rev. 1. 6. — Blessed are they who hear the Word of God , and keep it , Luke 11. 28. — Where is the Wise ? where is the Scribe ? where is the Disputer of this World ? 1 Cor. 1. 20. Put on the Brest - Plate of Righteousness , Eph. 6 14. Stob. The Just shall live by Faith , Hab. 24. — Without Holiness no man shall see the Lord , Heb. 12. 14. They that wait upon the Lord shall renew their Strength , Isa. 40. 31. — The Secrets of the Lord are with them that fear him , Psal. 25. 14. Valer. Max. 2. 10. Cic. pro Bal. Laert. Mat. 5. 34. Cic. de Fin. 2. Rom. 2. 14 , 15. Laert. Ibid. Stob. The Fear of the Lord is the Beginning of Wisdom , Job 28. 28. Laert. The Rulers take Counsel together against the Lord , Psal. 2. 2. Stob. The Wisdom which is from above , is first Pure , then Peaceable , Jam. 3. 17. Laert. Id. Psal. 111. 9 , 10. Cic. Parad. Stob. Id. Theatr. cap. 3. 10. Be ye Holy , for I the Lord your God am Holy , Levit. 11. 44 , 45. Notes for div A54120-e33530 Plut. plac . 4. 7. Stob. Phys. Rev. 20. 12 , 13 , 14. Chap. 21. 7 , 8. Plat. phaed. 2 Cor. 5 8. * Ad Amph. Clem. Alex. Strom. l. 3. 2 Cor. 5. 8. Philip. 1. 21. Plat. Phaed. Eccles. 12. 7. Idem . The Sheep on the Right Hand , and the Go●…tes on the Lest , Mat. 25. 31 , 32 , 33. 1 Cor. 15. 28 , 29 , 30 , 31. Observe Socrates his Distinction betwixt being Dead & Departed . Acts 7. 60. H. Mor. Des. Phil. Cab. c. 3. Revel . Rev. 22. 5. Notes for div A54120-e35170 See Const. Orat. in Eus. Isa. 2. 2 , 3 , 4 , 5. Isa. 7. vers . 14 , 15 , 16 , 17 , 18 , 19 , 20 , 21 , 22 , 23 , 24 , 25. Chap. 9 , & 10. 1 John 4. 5 , 6. Chap. 11. 6 , 7 , 8 , 9 , 10 , 11. Jer. 23. Notes for div A54120-e37090 Isa. 1. 12 , 13 , 14 , 15. Ezek. 18. 31 , 32. Notes for div A54120-e37640 Objection . Mat. 5. 27. 28. Notes for div A54120-e39060 Joh. 8. 56 , 57 , 58. Helv. Chron. Rom. 5. 9. Gal. 3. 16. Notes for div A54120-e40100 Joh. 14. 17. Notes for div A54120-e40880 Hos. 13. 4. Hebr. 10. John 6. 51 , 52. 53 , 54 , 62 , 63. Rom. 3. 25. Ephes , 1. 7. Hebr. 9. 14. Rom. 3 , 25. Hebr. 10. 5 , 7. 2 Cor. 3. 18. Notes for div A54120-e42700 Joh. 1. 9. Joh. 1. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 9. See Dial. pag. 3. 4. See Origen , Chrysostom , Greg Erasm Drus. Zeger . Cam. Grot. B. Sand. Dr. Ham. John 〈◊〉 . Notes for div A54120-e45910 Dial. pag. 2. 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 . 5. Rom. 〈◊〉 . Jam. 5. 6. 1 John 2. 15. 16. 1. Pet. 1. 18. Ephes. 5. 1 Joh. 1. 5 , 6. Jam. 3. 1 , 2 , 3. Notes for div A54120-e46980 T. Jenner . T. Tayler . J. Faldo . T. Hicks . H. Grigg . &c. Notes for div A54120-e48180 Mat. 11. 27. 1 Cor. 2. 11. Ephes. 5. 13. Rom. 1. 19. Mic. 5. 8. Jren. l. 2. c. 30. Tertul. con . Jud. p. 184. Quakerism a new nickname for old Christianity , p. 54. 55. Rom. 2. 14 , 15. Justin Martyr saith , That all are Christians who live with Christ , as Abraham and Elias ; and amongst the Greeks , as S●…crates , H●…raclitus , &c. See Scult●…tus on him , ●…ho also saith , That some at this day are of his Judgment , who have taught that Melchizedec●… , Abimel●…ch , Ruth , Rachab , the Queen of Sheba , Hiram of Tyre , Naaman t●…e Syrian , and the City o●… Ninive , are in the Catalogue of Christians . Eusebius Pamph. in his Ecclesiastical History , saith , That Abraham and the ancient Fathers were Christians : And defines a Christian to be , one that by the Knowledge and Doctrine of Christ ●…xcels in Moderation of Mind , in Righteousness and Continency of Life , and Strength of Vertue & Godliness towards one only God ; see Scultetus on him . Clemens Alexandrinus saith , The Law of Nature and of Discipline is one . And Moses seems , to call the Lord the Covenant : For he had said before , the Covenant was not to be sought in Scripture ; for that