The humble representation of the Commission of the Generall Assembly to the Honourable Estates of Parliament upon their declaration lately communicate [sic] to us, Edinburgh, 28 Aprile, 1648. Church of Scotland. General Assembly. Commission. This text is an enriched version of the TCP digital transcription A42762 of text R21600 in the English Short Title Catalog (Wing G750). Textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. The text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with MorphAdorner. The annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). Textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. This text has not been fully proofread Approx. 58 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 15 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images. EarlyPrint Project Evanston,IL, Notre Dame, IN, St. Louis, MO 2017 A42762 Wing G750 ESTC R21600 12180385 ocm 12180385 55625 This keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the Early English Books Online Text Creation Partnership. This Phase I text is available for reuse, according to the terms of Creative Commons 0 1.0 Universal . The text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A42762) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 55625) Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1641-1700 ; 762:9) The humble representation of the Commission of the Generall Assembly to the Honourable Estates of Parliament upon their declaration lately communicate [sic] to us, Edinburgh, 28 Aprile, 1648. Church of Scotland. General Assembly. Commission. Gillespie, George, 1613-1648. 28 p. Printed by Edward Griffin for I.R. ..., London : 1648. Wing attributes to George Gillespie. Reproduction of original in the University of Illinois (Urbana-Champaign Campus). Library. eng Great Britain -- Politics and government -- 1642-1649. A42762 R21600 (Wing G750). civilwar no The humble representation of the Commission of the Generall Assembly, to the Honourable Estates of Parliament, upon their declaration lately Church of Scotland. General Assembly. Commission 1648 10848 3 0 0 0 0 0 3 B The rate of 3 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the B category of texts with fewer than 10 defects per 10,000 words. 2003-04 TCP Assigned for keying and markup 2003-05 SPi Global Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2004-01 Emma (Leeson) Huber Sampled and proofread 2004-01 Emma (Leeson) Huber Text and markup reviewed and edited 2004-02 pfs Batch review (QC) and XML conversion THE HUMBLE REPRESENTATION OF THE COMMISSION OF THE GENERALL ASSEMBLY To the Honourable Estates of Parliament , upon their Declaration lately communicate to us . Edinburgh , 28. Aprile 1648. Printed at London by Edward Griffin for I. R. at the Sun in Pauls-Church-yard . 1648. THE HUMBLE REPRESENTATION OF THE COMMISSION OF THE GENERALL ASSEMBLY To the Honourable Estates of Parliament , upon their Declaration lately communicate to us . Edinburgh , 28 Aprile 1648. SEing your Lordships have been pleased in your Answer to us of the twentie of this Moneth to remit us to your Declaration to the Kingdome , for satisfaction to our eight desires formerly presented to your Lordships , as likewise to our other desire concerning applications to bee made to the King as well as to the Parliament of England ; And seeing your Lordships in the same Paper answering our desire to be satisfied in the whole matter , were pleased again to remit us to the Declaration , as containing the grounds and resolutions of the Parliament on the whole matter . Wee have therefore taken to our serious consideration your Lordships Declaration , to look after satisfactorie answers to these our desires , and to be satisfied on the whole matter : But instead thereof , our feares and dissatisfactions are not a little increased by your Lordships Declaration . Wee shall not search into some particulars in matter of fact , mentioned in the narrative part , neither shall we be curious after the reason , why in so large a Declaration concerning publict dangers , duties , and remedies , There is no expression for preservation of Monarchicall , Government in his Majesties Posteritie as well as in his own Person . To the Preface we shall only say this much , that we could have wished your Lordships had been pleased to expresse your selves more plainly , who are those obstructers and traducers of your Lordships proceedings : those deceivers and abusers of the people , which your Lordships ( we suppose ) point at in reference to this Kingdome , the Declaration being intended for the Subjects of this Kingdome , whom your Lordships call the abused People ; If your Lordships meaning be , that the People are abused by the lies and calumnies of Malignants , how comes it that so much favour and forbearance is granted to such men ? if any others then the Malignant party in the Kingdome be meant , we should be glade they were made known . In the first part of the narrative , concerning the necessity occasion and consequence of the conjunction of both Kingdomes , We cannot but take notice of that which your Lordships say of those common enemies , by whose counsels and practises the composing of differences in the beginning was hindered , and what evils this Kingdome might have expected , if these counsels and advices which gave first life and motion to these dissentions , should have been still prevalent , We desire it may not be forgotten who were these common enemies , and whose counsell it was that did prevaile about his Majesty in the beginning of these troubles , and whether there ought not to be a jealous and watchfull eye over any such , if even after their joyning in the Covenant they be found in a way of compliance with known Malignants , and in a way of opposition to such as have been most active and zealous in the Cause from the beginning . Your Lordships adde , that in pursuance of the Covenant this Kingdom joyned in Arms with their Brethren of England , and did prosecute these ends till their common enemies were subdued , and most of them brought to such condigne punishment , as the respective Parliaments thought fit . We shall heer passe your Lordships omitting of the Treaty between the Kingdomes , which may be thought to have had a neer and immediate influence in reference to the conjunction of these Kingdomes in Arms , although the Covenant was the chief foundation thereof : But whereas your Lordships seem to intimate that the cloud of Malignancie was then sufficiently dissipat , or at least that the Covenant was sufficiently performed in bringing Delinquents to such condigne punishment as the respective Parliaments thought fit ; We are sory that we have cause to remember what sorbearance , yea , favour and friendship hath been granted to many such : and we are so far from thinking the danger from these former common enemies past and gone , that we still see Malignancie upon the one hand , as Sectarisine upon the other springing up like roots of bitternesse to trouble , yea , to defile many in these Kingdomes . these are the horns which yet push Iudah and Ierusalem on both sides , the Lord prepare such carpenters as may cut off both the one and the other . As for the breaches of Covenant which your Lordships insist upon in the following part of your narrative , we wish your Lordships to remember a passage in the Declaration of the Generall Assembly , and how cautiously they speak of the breach of Covenant in England ▪ the words are these , We would not be understood as if we meant either to justifie this Nation , or to charge