The ivstification of the independant chvrches of Christ being an answer to Mr. Edvvards his booke, which hee hath written against the government of Christ's chvrch and toleration of Christs, publike worship : briefely declaring that the congregations of the saints ought not to have dependancie in government upon any other : or direction in worship from any other than Christ their head and lavv-giver / by Katherine Chidley.
         Chidley, Katherine.
      
       
         This text is an enriched version of the TCP digital transcription A32820 of text R5068 in the  English Short Title Catalog (Wing C3832). Textual changes  and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more  computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life.  The text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with  MorphAdorner. The annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). Textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish.  This text has not been fully proofread 
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         ESTC R5068
         12793306
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         Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 93961)
         Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1641-1700 ; 256:E174, no 7)
      
       
         
           
             The ivstification of the independant chvrches of Christ being an answer to Mr. Edvvards his booke, which hee hath written against the government of Christ's chvrch and toleration of Christs, publike worship : briefely declaring that the congregations of the saints ought not to have dependancie in government upon any other : or direction in worship from any other than Christ their head and lavv-giver / by Katherine Chidley.
             Chidley, Katherine.
          
           [8], 81 (i.e. 82) p.
           
             Printed for William Larnar ...,
             London :
             1641.
          
           
             An answer to Thomas Edwards' Reasons against the independent government of particular congregations.
             Reproduction of original in Thomason Collection, British Library.
          
        
      
    
     
       
         eng
      
       
         
           Edwards, Thomas, 1599-1647. -- Reasons against the independent government of particular congregations.
           Church polity -- Early works to 1800.
        
      
    
       A32820  R5068  (Wing C3832).  civilwar no The justification of the independant churches of Christ. Being an answer to Mr. Edvvards his booke, which hee hath written against the gover Chidley, Katherine 1641    45608 286 0 0 0 0 0 63 D  The  rate of 63 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the D category of texts with between 35 and 100 defects per 10,000 words. 
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           THE
           IVSTIFICATION
           OF
           THE
           Independant
           CHVRCHES
           of
           CHRIST
           .
           Being
           an
           Answer
           to
           Mr.
           EDVVARDS
           his
           BOOKE
           ,
           which
           hee
           hath
           written
           against
           the
           Government
           of
           CHRISTS
           CHVRCH
           ,
           and
           Toleration
           of
           CHRISTS
           Publike
           Worship
           ;
           BRIEFELY
           DECLARING
           That
           the
           Congregations
           of
           the
           Saints
           ought
           not
           to
           have
           Dependancie
           in
           Government
           upon
           any
           other
           ;
           or
           direction
           in
           worship
           from
           any
           other
           than
           CHRIST
           their
           HEAD
           and
           LAVV-GIVER
           .
           By
           KATHERINE
           CHIDLEY
           .
        
         
           1
           SAM.
           17.
           45.
           
        
         
           Thou
           commest
           unto
           me
           with
           a
           Sword
           ,
           and
           with
           a
           Speare
           ,
           and
           with
           a
           Sheild
           ,
           but
           I
           come
           unto
           thee
           in
           the
           name
           of
           the
           Lord
           of
           Hoasts
           the
           God
           of
           the
           armies
           of
           Israel
           ,
           whom
           thou
           hast
           defied
           .
        
         
           IVDGES
           4.
           21.
           
        
         
           Then
           
             Iael
             ,
             Hebers
          
           wife
           tooke
           a
           naile
           of
           the
           tent
           ,
           and
           tooke
           an
           hammer
           in
           her
           hand
           ,
           and
           went
           softly
           unto
           him
           ,
           and
           smote
           the
           naile
           into
           his
           temples
           and
           fastened
           it
           into
           the
           ground
           ,
           (
           for
           he
           was
           fast
           asleepe
           and
           weary
           )
           and
           so
           he
           died
           .
        
         
           
             LONDON
             ,
          
           Printed
           for
           WILLIAM
           LARNAR
           ,
           and
           are
           to
           be
           sold
           at
           his
           
             Shop
             ,
          
           at
           the
           Signe
           of
           the
           
             Golden
             Anchor
             ,
          
           neere
           
             Pauls-Chaine
             .
          
           1641.
           
        
      
       
       
       
         
           TO
           The
           
             CHRISTIAN
             READER
             ;
          
           Grace
           ,
           Mercy
           ,
           and
           Peace
           ,
           from
           God
           the
           Father
           ,
           and
           from
           our
           
             Lord
             Jesus
             Christ
             .
          
        
         
           IT
           is
           ,
           and
           hath
           beene
           (
           for
           a
           long
           time
           )
           a
           Question
           more
           enquired
           into
           than
           well
           weighed
           ;
           Whether
           it
           be
           lawfull
           for
           such
           ,
           who
           are
           informed
           of
           the
           evills
           of
           the
           Church
           of
           
             England
             ,
          
           to
           Separate
           from
           it
           :
           For
           my
           owne
           part
           ,
           considering
           that
           the
           Church
           of
           
             England
          
           is
           governed
           by
           the
           Canon
           Lawes
           (
           the
           Discipline
           of
           Antichrist
           )
           and
           altogether
           wanteth
           the
           Discipline
           of
           
             Christ
             ,
          
           and
           that
           the
           most
           of
           them
           are
           ignorant
           what
           it
           is
           ,
           and
           also
           doe
           professe
           to
           worship
           God
           by
           a
           stinted
           Service-Booke
           .
           I
           hold
           it
           not
           onely
           lawfull
           ,
           but
           also
           the
           duty
           of
           all
           those
           who
           are
           informed
           of
           such
           evills
           ,
           to
           separate
           themselves
           from
           them
           ,
           and
           such
           as
           doe
           adhere
           unto
           them
           ;
           and
           also
           to
           joyne
           together
           in
           the
           outward
           profession
           and
           practise
           of
           Gods
           true
           worship
           ,
           when
           God
           hath
           declared
           unto
           them
           what
           it
           is
           ;
           and
           being
           thus
           informed
           in
           their
           minds
           of
           the
           knowledge
           of
           the
           will
           of
           God
           (
           by
           the
           teaching
           of
           his
           Sonne
           Jesus
           Christ
           )
           it
           is
           their
           duty
           to
           put
           it
           in
           practise
           ,
           not
           onely
           in
           a
           Land
           where
           they
           have
           Toleration
           ,
           but
           also
           where
           they
           are
           forbidden
           to
           preach
           ,
           or
           teach
           in
           the
           name
           (
           or
           by
           the
           power
           )
           of
           the
           Lord
           Jesus
           .
        
         
           But
           Mr.
           
             Edwards
          
           (
           with
           whom
           I
           have
           here
           to
           deale
           )
           conceiving
           that
           the
           beauty
           of
           Christs
           true
           worship
           ,
           would
           quickly
           discover
           the
           Foggy
           darkenesse
           of
           the
           Antichristian
           devised
           worship
           ;
           and
           also
           that
           the
           glory
           of
           Christs
           true
           Discipline
           ,
           grounded
           and
           founded
           in
           his
           Word
           ,
           would
           soone
           discover
           the
           blacknesse
           and
           darkenesse
           of
           the
           Antihristian
           Government
           (
           which
           the
           poore
           people
           of
           
             England
          
           are
           in
           bondage
           unto
           )
           hath
           set
           his
           wits
           a
           work
           to
           withstand
           the
           bright
           comming
           of
           
             Christs
             Kingdome
          
           (
           into
           the
           hearts
           of
           men
           )
           
           which
           we
           are
           all
           commanded
           in
           the
           most
           absolute
           rule
           of
           Prayer
           to
           petition
           for
           ;
           for
           the
           turning
           aside
           whereof
           Mr.
           
             Edwards
          
           hath
           mustred
           up
           his
           forces
           ,
           even
           eight
           Reasons
           ,
           against
           the
           government
           of
           
             Christ
             ,
          
           which
           hee
           calls
           Independant
           ;
           and
           hath
           joyned
           unto
           these
           eight
           ,
           ten
           more
           ;
           which
           he
           hath
           made
           against
           Toleration
           ▪
           affirming
           that
           they
           may
           not
           practise
           contrary
           to
           the
           course
           of
           the
           Nation
           wherein
           they
           live
           ,
           without
           the
           leave
           of
           the
           Magistrate
           ,
           neither
           judgeth
           he
           it
           commendable
           in
           them
           to
           aske
           the
           Magistrates
           leave
           ,
           nor
           commendable
           in
           the
           Magistrate
           to
           heare
           their
           petitions
           ,
           but
           rather
           seeketh
           to
           stirre
           up
           all
           men
           to
           disturbe
           their
           peace
           ,
           affirming
           most
           unjustly
           ,
           that
           they
           disturbe
           the
           peace
           of
           the
           Kingdome
           ,
           nay
           ,
           the
           peace
           of
           three
           Kingdomes
           ,
           which
           all
           the
           lands
           under
           the
           Kings
           Dominions
           know
           to
           be
           contrary
           ,
           nay
           I
           thinke
           most
           of
           the
           Kingdomes
           in
           Europe
           cannot
           be
           ignorant
           what
           the
           cause
           of
           the
           disturbance
           was
           ;
        
         
           But
           this
           is
           not
           the
           practise
           of
           Mr.
           
           
             Edwards
          
           alone
           ,
           but
           also
           of
           the
           whole
           generation
           of
           the
           Clergie
           ;
           as
           thou
           maist
           know
           ,
           Christian
           Reader
           ,
           it
           was
           the
           practise
           of
           the
           Bishop
           of
           
             Canterbury
          
           to
           exclaime
           against
           Mr
           ▪
           
             Burton
             ,
          
           Doctor
           
             Bastwicke
             ,
          
           and
           Mr.
           
             Prynne
             ,
          
           calling
           them
           scandalous
           Libellers
           ,
           &
           Innovators
           (
           though
           they
           put
           their
           own
           name
           to
           that
           which
           they
           write
           ,
           and
           proved
           what
           they
           taught
           by
           divine
           authority
           )
           and
           this
           hath
           beene
           alwayes
           the
           practise
           of
           the
           instruments
           of
           Sathan
           ,
           to
           accuse
           the
           Lords
           people
           ,
           for
           disturbing
           of
           the
           peace
           ,
           as
           it
           hath
           beene
           found
           in
           many
           Nations
           ,
           when
           indeede
           the
           troublers
           be
           themselves
           and
           their
           fathers
           house
           .
           But
           in
           this
           they
           are
           like
           unto
           
             Athalia
          
           crying
           treason
           ,
           treason
           ,
           when
           they
           are
           in
           the
           treason
           themselves
           .
        
         
           But
           for
           the
           further
           strengthning
           of
           his
           army
           ,
           he
           hath
           also
           subjoyned
           unto
           these
           his
           Answer
           to
           sixe
           Reasons
           ,
           which
           he
           saith
           ,
           are
           theirs
           ,
           but
           the
           forme
           of
           some
           of
           them
           seemeth
           to
           be
           of
           his
           owne
           making
           ;
           all
           which
           thou
           shalt
           finde
           answered
           ,
           and
           disproved
           in
           this
           following
           Treatise
           .
        
         
           But
           though
           these
           my
           Answers
           are
           not
           laid
           downe
           in
           a
           Schollerlik
           way
           ,
           but
           by
           the
           plaine
           truth
           of
           holy
           
             Scripture
             ;
          
           yet
           I
           beseech
           thee
           have
           the
           patience
           to
           take
           the
           paynes
           to
           reade
           them
           ,
           and
           spare
           some
           time
           to
           consider
           them
           ;
           and
           if
           thou
           findest
           things
           disorderly
           placed
           ,
           la●our
           to
           rectifie
           them
           to
           thine
           own
           mind
           .
           And
           if
           there
           be
           any
           weight
           in
           them
           ,
           give
           the
           glory
           to
           God
           ;
           but
           if
           thou
           feest
           nothing
           worthy
           ,
           attribute
           not
           the
           weakenesse
           thereof
           to
           the
           truth
           of
           the
           cause
           ,
           but
           rather
           to
           the
           ignorance
           and
           unskilfulnesse
           of
           the
           weake
           Instrument
           .
        
         
           
             Thine
             in
             the
             Lord
             Jesus
             ,
             KATHERINE
             CHIDLEY
             ▪
          
        
      
       
       
         
           THE
           Answer
           to
           Mr.
           
           EDVVARDS
           his
           INTRODVCTION
           .
        
         
           _●
           Hearing
           the
           complaints
           of
           many
           that
           were
           godly
           ,
           against
           the
           Booke
           that
           
             Mr.
             Edwards
          
           hath
           written
           ;
           and
           upon
           the
           sight
           of
           this
           his
           Introduction
           ,
           considering
           his
           desperate
           resolution
           ,
           (
           namely
           )
           that
           he
           would
           set
           out
           severall
           Tractates
           against
           the
           whole
           way
           of
           Separation
           .
           I
           could
           not
           but
           declare
           by
           the
           testimony
           of
           the
           Scripture
           it selfe
           ,
           that
           the
           way
           of
           Separation
           is
           the
           way
           of
           God
           ,
           who
           is
           the
           author
           of
           it
           ,
           
             *
          
           which
           manifestly
           appeares
           by
           his
           separating
           of
           his
           Church
           from
           the
           world
           ,
           and
           the
           world
           from
           his
           Church
           in
           all
           ages
           .
        
         
           When
           the
           Church
           was
           greater
           than
           the
           world
           ,
           then
           the
           world
           was
           to
           be
           separated
           from
           the
           Church
           ;
           but
           when
           the
           world
           was
           greater
           than
           the
           Church
           ,
           then
           the
           Church
           was
           to
           separate
           from
           the
           world
           .
        
         
           As
           for
           instance
           ;
        
         
           When
           
             Caine
          
           was
           a
           member
           of
           the
           Church
           ,
           then
           the
           Church
           was
           greater
           than
           the
           world
           ;
           and
           
             Caine
          
           being
           discovered
           ,
           was
           exempted
           from
           Gods
           presence
           ;
           
             *
          
           before
           whom
           he
           formerly
           had
           presented
           himselfe
           :
           
             c
          
           but
           in
           the
           time
           of
           
             Noah
             ,
          
           when
           the
           world
           was
           greater
           than
           the
           Church
           
             d
          
           then
           
             Noah
          
           and
           his
           Family
           who
           were
           the
           Church
           ,
           were
           commanded
           to
           goe
           into
           the
           Arke
           
             e
          
           in
           which
           place
           they
           were
           saved
           ,
           when
           the
           world
           was
           drowned
           .
           
             f
          
           
             yet
          
           Ham
           
             being
             afterward
             discovered
             ,
             was
             accursed
             of
             his
             Father
             ,
             and
          
           Shem
           
             was
             blessed
             ,
             and
             good
             prophesied
             for
          
           Iaphat
           .
        
         
           Afterward
           when
           the
           world
           was
           grown
           mightier
           than
           the
           Church
           againe
           ,
           then
           
             Abraham
          
           was
           called
           out
           of
           
             Vr
          
           of
           the
           
             Caldeans
             ▪
          
           
           both
           from
           his
           country
           and
           from
           his
           kindred
           ,
           and
           from
           his
           fathers
           house
           
             g
          
           (
           because
           they
           were
           Idolat●rs
           )
           to
           ●●●ship
           God
           in
           
             Canaan
             .
          
        
         
           Moreover
           ,
           afterwards
           
             Moses
          
           was
           se●●
           ,
           and
           his
           brother
           
             Aaron
             ,
          
           to
           deliver
           the
           children
           of
           Israel
           out
           of
           the
           Land
           of
           
             Egypt
          
           when
           Pharaoh
           vexed
           them
           ,
           
             h
          
           at
           which
           time
           God
           wrought
           their
           deliverance
           ,
           
             i
          
           separating
           wondrously
           between
           the
           
             Egyptians
          
           and
           the
           
             Israelites
             ,
          
           and
           that
           which
           was
           light
           to
           the
           one
           ,
           was
           darkenesse
           to
           the
           other
           .
        
         
           Afterwards
           ,
           when
           
             Cerah
          
           and
           his
           Congregation
           rebelled
           against
           God
           ,
           and
           were
           obstinate
           therein
           
             k
          
           the
           people
           were
           commanded
           to
           depart
           from
           the
           tents
           of
           those
           with
           〈…〉
           
             l
          
           were
           the
           children
           separated
           from
           the
           parents
           ,
           and
           those
           who
           did
           not
           separate
           ▪
           were
           destroyed
           by
           fire
           ,
           
             m
          
           and
           swallowed
           by
           the
           earth
           ,
           
             n
          
           upon
           the
           day
           which
           God
           had
           appointed
           
             *
          
           as
           〈…〉
           
             Noahs
          
           time
           ,
           who
           repented
           not
           ▪
           were
           swallowed
           by
           wate●
        
         
           Moreover
           ,
           when
           God
           brought
           his
           people
           into
           the
           promised
           Land
           ,
           he
           commanded
           them
           to
           be
           separated
           from
           the
           Idolaters
           ,
           
           and
           not
           to
           meddle
           with
           the
           accursed
           things
           .
           And
           for
           this
           cause
           God
           gave
           them
           his
           Ordinances
           and
           Commandements
           ;
           and
           by
           the
           manifestation
           of
           their
           Obediance
           to
           them
           ,
           they
           were
           known
           to
           be
           the
           onely
           people
           of
           God
           ,
           
             *
          
           which
           made
           a
           reall
           separation
           .
        
         
           And
           when
           they
           were
           carried
           captive
           into
           Babylon
           a●
           any
           
           time
           for
           their
           sinnes
           :
           God
           raised
           them
           up
           deliverers
           to
           bring
           them
           from
           thence
           :
           and
           Prophets
           to
           call
           them
           from
           thence
           
             p
          
           and
           from
           their
           backesliding
           .
           
             q
          
           And
           it
           was
           the
           practise
           of
           all
           the
           Prophets
           of
           God
           ,
           (
           which
           prophesied
           of
           the
           Church
           under
           the
           New
           Testament
           )
           to
           separate
           the
           precious
           from
           the
           vile
           ,
           and
           God
           hath
           declared
           that
           hee
           that
           so
           doth
           shall
           be
           as
           his
           mouth
           ,
           
             Jer.
             15.
             19.
             
          
        
         
           And
           we
           know
           it
           was
           the
           practise
           of
           the
           Apostles
           of
           the
           Lord
           Iesus
           ,
           to
           declare
           to
           the
           people
           that
           there
           could
           be
           no
           more
           agreement
           betweene
           beleevers
           and
           unbeleevers
           ,
           than
           betweene
           light
           and
           darkenesse
           ,
           God
           and
           Belial
           ,
           as
           
             Paul
          
           writing
           to
           the
           
             Corinthians
          
           doth
           declare
           ,
           when
           he
           saith
           ,
           
             Be
             not
             unequally
             yoked
             together
             with
             unbeleevers
             ;
             for
             what
             fellowship
             hath
             righteousnesse
             with
             unrighteousnesse
             ?
             and
             what
             communion
             hath
             light
             with
             darkenesse
             ,
             and
             what
             concord
          
           
           
             hath
             Christ
             ,
             with
             Belial
             ?
             or
             what
             part
             hath
             he
             that
             beleeveth
          
           
           
             with
             an
             Infidell
             ?
             and
             what
             agreement
             hath
             the
             Temple
             of
             God
             with
             Idolls
             ?
             for
             yee
             are
             the
             Temple
             of
             the
             living
             God
             ,
             as
             God
             hath
             said
             ,
             I
             will
             dwell
             in
             them
             ,
             and
             walke
             in
             them
             ,
             and
             I
             will
             be
             their
             God
             ,
             and
             they
             shall
             be
             my
             people
             ;
             Wherefore
             come
             out
             from
             among
             them
             ,
             and
             by
             yee
             Separate
             ,
             saith
             the
             Lord
             ,
             and
             touch
             not
             the
             uncleane
             thing
             ,
             and
             I
             will
             receive
             you
             ,
             and
             I
             will
             be
             a
             Father
             unto
             you
             ,
             and
             yee
             shall
             be
             my
             sonnes
             and
             daughters
             ,
             saith
             the
             Lord
             Almighty
             ,
          
           1
           Cor.
           6.
           14
           ,
           15
           ,
           16
           ,
           17
           ,
           18.
           
        
         
           Moreover
           ,
           they
           are
           pronounced
           blessed
           ,
           which
           reade
           ,
           heare
           ,
           and
           keepe
           the
           words
           of
           the
           Booke
           of
           the
           Revelation
           of
           Iesus
           Christ
           ;
           
             r
          
           among
           which
           sentences
           ,
           there
           is
           a
           commandement
           from
           heaven
           for
           a
           totall
           
             Separation
             .
          
           
             s
          
        
         
           
             These
             things
             (
             in
             briefe
             )
             I
             have
             minded
             from
             the
             Scriptures
             ,
             to
             prove
             the
             necessitie
             of
             Separation
             ;
             and
             though
             the
             Scripture
             be
             a
             deepe
             Well
             ▪
             and
             containeth
             in
             the
             Treasures
             thereof
             innumerable
             Doctrines
             and
             Precepts
             tending
             to
             this
             purpose
             ;
             yet
             I
             leave
             the
             further
             prosecution
             of
             the
             same
             ,
             till
             a
             fitter
             opertunity
             be
             offered
             to
             me
             ,
             or
             any
             other
             whom
             the
             Lord
             shall
             indue
             with
             a
             greater
             measure
             of
             his
             Spirit
             .
          
        
         
           But
           Mr.
           
             Edwards
             ,
          
           for
           preparation
           to
           this
           his
           desperate
           intention
           ,
           hath
           sent
           these
           Reasons
           against
           Independant
           government
           ,
           and
           Toleration
           ,
           and
           presented
           them
           to
           the
           Honorable
           House
           of
           Commons
           ;
           which
           Reasons
           (
           I
           thinke
           )
           he
           would
           have
           to
           be
           get
           a
           Snake
           ,
           to
           appeare
           (
           as
           he
           saith
           )
           under
           the
           greene
           grasse
           ;
           for
           I
           am
           sure
           ,
           he
           cannot
           ,
           ●ake
           the
           humble
           petitions
           of
           of
           the
           Kings
           subjects
           to
           be
           a
           Snake
           ,
           for
           petitioning
           is
           a
           way
           of
           peace
           and
           submission
           ,
           without
           violence
           or
           venum
           ;
           neither
           can
           it
           cast
           durt
           upon
           any
           government
           of
           the
           Nation
           ,
           as
           he
           unjustly
           accuseth
           the
           
             Protestation
             Protested
             ,
          
           for
           that
           Author
           leaveth
           it
           to
           the
           Magistrate
           ,
           not
           undertaking
           to
           determine
           of
           himselfe
           what
           government
           shall
           be
           set
           ever
           the
           Nation
           ,
           for
           the
           bringing
           of
           men
           to
           God
           but
           leaveth
           it
           to
           the
           consideration
           of
           them
           that
           have
           authority
           ,
        
         
           And
           whereas
           Mr.
           
             Edwards
          
           grudges
           that
           they
           preach
           so
           often
           at
           the
           Parliament
           ;
           in
           this
           he
           is
           like
           unto
           
             Amaziah
             ,
          
           who
           bid
           the
           Prophet
           
             Amos
          
           to
           flee
           away
           into
           the
           Land
           of
           
             Ju●●a
             ,
          
           and
           not
           to
           Prophesie
           at
           
             Bethel
             ,
          
           the
           Kings
           Chappell
           ,
           and
           the
           House
           of
           the
           Kingdome
           .
           
             *
          
        
         
         
           And
           though
           Mr.
           
           
             Edwards
          
           boast
           himselfe
           heare
           ,
           to
           be
           a
           Minister
           of
           the
           Gospell
           ,
           and
           a
           sufferer
           for
           it
           ,
           yet
           I
           challenge
           him
           ,
           to
           prove
           unto
           me
           ,
           that
           he
           hath
           any
           Calling
           or
           Ordination
           to
           the
           Ministry
           ,
           but
           that
           which
           he
           hath
           successively
           from
           
             Rome
             ;
          
           If
           he
           lay
           claime
           to
           that
           ;
           he
           is
           one
           of
           the
           Popes
           household
           ;
           But
           if
           he
           deny
           that
           calling
           ▪
           then
           is
           he
           as
           void
           of
           a
           calling
           to
           the
           worke
           of
           the
           Ministry
           ,
           and
           as
           void
           of
           Ordination
           ,
           as
           any
           of
           those
           Ministers
           ,
           whom
           hee
           calleth
           Independant
           men
           ,
           (
           which
           have
           cast
           off
           the
           Ordination
           of
           the
           Prelates
           )
           and
           consequently
           as
           void
           of
           Ordination
           as
           a
           macanicall
           trades
           man
           .
        
         
           And
           therefore
           I
           hope
           that
           Honourable
           House
           that
           is
           so
           full
           of
           wisedome
           (
           which
           
             Mr
             ▪
             Edwards
          
           doth
           confesse
           )
           will
           never
           judge
           these
           men
           unreasonable
           ,
           because
           they
           do
           Petition
           ,
           nor
           their
           petitions
           unreasonable
           before
           they
           are
           tried
           ,
           and
           so
           proved
           ,
           by
           some
           better
           ground
           ,
           then
           the
           bare
           entrance
           of
           Mr.
           
           
             Edwards
          
           his
           Cavit
           ,
           or
           writ
           of
           
             Ne
             admittas
             ,
          
           though
           he
           saith
           he
           fo●ched
           it
           from
           heaven
           ;
           for
           I
           know
           it
           was
           never
           there
           ,
           Neither
           is
           it
           confirmed
           by
           the
           Records
           of
           holy
           Scripture
           ,
           but
           taken
           from
           the
           practise
           of
           
             Nimrod
             ,
             That
             mighty
             Hunter
             before
             the
             Lord
             ,
          
           
             *
          
           and
           from
           the
           practise
           of
           
             Haman
          
           that
           wicked
           persecucuter
           ,
           
             *
          
           &
           from
           the
           evill
           behaviour
           and
           malicious
           speeches
           ,
           and
           gesture
           of
           wicked
           
             Sanballet
             ,
          
           
             *
          
           and
           
             Tobias
             ,
          
           who
           were
           both
           bitter
           enemies
           to
           God
           ,
           and
           sought
           to
           hinder
           the
           building
           of
           the
           walles
           of
           
             Jerusalem
             .
          
        
         
           But
           the
           Prophet
           
             Haggai
             ,
          
           reproveth
           not
           onely
           such
           as
           hindred
           the
           building
           of
           the
           Lords
           House
           ▪
           but
           also
           those
           that
           were
           contented
           to
           live
           in
           their
           seyled
           Houses
           ,
           and
           suffer
           the
           Lords
           House
           to
           lie
           waste
           ,
           
             Hag.
             1
             -
          
        
      
    
     
       
       
         
           AN
           ANSVVER
           To
           Mr.
           EDVVARDS
           his
           BOOKE
           ,
           Intituled
           ,
           REASONS
           against
           the
           Independent
           GOVERNMENT
           in
           particular
           CONGREGATIONS
           .
        
         
           
             
               Mr.
               
                 EDWARDS
                 ,
              
            
          
           
             I
             Understanding
             that
             you
             are
             a
             mighty
             Champion
             ,
             and
             now
             mustering
             up
             your
             mighty
             forces
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             and
             I
             apprehending
             they
             must
             come
             against
             the
             Hoast
             of
             
               Israel
               ,
            
             and
             hearing
             the
             Armies
             of
             the
             Living
             God
             so
             defied
             by
             you
             ,
             could
             not
             be
             withheld
             ,
             but
             that
             I
             (
             in
             stead
             of
             a
             better
             )
             must
             needs
             give
             you
             the
             meeting
             .
          
           
             First
             .
             Whereas
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               the
               Church
               of
               God
               (
               which
               is
               his
               House
               and
               Kingdome
               )
               could
               not
               subsist
               with
               such
               provision
               as
               their
               father
               gave
               them
               :
               which
               provision
               was
            
             (
             by
             your
             owne
             confession
             )
             
               the
               watering
               of
               them
               by
               Evangelists
               ,
               and
               Prophets
               ,
               when
               they
               were
               planted
               by
               the
               Apostles
               ,
               and
               after
               planting
               and
               watering
               to
               have
               Pastors
               and
               Teachers
               ,
               with
               all
               other
               Officers
               ▪
               set
               over
               them
               by
               the
               Apostles
               &
               their
               own
               Election
               ,
               yet
               notwithstanding
               all
               this
               provision
               ,
               the
               Father
               hath
               made
               for
               them
               ,
               it
               was
               evident
            
             (
             say
             you
             )
             
               they
               could
               not
               well
               stand
               of
               themselves
               ,
               without
               some
               other
               helpe
               .
            
          
           
             This
             was
             the
             very
             suggestion
             of
             Sathan
             into
             the
             hearts
             of
             our
             first
             Parents
             ;
             for
             they
             having
             a
             desire
             of
             some
             thing
             more
             then
             was
             warranted
             by
             God
             ,
             tooke
             unto
             them
             the
             forbidden
             fruit
             ,
             as
             you
             would
             have
             the
             Lords
             Churches
             to
             doe
             when
             you
             say
             they
             must
             take
             some
             others
             besides
             these
             Churches
             and
             Officers
             ,
             and
             that
             to
             interpose
             authoritatively
             ;
             and
             these
             something
             else
             you
             make
             to
             be
             Apostles
             ,
             Evangelists
             ,
             and
             Elders
             of
             other
             
             Churches
             ,
             whereas
             you
             confessed
             before
             ,
             that
             these
             are
             the
             furniture
             of
             Christs
             Kingdome
             ;
             and
             wee
             know
             their
             authoritie
             was
             limitted
             ,
             within
             the
             bounds
             of
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             :
             as
             first
             ,
             If
             any
             of
             them
             would
             be
             greater
             ,
             he
             must
             be
             servant
             to
             all
             .
             Secondly
             ,
             they
             were
             forbidden
             to
             be
             Lords
             over
             Gods
             heritage
             .
             Thirdly
             ,
             they
             were
             commanded
             to
             teach
             the
             people
             ,
             to
             observe
             onely
             those
             things
             which
             Christ
             had
             commanded
             them
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               seeme
               to
               affirme
               ,
               that
               these
               Offices
               were
               extraordinary
               and
               ceased
               ,
               and
               yet
               the
               Churches
               have
               still
               neede
               of
               them
               :
            
             You
             seeme
             to
             contradict
             your selfe
             ,
             and
             would
             faine
             cure
             it
             againe
             ,
             in
             that
             some
             other
             way
             which
             you
             say
             ,
             you
             have
             to
             supply
             the
             want
             of
             them
             ,
             but
             this
             other
             way
             you
             have
             not
             yet
             made
             known
             :
             
               You
               presuppose
               ,
               it
               may
               be
               by
               some
               Sinods
               and
               Councels
               ,
               to
               make
               a
               conjunction
               of
               the
               whole
               .
            
          
           
             If
             you
             meane
             such
             a
             Counsell
             ▪
             as
             is
             mentioned
             ▪
             
               Acts
            
             15.
             4.
             22
             ,
             consisting
             of
             Apostles
             and
             Elders
             with
             the
             whole
             Church
             :
             then
             you
             have
             said
             no
             more
             than
             you
             have
             said
             before
             ,
             and
             that
             which
             we
             grant
             ,
             for
             this
             is
             still
             the
             furniture
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ;
             but
             if
             you
             intend
             that
             your
             Counsell
             should
             consist
             of
             an
             armie
             of
             Arch-Bishops
             Diocesan
             Bishops
             ,
             Deanes
             ,
             Suffragans
             ,
             with
             the
             rest
             of
             that
             rabble
             ,
             which
             be
             for
             their
             titles
             names
             of
             blasphemy
             ,
             and
             such
             as
             were
             bred
             in
             the
             smoake
             of
             the
             pit
             .
             I
             deny
             that
             any
             of
             these
             be
             ordained
             of
             God
             ,
             for
             they
             have
             no
             footing
             in
             his
             word
             ;
             therefore
             indeede
             these
             are
             a
             part
             of
             the
             fruit
             of
             the
             forbidden
             Tree
             ,
             which
             the
             Churches
             of
             God
             have
             taken
             and
             eaten
             ;
             and
             this
             seeking
             out
             inventions
             of
             their
             owne
             ,
             after
             that
             God
             made
             them
             righteous
             ,
             hath
             brought
             them
             into
             a
             state
             of
             Apostasie
             ,
             even
             as
             
               Ieroboams
            
             high
             places
             and
             Calves
             did
             the
             people
             of
             
               Israel
               ;
            
             which
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             by
             the
             Churches
             of
             
               Asia
               .
            
             If
             these
             be
             that
             some
             other
             supply
             which
             you
             meane
             and
             have
             produced
             to
             helpe
             the
             Churches
             ,
             and
             Cities
             of
             God
             (
             as
             you
             call
             them
             )
             to
             determine
             for
             those
             Churches
             and
             Cities
             the
             cases
             of
             Doctrine
             and
             Discipline
             in
             stead
             of
             those
             many
             Ministers
             which
             ,
             you
             conceive
             them
             now
             to
             want
             ,
             it
             tends
             to
             make
             (
             as
             they
             have
             now
             done
             )
             a
             conjunction
             not
             onely
             of
             all
             the
             Churches
             professing
             one
             faith
             into
             one
             body
             ;
             but
             also
             of
             all
             the
             Armies
             of
             the
             Man
             of
             Sinne
             ,
             and
             so
             to
             confound
             the
             Church
             and
             the
             world
             together
             ,
             which
             the
             Ministers
             of
             the
             
             Gospell
             ought
             to
             divide
             ,
             by
             separating
             the
             precious
             from
             the
             vile
             ▪
          
           
             And
             whereas
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               The
               Independent
               Congregations
               now
               have
               but
               few
               Ministers
               ;
            
          
           
             It
             is
             very
             true
             ,
             for
             indeede
             they
             are
             but
             a
             few
             people
             ,
             and
             a
             
             few
             hands
             will
             feede
             a
             few
             mouths
             sufficiently
             ,
             if
             God
             provide
             meat
             .
          
           
             But
             whereas
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               those
               Congregations
               may
               have
               no
               Officer
               ,
               at
               all
               by
               their
               owne
               grounds
               ,
               and
               yet
               be
               independent
               .
            
          
           
             I
             thinke
             ,
             they
             conceive
             by
             those
             grounds
             ,
             the
             Office
             onely
             of
             Pastor
             ,
             and
             Teacher
             ;
             but
             not
             that
             the
             Church
             of
             God
             hath
             need
             at
             any
             time
             of
             the
             helpe
             of
             any
             other
             ,
             then
             God
             hath
             given
             and
             set
             in
             his
             Church
             ,
             which
             be
             all
             the
             Officers
             that
             are
             before
             mentioned
             ,
             as
             Apostles
             ,
             Prophets
             ,
             Evangelists
             ,
             Pastors
             ,
             and
             Teachers
             ;
             and
             to
             have
             recourse
             to
             any
             for
             counsell
             ,
             helpe
             ,
             or
             assistance
             ,
             either
             of
             Church
             or
             Ministry
             ,
             which
             is
             not
             of
             Christs
             owne
             ,
             were
             very
             ridiculous
             .
             For
             it
             is
             recorded
             ,
             
               Ephe.
            
             4.
             11.
             12.
             
             That
             he
             gave
             these
             for
             the
             gathering
             together
             of
             the
             Saints
             for
             the
             worke
             of
             the
             Ministry
             ,
             and
             for
             the
             edification
             of
             the
             body
             of
             Christ
             ,
             being
             so
             gathered
             ;
             The
             time
             they
             must
             continue
             is
             ,
             
             till
             all
             the
             Saints
             be
             in
             the
             unitie
             of
             faith
             .
             The
             reason
             wherefore
             they
             were
             given
             ,
             was
             to
             keepe
             people
             from
             being
             tossed
             too
             and
             fro
             with
             every
             winde
             of
             Doctrine
             .
             And
             these
             are
             they
             ,
             by
             whom
             all
             the
             body
             is
             coupled
             and
             knit
             together
             ,
             by
             every
             joynt
             for
             the
             furniture
             thereof
             ,
             according
             to
             the
             effectuall
             power
             ,
             which
             is
             in
             the
             measure
             of
             every
             part
             ,
             and
             receiveth
             increase
             of
             the
             body
             unto
             the
             edifying
             of
             it selfe
             in
             love
             .
             And
             this
             is
             according
             to
             the
             promise
             that
             Christ
             made
             ,
             
               Matth.
            
             28.
             19.
             20.
             to
             be
             with
             his
             Ministers
             in
             teaching
             his
             people
             to
             the
             end
             of
             the
             world
             .
          
           
             And
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
               ,
            
             you
             cannot
             gather
             from
             our
             owne
             words
             ,
             that
             we
             have
             neede
             of
             the
             helpe
             of
             any
             other
             Churches
             ▪
             or
             Ministers
             ,
             to
             interpose
             (
             as
             you
             unjustly
             affirme
             )
             as
             it
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             by
             Mr.
             
             
               Robinsons
            
             owne
             words
             in
             the
             Justification
             of
             the
             Separation
             ,
             
               pag.
            
             121.
             122.
             
             These
             are
             his
             words
             ;
             It
             is
             the
             Stewards
             duty
             to
             make
             provision
             for
             the
             family
             ;
             but
             what
             if
             he
             neglect
             this
             duty
             in
             the
             Masters
             absence
             ?
             Must
             the
             whole
             family
             starve
             ,
             yea
             and
             the
             wife
             also
             ?
             Or
             is
             not
             some
             other
             of
             the
             family
             best
             able
             to
             be
             employed
             for
             the
             present
             necessity
             ?
             The
             like
             he
             saith
             concerning
             the
             government
             of
             a
             Ship
             ,
             of
             an
             Armie
             ▪
             and
             of
             Common wealths
             ;
             alluding
             to
             the
             Church
             of
             Christ
             .
             And
             further
             expresseth
             ,
             that
             as
             a
             private
             Citizen
             may
             become
             a
             Magistrate
             ,
             so
             a
             private
             member
             may
             become
             a
             Minister
             ,
             for
             an
             action
             of
             necessity
             to
             be
             performed
             ,
             by
             the
             consent
             of
             the
             rest
             ,
             &c.
             