is the Covenant , which God , the Cause of all , setteth , whence his Name in Greek is derived . And in the Preaching of Peter , thou mayest find the Lord called the Word or Reason , and the Law. See his 1 Book Strom at the end . And before pag. 353. he saith , The Law and the Gospel is the Operation of one ●…ord who is the Vertue & Wisdom of God : And the Fear which the Law had bred , is mereiful to Salvation : And the Fear of the Lord is the Beginning of VVisdom . That she ( that is , VVisdom ) that administreth Providence , is Mistress and Good ; and the Power of both procureth Salvation : the one Chastizing as Mistre's , the other being bountiful , as a Benefactor ; for on must pass from Darkness to Life ; and applying his Ear to wisdom , first be a Servant , then a faithful Minister , and so as●…nd into the Number of Sons , and be brought into the elect Adoption of Sons . That the Law works to make them immortal , that chuse to Live temperately and justly . And Again , Evil men do not understand the Law ; but they that se●…k the Lord , do understand in every good thing . And the whole first Book of the Stromat●… is especi●…ly to prove the Antiquity of the one true Religion , or Philosophy , a●… he calls it . Ephes. 2. 8. 1 John 5. 4. Genesis 17. Gal. 5. 1 , 2. Acts 15. 28. Ther 's not laid down in Scripture any general Rule how to answer before Magistrates ; & to act in Times of Sufferings . Thus said a Baptist in print , o●… to that purpose . John 1. 9. Tit. 2. 11 , 12. John 18. 36. Isa. 54. 13. Joel 2. 28 Jer. 31. 33. Mal. 2. 7. Heb. 7. 24 , 25 , 26 , 27. Isa. 9. 6 , 7. Luk. 17. 20 , 21. Heb. 8. 10. Rev. 21. 3. Joel . 2. 28. Tit. 2. 11 , 12. Job . 32. 8. Rom. 1. 19. Gal 5. 16. 1 Joh 1 7. Is●… . 2. 5. Rev. 21. 23. Gal. 6. 15 , 16. Galat. 6. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in this Rule ; as it is translated Phil. 3. 16. which is spoken of the Measure of Attainment : and Grotius saith , in the Manuscript , Rule is not ; so it must be understood , let us walk in the same Attainment ; as also in 2 Cor. 10. 13 , 15. in which three Places that word is only found : See Erasmus , Vatablus , Zegerus , Cameron . Ja●… . Capellus and Grotius , on those places , none whereof can be drawn to the Scriptures . Zegerus interprets this Place of Gal. 6. 16. thus , They that have ●…ollowed this Form of Life , or Rule of the new Creatur●… , having turned away from the invalid Cer●…monies of the Law ; Peace , &c. Drusius explains it from Chap. 5. 6. The new Creation . i. Faith which worketh by Love. Grotius saith , Rule here is a Way made as to a Rule that is plainly Right ; such is that Way of the new Creation , which was foretold Isa. 42. 9. And signifies the State of the new Man , of which Paul Speaks , Col. 3. 10 . Eph. 2. 15. Rom. 6. 4. Bp. Rob. Sand. de Reg●… . ConsProel 4ta . sect . 31. Tertul. de Prescript . Heraetic . pag. 204. Dell. Confut. of Symps. p. 89 , 90. Hieron Tom. 4. 70. Bp. Jewel , p. 532. Po●…ano . 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 . pag. 150 E●…sinus on 1 〈◊〉 . 1. 19. Ib. 〈◊〉 1 Cor. 2. Luther Tom. 3. fol. 169. Peter . Martyr , Com. loc . p. 1. c. 6. Ibid. p. 2. c. 18. Book of Martyr 3 vol. p. 298. Calvin . Instit lib. 1. cap. 8. Beza on 2 Pet. 1. 19. Tindal . works , Pag. 319. & 80. Jewel against Harding , pag. 532 , 534. D. Ames against Bell●…m . l. 1. c. 5. Thes. 32. G. Cradok divin . drops , pag. 217. C. Goad Refr . drops , pag. 12. Excrcit . 2 , 7 , 9. against Quak. John 7. 17. 1 Cor. 2. 10. 1 P●…t . 1. 11. 1 Cor. 2. 10 , 11. Ephes. ●… . 13. ●… Prelect . 4. §. 21 , 22. Jos●…phus , Wars of the Iews , l. 2. c. 7. Philo , de spec . leg . & decalog . Lae●…t . Hermip . & Orig. con●… . Cels. ●…uint . Curtiu●… , ni vit . Al●…x . H. Grotius on . Mat. 5. 