such a sin upon all in that Nation ; We know the Covenant hath been in diverse particulars broken by many in both Kingdoms , ( The Lord pardon it and accept a sacrifice ) and we do not doubt but there are many seven thousands in England who have not only kept themselves unspotted and retained their integritie in that bussinesse , &c. That the Covenant hath been foully and shamefully broken by as many of the prevalent party of Sectaries and their adherents , as ever took the Covenant ; is clear and undenyable , and by their meanes hath come the resisting and hindering of Reformation , connivance at Heresie and Schisme , and other things contrary to the Covenant ; But it can as little be doubted of , that there are dangerous breaches of Covenant by Malignants , both at home and abroad ; And your Lordships know , true zeale against breach of Covenant should strike equally on both hands , beginning to reforme at home . Your Lordships say well , that the not takers of the Covenant are by the joynt Declaration of both Kingdomes declared to be publict enemies to Religion and Countrey , and are to be punished as professed Adversaries and Malignants : but we wish your Lordships may not forget to apply that passage of the said Declaration to those who have not to this day taken the Covenant in England , and that therefore , they may be looks upon by your Lordships as common enemies which ought to be suppressed and punished . The laying aside of the Covenant out of the new Propositions sent to his Majesty to the Isle of Wight we utterly disapprove , and are heartily sorry for it : but we wish there had not been some guiltinesse of this same kinde at home , when it was carried in the Committee of Estates , that there should be no mention of the Covenant in the publick desires sent up in August last to his Majesty . And whereas your Lordships do enumerate amongst these breaches of Covenant that they who ought to be brought to try all and condigne punishment for hindering the Reformation of Religion , dividing the King from his People , or one of the Kingdomes from another , or making any faction or party among the People , contrary to the League and Covenant , have been protected and assisted ; We shall heer only desire your Lordships to remember , that all this is true of Malignants , as well as of Sectaries : and for our part , ( whatsoever liberty there be in the manner or circumstances ) wee do not doubt , but the thing itself is necessary , both by the Word of God , and Solemne Covenant , viz. That justice be done and condigne punishments inflicted on all hinderers of Reformation and Peace , and all who make factions contrary to the Covenant , whether they be Sectaries or Malignants : But if it was sufficient that the most part of the Malignants were brought to such condigne punishment , as the respective Parliaments thought fit , which your Lordships gave us a touch of in the precedent part of your narrative , we leave it to your Lordships consideration , whether you do not hereby furnish such a retortion to those that favour the Sectaries in England , as that they may plead from that principle in your Lordships Declaration , that the punishment of Sectaries is to be referred simplie to the Parliament of England as they think fit , and that your Lordships must allow them the same latitude of favour toward the Sectaries , as before you have allowed both to your selves and them towards the Malignants . Your Lordships adde as another breach of Covenant , that instead of a firme Union and Peace between the Kingdomes , a breach hath been endeavoured , which can not be denyed to be a breach of Covenant , and therefore a rock to be the more carefully avoided ; It is our grief that there is also cause to complain of the Malignant party at home , as no lesse guilty of endeavouring a breach between the Kingdomes . The attemps , injuries , and violences of that party of Sectaries against his Majesties Royall Person , and the hard condition he is reduced unto by their means , we are very sensible of : And , as we have often before professed , our prayers and endeavours according to our place and calling , have not been neither shall be wanting for the preservation of his Majesties Person and Authority , in the preservation of the true Religion , and liberties of the Kingdomes : And we leave it to be pondered by your Lordships , whether they that obstruct and hinder the requiring of satisfaction and security from his Majestie , in point of Religion , before his restitution to the exercise of his Royall Power , do not upon the matter , and by consequence obstruct and hinder his Majesties deliverance and restitution , whereof such securitie and assurance had from his Majestie , might be a powerfull and effectuall means . As we know not whom your Lordships mean when you speak of such , as had warrand from the Parliament of this Kingdome , for accesse to his Majestie , and yet were debarred , and as no violence nor injurie offered to a publick Minister of another Kingdome can be excused , so we are informed , that the souldiers Act in removing once the Earle of Lauderdale from Wooburn , was not only disclamed , but his Lordship often thereafter permitted free accesse to his Majestie . Your Lordships insist upon three instances of the breach of Treaties , one of the large Treaty , and two other breaches of the Treaty , 1643. As to the first , ( which for orders sake we begin at ) We cannot say that it holds forth any convincing clearnes to us ; Yea so far as we understand , the thing whereunto the Kingdom of England was bound by the Treaty , was not insisted upon by the Commissioners of this Kingdom at London , but ane alternative , for assistance against the Rebels by Forces or Moneys ; After which the Parliament of this Kingdome made a desire of assistance by Moneys , which the Parliament of England promised to take into their consideration ; And seeing your Lordships in this same Declaration wave breaches of Treaty in Money-matters , even where the Money was due by Treaty , Wee hope your Lordships will find it the more inexpedient to insist upon the not obtaining of that assistance by Moneys against the rebels , being a way not provided by the Treaty . Concerning the other two breaches which pitch upon the Treaty , 1643. First , your Lordships say , that according to the first article of that Treaty , the Covenant should have been taken by both Kingdomes , but that now by the prevalent party of Sectaries and their adherents , it is not only laid aside in the new Propositions , and no execution of publick Orders for taking it throughout the Countrey , but many in places of trust have never taken it , neither are urged to take it . Certainly such slighting of the Covenant is a great sin against GOD , and a high contempt of the Covenant ; And it is very fit that this Kingdome should desire the Parliament of England to presse it , not only upon persons of trust , but universally on all the Subjects of that Kingdome : yet we are not convinced of any just ground of War against that Kingdome , in that which hath been instanced by your Lordships , especially considering that the Covenant was taken by the Representatives , and other chief corporations in England , whereupon both the Generall Assembly , and the Parliament of this Kingdome have frequently mentioned in their Acts , Letters , and Declarations , the Union and conjunction of both Kingdomes by Solemne Covenant : neither are we without hopes , if things be carried on in a fair and right way that the Kingdome of England may be brought a