          
           
             Therefore
             it
             appeares
             plainely
             by
             all
             that
             hath
             binsaid
             ,
             that
             the
             Churches
             of
             Christ
             may
             be
             truely
             constituted
             according
             to
             the
             Scripture
             ,
             and
             subsist
             a
             certaine
             time
             without
             Pastor
             and
             Teacher
             ,
             and
             enjoy
             the
             power
             of
             Christ
             amongst
             themselves
             having
             
             no
             dependancie
             upon
             any
             other
             Church
             or
             Churches
             which
             shall
             claime
             Authority
             or
             superiority
             over
             them
             .
          
           
             And
             thus
             much
             for
             your
             first
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             NOw
             in
             your
             second
             Reason
             ,
             which
             runneth
             upon
             the
             calling
             of
             the
             Ministry
             ,
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               the
               government
               of
               the
               Independent
               Congregations
               is
               not
               of
               divine
               institution
               .
            
          
           
             Which
             I
             utterly
             denie
             ,
             and
             will
             prove
             it
             ,
             by
             disproveing
             the
             following
             Instances
             by
             which
             you
             affirme
             to
             prove
             it
             .
          
           
             Whereas
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               their
               Independencie
               forces
               them
               to
               have
               Ministers
               without
               Ordination
               .
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             it
             is
             a
             plaine
             case
             by
             the
             foregoing
             Answer
             ,
             to
             your
             first
             Reason
             ,
             that
             you
             speake
             untruely
             ,
             for
             their
             practise
             is
             there
             made
             knowne
             to
             be
             otherwise
             ;
             and
             if
             you
             will
             still
             affirme
             ,
             that
             they
             have
             not
             power
             so
             to
             practise
             ,
             you
             will
             thereby
             deny
             the
             truth
             of
             the
             Scriptures
             ;
             for
             the
             Apostles
             were
             commanded
             to
             teach
             the
             Churches
             ,
             to
             observe
             all
             things
             whatsoever
             Christ
             had
             commanded
             them
             .
             But
             Christ
             commanded
             the
             Apostles
             to
             ordaine
             Elders
             in
             every
             Church
             by
             election
             ;
             therefore
             the
             Apostles
             taught
             the
             Churches
             to
             ordaine
             Elders
             by
             Election
             also
             .
             And
             whereas
             you
             bid
             us
             produce
             one
             instance
             (
             if
             we
             can
             )
             for
             an
             ordinary
             Officer
             to
             be
             made
             without
             Ordination
             ,
             it
             is
             needlesse
             ;
             for
             we
             (
             whom
             you
             call
             Independant
             )
             strive
             for
             no
             such
             thing
             ,
             as
             you
             have
             proved
             it
             plainely
             out
             of
             Mr.
             
             
               Robinsons
            
             Booke
             ,
             
               Apol.
               Chap.
            
             1.
             18.
             to
             which
             I
             send
             you
             to
             learne
             better
             .
          
           
             Further
             ,
             you
             alleadge
             ,
             
               That
               if
               they
               be
               ordained
               ,
               it
               is
               by
               persons
               who
               are
               not
               in
               office
               .
            
          
           
             Now
             if
             you
             meane
             ,
             they
             have
             no
             office
             because
             they
             are
             not
             elected
             ,
             ordained
             and
             set
             apart
             by
             the
             Clergie
             to
             some
             serviceable
             ,
             admini●●ation
             ;
             I
             pray
             you
             tell
             me
             who
             ordained
             the
             Apostles
             ,
             Prophets
             ,
             and
             Evangelists
             to
             their
             worke
             or
             Ministry
             ?
             If
             you
             will
             say
             they
             were
             ordained
             of
             God
             ,
             I
             will
             grant
             it
             ,
             and
             doe
             also
             affirme
             that
             God
             hath
             promised
             the
             supply
             of
             them
             ,
             to
             the
             end
             of
             the
             world
             ,
             as
             before
             hath
             beene
             mentioned
             ,
             from
             
               Ephe.
            
             4.
             
             As
             also
             ,
             it
             appeares
             by
             
               Pauls
            
             charge
             to
             
               Timothy
               ;
            
             2
             
               Tim.
            
             2.
             2.
             
             That
             what
             things
             he
             had
             heard
             of
             him
             ,
             among
             many
             witnesses
             ,
             the
             same
             he
             should
             commit
             to
             faithfull
             men
             who
             should
             be
             able
             to
             teach
             others
             also
             :
             but
             I
             verily
             doe
             beleeve
             ,
             that
             as
             
               Titus
               ,
            
             so
             
               Timothy
            
             heard
             of
             
               Paul
            
             that
             Elders
             must
             be
             ordained
             by
             Election
             in
             every
             city
             ,
             and
             that
             
               Titus
            
             was
             as
             much
             bound
             to
             communicate
             the
             things
             unto
             others
             ,
             which
             he
             had
             learned
             of
             
               Paul
               ,
            
             as
             
               Timothy
            
             was
             ,
             and
             
               Timothy
            
             (
             we
             know
             )
             was
             to
             teach
             faithfull
             
             men
             ,
             and
             those
             faithfull
             men
             were
             to
             teach
             others
             those
             things
             that
             they
             had
             heard
             of
             
               Timothy
               ,
            
             among
             which
             things
             Ordination
             was
             one
             ,
             as
             it
             was
             delivered
             to
             
               Titus
               ;
            
             and
             we
             are
             not
             to
             doubt
             of
             
               Timothius
            
             faithfulnesse
             in
             the
             declaring
             of
             this
             part
             of
             his
             message
             more
             than
             the
             rest
             ,
             but
             if
             those
             to
             whom
             
               Timothy
            
             delivered
             it
             ,
             were
             not
             faithfull
             in
             the
             discharge
             of
             their
             duty
             :
             but
             that
             in
             due
             time
             the
             Ordinances
             might
             possibly
             grow
             out
             of
             use
             ,
             as
             the
             Churches
             ▪
             did
             by
             little
             and
             little
             apostate
             ;
             yet
             that
             hinders
             not
             but
             that
             it
             was
             still
             written
             in
             the
             Scripture
             ▪
             that
             the
             generations
             to
             come
             might
             recover
             againe
             the
             right
             use
             of
             the
             Ordinances
             when
             God
             should
             by
             his
             Spirit
             direct
             them
             to
             know
             the
             same
             .
          
           
             Moreover
             ▪
             I
             affirme
             ,
             that
             all
             the
             Lords
             people
             ,
             that
             are
             made
             Kings
             and
             Priests
             to
             God
             ,
             have
             a
             free
             voyce
             in
             the
             Ordinance
             of
             Election
             ,
             therefore
             they
             must
             freely
             consent
             before
             there
             can
             be
             any
             Ordination
             ;
             and
             having
             so
             consented
             they
             may
             proceede
             to
             Ordination
             ,
             notwithstanding
             they
             be
             destitute
             ,
             of
             the
             Counsell
             or
             assistance
             of
             any
             neighbour
             Church
             ;
             as
             if
             there
             were
             no
             other
             Churches
             in
             the
             Land
             ,
             but
             onely
             one
             company
             of
             beleevers
             joyned
             together
             in
             fellowship
             ,
             according
             to
             Christs
             institution
             .
             The
             promise
             made
             in
             the
             14th
             .
             of
             
               Iohn
            
             12.
             13.
             is
             made
             unto
             them
             ,
             where
             Christ
             said
             .
             
               The
               workes
               that
               he
               did
               they
               should
               doe
               ●s●
               ;
               &
               that
               whatsoever
               they
               should
               aske
               in
               his
               name
               ,
               that
               he
               would
               do
               for
               the●
               ,
               that
               the
               Father
               may
               be
               glorified
               ,
               and
               that
               the
               Spirit
               of
               truth
               should
               ●●ide
               with
               them
               for
               ever
               .
               And
               that
               he
               should
               teach
               them
               all
               things
               ,
               and
               bring
               all
               things
               unto
               their
               remembrance
               ,
            
             as
             it
             is
             said
             in
             the
             following
             verses
             of
             the
             same
             Chapter
             .
             This
             (
             you
             may
             see
             )
             is
             the
             portion
             of
             beleevers
             ,
             and
             they
             that
             have
             this
             portion
             are
             the
             greatest
             in
             the
             world
             ,
             and
             many
             of
             them
             are
             greater
             than
             one
             ,
             but
             many
             joyned
             together
             in
             a
             comely
             order
             in
             the
             fellowship
             of
             the
             Gospell
             ,
             according
             to
             the
             Scriptures
             ,
             are
             the
             greatest
             of
             all
             and
             therefore
             have
             power
             to
             ordaine
             ,
             and
             to
             blesse
             their
             Ministers
             in
             the
             name
             of
             the
             Lord
             .
             Thus
             the
             lesser
             is
             blessed
             of
             the
             greater
             .
          
           
             Now
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
               ,
            
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             confesse
             ,
             that
             you
             spake
             unadvisedly
             ,
             when
             you
             affirmed
             ,
             
               The
               maintenance
               of
               Independensie
               ,
               was
               the
               breaking
               of
               Gods
               Ordinance
               ,
               and
               violating
               of
               that
               Order
               and
               constant
               ●●y
               of
               Ministers
               recorded
               in
               the
               Word
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             Answer
             ,
             that
             if
             the
             Church
             doe
             elect
             one
             ,
             he
             must
             be
             elected
             out
             of
             some
             more
             ,
             &
             those
             that
             are
             not
             elected
             ,
             may
             be
             as
             able
             to
             blesse
             the
             Church
             in
             the
             name
             of
             the
             Lord
             ,
             as
             he
             ;
             therefore
             one
             of
             these
             who
             are
             not
             elected
             ,
             being
             chosen
             by
             the
             whole
             Church
             ,
             to
             blesse
             him
             in
             the
             name
             of
             the
             Lord
             ,
             whom
             the
             
             Church
             hath
             ordained
             ,
             is
             the
             hand
             of
             the
             whole
             (
             who
             are
             greatest
             of
             all
             ,
             and
             so
             a
             sufficient
             Officer
             for
             that
             worke
             which
             hee
             is
             put
             a
             part
             to
             doe
             .
          
           
             Thus
             you
             may
             see
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             that
             we
             doe
             not
             hold
             Ordination
             extraordinary
             and
             temporary
             ;
             neither
             doe
             we
             hold
             it
             the
             least
             of
             Gods
             Institutions
             ,
             for
             we
             have
             respect
             unto
             them
             all
             ;
             
               But
               that
               nothing
               in
               matter
               of
               Order
               hath
               so
               cleare
               and
               constant
               a
               practise
               as
               this
            
             (
             as
             you
             do
             affirme
             )
             
               and
               also
               say
               ,
               the
               whole
               frame
               of
               Church
               and
               Discipline
               ,
               hath
               not
               so
               much
               ground
               in
               the
               word
               for
               it
               as
               this
               .
            
             I
             deny
             ,
             and
             doe
             affirme
             ,
             that
             not
             onely
             this
             ,
             but
             all
             Gods
             Ordinances
             have
             as
             much
             ground
             and
             footing
             in
             Gods
             Word
             also
             .
          
           
             
               Yet
               notwithstanding
               you
               say
               ,
               that
            
             Calvin
             
               confesseth
               ,
               that
               there
               is
               no
               expresse
               precept
               concerning
               the
               imposition
               of
               hands
               :
            
             Hath
             the
             imposition
             of
             hands
             no
             footing
             in
             Gods
             Word
             ?
             and
             yet
             hath
             not
             all
             the
             forme
             of
             Gods
             Worship
             so
             much
             footing
             as
             it
             ?
             Here
             Mr.
             
               Calvin
            
             and
             you
             ,
             will
             now
             pin
             all
             the
             forme
             of
             Church
             and
             Discipline
             ,
             upon
             unwritten
             verities
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               rehearse
               confusedly
               ,
               the
               opinion
               of
            
             Zanchius
             
               to
               strenghen
               yours
               who
               (
               say
               you
               )
               would
               have
               the
               example
               of
               the
               Apostles
               and
               ancient
               Church
               ,
               to
               be
               more
               esteemed
               of
               ,
               and
               to
               be
               instead
               of
               a
               command
               .
            
          
           
             I
             pray
             you
             ,
             how
             doe
             you
             know
             it
             to
             be
             their
             example
             ,
             if
             it
             be
             not
             written
             ?
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               alledge
               ,
               that
            
             Zanchius
             
               saith
               ,
               it
               is
               no
               vaine
               Ceremony
               but
               the
               holy
               Spirit
               is
               present
               to
               performe
               things
               inwardly
               ▪
               which
               are
               signified
               by
               this
               Ordinance
               outwardly
               .
            
          
           
             I
             have
             granted
             you
             that
             already
             ,
             where
             I
             affirme
             ,
             that
             the
             Church
             having
             the
             Spirit
             of
             God
             hath
             power
             by
             an
             instrument
             of
             her
             owne
             chusing
             ,
             to
             blesse
             the
             party
             to
             his
             worke
             in
             the
             name
             of
             the
             LORD
             ;
             and
             I
             am
             also
             bound
             to
             beleeve
             ,
             that
             God
             will
             accompany
             that
             his
             owne
             Ordinance
             (
             which
             is
             performed
             by
             them
             outwardly
             )
             with
             his
             owne
             Spirit
             inwardly
             ,
             to
             furnish
             the
             party
             (
             so
             blessed
             by
             them
             )
             with
             the
             knowledge
             of
             the
             Scripture
             ,
             which
             is
             able
             to
             furnish
             the
             man
             of
             God
             to
             every
             part
             of
             his
             duty
             .
             And
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             that
             we
             have
             not
             departed
             from
             Christs
             way
             ,
             nor
             gone
             any
             other
             way
             ,
             in
             things
             concerning
             his
             House
             and
             Officers
             ,
             then
             he
             hath
             directed
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               demand
               for
               what
               cause
            
             Paul
             
               left
            
             Titus
             
               at
            
             Cr●●te
             ?
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             I
             have
             told
             you
             before
             ,
             that
             it
             was
             to
             communicate
             the
             things
             unto
             others
             ,
             which
             hee
             had
             learned
             ,
             whereof
             Ordination
             was
             one
             .
             And
             no
             doubt
             but
             hee
             declared
             the
             same
             to
             faithfull
             men
             ,
             that
             they
             might
             teach
             others
             also
             ,
             therefore
             he
             was
             there
             employed
             in
             preaching
             of
             the
             Gospell
             ,
             as
             
             well
             as
             if
             he
             had
             gone
             preaching
             with
             
               Paul
               .
            
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               goe
               upon
               ,
               is
               the
               triall
               of
               the
               gifts
               of
               Ministers
               ,
               and
               this
               you
               attribute
               to
               them
               which
               have
               the
               greatest
               measure
               of
               the
               Spirit
               ,
               for
               you
               say
               ,
               Examination
               belongeth
               to
               the
               most
               skilfull
               ,
               and
               they
               who
               have
               most
               authority
               .
            
          
           
             All
             these
             things
             are
             well
             allowed
             of
             by
             us
             ,
             for
             who
             hath
             a
             greater
             measure
             of
             the
             Spirit
             than
             beleevers
             ?
             and
             who
             hath
             more
             skill
             than
             he
             that
             hath
             beene
             trained
             up
             in
             the
             Schoole
             of
             Christ
             ?
             and
             hath
             learned
             this
             Lesson
             to
             be
             obedient
             to
             his
             Master
             Christ
             in
             keeping
             of
             all
             his
             commandements
             ?
             and
             who
             hath
             greater
             authority
             upon
             the
             earth
             then
             they
             that
             are
             visible
             Saints
             ?
             and
             what
             makes
             men
             visible
             Saints
             ?
             if
             not
             the
             manifestation
             of
             their
             obedience
             to
             God
             the
             Father
             ,
             and
             Christ
             his
             sonne
             ,
             in
             the
             practise
             of
             all
             his
             Ordinances
             ,
             and
             not
             to
             have
             some
             other
             Presbyters
             present
             with
             them
             ,
             to
             assist
             them
             ,
             (
             as
             you
             affirme
             )
             for
             by
             these
             other
             Presbyters
             ,
             I
             know
             not
             yet
             who
             you
             meane
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               the
               Church
               may
               be
               led
               into
               errours
               ,
               or
               kept
               in
               a
               low
               estate
               by
               unfit
               Pastors
               and
               Elders
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             It
             is
             a
             cleare
             truth
             ;
             as
             wofull
             experience
             teacheth
             us
             ,
             who
             live
             here
             in
             the
             Land
             of
             England
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               affirme
               ,
               that
               visible
               Saints
               cannot
               ordaine
               Officers
               ,
               because
               they
               have
               no
               gifts
               of
               prayer
               .
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             Here
             you
             make
             prayer
             the
             Ordination
             of
             Ministers
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               say
               they
               are
               not
               able
               to
               conceive
               prayer
               .
            
          
           
             Here
             you
             give
             the
             holy
             Ghost
             the
             lie
             :
             for
             Beleevers
             have
             received
             the
             Spirit
             of
             adoption
             to
             cry
             
               Abba
               Father
               ,
            
          
           
             
               But
               say
               you
               ,
               they
               cannot
               conceive
               prayer
               according
               to
               the
               action
               in
               bo●●
               .
            
          
           
             Here
             you
             would
             seeme
             to
             make
             beleevers
             ,
             which
             have
             the
             Spirit
             of
             God
             ,
             to
             leade
             them
             into
             all
             truths
             ,
             more
             voide
             of
             common
             reason
             ,
             then
             men
             that
             have
             but
             gifts
             of
             nature
             .
          
           
             
               Againe
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               have
               not
               gifts
               to
               make
               publike
               exhortation
               ,
               and
               admonition
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             If
             they
             had
             first
             knowledge
             to
             feele
             the
             want
             of
             a
             Pastor
             ,
             and
             also
             divers
             able
             men
             out
             of
             whom
             to
             elect
             and
             ordaine
             a
             Pastor
             ,
             then
             they
             out
             of
             whom
             this
             person
             is
             chosen
             ,
             are
             able
             to
             exhort
             ,
             and
             to
             admonish
             :
             for
             he
             that
             hath
             not
             the
             gift
             of
             teaching
             ,
             may
             have
             the
             gift
             of
             exhortation
             :
             againe
             ,
             the
             man
             that
             undertaketh
             to
             teach
             others
             ,
             ought
             to
             be
             taught
             by
             God
             ,
             and
             likewise
             to
             be
             able
             by
             sound
             Doctrine
             to
             withstand
             the
             Gainesayers
             ,
             but
             a
             man
             may
             give
             good
             exhortations
             ,
             (
             and
             
             that
             publikely
             )
             that
             is
             not
             able
             to
             withstand
             the
             Gainesayers
             by
             ●ound
             Doctrine
             .
             By
             this
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             the
             Church
             of
             God
             can
             never
             be
             without
             some
             Ministers
             ,
             except
             it
             be
             (
             according
             to
             that
             spoken
             by
             
               Zacha●iah
            
             )
             in
             the
             day
             of
             very
             small
             things
             indeede
             ,
             when
             God
             shall
             take
             away
             their
             Ministers
             by
             death
             ,
             prison
             ,
             or
             exile
             :
             for
             seeing
             the
             Churches
             were
             planted
             by
             Ministers
             of
             Gods
             owne
             ordaining
             ;
             therefore
             they
             were
             not
             without
             Ministers
             in
             the
             very
             beginning
             :
             and
             still
             the
             Churches
             are
             planted
             by
             the
             Ministeriall
             power
             of
             the
             Lord
             Jesus
             ,
             which
             cannot
             be
             exercised
             without
             fit
             instruments
             ;
             Yet
             that
             they
             must
             want
             the
             word
             preached
             ,
             or
             Sacraments
             administred
             ,
             till
             they
             have
             Pastors
             and
             Teacher
             in
             Office
             ,
             is
             yet
             to
             be
             proved
             ,
             but
             that
             
               page
            
             of
             Mr.
             
             
               Robinsons
               ,
            
             which
             hath
             beene
             alledged
             before
             ,
             is
             sufficient
             for
             this
             present
             purpose
             against
             you
             ,
             even
             to
             prove
             that
             the
             family
             must
             not
             be
             unprovided
             for
             ,
             either
             for
             the
             absence
             or
             neglect
             of
             a
             Steward
             .
          
           
             But
             now
             you
             seeme
             to
             insinuate
             an
             affirmation
             ,
             or
             a
             supposition
             ,
             I
             cannot
             well
             tell
             whether
             ,
             
               That
               a
               ruleing
               Elder
               may
               be
               destitute
               of
               the
               guift
               of
               discering
               ,
               and
               seeme
               to
               imply
               ,
               that
               if
               he
               be
               destitute
               ,
               then
               all
               the
               Church
               must
               be
               destitute
               ,
               if
               there
               be
               no
               more
               Officers
               then
               be
               .
            
          
           
             Here
             you
             would
             faine
             make
             the
             ruling
             Elders
             ,
             the
             eyes
             of
             the
             Church
             ,
             and
             then
             all
             the
             rest
             of
             the
             body
             must
             be
             blinde
             ,
             and
             so
             unfit
             to
             have
             any
             hand
             in
             election
             ,
             and
             also
             voide
             of
             the
             Spirit
             of
             Grace
             to
             discerne
             the
             gifts
             by
             ,
             though
             it
             hath
             beene
             proved
             unto
             you
             before
             ,
             that
             she
             is
             the
             greatest
             of
             all
             ,
             having
             the
             Spirit
             of
             God
             to
             leade
             her
             into
             all
             truth
             ,
             being
             the
             Spouse
             of
             Christ
             ,
             and
             endowed
             with
             all
             his
             riches
             ,
             gifts
             ,
             and
             donations
             .
          
           
             And
             thus
             you
             still
             deny
             the
             Authority
             ,
             &
             ability
             of
             the
             Church
             giving
             to
             the
             persons
             in
             office
             all
             power
             and
             deserning
             .
             But
             this
             is
             indeede
             according
             to
             your
             practise
             here
             in
             
               England
               ,
            
             but
             not
             according
             to
             the
             minde
             and
             Spirit
             of
             God
             .
          
           
             And
             for
             the
             neighbour
             Churches
             Counsell
             ,
             I
             deny
             not
             ,
             but
             that
             it
             may
             be
             imbraced
             ,
             and
             the
             Saints
             have
             cause
             to
             praise
             God
             for
             any
             helpes
             of
             Gods
             ordaining
             .
             But
             if
             they
             want
             the
             helpe
             of
             a
             neighbour
             Church
             to
             Counsell
             them
             ,
             or
             neighbour
             Ministers
             to
             direct
             them
             :
             yet
             if
             they
             be
             a
             Church
             of
             Jesus
             Christ
             ,
             they
             have
             (
             as
             hath
             beene
             said
             before
             )
             power
             among
             themselves
             to
             elect
             and
             ordaine
             their
             owne
             Officers
             ;
             as
             also
             the
             Spirit
             of
             discerning
             ▪
             whereby
             to
             try
             their
             gifts
             ,
             and
             yet
             be
             farre
             from
             falling
             into
             that
             evill
             ,
             which
             they
             complaine
             against
             in
             the
             Episcopacie
             (
             namely
             )
             for
             one
             man
             to
             have
             the
             sole
             power
             of
             Ordination
             .
          
           
             By
             all
             these
             particulars
             ,
             you
             may
             clearely
             see
             all
             your
             pretended
             
             proofes
             and
             former
             assertions
             disproved
             ,
             as
             I
             promised
             you
             ,
             in
             the
             entrance
             of
             this
             my
             answer
             to
             your
             second
             Reason
             .
          
           
             So
             that
             these
             two
             first
             Reasons
             ,
             being
             (
             as
             I
             conceive
             )
             the
             greatest
             Champions
             ,
             which
             you
             have
             sent
             out
             in
             this
             skirmage
             ,
             are
             now
             both
             slaine
             ,
             and
             made
             voide
             of
             all
             the
             life
             that
             ever
             was
             in
             them
             ,
             for
             ,
             they
             were
             made
             most
             of
             suppositions
             ,
             and
             of
             things
             that
             appeared
             unto
             you
             by
             likelihood
             ,
             without
             any
             ground
             from
             the
             Scriptures
             :
             and
             of
             some
             other
             thing
             than
             Gods
             Word
             allowed
             :
             and
             of
             some
             triviall
             affirmations
             which
             were
             not
             grounded
             upon
             any
             truth
             of
             Gods
             Word
             .
          
           
             Now
             ,
             these
             two
             being
             thus
             turned
             aside
             ,
             by
             one
             of
             the
             meanest
             of
             all
             the
             Army
             of
             Jesus
             Christ
             ,
             you
             may
             justly
             feare
             ,
             that
             all
             the
             rest
             of
             your
             souldiers
             will
             run
             away
             wounded
             .
          
        
         
           
             IN
             your
             third
             Reason
             ,
             ▪
             
               You
               say
               it
               is
               not
               to
               be
               thought
               ,
               that
               Christ
               would
               institute
               such
               a
               Government
               of
               his
               Church
               which
               affords
               no
               helpe
               ;
               nor
               allowes
               no
               way
               or
               remedy
               for
               innocent
               persons
               that
               are
               wronged
               .
            
          
           
             Which
             thing
             I
             grant
             to
             be
             very
             true
             ;
             but
             touching
             the
             means
             and
             helpes
             which
             you
             pleade
             for
             ,
             that
             is
             ,
             some
             other
             Synods
             to
             appeale
             unto
             ,
             I
             tell
             you
             I
             know
             not
             what
             Synods
             you
             meane
             .
             But
             this
             I
             affirme
             that
             there
             are
             no
             larger
             Synods
             to
             be
             kept
             to
             settle
             Church
             differences
             ,
             then
             the
             comming
             together
             of
             the
             Ministers
             ,
             and
             Brethren
             ,
             as
             it
             is
             mentioned
             in
             the
             15th
             .
             of
             the
             
               Acts
               ,
            
             which
             I
             have
             granted
             you
             in
             my
             Answers
             to
             your
             former
             Reasons
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               strive
               for
               appeales
               :
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             It
             is
             the
             rule
             of
             Christ
             ,
             that
             if
             one
             brother
             doe
             
             trespasse
             against
             another
             ;
             and
             if
             the
             brother
             offending
             will
             not
             be
             reclaimed
             by
             the
             private
             admonition
             of
             the
             brother
             offended
             ,
             he
             is
             to
             be
             admonished
             by
             one
             or
             two
             other
             brethren
             with
             him
             ;
             but
             if
             he
             will
             not
             heare
             them
             ,
             the
             brother
             offended
             is
             to
             tell
             the
             Church
             ;
             and
             if
             he
             will
             not
             heare
             the
             Church
             ,
             then
             he
             is
             not
             to
             be
             accounted
             a
             brother
             but
             as
             a
             Heathen
             man
             and
             a
             Publican
             ;
             if
             not
             as
             a
             brother
             ,
             then
             out
             of
             the
             fellowship
             :
             then
             if
             the
             wrong
             be
             any
             personall
             injury
             ,
             as
             oppression
             ,
             or
             fraud
             ,
             or
             any
             other
             sinne
             of
             these
             natures
             ,
             the
             Law
             is
             open
             ,
             where
             he
             may
             appeale
             for
             Justice
             to
             the
             Magistrate
             in
             any
             part
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ,
             where-ever
             he
             liveth
             ;
             but
             if
             it
             be
             a
             matter
             of
             scandall
             ;
             as
             if
             hee
             should
             be
             a
             drunkard
             ,
             or
             incontinent
             ,
             or
             the
             like
             ,
             then
             he
             hath
             sufficient
             remedy
             ,
             when
             such
             a
             one
             is
             cast
             out
             of
             his
             society
             .
             By
             this
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             the
             way
             of
             government
             given
             by
             Christ
             Jesus
             ,
             the
             King
             of
             peace
             ,
             is
             the
             way
             of
             peace
             and
             righteousnesse
             .
          
           
             And
             whereas
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               if
               the
               controversie
               touching
               Circumcision
               ,
               should
               have
               beene
               ended
               in
               the
               Church
               of
            
             Antiochia
             ,
             
               then
               parties
               must
               have
               beene
               Iudges
               .
            
          
           
           
             Here
             ,
             you
             would
             seeme
             by
             this
             to
             make
             the
             whole
             Church
             of
             
               Antioch
            
             leavened
             with
             the
             Doctrine
             of
             Justification
             by
             Circumcision
             ,
             which
             to
             doe
             is
             a
             very
             great
             slander
             ,
             as
             it
             appeares
             by
             
               Paul
            
             &
             
               Barnabas
            
             opposing
             them
             there
             ,
             and
             that
             Churches
             sending
             
               Paul
            
             and
             
               Barnabas
            
             to
             have
             the
             Churches
             advise
             at
             
               Ierusalem
            
             concerning
             
             this
             matter
             .
          
           
             
               But
               whereas
               you
               affirme
               ,
               That
               the
               Church
               of
            
             Antiochia
             ,
             
               judged
               it
               unequall
               to
               decide
               the
               case
               among
               themselves
               :
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             That
             they
             judged
             it
             unequall
             ,
             is
             more
             than
             is
             expressed
             in
             that
             place
             :
             but
             if
             that
             should
             be
             granted
             ,
             it
             will
             make
             against
             you
             ,
             for
             their
             reason
             in
             sending
             the
             matter
             to
             
               Ierusalem
               ,
            
             was
             ,
             because
             the
             parties
             were
             members
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
               ,
            
             as
             it
             appeares
             by
             
               Acts.
            
             ●5
             .
             1.
             5.
             24.
             
             The
             first
             verse
             sheweth
             ,
             that
             they
             were
             men
             of
             
               Iudea
               ;
            
             the
             5th
             .
             verse
             proves
             that
             they
             were
             Beleevers
             ▪
             The
             24th
             ▪
             verse
             declares
             ,
             that
             they
             went
             out
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
            
             unto
             them
             .
             And
             by
             this
             you
             may
             see
             plainely
             ,
             that
             this
             
               Chapter
            
             (
             above
             all
             the
             
               Chapters
            
             that
             I
             can
             finde
             )
             proves
             Independencie
             upon
             your
             owne
             ground
             ;
             that
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Antiochia
            
             judged
             it
             an
             unequall
             thing
             for
             them
             to
             judge
             the
             members
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
               .
            
             And
             by
             this
             you
             may
             perceive
             ,
             how
             you
             have
             either
             erred
             ,
             not
             knowing
             the
             Scriptures
             or
             else
             you
             have
             done
             worse
             in
             labouring
             to
             darken
             the
             truth
             by
             evasions
             ,
             or
             false
             glosses
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             third
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             IN
             your
             fourth
             Reason
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               the
               light
               and
               Law
               of
               Nature
               ,
               with
               right
               reason
               ,
               is
               against
               the
               Independancie
               of
               particular
               Churches
               ▪
            
             which
             is
             an
             unjust
             affirmation
             as
             hath
             beene
             plainely
             proved
             before
             in
             the
             Answer
             to
             your
             third
             Reason
             .
             ▪
             But
             a
             few
             words
             concerning
             this
             Reason
             .
          
           
             
               You
               say
               it
               is
               found
               necessary
               ,
               in
               bodies
               naturall
               ,
               that
               the
               particular
               members
               doe
               joyne
               in
               one
               ,
               for
               the
               good
               of
               the
               whole
               ,
               and
               that
               the
               whole
               being
               greater
               than
               a
               part
               ,
               the
               severall
               parts
               should
               be
               subject
               too
               ,
               and
               ordered
               by
               the
               whole
               :
            
             All
             this
             I
             have
             granted
             you
             freely
             ▪
             already
             in
             the
             Answer
             to
             your
             second
             Reason
             ;
             where
             I
             have
             plainely
             proved
             unto
             you
             ,
             that
             the
             hands
             of
             the
             Church
             are
             ordered
             by
             the
             whole
             body
             ,
             in
             the
             Ordination
             of
             the
             Ministery
             :
             And
             this
             is
             according
             to
             the
             very
             Scripture
             it selfe
             ,
             for
             the
             holy
             Ghost
             speaketh
             so
             ,
             in
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             12.
             
             Comparing
             the
             Church
             of
             God
             to
             
             the
             naturall
             body
             of
             a
             man
             ;
             and
             therefore
             when
             the
             hand
             lanceth
             the
             foote
             ,
             it
             cannot
             be
             said
             properly
             to
             be
             the
             action
             of
             the
             hand
             alone
             ,
             because
             the
             hand
             is
             set
             a
             worke
             ,
             by
             the
             body
             ;
             neither
             can
             the
             body
             set
             the
             hand
             a
             worke
             ,
             if
             it
             be
             destitute
             of
             the
             
             power
             ,
             for
             the
             motion
             of
             the
             body
             commeth
             not
             from
             the
             hand
             ▪
             but
             the
             motion
             of
             the
             hand
             from
             the
             body
             ;
             and
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             I
             have
             granted
             your
             comparison
             .
             And
             the
             nearer
             politicke
             bodies
             doe
             goe
             to
             this
             Rule
             ;
             the
             more
             orderly
             they
             are
             guided
             ;
             for
             as
             all
             the
             cities
             and
             country
             of
             
               England
               ,
            
             make
             up
             but
             one
             Kingdome
             ,
             and
             all
             the
             people
             in
             
               England
            
             ought
             to
             be
             subject
             to
             one
             King
             ;
             so
             all
             the
             Independant
             Congregations
             in
             
               England
               ,
            
             and
             out
             of
             
               England
               ,
            
             (
             that
             are
             guided
             by
             the
             Lawes
             of
             Christ
             )
             make
             up
             but
             one
             Kingdome
             spiritually
             to
             him
             that
             is
             their
             King
             .
          
           
             Now
             concerning
             Armies
             ;
             though
             I
             be
             very
             ignorant
             in
             these
             things
             ▪
             yet
             thus
             much
             I
             conceive
             ,
             that
             all
             the
             Armies
             ,
             that
             belong
             to
             the
             Kingdome
             ought
             to
             be
             under
             the
             banner
             of
             their
             owne
             King
             ;
             even
             so
             all
             the
             particular
             Congregations
             of
             
               Christ
               ,
            
             are
             to
             be
             guided
             by
             the
             Lawes
             of
             their
             owne
             Captaine
             Christ
             ,
             who
             rideth
             before
             them
             with
             his
             garments
             dipt
             in
             blood
             ,
             and
             they
             follow
             after
             him
             riding
             upon
             white
             horses
             ,
             
               Revel.
            
             19.
             11
             ,
             12.
             13
             ,
             14.
             
          
           
             We
             reade
             also
             in
             the
             Scripture
             of
             another
             armie
             ,
             which
             were
             gathered
             together
             against
             the
             Lord
             ,
             and
             against
             his
             Christ
             :
             And
             this
             armie
             (
             I
             conceive
             )
             consisteth
             of
             those
             Locusts
             ,
             which
             ascended
             out
             of
             the
             bottomlesse
             pit
             ,
             
               Rev.
            
             9.
             
             And
             these
             ,
             as
             I
             told
             you
             before
             ,
             are
             Arch-Bishops
             ,
             Diocesan
             Bishops
             ,
             Deanes
             ,
             Prebends
             ,
             &c.
             and
             the
             rest
             of
             that
             rable
             ;
             and
             these
             also
             have
             a
             King
             over
             them
             ,
             which
             is
             the
             Angell
             of
             the
             bottomlesse
             pit
             ,
             who
             is
             said
             to
             be
             the
             great
             red
             Dragon
             the
             Devill
             and
             Sathan
             ,
             
               Rev.
            
             12.
             3.
             9.
             and
             20.
             2.
             who
             gave
             unto
             this
             armie
             his
             power
             and
             throne
             ,
             and
             great
             authority
             ,
             
               Rev.
            
             13.
             2.
             
             Therefore
             ,
             to
             any
             Counsells
             that
             are
             held
             ,
             or
             Canon
             Lawes
             that
             are
             enacted
             by
             any
             Captaine
             of
             this
             armie
             ,
             the
             Churches
             of
             Christ
             ought
             not
             to
             submit
             ,
             though
             they
             should
             be
             commanded
             ,
             by
             any
             Statute
             Law
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ;
             for
             those
             Statute
             Lawes
             are
             not
             according
             to
             Christs
             Rule
             ,
             but
             ought
             by
             all
             Councells
             of
             State
             to
             be
             repealed
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               It
               is
               alledged
               by
               the
               Separation
               ;
               that
               hold
               Independancie
               ,
               That
               the
               Magistrate
               of
            
             Leyden
             
               cannot
               governe
               in
            
             Delph
             :
          
           
             This
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             grant
             ;
             for
             I
             am
             sure
             the
             Magistrates
             of
             
               Coventry
            
             cannot
             execute
             their
             office
             in
             
               Shrewsbury
               ,
            
             neither
             can
             the
             one
             Towne
             chuse
             Magistrates
             for
             the
             other
             :
             and
             this
             still
             proves
             Independencie
             ,
             for
             either
             of
             these
             may
             chuse
             their
             owne
             ,
             and
             guide
             their
             owne
             at
             all
             times
             ,
             except
             they
             forfeit
             their
             Charter
             .
          
           
             
               Now
               whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               people
               alleadge
               for
               themselves
               ,
               that
               the
            
             
             
               Law
               of
               nature
               teacheth
               them
               to
               make
               a
               Covenant
               ;
               though
               there
               be
               neither
               precept
               nor
               practise
               of
               it
               in
               the
               word
               .
            
          
           
             I
             suppose
             you
             misconster
             their
             sayings
             ,
             for
             the
             text
             alleadged
             in
             
               Thessalonians
            
             4●
             doth
             not
             prove
             that
             brotherly
             love
             was
             never
             written
             of
             in
             the
             Scripture
             ;
             but
             that
             it
             had
             beene
             so
             sufficiently
             taught
             of
             God
             by
             written
             precepts
             ,
             that
             it
             needed
             not
             to
             be
             written
             againe
             .
             Besides
             ,
             I
             am
             able
             to
             prove
             by
             the
             Scripture
             ,
             that
             there
             is
             both
             precept
             and
             practise
             for
             a
             Church
             Covenant
             :
             the
             which
             I
             will
             answer
             you
             in
             the
             Answer
             to
             your
             6th
             .
             Reason
             ,
             where
             you
             begge
             the
             Question
             .
          
           
             
               Concerning
               what
               is
               asserted
               by
               some
               Divines
               of
            
             Scotland
             ,
             
               That
               in
               such
               things
               as
               are
               alike
               common
               to
               the
               Church
               ,
               and
               Commonwealth
               ,
               and
               have
               the
               same
               use
               in
               both
               ,
               and
               that
               whatsoever
               natures
               light
               directeth
               the
               one
               ,
               directeth
               the
               other
               also
               .
            
          
           
             You
             know
             (
             by
             what
             hath
             beene
             formerly
             spoken
             )
             I
             have
             fully
             assented
             unto
             it
             .
          