34. Book Martyr . vol. 3. p. 475. Gual●… . Cr●… . Divine Drops , p. 〈◊〉 . Phil. 3. 16 B. Mart. vol. 3. P 577. B. Mart. vol. 3. P. 475. Rev. 21. 3 , 7. Isa. 54. 13. Rom. 11. 28. 29. Rom 〈◊〉 . 14 , 15. 1 Tim. 4. 8. Col 〈◊〉 20 , 21 , 〈◊〉 , 23. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 38 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 23. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Notes for div A54120-e59630 Contradiction . Contradiction . His 1st . Argum. His 2d . Argum , His 3d. Argum. * That , Life which is the Light of men is Divine , Unchangeable , and Infinite , and therefore preferred before ( & is above ) all Sufferings which are temporary & finite . His 4th . Argum. His 5th . Argum. His 6th . Argum. His 7th Argum His 8th . Argum. * Let the Reader observe this by the Way ; thou maystremember , that the Controversie between us , was not , whether the Light as in every man be the Christ or no ? but whether it be a divine Light of Christ ( which I affirm ) or but a Creature ? ( which I deny ) this is enough to my Intention . Joh. 17. 11. and 14. 19. Mar. 16. 1●… . Luke 24. 36 , 4. 8. Joh. 20. 19. 23 , 24. 29 Mat. 28. 9 , 10. * And so he hath dealt with Acts 1. 11. saying , In the same manner , p. 21. instead of In like manner . * H. G. * H. G. Contrad . pag. 94. * This is Mat Caffin's old Story against the Light. Mat. 5. 48. pag. 3. pag. 6. ☞ Wisd. 12. 1 , 2. pag. 18 ☜ * A meer Ta●…tology ; Unless at sometime to say [ that Body of Flesh and Bone ] doth no●… respect its own matter and Substance , but some other . * Thus far in Answer to his Questions Dialogue , pag. 58. Baptist's Excommunication . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . Excom . The Marginal Notes are added . (a) Some of your Brethren now scoff . at the Quakers for bearing Witness to the Immortal Seed within (b) For this Doctrine of Perfection , the Baptists , now revile us , who are called Quakers , and furiously oppose it . (c) Which Lightning and Revivings do assert the Inward Light & immediate Teachings of God , now opposed by many of the Baptists . (d) And this Strength and Light must inwardly be received ; but not by them that hate the Light. (e) Which are since greatly encreased among you . (f) Many of you are greatly guilty of that , witness your Railing Pamphlets & Sermons against us . (g) All these are fallen in upon you , because you have refi●…ed the Light within , which would give the Knowledge of the Power and Life . (h) Herein you did own immediate Teaching . (i) That Sense and Travel you have yet kept off , and despise them that experience it . (k) And you are more unsound now then ever , neither can you be sound , until you own the Light. (l) And especially for your Envy and Hypocrisie . (m) But now you despise them that do . (n) Which kind of Pharisaical Babling is still very customary among you . (o) Excepting , that you are outwardly dipt , but as inwardly corrupt as others , and more envious then most Men are . (p) And will yet fall more : (q) Which shews the great hardnes of Heart that is among you . (q) Oh! great Dryness and Withering is come upon you . (r) So you have Cause still to mourn much more . (s) The slavish Fear of many of you hath greatly appeared in suffering Times ; and se 〈◊〉 - In●…erest and Gain hath much stopt you . (t) You cannot get them rooted out without the Power of God , which only is received by believing in his Light within . (v) Your House is not yet purged of them ; however , this was an honest Care to endeavour such a purging , better then to excommunicate Persons for owning the Light within . (w) Which they are very prone to for Advantage . (x) Many more Evils you had n●…od now to spread before them . But S. S. tells us not whether or no he owns those Books , called Apocrypka , or any of them , as any part of his Rule or Canon ; or whether he is not of the same Opinion with his Masters of the Assembly , where in their confession they say , that the Books , commonly call'd Apocrypha , not being of divine Inspiration , are no part of the Canon of the Scriptures , & therefore are of no Authority in the Church of God , nor to be any otherwise approved or made use of , then other human Writings : Thus farr the Assembly ; but this general Debasement of these Books we cannot own . 