further length in the performance of this dutie ; Whereof we are the more confident , because of the famous and frequent testimonies given to the Covenant , and against the errours of the time , by the Ministry in diverse Provinces in England . As for the last breach , which your Lordships conceive to be against the eighth Article of the same Treaty , 1643. Wee heartily wish , that the joint way of applications to the King by both Kingdomes once begun , had been continued , and do conceive very much prejudice to the Cause by the divided way : only we offer it to your Lordships further consideration , whither this breach be not at least disputable , there being no mention at all in that Article of Proposals , Propositions , or Bills , but only of Cessation , Pacification and agreement for Peace ; So that it may justly be doubted whether the sending of those Proposalls and Bills to the King without the consent of this Kingdome , hath in it that certainty and clearnesse of a breach of Treaty between the Kingdomes , as may be a ground of War : And if it be a breach of the Treaty for either Kingdome singly and dividedly to send Propositions to his Majestie . We shall crave leave that we may desire to be informed , how this consisteth with that latitude which your Lordships leave afterwards in this same Declaration in the manner of presenting Bills or Acts of Parliament to the King , for your Lordships desire assurance of his Majestie to agree to such Acts or Bills as shall be presented to him by his Parliaments of both or either Kingdomes , respectivè . We might also insist upon some Papers and Propositions presented to his Majestie from this Kingdome at Newcastle , and much more upon the Pacification concluded there , with his Majestie , in reference to the disbanding and removing of the Rebels in this Kingdome , and that in a single way ( as we conceive ) without the knowledge , and concurrance of the Parliament of England . But we shall come to that which your Lordships make the result upon all these breaches of Covenant and Treaties , viz. That they call upon your Lordships to a duty to GOD , your King and Countrey , and to your oppressed Brethren in England , which your Lordships speake more plainly in the next Clause , giving us to understand , that those differences or breaches are such , as if not repared by amicable endeavours , may otherwise necessitat this Kingdome to engadge in a War , but that first your Lordships intend to send the three desires ( next mentioned in the Declaration ) to the Parliament of England : And this is all the satisfaction we find to our second desire , which was , that according to the Treaties it may be condescended upon , and declared by the Parliament , what are those breaches of Peace which they take to be ae ground of War , and that reparation thereof may be sought . But as we see no breach of Peace instanced in the Declaration , and as the three breaches of Treaties insisted upon by your Lordships , seem to be at least debatable ; So we hear nothing of any resolution of Parliament , that such breaches as are , or shall be condescended upon by your Lordships , shall be made known and sent to the Parliament of England , as we expected and they have desired by their Commissioners here : Only we hear of three desires to be sent to the Parliament of England for Religion , his Majestie and the Good and Peace of these Kingdomes : Wee conceive 't is the best and most justifiable way of proceeding , that publick , as well as private injuries be declared and made known to these whom it concerneth to give satisfaction therein . Besides all this we fear your Lordships will hardly avoid a Nationall quarrell against the Parliament of England , if the three instances before mentioned be insisted upon as breaches of Treaty to inferre a War ; Because when the Houses were most free , and when there was no such over-awing influence of the Sectaries party , even then they did not suppresse the Irishes in this Kingdome , they did not enforce the Covenant on all their Officers , much lesse on all English Subjects , neither would they then admit that they were oblieged by Treaty not to send Propositions or Bills to the King , without the concurrance of this Kingdome . In all this that we have said , it is far from our meaning to assume any judgement of the Treaties between the Kingdoms ; Only because your Lordships have remitted us to the Declaration , for satisfaction to our consciences , as in other particulars , so in this of the breaches , We have humbly represented to your Lordships , wherein we are not clear and satisfied in our consciences , to consent and concurre for our part upon such grounds . And withall , seeing it is not only our desire as Messengers of Peace , but your Lordships prosessed resolution in this Declaration that you will assay all Brotherly and amicable wayes , for reparing differences and making up breaches , Wee recommend it to your Lordships serious thoughts , whether it will not be most agreeable to that Brotherly way of proceeding between two Kingdomes in Covenant together , to desire a Treaty with the Parliament of England , concerning the breaches and demands mentioned in this your Declaration , Especially seeing the way of Treaty was the way thought fit to be used in the years 1639. and 1640. before the Kingdomes were joined in Covenant ; How much more now , being so conjoined , are all possible and lawfull wayes to be tried for preventing the effusion of more blood . In your Lordships first demand which concerneth Religion , there are some things where with we can not in our consciences be satisfied , as namely , 1. Because the first two particulars therein contained , viz. concerning the taking of the Covenant , and practising of the Directory of Worship are pressed only upon Subjects , which may be interpreted as tending to exempt the Kings Majestie , not only from taking the Covenant , ( which yet was laudably desired in the Propositions of both Kingdomes ) but from having the Directory of Worship practised in his Family , which was a liberty that his Majestie reserved to himself in his late Concessions sent to us , and in diverse messages before sent to the Houses of Parliament at Westminster . 2. We find nothing in this demand of any application to be made at , or about the same time to the King for obtaining assurance from his Majestie for his Royall consent ; But of this we have expressed our selves more fully in answer to your Lordships Paper of the twentiethof this Month. 3 Although this is the second time your Lordships cite in this Declaration a passage of the joint Declaration of both Kingdoms , by which all that would not take the Covenant were declared to be publick enemies to their Religion and Countrey , and that they are to be censured and punished as professed Adversaries and Malignants ; yet we find no such thing declared or resolved by your Lordships in this Declaration , in reference to those who have not to this day taken the Covenant , as that you will hold them all for professed Adversaries and Malignants . We hope your Lordships will not think it just nor equall to presse such a rule upon the Parliament of England , except your Lordships be pleased to walk according to that rule your selves . 