           
             I
             also
             agree
             with
             
               Amesius
               ,
            
             as
             farre
             as
             he
             agrees
             with
             the
             truth
             ;
             but
             to
             agree
             with
             you
             in
             that
             falsehood
             ,
             that
             the
             Government
             of
             independant
             Churches
             ,
             is
             against
             the
             light
             of
             nature
             and
             right
             Reason
             ,
             that
             I
             have
             denied
             ,
             and
             disproved
             sufficiently
             already
             .
          
           
             Thus
             having
             answered
             every
             particular
             thing
             in
             this
             Reason
             ,
             that
             hath
             not
             beene
             answered
             already
             ,
             I
             proceede
             to
             the
             Fifth
             .
          
        
         
           
             IN
             your
             5th
             .
             Reason
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               That
               there
               be
               many
               Rules
               in
               Scripture
               ,
               that
               doe
               require
               the
               combination
               of
               Churches
               into
               Synods
               ;
               for
               proofe
               whereof
               you
               say
               ,
               that
            
             Amesius
             
               confesseth
               ,
               the
               Rules
               and
               Commands
               to
               be
               such
               as
               these
               ;
            
             Let
             all
             things
             be
             done
             to
             edification
             ,
             decently
             and
             in
             order
             ,
             
               Cor.
            
             14.
             26.
             40.
             and
             follow
             after
             the
             things
             which
             make
             for
             peace
             ,
             
               Rom.
            
             14.
             19.
             
             So
             
               Phil.
            
             4.
             8.
             
             
               And
               you
               conclude
               that
               Synods
               a●e
               found
               to
               be
               for
               edification
               ,
               peace
               ,
               and
               order
               .
            
             But
             you
             have
             brought
             no
             Scripture
             yet
             that
             proveth
             it
             ▪
             and
             I
             know
             all
             Scripture
             is
             against
             it
             ,
             therefore
             I
             deny
             it
             .
             And
             as
             for
             the
             Scriptures
             alleadged
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             by
             
               Amesius
               ,
            
             they
             are
             such
             as
             were
             spoken
             to
             particular
             Congregations
             :
             and
             in
             the
             particular
             Congregation
             of
             
               Colosse
               ,
               Paul
            
             beheld
             a
             comely
             order
             ,
             notwithstanding
             there
             were
             no
             Synod
             ,
             consisting
             of
             any
             but
             onely
             the
             members
             and
             Ministers
             of
             that
             Congregation
             ,
             
               Col.
            
             2.
             5.
             
          
           
             
               And
               as
               for
               commands
               ,
               which
               you
               say
               are
               some
               generall
               ,
               and
               others
               particular
               ;
            
             Here
             you
             labour
             by
             evasions
             to
             turne
             away
             the
             truth
             ;
             for
             you
             your selfe
             know
             ▪
             that
             every
             particular
             command
             reacheth
             not
             to
             the
             generall
             ,
             though
             a
             generall
             command
             reach
             to
             
             every
             particular
             .
             Now
             if
             you
             can
             shew
             us
             in
             the
             Scriptures
             any
             generall
             command
             ,
             that
             all
             the
             Churches
             should
             ,
             or
             an
             example
             that
             all
             the
             Churches
             did
             gather
             a
             Councell
             of
             some
             Ministers
             out
             of
             every
             particular
             Congregation
             ,
             to
             make
             Decrees
             o●
             Lawes
             to
             impose
             upon
             the
             whole
             ,
             then
             you
             will
             speake
             speake
             something
             to
             the
             purpose
             ,
             but
             as
             yet
             you
             have
             not
             spoken
             one
             word
             that
             proveth
             any
             such
             thing
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               alleadge
               that
               Scripture
               ,
            
             That
             the
             Spirits
             of
             the
             Prophets
             must
             be
             subject
             to
             the
             Prophets
             ,
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             14.
             32.
             
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             That
             that
             is
             given
             to
             particular
             Congregations
             ;
             and
             therefore
             not
             to
             all
             in
             a
             Province
             or
             Nation
             ,
             and
             so
             not
             to
             Synods
             :
             And
             
               Paul
               never
               sought
               to
               winne
               credit
               nor
               obedience
               to
               Orders
               established
               by
               himselfe
               ,
               (
               as
               you
               say
               )
            
             for
             he
             never
             made
             any
             other
             Orders
             ,
             nor
             taught
             the
             people
             any
             other
             thing
             than
             what
             he
             had
             received
             of
             the
             Lord
             Jesus
             ,
             as
             it
             is
             plaine
             in
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             11.
             
             
               Be
               ye
               followers
               of
               me
            
             (
             saith
             he
             )
             
               as
               I
               am
               of
               Christ
               ,
            
             and
             in
             the
             23.
             
               verse
            
             of
             the
             same
             Chapter
             ,
             
               I
               have
               received
               of
               the
               Lord
            
             (
             saith
             he
             )
             
               that
               which
               I
               have
               delivered
               unto
               you
               .
               Paul
            
             also
             writes
             unto
             these
             
               Corinthians
               ,
            
             (
             whom
             he
             had
             converted
             unto
             the
             faith
             )
             
               to
               be
               followers
               of
               him
               ,
            
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             4.
             ●6
             .
             in
             
               ver.
            
             17.
             he
             sheweth
             them
             ,
             that
             therefore
             he
             sent
             
               Timothy
            
             unto
             them
             ,
             to
             the
             end
             that
             
               Timothy
            
             should
             put
             them
             in
             remembrance
             of
             
               Pauls
            
             wayes
             in
             Christ
             ,
             as
             
               Paul
            
             had
             taught
             every where
             in
             every
             Church
             .
             Here
             you
             may
             see
             
               Paul
            
             brings
             not
             the
             Example
             of
             the
             Synod
             before
             them
             ,
             nor
             layes
             upon
             them
             any
             Decree
             or
             Command
             ,
             to
             practise
             
               otherwise
               than
               he
               himselfe
               had
               learned
               in
               Christ
               ;
            
             yet
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             not
             deny
             ,
             but
             that
             this
             Church
             spoken
             of
             ,
             was
             a
             Church
             of
             Christ
             as
             well
             as
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Colosse
               .
            
          
           
             
               Now
               the
               next
               thing
               to
               be
               considered
               is
               ,
               that
               which
               you
               alleadge
               of
               Pauls
               submission
               ,
               to
               the
               practise
               of
               what
               was
               agreed
               upon
               ,
               by
               the
               common
               consent
               of
            
             Iames
             ,
             
               and
               the
               rest
               of
               the
               Elders
               ,
               Acts
            
             21.
             
               from
               .
            
             18.
             
               to
            
             27.
             
          
           
             The
             Reason
             why
             they
             counselled
             
               Paul
            
             to
             doe
             the
             thing
             ,
             was
             ,
             because
             of
             the
             information
             that
             the
             Jewes
             had
             then
             against
             
               Paul
               ▪
            
             that
             he
             taught
             the
             people
             to
             forsake
             
               Moses
               ,
               Acts
            
             21.
             21.
             
             Now
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             not
             deny
             ,
             but
             that
             this
             was
             a
             false
             affirmation
             .
          
           
             The
             thing
             wherein
             they
             conceived
             he
             transgressed
             was
             ,
             by
             bringing
             in
             
               Trophimus
            
             an
             
               Ephesian
               ,
            
             (
             as
             they
             thought
             into
             the
             Temple
             )
             because
             they
             saw
             him
             with
             him
             in
             the
             citie
             .
          
           
             This
             was
             but
             their
             supposition
             ,
             as
             it
             appeares
             in
             the
             29
             verse
             of
             this
             Chapter
             .
          
           
             Now
             what
             the
             Elders
             counselled
             
               Paul
            
             to
             doe
             ,
             in
             respect
             of
             giving
             offence
             to
             the
             Jewes
             ,
             was
             no
             injunction
             to
             any
             to
             follow
             
             the
             same
             example
             ,
             except
             it
             were
             in
             the
             same
             case
             .
          
           
             Now
             
               Paul
            
             himselfe
             was
             a
             Jew
             ,
             and
             taught
             all
             men
             that
             
               Christ
            
             was
             come
             to
             fulfill
             the
             Law
             ,
             and
             not
             to
             destroy
             the
             Law
             ;
             therefore
             he
             condescended
             to
             circumcise
             
               Timothy
            
             because
             his
             mother
             was
             a
             Jew
             ,
             and
             the
             Jewes
             knew
             his
             father
             was
             a
             
               Grecian
               .
            
             
             But
             
               Titus
            
             a
             
               Grecian
            
             was
             not
             compelled
             to
             be
             circumcised
             ;
             yea
             ,
             though
             there
             were
             false
             brethren
             crastily
             crept
             in
             ,
             to
             spy
             out
             their
             liberty
             ;
             
               Paul
            
             gave
             not
             place
             to
             them
             ,
             no
             not
             for
             an
             houre
             ,
             
               Gal
            
             2.
             3
             4.
             5.
             
          
           
             Now
             the
             things
             that
             the
             Elders
             counselled
             
               Paul
            
             to
             doe
             ,
             was
             to
             purifie
             himselfe
             ,
             with
             them
             that
             had
             a
             vow
             ,
             and
             to
             contribute
             with
             them
             ;
             and
             the
             reason
             wherefore
             they
             counselled
             
               Paul
            
             to
             doe
             this
             ,
             was
             ,
             that
             it
             might
             appeare
             to
             the
             Jewes
             that
             
               Paul
            
             was
             a
             Jew
             ,
             and
             not
             an
             uncircumcised
             person
             ,
             for
             the
             Jewes
             knew
             that
             it
             was
             a
             sinfull
             thing
             to
             bring
             into
             the
             Temple
             any
             uncircumcised
             person
             in
             heart
             or
             flesh
             ,
             
               Ezek.
            
             44.
             7.
             
          
           
             Now
             
               Paul
            
             in
             all
             this
             did
             nothing
             but
             what
             was
             commanded
             in
             the
             Law
             ,
             as
             purifications
             and
             vowes
             ,
             &c.
             
          
           
             Moreover
             ,
             this
             counsell
             of
             
               Iames
            
             and
             the
             Elders
             unto
             
               Paul
               ,
            
             was
             not
             generall
             to
             the
             beleeving
             Jewes
             ;
             neither
             was
             it
             generally
             or
             particularly
             to
             the
             
               Gentiles
               ,
            
             but
             particularly
             to
             
               Paul
               ,
            
             and
             the
             rest
             with
             him
             ,
             because
             of
             the
             false
             report
             which
             the
             Jewes
             had
             received
             of
             him
             .
          
           
             And
             as
             this
             Counsell
             was
             not
             generall
             ,
             so
             it
             was
             not
             perpetuall
             ,
             but
             served
             to
             put
             an
             honorable
             end
             to
             the
             Law
             ,
             which
             
               Christ
            
             came
             to
             fulfill
             ,
             and
             not
             to
             destroy
             .
          
           
             By
             all
             this
             it
             appeares
             ,
             it
             maketh
             nothing
             for
             any
             counsell
             that
             you
             plead
             for
             ,
             to
             establish
             any
             unwritten
             verities
             ;
             for
             such
             counsels
             are
             the
             counsels
             of
             darkenesse
             :
             because
             they
             are
             not
             according
             to
             the
             Law
             and
             the
             Testimony
             ,
             it
             appeares
             there
             is
             no
             light
             in
             them
             :
             therefore
             they
             are
             not
             of
             authoritie
             to
             bind
             any
             particular
             member
             of
             the
             Church
             ,
             much
             lesse
             the
             generall
             ,
             as
             you
             say
             they
             are
             .
          
           
             
               But
               seeing
               you
               confesse
               ,
               that
               no
               Synod
               can
               say
               ▪
               It
               seemeth
               good
               unto
               the
               holy
               Ghost
               and
               to
               us
               ;
            
             it
             plainely
             appeares
             that
             your
             counsels
             presume
             without
             the
             counsell
             of
             the
             holy
             Ghost
             .
             But
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             that
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
            
             did
             nothing
             without
             the
             counsell
             of
             the
             Spirit
             ,
             neither
             determined
             of
             any
             thing
             ,
             that
             was
             not
             written
             in
             the
             Scripture
             .
             So
             the
             Churches
             of
             God
             now
             ought
             to
             presume
             to
             do
             nothing
             but
             what
             the
             written
             Word
             allowes
             them
             ;
             being
             taught
             the
             true
             meaning
             thereof
             by
             the
             Spirit
             that
             God
             hath
             given
             them
             .
          
           
             Moreover
             ,
             the
             counsell
             of
             
               Ierusalem
            
             imposed
             nothing
             
             upon
             the
             
               Gentiles
            
             for
             a
             Law
             ,
             but
             counselled
             them
             to
             abstaine
             from
             some
             necessary
             things
             ,
             which
             would
             be
             either
             offensive
             to
             the
             Iewes
             ,
             or
             sinfull
             in
             themselves
             ,
             
               Acts
            
             15.
             29.
             20.
             28.
             29.
             
          
           
             Now
             seeing
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
            
             hath
             done
             nothing
             ,
             but
             by
             he
             counsell
             of
             the
             written
             word
             ,
             in
             forbidding
             things
             sinfull
             in
             themselves
             and
             offensive
             to
             their
             brethren
             ,
             it
             appeares
             to
             be
             plainely
             against
             your
             Synods
             ,
             and
             dependencie
             in
             government
             ,
             which
             in
             cases
             difficult
             ,
             doe
             establish
             things
             which
             have
             no
             footing
             in
             Gods
             word
             ;
             
               neither
               have
               they
               ,
               by
               your
               owne
               confession
               ,
               in
               their
               Counsels
               any
               one
               ,
               who
               is
               immediatly
               and
               infallibly
               imspired
               by
               the
               Spirit
               ,
               and
               able
               of
               himselfe
               to
               satisfie
               the
               controversie
               ,
               they
               being
               by
               your
               owne
               confession
               inferiour
               to
               Paul
               and
               Barnabas
               ;
            
             And
             
               Paul
            
             and
             
               Barnabas
            
             might
             teach
             nothing
             but
             what
             was
             taught
             in
             the
             Law
             and
             the
             Prophets
             .
             And
             therefore
             ,
             by
             this
             it
             appeares
             you
             have
             not
             grounded
             any
             affirmation
             or
             supposition
             upon
             Gods
             word
             ;
             for
             the
             proving
             either
             of
             your
             Synods
             or
             dependencie
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             fifth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               sixth
               Reason
               you
               affirme
               that
               the
               government
               of
               the
               Church
               by
               Synods
               ,
               is
               no where
               forbidden
               by
               God
               in
               the
               new
               Testament
               ,
               either
               directly
               ,
               or
               by
               consequence
               .
            
          
           
             But
             I
             doe
             affirme
             the
             contrary
             ,
             and
             prove
             it
             thus
             ;
          
           
             That
             whatsoever
             Government
             is
             not
             commanded
             by
             God
             is
             accursed
             ,
             and
             that
             is
             plainely
             manifested
             in
             the
             New
             Testament
             ▪
             
               Rev.
            
             22.
             18.
             
          
           
             But
             your
             government
             by
             Synods
             is
             not
             commanded
             by
             God
             ,
             and
             therefore
             it
             is
             accursed
             ▪
             as
             it
             will
             appeare
             in
             the
             following
             discourse
             .
          
           
             
               Whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               all
               the
               Ministers
               are
               greater
               than
               one
               :
            
          
           
             I
             have
             already
             proved
             ,
             that
             the
             Church
             of
             Christ
             is
             greater
             than
             all
             the
             Ministers
             .
             
          
           
             
               You
               say
               Synods
               appoint
               no
               other
               office
               or
               Officer
               in
               the
               Church
               ,
               which
               Christ
               hath
               not
               appointed
               .
            
          
           
             Me
             thinkes
             you
             are
             strangely
             put
             to
             your
             shifts
             ▪
             that
             dare
             not
             tell
             the
             world
             what
             you
             meane
             by
             your
             Synods
             .
             But
             if
             you
             meane
             the
             Councell
             or
             Convocation
             that
             used
             to
             sit
             at
             
               Pauls
               ,
            
             I
             have
             told
             you
             already
             they
             are
             none
             of
             the
             Councell
             of
             
               Christ
               ,
            
             neither
             hath
             he
             appointed
             that
             councell
             or
             any
             other
             councell
             ,
             to
             make
             ,
             or
             ordaine
             ,
             either
             Officers
             or
             Offices
             for
             his
             Church
             ,
             therefore
             so
             to
             affirme
             is
             blasphemie
             ,
             for
             he
             himselfe
             is
             their
             Lord
             and
             Law-giver
             ,
             and
             hath
             instituted
             every
             particular
             Ordinance
             in
             his
             Church
             ,
             that
             the
             Church
             hath
             neede
             of
             ,
             therefore
             it
             is
             (
             as
             hath
             beene
             said
             already
             )
             against
             the
             Law
             and
             light
             of
             nature
             ▪
             
             and
             contrary
             to
             edification
             ,
             order
             ,
             peace
             ,
             purenesse
             ,
             lovelinesse
             ,
             for
             any
             to
             decree
             for
             ,
             or
             injoyne
             upon
             ,
             the
             Assemblies
             of
             the
             Saints
             any
             other
             practise
             but
             those
             that
             the
             Apostles
             have
             taught
             ,
             which
             they
             themselves
             had
             learned
             from
             the
             Lord
             Jesus
             :
             but
             as
             for
             you
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
               ,
            
             it
             appeareth
             plainely
             that
             you
             doe
             not
             understand
             nor
             see
             the
             forme
             of
             the
             Lords
             House
             ;
             which
             causeth
             you
             to
             call
             upon
             any
             to
             produce
             
               a
               particular
               word
               ,
               or
               rule
               ,
               for
               the
               order
               of
               Gods
               worship
               ,
               what
               must
               be
               performed
               first
               ,
               what
               second
               ,
               what
               third
               ,
               what
               fourth
               ,
               and
               so
               of
               the
               rest
               ;
               and
               that
               no
               Ordinance
               ,
               and
               part
               of
               worship
               may
               be
               in
               another
               order
               .
               Further
               ,
               you
               chalenge
               them
               if
               they
               can
               ,
               to
               shew
               a
               particular
               word
               or
               rule
               out
               of
               the
               New
               Testament
               ,
               for
               their
               Church
               Covenant
               ,
               which
               you
               say
               ,
               is
               the
               forme
               of
               the
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             
               You
               also
               inquire
               for
               the
               forme
               of
               Excommunication
               ,
               and
               Ordination
               ,
               and
               gestures
               in
               the
               severall
               Ordinances
               of
               God
               .
               And
               this
               you
               say
               they
               are
               not
               able
               to
               doe
               ,
               but
               onely
               in
               generall
               rules
               .
            
          
           
             I
             have
             told
             you
             already
             that
             generall
             rules
             reach
             to
             every
             perticular
             ,
             and
             that
             is
             no
             more
             than
             you
             seeme
             to
             know
             already
             :
             for
             you
             have
             confessed
             ,
             that
             there
             are
             generall
             rules
             to
             teach
             every
             one
             of
             these
             particulars
             ,
             which
             you
             could
             not
             chuse
             but
             acknowledge
             ;
             otherwise
             you
             would
             have
             made
             Christ
             not
             so
             faithfull
             in
             his
             house
             as
             
               Moses
               .
            
             But
             the
             more
             you
             know
             ,
             the
             greater
             is
             your
             sinne
             ,
             in
             that
             you
             labour
             to
             turne
             away
             the
             light
             ;
             and
             you
             are
             still
             repairing
             of
             those
             thresholds
             ,
             which
             have
             beene
             set
             up
             by
             Gods
             thresholds
             .
             If
             I
             had
             any
             hope
             therefore
             that
             you
             would
             be
             ashamed
             of
             all
             that
             you
             have
             done
             ,
             I
             would
             shew
             you
             ,
             though
             not
             all
             that
             I
             see
             ,
             yet
             what
             I
             am
             able
             to
             expresse
             of
             the
             forme
             of
             the
             house
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             the
             paterne
             thereof
             ,
             and
             the
             
             going
             out
             thereof
             ,
             and
             the
             comming
             in
             thereof
             ,
             and
             all
             the
             Ordinances
             thereof
             ,
             and
             the
             Lawes
             thereof
             and
             write
             it
             in
             your
             sight
             ,
             that
             so
             you
             may
             keepe
             the
             whole
             fa-shion
             thereof
             ,
             and
             all
             the
             Ordinances
             thereof
             ,
             and
             doe
             them
             .
          
           
             As
             for
             the
             Ordinance
             of
             Election
             ,
             Ordination
             ,
             and
             Excommunication
             &c.
             
             I
             have
             declared
             already
             the
             forme
             to
             them
             that
             have
             their
             eyes
             open
             to
             see
             it
             .
             But
             they
             cannot
             see
             the
             forme
             of
             the
             house
             ,
             that
             have
             not
             repented
             them
             of
             the
             evills
             that
             they
             have
             done
             therefore
             I
             will
             cease
             to
             strive
             with
             such
             persons
             ,
             for
             they
             may
             live
             and
             stay
             long
             enough
             ,
             and
             be
             of
             no
             Church
             of
             Christ
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             Sixth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             IN
             your
             7th
             .
             Reason
             you
             say
             ,
             
               That
               consociation
               and
               combination
               ,
               in
               way
               of
               Synods
               ,
               is
               granted
               by
               themselves
               ,
               (
               and
               you
               produce
               for
               your
               Authors
               these
               foure
               ;
               Christ
               on
               his
               Throne
               ,
               Examination
               of
               Prelates
               Petition
               ,
               Syons
               Prerogative
               Royal
               ,
               and
               the
               Protestation
               Protested
               ;
               which
            
             
             
               Authors
               ,
               if
               the
               Reader
               please
               to
               examine
               shall
               fina●
               cleare
               against
               you
               )
               That
               which
               you
               have
               gathered
               here
               from
               these
               Authors
               is
               ,
               that
               they
               grant
               that
               one
               Church
               should
               be
               content
               that
               matters
               of
               difference
               and
               importance
               should
               be
               heard
               by
               other
               Churches
               ,
               as
               also
               to
               be
               advised
               and
               counselled
               by
               other
               Churches
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             though
             all
             should
             confesse
             ,
             that
             it
             is
             profitable
             to
             have
             the
             counsell
             of
             their
             brethren
             and
             neighbour
             Churches
             in
             doubtfull
             cases
             ,
             yet
             this
             will
             be
             farre
             from
             proving
             the
             lawfulnesse
             of
             your
             Synods
             ;
             as
             may
             appeare
             by
             the
             Authors
             that
             your selfe
             hath
             here
             alledged
             ,
             for
             they
             intend
             no
             such
             Consociation
             ,
             nor
             Combination
             ,
             which
             you
             have
             mentioned
             :
             but
             seeing
             your selfe
             would
             have
             something
             which
             you
             cannot
             prove
             ,
             you
             would
             begge
             of
             others
             to
             grant
             it
             or
             prove
             it
             for
             you
             .
          
           
             
               Concerning
               the
               Orders
               ,
               or
               Decrees
               of
               the
               Church
               of
            
             Ierusalem
             (
             
               Acts
            
             16.
             4
             )
             they
             were
             not
             such
             Decrees
             as
             were
             alterable
             ,
             but
             such
             as
             were
             warranted
             by
             God
             ,
             and
             a
             perpetuall
             Rule
             for
             all
             the
             Churches
             of
             the
             
               Gentiles
               .
            
          
           
             You
             neede
             not
             tell
             me
             what
             
               Amesius
            
             speaketh
             of
             the
             parts
             of
             Discipline
             ,
             as
             if
             any
             of
             the
             Separation
             ,
             held
             it
             to
             consist
             all
             in
             Excommunication
             ;
             for
             I
             have
             told
             you
             already
             ,
             that
             they
             have
             seene
             the
             forme
             of
             the
             Lords
             house
             ,
             and
             have
             respect
             unto
             all
             his
             Ordinances
             ,
             and
             doe
             not
             take
             one
             for
             all
             .
          
           
             
               Neither
               is
               it
               granted
               you
               ,
               that
               admonitions
               and
               reproofès
               ,
               and
               decreeing
               of
               Excommunications
               should
               be
               by
               Officers
               of
               other
               Churches
               ,
               towards
               members
               of
               any
               Congregation
               ,
            
             though
             in
             the
             same
             constitution
             ;
             the
             contrary
             most
             evidently
             appeareth
             ,
             even
             by
             the
             practise
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Antioch
               ,
            
             who
             brought
             the
             matter
             to
             the
             
               Church
            
             of
             
               Ierusalem
               ,
            
             which
             concerned
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalems
            
             members
             ,
             neither
             may
             any
             of
             the
             Churches
             now
             be
             subject
             to
             the
             censures
             of
             other
             Congregations
             ,
             except
             they
             must
             be
             subject
             to
             humane
             Ordinances
             ;
             but
             in
             case
             ,
             both
             the
             members
             ,
             and
             the
             Church
             ,
             be
             obstinate
             in
             any
             knowne
             sinne
             ,
             then
             are
             the
             Churches
             of
             God
             bound
             to
             admonish
             her
             ,
             and
             reprove
             her
             ,
             and
             reject
             her
             ;
             as
             if
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Antiochia
            
             had
             found
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
            
             all
             leavened
             with
             the
             Doctrine
             of
             Iustification
             by
             circumcision
             ;
             then
             had
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Antiochia
            
             power
             to
             admonish
             ,
             reprove
             ,
             and
             reject
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
               ,
            
             and
             not
             have
             communion
             with
             them
             ,
             if
             they
             persisted
             obstinate
             in
             that
             evill
             ;
             for
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Antiochia
            
             was
             not
             inferiour
             in
             power
             to
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
               .
            
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             seventh
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
         
           
             
               IN
               the
               beginning
               of
               your
               Eight
               Reason
               you
               say
               they
               grant
               and
               confe●se
               ,
               That
               Churches
               of
               one
               constitution
               ought
               to
               withdraw
               from
               ;
               and
               ●enounce
               communion
               and
               fellowship
               with
               a
               Congregation
               or
               Church
               that
               is
               fallen
               into
               sinne
               ,
               as
               false
               Doctrine
               ,
               and
               evill
               discipline
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             have
             granted
             you
             ,
             that
             in
             the
             conclusion
             of
             the
             answer
             to
             your
             7d●
             .
             Reason
             ,
             if
             the
             Church
             stand
             obstinace
             in
             sinne
             ,
             and
             will
             not
             be
             reclaimed
             .
          
           
             
               But
               that
               they
               should
               be
               complained
               on
               to
               Syn●ds
               and
               Classes
               ,
               and
               subject
               to
               their
               censures
               ,
               that
               is
               but
               a
               question
               of
               your
               owne
               begging
               ,
            
             and
             remaines
             for
             you
             to
             prove
             ,
             and
             denied
             of
             me
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               would
               know
               is
               the
               diference
               betweene
               excomm●●ication
               and
               reje●●ion
               ,
               and
               would
               seeme
               to
               make
               them
               both
               one
               ▪
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             
               Titus
            
             had
             power
             to
             reject
             a
             person
             ,
             
               a
            
             but
             we
             doe
             not
             reade
             that
             he
             had
             power
             of
             himselfe
             to
             excommunicate
             that
             person
             .
          
           
             A
             wicked
             man
             may
             be
             said
             to
             reject
             God
             when
             he
             rejecteth
             his
             Word
             .
             So
             
               Saul
            
             rejected
             God
             ,
             (
             1
             
               Sam.
            
             15.
             23.
             
               therefore
               God
               rejected
               him
               from
               being
               King
               ,
               vers.
            
             26.
             but
             did
             he
             excommunicate
             God
             ?
             So
             the
             people
             of
             Israel
             rejected
             God
             1
             
               Sam.
            
             8.
             7.
             and
             10.
             19.
             
             Did
             they
             therefore
             excommunicate
             God
             ?
          
           
             Here
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
               ,
            
             you
             may
             see
             that
             Excommunication
             is
             more
             than
             rejection
             ,
             as
             it
             also
             plainely
             appeares
             by
             
               Pauls
            
             words
             ,
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             5.
             4.
             5.
             where
             he
             delivers
             unto
             them
             the
             forme
             of
             Excommunication
             ,
             in
             these
             words
             ;
             
               When
               ye
               are
               gathered
               together
               ,
               and
               my
               spirit
               ,
               in
               the
               name
               of
               our
               Lord
               Iesus
               Christ
               ,
               that
               such
               a
               one
               by
               the
               power
               of
               our
               Lord
               Iesus
               Christ
               be
               delivered
               unto
               Sat●an
               ,
               &c.
            
             Here
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
               ,
            
             you
             may
             plainely
             see
             the
             forme
             of
             this
             part
             of
             the
             Lords
             house
             ;
             This
             you
             see
             
               Paul
            
             had
             determined
             before
             ;
             and
             also
             that
             
               Pauls
            
             spirit
             was
             together
             with
             the
             Church
             in
             the
             action
             doing
             ;
             yet
             
               Paul
            
             tooke
             not
             upon
             him
             that
             power
             of
             himselfe
             ,
             but
             committed
             the
             action
             to
             the
             Church
             who
             had
             the
             power
             of
             our
             Lord
             Iesus
             Christ
             ,
             as
             he
             himselfe
             testifieth
             ,
             which
             plainely
             proves
             ,
             that
             the
             Church
             had
             the
             power
             that
             
               Paul
            
             had
             not
             ;
             for
             though
             
               Paul
            
             was
             a
             good
             Counsellor
             ,
             yet
             he
             was
             no
             executioner
             in
             that
             action
             ,
             but
             as
             a
             member
             for
             his
             part
             .
             Here
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             you
             may
             see
             the
             difference
             betweene
             rejection
             and
             excommunication
             ;
             a
             man
             in
             rejecting
             the
             Law
             of
             God
             ,
             may
             be
             said
             to
             reject
             God
             ,
             and
             he
             that
             addes
             to
             ,
             or
             diminisheth
             from
             the
             Lawes
             of
             God
             ,
             rejects
             God
             ,
             in
             rejecting
             the
             counsell
             of
             God
             ,
             which
             injoynes
             him
             neither
             to
             adde
             ,
             nor
             diminish
             :
             but
             you
             by
             pleading
             for
             your
             unknowne
             Synods
             and
             ungrounded
             dependencie
             ,
             reject
             the
             counsell
             of
             God
             ;
             and
             so
             doe
             all
             those
             ,
             that
             assist
             you
             in
             it
             .
          
           
           
             The
             next
             thing
             you
             affirme
             is
             ;
             
               That
               this
               government
               of
               Independencie
            
             (
             which
             I
             have
             proved
             to
             be
             Christs
             government
             )
             
               overthro●es
               the
               Communion
               of
               Saints
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             This
             appeares
             to
             be
             contrary
             by
             that
             which
             hath
             beene
             said
             already
             ;
             as
             for
             example
             ,
             the
             difference
             betweene
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Antiochia
               ,
            
             and
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierusalem
               ;
            
             turned
             to
             good
             ,
             because
             they
             undertooke
             not
             the
             authority
             to
             determine
             the
             case
             themselves
             ,
             as
             hath
             beene
             said
             ;
             because
             it
             was
             against
             the
             members
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Ierasalem
               :
            
             and
             this
             increased
             union
             and
             communion
             in
             both
             Churches
             ,
             as
             we
             may
             plainely
             see
             ,
             for
             
               Peter
            
             communicated
             unto
             them
             what
             God
             had
             revealed
             unto
             him
             :
             and
             
               Paul
            
             &
             
               Barnabas
            
             declared
             what
             God
             had
             done
             by
             them
             .
             
               Iames
            
             calls
             from●
             backe
             to
             consider
             what
             
               Peter
            
             had
             declared
             ;
             and
             backes
             it
             with
             the
             Scripture
             ,
             manifesting
             how
             it
             agreed
             with
             the
             words
             of
             the
             Prophets
             ,
             as
             you
             may
             reade
             at
             large
             ,
             in
             
               Act.
            
             15.
             
             Thus
             you
             may
             see
             what
             sweete
             Communion
             was
             betweene
             these
             Churches
             that
             were
             both
             Independant
             .
          
           
             
               Now
               ,
               whereas
               you
               say
               〈◊〉
               be
               in
               a
               Christian
               Common-wealth
               ,
               or
               Nation
               .
            
          
           
             I
             doe
             affirme
             it
             may
             stand
             with
             Christs
             Church
             in
             a
             Common-wealth
             ,
             as
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             in
             the
             three
             first
             Chapters
             of
             the
             
               Revelations
               ,
            
             which
             testifies
             that
             there
             were
             seven
             Churc●●s
             in
             
               Asia
               ,
            
             and
             these
             seven
             Churches
             were
             compared
             to
             seven
             g●●den
             Candlestickes
             ,
             
               b
            
             and
             every
             Candlesticke
             stood
             by
             it
             se●●
             ,
             and
             held
             forth
             her
             owne
             light
             ,
             as
             appeares
             by
             those
             severall
             m●●sages
             ,
             which
             were
             sent
             to
             those
             seven
             Churches
             ;
             for
             had
             they
             had
             a
             dependencie
             one
             upon
             another
             in
             respect
             of
             power
             ,
             then
             one
             message
             would
             have
             served
             unto
             them
             all
             ;
             and
             what
             sinne
             any
             of
             the
             Churches
             or
             Angels
             were
             guilty
             of
             ,
             would
             have
             been
             laid
             unto
             the
             charge
             of
             all
             the
             Churches
             and
             Angels
             ;
             but
             wee
             see
             it
             was
             otherwise
             ▪
             As
             for
             instance
             ;
             there
             was
             none
             charged
             for
             
             suffering
             the
             woman
             
               Iezebel
            
             to
             teach
             the
             people
             ;
             to
             commit
             for
             nication
             ,
             and
             to
             eate
             things
             sacrificed
             to
             Idols
             ,
             but
             the
             Angell
             of
             
               Thyatria
               ;
            
             by
             this
             you
             may
             plainely
             see
             there
             was
             not
             one
             Angell
             set
             over
             them
             all
             ,
             nor
             one
             Synod
             oppointed
             to
             judge
             and
             correct
             them
             all
             ,
             which
             is
             the
             thing
             you
             labour
             for
             .
             Yet
             it
             cannot
             be
             said
             that
             the
             Independancie
             of
             these
             seven
             Churches
             hindred
             their
             communion
             ,
             either
             with
             
               Christ
            
             their
             head
             ,
             or
             one
             with
             another
             :
             neither
             was
             it
             any
             disturbance
             to
             the
             Common-wealth
             or
             Nation
             wherein
             they
             lived
             .
          
           
             And
             here
             you
             cannot
             say
             that
             I
             have
             eyaded
             ,
             but
             have
             answered
             you
             directly
             ,
             to
             these
             your
             doubts
             ,
             and
             suppositions
             ,
             and
             to
             many
             of
             your
             ●ffs
             ,
             which
             have
             beene
             ,
             your
             spies
             sent
             out
             in
             this
             Scout
             ;
             And
             moreover
             ,
             I
             will
             answer
             all
             your
             many
             Reasons
             as
             
             I
             come
             to
             them
             (
             though
             they
             be
             joyned
             in
             battle
             with
             these
             )
             I
             meane
             your
             following
             Reasons
             against
             Toleration
             ;
             and
             also
             batter
             ,
             or
             drive
             backe
             your
             answers
             which
             you
             have
             made
             to
             the
             Six
             Reasons
             ,
             which
             you
             say
             be
             theirs
             ,
             and
             yet
             neither
             this
             Scout
             ,
             nor
             the
             joyned
             ,
             nor
             the
             subjoyned
             forces
             ,
             shall
             be
             able
             to
             discover
             what
             strength
             is
             on
             my
             side
             ,
             although
             they
             be
             formed
             by
             you
             in
             battle
             aray
             .
          
        
      
       
         
           Now
           I
           have
           proved
           the
           
             Independant
             Government
          
           to
           be
           
             Christs
             Government
             ;
          
           I
           will
           also
           prove
           in
           my
           
             Answers
          
           to
           these
           your
           following
           
             Reasons
             ,
          
           that
           the
           
             Independant
             Congregations
          
           performe
           
             Christs
          
           publike
           worship
           ,
           and
           therefore
           ought
           to
           be
           tolerated
           ,
           and
           maintained
           in
           the
           practise
           thereof
           .
        
         
           
             
               IN
               the
               beginning
               of
               your
               first
               Reason
               against
               Toleration
               ,
               you
               grant
               ,
               that
               the
               Scriptures
               speake
               m●ch
               for
               Toleration
               ,
               and
               bearing
               with
               one
               another
               in
               many
               things
               ,
               both
               in
               matters
               of
               opinion
               and
               practise
               ,
               and
               the
               Scriptures
               you
               quote
               are
               very
               pertinent
               to
               this
               purpose
               ,
               but
               alwayes
               provided
               ,
               they
               are
               to
               be
               understood
               as
               spoken
               properly
               to
               particular
               Congregations
               ,
               and
               not
               unto
               any
               whole
               Nation
               .
            
          
           
             But
             to
             stand
             for
             the
             Toleration
             of
             the
             maintenance
             of
             Heresie
             ,
             and
             Schisme
             ,
             is
             not
             the
             Toleration
             that
             we
             plead
             for
             (
             as
             farre
             as
             hath
             beene
             yet
             made
             knowne
             )
             but
             rather
             your
             insinuation
             :
             for
             I
             have
             declared
             unto
             you
             already
             in
             the
             driving
             backe
             of
             the
             first
             Scout
             of
             your
             Army
             ,
             That
             God
             hath
             provided
             a
             way
             and
             meanes
             to
             purge
             every
             Congregation
             of
             his
             from
             all
             such
             persons
             that
             doe
             offend
             ,
             whether
             it
             be
             in
             matters
             of
             Faith
             or
             Order
             .
             Neither
             doe
             any
             that
             stand
             for
             Christian
             liberty
             condemne
             them
             for
             cruelty
             ,
             or
             that
             it
             is
             against
             charitie
             .
          