1 Sam 28. 11. 〈◊〉 This Contra-distinction is his own or Tutor's Inventing . * Mark well . pag. 93. pag. 94. pag. 95. pag. 96. * Though they seem to render Adam worse then the Devil ( who is the Author of sin and Immediate Tempter to it ) & to lay more to Adam's Charge then to the Devil or their own corrupt Hearts and vile Affections which constantly att●…nd them . pag. 98. Luk. 15. 18 , 19. pag. 99. To his 10. & 11th Argum. pag. 89. pag. 130. pag. 100. pag. 100. The Apostles Doctrine & our Opposers Inconsistent . * Many more Comparisons & instances might be produced to 〈◊〉 how inconsisient our Opposers are with the true Apostles and their Doctrine . Object . pag. 101. pag. 102. Notewhat Doctrine is here . Phil. 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8 , 9. Arg. 12. 13. pag. 103. pag. 103. 104. pag. 104. pag. 106. pag. 102. pag. 104. Truth saith not this to Christ , but to the Offenders , Deut. 27. A Testimony against S. S's Doctrine . Isa. 43. 11 , 25. pag. 104. pag. 104. pag. 105. As S. S. hath pag. 105. Also his Brother T. Dans. saith , Christ was not Innocent , but guilty of our Sins , when he suffered , Synops. p. 36 , 40. pag. 105. pag. 105. Heb. 12. 24. Chap. 9. 14 , 15. pag. 106. Christ's tasting Death for every Man could not be the same with the full Punishment that 's due for Sin. pag. 106. pag. 107. pag. 108. Is not this like the Language of Hell ? or theirs saing of Christ , will he kil himself ? And he is guilty of death . This is something like his Brother W. Haworth his Affirming , [ That the Father poured out all his Wrath upon his Son Jesus Christ ] and that this way he Satisfied Vengeance , which he cals his Justice , in his Epistle to their Quaker Converted ; answered by John Crook , and W. Bayly , in their Book Rebellion rebuked , but the Adversaries of Truth shall finde there 's wrath yet for them , if they repent not . pag. 109. pag. 109. pag. 109. pag. 109. pag. 110. pag. 110. Object . 〈◊〉 Hebr. 9. 23. The Presbyterians , or Predestinarians Gospel anti-scriptural . The Conditions and Tendence of the Quakers Gospel Scriptural . Presbyter : Opinion . * [ What soever ] makes no Exception of either good or bad Actions of men ; and this is high Ranterism . * Note , They place it upon particular Persons , rendering God a Respecter of Persons . * Whereas he dyed for all men , and is a Propitiation for the Sins of the whole World. These were of cur Opposers . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is Order , or Rank , 1 Cor. 15. 23. Edom relates to the Earthly Birth . Gen. 35. 10. Confession of Faith. The Hardness and Cruelty of Pharaoh , 〈◊〉 app●…ared against the Hebrews witness the Murtherous Intentio●… of that King , who gave Command to kill th●… Male-children , Exod . 1. 16. & their great Affliction & Bondage , v. 11 , 14. until the Lord heard their Cry , a●…ter much Forbcarance . pag. 115. * Which is our Sense of the Matter in both . * Note the Consequences of the Predestina●…ian Opinion against universa●… Grace . Pag. 116. 1 Sam. 11. 5 , 15. & 12. 