4. Your Lordships do simply and absolutly desire , that the Confession of Faith transmitted from the Assembly of Divines at Westminster , to the Houses , be approven ; Whereas the Act of the last Generall Assembly , approving that Confession of Faith , hath in it some necessary cautions , provisoes , and explanations , which as the Generall Assembly judged necessary to be added in their Act , so we do not think that part of your Lordships demand as itstands without any such caution to be safe enough : which among other things shewes the danger and inconvenience of your Lordships taking resolutions in things concerning Religion without our advice and consent , 5. As we desire that , Reformation of , and Uniformity in Religion , may be endeavoured by your Lordships in all fair , lawfull , and brotherly wayes according to the Covenant , and heartily approve any such desire as your Lordships shall send to the Parliament of England , by the advice and consent of this Kirk , for injoying the Covenant , and for bringing the Churches of CHRIST in the three Kingdomes to the nearest Conjunction and Uniformity in one Confession of Faith , Directory of Worship , and Presbyteriall Government ; So we would be very cautious , and tender when such desires are turned into causes of War , if not obtained , which is the present case , as we understand by your Lordships expression in the precedent paragraphe . Your Lordships second demand is . That the Kings Majestie may come to some of his Houses in , or near London , with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , that applications may be made to him by Parliamonts of both Kingdomes , for attaining his Royall assent to such desires as shall be by them presented to him for establishing Religion as is above exprest , and setling a well grounded Peace . This demand we conceive to be of dangerous consequence to Religion and the Covenant for the reasons and considerations following , which we humbly offer to be considered by your Lordships , 1. All applications and desires to his Majesty for Religion are suspended till he come with Honour , Freedome , and Safety to some of his Houses , in , or near London ; We know not what length of time this may draw to , or how much danger there may be in the delay . 2. The establishing of Religion here mentioned , as that which your Lordships intend to desire of his Majestie , is according to that which is above expressed , where we doubt not your Lordships referre to your first demand which went before ; Whereas the establishing of Religion in such a manner as is there expressed , we do not think safe , for the reasons before given . 3. We conceive that this second demand amounts to no lesse then the restitution of his Majestie to the exercise of his Royall Power before Applications made , and desires presented to him , much more before assurance and security had from him , for the setling of Religion in the right manner , and according to the Covenant . For besides what we have expressed in our last Paper presented to your Lordships , that this honour , freedome , and safety is conceived by your Lordships to be such , as may enable his Majestie to effectuat his Concessions concerning Religion ; And what is that lesse then the exercise of his Royall power restored ? This we further adde , that we humbly conceive his Majesties Honour may comprehend , or may be made use of as comprehending , not only the possession of his Revenews , but also the exercise of his Royall Government : Next , being in freedome , he may repare to any part of his Dominions in Scotland , England or Ireland ; And lastly , being restored to be in a condition of safety , he may provide Forces for guarding Himself against all apprehended dangers , for if Guards should be set about him by his Parliament , it will be said to be contrary to the condition of freedome : So that being restored to some of his Houses , in , or near London , with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , We do not conceive what he shall want of the exercise of his Royall Power ; Considering withall , that neither Himself , nor any others will conceive the Honour , Freedome , and Safety to be Kingly , and such as becomes his Royall Person , if he shall want the exercise of his Royall Power : Yet this restitution of his Majestie to the exercise of his Royall Power , before security had from him for settling Religion , Your Lordships know by our eight Desires , and otherwayes , is conceived by us to be inconsistent with the safety and security of Religion . 4. If his Majestie were once come with Honour , Freedome , and Safety to some of his Houses , in , or near London , We know not what influences he may have upon the Houses of Parliament to obstruct and hinder their presenting of Bills to Him , for enjoining the Covenant , abolishing Prelacy , and the Book of Common-prayer , Establishing the Confession of Faith , Directory of Worship , and Presbyteriall Government ; Or what strength his Majesty so restored may again attain by the assistance of the Popish , Prelaticall , and Malignant party , for a new and bloody War , to the devastation of these Kingdomes , and the ruine of our Religion and Liberties . Which things we have the more cause to fear and apprehend , his Majesty having declared and professed , that he is oblieged in conscience to emprove all the power which GOD shall put in his hands , for the establishment of Episcopacy . 5. To insist upon the bringing of his Majesty to some of his Houses , in , or neer London , before satisfaction and security had from him in point of Religion , and in such other things as are necessary for the safety of the Kingdomes , could not as we conceive but be an exceeding great discouragement and offence to the Presbyterians in England , who will conceive ( if such a thing be pressed upon them ) that the remedy propounded in your demand is worse then the disease . And we have also heard , that the Parliament of England , when they were as free as ever they were , would never agree to his Majesties comming to London , with honour , freedome , and safety , without security first had from him in such things as are necessary for Religion , and the safety of the Kingdome . 6. Seing your Lordships are oblieged by the third Article of the Covenant , to defend his Majesties Person and Authority , in the perservation and defence of the true Religion , and Liberties of the Kingdomes ; We conceive your Lordships should not demand from , nor presse upon the Kingdome of England , His Majesties restitution with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , except with that qualification in the Covenant , and with a subordination to Religion and the Liberties of the Kingdoms . And how can this subordination according to the Covenant be said to be observed in your Lordships demand as it stands ; for , if His Majesty be brought to some of His Houses , in or near London , with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , before so much as applications be made to Him for establishing Religion and Peace , we then leave it to your Lordships consciences , whether His Majestie shall not be restored to His Honour , before JESUS CHRIST be restored to His Honour , and set upon His Throne of Government in His Church : Whether His Majesty shall not be in a condition of Libertie before the Ordinances of CHRIST have a free course , and whether His Majesties safety shall not be provided for and secured , before either Church , or Kingdome can say they are in a condition of safetie . And is this to endeavour the setling of Religion before all worldly interests , or rather to make it come after the Kings interest ? 