           
             For
             if
             we
             compare
             the
             Church
             with
             one
             man
             or
             a
             few
             then
             it
             will
             easily
             appeare
             ,
             that
             the
             one
             doth
             out-weigh
             the
             other
             :
             
               ●nd
               you
               say
               ,
            
             Calvin
             
               saith
               ,
               It
               is
               cruell
               mercy
               which
               preferres
               one
               man
               ,
               or
               a
               few
               ,
               before
               the
               Church
               :
            
             To
             these
             words
             of
             
               Calvin
            
             I
             doe
             fully
             agree
             unto
             ,
             for
             they
             are
             of
             the
             same
             nature
             with
             my
             former
             Answers
             to
             your
             Reasons
             against
             Independancie
             ,
             where
             I
             have
             proved
             against
             you
             ,
             that
             the
             weight
             and
             power
             Ireth
             in
             the
             Church
             and
             that
             the
             Church
             is
             above
             the
             Ministers
             ,
             and
             that
             the
             Ministers
             
             have
             their
             power
             by
             the
             Church
             to
             exercise
             in
             the
             Church
             ,
             and
             not
             the
             Church
             by
             the
             Ministers
             .
          
           
             The
             next
             thing
             to
             be
             considered
             in
             this
             your
             Reason
             ,
             is
             your
             peremptory
             affirmation
             ,
             but
             grounded
             upon
             no
             Scripture
             ,
             (
             namely
             )
             
               That
               to
               set
               up
               Independant
               and
               separated
               Churches
               ,
               is
               a
               Schisme
               in
               it selfe
               ,
               and
               that
               it
               will
               make
               great
               disturbance
               in
               the
               Church
               ,
               both
               to
               the
               outward
               peace
               ,
               and
               to
               the
               faith
               and
               conscience
               of
               the
               people
               of
               the
               Kingdome
               .
            
          
           
             Now
             that
             it
             is
             a
             Schisme
             in
             it selfe
             ,
             I
             deny
             ,
             and
             prove
             the
             contrary
             thus
             ;
          
           
             God
             hath
             commanded
             all
             his
             people
             to
             separate
             themselves
             from
             all
             Idolatry
             
               c
            
             and
             false
             worshipping
             
               d
            
             and
             false
             worshippers
             
               e
            
             (
             and
             therefore
             it
             is
             no
             Schisme
             )
             except
             you
             will
             make
             God
             the
             Author
             of
             Schisme
             )
             &
             this
             is
             according
             to
             the
             Prophet
             
               Esaiahs
            
             words
             ,
             
               Esay
            
             1.
             which
             is
             the
             first
             Lesson
             that
             every
             one
             ought
             to
             learne
             ;
             even
             to
             cease
             to
             doe
             evill
             .
             But
             I
             hope
             it
             will
             not
             be
             denied
             but
             that
             they
             are
             to
             learne
             another
             lesson
             ,
             which
             is
             ,
             to
             learne
             to
             doe
             well
             :
             but
             to
             doe
             well
             is
             to
             keepe
             all
             Gods
             Commandements
             ,
             and
             to
             obey
             God
             rather
             then
             men
             .
          
           
             Now
             Gods
             commands
             to
             his
             people
             ,
             is
             ,
             that
             they
             learne
             to
             know
             the
             forme
             of
             the
             house
             (
             as
             I
             have
             told
             you
             before
             )
             and
             all
             the
             Ordinances
             of
             the
             house
             ,
             and
             to
             doe
             them
             ,
             
               Ezek.
            
             43.
             11.
             but
             the
             Ordinances
             of
             Christs
             Kingdome
             under
             the
             Gospell
             ,
             (
             amongst
             the
             rest
             )
             are
             Doctrine
             ,
             Fellowship
             ,
             breaking
             of
             Bread
             ,
             and
             Prayer
             ;
             which
             Ordinances
             the
             Saints
             continued
             stedfastly
             in
             ,
             and
             are
             commended
             for
             their
             constancie
             in
             the
             same
             ,
             
               Acts
            
             2.
             42
             and
             that
             in
             every
             particular
             Church
             or
             Congregation
             ,
             though
             there
             were
             divers
             in
             one
             Nation
             ,
             and
             yet
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             not
             affirme
             it
             was
             any
             disturbance
             to
             the
             Nation
             (
             otherwise
             th●n
             Christ
             hath
             shewed
             shall
             ever
             be
             ,
             that
             the
             seed
             of
             the
             Serpent
             ,
             shall
             persecute
             the
             seede
             of
             the
             Woman
             )
             for
             Gods
             people
             are
             said
             to
             be
             a
             peaceable
             people
             and
             the
             Lord
             himself
             hath
             said
             that
             he
             hath
             set
             them
             in
             the
             world
             as
             Lambs
             among
             Wolves
             .
             Now
             there
             must
             needs
             be
             a
             disagreement
             betweene
             Lambes
             and
             Wolves
             but
             the
             Lambes
             are
             not
             the
             cause
             thereof
             .
             By
             this
             you
             may
             see
             that
             Separation
             is
             not
             a
             Scisme
             ,
             but
             obedience
             to
             Gods
             Commandement
             .
          
           
             And
             for
             any
             Magistrate
             to
             give
             way
             for
             men
             to
             separate
             ,
             from
             the
             worship
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             established
             by
             Law
             (
             if
             that
             worship
             be
             not
             according
             to
             Gods
             Law
             )
             is
             the
             Magistrates
             duty
             ;
             and
             the
             Magistrate
             shall
             partake
             of
             no
             sinne
             in
             so
             doing
             because
             there
             is
             no
             sinne
             committed
             .
             Therefore
             the
             Magistrate
             ought
             not
             to
             forbid
             the
             practise
             of
             Gods
             Worship
             ;
             when
             hee
             
             hath
             power
             to
             command
             it
             ;
             for
             he
             is
             set
             up
             for
             the
             practise
             of
             those
             that
             doe
             well
             ,
             and
             for
             the
             punishment
             of
             evill
             ●oers
             .
          
           
             
               And
               therefore
               you
               did
               well
               ,
               when
               you
               admonished
               the
               Parliament
               in
               your
               Epistle
               ,
               to
               cast
               out
               of
               the
               way
               all
               stambling
               blockes
               ,
               and
               to
               breake
            
             
             
               downe
               all
               Images
               ,
               and
               Crucifixes
               ;
               and
               to
               throw
               downe
               all
               〈◊〉
               ,
               and
               remove
               the
               High
               places
               ;
               and
               to
               breake
               to
               pieces
               the
               brazen
               Serpents
               which
               have
               beene
               so
               abused
               to
               Idolatry
               and
               Superstition
               .
            
             So
             then
             you
             grant
             ,
             that
             much
             may
             be
             done
             (
             as
             it
             seemeth
             by
             your
             speech
             )
             and
             yet
             if
             there
             be
             not
             a
             full
             reformation
             ,
             even
             to
             the
             throwing
             downe
             of
             the
             High
             places
             ,
             it
             will
             prove
             a
             blemish
             to
             the
             reformers
             .
          
           
             
               You
               say
               ,
               he
               that
               doth
               not
               forbid
               ,
               when
               he
               hath
               power
               ,
               he
               commands
               .
            
             
          
           
             But
             I
             hope
             you
             doubt
             not
             but
             the
             Parliament
             hath
             power
             ,
             and
             therefore
             whatsoever
             they
             doe
             not
             forbid
             (
             by
             your
             owne
             ground
             )
             they
             have
             or
             doe
             command
             .
          
           
             But
             in
             the
             Protestation
             ,
             they
             have
             not
             forbidden
             Gods
             Worship
             ,
             which
             is
             according
             to
             his
             Word
             ;
             but
             they
             have
             Protested
             (
             and
             have
             injoyned
             others
             so
             to
             doe
             )
             to
             maintaine
             and
             ●●●end
             the
             Protestant
             Religion
             ,
             expressed
             in
             the
             Doctrine
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             against
             all
             Popery
             ,
             and
             Popish
             Innovations
             ,
             within
             this
             Realme
             &c.
             
             And
             in
             the
             Interpretation
             of
             their
             meaning
             of
             the
             said
             Oath
             ,
             they
             binde
             us
             neither
             to
             the
             ●●t
             forme
             of
             Worship
             ,
             Discipline
             ,
             or
             Government
             ,
             nor
             any
             Rites
             or
             Ceremonies
             of
             the
             said
             Church
             of
             England
             .
          
           
             Now
             if
             we
             must
             withstand
             Popery
             ,
             and
             Popish
             Innovations
             ,
             then
             we
             must
             needs
             withstand
             such
             dependencie
             as
             makes
             up
             a
             whole
             Nation
             a
             Church
             both
             good
             and
             bad
             ,
             without
             separating
             the
             precious
             from
             the
             vile
             ,
             and
             also
             such
             Synods
             or
             Counsels
             that
             decree
             ,
             and
             make
             Lawes
             ,
             and
             impose
             them
             upon
             any
             Church
             to
             keepe
             ,
             having
             not
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             to
             warrant
             them
             ;
             for
             these
             are
             Popish
             Innovations
             ,
             and
             to
             be
             withstood
             by
             us
             ,
             according
             to
             our
             Oath
             .
          
           
             And
             truely
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
               ,
            
             you
             might
             have
             asked
             the
             independant
             Ministers
             a
             question
             in
             private
             ,
             (
             for
             you
             knew
             where
             to
             finde
             them
             )
             and
             not
             have
             propounded
             so
             silly
             a
             question
             before
             the
             Parliament
             ,
             when
             there
             was
             none
             there
             to
             answer
             you
             .
          
           
             Your
             Question
             is
             ,
             
               Whether
               it
               be
               fitting
               ,
               that
               well
               meaning
               Christians
            
             
             
               should
               be
               suffered
               to
               goe
               to
               make
               Churches
               ?
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             Answer
             ,
             It
             is
             fitter
             for
             well
             meaning
             Christians
             than
             for
             ill-meaning
             Christians
             ,
             for
             well-meaning
             Christians
             be
             the
             fittest
             on
             the
             earth
             to
             make
             Churches
             ,
             and
             to
             choose
             their
             Officers
             ;
             whether
             they
             be
             Taylors
             ,
             Felt-makers
             ,
             Button-makers
             ,
             Tent-makers
             ,
             Shepherds
             ,
             or
             Ploughmen
             ,
             or
             what
             honest
             
             Trade
             soever
             ,
             if
             they
             are
             well-meaning
             Christians
             ;
             but
             ill-meaning
             Priests
             are
             very
             unfit
             men
             to
             make
             Churches
             ;
             because
             what
             they
             build
             up
             with
             one
             hand
             ,
             they
             pull
             downe
             with
             the
             other
             .
          
           
             
               Futuher
               you
               seeme
               to
               feare
               the
               s●reading
               of
               Heresies
               ,
               if
               there
               be
               not
               a
               bi●drance
               of
               these
               Assemblies
               .
            
          
           
             But
             you
             should
             rather
             feare
             that
             your
             owne
             glory
             would
             be
             eclipsed
             by
             their
             gifts
             and
             graces
             ;
             for
             they
             are
             not
             men
             of
             so
             meane
             parts
             ,
             as
             you
             would
             make
             them
             :
             but
             are
             able
             to
             divide
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             aright
             by
             the
             spirit
             that
             God
             hath
             given
             them
             .
             Therefore
             I
             would
             wish
             you
             rather
             to
             let
             your
             heart
             bleed
             for
             your selfe
             and
             for
             the
             evills
             that
             you
             have
             done
             .
             For
             Christ
             will
             never
             suffer
             any
             to
             perish
             for
             whom
             he
             died
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             first
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               second
               Reason
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               Toleration
               desired
               will
               not
               helpe
               to
               beale
               the
               Schismes
               and
               Rents
               of
               your
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             if
             your
             Church
             be
             not
             the
             Church
             of
             Christ
             ,
             it
             will
             not
             heale
             it
             indeede
             ,
             for
             though
             the
             Prophets
             would
             have
             healed
             Babel
             ,
             it
             could
             not
             be
             healed
             .
          
           
             
               You
               say
               that
               Ministers
               and
               people
               will
               not
               submit
               to
               the
               Reformation
               and
               Government
               setled
               by
               Law
               .
            
          
           
             It
             is
             very
             like
             so
             ,
             if
             it
             be
             not
             free
             from
             Innovations
             of
             Popery
             ,
             because
             they
             are
             sworne
             to
             the
             contrary
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               many
               doubts
               will
               arise
               in
               the
               peoples
               mindes
               ,
               that
               the
               Government
               of
               your
               Church
               is
               not
               ordered
               according
               to
               the
               Word
               of
               God
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ;
             If
             you
             meane
             the
             Church
             of
             Englands
             Government
             ,
             established
             by
             the
             Canon
             Law
             .
             I
             thinke
             it
             is
             out
             of
             doubt
             with
             the
             most
             ,
             for
             they
             that
             understand
             but
             little
             ,
             doe
             see
             and
             know
             that
             that
             Government
             is
             vaine
             and
             Popish
             ;
             and
             that
             is
             the
             reason
             (
             as
             I
             conceive
             )
             why
             so
             many
             refuse
             to
             conforme
             to
             it
             :
             and
             if
             you
             feare
             that
             that
             will
             prove
             so
             great
             a
             division
             ,
             you
             may
             doe
             well
             to
             counsell
             the
             Magistrates
             ,
             to
             expell
             all
             such
             Government
             ,
             and
             to
             reject
             all
             such
             Synods
             and
             Counsells
             ,
             and
             to
             labour
             to
             understand
             the
             minde
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             to
             set
             up
             his
             Government
             over
             Beleevers
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             of
             England
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               many
               of
               the
               people
               who
               yet
               be
               not
               in
               this
               Church
               way
               ,
               are
               possessed
               with
               these
               principles
               (
               of
               the
               Independant
               way
               )
               and
               much
               looking
               towards
               it
               :
            
          
           
             I
             say
             it
             is
             pitty
             they
             should
             any
             longer
             be
             led
             about
             by
             the
             way
             of
             the
             Wildernesse
             .
          
           
             2.
             
             
               You
               doe
               affirme
               ,
               that
               the
               mindes
               of
               multitudes
               of
               Professors
               in
            
             
             
               England
               ,
               and
               especially
               in
               the
               City
               of
               London
               ,
               are
               upon
               all
               occasions
               ,
               very
               apt
               to
               fall
               to
               any
               way
               in
               Doctrine
               or
               discipline
               ,
               that
               is
               not
               commonly
               received
               by
               the
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             Indeede
             the
             Proverbe
             is
             verified
             upon
             them
             .
             
               The
               burned
               child
               dreads
               the
               fire
               ;
            
             for
             they
             have
             beene
             so
             long
             deceived
             by
             your
             false
             glosses
             ,
             that
             now
             their
             eyes
             being
             a
             little
             open
             ,
             the
             light
             appeareth
             very
             sweete
             unto
             them
             ;
             yea
             ,
             although
             they
             see
             men
             but
             like
             trees
             ,
             as
             the
             blinde
             man
             ,
             when
             his
             eyes
             began
             to
             be
             opened
             ,
             who
             had
             beene
             blinde
             from
             his
             birth
             .
          
           
             
               The
               third
               thing
               which
               you
               have
               laid
               downe
               in
               this
               Reason
               ,
               is
               ;
               That
               the
               Ministers
               will
               not
               be
               tied
               ,
               from
               preaching
               those
               points
               in
               publike
               ,
               nor
               from
               speaking
               of
               them
               in
               private
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             hope
             they
             will
             not
             indeed
             ,
             for
             it
             were
             their
             great
             sinne
             ,
             if
             they
             should
             not
             declare
             Gods
             whole
             Councell
             ,
             so
             farre
             as
             he
             hath
             revealed
             it
             unto
             them
             .
          
           
             
               But
               if
               they
               would
               (
               you
               say
               )
               the
               people
               both
               men
               and
               women
               ,
               are
               s●
               strangely
               bold
               and
               pragmaticall
               ,
               and
               so
               highly
               conceited
               of
               their
               way
               as
               the
               Kingdome
               of
               Christ
               and
               the
               onely
               way
               of
               Christ
               ,
               that
               out
               of
               those
               principles
               ,
               they
               would
               be
               drawing
               many
               of
               their
               friendship
               and
               kindred
               ;
               and
               many
               would
               (
               say
               you
               )
               come
               unto
               them
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             this
             (
             I
             hope
             )
             you
             count
             a
             vertue
             ,
             for
             it
             is
             the
             property
             of
             the
             Sheepe
             when
             they
             fare
             well
             ,
             to
             call
             their
             fellowes
             ▪
             But
             Hogges
             will
             not
             doe
             so
             .
          
           
             
               The
               fourth
               thing
               to
               be
               minded
               is
               (
               that
               you
               say
               )
               Liberty
               ,
               the
               power
               of
               government
               ,
               and
               rule
               ,
               to
               be
               in
               the
               people
               ,
               are
               mighty
               pleasing
               to
               flesh
               and
               blood
               ,
               especially
               in
               meane
               persons
               ,
               and
               such
               as
               have
               beene
               kept
               under
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             they
             that
             have
             beene
             kept
             under
             ,
             have
             beene
             kept
             under
             by
             the
             tyranny
             of
             the
             Man
             of
             Sinne
             ;
             This
             you
             confesse
             to
             be
             especially
             the
             poore
             ,
             upon
             whom
             those
             Taskemasters
             have
             laid
             the
             greatest
             burthens
             .
             Therefore
             for
             them
             to
             affect
             liberty
             is
             no
             wonder
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               say
               they
               would
               have
               the
               power
               and
               Rule
               :
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             It
             is
             not
             any
             power
             or
             Rule
             which
             is
             pleasing
             to
             the
             flesh
             (
             as
             you
             speake
             ,
             thinking
             them
             to
             be
             like
             those
             Priests
             ,
             
               Whose
               god
               is
               their
               belly
               ,
               whose
               glory
               is
               their
               shame
               ,
               who
               minde
               earthly
               things
            
             )
             but
             it
             is
             the
             power
             of
             Christ
             which
             they
             stand
             for
             ,
             as
             they
             are
             members
             of
             the
             Churches
             of
             Christ
             ;
             to
             which
             Churches
             Christ
             the
             King
             thereof
             hath
             given
             all
             power
             in
             spirituall
             things
             .
          
           
             And
             that
             the
             Church
             of
             Christ
             consisteth
             of
             meane
             persons
             ,
             is
             no
             wonder
             ;
             for
             wee
             have
             learned
             ,
             that
             the
             poore
             receive
             the
             Gospell
             ,
             and
             you
             know
             you
             have
             granted
             ,
             that
             it
             stands
             with
             the
             light
             and
             Law
             of
             Nature
             ,
             That
             the
             liberty
             ,
             power
             ,
             and
             rule
             ,
             
             should
             be
             in
             the
             whole
             ,
             and
             not
             in
             one
             man
             or
             a
             few
             ;
             so
             that
             the
             power
             must
             rest
             in
             the
             body
             ▪
             and
             not
             in
             the
             Officers
             ,
             though
             the
             Church
             be
             never
             so
             poore
             .
          
           
             
               Now
               the
               fifth
               thing
               you
               minde
               in
               this
               Reason
               is
               ,
               That
               Tolleration
               will
               be
               made
               use
               of
               to
               strengthen
               their
               way
               .
            
          
           
             
               And
               you
               also
               conclude
               ,
               it
               will
               be
               granted
               ,
               that
               the
               ablest
               Ministers
               could
               not
               answer
               them
               ,
               and
               therefore
               were
               content
               they
               should
               have
               a
               Tolleration
               .
            
          
           
             You
             doe
             very
             well
             to
             feare
             the
             worst
             ,
             but
             you
             had
             done
             better
             if
             you
             had
             armed
             your selfe
             against
             them
             ,
             and
             answered
             the
             Scriptures
             ,
             they
             bring
             by
             Scripture
             :
             But
             it
             is
             a
             plaine
             case
             ,
             you
             could
             not
             do
             that
             ,
             &
             therfore
             your
             feare
             was
             just
             ;
             but
             if
             you
             were
             a
             wellminded
             man
             ,
             or
             a
             wellmeaning
             Christian
             man
             ,
             you
             should
             not
             have
             feared
             the
             comming
             of
             the
             truth
             to
             light
             ,
             nor
             have
             been
             afraid
             of
             reformation
             ,
             because
             it
             would
             worke
             to
             your
             greater
             divisions
             ,
             and
             rents
             ,
             for
             Christ
             came
             not
             to
             set
             peace
             upon
             the
             earth
             ,
             (
             as
             I
             have
             told
             you
             before
             )
             but
             the
             seede
             of
             the
             Serpent
             will
             be
             ever
             playing
             his
             part
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             second
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               third
               Reason
               you
               affirme
               ,
               That
               Tolleration
               will
               breed
               divisions
               ,
               and
               Schismes
               ,
               disturbing
               the
               peace
               and
               quiet
               of
               Churches
               ,
               and
               Townes
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             have
             told
             you
             already
             ,
             we
             plead
             for
             no
             tolleration
             that
             shall
             disturbe
             the
             peace
             of
             Churches
             or
             Townes
             .
          
           
             
               Moreover
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               it
               will
               not
               onely
               doe
               so
               ,
               but
               it
               will
               also
               breed
               divisions
               in
               families
               betweene
               husband
               and
               wife
               ,
               brother
               ,
               and
               brother
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             There
             was
             a
             division
             in
             the
             first
             Family
             that
             ever
             was
             ,
             and
             brother
             rose
             up
             against
             brother
             ▪
             but
             Tolleration
             was
             not
             the
             cause
             of
             it
             ;
             but
             the
             malice
             of
             Sathan
             in
             the
             seed
             of
             the
             Serpent
             ,
             as
             it
             hath
             beene
             ,
             and
             is
             now
             at
             this
             day
             .
          
           
             And
             this
             is
             according
             to
             
               Christs
            
             words
             ,
             
               Luke
            
             12.
             52
             ,
             53.
             which
             saith
             ,
             
               That
               there
               shall
               be
               five
               in
               one
               house
               ,
               two
               against
               three
               ,
               and
               three
               against
               two
               ,
               &c.
            
             and
             in
             
               Matth.
            
             10.
             34
             ,
             35
             ,
             36.
             
             
               Thinke
               not
            
             (
             saith
             he
             )
             
               that
               I
               come
               to
               send
               peace
               into
               the
               earth
               ,
               I
               came
               not
               to
               send
               peace
               ,
               but
               the
               sword
               :
               For
               I
               am
               come
               to
               set
               a
               man
               at
               variance
               against
               his
               father
               ,
               and
               the
               daughter
               against
               her
               mother
               ,
               and
               the
               daughter
               in
               Law
               against
               her
               mother
               in
               Law
               ,
               and
               a
               mans
               enemies
               shall
               be
               they
               of
               his
               owne
               household
               ;
            
             and
             moreover
             ,
             in
             
               Luke
            
             21.
             16.
             our
             Saviour
             doth
             declare
             ,
             
               that
               we
               shall
               be
               betrayed
               ,
               both
               by
               parents
               ,
               and
               brethren
               ,
               and
               kinssolkes
               ,
               and
               friends
               .
            
             
             Now
             if
             Christ
             may
             be
             said
             to
             be
             the
             Author
             of
             evill
             ,
             then
             you
             may
             say
             that
             Toleration
             of
             true
             Religion
             is
             the
             cause
             of
             this
             division
             .
          
           
             Againe
             you
             say
             ,
             
               (
               O
               how
               )
               this
               will
               occasion
               disobedience
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             your
             Lamentation
             I
             answer
             .
             O
             that
             you
             would
             remember
             the
             rule
             
               *
            
             that
             every
             servant
             ought
             to
             count
             his
             Master
             worthy
             of
             all
             honour
             ;
             and
             in
             the
             judgement
             of
             charitie
             beleeve
             ,
             that
             persons
             professing
             the
             Gospel
             will
             learne
             that
             lesson
             .
          
           
             
               Next
               you
               say
               O!
               how
               will
               this
               take
               away
               that
               power
               &
               authority
               which
               God
               hath
               given
               to
               Husbands
               ,
               Fathers
               ,
               and
               Masters
               ,
               over
               wives
               ,
               children
               ,
               and
               servants
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             O!
             that
             you
             would
             consider
             the
             text
             in
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             7.
             which
             plainly
             declares
             that
             the
             wife
             may
             be
             a
             beleever
             ,
             &
             the
             husband
             an
             unbeleever
             ▪
             but
             if
             you
             have
             considered
             this
             text
             ,
             I
             pray
             you
             tell
             me
             ,
             what
             authority
             this
             unbeleeving
             husband
             hath
             over
             the
             conscience
             of
             his
             beleeving
             wife
             ;
             It
             is
             true
             he
             hath
             authority
             over
             her
             in
             bodily
             and
             civill
             respects
             ,
             but
             not
             to
             be
             a
             Lord
             over
             her
             conscience
             ;
             and
             the
             like
             may
             be
             said
             of
             fathers
             and
             masters
             ,
             and
             it
             is
             the
             very
             same
             authority
             which
             the
             Soveraigne
             hath
             over
             all
             his
             subjects
             ,
             &
             therfore
             it
             must
             needes
             reach
             to
             families
             :
             for
             it
             is
             granted
             that
             the
             King
             hath
             power
             (
             according
             to
             the
             Law
             )
             over
             the
             bodies
             ,
             goods
             ,
             and
             lives
             of
             all
             his
             subjects
             ;
             yet
             it
             is
             Christ
             the
             King
             of
             Kings
             that
             reigneth
             over
             their
             consciences
             :
             and
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             it
             taketh
             away
             no
             authority
             which
             God
             hath
             given
             to
             them
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               say
               is
               ,
               that
               they
               cannot
               be
               certaine
               ,
               that
               their
               servants
               and
               children
               sanctifie
               the
               Lords
               day
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             indeede
             unbeleeving
             Masters
             take
             as
             little
             care
             of
             this
             ▪
             as
             they
             that
             have
             given
             liberty
             to
             prophane
             the
             Lords
             Day
             ;
             but
             beleeving
             Parents
             and
             Masters
             ,
             may
             easily
             know
             (
             if
             their
             children
             or
             servants
             be
             of
             any
             Congregation
             )
             what
             their
             life
             and
             conversation
             is
             ,
             and
             therefore
             this
             can
             hinder
             no
             duties
             ,
             or
             workes
             of
             Families
             (
             as
             you
             falsely
             affirme
             )
             nor
             crosse
             the
             good
             and
             peace
             of
             Familes
             .
          
           
             By
             this
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             that
             this
             your
             groundlesse
             affirmation
             ,
             is
             no
             good
             Reason
             against
             Toleration
             .
          
           
             And
             therefore
             the
             Court
             of
             Parliament
             (
             to
             whom
             you
             submit
             for
             judgement
             )
             may
             easily
             see
             that
             good
             members
             both
             for
             Churches
             and
             Common-wealths
             ,
             may
             issue
             out
             of
             such
             Families
             ,
             that
             live
             under
             Christs
             government
             ,
             and
             that
             such
             Families
             may
             be
             good
             Nurseries
             ,
             both
             for
             Church
             and
             Common-wealth
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             third
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               fourth
               Reason
               you
               doe
               affirme
               ,
               that
               there
               will
               be
               great
               danger
               of
               disputes
               amongst
               you
               about
               Government
               and
               Worship
               ,
               and
               Doctrine
               ,
               and
               practises
               (
               in
               the
               Conclusion
               )
               you
               say
               ,
               it
               will
               be
               about
               a
               question
               where
               Saints
               goe
               when
               they
               die
               ,
               whether
               to
               heaven
               or
               a
               third
               place
               .
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             This
             is
             a
             question
             I
             never
             heard
             amongst
             the
             Separates
             ,
             (
             or
             any
             of
             those
             whom
             you
             call
             Independant
             men
             )
             ,
             but
             amongst
             the
             Papists
             of
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             and
             
               England
               .
            
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               is
               ,
               about
               sitting
               with
               hats
               on
               to
               breake
               bread
               ?
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             this
             may
             be
             a
             question
             indeed
             ,
             but
             not
             to
             breede
             division
             ;
             for
             it
             may
             be
             as
             lawfull
             for
             one
             man
             to
             sit
             covered
             &
             another
             uncovered
             ,
             as
             it
             may
             be
             lawfull
             for
             one
             man
             to
             receive
             it
             sitting
             ,
             and
             another
             lying
             in
             bed
             .
             But
             if
             any
             man
             list
             to
             be
             contentious
             ,
             the
             Churches
             of
             God
             have
             no
             such
             custome
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             Fourth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               fifth
               Reason
               you
               affirme
               ,
               that
               the
               Ministers
               of
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               can
               have
               little
               assurance
               ,
               of
               the
               continuance
               of
               their
               flockes
               to
               them
               ,
               if
               such
               a
               toleration
               be
               granted
               ,
               but
               that
               the
               tolerated
               Churches
               will
               admit
               them
               into
               fellowship
               ,
               and
               increase
               Churches
               out
               of
               their
               labours
               :
               and
               that
               they
               should
               doe
               little
               else
               but
               spend
               and
               be
               spent
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             if
             you
             were
             the
             Ministers
             of
             Christ
             ,
             as
             you
             would
             be
             taken
             to
             be
             ,
             it
             might
             be
             your
             comfort
             ,
             joy
             ,
             and
             glory
             ,
             for
             it
             was
             the
             Apostles
             worke
             to
             gather
             the
             Saints
             ,
             and
             to
             travell
             in
             birth
             of
             children
             ;
             and
             they
             did
             not
             grudge
             that
             they
             were
             added
             unto
             the
             Churches
             of
             Christ
             ,
             but
             tooke
             care
             for
             them
             being
             so
             added
             ,
             for
             the
             care
             of
             all
             Churches
             lay
             upon
             them
             ,
             and
             therefore
             they
             were
             as
             Fathers
             ,
             and
             Nurses
             ,
             unto
             them
             ;
             and
             the
             Gospell
             admits
             of
             no
             such
             theft
             as
             to
             steale
             away
             members
             from
             other
             Churches
             :
             but
             if
             men
             draw
             neere
             to
             the
             truth
             (
             which
             never
             ▪
             were
             members
             of
             any
             Church
             )
             and
             offer
             themselves
             to
             joyne
             unto
             us
             ;
             we
             may
             admit
             them
             upon
             good
             experience
             of
             their
             life
             and
             conversation
             ,
             for
             those
             members
             that
             travelled
             from
             one
             Church
             to
             another
             ,
             were
             commended
             unto
             those
             Churches
             by
             Letters
             from
             the
             Church
             where
             they
             were
             members
             ,
             or
             else
             they
             could
             not
             have
             beene
             admitted
             :
             and
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             the
             way
             of
             the
             Gospell
             admits
             of
             no
             such
             disorder
             .
          
           
             
               Now
               whereas
               you
               say
               ▪
               that
               this
               Toleration
               upon
               any
               light
               occasion
               of
               demanding
               dues
               ;
               or
               preaching
               against
               any
               thing
               they
               like
               not
               ,
               opens
               a
               wide
               doore
               ,
               and
               will
               invite
               them
               to
               disert
               their
               Ministers
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             by
             demanding
             of
             that
             which
             you
             call
             dues
             ;
             you
             may
             indeede
             give
             just
             occasion
             ,
             for
             you
             may
             demand
             for
             due
             ,
             that
             which
             is
             not
             due
             ;
             as
             all
             the
             Priests
             of
             
               England
            
             doe
             .
             Likewise
             
             by
             preaching
             of
             Doctrine
             ,
             you
             may
             give
             just
             occasion
             ▪
             if
             you
             justifie
             the
             wicked
             ,
             and
             condemne
             the
             just
             ,
             and
             make
             sad
             the
             hearts
             of
             those
             whom
             God
             would
             not
             have
             made
             sad
             ;
             and
             then
             if
             your
             people
             flye
             from
             you
             ,
             you
             may
             thanke
             your selves
             ;
             but
             concerning
             what
             you
             count
             to
             be
             your
             due
             ,
             I
             will
             declare
             hereafter
             .
             
               *
            
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             fifth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               NOw
               in
               the
               beginning
               of
               your
               sixth
               Reason
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               liberty
               will
               be
               an
               undoubted
               meanes
               and
               way
               of
               their
               infinite
               multiplication
               and
               increase
               ,
               even
               to
               thirty
               fould
               .
            
          
           
             Truely
             I
             thinke
             you
             are
             afraid
             ,
             as
             
               Pharaoh
            
             was
             ,
             least
             the
             Lords
             ▪
             people
             should
             grow
             mightier
             then
             you
             .
          
           
             
               Next
               you
               say
               ,
               if
               the
               Parliament
               could
               like
               to
               have
               more
               of
               the
               breede
               of
               them
               ,
               and
               have
               a
               delight
               to
               have
               multitudes
               exempted
               from
               the
               Ecclesiasticall
               Lawes
               of
               the
               Land
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             it
             is
             no
             disgrace
             to
             the
             Parliament
             ,
             if
             they
             should
             so
             delight
             ▪
             though
             never
             Parliament
             before
             had
             done
             the
             like
             .
          
           
             
               Moreover
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               have
               increased
               within
               this
               nine
               moneths
               ,
               without
               a
               toleration
               ,
               therefore
               (
               you
               conclude
               )
               they
               would
               multiply
               much
               ,
               if
               they
               had
               a
               toleration
               ,
               in
               many
               ,
               if
               not
               in
               most
               Townes
               and
               Parishes
               ;
               and
               ●ou
               say
               it
               cannot
               be
               helped
               .
            
          
           
             All
             this
             I
             grant
             may
             be
             ;
             although
             they
             have
             not
             a
             Toleration
             ,
             I
             thinke
             they
             will
             increase
             ;
             for
             the
             Taskemasters
             can
             lay
             no
             heavier
             burthens
             upon
             them
             ,
             then
             they
             have
             laid
             already
             :
             but
             though
             they
             should
             increase
             ,
             it
             will
             not
             be
             unprofitable
             ,
             for
             the
             increase
             of
             beleevers
             will
             be
             the
             strength
             and
             ▪
             glory
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ;
             for
             they
             will
             in
             all
             lawfull
             things
             ,
             be
             subject
             to
             the
             Kings
             Majestie
             their
             ▪
             dread
             Soveraigne
             ,
             and
             to
             all
             the
             wholesome
             Lawes
             of
             his
             Land
             ,
             and
             therefore
             it
             will
             be
             no
             danger
             to
             have
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             swarmes
             of
             them
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             Sixth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               7th
               .
               Reason
               you
               affirme
               ,
               that
               it
               will
               be
               very
               pre●udiciall
               dangerous
            
             
             
               and
               insufferable
               to
               this
               Kingdome
               ,
               for
               Saints
               two
               ,
               or
               three
               ,
               or
               more
               ,
               to
               gather
               ▪
               and
               combine
               themselves
               in
               Church
               Fellowship
               ,
               having
               one
               ●●
               power
               from
               Christ
               their
               immediate
               heade
               :
               without
               expecting
               warrant
               from
               any
               Governors
               .
            
          
           
             
               First
               ▪
               whereas
               you
               say
               it
               will
               be
               prejudiciall
               :
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             It
             can
             prejudice
             none
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             ,
             except
             it
             be
             the
             Priests
             ,
             and
             it
             will
             be
             but
             of
             a
             little
             tithes
             ,
             which
             they
             dare
             not
             in
             conscience
             pay
             ,
             because
             those
             Iewish
             Ceremonies
             are
             
             ceased
             ▪
             and
             if
             they
             have
             not
             Toleration
             ,
             that
             will
             be
             all
             one
             (
             in
             that
             respect
             ▪
             )
             for
             they
             will
             rather
             suffer
             ,
             then
             doe
             any
             thing
             against
             conscience
             .
          
           
             
               Now
               whereas
               you
               say
               it
               will
               be
               dangerous
               ,
               and
               insufferable
               to
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
            
             both
             these
             I
             deny
             ;
             for
             if
             they
             were
             offensive
             people
             ,
             two
             or
             three
             or
             a
             few
             could
             doe
             but
             little
             hurt
             .
             But
             they
             have
             beene
             proved
             to
             be
             a
             peaceable
             people
             and
             the
             suffering
             of
             such
             hath
             never
             beene
             dangerous
             to
             any
             Nation
             ▪
             but
             the
             not
             suffering
             of
             such
             to
             live
             quietly
             in
             a
             Land
             ,
             or
             to
             passe
             quietly
             thorow
             a
             land
             ,
             hath
             brought
             Judgements
             upon
             such
             Lands
             .
          
           
             
               Now
               whereas
               you
               seeme
               to
               imply
               ,
               that
               they
               should
               aske
               leave
               of
               the
               Magistrate
               ,
               to
               gather
               and
               combine
               themselves
               into
               visible
               Churches
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             doe
             not
             reade
             that
             any
             ever
             asked
             leave
             of
             the
             Magistrate
             for
             such
             a
             thing
             ;
             nor
             to
             performe
             any
             of
             the
             parts
             of
             Gods
             Worship
             or
             Discipline
             :
             and
             yet
             you
             confesse
             that
             these
             independant
             men
             doe
             petition
             ,
             to
             the
             Parliament
             for
             liberty
             .
             
               *
            
             Now
             I
             pray
             you
             Master
             
               Edw●rds
               ,
            
             would
             you
             have
             Magistrates
             ,
             and
             Kings
             ,
             and
             Princes
             to
             have
             more
             power
             over
             their
             subjects
             then
             over
             their
             bodies
             ,
             estates
             ,
             and
             lives
             ?
             would
             you
             have
             them
             be
             Lords
             over
             their
             consciences
             ?
             I
             pray
             you
             where
             must
             Christ
             reigne
             then
             ?
             Must
             he
             sit
             at
             the
             Magistrats
             footestoole
             ?
             and
             take
             what
             power
             the
             Magistrate
             will
             give
             him
             ?
             (
             I
             meane
             spirituall
             power
             of
             gathering
             and
             making
             Churches
             )
             and
             such
             Lawes
             as
             the
             Magistrate
             will
             give
             him
             leave
             to
             have
             ,
             to
             rule
             over
             them
             by
             ?
             Here
             you
             thrust
             Christ
             into
             a
             narrow
             corner
             ;
             for
             you
             would
             faine
             force
             him
             to
             give
             his
             glory
             to
             some
             other
             ,
             and
             his
             praise
             to
             some
             graven
             Image
             ,
             of
             your
             owne
             devising
             ,
             which
             he
             hath
             said
             he
             will
             not
             doe
             .
             
               *
            
          
           
             But
             methinkes
             it
             were
             fitter
             for
             men
             of
             ●our
             coate
             ,
             to
             ground
             the
             Government
             of
             Christs
             Church
             ,
             upon
             〈◊〉
             written
             Word
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             not
             upon
             Statute
             Lawes
             ,
             nor
             Canon
             Lawes
             ,
             which
             you
             call
             Ecclesiasticall
             ;
             for
             it
             will
             be
             no
             disparagement
             to
             the
             Imperiall
             Crowne
             of
             this
             Realme
             ,
             for
             Christs
             Church
             to
             be
             governed
             by
             Christs
             owne
             Lawes
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               is
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               Oath
               of
               Supremacie
               was
               appointed
               by
            
             
             
               Law
               for
               Ecclesiasticall
               persons
               to
               take
               .
            