9. Psal. 89 These many do slight and refuse , and both resist , grieve & quench the Spirit in its low and tender Appearance to their own Destruction and Misery , when the Love and long Suffering of God is turned into Wrath and Indignation against them . * How long before their Conformity to Christ were they appointed ? Was it from all Eternity , or rather in their Age and Time ? Had not this and all other meer Acts and Works of God a beginning in their time and season ( considered as meer Acts ) Could this of his appointment then be from eternity and so far a Preappointment meerly respecting particular Persons , and with exclusion of all besides from any saving Grace ? This is still harsh , and partial , and unequal , contrary to God's Wayes ; although as the general Fore-appointment and Ordination of God concerning the true Believers and obedient , is , that they shall be saved : So this Predestina ion , or Fore-appointment includes or reaches all the many holy Brethren in whom Christ is formed . Vid. Mass in Lat. & Eng. by Ja. Mountain , pag. 121 , 122 , 123. pag. 69. Pag. 69. Pag. 70. Pag. 70. Indef . Seek . pag. 71. The Light within the Rule . Pag. 74. Vide Gill's Sermen on Eccl. 7. 19 , 20. in his Essay . * Dialoge , 1 Cor. 15. 22 , 23. 2 Cor. 5. 1. 8. Phil. 1. 21. Acts 17. 30 , 31. Mat. 10. 15. & 11. 22 , 24. & 12. 36. Job . 21. 30. 2 Pet. 2. 9. & 3. 7. Psal. 102. 25. Hebr. 1. 10 , 11 , 21. See also 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 . Chap. 19. 〈◊〉 * He takes It for Idem , the Self same Body ; but where hath he this ●…ither from the Greek or Latine on the place cited ? Isa. 3. 9. Luk. 20. 35. * T. D. 〈◊〉 Note . Pag. 16. * Note , Then not the same gross Bodies ; but as a pure Extract . * Which cannot be This 〈◊〉 Flesh. * Not ? Why are we not then to have as spiritual a Sense of the Resurrection ? * Nay , they shall have far better . * A Glory 〈◊〉 that of 〈◊〉 Earthly Bodies . * Not only , as spiritually qualified ; but as a spiritual Body . * Which excel all Terrestrial Bodies . * Concerning the Judgment of the Wiked . * Which is not Carnal ; but Spiritual . * And who must make so vile and like Devils ? * And who must drag the Devils to Judgment then , if they must be so officious for Justice ? * What sad Work 's here ? * He thinks of a Good Place for himself however . * Rather an empty talk to sell at a dear ra●… . * Presbyters are not wont to be so free . * Is it so ? then God did not decree it as his own meer Wist & Pleasure . 〈◊〉 personal Election and Reprobation . * Was he so ? Good Doctrine : But then he did not decree their Damnation from eternity . * True ; then the true light was freely given to them , to shew them the Way out of evil . * That was their Fault still , and not Gods Decre●… . * What will become of the Covetous Priests and Presbyters then ? * And so did many of the Presbyters when parish Priests . * An Uncharitable Sentence . * The guilty Conscience and d●…filed Mind is attended with such Imaginations of Torments , which though they are not real , but Imaginary , yet they produce a real Torment and Horror to some ; and in these things appears an Image of that future Darkness that the Wicked will have their due Rewards in : But these frightfull Stories of T. Vincent's do not fright People out of their Sins , nor reach their Cons●… for that End. They must be directed to the LIGHT which discovers Sin , and disturbeth Men in their wicked Courses ( as he cor●…sesseth ) To this they must come , and bring their Deeds , whoever escape Damnation , or attain to the blessed Resurrection and future Glory . From a true Sence and Knowledge of the Terrors of the Lord , men may be perswaded from Evil to Good ; and their Hearts become broken with a sence of his Goodness therein , when meer Dreams and Fancies will not fright them to Heaven ; nor truly reduce them from any Sin or Evil. * Note . 2 Cor. 5.