7. We fear that if after so many instructions from the Parliament , Convention , and Committee of Estates to their Commissioners at London , from time to time , for endeavouring in the first place , the setlement of Religion , and then to endeavour the removing of the Civill differences , and the restitution of the King , upon His first giving satisfaction in Religion and the grounds of a solide Peace ; And if after it was declared by this Kingdome , ( during His Majesties being at Newcastle ) that they could not admit of His Majesties coming to Scotland in freedome , unlesse His Majesty granted the Proposition concerning the Covenant and Religion , and gave a satisfactory Answer to the rest of the Propositions ; Likewise , if after such a Declaration of the Parliament of this Kingdome , Ianuary 16. 1647. for His Majesties being in some of His Houses , with such attendance as the two Houses should think fit , untill He give satisfaction in the Propositions ; If after all this it be now insisted upon , that His Majestie may be restored with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , before such satisfaction had from Him , we fear it shall lye as a great scandale upon this Kingdome , and as too sensible and apparent a change of their former principales and professions in a point so much concerning the security of Religion . 8. We are very apprehensive , that your Lordships urging the disposall of the Kings Person in England , in such a way as that he may come to London with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , without his Majesties giving , or Your Lordships desiring his Majestie to give satisfaction and securitie in Religion , and in such things as belong to the safety of the Kingdome ( without which there can be no lasting security expected to Religion ) As it is a farre different point from the urging of a joint interest in the disposing of the Kings Person by both Kingdomes for the good of both , So it will be judged by most of all parties in England , that ever concurred in this Cause , to be so prejudiciall to their Nationall Rights and Liberties , and such an encroachment thereupon ( though your eLordships declare you have no such intention ) as that it will unite them all in opposition to this Kingdome , and consequently alienate them from the intended Uniformity in Religion , according to the Covenant . As these reasons make us conceive your Lordships second demand to import no small danger to Religion , So we would not be understood as if we had any thoughts to decline the restoring of his Majestie to the same condition he was in , by the agreement of both Kingdomes , when he was taken away by a party of the Army under the command of Sir Thomas Fairfax , That both Kingdomes may freely make their applications to Him . Concerning your Lordships third demand , That the present Army of Sectaries may bee disbanded , for the ends expressed in the demand , As we think no persons whatsoever fit to be imployed or entrusted in the Armies of either Kingdome , we have not taken the Covenant , And that all Sectaries in England that are in Armes should be disbanded and disarmed , So we conceive there is also reason for your Lordships to foresee , and provide against the danger of the rising again of the Popish Prelaticall and Malignant party in Armes , and the rather , because of the late commotions begun by some of them both in England and Ireland ; These being also some both in Wales and Ireland actually in armes , who have discovered and declared their principles and ends to be very Malignant ; Wherein we are informed they are the more animated and encouraged upon confidence of some agreement between his Majestie and this Kingdome . It is further to be considered , that this Demand being joined with the second , the present Army in England disbanded , and his Majestie brought to London with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , how easily may all the Malignant , Popish and Prelaticall party in his Majesties Dominions flock unto him ? Which how prejudiciall it may be , his Majestie keeping still his principles , is easie to be judged . As for the exceptions added in your Lordships demand , to passe the ambiguity thereof , your Lordships except from the said disbanding , the Garisons necessary to be kept in England and desire that these Garisons may be commanded by such , as have or shall take the Covenant , and are well affected to Religion and Government , but do not desire any such thing concerning the Garisons themselves ; Which may be understood as a tacite Confession on your part that all the Garisons to be kept in England , may be of such as have not taken nor shall take the Covenant , nor are well affected to Religion and Government , provided that those Garisons be commanded by such as your Lordships describe . We have but one point more to adde , concerning this third and last demand . For we cannot conceale our feares and apprehensions , that your present resolutions and proceedings , and the entertainment of English Souldiers , whereof many are Papists and Malignants , and some eminent in Malignancy , is not the way to further , but to retard and hinder the disbanding of the present Army in England , and to frustrate the en● your Lordships propose in your Declaration for the disbanding of that army . And whereas your Lordships declare , that it is not your intention at all to make a Nationall engadgement against the Parliament and Kingdome of England , but for them ; As we shall not presume to speake of the Nation 〈◊〉 Rights and Priviledges of another Kingdome , So we cannot see how the principles of your Lordships Declaration can consist with the first part of our third desire , which was ; That there may be no such quarrell or ground of the War as may break the Union between the Kingdomes ; For we conceive there are diverse such quarrels in the Declaration as fall directly and necessarly upon the votes and proceedings of the Houses of Parliament , even when they were most free . Concerning that which your Lordships adde in reference to the latter part of our third desire , and to our whole fourth desire . We humbly conceive , it is very far short of that which is no lesse your Lordships du●●y then our desire ; for , 〈◊〉 Your Lordships only declare against Association and Conjunction of Forces with those who shall refuse to swear and subscribe the Covenant , which doth not exclude Association of Forces with such as neither have taken , nor shall take the Covenant , so that they be not urged to 〈◊〉 , and so not reckoned amongst refusers . This we have the more reason to take notice of , because your Lordships have before in this same Declaration complained that there is no urging of the Covenant in England , nor no execution of Publict Orders for taking of the same . Which being so ; How shall your Lordships find the Malignants in England to be refusers of the Covenant , except your Lordships enforce it upon them , Which we suppose your Lordships intend not to do ? 2. YourLordships do not declare , that if any who have not taken , and shall not take the Covenant , may not so much as they that shall refuse the Covenant ; if they rise in Armes , your Lordships will oppose them , and endeavour to suppresse them , only your Lordships say , you will not associat nor joine Forces with them . 