          
           
             Me
             thinkes
             that
             was
             a
             good
             consideration
             ,
             for
             Ecclesiasticall
             persons
             have
             beene
             in
             all
             ages
             ready
             to
             tyrannize
             ,
             over
             Kings
             and
             Emperours
             .
          
           
             But
             now
             you
             aske
             the
             independant
             men
             (
             as
             you
             call
             them
             )
             a
             question
             ;
             but
             before
             you
             come
             to
             the
             question
             ,
             you
             lay
             downe
             an
             affirmation
             or
             a
             conclusion
             ;
             (
             namely
             )
             
               That
               these
               independant
               men
               give
               power
               to
               the
               Churches
               .
            
          
           
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ;
             If
             they
             should
             doe
             so
             ,
             they
             were
             very
             ignorant
             ,
             and
             very
             presumptuous
             ,
             for
             Christ
             hath
             given
             power
             to
             the
             Churches
             ,
             and
             all
             the
             Ministers
             that
             doe
             administer
             in
             the
             Churches
             ,
             must
             have
             the
             power
             by
             the
             Church
             .
          
           
             
               But
               say
               you
               ,
               they
               give
               that
               power
               to
               the
               Churches
               ,
               which
               the
               Papists
               give
               unto
               the
               Pope
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             they
             doe
             so
             they
             are
             blasphemers
             for
             the
             Papists
             acknowledge
             the
             Pope
             to
             be
             the
             head
             of
             the
             Church
             :
             which
             title
             all
             men
             ought
             to
             give
             onely
             unto
             Christ
             .
          
           
             
               But
               now
               to
               your
               question
               ;
               which
               is
               ,
               whether
               they
               will
               take
               the
               Oath
               of
               Supremacie
               ,
               or
               doe
               acknowledge
               in
               their
               prayers
               ,
            
             The
             King
             Defender
             of
             the
             Faith
             ?
             
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             This
             Ooth
             you
             say
             ,
             was
             ordained
             for
             Ecclesiasticall
             persons
             ▪
             and
             I
             hope
             these
             Ecclesiasticall
             independant
             men
             (
             if
             I
             may
             safely
             so
             call
             them
             )
             will
             ever
             ,
             both
             acknowledge
             ,
             and
             maintaine
             ,
             that
             the
             King
             is
             supreme
             over
             all
             the
             Land
             ▪
             therefore
             over
             the
             Church
             of
             the
             Land
             ,
             though
             it
             consist
             of
             the
             Clergie
             ,
             as
             it
             appeares
             by
             that
             Oath
             which
             you
             say
             was
             appointed
             for
             the
             Clergie
             ▪
          
           
             
               But
               whether
               they
               doe
               acknowledge
               the
               King
               ,
               defender
               of
               the
               Faith
               ,
            
             &c.
             
               which
               is
               the
               later
               part
               of
               your
               Question
               ?
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             .
             It
             is
             out
             of
             all
             doubt
             ,
             that
             these
             men
             doe
             desire
             from
             their
             heart
             ,
             (
             as
             well
             as
             all
             the
             Lords
             people
             )
             that
             the
             King
             may
             defend
             the
             Faith
             of
             Christ
             Jesus
             ,
             and
             dayly
             make
             their
             prayers
             and
             supplications
             to
             God
             for
             him
             ,
             and
             that
             in
             conscience
             ,
             and
             obedience
             to
             God
             ,
             being
             commanded
             in
             his
             Word
             so
             to
             doe
             ▪
             for
             they
             know
             it
             is
             a
             duty
             laid
             upon
             them
             ;
             for
             prayers
             and
             supplications
             must
             be
             made
             for
             Kings
             ,
             and
             all
             them
             that
             be
             in
             authoritie
             ;
             
               b
            
             but
             〈◊〉
             can
             make
             axceptable
             prayers
             ,
             but
             the
             Saints
             ,
             
               for
               the
               prayers
               of
               the
               wicked
               are
               abomination
               unto
               the
               Lord
            
             
               c
            
             But
             that
             all
             Kings
             have
             beene
             defenders
             of
             the
             Faith
             of
             Christ
             ,
             I
             deny
             ;
             for
             there
             is
             but
             one
             Faith
             ,
             
               *
            
             and
             those
             that
             do
             maintaine
             that
             true
             saith
             of
             our
             Lord
             Jesus
             Christ
             ,
             lawfully
             have
             that
             title
             given
             them
             ;
             and
             none
             other
             may
             lawfully
             have
             it
             but
             they
             .
          
           
             You
             will
             happily
             say
             ,
             Queene
             
               Mary
            
             was
             not
             a
             Defender
             of
             the
             Faith
             .
             But
             I
             say
             unto
             you
             ,
             if
             the
             Crowne
             of
             
               England
            
             give
             unto
             Kings
             and
             Queenes
             that
             title
             ;
             Queene
             
               Mary
            
             had
             as
             much
             right
             to
             the
             title
             as
             Queene
             
               Elizabeth
               .
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             
               Secondly
               ,
               you
               say
               ▪
               they
               hold
               that
               the
               imposition
               of
               lawfull
               things
               ,
               doth
               make
               them
               unlawfull
               ,
               (
               which
               you
               say
               is
               a
               strange
               paradoxe
               .
               )
            
             
          
           
             I
             answer
             the
             imposition
             of
             lawfull
             things
             doe
             not
             make
             them
             unlawfull
             ,
             if
             he
             that
             imposeth
             them
             have
             authoritie
             so
             to
             doe
             :
             as
             for
             example
             ;
             the
             i●●osition
             of
             an
             Oath
             is
             very
             lawfull
             ;
             but
             
             if
             it
             be
             imposed
             by
             him
             that
             hath
             not
             authoritie
             ,
             though
             it
             make
             not
             the
             Oath
             unlawfull
             simply
             in
             it selfe
             ,
             yet
             it
             makes
             the
             use
             of
             it
             unlawfull
             ,
             at
             that
             time
             ,
             both
             to
             him
             and
             to
             me
             .
          
           
             
               But
               as
               for
               formes
               of
               prayer
               :
               which
               (
               you
               say
               )
               they
               doe
               confesse
               to
               be
               for
               order
               ,
               and
               lawfull
               in
               themselves
               ,
               yet
               unlawfull
               ,
               being
               imposed
               .
            
          
           
             I
             say
             ,
             not
             as
             you
             say
             ,
             they
             say
             ,
             for
             I
             know
             no
             forme
             of
             prayer
             lawfull
             in
             it selfe
             ,
             for
             any
             of
             the
             Lords
             people
             to
             tie
             themselves
             unto
             ;
             nor
             that
             ever
             was
             imposed
             upon
             any
             by
             Christ
             ,
             or
             his
             Apostles
             ;
             (
             We
             reade
             in
             1
             
               Tim.
            
             2.
             1.
             2.
             that
             all
             manner
             of
             prayers
             must
             be
             made
             unto
             God
             ;
             and
             amongst
             other
             ,
             supplications
             must
             be
             made
             for
             Kings
             ,
             but
             there
             was
             no
             forme
             of
             words
             given
             by
             which
             wee
             must
             pray
             for
             any
             :
             and
             we
             are
             commanded
             to
             pray
             with
             the
             Spirit
             ,
             and
             to
             pray
             with
             understanding
             ;
             )
             but
             we
             are
             commanded
             to
             avoid
             an
             evill
             manner
             of
             praying
             ;
             that
             we
             should
             not
             be
             like
             the
             Hipocrites
             ;
             which
             love
             to
             stand
             and
             pray
             in
             the
             Synogogues
             ,
             
               *
            
             nor
             that
             we
             should
             make
             vaine
             repititions
             as
             the
             Heathens
             ,
             which
             thinke
             to
             be
             heard
             for
             their
             much
             babling
             :
             
               *
            
             and
             as
             also
             we
             are
             forbidden
             an
             evill
             manner
             of
             praying
             ;
             so
             wee
             are
             commanded
             by
             God
             what
             manner
             to
             use
             ,
             as
             it
             is
             plaine
             in
             
               Matth.
            
             6.
             9.
             
             
          
           
             The
             manner
             is
             that
             wee
             must
             in
             our
             prayers
             acknowledge
             God
             to
             be
             
               our
               Father
               .
            
          
           
             And
             secondly
             ,
             That
             he
             is
             
               in
               heaven
               .
            
          
           
             Thirdly
             ,
             we
             must
             give
             glory
             to
             his
             
               Name
               .
            
          
           
             Fourthly
             ,
             we
             must
             pray
             for
             the
             coming
             of
             his
             
               Kingdome
               .
            
          
           
             Fiftly
             ,
             we
             must
             pray
             that
             the
             Lords
             
               Will
            
             may
             
               be
               done
               ,
               both
               in
            
             
             
               earth
               and
               in
               heaven
               .
            
          
           
             Sixthly
             ,
             wee
             must
             pray
             for
             all
             things
             necessary
             for
             this
             life
             ,
             
             which
             is
             there
             set
             forth
             under
             the
             name
             of
             
               dayly
               bread
               .
            
          
           
             Seventhly
             ,
             wee
             must
             pray
             for
             the
             forgivenesse
             of
             
               our
            
             owne
             
             
               sinnes
               ;
            
             and
             we
             are
             also
             put
             in
             minde
             ,
             that
             as
             wee
             would
             have
             our
             owne
             sinnes
             forgiven
             ,
             so
             we
             should
             forgive
             others
             ;
             if
             they
             acknowledge
             their
             offences
             ,
             according
             to
             that
             in
             
               Luke
            
             17
             ▪
             4
             ▪
             
               If
               thy
               brother
               trespasse
               against
               thee
               seven
               times
               a
               day
               ,
               and
               seven
               times
               a
               day
               ,
               end
               say
               it
               repenteth
               him
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             Eightly
             ,
             we
             must
             pray
             against
             
               temptations
            
             to
             be
             delivered
             
               from
            
             
             
               the
               evills
               thereof
               .
            
          
           
             And
             lastly
             ,
             we
             must
             conclude
             with
             thankesgiving
             acknowledging
             
               the
               Kingdome
            
             to
             be
             the
             Lords
             and
             all
             
               power
               ,
               and
               glory
            
             to
             be
             due
             unto
             him
             ,
             not
             onely
             for
             that
             present
             time
             ,
             but
             
               for
               ever
               .
            
          
           
             Here
             you
             may
             see
             we
             are
             taught
             the
             
               manner
            
             how
             we
             ought
             to
             pray
             ,
             but
             we
             are
             tied
             to
             no
             
               forme
            
             of
             
               words
               ,
            
             yet
             we
             are
             to
             beleeve
             that
             this
             is
             a
             perfect
             
               Rule
               ,
            
             and
             that
             we
             may
             sufficiently
             ground
             all
             
             the
             
               petitions
            
             we
             neede
             to
             put
             up
             from
             this
             very
             
               rule
               .
            
          
           
             As
             for
             Example
             .
          
           
             As
             we
             desire
             to
             acknowledge
             God
             to
             be
             
               our
               Father
               ,
            
             so
             wee
             ought
             to
             desire
             ,
             that
             others
             would
             doe
             the
             like
             .
          
           
             And
             whereas
             we
             ought
             to
             pray
             for
             the
             Kingdome
             of
             God
             to
             come
             ,
             we
             are
             not
             to
             limit
             it
             to
             this
             ,
             (
             that
             Christ
             may
             come
             to
             rule
             in
             us
             onely
             )
             but
             that-he
             may
             rule
             as
             a
             King
             in
             the
             heart
             of
             all
             his
             chosen
             .
          
           
             Neither
             ought
             wee
             alone
             to
             acknowledge
             praises
             but
             wee
             ought
             to
             desire
             that
             prayses
             to
             God
             may
             be
             acknowledged
             by
             others
             also
             ,
             and
             that
             they
             may
             grant
             the
             
               Kingdome
               ,
               and
               power
               ,
               and
               glory
            
             to
             be
             his
             ,
             not
             that
             he
             should
             be
             a
             King
             onely
             to
             rule
             in
             the
             hearts
             of
             men
             ,
             but
             also
             that
             he
             may
             rule
             and
             governe
             the
             actions
             of
             the
             bodies
             of
             men
             in
             his
             outward
             worship
             :
             as
             we
             are
             commanded
             to
             
               glorifie
               God
               with
               our
               bodies
               and
               soules
               ,
            
             and
             the
             reason
             ,
             is
             
               because
               they
               are
               his
               ,
            
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             6.
             20.
             
             Now
             ,
             if
             our
             
               bodies
               and
               soules
            
             be
             Gods
             ,
             then
             it
             must
             needs
             be
             granted
             ▪
             that
             it
             is
             in
             spirituall
             worship
             :
             for
             in
             all
             civill
             things
             it
             hath
             beene
             acknowledged
             already
             ,
             that
             both
             bodies
             and
             lives
             are
             our
             soveraigne
             Lord
             the
             Kings
             ;
             in
             whose
             Land
             we
             dwell
             .
          
           
             Now
             if
             there
             were
             any
             forme
             of
             prayer
             for
             men
             to
             bind
             themselves
             unto
             ,
             it
             would
             have
             beene
             shewed
             ,
             either
             in
             this
             Scripture
             ,
             or
             in
             
               some
               other
               ;
               which
               thing
            
             you
             have
             not
             yet
             proved
             .
          
           
             That
             they
             were
             not
             tied
             to
             this
             forme
             of
             words
             is
             plaine
             by
             another
             Evangelist
             ,
             which
             doth
             not
             use
             the
             same
             words
             ,
             but
             addeth
             some
             ,
             and
             leaveth
             out
             other
             some
             ;
             and
             also
             the
             whole
             forme
             of
             thankesgiving
             ,
             is
             left
             out
             by
             
               Luke
               ,
            
             (
             
               Luke
            
             11.
             2.
             3.
             4.
             
             Compared
             with
             
               Matth.
            
             6.
             9.
             
             )
             and
             to
             seeke
             the
             helpe
             of
             any
             booke
             but
             the
             Bible
             to
             teach
             men
             to
             pray
             ,
             is
             to
             disable
             God
             which
             hath
             promised
             to
             give
             Beleevers
             his
             Spirit
             ,
             whereby
             they
             shall
             cry
             
               Abba
               Father
               ,
            
             
               c
            
             and
             that
             that
             Spirit
             
               should
               leade
               them
               into
               all
               truth
               ,
               and
               bring
               all
               things
               to
               their
               remembrance
            
             
               d
            
             Therefore
             a
             forme
             of
             prayer
             for
             men
             to
             tie
             themselves
             unto
             ,
             cannot
             be
             sufficient
             and
             pleasing
             to
             God
             though
             it
             were
             never
             imposed
             by
             any
             .
          
           
             
               Thirdly
               ,
               you
               lay
               another
               slander
               upon
               us
               ,
               as
               though
               we
               should
               affirme
               ,
               that
               Christian
               Princes
               ,
               and
               Magistrates
               ,
               who
               are
               defenders
               of
               the
               Faith
               have
               no
               more
               to
               doe
               in
               and
               about
               the
               Church
               ,
               then
               Heathen
               Princes
               .
            
          
           
             This
             is
             not
             true
             ,
             for
             we
             know
             that
             Christian
             Princes
             ,
             and
             Magistrates
             ought
             to
             be
             members
             of
             Christs
             Church
             ;
             and
             so
             being
             they
             may
             be
             Officers
             in
             the
             Church
             ;
             And
             if
             they
             be
             Defenders
             of
             the
             Faith
             ,
             they
             be
             such
             as
             defend
             the
             pure
             worship
             of
             God
             ,
             manifested
             in
             his
             Word
             ,
             as
             also
             the
             true
             professors
             thereof
             ,
             and
             that
             against
             all
             tyrannicall
             power
             that
             shall
             attempt
             to
             suppresse
             either
             it
             or
             them
             ,
             
               as
               the
               good
               Kings
               of
            
             Judah
             
               and
            
             Israel
             
             
               did
               ,
               by
               slaying
               the
               Servants
               and
               Prophets
               of
               Baal
               who
               had
               slaine
               the
               Lords
               people
               .
            
          
           
             But
             Heathen
             Kings
             cannot
             be
             said
             to
             be
             members
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             Christ
             before
             they
             know
             Christ
             ,
             and
             then
             they
             become
             Christian
             Kings
             .
             Therefore
             ,
             to
             vent
             upon
             all
             occasions
             ,
             such
             principles
             as
             you
             see
             wee
             hold
             ,
             and
             maintaine
             ,
             is
             not
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             dangerous
             and
             insufferable
             ,
             neither
             are
             the
             people
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               further
               ,
               that
               the
               people
               for
               a
               great
               part
               of
               them
               are
               heady
               and
               refractory
               ,
               and
               proud
               ,
               and
               bitter
               ,
               and
               scornfull
               ,
               and
               dispisers
               of
               authoritie
               ,
               and
               that
               they
               will
               not
               suffer
               publike
               prayers
               to
               be
               prayed
               ,
               but
               that
               by
               their
               gesture
               and
               threatning
               of
               the
               Ministers
               ,
               they
               have
               laboured
               to
               hinder
               the
               use
               of
               them
               :
            
             And
             these
             people
             (
             I
             gather
             from
             your
             owne
             words
             )
             
               are
               the
               professors
               in
               England
               ,
               and
               especially
               in
               the
               city
               of
               London
               ;
            
             and
             it
             is
             very
             like
             to
             be
             so
             ;
             because
             they
             were
             there
             at
             the
             time
             of
             your
             service
             ;
             (
             for
             neither
             the
             Separates
             nor
             Semiseparates
             (
             as
             you
             call
             them
             )
             use
             to
             be
             there
             at
             the
             time
             of
             your
             service
             (
             for
             ought
             I
             know
             :
             )
             and
             these
             Professors
             you
             have
             also
             called
             
               Idle
               ,
               &
               busibodies
               ,
               tatlers
               also
               ,
            
             as
             it
             is
             said
             ,
             1
             
               Tim.
            
             5.
             13.
             
               very
               wanton
               in
               their
               wits
            
             (
             say
             you
             )
             
               affecting
               novelties
               in
               Religion
               ,
               and
               liking
               of
               points
               that
               are
               not
               established
               nor
               commonly
               held
               ,
               and
               these
               you
               say
               are
            
             many
             
               of
               the
               professors
               ▪
            
             
               *
            
             
               And
               in
               your
               second
               Reason
               against
               Toleration
               ,
               Pag.
            
             24.
             (
             you
             say
             )
             
               that
               the
               mindes
               of
            
             multitudes
             
               of
               the
               Professors
               in
               England
               ,
               and
               especially
               in
               this
               citie
               ,
               are
               upon
               all
               occasions
               very
               apt
               to
               fall
               to
               any
               way
               in
               Doctrine
               or
               Discipline
               that
               is
               not
               commonly
               received
               by
               the
               Church
               ,
               &c.
               
            
             But
             I
             tel
             you
             ,
             you
             ought
             not
             to
             blame
             any
             for
             withstanding
             any
             thing
             in
             Gods
             worship
             ,
             which
             is
             not
             grounded
             in
             his
             Word
             :
             Neither
             (
             if
             the
             whole
             body
             of
             the
             worship
             there
             tendred
             be
             the
             invention
             of
             man
             )
             ought
             any
             of
             them
             to
             be
             blamed
             for
             opposing
             such
             a
             worship
             ;
             because
             it
             is
             according
             to
             their
             Protestation
             .
          
           
             Yet
             I
             justifie
             none
             that
             will
             oppose
             disorderly
             ,
             as
             either
             by
             
               casting
               up
               of
               hats
               ,
            
             or
             
               threatning
               the
               Minister
               ,
            
             or
             any
             the
             like
             unseemely
             behaviour
             ;
             for
             I
             judge
             it
             better
             for
             them
             to
             depart
             in
             peace
             ,
             if
             they
             have
             not
             faith
             in
             the
             action
             performed
          
           
             But
             methinkes
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             you
             have
             foulely
             missed
             it
             ,
             in
             that
             you
             have
             thus
             vilified
             your
             brethren
             ,
             to
             call
             them
             by
             the
             
               names
               of
               those
               mockers
               which
            
             (
             
               Paul
            
             testified
             )
             
               should
               come
               in
               the
               last
               time
               ,
               that
               should
               be
               heady
               ▪
               and
               high
               minded
               ,
               and
               proud
               boasters
               ,
               and
               dispisers
               of
               authority
               ;
               for
               such
               as
               these
               have
               not
               the
               power
               of
               godlinesse
               ,
            
             (
             and
             by
             this
             you
             make
             your
             Church
             a
             foule
             Church
             ,
             and
             defile
             shrewdly
             your
             owne
             nest
             ,
             and
             make
             it
             appeare
             to
             all
             men
             that
             you
             live
             in
             a
             Cage
             of
             uncleane
             birds
             )
             
               &
               therefore
               you
               are
               commanded
               from
               such
               to
               turne
               aside
               ;
            
             
               *
            
             if
             the
             feare
             of
             God
             be
             in
             your
             heart
             .
          
           
           
             Moreover
             ,
             
               You
               say
               ,
               you
               feare
               they
               will
               not
               tolerate
               the
               Government
               established
               by
               the
               Ecclesiasticall
               ,
               and
               civill
               Lawes
               ;
            
             and
             you
             would
             faine
             father
             the
             cause
             of
             this
             your
             feare
             upon
             Separates
             ,
             and
             Independancie
             ,
             whereas
             you
             cannot
             be
             so
             ignorant
             ,
             but
             that
             you
             must
             know
             ,
             that
             the
             government
             established
             by
             Law
             may
             stand
             without
             the
             leave
             of
             Separates
             ,
             for
             they
             have
             neither
             power
             to
             give
             toleration
             ,
             nor
             to
             prohibit
             toleration
             ,
             for
             ,
             or
             against
             any
             thing
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               would
               rather
               pray
               against
               toleration
               ,
               than
               prophesie
               of
               the
               wofull
               effe●ts
               of
               it
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             you
             can
             make
             such
             a
             prayer
             in
             a
             time
             acceptable
             ,
             then
             sometimes
             such
             prayers
             will
             be
             accepted
             which
             are
             not
             grounded
             upon
             Gods
             Word
             .
          
           
             But
             of
             the
             wofullest
             effects
             of
             toleration
             ,
             you
             have
             prophesied
             already
             ;
             in
             that
             you
             say
             ,
             
               they
               will
               withstand
               your
               Doctrine
               and
               your
               dues
               ,
            
             
               *
            
             
               and
               that
               will
               be
               a
               wofull
               effect
               indeede
               !
               when
               you
               shall
               be
               driven
               ,
               to
               cry
               out
               ,
               Alas
               ,
               alas
               ,
               that
               great
               city
               Babylon
               ,
               for
               in
               one
               houre
               is
               so
               great
               wealth
               come
               to
               desolation
               .
            
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             Seventh
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               Eight
               Reason
               ,
               you
               affirme
               ,
               That
               these
               Independant
               men
               ,
               where
               they
               have
               power
               ,
               as
               in
            
             New-England
             ,
             
               will
               not
               tolerate
               any
               Churches
               or
               Government
               ,
               but
               in
               their
               owne
               way
               .
            
          
           
             In
             using
             the
             word
             
               these
               ,
            
             you
             carry
             the
             matter
             so
             darkely
             ,
             that
             I
             know
             not
             whom
             you
             meane
             ,
             for
             you
             have
             named
             none
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               seeme
               to
               say
               ,
               they
               be
               men
               that
               have
               power
               in
            
             New
             England
             .
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             Indeede
             it
             may
             happen
             to
             be
             so
             ;
             That
             there
             may
             be
             some
             men
             there
             ,
             that
             take
             upon
             them
             authority
             ,
             to
             binde
             mens
             consciences
             ,
             as
             you
             and
             all
             your
             fellowes
             do
             here
             .
             But
             if
             it
             have
             beene
             so
             ,
             I
             thinke
             it
             was
             ,
             because
             they
             had
             (
             here
             in
             
               England
            
             )
             taken
             upon
             them
             an
             oath
             of
             conformity
             ,
             (
             as
             you
             have
             sometimes
             done
             ;
             )
             and
             because
             the
             tyranny
             of
             the
             Prelats
             was
             so
             mighty
             ,
             against
             all
             good
             men
             ,
             that
             they
             were
             faine
             to
             go
             away
             privately
             ,
             and
             so
             had
             not
             time
             or
             opportunity
             publikely
             to
             disclaime
             this
             their
             Oath
             ;
             and
             then
             there
             might
             be
             feare
             ,
             that
             upon
             complaint
             made
             for
             disorder
             committed
             there
             ,
             in
             suffering
             the
             liberty
             of
             the
             Gospel
             there
             which
             could
             not
             be
             admitted
             here
             ,
             they
             might
             have
             beene
             sent
             for
             backe
             by
             their
             Ordinaries
             ,
             and
             so
             have
             been
             committed
             ▪
             to
             some
             stincking
             prison
             ,
             here
             in
             
               London
               ,
            
             there
             to
             have
             beene
             murdered
             ▪
             as
             divers
             of
             the
             Lords
             people
             have
             beene
             ,
             of
             these
             late
             yeares
             ,
             as
             I
             am
             able
             to
             prove
             of
             my
             owne
             knowledge
             ;
             and
             if
             they
             have
             banished
             any
             out
             of
             their
             Parents
             ,
             
             that
             were
             neither
             disturbers
             of
             the
             peace
             ,
             of
             the
             Land
             ,
             nor
             the
             worship
             practised
             in
             the
             Land
             ,
             I
             am
             perswaded
             ,
             it
             was
             their
             weakenesse
             ,
             and
             I
             hope
             they
             will
             never
             attempt
             to
             doe
             the
             like
             .
             But
             I
             am
             still
             perswaded
             ,
             they
             did
             it
             upon
             the
             same
             ground
             ,
             that
             having
             knowledge
             in
             themselves
             ,
             that
             their
             former
             Oath
             ,
             might
             be
             a
             snare
             unto
             them
             ,
             if
             they
             did
             not
             hold
             still
             some
             correspondencie
             with
             the
             practise
             of
             England
             ,
             even
             till
             God
             should
             open
             a
             way
             or
             meanes
             for
             them
             to
             seeke
             free
             liberty
             for
             all
             ,
             by
             the
             approbation
             of
             authority
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               minde
               against
               them
               is
               ,
               that
               they
               would
               not
               admit
               liberty
               ,
               to
               some
               of
               their
               brethren
               ,
               which
               were
               godly
               Ministers
               ▪
               though
               they
               did
               approve
               of
               them
               ,
               as
               being
               against
               Ceremonies
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             ,
             1.
             
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             it
             is
             strange
             that
             any
             man
             should
             send
             to
             aske
             their
             liberty
             .
             2.
             
             It
             is
             much
             more
             strange
             to
             me
             (
             if
             it
             be
             true
             ,
             as
             you
             say
             ,
             that
             these
             men
             were
             against
             Ceremonies
             )
             that
             there
             should
             be
             any
             difference
             betweene
             them
             ,
             and
             the
             Ministers
             in
             
               New
               England
               .
            
          
           
             
               But
               it
               seemes
               (
               by
               your
               speech
               )
               they
               would
               have
               gone
               in
               a
               middle
               way
               ,
            
             which
             presupposeth
             to
             me
             ,
             that
             they
             are
             so
             farre
             from
             being
             against
             Ceremonies
             ,
             that
             are
             already
             invented
             ,
             that
             they
             would
             have
             set
             up
             some
             invention
             of
             their
             owne
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               charge
               some
               of
               them
               with
               ,
               is
               ,
               That
               they
               would
               not
               admit
               into
               fellowship
               ,
               those
               that
               would
               not
               enter
               into
               their
               Covenant
               ,
               and
               professe
               faith
               ,
               and
               submit
               to
               their
               Church
               Orders
               ,
               though
               they
               would
               be
               of
               their
               Church
            
          
           
             Me
             thinkes
             you
             have
             strange
             evasions
             ,
             but
             I
             pray
             you
             answer
             me
             to
             these
             two
             questions
             :
             the
             first
             is
             ,
             how
             men
             of
             yeares
             of
             discretion
             ,
             may
             (
             by
             the
             rule
             of
             Gods
             Word
             )
             be
             admitted
             into
             fellowship
             ,
             and
             not
             professe
             their
             faith
             .
          
           
             Secondly
             ,
             how
             men
             may
             be
             accounted
             ,
             to
             be
             of
             the
             Church
             ,
             and
             not
             submit
             unto
             the
             orders
             of
             the
             Church
             :
             Seeing
             that
             the
             Apostle
             
               Paul
            
             had
             these
             two
             things
             to
             rejoyce
             in
             ;
             the
             beholding
             of
             the
             Saints
             stedfast
             faith
             ,
             and
             comely
             order
             ,
             in
             the
             Church
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               that
            
             these
             
               men
               who
               would
               faine
               have
               a
               toleration
               in
               this
               great
               kingdome
               ,
               will
               not
               allow
               any
               in
               their
               small
               particular
               Congregations
               .
            
          
           
             Truely
             (
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             It
             were
             good
             for
             you
             to
             labour
             to
             understand
             the
             minde
             and
             will
             of
             God
             for
             your selfe
             ,
             and
             have
             charitie
             towards
             your
             brethren
             ;
             and
             hope
             well
             ,
             that
             they
             have
             so
             much
             knowledge
             ,
             of
             the
             Lords
             will
             ,
             that
             they
             will
             not
             pleade
             for
             such
             an
             absurdity
             ,
             as
             to
             set
             up
             one
             Church
             ,
             within
             another
             ,
             and
             so
             make
             a
             schisme
             .
             But
             the
             Toleration
             they
             plead
             for
             ,
             is
             that
             Gods
             true
             worship
             ,
             may
             be
             set
             up
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             ▪
             by
             those
             that
             understand
             what
             it
             is
             ;
             and
             that
             by
             the
             sufferance
             of
             
             the
             Governors
             ;
             and
             that
             it
             should
             be
             setled
             in
             a
             peaceable
             way
             ;
             which
             would
             be
             farre
             from
             disturbing
             the
             peace
             of
             three
             Kingdomes
             ,
             (
             as
             you
             invectively
             speake
             ;
             )
             but
             to
             set
             up
             a
             Congregation
             in
             a
             Congregation
             ,
             would
             be
             confusion
             ,
             even
             as
             to
             set
             up
             one
             Kingdome
             ▪
             within
             another
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               charge
               them
               with
               ,
               is
               ,
               that
               they
               are
               partiall
               ;
               (
               by
               a
               supposition
               of
               your
               owne
               :
               )
               for
               you
               say
               ,
               it
               is
               ordinary
               for
               men
               ,
               when
               they
               are
               not
               in
               place
               ,
               nor
               have
               no
               power
               in
               Church
               or
               Common-wealth
               ;
               and
               hold
               also
               Do●rines
               and
               principles
               contrary
               to
               what
               is
               held
               and
               established
               ;
               to
               pleade
               for
               Toleration
               ;
               but
               when
               the
               same
               men
               come
               to
               have
               place
               and
               power
               (
               say
               you
               )
               they
               will
               not
               tolerate
               others
               ;
               and
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               you
               doe
            
             beleeve
             
               that
               these
               are
               the
               men
               ,
               which
               now
               indevour
               a
               toleration
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             you
             may
             doe
             well
             to
             let
             this
             
               beleefe
            
             of
             yours
             be
             no
             Article
             of
             your
             faith
             ,
             because
             it
             stands
             upon
             no
             ground
             ;
             for
             though
             a
             man
             may
             hope
             the
             best
             ,
             and
             feare
             the
             worst
             ;
             yet
             he
             may
             beleeve
             nothing
             but
             what
             he
             hath
             proofe
             for
             .
             But
             I
             doe
             beleeve
             that
             all
             this
             is
             your
             evill
             surmising
             ,
             (
             to
             think
             ,
             that
             if
             they
             had
             power
             in
             their
             hands
             to
             settle
             a
             Government
             ,
             they
             would
             tolerate
             none
             but
             their
             independant
             way
             ,
             )
             as
             it
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             by
             the
             
               Protestation
               Protested
               ,
            
             which
             you
             quote
             here
             for
             your
             Author
             ,
             for
             though
             the
             Protestor
             declare
             what
             he
             would
             have
             for
             the
             Churches
             of
             the
             Saints
             ;
             yet
             he
             doth
             not
             take
             upon
             him
             to
             determine
             ,
             what
             Government
             or
             rule
             ,
             shall
             be
             set
             up
             in
             the
             Land
             ,
             to
             bring
             men
             out
             of
             darkenesse
             to
             light
             ,
             but
             leaveth
             that
             to
             the
             judgement
             of
             them
             which
             have
             the
             power
             ,
             even
             the
             King
             and
             Parliament
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             Eight
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               ninth
               Reason
               you
               affirme
               ,
               that
               toleration
               may
               he
               demanded
               ,
               upon
               the
               same
               grounds
               ,
               for
               Brownists
               ,
               Anabaptists
               ,
               and
               Familists
               ,
               and
               others
               ,
               who
               professe
               it
               is
               their
               conscience
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ;
             That
             seeing
             you
             plead
             for
             them
             ,
             I
             may
             well
             hold
             my
             peace
             .
             But
             I
             thinke
             the
             
               Familists
            
             will
             not
             aske
             liberty
             for
             toleration
             if
             they
             be
             as
             (
             I
             doe
             conceive
             )
             of
             the
             
               Sect
               of
               the
               Libertines
            
             mention
             in
             the
             Acts
             .
          
           
             
               But
               ,
               say
               you
               ,
               these
               may
               be
               pleaded
               for
               upon
               better
               grounds
               then
               Semi-Separates
               ,
               and
               the
               Reason
               you
               say
               is
               ,
               because
               they
               deny
               the
               truth
               of
               your
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             Answer
             ,
             I
             do
             beleeve
             ,
             those
             (
             whom
             you
             call
             Semi-Separates
             )
             do
             deny
             the
             truth
             of
             your
             Church
             also
             ;
             (
             though
             not
             in
             all
             respects
             )
             and
             so
             farre
             as
             they
             be
             Separates
             ,
             they
             must
             needs
             deny
             the
             Church
             from
             which
             they
             Separate
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               here
               demand
               ,
               whether
               Papists
               may
               not
               petition
               and
               have
               hope
               ▪
            
             
             
               for
               toleration
               ,
               seeing
               it
               is
               their
               conscience
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             know
             no
             reason
             why
             they
             may
             not
             petition
             and
             hope
             to
             speede
             also
             ,
             seeing
             they
             have
             many
             friends
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               if
               one
               sort
               may
               have
               an
               exemption
               from
               the
               Religion
               established
               ,
               why
               not
               others
               ?
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             .
             There
             may
             be
             many
             reasons
             given
             ,
             why
             those
             may
             not
             have
             freedome
             (
             of
             any
             great
             resorts
             in
             the
             Land
             )
             which
             have
             often
             attempted
             ,
             by
             plots
             ,
             and
             treachery
             to
             ruinate
             the
             Land
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               affirme
               ,
               is
               ,
               if
               ever
               the
               doore
               of
               toleration
               ,
               should
               be
               but
               a
               little
               opened
               ,
               there
               would
               be
               great
               crowding
               in
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             That
             the
             more
             good
             men
             doe
             imbrace
             the
             whole
             truth
             of
             God
             ,
             the
             better
             it
             will
             be
             ,
             but
             there
             have
             beene
             too
             many
             
               crowders
            
             and
             
               creepers
               in
            
             in
             all
             ages
             ;
             and
             we
             may
             justly
             feare
             it
             will
             be
             so
             still
             ;
             for
             the
             Text
             saith
             ,
             in
             the
             2
             
               Pet.
            
             2.
             2.
             
             
               That
               many
               shall
               follow
               their
               destruction
               ,
               and
               some
               of
               them
               shall
               doe
               it
               through
               covetousnesse
               ,
               who
               shall
               with
               fained
               words
               make
               merchandise
               of
               the
               Lords
               people
            
             (
             as
             is
             plaine
             in
             the
             next
             verse
             )
             
               whose
               destruction
               sleepeth
               not
               .
            
             But
             who
             these
             creepers
             in
             be
             ,
             appeares
             by
             the
             15.
             verse
             of
             this
             Chapter
             ,
             
               That
               they
               were
               they
               that
               loved
               the
               wages
               of
               unrighteousnesse
               as
               Balaam
               did
               :
            
             But
             if
             any
             one
             so
             doe
             ,
             his
             last
             end
             shall
             be
             worse
             '
             then
             his
             beginning
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             ninth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             
               IN
               your
               Tenth
               Reason
               ,
               you
               affirme
               ,
               That
               the
               first
               principle
               of
               the
               Independant
               way
               ,
               is
               ,
               That
               two
               or
               three
               Saints
               wheresoever
               ,
               or
               by
               what
               meanes
               soever
               they
               doe
               arise
               ;
               separating
               themselves
               from
               the
               world
               into
               the
               fellowship
               of
               the
               Gospell
               ,
               are
               a
               Church
               truely
               gathered
               :
               for
               this
               you
               quete
            
             Mr.
             
               Robinsons
               Iustification
               ,
               pag.
            
             221.
             
          
           
             But
             in
             that
             page
             there
             is
             no
             such
             thing
             written
             ,
             as
             I
             can
             finde
             ,
             but
             seeing
             it
             commeth
             so
             neere
             the
             truth
             ,
             we
             neede
             not
             to
             contend
             about
             it
             .
             For
             I
             doe
             affirme
             ,
             that
             a
             company
             of
             Saints
             ,
             Separated
             from
             the
             world
             ,
             and
             gathered
             into
             the
             fellowship
             of
             the
             Gospell
             (
             by
             what
             meanes
             so
             ever
             it
             be
             ,
             that
             matters
             not
             ,
             so
             it
             be
             by
             the
             teaching
             of
             the
             Sonne
             of
             God
             ,
             according
             to
             that
             in
             
               Heb.
            
             1.
             1.
             
             )
             these
             Saints
             (
             I
             say
             )
             separating
             themselves
             ,
             and
             being
             gathered
             into
             the
             fellowship
             of
             the
             Gospell
             (
             though
             they
             combine
             themselves
             without
             the
             warrant
             of
             the
             Governours
             )
             are
             a
             true
             Church
             ,
             and
             have
             right
             to
             all
             Gods
             Ordinances
             ,
             not
             onely
             
             to
             admit
             men
             into
             fellowship
             ,
             but
             also
             to
             admonish
             ,
             to
             reprove
             and
             to
             cast
             out
             of
             their
             societie
             all
             obstinate
             offenders
             amongst
             them
             that
             doe
             transgresse
             ,
             either
             against
             the
             first
             or
             second
             Table
             ;
             having
             (
             as
             hath
             beene
             said
             before
             )
             the
             Spirit
             of
             God
             to
             
             guide
             them
             ,
             and
             wisedome
             from
             above
             to
             judge
             of
             persons
             ,
             and
             causes
             ,
             within
             the
             Church
             ,
             though
             they
             have
             nothing
             to
             doe
             to
             judge
             those
             that
             are
             without
             .
          
           
             And
             this
             doth
             not
             make
             way
             for
             Libertisnime
             ,
             for
             Heresies
             and
             Sectaries
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             neither
             doth
             it
             make
             men
             to
             runne
             from
             their
             owne
             Ministers
             ,
             because
             they
             restraine
             them
             from
             sinne
             ,
             or
             keepe
             them
             to
             Gods
             Ordinances
             ,
             (
             as
             you
             doe
             affirme
             )
             for
             if
             any
             separate
             for
             any
             such
             cause
             ,
             they
             shall
             not
             be
             received
             into
             fellowship
             ,
             nor
             justified
             of
             any
             of
             the
             Lords
             people
             .
          
           
             But
             the
             way
             of
             the
             Gospell
             ,
             as
             hath
             beene
             plainely
             proved
             ,
             is
             not
             to
             live
             without
             Gods
             Ordinances
             ,
             nor
             to
             live
             at
             liberty
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             except
             you
             meane
             the
             liberty
             wherein
             Christ
             hath
             set
             them
             ,
             and
             commanded
             them
             to
             stand
             fast
             ,
             because
             he
             hath
             made
             them
             free
             ,
             
               Gal.
            
             5.
             1.
             
             By
             this
             you
             may
             see
             the
             Saints
             are
             called
             into
             liberty
             ;
             but
             not
             a
             liberty
             to
             sinne
             (
             as
             you
             would
             insinuate
             )
             but
             to
             be
             freed
             from
             the
             yoake
             of
             bondage
             ,
             which
             is
             the
             tyranny
             ,
             or
             tyrannicall
             government
             of
             the
             Canon
             Lawes
             ,
             either
             of
             
               Rome
            
             or
             
               England
               .
            
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               all
               heretickes
               ,
               Sectaries
               ,
               or
               libertines
               will
               count
               themselves
               Saints
               ,
               as
               well
               as
               the
               Independant
               men
               ;
               and
               the
               reason
               you
               seeme
               to
               give
               for
               this
               ,
               is
               ,
               because
               the
               Ministers
               ,
               and
               Magistrats
               of
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               shall
               not
               have
               power
               to
               determine
               who
               be
               Saints
               .
            
             
               *
            
          
           
             Now
             let
             all
             men
             judge
             what
             a
             weighty
             argument
             this
             is
             ,
             who
             is
             he
             that
             knows
             any
             thing
             &
             knows
             not
             this
             ,
             that
             the
             Priests
             in
             
               England
            
             which
             are
             the
             Bishops
             creatures
             ,
             do
             generally
             justifie
             the
             wicked
             ,
             and
             condemne
             the
             just
             ,
             and
             are
             not
             these
             meet
             men
             to
             judge
             Saints
             ?
             they
             justifie
             none
             that
             will
             not
             be
             conformable
             ,
             and
             yeeld
             unto
             the
             traditions
             which
             they
             have
             invented
             ,
             in
             their
             Councels
             and
             Convocations
             ;
             though
             they
             have
             not
             one
             title
             of
             Gods
             Word
             to
             warrant
             them
             ;
             Furthermore
             ,
             they
             condemne
             all
             that
             will
             not
             submit
             ,
             to
             their
             devised
             worship
             ,
             even
             in
             all
             the
             traditions
             thereof
             :
             and
             this
             is
             the
             dependancie
             which
             they
             have
             brought
             all
             men
             unto
             ,
             both
             high
             and
             low
             ,
             even
             to
             be
             subject
             to
             their
             wills
             ,
             which
             is
             a
             Law
             .
          
           
             
               But
               now
               touching
               the
               Magistrate
               ,
               you
               would
               seeme
               to
               inferre
               that
               he
               should
               have
               no
               more
               power
               than
               a
               Priest
               .
            
          
           
             It
             is
             plaine
             ,
             the
             Priests
             have
             no
             power
             ,
             but
             what
             they
             have
             by
             permission
             ,
             and
             sufferance
             ▪
             though
             they
             have
             dependancie
             upon
             the
             Pope
             himselfe
             ,
             but
             the
             Magistrate
             hath
             power
             given
             him
             of
             God
             by
             whom
             he
             is
             set
             up
             ,
             for
             the
             praise
             of
             those
             that
             doe
             well
             and
             for
             the
             punishment
             of
             evill
             doers
             ,
             and
             hath
             the
             same
             rule
             given
             him
             (
             whereby
             to
             judge
             them
             )
             that
             God
             hath
             given
             to
             his
             Church
             ;
             especially
             Christian
             Magistrates
             ,
             notwithstanning
             
             they
             are
             opposed
             ,
             yet
             they
             have
             power
             given
             of
             God
             ;
             as
             you
             may
             reade
             in
             
               Acls
            
             7
             35.
             
             
               This
               man
               Moses
               whom
               they
               forsooke
               saying
               ,
               who
               ma●e
               thee
               a
               Prince
               and
               a
               Iudge
               ,
               the
               same
               God
               sent
               for
               a
               Prince
               and
               a
               deliverer
               :
               and
               this
               is
               he
               which
               was
               as
               a
               God
               unto
               Aaron
               ;
               when
               Aaron
               was
               as
               the
               mouth
               of
               Moses
               to
               the
               people
               ,
            
             Exod.
             4.
             16.
             
             Now
             if
             you
             Priests
             could
             have
             proved
             your selves
             as
             
               Aaron
               ,
            
             then
             you
             might
             have
             beene
             assistants
             to
             Godly
             Magistrates
             to
             deliver
             the
             Lords
             people
             out
             of
             the
             hands
             of
             Tyrannicall
             Princes
             ;
             but
             contrariwise
             ,
             you
             adde
             afflictions
             as
             
               Pharaohs
            
             Taskemasters
             
             did
             ;
             even
             you
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             when
             you
             say
             the
             Lords
             people
             are
             wanton-witted
             and
             idle
             ,
             when
             they
             desire
             to
             have
             liberty
             to
             serve
             God
             .
          
           
             And
             thus
             you
             sit
             in
             the
             consciences
             of
             men
             ;
             judging
             zeale
             to
             be
             hypocrisie
             ;
             but
             the
             time
             will
             come
             ,
             when
             every
             worke
             shall
             be
             brought
             to
             judgement
             .
          
           
             And
             now
             drawing
             neere
             to
             an
             end
             of
             this
             Answer
             to
             your
             tenth
             Reason
             (
             which
             is
             the
             last
             of
             this
             your
             joyned
             army
             )
             it
             is
             good
             to
             looke
             backe
             a
             little
             ,
             and
             consider
             what
             hath
             beene
             said
             .
          
           
             You
             have
             spoken
             much
             for
             
               Dependencie
               ;
            
             but
             upon
             whom
             you
             doe
             depend
             ,
             I
             cannot
             tell
             ;
          
           
             You
             labour
             to
             bring
             men
             into
             doubts
             ,
             by
             your
             suppositions
             ,
             but
             you
             doe
             not
             make
             any
             conclusion
             ,
             which
             is
             Gods
             way
             ,
             that
             men
             fearing
             God
             ,
             may
             expect
             a
             blessing
             when
             they
             walke
             in
             it
             ,
             but
             you
             cry
             out
             for
             Dependencie
             ,
             upon
             
               Councels
               ,
            
             and
             
               Synods
               ,
            
             and
             
               Churches
               ;
            
             I
             pray
             you
             what
             Dependencie
             hath
             the
             Church
             of
             
               England
            
             upon
             any
             other
             Church
             ?
             for
             I
             suppose
             you
             will
             say
             ,
             that
             all
             the
             Land
             is
             but
             one
             Church
             .
          
           
             If
             you
             say
             ,
             
               that
               you
               have
               Dependencie
               ,
               upon
               the
               Church
               of
               Rome
               ;
            
             I
             doe
             beleeve
             you
             ;
             for
             the
             Bishop
             of
             
               Canterbury
            
             hath
             said
             so
             much
             ,
             in
             his
             booke
             ,
             where
             hee
             confesseth
             ,
             
               Rome
            
             to
             be
             as
             leprous
             
               Naaman
               ,
            
             and
             
               England
            
             to
             be
             the
             same
             
               Naaman
               cleansed
               .
            
          
           
             Now
             that
             it
             is
             the
             same
             ,
             may
             easily
             be
             proved
             ,
             by
             divers
             of
             your
             owne
             Authors
             .
             
               But
               you
               in
               your
               Epistle
               ,
               affirme
               ,
               it
               is
               not
               cleansed
               ,
            
             in
             that
             place
             ,
             
               where
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               there
               is
               yet
               Altars
               and
               Images
               ,
               brasen
               Serpents
               ,
               abused
               to
               Idolatry
               ,
               with
               divers
               other
               things
               ,
               which
               you
               would
               have
               purged
               out
               .
            
          
           
             By
             this
             it
             appeares
             ,
             that
             it
             is
             the
             same
             with
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             in
             the
             very
             nature
             of
             it
             ▪
             though
             not
             in
             every
             Circumstance
             ,
             and
             this
             (
             for
             any
             thing
             can
             be
             discerned
             )
             is
             the
             
               Dependancie
               ,
            
             for
             which
             you
             pleade
             :
             even
             the
             
               Dependancie
               and
               affinitie
               ,
            
             betweene
             
               Rome
            
             and
             
               England
               .
            
          
           
           
             Therefore
             you
             should
             rather
             have
             said
             ,
             
               That
               in
               the
               belly
               of
               this
               Dependancie
               ,
               doth
               lurke
               all
               liberty
               ,
               and
               heresie
               ,
               and
               whatsoever
               ,
               Sathan
               ,
               and
               the
               corrupt
               hearts
               of
               men
               have
               a
               pleasure
               to
               broach
               .
            
             For
             in
             that
             way
             ,
             it
             is
             too
             common
             ,
             for
             men
             to
             broach
             their
             owne
             pleasures
             ;
             for
             their
             Religion
             is
             made
             of
             mens
             inventions
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             
               10th
               .
            
             Reason
             .
          
        
      
       
         
           
             YEt
             furthermore
             ,
             (
             for
             addition
             to
             these
             ten
             Reasons
             ,
             you
             adde
             a
             Question
             ;
          
           
             *
          
           
             your
             Qeustion
             is
             ,
             what
             these
             men
             would
             have
             in
             this
             Toleration
             ,
             Whether
             the
             number
             of
             five
             or
             sixe
             Congregations
             onely
             ,
             and
             no
             more
             ?
             Or
             whether
             the
             number
             shall
             be
             left
             undetermined
             ,
             and
             be
             free
             to
             multiply
             ?
          
           &c.
           
        
         
           For
           answer
           to
           this
           ,
           I
           doe
           affirme
           ,
           that
           the
           number
           ought
           not
           to
           be
           limitted
           ,
           for
           the
           Churches
           of
           the
           New
           Testament
           were
           free
           ,
           to
           multiply
           ,
           not
           onely
           in
           greatnesse
           ,
           but
           also
           in
           number
           .
           I
           say
           they
           were
           left
           free
           by
           God
           ;
           for
           the
           Apostles
           were
           not
           limitted
           ,
           from
           constituting
           Churches
           wheresoever
           men
           were
           brought
           to
           beleeve
           in
           Christ
           .
        
         
           
             But
             say
             you
             ,
             it
             is
             their
             principles
             to
             breake
             one
             Church
             in
             two
             or
             three
             .
          
        
         
           I
           answer
           ,
           I
           know
           no
           man
           that
           holdeth
           any
           such
           principle
           .
        
         
           
             But
             say
             you
             ,
             it
             hath
             beene
             so
             at
          
           Amsterdam
           ,
           Roterdam
           ,
           
             and
             London
             .
          
        
         
           To
           this
           I
           answer
           ,
           I
           deny
           not
           ,
           but
           that
           there
           may
           be
           offences
           taken
           ,
           and
           sometimes
           given
           ,
           which
           may
           cause
           men
           to
           depart
           one
           from
           another
           (
           as
           
             Paul
          
           and
           
             Barnabas
          
           did
           )
           sometimes
           about
           persons
           ,
           and
           sometimes
           about
           things
           ;
           and
           wofull
           experience
           teacheth
           all
           men
           ,
           that
           brethren
           are
           apt
           to
           fall
           out
           by
           the
           way
           ;
           and
           that
           
             Ioseph
          
           knew
           very
           well
           ,
           when
           he
           admonished
           his
           brethren
           to
           the
           contrary
           .
           
             *
          
           But
           though
           some
           should
           be
           offended
           ,
           and
           could
           not
           be
           reconciled
           ,
           (
           as
           the
           Scripture
           saith
           ,
           
             a
             brother
             offended
             ,
             is
             harder
             to
             be
             wonne
             than
             a
             strong
             citie
          
           
             *
          
           )
           yet
           the
           departing
           of
           such
           a
           brother
           ,
           (
           or
           breth●en
           )
           cannot
           make
           that
           Church
           two
           Churches
           ,
           yet
           notwithstanding
           this
           may
           sometimes
           tend
           to
           the
           further
           spreading
           of
           the
           Gospell
           ,
           even
           as
           the
           departing
           of
           
             Paul
          
           and
           
             Barnabas
          
           did
           .
           Not
           that
           I
           justifie
           the
           practise
           of
           any
           that
           are
           not
           apt
           to
           beare
           ,
           but
           that
           God
           doth
           sometimes
           ,
           bring
           good
           out
           of
           evill
           ,
           (
           as
           it
           was
           in
           the
           selling
           of
           
             Ioseph
             ,
          
           
             *
          
           by
           turning
           it
           to
           his
           owne
           glory
           ,
           and
           the
           good
           and
           comfort
           of
           his
           people
           .
        
         
           Therefore
           you
           neede
           not
           to
           marvell
           .
           which
           shall
           be
           the
           state
           approved
           by
           the
           Magistrate
           ;
           because
           that
           properly
           ,
           there
           remaineth
           but
           one
           intire
           state
           ,
           (
           in
           such
           cases
           of
           division
           ,
           as
           you
           have
           before
           mentioned
           .
           )
           By
           all
           this
           it
           appeares
           that
           it
           is
           none
           of
           our
           principles
           to
           breake
           one
           Church
           into
           two
           or
           three
           .
        
         
         
           
             But
             you
             say
             ,
             if
             the
             number
             be
             left
             undetermined
             ,
             there
             may
             be
             many
             Churches
             in
             a
             Towne
             .
          
        
         
           For
           answer
           whereof
           ,
           I
           must
           tell
           you
           ,
           that
           I
           reade
           in
           the
           Scriptures
           of
           no
           more
           Churches
           in
           a
           towne
           ,
           but
           one
           ,
           as
           in
           
             Ierusalem
          
           where
           there
           were
           many
           Converts
           ,
           yet
           I
           reade
           but
           of
           one
           Church
           .
        
         
           Now
           this
           was
           in
           the
           first
           plantation
           of
           the
           Gospell
           ,
           but
           what
           they
           might
           increase
           to
           afterward
           ,
           the
           Scripture
           is
           silent
           in
           ,
           for
           any
           thing
           I
           know
           .
        
         
           
             But
             that
             there
             may
             be
             two
             or
             three
             in
             one
             place
          
           (
           as
           you
           say
           )
           that
           seemeth
           unto
           me
           to
           be
           confusion
           ,
           except
           they
           should
           meete
           in
           one
           place
           for
           consultation
           ,
           which
           may
           very
           well
           be
           ,
           for
           God
           is
           the
           God
           of
           Order
           and
           not
           of
           confusion
           .
        
         
           And
           I
           never
           reade
           in
           the
           Scripture
           ,
           that
           two
           Churches
           met
           together
           in
           one
           place
           ,
           for
           the
           practise
           of
           publike
           worship
           .
        
         
           
             But
             say
             you
             ;
             we
             may
             have
             ,
             every where
             ,
             three
             or
             foure
             men
             ;
             of
             an
             opinion
             differing
             from
             others
             ,
             to
             goe
             to
             make
             a
             Church
             .
          
        
         
           To
           this
           I
           answer
           ,
           If
           you
           meane
           (
           by
           every where
           )
           in
           every
           Towne
           of
           the
           Land
           ,
           I
           say
           ,
           although
           it
           should
           be
           so
           ,
           (
           and
           though
           there
           be
           sixe
           townes
           in
           a
           Parish
           )
           yet
           it
           will
           be
           no
           no
           confusion
           ;
           for
           the
           fewer
           they
           are
           together
           the
           lesse
           ground
           will
           there
           be
           of
           fearing
           them
           .
        
         
           
             But
             touching
             divisions
             and
             subdivisions
             .
          
        
         
           If
           any
           such
           thing
           happen
           ,
           it
           is
           but
           that
           which
           we
           have
           bin
           told
           on
           before
           .
           The
           Apostles
           words
           are
           these
           ,
           
             They
             went
             out
             from
             us
             ,
             because
             they
             were
             not
             of
             us
             ,
             &c.
          
           
             *
          
           and
           if
           evill
           minded
           men
           ,
           that
           crept
           in
           departed
           from
           
             Christ
             ,
          
           
             *
          
           we
           neede
           not
           to
           thinke
           much
           ,
           that
           such
           creepers
           in
           ,
           should
           depard
           from
           
             us
          
           also
           ;
           yet
           the
           disorderly
           going
           away
           of
           any
           (
           as
           I
           have
           said
           before
           )
           doth
           not
           make
           them
           a
           Church
           which
           goe
           away
           disorderly
           .
        
         
           And
           thus
           I
           have
           given
           you
           an
           answer
           to
           your
           second
           tenth
           Reason
           ,
           
             *
          
           for
           in
           your
           Booke
           you
           have
           by
           your
           stile
           made
           it
           a
           Reason
           ,
           though
           you
           seemed
           at
           the
           first
           entrance
           into
           it
           to
           make
           it
           but
           a
           question
           .
        
         
           
             But
             before
             you
             conclude
             the
             whole
             ,
             you
             subjoyne
             to
             these
             ,
             the
             Answer
             to
             five
             or
             sixe
             things
             (
             which
             you
             would
             make
             to
             be
             their
             reasons
             )
             and
             you
             say
             that
             they
             are
             continually
             alleadged
             ,
             by
             them
             for
             their
             toleration
             ,
             in
             this
             Kingdome
             .
          
        
         
           
             THe
             first
             Reason
             (
             you
             say
             they
             bring
             )
             is
             ,
             that
             toleration
             is
             no
             more
             ,
             then
             the
             
               French
               ,
            
             and
             
               Dutch
            
             enjoy
             ,
             who
             live
             among
             us
             .
          
           
           
             Indeede
             that
             is
             a
             very
             good
             reason
             ,
             for
             methinkes
             it
             stands
             with
             equitie
             ,
             that
             
               Natives
               borne
               ,
            
             should
             have
             as
             much
             priviledge
             as
             
               Strangers
               .
            
          
           
             But
             you
             would
             seeme
             to
             alter
             the
             state
             of
             the
             case
             ,
             in
             sixe
             respects
             .
          
           
             
               First
               ,
               That
               the
            
             French
             
               and
            
             Dutch
             
               Protestants
               have
               nothing
               ,
               nor
               desire
               nothing
               ,
               as
               contra
               distinct
               to
               the
               Protestants
               of
            
             France
             
               and
            
             Holland
             .
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             the
             Protestants
             of
             
               France
               ,
            
             and
             
               Holland
               ,
            
             have
             liberty
             of
             their
             conscience
             ,
             and
             be
             not
             at
             all
             burdened
             ,
             with
             
               Iewish
               ,
               Popish
               ,
            
             or
             
               Heathenish
            
             Observations
             ,
             but
             may
             be
             free
             there
             ,
             to
             worship
             God
             ,
             according
             to
             his
             Will
             ,
             revealed
             in
             his
             Word
             ,
             then
             they
             that
             are
             here
             (
             amongst
             us
             )
             neede
             not
             to
             seeke
             more
             liberty
             ,
             and
             I
             am
             sure
             the
             Independant
             men
             will
             aske
             no
             more
             .
          
           
             
               Secondly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               this
               liberty
               ,
               was
               granted
               ,
               by
               our
               Pio●s
               Princes
               ,
               in
               the
               times
               of
               persecution
               to
               the
               Protestants
               .
            
          
           
             Here
             you
             crosse
             your
             first
             respect
             ,
             for
             if
             these
             Protestants
             were
             persecuted
             in
             
               France
               ,
            
             then
             it
             is
             certaine
             their
             Religion
             was
             different
             ,
             from
             the
             state
             of
             their
             owne
             Nation
             ;
             for
             you
             say
             they
             could
             not
             enjoy
             their
             Religion
             at
             home
             .
          
           
             
               Furthermore
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               it
               hath
               beene
               kept
               ever
               since
               ,
               for
               a
               refuge
               to
               the
               persecuted
               Protestants
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             The
             very
             like
             may
             be
             said
             of
             the
             libertie
             granted
             to
             the
             
               English
            
             Church
             in
             
               Amsterdame
               ,
            
             which
             hath
             beene
             a
             refuge
             for
             the
             Protestants
             which
             have
             beene
             persecuted
             out
             of
             
               England
            
             ever
             since
             .
          
           
             
               But
               (
               you
               say
               )
               we
               may
               enjoy
               our
               Religion
               in
               this
               Land
               ,
               and
               that
               by
               the
               authority
               of
               the
               King
               and
               Parliament
               .
            
          
           
             If
             it
             be
             so
             :
             I
             pray
             you
             what
             is
             the
             meaning
             ,
             of
             the
             bleating
             of
             such
             cattell
             ,
             as
             your selfe
             ?
             which
             cry
             out
             dayly
             to
             the
             King
             and
             Parliament
             ▪
             for
             the
             suppression
             of
             the
             Lords
             people
             ;
             and
             for
             the
             hindring
             of
             their
             meetings
             .
          
           
             
               Thirdly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               The
            
             French
             
               and
            
             Dutch
             
               Churches
               will
               willingly
               be
               joyned
               in
               Government
               ,
               and
               in
               one
               way
               of
               discipline
               with
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               if
               there
               be
               a
               Reformation
               .
            
          
           
             Indeede
             if
             you
             had
             not
             added
             a
             great
             If
             ,
             here
             you
             had
             told
             a
             loud
             untruth
             ,
             but
             if
             this
             were
             performed
             ,
             that
             there
             were
             a
             Reformation
             ,
             according
             to
             Gods
             Will
             ,
             I
             doubt
             not
             but
             the
             Independant
             men
             would
             doe
             the
             like
             .
          
           
             
               Fourthly
               ,
               you
               say
               these
               Churches
               doe
               not
               hold
               our
               principles
               ,
               but
               doe
               admit
               of
               appeales
               in
               great
               businesses
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             have
             told
             you
             already
             ,
             and
             I
             now
             tell
             you
             againe
             ,
             that
             I
             admit
             of
             appeales
             also
             ,
             such
             as
             the
             Scripture
             warrants
             ,
             
             and
             I
             have
             declared
             at
             large
             what
             appeales
             they
             be
             .
             
               *
            
          
           
             
               Fifthly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               be
               strangers
               different
               in
               Language
               ,
               and
               have
               little
               acquaintance
               with
               you
               (
               keeping
               themselves
               for
               the
               most
               part
               among
               themselves
               )
               and
               therefore
               (
               say
               you
               )
               there
               will
               be
               the
               lesse
               danger
               of
               drawing
               away
               the
               people
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             they
             differ
             so
             little
             from
             you
             ,
             as
             you
             would
             make
             the
             world
             beleeve
             ,
             there
             were
             small
             cause
             of
             danger
             ,
             or
             Schisme
             ,
             if
             they
             will
             willingly
             be
             joyned
             (
             as
             you
             said
             before
             )
             in
             Government
             ,
             and
             in
             one
             way
             of
             discipline
             with
             the
             Kingdome
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               they
               vent
               no
               principles
               ,
               against
               your
               Church
               ,
               and
               Government
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             Indeede
             ▪
             if
             they
             should
             never
             open
             a
             mouth
             to
             speake
             ,
             yet
             their
             practise
             makes
             them
             different
             from
             you
             ,
             both
             in
             worship
             and
             government
             ;
             and
             yet
             it
             may
             be
             upon
             better
             considerations
             ,
             they
             may
             draw
             neerer
             to
             the
             rule
             hereafter●
             ;
             but
             for
             my
             part
             I
             leave
             them
             ,
             as
             being
             partly
             ignorant
             of
             their
             practise
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               will
               not
               admit
               your
               people
               to
               be
               members
               of
               their
               Congregations
               .
            
          
           
             Answer
             ,
             Indeede
             I
             doe
             not
             know
             that
             ever
             they
             have
             refused
             any
             ;
             but
             this
             much
             I
             know
             ;
             that
             some
             
               English
            
             people
             ,
             that
             have
             the
             
               French
               ,
            
             and
             
               Dutch
            
             tongue
             ,
             have
             ,
             and
             doe
             goe
             thither
             to
             heare
             ;
             but
             that
             any
             should
             desire
             to
             goe
             thither
             to
             heare
             ,
             that
             have
             not
             the
             language
             ,
             were
             very
             absurd
             .
          
           
             
               Sixthly
               ,
               There
               ,
               is
               (
               say
               you
               )
               a
               great
               reason
               ,
               and
               necessity
               ,
               of
               allowing
               them
               Churches
               and
               places
               to
               preach
               ,
               and
               be
               by
               them●●lves
               ,
               and
               the
               reasons
               you
               yeeld
               ,
               are
            
             (
             1
             )
             
               because
               many
               of
               them
               understand
               not
            
             English
             
               at
               all
               ,
               and
            
             (
             2
             )
             
               for
               the
               benefit
               of
               strangers
               of
               their
               owne
               Religion
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             The
             very
             same
             may
             be
             said
             concerning
             
               the
               English
               Churches
            
             in
             
               Holland
               .
            
          
           
             
               But
               further
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               they
               may
               well
               be
               allowed
               some
               Discipline
               among
               themselves
               ,
               in
               respect
               they
               maintaine
               all
               their
               owne
               poore
               .
            
          
           
             Methinks
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             there
             should
             be
             much
             more
             reason
             ,
             that
             the
             English
             Protestants
             ,
             or
             Separates
             ,
             should
             be
             tolerated
             ,
             for
             the
             same
             cause
             ,
             for
             they
             maintaine
             all
             their
             owne
             
               poore
            
             also
             .
             And
             furthermore
             ,
             they
             maintaine
             the
             
               poore
            
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ;
             yea
             ,
             in
             every
             parish
             where
             their
             dwelling
             houses
             stand
             ,
             they
             pay
             to
             the
             poore
             weekely
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             any
             other
             man
             .
          
           
             They
             also
             pay
             their
             money
             for
             the
             maintenance
             of
             the
             
               Visited
               Houses
            
             in
             the
             Parishes
             where
             they
             dwell
             .
          
           
             Nay
             ,
             furthermore
             ,
             they
             pay
             also
             their
             mony
             for
             the
             maintenance
             of
             the
             Priests
             of
             England
             ,
             (
             the
             more
             is
             the
             pitty
             )
             and
             so
             I
             feare
             
             the
             
               Dutch
            
             and
             
               French
            
             doe
             also
             ,
             yea
             though
             the
             Priests
             are
             as
             Popish
             as
             they
             were
             in
             
               Q●eene
               Maries
            
             time
             .
             And
             this
             is
             well
             knowne
             to
             all
             Landlords
             that
             doe
             let
             them
             houses
             ,
             for
             if
             they
             know
             them
             to
             be
             Separates
             ,
             and
             that
             they
             will
             not
             ,
             have
             to
             doe
             with
             the
             Priests
             in
             the
             pay
             ment
             of
             that
             they
             call
             
               dues
               ,
            
             they
             make
             their
             Tenant
             pay
             the
             more
             rent
             ,
             for
             if
             the
             Tenant
             will
             not
             the
             Landlord
             must
             .
             And
             by
             this
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             their
             burthens
             are
             double
             to
             other
             mens
             ;
             in
             that
             they
             must
             maintaine
             their
             owne
             poore
             and
             their
             owne
             Ministers
             ,
             and
             the
             Church
             of
             Englands
             also
             .
          
           
             And
             by
             this
             you
             may
             see
             ▪
             that
             you
             have
             not
             (
             in
             the
             least
             )
             altered
             the
             state
             of
             the
             case
             ,
             betweene
             the
             
               Dutch
               ,
            
             and
             
               French
               ,
            
             and
             us
             ,
             in
             the
             causes
             before
             mentioned
             .
          
           
             Therefore
             this
             their
             first
             reason
             for
             toleration
             lies
             yet
             unanswered
             by
             you
             .
          
        
         
           
             FOr
             answer
             to
             their
             second
             Reason
             ,
             which
             (
             you
             say
             )
             is
             that
             they
             seeke
             no
             more
             then
             is
             granted
             them
             ,
             in
             
               Holland
               ;
            
             your
             answer
             to
             it
             is
             this
             ,
          
           
             
               That
               if
               that
               be
               a
               good
               ground
               ,
               then
            
             Jewes
             
               and
            
             Anabaptists
             
               may
               have
               a
               toleration
               also
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             For
             my
             part
             I
             speake
             for
             my selfe
             ,
             and
             I
             suppose
             ,
             that
             they
             may
             say
             as
             much
             for
             themselves
             (
             in
             these
             late
             respects
             ,
             which
             you
             have
             mentioned
             )
             as
             the
             Separates
             doe
             ,
             for
             they
             maintaine
             their
             poore
             ,
             and
             their
             Ministers
             ,
             and
             the
             poore
             ,
             and
             the
             Priests
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             we
             .
             And
             I
             thinke
             they
             are
             persecuted
             and
             hunted
             also
             ;
             but
             I
             will
             leave
             them
             to
             pleade
             for
             themselves
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               adde
               ,
               That
               such
               a
               Toleration
               is
               not
               fit
               ,
               neither
               in
               Divinity
               ,
               nor
               in
               policie
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             know
             no
             true
             Divinitie
             that
             teacheth
             men
             to
             be
             Lords
             over
             the
             conscience
             ;
             and
             I
             thinke
             it
             is
             no
             part
             of
             Godly
             policie
             ,
             to
             drive
             the
             Kings
             subjects
             out
             of
             the
             land
             ,
             because
             they
             desire
             free
             liberty
             to
             worship
             God
             in
             the
             Land
             according
             to
             his
             will
             ;
             the
             
               States
            
             of
             
               Holland
            
             are
             counted
             politicke
             ,
             and
             yet
             they
             esteeme
             it
             the
             
               Strength
            
             of
             their
             
               Kingdome
               ,
            
             to
             grant
             free
             libertie
             of
             conscience
             .
          
           
             
               Secondly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               there
               may
               be
               a
               toleration
               for
               us
               in
            
             Holland
             ,
             
               with
               much
               more
               safety
               to
               the
               government
               established
               ,
               then
               can
               be
               here
               ,
               because
               the
               people
               understand
               not
               our
               language
               ;
               and
               also
               have
               little
               ,
               or
               no
               relation
               to
               us
               of
               kindred
               and
               friendship
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             must
             say
             to
             you
             ,
             as
             I
             have
             said
             already
             ,
             that
             there
             was
             never
             any
             danger
             to
             a
             Kingdome
             ,
             to
             suffer
             the
             Lords
             people
             
             to
             live
             quietly
             ,
             and
             enjoy
             their
             liberty
             .
          
           
             
               Thirdly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               The
               people
               of
               the
            
             Holenders
             
               are
               generally
               industrious
               ,
               and
               mind
               their
               businesse
               ,
               and
               keeping
               to
               what
               is
               established
               by
               their
               Lawes
               ,
               not
               troubling
               their
               heads
               so
               much
               with
               other
               points
               of
               Religion
               .
            
          
           
             By
             this
             one
             may
             easily
             perceive
             your
             minde
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             with
             the
             rest
             of
             your
             fellowes
             ,
             and
             also
             know
             ,
             that
             you
             are
             naturally
             derived
             from
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             in
             that
             you
             would
             have
             all
             men
             ,
             to
             content
             themselves
             ,
             with
             an
             implicit
             faith
             ▪
             ;
             and
             to
             take
             for
             granted
             ,
             what
             government
             your
             Lawes
             alloweth
             ,
             and
             what
             worship
             your
             inventions
             have
             hatcht
             ;
             and
             not
             to
             search
             the
             the
             Scripture
             at
             all
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               you
               add
               here
               ,
               that
               the
               people
               in
               England
               are
               not
               so
               ,
               especially
               in
               this
               city
               of
            
             London
             
               and
               great
               Townes
               ,
               you
               say
               many
               of
               the
               professors
               ,
               are
               more
               idle
               ,
               and
               busie
               ▪
               bodies
               ,
               tatlers
               also
               ,
            
             as
             it
             is
             said
             ,
             1
             
               Tim.
            
             5.
             13.
             
               very
               wanton
               also
               in
               their
               wits
               ,
               affecting
               novelties
               in
               Religion
               ,
               &c.
               
            
          
           
             Now
             truly
             (
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             if
             you
             were
             of
             my
             mind
             ,
             and
             were
             a
             member
             of
             such
             a
             Church
             ,
             that
             had
             such
             members
             in
             it
             ;
             you
             woulde
             be
             so
             farre
             from
             fearing
             ,
             of
             being
             beguilded
             of
             them
             ,
             that
             you
             would
             be
             very
             glad
             to
             have
             such
             birds
             taken
             out
             of
             your
             nest
             .
             But
             you
             are
             so
             farre
             from
             observing
             the
             rule
             of
             Christ
             (
             
               Matth.
            
             18.
             15.
             
             )
             that
             is
             to
             tell
             your
             brother
             of
             his
             fault
             betweene
             him
             and
             you
             that
             you
             rather
             walke
             with
             slanders
             and
             elamours
             ,
             vilifying
             your
             owne
             mothers
             sonnes
             ;
             so
             that
             every
             good
             man
             may
             be
             ashamed
             of
             you
             .
          
           
             
               Fourthly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
            
             Holland
             
               tolerates
               us
               and
               many
               others
               ,
               but
               it
               is
               more
               upon
               grounds
               and
               necessitie
               of
               worldly
               respects
               ,
               because
               of
               the
               benifite
               of
               exsise
               towards
               the
               maintenance
               of
               warre
               .
            
          
           
             Now
             (
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             you
             have
             utterly
             overthrowne
             your
             owne
             Argument
             ,
             laid
             downe
             in
             the
             beginning
             of
             your
             answer
             to
             this
             their
             second
             Reason
             ,
             for
             then
             
               you
               said
               ,
            
             it
             was
             against
             the
             rule
             of
             policie
             ;
             
               but
               now
               you
               say
            
             it
             is
             their
             policie
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               would
               make
               the
               case
               different
               betweene
            
             England
             
               and
            
             Holland
             .
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             It
             is
             not
             different
             at
             all
             ;
             for
             
               England
            
             hath
             the
             Subjects
             purses
             to
             maintaine
             warres
             as
             well
             as
             
               Holland
               ;
            
             and
             though
             it
             be
             not
             in
             exsise
             for
             victuals
             ,
             yet
             it
             is
             in
             some
             other
             wayes
             from
             which
             the
             subjects
             of
             
               Holland
            
             are
             freed
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               affirme
               ,
               is
               ;
               That
               your
               riches
               and
               strength
               ,
               standeth
               in
               one
               way
               of
               Religion
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             thinke
             (
             if
             I
             could
             understand
             your
             minde
             herein
             )
             
               you
               meane
               the
               riches
               and
               strength
               of
               the
               Priests
               :
            
             
             for
             I
             am
             sure
             the
             riches
             ,
             and
             strength
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ,
             may
             stand
             best
             with
             Toleration
             ,
             as
             it
             may
             appeare
             ,
             partly
             by
             what
             hath
             been
             said
             already
             ,
             for
             you
             have
             heard
             that
             the
             Lords
             people
             (
             whom
             you
             thus
             persecute
             )
             maintaine
             their
             owne
             poore
             .
          
           
             And
             it
             will
             also
             be
             made
             appeare
             ,
             that
             they
             pay
             Scot
             ,
             and
             Lot
             ,
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             ,
             in
             all
             civill
             respects
             ,
             and
             are
             all
             as
             true
             subjects
             to
             the
             Kings
             Majesty
             ,
             and
             are
             ready
             to
             doe
             him
             all
             faithfull
             service
             with
             their
             bodies
             ,
             and
             estates
             ,
             as
             any
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             .
          
           
             But
             I
             confesse
             that
             toleration
             would
             be
             neither
             riches
             nor
             strength
             to
             the
             Priests
             ,
             for
             it
             is
             sore
             against
             the
             peoples
             will
             ▪
             that
             they
             pay
             them
             any
             thing
             
               now
               ;
            
             and
             it
             will
             be
             no
             wonder
             when
             it
             shall
             be
             made
             to
             appeare
             ,
             what
             the
             Priests
             wages
             i●
             ,
             
               *
            
             but
             that
             shall
             be
             done
             hereafter
             .
          
        
         
           
             THeir
             third
             Reason
             you
             say
             is
             ,
             That
             if
             they
             have
             not
             liberty
             to
             erect
             some
             Congregations
             ,
             it
             will
             force
             them
             to
             leave
             the
             Kingdome
             .
          