3. Whereas your Lordships say , That you will be so far from joyning , or associating with the Popish . Prelaticall , or Malignant party , if they shall again rise in Armes ; either to oppose or obstruct ! all or any one of the Ends of the Covenant , that you will oppose and endeavour to suppresse them as ; enemies to the Cause and Covenant ; We beseech your Lordships to consider , whether this part of your Declaration doth not reserve a latitude , that if the Popish , Prelaticall , or Malignant party shall rise in Armes for the Kings restitution ; and can but have so much cunning ( which is more nor probable ) as to conceale their intentions of obstructing or opposing all , or any one of the Ends of the Covenant , in such a case it may be free to your Lordships in stead of opposing or endeavouring to suppresse them , that you shall both protect their persons and estates , and also joyne or associate Forces with them . In all which we have the more cause to be full of feares and apprehensions , because of so many English Malignants , even now protected and intertained in this Kingdome , in hopes of military employments , yea diverse of them ( as we are informed ) such as have served against this Cause and Covenant . As to that which follows relating to our seventh desire , concerning such as are to be entrusted in Armies and Committies , we shall need to say no more then was expressed in our humble Representation , March 29. Namely , that your Lordships omit in your Answer some of the qualifications expressed in our desire , viz. such as have given constant proof of their integrity and faithfulnesse in this Cause , and against whom there is no just cause of jealousie , that so we may the more confidently encourage our Flocks to follow the Cause of GOD in their hands , and not to doubt of their fidelity ; Which qualifications being contained in our desire , and omitted in your Lordships Answer , we are not without fears , that this omission may be made use of by some , as if your Lordships had not meant to agree fully to that desire , and so take occasion to deal for employing and entrusting such in the Committees and Armies , as may be justly excluded by the qualifications contained in our said desire . These things having beene before represented to your Lordships , and there being nothing in your Lordships Declaration to satisfie or take off these our fears , but such expressions insisted upon as keep aloof from the qualifications desired by us , all that are unbyased may easily judge whether we have not herein some reall ground to be unsatisfied . That which followeth in the Declaration concerning the rescuing of His Majesties Person , that He may come with Honour , Freedome , and Safetie so , or near London , where both Kingdomes may make their applications to Him , for setling Religion and Peace , we have before spoken fully to it . And whereas your Lordships adde a kinde of Salvò in satisfaction to our fifth and sixth desires , it will plainly appear that these desires are not satisfied by any thing here expressed in your Lordships Declaration . Your Lordships say , You resolve not to put in His Majesties Hands or in any others whatsoever , any such power whereby any of the ends of the Covenant may bee obstructed or opposed : But may it please your Lordships to give us leave to put you in minde . 1. That your Lordships words may bee understood , either in this sense , that you are not resolved to put any such Power in His Majesties Hands , And if so , your Lordships know , what you resolve not now , you may resolve afterwards ; Or in this sense , that your Lordships are resolved that you shall put no such power in His Majesties Hands , and if so , then their remaines some doubt how far that power extends , which yourLordships conceive shall not be able to obstruct or oppose any of the ends of the Covenant , or endanger Religion and Presbyteriall Government ; Or whether it bee meant to be extended to His Majesties negative voice . 2. When your Lordships say , that you are not resolved to put any such power in His Majesties Hands , This needeth not hinder your Lordships yeelding and acquiescing if others put such power in His Majesties Hands ; For resolutions not to doe a thing , may stand with resolutions not to hinder it . 3. When your Lordships have resolved to oppose the putting of any such power in His Majesties Hands , as may be destructive to Religion ; Yet upon supposition , that His Majestie is come to London with Honour , Freedome and Safetie , wee doubt , whether it may not prove impossible to your Lordships to hinder the putting of such a power in His Majesties Hands . Your Lordships adde what assurance you intend to crave from His Majestie for satisfaction in point of Religion ; But withall , we observe three limitations or qualifications joined therewith , which ( so far as we are able to judge ) leave this great point in a verie dangerous uncertaintie . 1. Your Lordships resolve , that His Majestie give this assurance for Religion , before any agreement or condition to be made with His Majestie , which is the expression chosen by your Lordships in Head of that clause in our sixt desire , Before his restitution to the exercise of his Royill Power . If your Lordships expression were onely a more smooth one , with the like securitie to Religion , ( such as your Lordships Answer March 27. did put us in hopes of ) wee should have chearefully acquiesced : but wee are so far from perceiving the like securitie to Religion , that we rather fear your Lordships qualification may make void and frustrate the securitie that we desired . For first , It clearely supposeth , that His Majestie shall come with Honour , Freedome and Safetie to London , before any agreement or condition to be made with Him ; For such agreement or condition to be made with His Majestie being posterior to the assurance to be had from Him for Religion , must be much more posterior to His Majesties coming to , or neer London with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , according to the method of proceedings proposed in the Declaration ; Now being once at London , with Honour , Freedome , and Safety , and that without any agreement or condition made with Him , it is not probable to us , that His Majesty will then desire any agreement , or condition , unlesse it be for some Concessions on His Parliaments part , and among other Concessions probably somewhat for Episcopacy too , for establishing whereof , He conceiveth Himself oblieged in conscience to make use of His Power as was before observed . The result of this point that we humbly conceive is , that notwithstanding of that clause , before any agreement or condition to be made with His Majesty , or any thing else in the Declaration , His Majesty may be restored to the exercise of His Royall Power before security had from Him for Religion as we desired . The next qualification added by your Lordships , immediatly is in these words , having found His late Concessions and offers concerning Religion not satisfactory ; where first , the words having found , may be variously understood , either , when His Majesty shall have found , or , when your Lordships shall have found , or , because His Majesty hath found , or , because your Lordships have found . Next , the words , not satisfactory , are as doubtfull , and may e interpreted in severall senses , either that His Majesties late Concessions and Offers concerning Religion , are not satisfactory in themselves , or , that they are neither satisfactory to your Lordships , nor to us , or the meaning may be only , that they are not satisfactory to us . Which doubtfulnesse in the sense of the words we have more cause to observe , because your Lordships have not hitherto returned us any clear or positive answer to our fifth desire : That His Majesties late Concessions and Offers concerning Religion , as they have been by the Church , so may be by the Parliament declared unsatisfactorie , Only your Lordships are pleased here to