           
             
               For
               answer
               whereof
               ,
               you
               doe
               affirme
               (
               in
               the
               first
               place
               )
               that
               there
               is
               no
               neede
               of
               a
               toleration
               for
               them
               ;
               neither
               that
               they
               should
               leave
               the
               Kingdome
               for
               conscience
               ,
               and
               that
               you
               say
               will
               appeare
               by
               the
               Reasons
               and
               principles
               which
               they
               doe
               agree
               to
               ,
               which
               you
               say
               are
               these
               ;
            
          
           
             First
             ,
             that
             they
             hold
             your
             Churches
             true
             ,
             your
             Ministers
             true
             ,
             Ordinances
             true
             :
             Further
             you
             say
             they
             can
             partake
             with
             you
             in
             your
             Congregations
             in
             all
             Ordinances
             ,
             even
             to
             the
             Lords
             Supper
             .
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             Indeede
             here
             you
             would
             make
             the
             Readers
             beleeve
             ,
             that
             they
             had
             opened
             a
             wide
             gappe
             ,
             (
             if
             they
             should
             take
             your
             
               affirmation
               ,
            
             without
             your
             
               provisall
            
             )
             but
             you
             come
             to
             helpe
             your selfe
             handsomely
             ,
             in
             that
             you
             say
             their
             condition
             was
             ,
             that
             it
             must
             first
             be
             
               provided
               ,
               that
               scandalous
               and
               ignorant
               persons
               must
               be
               kept
               backe
               ,
               and
               Cerimonies
               must
               be
               removed
               .
            
          
           
             Methinks
             ,
             this
             is
             a
             mighty
             great
             mountaine
             ,
             that
             stands
             between
             them
             ▪
             and
             you
             ,
             and
             therefore
             you
             have
             small
             cause
             ,
             to
             aske
             them
             wherfore
             they
             should
             desire
             ,
             to
             set
             up
             Churches
             ?
             fortill
             this
             mountaine
             be
             removed
             ,
             they
             may
             be
             true
             to
             their
             own
             principles
             ,
             and
             not
             go
             from
             their
             word
             ,
             and
             yet
             never
             communicate
             with
             you
             ,
             either
             in
             worship
             ,
             or
             government
             .
          
           
             For
             first
             ,
             
               If
               you
               keepe
               out
               all
               scandalous
               persons
               ,
               out
               of
               all
               the
               Churches
               in
               England
               ,
               from
               the
               Sacraments
               ,
               and
               all
               ignorant
               persons
               ;
            
             truely
             then
             your
             Churches
             will
             be
             as
             emptie
             as
             ours
             .
          
           
             Secondly
             ,
             
               If
               you
               should
               remove
               away
               all
               your
               Ceremonies
               ,
            
             (
             which
             is
             the
             second
             part
             of
             your
             reformation
             ,
             )
             you
             could
             not
             tell
             how
             to
             worship
             ;
             for
             your
             whole
             forme
             and
             manner
             of
             worship
             is
             made
             of
             invented
             Ceremonies
             .
          
           
           
             But
             if
             you
             can
             procure
             such
             a
             reformation
             ,
             
               to
               have
               your
               Church
               all
               consist
               of
               persons
               of
               knowledge
               ,
               fearing
               God
               ,
               and
               ●ating
               covetousnesse
               ,
               &
               void
               of
               all
               other
               scandalls
            
             (
             so
             far
             as
             we
             can
             judge
             by
             the
             Scripture
             )
             
               and
               that
               the
               Ceremonies
               may
               be
               removed
               ,
               and
               we
               enjoy
            
             (
             as
             you
             bragge
             )
             
               all
               Gods
               Ordinances
               with
               you
               ,
               as
               well
               as
               in
               our
               owne
               Churches
               ,
            
             then
             you
             shall
             heare
             ,
             what
             I
             will
             say
             to
             you
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             the
             Independant
             men
             .
          
           
             But
             till
             all
             this
             be
             done
             ,
             you
             see
             there
             is
             still
             
               good
               reason
               ,
            
             for
             
               good
               men
               ,
            
             either
             to
             desire
             liberty
             ,
             or
             to
             leave
             the
             Kingdome
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               some
               of
               them
               could
               take
               the
               charge
               of
               Parochiall
               Churches
               amongst
               you
               ,
               upon
               the
               Reformation
               .
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             Indeede
             such
             a
             Reformation
             ,
             which
             you
             have
             formerly
             mentioned
             ,
             will
             hardly
             stand
             with
             Parochiall
             Churches
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               could
               yeeld
               to
               Presbyteriall
               Government
               ,
               by
               Classes
               and
               Synods
               ;
               so
               they
               might
               not
               be
               injoyned
               to
               submit
               to
               it
               ,
            
             as
             Jure
             Divino
             .
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             .
             It
             seemes
             (
             by
             your
             owne
             confession
             )
             that
             they
             doe
             deny
             the
             Presbyteriall
             government
             by
             Classes
             ,
             and
             Synods
             ,
             to
             be
             from
             God
             ,
             as
             it
             appeares
             ,
             in
             that
             you
             say
             ,
             they
             will
             not
             submit
             to
             it
             ,
             as
             
               Iure
               Divino
               ,
            
             and
             therefore
             you
             have
             overthrowne
             your selfe
             (
             in
             all
             this
             your
             reasoning
             )
             with
             your
             Synods
             and
             Classes
             also
             ;
             so
             that
             still
             there
             remaines
             good
             grounds
             to
             seeke
             a
             Toleration
             ,
             that
             the
             Saints
             may
             grow
             into
             bodies
             even
             in
             this
             Land
             .
          
           
             But
             to
             grow
             into
             one
             body
             with
             you
             (
             as
             you
             would
             have
             them
             )
             while
             your
             Churches
             body
             is
             like
             a
             Leopard
             ,
             and
             all
             bespotted
             ,
             (
             as
             appeares
             by
             your
             words
             )
             were
             very
             absurd
             ;
             for
             you
             ●●●e
             affirme
             ,
             that
             the
             best
             of
             your
             members
             ▪
             even
             
               the
               Professors
               ,
               especially
               of
            
             London
             ,
             
               and
               of
               the
               great
               Townes
               in
            
             England
             ;
             
               are
               very
               f●●le
               ;
            
             yet
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             confesse
             ,
             that
             they
             are
             the
             best
             of
             your
             members
             ;
             then
             if
             it
             be
             true
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             
               that
               you
               must
               remove
               in
               your
               Reformation
               ,
               all
               ignorant
               and
               scandalous
               persons
               ▪
            
             by
             your
             grounds
             ,
             you
             should
             have
             but
             a
             very
             few
             to
             make
             a
             Church
             of
             as
             well
             as
             wee
             .
             For
             you
             must
             remove
             also
             all
             your
             
               Professors
               ,
            
             which
             you
             say
             are
             so
             scandalous
             .
          
           
             Therefore
             ,
             I
             should
             rather
             counsell
             you
             to
             repent
             of
             all
             your
             evills
             that
             you
             have
             done
             ,
             and
             be
             reconciled
             to
             God
             the
             Father
             ,
             and
             Christ
             his
             Sonne
             ,
             and
             separate
             your selves
             from
             all
             your
             wickednesse
             ,
             and
             even
             come
             and
             grow
             up
             into
             one
             body
             with
             us
             .
          
           
             
               Secondly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               Seeing
               your
               Churches
               ,
               Ministers
               ,
               and
               Ordinances
               be
               true
               ,
               the
               erecting
               of
               new
               ,
               and
               withdrawing
               from
               such
               Congregations
               ,
               can
               never
               be
               answered
               to
               God
               .
            
          
           
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             Here
             you
             take
             for
             granted
             that
             which
             you
             cannot
             prove
             ,
             and
             it
             is
             your
             wisdome
             so
             to
             doe
             ,
             for
             by
             that
             meanes
             ;
             you
             may
             make
             simple
             people
             beleeve
             ▪
             that
             you
             are
             very
             right
             ,
             except
             a
             few
             defects
             ,
             which
             no
             man
             shall
             be
             freed
             from
             ,
             while
             he
             is
             in
             this
             life
             .
          
           
             But
             now
             to
             the
             point
             ;
             and
             first
             ,
             touching
             your
             Churches
             and
             Ministers
             ,
             which
             you
             say
             be
             true
             ,
             and
             you
             also
             say
             ,
             the
             Independant
             men
             would
             grant
             them
             to
             be
             true
             ,
             upon
             a
             Reformation
             ,
             such
             as
             the
             Word
             requires
             .
          
           
             I
             tell
             you
             for
             answer
             ,
             that
             this
             your
             juggling
             will
             not
             helpe
             you
             ,
             for
             no
             man
             is
             bound
             to
             take
             your
             bare
             word
             ,
             therefore
             it
             is
             good
             you
             make
             proofe
             of
             that
             which
             you
             have
             said
             .
          
           
             But
             before
             you
             goe
             to
             prove
             your
             Churches
             true
             ,
             declare
             unto
             me
             what
             Churches
             you
             meane
             ?
             for
             I
             ever
             tooke
             the
             whole
             Land
             of
             England
             to
             be
             but
             one
             Church
             ,
             (
             as
             it
             stands
             established
             by
             the
             Canon
             Laws
             )
             and
             that
             all
             the
             Parishes
             in
             the
             Land
             make
             up
             but
             one
             entire
             body
             ,
             therefore
             what
             is
             amisse
             in
             one
             Parish
             ,
             all
             the
             whole
             are
             guilty
             of
             ,
             and
             it
             will
             be
             laid
             to
             the
             charge
             of
             the
             Archbishops
             ,
             who
             are
             the
             Metropolitanes
             ,
             or
             chiefe
             Priests
             over
             the
             Church
             of
             the
             Land
             .
             Seeing
             it
             is
             so
             ,
             you
             must
             stand
             out
             to
             maintaine
             your
             Church
             ,
             and
             you
             neede
             not
             to
             trouble
             your selfe
             about
             your
             Church-es
             for
             I
             know
             no
             dependancie
             you
             have
             upon
             any
             ,
             except
             it
             be
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             according
             as
             I
             have
             told
             you
             before
             in
             the
             conclusion
             of
             my
             answer
             to
             your
             first
             tenth
             Reason
             against
             Independencie
             .
             Therefore
             this
             is
             the
             Church
             that
             you
             must
             maintaine
             ,
             even
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             established
             by
             the
             Canon
             Laws
             ,
             consisting
             of
             Archbishops
             ,
             Diocesan
             Bishops
             ,
             with
             all
             the
             rest
             of
             that
             erew
             ;
             for
             this
             is
             indeed
             both
             your
             Church
             and
             Ministry
             ,
             which
             doth
             appeare
             by
             your
             owne
             ground
             ,
             because
             you
             affirme
             ,
             that
             in
             this
             part
             lieth
             all
             the
             power
             :
             but
             (
             by
             your
             owne
             grounds
             )
             the
             whole
             body
             of
             the
             Land
             .
             (
             I
             meane
             of
             the
             Laitie
             (
             as
             you
             call
             them
             )
             hath
             no
             power
             at
             all
             to
             reforme
             any
             abuse
             :
             therfore
             this
             Clergy
             must
             needs
             be
             your
             Church
             ;
             and
             thus
             you
             make
             your selves
             the
             head
             ,
             and
             body
             ,
             and
             all
             the
             rest
             of
             the
             Land
             the
             ●ayle
             to
             follow
             after
             you
             .
          
           
             Now
             if
             you
             can
             prove
             this
             to
             be
             a
             true
             Church
             ,
             which
             hath
             neither
             ground
             ,
             nor
             footing
             in
             Christs
             Testament
             ,
             you
             will
             worke
             wonders
             :
             but
             indeede
             such
             wonders
             have
             been
             wrought
             by
             you
             ;
             for
             all
             the
             world
             ▪
             hath
             wondered
             ,
             and
             runne
             after
             the
             beast
             ,
             saying
             ,
             
               Who
               is
               like
               unto
               him
               ?
               and
               who
               is
               able
               to
               make
               warre
               with
               him
               ?
            
             as
             you
             may
             plainely
             see
             in
             the
             13.
             of
             the
             
               Reveation
               .
            
             
             Therefore
             they
             that
             doe
             justifie
             such
             a
             Church
             ;
             are
             such
             as
             have
             beene
             deceived
             by
             her
             false
             miracles
             ,
             even
             by
             the
             fire
             which
             she
             hath
             made
             to
             come
             downe
             from
             heaven
             .
          
           
           
             I
             pray
             you
             did
             not
             fire
             come
             downe
             from
             heaven
             in
             Queene
             
               Maries
            
             time
             ,
             and
             devour
             the
             Saints
             in
             
               Smithfield
               ;
            
             if
             you
             understand
             heaven
             in
             that
             place
             ,
             as
             I
             understand
             it
             (
             to
             be
             the
             seate
             of
             the
             Magistrate
             )
             you
             must
             grant
             the
             same
             ,
             for
             they
             are
             called
             Gods
             ,
             and
             the
             children
             of
             the
             most
             high
             .
          
           
             For
             your
             forefathers
             did
             (
             as
             
               Pila●
            
             did
             )
             wash
             their
             hands
             from
             the
             blood
             of
             the
             Saints
             ,
             and
             of
             the
             innocent
             ,
             and
             turned
             them
             over
             ,
             for
             their
             sentence
             of
             condemnation
             ,
             to
             the
             Secular
             power
             ,
             which
             you
             made
             your
             hornes
             ,
             and
             your
             heads
             pushed
             them
             forward
             to
             execute
             your
             bloody
             cruelty
             ;
             and
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             that
             fire
             came
             downe
             from
             heaven
             ,
             in
             the
             sight
             or
             apprehension
             of
             men
             for
             most
             that
             beheld
             it
             thought
             it
             was
             just
             ,
             because
             it
             was
             the
             sentence
             of
             the
             Magistrate
             .
          
           
             And
             by
             this
             all
             men
             may
             see
             ,
             that
             you
             of
             the
             Clergie
             are
             the
             
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             and
             that
             this
             Clergy
             came
             from
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             and
             that
             therefore
             your
             Church
             is
             derived
             from
             
               Rome
               .
            
          
           
             Now
             if
             you
             would
             know
             whence
             the
             Church
             of
             
               Rome
            
             was
             derived
             ;
             I
             conceive
             that
             her
             power
             was
             derived
             from
             the
             beast
             with
             seven
             heads
             ,
             which
             rose
             up
             out
             of
             the
             sea
             ,
             as
             you
             may
             read
             of
             in
             the
             thirteenth
             of
             the
             
               Revelations
               ,
            
             for
             there
             both
             those
             beasts
             are
             mentioned
             ▪
             and
             also
             the
             Image
             of
             the
             first
             beast
             ,
             which
             the
             second
             beast
             hath
             caused
             to
             be
             made
             ,
             which
             is
             even
             here
             in
             England
             amongst
             us
             ;
             and
             you
             may
             see
             I
             have
             proved
             unto
             you
             already
             what
             it
             is
             ;
             as
             you
             may
             also
             read
             in
             the
             15.
             verse
             of
             that
             Chapter
             ,
             it
             was
             that
             to
             whom
             the
             beast
             gave
             a
             spirit
             ,
             and
             also
             he
             gave
             it
             power
             that
             it
             should
             speake
             ,
             and
             cause
             as
             many
             as
             would
             not
             worship
             the
             Image
             of
             the
             beast
             ,
             to
             be
             killed
             ,
             and
             hath
             not
             this
             Image
             caused
             aboundance
             to
             be
             killed
             in
             England
             ,
             and
             hath
             not
             he
             caused
             all
             to
             receive
             his
             marke
             ,
             or
             his
             name
             ,
             or
             the
             number
             of
             his
             name
             ;
             and
             they
             that
             have
             it
             not
             ,
             may
             neither
             buy
             nor
             sell
             ,
             as
             it
             is
             apparant
             by
             the
             testimonie
             of
             the
             Scripture
             it selfe
             ,
             and
             wofull
             experience
             .
          
           
             And
             is
             not
             this
             Image
             the
             Church
             that
             now
             you
             ●leade
             for
             ?
             which
             consisteth
             of
             all
             the
             Priests
             of
             England
             ;
             if
             it
             be
             not
             ,
             I
             
             pray
             you
             tell
             me
             what
             it
             is
             ?
          
           
             But
             if
             this
             be
             it
             (
             as
             it
             appeares
             it
             is
             )
             then
             these
             are
             your
             Ministers
             also
             ;
             and
             then
             it
             hath
             beene
             proved
             plainely
             ,
             whence
             this
             your
             Church
             and
             Ministry
             came
             .
             And
             that
             any
             of
             understanding
             should
             grant
             this
             Church
             ,
             and
             Ministry
             to
             be
             a
             true
             Church
             and
             Ministery
             ,
             would
             bewray
             great
             ignorance
             in
             them
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               they
               acknowledge
               the
               Ordinances
               to
               be
               true
               .
            
          
           
           
             In
             this
             I
             doe
             beleeve
             you
             upon
             your
             bare
             word
             ,
             for
             it
             is
             a
             truth
             ,
             if
             you
             meane
             Gods
             Ordinances
             which
             you
             have
             amongst
             you
             .
          
           
             As
             first
             ,
             you
             have
             the
             Scripture
             but
             you
             wring
             it
             and
             wrest
             it
             ,
             according
             to
             your
             owne
             devices
             ,
             and
             make
             of
             it
             a
             nose
             of
             waxe
             ,
             and
             a
             leaden
             rule
             to
             leane
             which
             way
             your
             minde
             leadeth
             you
             ;
             and
             though
             you
             ought
             to
             take
             that
             reede
             or
             rod
             in
             your
             hand
             ,
             at
             all
             times
             (
             if
             you
             were
             Gods
             messengers
             )
             to
             measure
             both
             the
             Temple
             and
             the
             Altar
             and
             the
             worshippers
             ,
             (
             
               Rev.
            
             11.
             2
             ,
             yet
             you
             have
             not
             learned
             that
             skill
             ,
             (
             for
             your
             Church
             and
             Ministrie
             holdeth
             no
             correspondencie
             with
             that
             measuring
             line
             .
             )
             but
             contrariwise
             you
             have
             taken
             that
             golden
             cup
             ▪
             and
             filled
             it
             full
             of
             abominations
             ;
             ●ay
             ,
             you
             have
             hacked
             it
             and
             mangled
             it
             to
             peeces
             ,
             and
             made
             it
             into
             little
             lessons
             ,
             which
             you
             call
             your
             Epistles
             and
             Gospells
             &
             they
             are
             Dedicated
             to
             your
             
               Saints
               ,
            
             upon
             your
             
               Saints-Dayes
            
             ;
             and
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             though
             you
             have
             the
             Scriptures
             (
             which
             is
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             )
             and
             take
             upon
             you
             to
             unfold
             the
             mysteries
             thereof
             ,
             yet
             in
             stead
             of
             that
             ,
             you
             darken
             the
             truth
             by
             false
             glosses
             .
          
           
             Secondly
             ,
             you
             have
             the
             Sacraments
             ,
             even
             baptisme
             ,
             and
             breaking
             of
             breade
             :
             but
             you
             pervert
             them
             both
             ,
             to
             your
             owne
             destruction
             ;
             neverthelesse
             they
             still
             remaine
             Gods
             Ordinances
             ,
             even
             as
             the
             golden
             vessells
             ,
             were
             Gods
             vessels
             ,
             when
             they
             were
             in
             Babel
             though
             
               Bels●azar
            
             made
             them
             his
             qua●●ing
             boules
             ▪
             yet
             still
             they
             remained
             to
             be
             Gods
             vessels
             .
             Even
             so
             did
             Circumcision
             remaine
             Gods
             Ordinance
             though
             it
             was
             with
             
               Ierobo●●
               .
            
             The
             like
             may
             be
             said
             of
             Baptisme
             ▪
             it
             still
             remaines
             Gods
             Ordinance
             ,
             though
             it
             be
             carried
             away
             with
             back●sliding
             Antichristians
             (
             even
             the
             Apostate
             fallen
             stats
             )
             and
             so
             you
             may
             read
             in
             the
             eleventh
             of
             the
             
               Revelation
               ,
            
             ver.
             2.
             that
             the
             court
             must
             be
             left
             out
             ,
             and
             be
             unmeasured
             ;
             and
             the
             reason
             was
             because
             it
             was
             given
             to
             the
             Gentiles
             ,
             even
             to
             them
             that
             should
             tread
             downe
             the
             holy
             citie
             for
             42.
             monethes
             ;
             this
             court
             we
             know
             ,
             belonged
             to
             the
             Temple
             (
             as
             you
             may
             read
             in
             the
             42.
             of
             
               Ezekiel
            
             )
             and
             had
             in
             it
             the
             Ordinances
             belonging
             to
             the
             people
             .
             And
             although
             you
             have
             Baptisme
             ,
             and
             the
             Lords
             Supper
             they
             will
             not
             sanctifie
             you
             ;
             though
             they
             may
             be
             sanctified
             to
             the
             use
             of
             them
             amongst
             you
             which
             are
             Gods
             people
             ,
             according
             to
             the
             election
             of
             grace
             .
          
           
             And
             though
             you
             have
             some
             of
             Gods
             Ordinances
             ,
             amongst
             you
             ;
             yet
             you
             have
             added
             unto
             them
             many
             Ordinances
             of
             your
             owne
             devising
             ,
             which
             doth
             utterly
             debarre
             the
             Lords
             people
             ,
             which
             have
             knowledge
             of
             them
             ,
             from
             communicating
             with
             you
             in
             any
             worship
             .
          
           
           
             As
             for
             example
             ,
          
           
             How
             shall
             any
             man
             partake
             with
             you
             of
             the
             word
             preached
             in
             your
             assemblies
             but
             he
             must
             needs
             partake
             also
             with
             the
             false
             calling
             of
             the
             Priest
             ,
             by
             which
             it
             is
             preached
             ,
             for
             none
             else
             are
             suffered
             to
             preach
             amongst
             you
             ,
             (
             by
             your
             leave
             or
             approbation
             ,
             )
             but
             they
             that
             preach
             by
             that
             false
             power
             .
          
           
             And
             who
             shall
             receive
             the
             Sacraments
             with
             you
             ,
             and
             not
             justifie
             your
             devised
             Service-booke
             ?
             for
             all
             your
             things
             are
             administred
             by
             that
             .
             And
             as
             all
             the
             Lords
             Ordinances
             ought
             to
             be
             sanctified
             by
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             and
             prayer
             :
             So
             on
             the
             contrarie
             you
             labour
             to
             sanctifie
             your
             things
             ,
             by
             the
             stinted
             service-booke
             ;
             and
             therefore
             the
             withdrawing
             from
             you
             ,
             may
             be
             answered
             to
             God
             .
          
           
             Further
             you
             beare
             the
             world
             in
             hand
             ,
             
               that
               you
               have
               but
               something
               amongst
               you
               wanting
               yet
               ,
               that
               were
               to
               be
               desired
               ,
               and
               therefore
               you
               say
               there
               is
               no
               cause
               to
               leave
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               nor
               for
               private
               men
               to
               set
               up
               true
               Churches
               .
            
          
           
             Answer
             ,
             Indeed
             If
             your
             Church
             &
             Ministers
             could
             be
             proved
             true
             (
             which
             you
             see
             is
             a
             thing
             unpossible
             )
             then
             it
             had
             beene
             needlesse
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             to
             leave
             the
             Land
             ;
             but
             neither
             is
             your
             Church
             nor
             Ministers
             true
             ,
             nor
             can
             the
             Ordinances
             be
             had
             amongst
             you
             without
             sinne
             :
             and
             that
             this
             is
             the
             judgement
             of
             the
             Independant
             men
             ,
             is
             plaine
             by
             your
             former
             confession
             ;
             
               Where
               you
               affirme
               ,
               they
               will
               not
               heare
               of
               growing
               into
               one
               body
               (
               or
               communicating
               )
               with
               you
               before
               a
               Reformation
               ;
               neither
               submit
               to
               your
               Classes
               or
               Presbyters
               ,
               as
            
             Jure
             Divino
             ,
          
           
             
               But
               in
               the
               next
               place
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               setting
               up
               of
               devided
               Churches
               ,
               would
               be
               to
               the
               scandall
               of
               all
               the
               Churches
               ,
               and
               not
               the
               giving
               of
               scandall
               to
               one
               brother
               ,
               but
               to
               tenne
               thousands
               of
               Congregations
               .
            
          
           
             Truely
             (
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             you
             overshoote
             yourselfe
             (
             in
             that
             you
             make
             your selfe
             such
             an
             apparant
             dissembler
             )
             for
             you
             would
             make
             men
             beleeve
             ,
             that
             you
             desire
             to
             keepe
             your
             Church
             and
             brethren
             unspotted
             ,
             and
             yet
             you
             your selfe
             with
             your
             owne
             tongue
             ,
             have
             most
             foulely
             scandalized
             the
             chiefe
             members
             of
             your
             Church
             ,
             making
             them
             so
             foule
             a
             people
             ,
             that
             they
             ought
             not
             to
             be
             communicated
             with
             .
             
               *
            
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               your
               words
               imply
               that
               so
               long
               as
               a
               man
               is
               not
               put
               upon
               the
               practise
               of
               that
               which
               is
               unlawfull
               ,
               he
               may
               beare
               .
            
          
           
             I
             tell
             you
             againe
             that
             your
             whole
             manner
             is
             unlawfull
             ,
             and
             therefore
             all
             the
             Lords
             people
             ,
             as
             they
             desire
             to
             be
             blessed
             and
             to
             be
             found
             walking
             in
             Gods
             waves
             have
             cause
             to
             separate
             from
             your
             Church
             ▪
             and
             to
             practise
             Gods
             Ordinances
             among
             themselves
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             they
             who
             are
             separated
             already
             ,
             (
             which
             you
             
             here
             you
             call
             
               Brownists
            
             )
             and
             the
             grounds
             and
             causes
             be
             so
             great
             ,
             that
             they
             may
             well
             be
             justified
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               would
               have
               conscious
               men
               to
               consider
               Mr.
            
             Robinson
             ,
             
               concerning
               circumstantiall
               corruptions
               ;
               you
               say
               ,
               he
               shewes
               it
               is
               not
               an
               intolerable
               evill
               ,
               for
               evill
               men
               be
               suffered
               in
               the
               Church
               ,
               &c.
               yet
               you
               confesse
               he
               affirmes
               it
               to
               be
               an
               evill
               .
            
          
           
             Two
             things
             are
             here
             to
             be
             minded
             .
          
           
             
               First
               ,
            
             that
             you
             would
             still
             please
             your selfe
             with
             this
             ,
             
               that
               you
               have
               a
               true
               Church
               (
               though
               corrupted
               )
            
             which
             hath
             beene
             proved
             contrary
             .
          
           
             
               Secondly
               ,
               that
               you
               would
               justifie
               your
               Church
               by
               the
               sinnes
               of
               others
               .
            
          
           
             But
             you
             know
             what
             Mr.
             
               Robinson
            
             saith
             ,
             That
             the
             government
             instituted
             by
             Christ
             is
             not
             onely
             neglected
             or
             violated
             in
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             but
             the
             plaine
             contrarie
             to
             it
             is
             established
             by
             Law
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               now
               supposing
               your
               Reformation
               ,
               it
               will
               be
               otherwise
               with
               England
               ,
               then
               when
               he
               writ
               .
            
          
           
             But
             (
             you
             may
             see
             )
             it
             is
             verie
             plaine
             ,
             that
             the
             crueltie
             ,
             and
             wickednesse
             ,
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             hath
             increased
             ever
             since
             that
             time
             .
          
           
             
               You
               say
               there
               is
               but
               something
               neglected
               ,
               and
               you
               would
               make
               it
               the
               want
               of
               some
               Law
               to
               suppresse
               evill
               men
               .
            
          
           
             To
             which
             I
             answer
             ,
             That
             your
             Canon
             Lawes
             be
             evill
             Lawes
             ,
             and
             your
             Lawmakers
             evill
             men
             ,
             and
             therefore
             it
             could
             not
             stand
             with
             their
             principles
             to
             make
             Lawes
             to
             suppresse
             evill
             men
             .
          
           
             
               Thirdly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               they
            
             (
             whom
             you
             call
             Independant
             )
             
               live
               in
               and
               are
               members
               of
               such
               Churches
               ,
               and
               yet
               they
               thinke
               it
               unlawfull
               ,
               to
               forsake
               them
               .
            
          
           
             I
             pray
             you
             ,
             have
             any
             of
             them
             told
             you
             ,
             that
             their
             Churches
             be
             like
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ?
             you
             must
             make
             proofe
             thereof
             ,
             for
             in
             this
             I
             will
             not
             take
             you
             upon
             your
             bare
             word
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               they
               want
               some
               parts
               of
               Government
               and
               Officers
               ,
               appointed
               by
               Christ
               ,
               more
               matertally
               than
               will
               be
               in
               your
               Church
               ,
               upon
               a
               Reformation
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             have
             plainely
             proved
             to
             you
             :
             that
             Christs
             Church
             hath
             his
             Government
             ,
             and
             Officers
             ;
             but
             your
             Church
             hath
             neither
             Christs
             Government
             nor
             Officers
             .
             But
             what
             it
             will
             be
             upon
             the
             Reformation
             ▪
             I
             cannot
             tell
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               must
               want
               the
               Ordinances
               ,
               or
               else
               they
               must
               have
               them
               with
               instruments
               without
               ordination
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             This
             is
             untrue
             as
             hath
             beene
             proved
             at
             large
             ,
             in
             the
             answers
             to
             one
             of
             your
             former
             Reasons
             against
             Independancie
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               you
               would
               have
               them
               heare
               with
               the
               defects
               in
               your
            
             
             
               Church
               ,
               and
               waite
               till
               God
               give
               you
               more
               light
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             I
             know
             no●e
             that
             interrupteth
             you
             ,
             for
             wee
             will
             neither
             meddle
             with
             your
             
               Idols
               ,
            
             nor
             with
             your
             
               Gods
            
             if
             you
             would
             but
             
               suffer
               us
               to
               worship
               our
               God
               ,
               after
               the
               way
               that
               you
               call
               heresie
               .
            
          
           
             The
             next
             thing
             you
             say
             is
             that
             they
             tell
             you
             that
             something
             may
             be
             omitted
             for
             a
             time
             ,
             and
             that
             affirmatives
             binde
             not
             alwayes
             and
             that
             the
             exercise
             of
             Discipline
             may
             be
             forborne
             for
             a
             time
             ,
             when
             it
             will
             not
             be
             for
             edification
             to
             the
             Church
             ,
             but
             for
             destruction
             ;
             and
             therefore
             you
             question
             them
             
               for
               not
               incorporating
               themselves
               into
               your
               Church
               ,
               though
               something
               were
               more
               there
               to
               be
               desired
               ,
               yet
               you
               say
               ,
               there
               will
               be
               nothing
               contrary
               put
               upon
               them
               (
               nor
               quite
               another
               thing
               .
               )
            
          
           
             
               Now
               that
               something
               may
               be
               omitted
               for
               a
               time
               ,
            
             that
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             ;
             
               for
               a
               man
               that
               hath
               brought
               his
               gift
               to
               the
               Altar
               ,
               and
               there
               remembreth
               that
               his
               brother
               hath
               ought
               against
               him
               ,
               must
               leave
               the
               offering
               of
               his
               gift
               ,
               and
               goe
               and
               be
               reconciled
               to
               his
               brother
               ,
               Matth.
            
             5.
             23.
             24.
             
          
           
             Now
             that
             
               affirmatives
               binde
               not
               alwayes
               ,
            
             is
             plaine
             ;
             for
             they
             binde
             not
             alwayes
             in
             cases
             of
             impossibility
             ,
             but
             in
             such
             cases
             God
             accepteth
             the
             will
             for
             the
             deede
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               excellencie
               of
               discipline
               may
               be
               forborne
               for
               a
               time
               ,
               when
               it
               is
               not
               for
               Edification
               of
               the
               Church
               ,
               but
               for
               destruction
               ;
            
          
           
             I
             say
             ,
             true
             discipline
             ,
             (
             being
             rightly
             used
             )
             is
             alwayes
             for
             the
             edification
             of
             the
             Church
             ,
             and
             never
             for
             destruction
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               affirme
               ,
               that
               there
               is
               nothing
               contrary
               put
               upon
               us
               by
               you
               ,
               (
               or
               quite
               another
               thing
               ;
               )
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             wee
             know
             you
             have
             none
             of
             Gods
             Ordinances
             ,
             without
             some
             other
             thing
             to
             accompany
             them
             .
          
           
             
               Fourthly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               they
               may
               safely
               be
               members
               of
               your
               Church
               in
               the
               Reformation
               of
               you
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             You
             might
             well
             have
             spared
             this
             your
             
               vaine
               repetition
            
             till
             you
             had
             obtained
             a
             Reformation
             .
          
           
             But
             the
             Reason
             you
             have
             heard
             alleadged
             for
             their
             first
             going
             away
             granted
             in
             a
             letter
             from
             
               Rotterdam
               .
            
             that
             reason
             still
             remaines
             (
             
               though
               you
               say
               it
               is
               ceased
            
             )
             and
             will
             remaine
             till
             the
             Reformation
             ,
             you
             have
             formerly
             promised
             ▪
          
           
             
               But
               say
               you
               ,
               that
               practise
               they
               judge
               themselves
               tied
               to
               ,
               is
               founded
               upon
               a
               false
               principle
               (
               namely
               )
               that
               the
               power
               of
               government
               is
               given
               by
               Christ
               to
               the
               body
               of
               the
               Congregation
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             I
             have
             told
             you
             before
             ,
             (
             in
             the
             reply
             to
             the
             second
             part
             of
             this
             your
             answer
             to
             their
             third
             Reason
             )
             &
             I
             now
             tell
             you
             
             againe
             ,
             that
             you
             make
             your
             Priests
             the
             head
             and
             body
             both
             ;
             but
             Christ
             hath
             given
             the
             power
             to
             the
             Church
             which
             is
             his
             body
             ,
             by
             whose
             power
             every
             Officer
             ,
             and
             member
             thereof
             ,
             doth
             move
             ,
             and
             doe
             their
             severall
             Offices
             .
          
           
             
               Fifthly
               ,
               There
               is
               ,
               say
               you
               a
            
             medium
             ,
             
               between
               persecution
               and
               a
               publike
               Toleration
               ;
               a
               middle
               way
               ,
               say
               you
               ,
               betweene
               not
               suffering
               them
               to
               live
               in
               the
               Land
               ,
               and
               granting
               them
               liberty
               .
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             This
             is
             a
             very
             true
             thing
             ,
             for
             
               Pharaoh
            
             would
             have
             beene
             willing
             ,
             that
             the
             
               children
               of
               Israel
               ,
            
             should
             have
             stayed
             in
             
               Egypt
               ,
            
             and
             made
             him
             bricke
             ,
             but
             he
             would
             not
             suffer
             them
             to
             goe
             into
             the
             
               wildernesse
               ,
            
             to
             offer
             
               sacrifice
               .
            
             But
             if
             
               Pharoah
            
             had
             beene
             willing
             to
             have
             succoured
             the
             
               children
            
             of
             
               Israel
               ,
            
             he
             would
             have
             commanded
             his
             
               taskemasters
            
             not
             to
             lay
             burthens
             upon
             them
             ,
             that
             they
             could
             not
             beare
             ;
             but
             he
             did
             not
             doe
             so
             ,
             and
             therefore
             their
             bricke-making
             turned
             to
             
               persecution
               ,
            
             even
             as
             your
             
               injunctions
            
             and
             
               penall
               Lawes
            
             doe
             here
             in
             
               England
               ,
            
             and
             you
             binde
             them
             up
             with
             a
             pretence
             of
             his
             Majesties
             command
             ,
             which
             makes
             the
             burthen
             very
             mighty
             .
          
           
             By
             this
             it
             is
             plaine
             ,
             that
             no
             good
             man
             can
             live
             in
             England
             without
             persecution
             ,
             even
             at
             this
             day
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               would
               have
               them
               to
               have
               a
               third
               way
               ,
               for
               you
               say
               persons
               may
               live
               in
               the
               Land
               ,
               and
               injoy
               their
               Lands
               and
               liberties
               ,
               and
               not
               be
               compelled
               to
               professe
               ,
               and
               practise
               ,
               things
               against
               their
               conscience
               .
            
          
           
             I
             pray
             you
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             bethinke
             yourselfe
             now
             ,
             how
             untruly
             you
             speake
             and
             whether
             you
             doe
             not
             looke
             one
             day
             to
             give
             an
             account
             ,
             for
             your
             words
             ;
             for
             you
             know
             that
             no
             man
             can
             live
             in
             this
             land
             ,
             and
             enioy
             his
             lands
             and
             liberty
             ,
             but
             he
             shall
             be
             forced
             to
             worship
             according
             to
             the
             custome
             of
             the
             Nation
             .
             Nay
             ,
             children
             that
             be
             but
             sixteene
             yeares
             of
             age
             ,
             though
             ignorant
             ,
             and
             scandalous
             in
             their
             lives
             ,
             are
             forced
             to
             receive
             the
             Sacrament
             of
             the
             Lords
             Supper
             ,
             though
             it
             be
             to
             their
             utter
             condemnation
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               if
               upon
               petition
               to
               the
               Parliament
               ,
               the
               Papists
               should
               have
               the
               Statutes
               repealed
               ,
               which
               injoyne
               them
               to
               come
               to
               your
               Church
               ,
               yet
               say
               you
               ,
               the
               granting
               the
               Papists
               a
               publike
               toleration
               ,
               for
               their
               Religion
               ,
               would
               be
               quite
               another
               thing
               ,
               in
               as
               much
               as
               you
               say
               though
               the
               Papists
               were
               the
               first
               in
               p●t●tioning
               for
               the
               former
               ,
               yet
               they
               move
               not
               for
               the
               latter
               .
            
          
           
             For
             answer
             to
             this
             ▪
             I
             tell
             you
             ;
          
           
             First
             ,
             
               That
               for
               granting
               the
               Papists
               publike
               exercises
            
             will
             not
             much
             crosse
             your
             
               principles
               ,
            
             for
             they
             and
             you
             are
             naturall
             brethren
             .
          
           
           
             Secondly
             ,
             
               for
               that
               they
               move
               not
               for
               the
               latter
               (
               as
               you
               say
               :
               )
            
             They
             neede
             not
             for
             they
             injoy
             it
             without
             moving
             and
             till
             this
             Parliament
             ,
             none
             hath
             disturbed
             them
             for
             many
             yeares
             .
          
           
             But
             further
             ,
             
               you
               adde
               ▪
               that
               so
               you
               judge
               that
               the
               Independant
               men
               may
               live
               in
               the
               land
               freely
               ,
               and
               injoy
               their
               liberties
               and
               estates
               ,
            
             (
             but
             you
             have
             your
             clause
             whereby
             you
             still
             crosse
             all
             your
             own
             tale
             ;
             your
             clause
             is
             that
             it
             must
             be
             )
             
               by
               comming
               to
               your
               Churches
               ,
               and
               enjoying
               the
               Ordinances
               .
            