make a light transition over that which we conceived to bee unto us a grave subject of a Solemne Declaration . The third qualification in the assurance to be required from his Majestie , is , that he shall agree to such Act or Acts of Parliament , and Bills , as shall be presented unto Him by His Parliaments of both or either Kingdomes respectively for enjoining the Covenant , and establishing the Presbyteriall Government , Directory of Worship and Confession of Faith in all His Majesties Dominions . But we humbly conceive , it were more for the glory of GOD , good of Religion , and his Majesties own happinesse , that his Majestie should after the example of the Godly reforming Kings of Judah , and of the best Christian Emperours of old in the Christian Church , declare his own zeale and forwardnesse for the Reformation , and setling Religion , and that your Lordships should do well to sollicite and incite his Majestie hereunto , rather then to seem to yeeld so farre , as that his Majestie shall be free for his part , till his Parliaments of both or either Kingdomes respectively agree what Acts or Bills to present to him ; The preparing and presenting whereof , how much it may be retarded and obstructed by the prevalency both of Malignants and Secretaries , we know not : Seeing therefore His Majestie oweth a dutie both to God and to his people for the Reformation and setlement of Religion , your Lordships may do better to sollicite his Majestie , and to desire that he will positively declare himself willing and ready for his part and for that duety which is incumbent to his Majestie , and that he give assurance for the same in the particulars . Your Lordships further declare in reference to our eighth and last desire , that you are willing to subjoine to the ground of your undertaking an Oath , wherein both in the framing thereof and otherwise your Lordships are willing the Church shall have their due interest is formerly in the like cases ; Where , as wee know not how farre your Lordships meaning doth reach in the word , otherwayes , and in the word , due ; So we know not why your Lordships did not think fit to agree to our desire as it was conceived , and as the words stood , viz. That there may bee na ingagement without a Solemn Oath , Wherein the Kirk may have the same : interest which they had in the Solemne League and Covenant , which define is so farre unsatisfied , that for our interest in the matter of the Oath , and in the grounds of the undertaking , we do not see it allowed or preserved to us , But rather that the Declaration holdeth foorth the grounds of the undertaking already resolved upon by your Lordships ; Only leaving us an interest inthe forme of an Oath to bee subjoined , and that not without some uncertaine and dubious qualifications , as hath been touched . Mean while we see only a Declaration without an Oath ; And as Declarations are alterable by Parliaments , and their proceedings sometimes not agreeable to their Declarations ( which the experience of these times hath taught us : ) so it there were an Oath subjoined to the grounds of undertaking expressed in this Declaration , we could not account it a lawfull Oath , but that it would make the bussinesse worse . Your Lordships adde somewhat further , relating to the matter of our first and second desires , namely , That your Lordships are resolved not to engage in any War before the necessity and lamfulnesse thereof be cleared , so as all who are well affected may be satisfied therewith , and that reparation to such breaches and injuries as are , or shall be condescended upon , shall be demanded in such a just and sit way as shall be found most lawfull and expedient . This clause , as likewise that which followeth , that many of the dangers with the grounds and resolutions , are by this Declaration of your Lordships made known to this Kingdom , seems to hold us in suspense , till all the dangers grounds and resolutions be made known , and till the lawfulnesse and necessity of the War bee cleared , and the way of seeking reparation resolved upon ; Yet your Lordships may bee pleased to remember , that in that part of your Answer to us of the twentieth , which is a returne to our desire of knowing fully your Lordships resolutions , and being satisfied on the whole matter , we were remitted to the Declaration , is containing the grounds and resolutions of the Parliament on the whole matter . As to that which followeth , concerning a present putting of the Countrey in a posture of defence as in Anno , 1643. we should be glad it were made to appear really that the grounds , principles and ends were the same now , they were in the year 1643. Otherwise the like Act upon different grounds , and for different ends make it not the same cause . Your Lordships do indeed speak of the principles expressed in the Declaration , as the same with the first principles contained in our Nationall Covenant , and in the Solemne League and Covenant . But what reason we have to conceive they are new and different principles , may appear by the severall particulars before mentioned . We cannot here passe a new interpretation which the Declaration puts upon the Solemne League and Covenant , viz. That we did Solemnly swear and promise before God and his Angels , to endeavour Reformation of , and Uniformitie in Religion and Church Government in all his Majesties Dominions according to the Word of GOD , and the Example of the best reformed Churches ; Where we passe your Lordships limiting and restricting of Uniformity more then the Covenant doth : which may infer that Uniformity in Church Government between the Churches of CHRIST in these three Covenanted Kingdomes , is not to be urged in any other manner or measure then we have a precedent of in other reformed Kirks ; but that which here we chiefly aime at , is the following clause of the Declaration ; viz. And not only to the utmost of our power , with our meanes and lives to stand to the defence of our dread Soveraigne , his Person and Authority in the preservation of the true Religion and Liberties of the Kingdom , but also in every cause which may concerne His Majesties Honour , to concur according to the Lawes of this Kingdom and dutie of good subjects . Yet your Lordships know that no such interpretation hath beene made by the Assemblies of the Kirk of the Solemne League and Covenant , as your Lordships are pleased here to make of it . If it be said , that your Lordships meaning was only of our Nationall Covenant , yet it may be observed withall , that the plain and grammaticall construction of the words will carry that interpretation either upon the Solemne League and Covenant only , or both upon it and upon our Nationall Covenant . How ever , although our Nationall Covenant only were here fixed upon , concerning which there is such an expression in the supplication of the Generall Assembly , Anno 1639. to his Majesties Commissioner and the Lords of Secret Counsell , yet there are some weighty considerations which we humbly offer against the application of that Supplication of the Assembly , to the present businesse ; for , 1. His Majestie was at that time giving satisfaction to the publick desires of this Kirk concerning Religion ; We heartily wish we might say the like now . 2. We do not see the Cause stated in the Declaration to be for his Majesties Honour , and so to fall within that duety expressed in the Declaration of the Generall Assembly . And as one of the ends of the Covenant was His Majesties Honour and Happinesse , and your Lordships also have acknowledged in your Oath of Parliament , that the Honour , Happinesse , and Greatnesse of the Kings Majestie , doth depend on the Purity of Religion as it is now established in this Kingdome , So whatsoever crosseth or prejudiceth the grounds of the Covenant , or any of the ends thereof , cannot with us find any such commendation as to be a cause which concerneth his Majesties Honour . 3. Whatsoever we owe to the King in civill matters distinct from the Cause of Religion , sure all these other dueties are with a subordination to the glory of God , and good of Religion , and we are very confident it was , and will be far from the thoughts of the Generall Assembly , under colour of his Majesties Honour to concur with Him , or any in His Name , in a cause which is hurtfull and prejudiciall to the good of Religion , and to the other ends of the Solemne League and Covenant , yet the cause stated in the Declaration , we humbly conceive to be such . 4. It may be remembred that the Crosse-petition having cited the same clause of the said Petition of the Generall Assembly , and making use thereof in order to an engadgement in War in his Majesties quarrell against the Parliament of England , was declared against by the Commission of the Generall Assembly , Anno 1643. And among other particulars it was then declared , that the limitations expresly mentioned in the words cited out of the Assemblies Supplication , viz. according to the Lawes of this Kingdome , and duety of good Subjects were interpreted by some that spake at the time in the Generall Assembly to be all one , as if it had been said , within this Kingdome , we not knowing of any Lawes of this Kingdome or further extent . It was also then observed and may now be applied and remembred , that the Nationall Covenant having been subscribed in the Yeares 1581. and 1590. before King James was King of England , and being qualified in the particular Heads and Articles by expresse limitations and restrictions to this Kirk and Kingdome , to the Religion , Lawes and Liberties of Sotland , can no more be extended to municipall debates , and to the Laws and Liberties of England , unto which we are strangers , then the Kingdome of England can judge of our Lawes , and determine our differences , the two Kingdoms being still independent each on other , and not subordinate one to another , as the first Article of the large Treaty fully declareth . As to that we finde in the close of the Declaration , that this Kingdome of Scotland will now make it evident , as they have often declared , that their quietnesse , stability , and happinesse doth depend upon the safety of the Kings Majesties Person and maintenance of His Greatnesse , and Royall Authority , who is Gods Vicegerent set over us , for Maintenance of Religion , and Ministration of Justice , we shall only put your Lordships in minde , that your Nationall Covenant joineth with his Majesties Safety , his good behaviour in his Office : and sayeth , That the quietnesse and stability of our Religion and Kirk doth depend upon the safety , and good behaviour of his Majesty , as upon a comfortable Instrument of GODS Mercy granted to this Countrey for the Maintenance of his Kirk , and Ministration of Iustice . Otherwise , if a King do not his duty for the Maintenance of the true Religion , and Ministration of Justice , It is not His safety alone , that make His People to be in quietnesse and happinesse ; Withall , as our quietnes and happinesse dependeth on his Majesty , and his doing of his duty as an Instrument and Minister of God for good ; So the Honour , Greatnesse , and Happinesse of the Kings Royall Majesty , and the welfare of the Subjects , depend upon the purity of Religion , as is well expressed in your Lordships Oath of Parliament . And now we shall with your Lordships favour and permission make this conclusion upon the whole matter , That as we neither were nor are against an engadgement with this Kingdome in War , but have been and shall be willing to consent thereto , If once satisfied in our conscience concerning the clearnes , lawfulnesse , and necessity of the Cause , and quatrell , and concerning our calling , manner of proceeding , Instruments to be entrusted , security to be had for Religion , and other particulars contained in our former Papers not yet satisfied by your Lordships . So we are necessitate to professe & declare to your Lordships , that we cannot , we dare not in our consciences agree to an engagement upon such grounds , and in such a way as is stated in your Lordships Declaration : And therefore , for our exoneration do dissent from the whole complex businesse in the said Declaration , as not containing clear and convincing grounds of undertaking of a War , not providing for the security of Religion , nor clearly disclaiming his Majesties late Concessions and offers as unsatisfactory , not tending to the suppression of the Malignant party , but rather to compliance with them , as we humbly conceive , nor preserving the Liberties and known interest of the Kirk nor proposing the way of Treaties , and all other possible wayes of Peace to be sought and assayed before a War . For which reasons , and others before mentioned , upon the particular heads of the Declaration , we plainly declare our dissent from the complex circumstantiat state of the present busines contained in the said Declaration , And take to witnesse , GOD , Angels , and Men , that your Lordships have not wanted warning from the Watchmen , And that we shall be free of all the distractions , confusions , miseries and blood , which may follow upon your Lordships proceeding to an engadgement in War , upon the grounds of the Declaration . We further call to record , the Searcher of all hearts , and the righteous Judge of all the World . That our not concurring proceedeth not from want of zeale against Sectaries , nor from any remissenes in that which may concern his Majesties true Honour , and Happinesse , and the preservation of Monarchicall Government in Him and His Posterity , nor from any want of tendernes of the Priviledges of Parliament , nor from any want of Sympathie with our afflicted and oppressed Brethren in England , In reference to all which our proceedings have been , and shall be ( we trust ) reall Testimonies of our affection and sincerity ; But our not concurring proceedeth meerly from tendernesse in the point of security of Religion , and Union between the Kingdomes , and from the unsatisfactorinesse of the grounds of your Lordships Declaration as hath been expressed in the particulars . Wherefore we humbly beseech your Lordships to interpret favourably and charitably any liberty which we have used , ( the mater being such as lyeth sad and weighty , upon our Consciences . ) And that your Lordships would also be pleased to be mindfull of making good that passage of your Declaration , where you say that you unresolved not to engadge in any War , before the necessity and , lawfulnesse thereof be cleared , so 〈◊〉 all who are well affected may be satisfied therewith ; Which 〈◊〉 your Lordships shall be pleased to do there is a door of Hope yet open , and we shall not cease to pray unto the Lord ( as he shall assist us ) that a Spirit of Counsell and Understanding and of the fear of the LORD may be upon you , and that GOD would graciously rid both your Lordships and us out of all hid and lurking snares , and so guide your Lordships , as that there may be yet a sweet and harmonious joining of hearts and hands upon right Principles Grounds and motives , in a right way , and for the right Ends . FINIS .