          
           
             Whereas
             you
             say
             
               so
               you
               judge
               ,
            
             it
             presupposeth
             that
             the
             
               Papists
            
             doe
             come
             to
             your
             Churches
             ,
             by
             what
             comes
             after
             ,
             that
             
               it
               must
               be
               by
               comming
               to
               your
               Churches
               ,
               and
               enjoying
               the
               Ordinances
               .
            
          
           
             Indeede
             the
             
               Papists
            
             may
             come
             to
             your
             
               Churches
               ,
            
             and
             injoy
             your
             
               Ordinances
               ,
            
             for
             first
             they
             were
             their
             
               Ordinances
               ;
            
             for
             when
             you
             apostated
             from
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             you
             carried
             the
             
               Romish
               traditions
            
             with
             you
             ,
             even
             as
             your
             forefathers
             in
             their
             apostacie
             from
             
               Christ
               Iesus
               ,
            
             carried
             some
             of
             his
             Ordinances
             with
             them
             ;
             so
             you
             retaine
             something
             of
             Gods
             to
             make
             your
             owne
             ware
             passe
             in
             sale
             ,
             and
             have
             patched
             you
             up
             a
             bundle
             of
             worship
             borrowing
             ●lso
             some
             
               Iewish
            
             and
             
               He●●henish
            
             Ceremonies
             to
             make
             up
             your
             
               pa●ke
               ;
            
             and
             will
             you
             be
             so
             kinde
             to
             suffer
             men
             to
             live
             in
             the
             land
             ,
             if
             they
             will
             but
             submit
             to
             this
             
               worship
            
             and
             promise
             them
             they
             shall
             never
             be
             compelled
             ,
             to
             professe
             or
             practise
             any
             more
             ?
             Indeede
             you
             are
             very
             liberall
             but
             it
             hath
             beene
             often
             said
             already
             ,
             (
             and
             you
             have
             said
             it
             yourselfe
             )
             that
             the
             Independant
             men
             ,
             cannot
             of
             conscience
             communicate
             with
             you
             before
             a
             Reformation
             :
             Therefore
             if
             this
             be
             the
             
               medium
            
             you
             have
             
               (
               betweene
               leaving
               the
               Land
               and
               toleration
               ▪
               )
               even
               that
               they
               must
               submit
               to
               your
               worship
               ,
            
             you
             might
             have
             bequeathed
             this
             
               Legacie
            
             to
             some
             that
             would
             accept
             of
             it
             ,
             and
             give
             you
             thankes
             for
             the
             Lord
             hath
             bequeathed
             liberty
             to
             his
             
               S●●●ts
            
             and
             
               Servants
               ,
            
             and
             hath
             purchased
             it
             at
             a
             deare
             price
             ;
             even
             that
             they
             should
             be
             freed
             from
             all
             
               Egyptian
               bondage
               ;
            
             and
             hath
             commanded
             them
             to
             stand
             fast
             in
             that
             
               liberty
               ,
            
             wherein
             he
             hath
             made
             them
             free
             :
             and
             whether
             they
             must
             obey
             Gods
             commands
             ,
             or
             your
             counsell
             be
             judge
             your selfe
             .
          
           
             
               Six●●y
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               If
               the
               former
               answers
               will
               not
               satisfie
               ,
               but
               that
               they
               must
               needs
               be
               in
               a
               Church
               fellowship
               ,
               as
               now
               they
               are
               then
               (
               you
               say
               )
               you
               you
               will
               shew
               them
               away
               ,
               according
               to
               their
               owne
               principles
               of
               a
               visible
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             For
             answer
             whereof
             I
             must
             tell
             you
             ,
             that
             fallacies
             ,
             and
             false
             conclusions
             upon
             mens
             words
             ,
             (
             without
             bringing
             their
             conditions
             )
             can
             satisfie
             no
             man
             concerning
             the
             matter
             in
             hand
             ;
             but
             it
             may
             satisfie
             all
             men
             of
             your
             evill
             minde
             ,
             that
             you
             still
             labour
             to
             turne
             away
             the
             truth
             as
             it
             may
             appeare
             ;
             by
             the
             way
             you
             here
             have
             chalked
             them
             out
             ,
             to
             walke
             in
             ;
             which
             is
          
           
           
             
               That
               because
               it
               is
               their
               principle
               (
               say
               you
               )
               that
               a
               few
               Saints
               joyned
               together
               in
               a
               Covenant
               ,
               have
               power
               ;
               therefore
               you
               imply
               that
               there
               should
               never
               neede
               a
               greater
               addition
               to
               them
               .
            
             
               *
            
          
           
             This
             you
             may
             know
             crosseth
             the
             whole
             Scripture
             as
             the
             very
             prophesies
             of
             the
             Church
             under
             the
             New
             Testament
             that
             is
             to
             say
             ,
             
               that
               a
               little
               one
               shall
               become
               a
               thousand
               ,
               and
               a
               great
               one
               a
               strong
               Nation
               ,
               Esay
            
             60.
             22.
             
               and
               that
               they
               should
               grow
               up
               as
               the
               Calves
               of
               the
               stall
               ,
               Mal.
            
             4.
             2.
             not
             onely
             in
             greatnesse
             ,
             but
             also
             in
             number
             :
             and
             
             especially
             when
             the
             Lambe
             overcommeth
             ,
             that
             is
             even
             when
             the
             Saints
             overcome
             ,
             by
             the
             blood
             of
             the
             Lambe
             ,
             and
             the
             word
             
             of
             their
             testimony
             ,
             not
             esteeming
             their
             lives
             to
             the
             death
             .
          
           
             Therefore
             you
             might
             have
             saved
             your
             schollership
             ,
             when
             you
             went
             about
             to
             teach
             them
             ,
             
               to
               make
               Churches
               in
               houses
               ,
               and
               also
               to
               come
               to
               your
               Church
               ,
               to
               the
               Word
               ,
               Prayer
               ,
               and
               Sacraments
               ▪
            
             for
             they
             have
             not
             so
             learned
             Christ
             ;
             to
             come
             one
             part
             of
             the
             day
             to
             worship
             before
             the
             Idols
             ,
             and
             to
             stand
             another
             part
             before
             God
             ,
             for
             if
             they
             should
             doe
             so
             ,
             the
             Lord
             saith
             ,
             (
             
               Ezek.
            
             44.
             13.
             
             )
             
               they
               should
               not
               come
               neere
               him
               ,
               neither
               to
               doe
               the
               office
               of
               the
               Priest
               ,
               nor
               to
               come
               neare
               the
               holy
               things
               ,
               but
               that
               they
               should
               beare
               their
               shame
               ,
               and
               their
               abomination
               .
            
          
           
             Further
             ,
             you
             might
             have
             saved
             your
             labour
             in
             teaching
             them
             ,
             
               to
               make
               family
               Church
               es
               :
            
             for
             God
             hath
             directed
             them
             what
             to
             doe
             in
             their
             Families
             .
          
           
             And
             it
             is
             not
             the
             practise
             of
             Gods
             people
             ,
             to
             shut
             out
             from
             their
             prayers
             ,
             and
             holy
             duties
             ,
             them
             that
             are
             of
             their
             Family
             ▪
             for
             God
             gave
             his
             Law
             to
             
               Abraham
            
             for
             another
             end
             (
             namely
             )
             
               that
               he
               should
               teach
               it
               his
               Family
               ,
            
             and
             by
             so
             doing
             ,
             traine
             up
             members
             in
             his
             family
             ,
             for
             Christs
             Family
             .
          
           
             Further
             ,
             you
             might
             have
             spared
             your
             care
             taken
             
               to
               shew
               a
               way
               for
               maintenance
               ,
               for
               those
               men
               among
               us
               ,
               that
               are
               schollers
               bred
               ,
            
             for
             if
             you
             can
             find
             no
             better
             maintenance
             for
             them
             ,
             then
             to
             come
             and
             be
             Lecturers
             amongst
             you
             (
             as
             you
             would
             have
             them
             )
             and
             to
             live
             in
             hope
             of
             the
             gifts
             of
             the
             dead
             ;
             that
             is
             no
             good
             provision
             :
             for
             ,
             for
             want
             of
             those
             shooes
             ▪
             men
             may
             goe
             long
             barefooted
             ▪
             seeing
             they
             cannot
             (
             by
             your
             owne
             confession
             )
             doe
             that
             of
             conscience
             till
             there
             be
             a
             Reformation
             .
             But
             you
             might
             rather
             have
             perswaded
             your
             
               Parish
               Priests
            
             to
             have
             bequeathed
             some
             of
             their
             large
             
               revenewes
            
             unto
             them
             :
             for
             whether
             they
             have
             Parsonage
             or
             Vicarage
             their
             
               pole-money
            
             comes
             in
             so
             thicke
             to
             them
             and
             their
             followers
             ,
             that
             it
             would
             make
             any
             sober
             minded
             man
             or
             woman
             to
             wonder
             how
             they
             can
             consume
             it
             :
             for
             besides
             their
             ordinary
             tithes
             or
             maintenance
             ▪
             which
             is
             the
             
               principall
               ,
            
             they
             have
             many
             other
             
               petty
               aues
               ,
            
             which
             they
             require
             of
             every
             one
             of
             the
             
             Kings
             subjects
             ,
             &
             they
             are
             not
             so
             reasonable
             as
             his
             Majestie
             ,
             which
             is
             contended
             with
             
               pole-money
            
             from
             his
             subjects
             ,
             from
             16.
             yeares
             old
             ,
             and
             upward
             ,
             but
             
               they
               will
               have
               a
               share
               out
               of
               him
               that
               is
               borne
               without
               life
            
             (
             as
             it
             will
             plainely
             be
             proved
             )
             for
             if
             a
             dead
             child
             be
             borne
             into
             the
             world
             ,
             they
             will
             be
             paid
             for
             reading
             a
             dirge
             over
             it
             ,
             before
             it
             shall
             be
             laid
             in
             the
             earth
             ,
             and
             they
             will
             be
             apt
             to
             inferre
             ,
             
               that
               that
               their
               deere
               brother
               is
               departed
               in
               the
               faith
               ,
            
             though
             it
             be
             the
             childe
             of
             theeves
             and
             murderers
             ,
             and
             the
             like
             .
          
           
             Further
             ,
             they
             will
             yet
             
               have
               another
               patrimony
               for
               the
               birth
               of
               that
               childe
               ,
            
             for
             before
             the
             mother
             dare
             goe
             abroade
             ,
             shee
             must
             have
             their
             
               blessing
               ;
            
             that
             the
             
               Sun
            
             shall
             not
             smite
             her
             by
             
               day
               ,
            
             nor
             the
             
               Moone
            
             by
             
               night
               ;
            
             for
             which
             
               blessing
            
             of
             theirs
             ,
             they
             must
             have
             an
             
               offering
               ,
            
             and
             the
             like
             they
             require
             for
             all
             the
             children
             that
             be
             borne
             into
             this
             world
             ,
             though
             there
             live
             not
             one
             of
             sixe
             to
             be
             men
             or
             women
             .
          
           
             But
             for
             as
             many
             of
             them
             as
             doe
             live
             ,
             they
             enlarge
             their
             Revenewes
             ,
             for
             ,
             if
             they
             live
             to
             come
             to
             the
             Sacrament
             of
             the
             
               Lords
               Supper
               ,
            
             then
             they
             must
             pay
             their
             offerings
             yearely
             to
             the
             
               Priest
               ,
            
             though
             the
             bread
             and
             wine
             be
             provided
             at
             the
             parishes
             charge
             .
          
           
             Further
             ,
             if
             they
             live
             to
             enter
             into
             the
             state
             of
             
               Matrimon●
               ,
            
             then
             they
             must
             be
             joyned
             together
             by
             a
             
               Priest
               ,
            
             for
             which
             worke
             of
             his
             he
             must
             have
             a
             large
             
               Offering
               .
            
          
           
             And
             these
             men
             be
             not
             content
             to
             take
             money
             where
             there
             is
             money
             (
             as
             the
             King
             is
             )
             but
             they
             will
             have
             these
             (
             which
             they
             call
             
               dues
            
             )
             of
             him
             that
             liveth
             of
             the
             very
             
               almes
            
             of
             the
             
               Parish
               ,
            
             whereas
             the
             King
             taketh
             not
             a
             penny
             of
             any
             that
             receive
             
               almes
               .
            
          
           
             Then
             if
             we
             consider
             their
             
               exa●●ion
            
             how
             they
             oppresse
             the
             people
             ,
             by
             their
             cruell
             forcing
             of
             them
             to
             pay
             so
             much
             as
             they
             demand
             ,
             (
             though
             it
             be
             contrary
             to
             all
             Law
             or
             equity
             )
             it
             will
             cause
             us
             to
             wonder
             at
             the
             hardnesse
             of
             their
             hearts
             for
             rather
             then
             they
             will
             abate
             any
             thing
             of
             what
             they
             demand
             they
             will
             force
             poore
             people
             even
             to
             pawne
             their
             cloathes
             ;
             for
             I
             am
             able
             to
             prove
             that
             they
             doe
             demand
             of
             poore
             people
             before
             they
             can
             have
             a
             childe
             (
             that
             is
             but
             fourteene
             ,
             or
             fifteene
             yeares
             of
             age
             )
             buried
             in
             one
             of
             the
             out-Church-yards
             of
             the
             great
             Parishes
             (
             which
             land
             is
             the
             free
             gift
             of
             the
             dead
             ,
             for
             the
             helpe
             of
             the
             
               poore
               ,
            
             even
             as
             
               Creplegates
            
             new
             Church-yard
             ,
             or
             
               Algat●s
               ,
               Ros●mary
               lane
               ,
            
             or
             
               White
               Chappell
               ;
               Mile-in
               greene
               ,
            
             (
             or
             others
             the
             like
             ;
             )
             before
             (
             I
             say
             )
             they
             can
             have
             such
             a
             child
             buried
             there
             ,
             it
             will
             cost
             the
             
               poorest
               parent
               ,
            
             seven
             or
             eight
             shillings
             :
             Nay
             ,
             I
             have
             knowne
             when
             they
             have
             distrusted
             paiment
             ,
             that
             they
             have
             affirmed
             ,
             that
             
               they
               would
               not
               bury
               them
               ,
               except
               they
               had
               their
               money
               paid
               before
               hand
               :
            
             Nay
             ,
             when
             any
             poore
             man
             bringeth
             out
             of
             the
             remote
             places
             of
             the
             city
             any
             
             Corps
             to
             
               Bedlam
            
             (
             which
             is
             the
             cheapest
             place
             that
             I
             know
             )
             ye
             when
             all
             things
             else
             is
             discharged
             ,
             even
             as
             ,
             
               Bearers
               wages
               ,
               Grave●●●gers
               wages
               ,
            
             and
             the
             ground
             paied
             for
             also
             ;
             yet
             they
             must
             be
             constrained
             to
             have
             a
             twelve-penny
             Priest
             ,
             to
             say
             something
             over
             the
             grave
             ,
             and
             he
             will
             grudge
             if
             he
             have
             not
             more
             than
             a
             snilling
             (
             though
             he
             say
             but
             a
             few
             words
             without
             the
             booke
             )
             when
             (
             perhaps
             )
             all
             the
             people
             that
             be'left
             alive
             in
             the
             Family
             ,
             be
             not
             worth
             a
             
               shilling
               .
            
          
           
             Furthermore
             ,
             If
             any
             poore
             man
             have
             a
             necessitie
             to
             
               worke
               ,
            
             upon
             one
             of
             their
             
               Saints-dayes
               ,
            
             then
             Mr.
             
             
               Paritor
            
             must
             come
             ,
             and
             have
             a
             grote
             ,
             for
             citing
             him
             to
             the
             Court
             ,
             but
             if
             he
             appeare
             not
             ,
             he
             must
             be
             
               Presented
               ,
            
             and
             for
             not
             paying
             
               Fees
               ,
            
             he
             shall
             be
             
               Excommunicated
               ,
            
             and
             he
             shall
             never
             be
             
               blessed
            
             in
             again
             ,
             but
             (
             though
             he
             be
             the
             poorest
             man
             in
             the
             Kingdome
             )
             the
             price
             of
             his
             
               blessing
            
             will
             be
             a
             
               noble
            
             at
             the
             least
             :
             but
             if
             he
             happen
             to
             die
             an
             
               Excommunicant
               ,
            
             then
             his
             friends
             must
             give
             money
             to
             absolve
             him
             after
             he
             is
             dead
             ,
             or
             else
             he
             shall
             not
             be
             buried
             in
             the
             
               consecrated
               Earth
               :
            
             but
             if
             his
             friends
             will
             goe
             to
             the
             
               Office
               ,
            
             and
             give
             but
             a
             matter
             of
             five
             pound
             for
             his
             
               Absolution
               ,
            
             after
             he
             is
             dead
             ;
             then
             he
             shall
             be
             buried
             in
             the
             
               Consecrated
               ground
               ;
            
             and
             they
             will
             also
             affirme
             he
             died
             in
             the
             
               Faith
               of
               Christ
               ,
            
             ye
             though
             he
             were
             excommunicated
             for
             notorious
             sinne
             ,
             and
             lived
             and
             died
             ▪
             obstinately
             in
             it
             .
          
           
             It
             is
             a
             plaine
             case
             therefore
             ,
             that
             these
             men
             are
             a
             greater
             plague
             to
             this
             Land
             ▪
             then
             the
             naturall
             Locusts
             of
             
               Egypt
               ,
               for
               they
               ate
               up
               the
               greene
               things
               ,
            
             but
             these
             eate
             up
             both
             greene
             and
             dry
             .
          
           
             Nay
             ,
             further
             ,
             I
             conceive
             they
             are
             more
             prejudiciall
             to
             the
             Common
             wealth
             ,
             than
             the
             Frogges
             that
             came
             up
             upon
             the
             Land
             of
             
               Egypt
               ,
            
             for
             
               they
               entred
               into
               the
               Oven
               ,
               and
               into
               the
               Kneading
               Trough
               :
            
             and
             wee
             reade
             not
             that
             they
             ascended
             higher
             than
             the
             
               Kings
               bed
               ,
            
             and
             the
             beds
             of
             his
             
               Servants
               ;
            
             but
             these
             are
             exalted
             above
             the
             Chimney
             tops
             ,
             to
             catch
             a
             Smoke-penny
             from
             every
             poore
             mans
             house
             .
          
           
             Thus
             you
             see
             the
             mighty
             
               Revenewes
            
             of
             the
             
               Priests
               :
            
             If
             I
             had
             but
             time
             to
             tell
             you
             of
             the
             things
             which
             I
             know
             (
             even
             of
             the
             extent
             of
             their
             Revenewes
             )
             what
             is
             gained
             unto
             the
             generality
             of
             
               Priests
               ,
            
             by
             granting
             of
             Licenses
             to
             
               Midwives
               ,
            
             and
             to
             
               Schoolemasters
               ,
            
             with
             divers
             of
             their
             own
             Officers
             ,
             such
             as
             Paritors
             ,
             Sumners
             ,
             &
             Pursevants
             ,
             with
             a
             number
             of
             that
             Ranke
             ,
             which
             have
             strange
             names
             that
             I
             know
             not
             ,
             It
             would
             (
             as
             I
             said
             before
             )
             make
             all
             men
             wonder
             ,
             how
             it
             is
             devoured
             ▪
             for
             they
             must
             be
             freed
             from
             all
             taxations
             ,
             and
             have
             their
             houses
             rent
             free
             ,
             and
             many
             times
             eate
             their
             bread
             at
             other
             mens
             tables
             ,
             and
             yet
             (
             for
             the
             most
             part
             )
             they
             die
             
               poore
               men
               ,
            
             and
             farre
             in
             debt
             ,
             and
             leave
             behinde
             
             them
             ,
             both
             wives
             and
             children
             ,
             destitute
             of
             Calling
             and
             Maintenance
             ,
             which
             is
             a
             plaine
             case
             to
             me
             ,
             that
             the
             hand
             of
             God
             is
             upon
             this
             Generation
             ,
             in
             cursing
             that
             which
             they
             would
             have
             blessed
             .
             And
             therfore
             I
             will
             confesse
             that
             I
             was
             overseene
             (
             in
             the
             entrance
             into
             this
             Discourse
             )
             when
             I
             moved
             you
             to
             perswade
             these
             men
             to
             bequeath
             some
             thing
             to
             their
             brethren
             ,
             (
             that
             are
             Schollers
             bred
             ;
             )
             for
             I
             did
             not
             consider
             ,
             that
             though
             they
             received
             much
             ,
             yet
             they
             had
             but
             little
             to
             give
             ,
             because
             it
             is
             not
             blessed
             for
             increase
             :
             but
             I
             should
             rather
             have
             comforted
             you
             ,
             with
             giving
             you
             knowledge
             ,
             that
             God
             hath
             provided
             maintenance
             for
             his
             Ministers
             ;
             as
             well
             as
             for
             his
             People
             ,
             that
             they
             neede
             not
             bow
             to
             you
             for
             a
             morsell
             of
             bread
             ;
             for
             God
             taught
             his
             Apostles
             to
             worke
             with
             their
             hands
             ,
             as
             
               Paul
            
             saith
             ,
             
               that
               his
               hands
               ministred
               to
               his
               necessities
               ,
               and
               those
               that
               were
               with
               him
               ;
               Acts
            
             20.
             34.
             not
             that
             
               Paul
            
             might
             not
             receive
             of
             the
             people
             carnall
             things
             ,
             for
             he
             declareth
             the
             contrary
             in
             another
             Scripture
             ,
             and
             I
             hope
             ,
             all
             the
             Lords
             people
             will
             confesse
             that
             the
             labourer
             is
             worthy
             of
             his
             hire
             ,
             and
             that
             it
             is
             their
             duty
             to
             make
             them
             partakers
             ▪
             of
             their
             
               carnall
               things
               ,
            
             of
             whom
             they
             receive
             
               spirituall
               things
               .
            
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               are
               carefull
               to
               have
               them
               sober
               ,
               and
               peaceable
               ,
               and
               not
               to
               preach
               and
               speake
               against
               what
               is
               established
               by
               Law
            
             
               *
            
          
           
             Indeede
             (
             I
             must
             tell
             you
             )
             in
             my
             judgement
             ,
             no
             man
             can
             make
             way
             for
             a
             true
             Reformation
             ,
             except
             hee
             declare
             what
             is
             evill
             ,
             before
             he
             shew
             what
             is
             good
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               suppose
               subscriptions
               will
               not
               be
               injoyned
               to
               formes
               of
               Government
               and
               Discipline
               .
            
          
           
             Here
             you
             seeme
             to
             yeeld
             that
             your
             formes
             of
             Government
             and
             Discipline
             be
             not
             of
             God
             ;
             then
             if
             there
             be
             no
             
               injunction
               ,
            
             none
             will
             obey
             ,
             but
             if
             
               injunctions
               ,
            
             none
             will
             obey
             for
             conscience
             ;
             for
             what
             good
             man
             can
             yeeld
             to
             an
             
               injuction
            
             that
             is
             not
             of
             God
             ,
             so
             then
             ,
             (
             you
             may
             see
             )
             your
             
               injunctions
            
             have
             beene
             the
             way
             and
             meanes
             to
             breed
             and
             bring
             forth
             a
             world
             of
             
               hypocrites
               ,
            
             as
             one
             may
             easily
             see
             by
             the
             
               Timeservers
            
             of
             your
             
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               without
               a
               toleration
               we
               may
               injoy
               in
               a
               secret
               way
               our
               Church
               fellowship
               .
            
          
           
             Indeede
             (
             M.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             we
             have
             learned
             that
             lesson
             already
             ▪
             for
             Christ
             hath
             taught
             us
             ,
             
               that
               we
               shall
               fly
               into
               the
               Wildernesse
               ,
            
             
               *
            
             and
             that
             
               the
               earth
               shall
               helpe
               us
            
             
               *
            
             but
             sometimes
             it
             proves
             to
             the
             danger
             of
             our
             
               lives
               ,
            
             and
             alwayes
             to
             the
             danger
             of
             our
             
               liberty
               ;
            
             as
             it
             may
             appeare
             by
             the
             practise
             herein
             
               London
               ,
            
             for
             though
             wee
             meete
             never
             so
             privately
             ,
             and
             peaceably
             ,
             yet
             such
             
               Cattle
            
             as
             your selfe
             ▪
             are
             alwayes
             bleeting
             in
             the
             eares
             of
             your
             Parish
             Officers
             ,
             and
             Constables
             ,
             with
             your
             other
             Officers
             ,
             even
             till
             you
             move
             the
             
             Lord
             Major
             himself
             to
             be
             your
             drudge
             ,
             and
             as
             your
             horne
             ,
             which
             you
             push
             forward
             for
             the
             destruction
             of
             our
             
               bodies
               ,
            
             when
             he
             hath
             laid
             violent
             hands
             on
             them
             ,
             for
             it
             is
             evident
             that
             it
             hath
             beene
             to
             the
             losse
             of
             some
             of
             their
             lives
             ;
             and
             this
             is
             the
             liberty
             we
             have
             in
             this
             Kingdome
             and
             all
             through
             the
             instigation
             of
             you
             Priests
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               ,
               though
               some
               of
               the
               more
               sober
               and
               conscientious
               Ministers
               and
               people
               could
               use
               it
               better
               ,
               yet
               the
               Brownists
               and
               Anabaptists
               ,
               and
               weake
               brethren
               would
               be
               apt
               to
               scandall
               :
               and
               therefore
               to
               avoid
               scandall
               ,
               you
               would
               i●si●●ate
               that
               we
               are
               bound
               to
               neglect
               the
               whole
               forme
               of
               Church
               worship
               .
            
          
           
             I
             told
             you
             before
             ,
             and
             I
             tell
             you
             now
             ,
             that
             you
             are
             afraid
             to
             have
             your
             owne
             glory
             ecclipsed
             and
             by
             this
             all
             men
             may
             see
             ,
             (
             and
             by
             all
             your
             formers
             answers
             also
             )
             that
             you
             would
             have
             us
             to
             enjoy
             in
             this
             Kingdome
             ,
             neither
             Ordinances
             ,
             nor
             conscience
             .
          
           
             
               The
               next
               thing
               you
               lay
               downe
               ,
               is
               the
               judgement
               of
               an
               antient
               Father
               ;
            
             But
             indeede
             he
             is
             as
             sound
             in
             the
             faith
             as
             your selfe
             ,
             for
             hee
             would
             have
             men
             to
             joyne
             to
             Churches
             that
             have
             no
             power
             .
             
               *
            
          
           
             And
             this
             being
             the
             sixth
             answer
             that
             you
             have
             given
             to
             their
             third
             reason
             ,
             
               you
               entreat
               them
               to
               lay
               all
               your
               sixe
               together
               ,
               and
               to
               consider
               s●●ly
               ,
               whether
               God
               require
               ,
               unlesse
               they
               have
               a
               toleration
               to
               leave
               the
               Kingdome
               to
               runne
               many
               hazards
               ,
               and
               dangers
               ,
               when
               as
               they
               may
               enjoy
               ,
               so
               much
               at
               home
               ,
               without
               a
               Toleration
               ,
               as
               you
               say
               you
               have
               opened
               to
               these
               sixe
               answers
               .
            
          
           
             To
             ●ch
             I
             answer
             ,
             when
             they
             are
             laid
             all
             six
             together
             ,
             they
             make
             but
             a
             peece
             of
             an
             answer
             to
             one
             of
             their
             Reasons
             ,
             and
             this
             piece
             of
             your
             answer
             is
             stuffed
             full
             of
             
               falicies
               ,
            
             as
             hath
             beene
             already
             proved
             ,
             and
             may
             further
             appeare
             ,
             by
             the
             conclusion
             of
             all
             here
             ,
             when
             you
             say
             they
             may
             have
             so
             much
             at
             home
             ,
             for
             it
             hath
             beene
             proved
             already
             ,
             that
             they
             can
             have
             nothing
             at
             home
             ,
             either
             in
             respect
             of
             liberty
             ,
             or
             worship
             ;
             (
             but
             what
             they
             must
             have
             by
             stealth
             ;
             )
             for
             when
             they
             would
             injoy
             the
             Ordinances
             of
             God
             ,
             which
             are
             
               Iewels
               ,
            
             which
             you
             would
             have
             none
             to
             have
             but
             your selves
             ,
             that
             so
             you
             might
             seeme
             glorious
             ;
             If
             any
             (
             I
             say
             )
             will
             presume
             to
             borow
             the
             
               Iewels
               ,
            
             and
             carry
             them
             away
             ,
             you
             will
             pursue
             after
             them
             ;
             and
             you
             know
             it
             was
             the
             practise
             of
             the
             
               Egyptians
            
             of
             old
             ,
             for
             they
             would
             have
             suffered
             the
             
               Israelites
            
             to
             have
             gone
             away
             empty
             ,
             and
             left
             their
             cattle
             behinde
             them
             ,
             so
             that
             they
             might
             have
             had
             nothing
             with
             them
             to
             have
             offered
             sacrifice
             withall
             ;
             and
             I
             pray
             you
             were
             not
             the
             Southsayers
             the
             cause
             of
             this
             ?
             by
             withstanding
             
               Moses
            
             and
             
               Aaron
               ,
            
             against
             the
             children
             of
             
               Israel
               ,
            
             even
             by
             the
             false
             Figures
             which
             they
             cast
             before
             the
             eyes
             of
             
               Pha●aoh
               ,
            
             to
             harden
             
               Phar●ahs
            
             heart
             ,
             even
             as
             you
             Priests
             doe
             at
             this
             day
             .
          
           
           
             And
             thus
             I
             have
             laid
             together
             your
             sixe
             Reasons
             ,
             and
             weighed
             them
             ;
             but
             one
             truth
             is
             sufficient
             to
             over
             weigh
             them
             all
             .
          
           
             But
             yet
             you
             have
             also
             a
             seventh
             Answer
             which
             is
             by
             it selfe
             :
             and
             it
             is
             this
             ,
             
               That
               if
               they
               will
               not
               be
               satisfied
            
             (
             say
             you
             )
             
               without
               setting
               up
               Churches
               ;
               it
               is
               better
               they
               should
               get
               out
               of
               the
               Kingdome
               .
            
          
           
             Besides
             ,
             you
             would
             have
             all
             others
             that
             be
             of
             this
             minde
             ,
             to
             leave
             the
             Land
             ,
             and
             goe
             to
             
               New-England
               ,
            
             that
             cannot
             be
             satisfied
             ,
             but
             that
             they
             must
             erect
             Churches
             to
             the
             disturbing
             of
             the
             peace
             of
             three
             Kingdomes
             .
          
           
             Truely
             (
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             you
             shew
             your selfe
             a
             bloody
             minded
             man
             ,
             that
             would
             have
             the
             Innocent
             suffer
             for
             the
             faults
             of
             them
             that
             are
             guilty
             .
             Was
             not
             the
             sending
             of
             your
             
               Masse-bookes
            
             into
             
               Scotland
            
             the
             cause
             of
             the
             disturbance
             ?
             and
             hath
             it
             not
             appeared
             plaine
             enough
             to
             the
             
               Parliament
            
             and
             to
             the
             
               Scots
               ,
            
             before
             the
             
               Parliament
            
             sate
             ,
             that
             the
             
               Bishops
            
             and
             
               Priests
            
             were
             the
             cause
             of
             the
             disturbance
             ?
             I
             doubt
             not
             but
             you
             have
             read
             both
             the
             
               Scotish
               Intentions
               ,
            
             and
             their
             
               Demands
               ,
            
             with
             their
             
               Declarations
               ,
            
             which
             have
             plainely
             manifested
             ,
             who
             and
             what
             was
             the
             cause
             of
             the
             
               disturbance
               ,
            
             it
             was
             not
             the
             meeting
             of
             a
             handfull
             of
             the
             Lords
             people
             ,
             which
             ever
             sought
             and
             do
             seeke
             the
             good
             and
             wellfare
             of
             the
             three
             Kingdomes
             ,
             with
             the
             life
             &
             happy
             reigne
             of
             their
             Soveraigne
             
               Lord
            
             the
             
               King
               ,
            
             who
             alwayes
             sue
             unto
             God
             for
             the
             peace
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ,
             in
             whose
             peace
             they
             may
             enjoy
             peace
             :
             but
             contrariwise
             ,
             it
             plainely
             appeares
             ,
             that
             it
             was
             you
             and
             your
             Fathers
             house
             which
             caused
             this
             variance
             .
          
           
             
               But
               say
               you
               ,
               it
               will
               be
               no
               great
               harme
               for
               many
               of
               them
               to
               goe
               away
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             It
             is
             like
             you
             apprehend
             the
             Judgements
             of
             God
             comming
             upon
             you
             ,
             and
             you
             thinke
             to
             be
             eased
             ,
             by
             driving
             out
             the
             Lords
             people
             in
             haste
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               would
               rather
               goe
               to
               the
               uttermost
               parts
               of
               the
               earth
               to
               live
               in
               a
               meane
               and
               hard
               condition
               ,
               rather
               than
               you
               would
               disturbe
               the
               peace
               or
               good
               of
               three
               Kingdomes
               .
            
          
           
             For
             Answer
             ,
             to
             this
             I
             must
             tell
             you
             ,
             I
             would
             you
             had
             considered
             this
             before
             you
             had
             done
             it
             .
             But
             now
             seeing
             God
             of
             his
             mercy
             hath
             reconciled
             them
             againe
             ,
             it
             may
             be
             the
             wisedome
             of
             you
             and
             your
             fellowes
             ,
             to
             depart
             unto
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             that
             Gods
             true
             Religion
             may
             be
             set
             up
             here
             in
             
               England
            
             without
             
               Popish
               Injunctions
               ,
            
             that
             so
             the
             last
             
               errour
            
             be
             not
             worse
             than
             the
             first
             ;
             
               for
               you
               say
               ,
               It
               is
               better
               that
               one
               perish
               than
               Vnity
               ;
            
             therefore
             (
             in
             my
             judgement
             )
             it
             is
             better
             that
             they
             should
             runne
             the
             
               hazard
               ,
            
             who
             have
             occasioned
             the
             
               strife
               .
            
          
           
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               plead
               for
               your selfe
               and
               for
               hundreds
               of
               your
               brethren
               ,
               that
               you
               have
               borne
               the
               brunt
               of
               the
               times
               ,
               and
               yet
               you
               doe
               professe
               that
               you
               will
               submit
               to
               what
               is
               established
               by
               Law
               ,
               because
               you
               hope
               it
               will
               be
               blessed
               and
               glorious
               .
            
          
           
             I
             tell
             you
             ,
             you
             are
             even
             like
             
               Isachers
            
             Asse
             ,
             and
             so
             are
             the
             rest
             of
             your
             fellowes
             ,
             even
             willing
             to
             stoope
             downe
             between
             two
             burdens
             ,
             because
             ease
             is
             good
             :
             for
             the
             Law
             indeede
             makes
             every
             thing
             seeme
             glorious
             ;
             but
             for
             any
             
               brunt
            
             that
             you
             have
             borne
             in
             these
             last
             times
             ;
             I
             thinke
             it
             hath
             not
             over-loaded
             you
             ;
             for
             I
             have
             not
             heard
             that
             you
             have
             beene
             at
             two
             pence
             cost
             ,
             to
             maintaine
             the
             Lords
             people
             in
             prison
             ;
             and
             therefore
             you
             are
             very
             unlike
             to
             
               Obadiah
               ,
            
             for
             instead
             of
             hiding
             of
             the
             Lords
             people
             ,
             you
             cry
             out
             upon
             the
             Parliament
             to
             have
             them
             hunted
             ;
             and
             this
             is
             a
             great
             
               brunt
            
             indeed
             ,
             (
             if
             it
             be
             well
             considered
             )
             and
             it
             is
             doubt
             it
             will
             cost
             you
             
               deare
               ,
            
             (
             by
             that
             time
             you
             have
             paid
             your
             reckoning
             )
             except
             God
             give
             you
             repentance
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               further
               expresse
               ,
               that
               you
               would
               not
               set
               up
               true
               Churches
               against
               a
               true
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             neither
             would
             these
             Independant
             men
             ,
             I
             hope
             ,
             for
             those
             things
             which
             God
             teacheth
             his
             servants
             to
             doe
             ,
             be
             not
             against
             the
             truth
             ,
             but
             for
             the
             truth
             ,
             neither
             can
             they
             be
             any
             cause
             of
             Divisions
             ,
             or
             heart-burnings
             ,
             betweene
             either
             
               Ministers
            
             or
             
               People
               .
            
          
           
             And
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             and
             behold
             ,
             that
             your
             seventh
             Answer
             (
             to
             their
             third
             Reason
             )
             that
             you
             have
             now
             left
             alone
             ,
             is
             a
             
               Noune
               Adjective
            
             in
             respect
             of
             proving
             any
             thing
             that
             you
             brought
             it
             for
             .
          
        
         
           
             YOu
             say
             their
             fourth
             Reason
             is
             ,
             that
             if
             the
             Ministers
             and
             Churches
             be
             not
             tolerated
             ,
             they
             are
             afraid
             that
             in
             time
             they
             shall
             draw
             most
             of
             the
             good
             people
             out
             of
             the
             Land
             after
             them
             .
          
           
             
               And
               for
               answer
               to
               this
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               suppose
               they
               rather
               hope
               than
               feare
               it
               ;
               and
               that
               ,
               (
               say
               you
               )
               plainely
               sheweth
               ,
               they
               have
               a
               good
               conceit
               of
               themselves
               ,
               and
               of
               their
               owne
               way
               .
            
          
           
             For
             answer
             to
             you
             ,
             I
             say
             ,
             that
             this
             your
             Answer
             is
             but
             a
             Supposition
             ,
             neither
             do
             I
             know
             whether
             it
             be
             their
             Reason
             ,
             for
             methinks
             it
             sounds
             somewhat
             like
             
               Nonsense
               ,
            
             but
             your
             Supposition
             will
             not
             prove
             them
             to
             have
             a
             good
             conceit
             of
             themselves
             ,
             neither
             of
             any
             way
             of
             their
             owne
             ;
             for
             it
             is
             the
             way
             of
             the
             
               Lord
               Iesus
               Christ
               ,
            
             that
             they
             plead
             for
             .
          
           
             
               Secondly
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               feare
               too
               ,
               but
               not
               as
               they
               doe
               ,
               but
               your
               feare
               is
               ,
               least
               toleration
               should
               draw
               away
               many
               good
               people
               .
            
          
           
             I
             pray
             you
             trouble
             not
             your selfe
             ,
             too
             much
             ,
             for
             if
             there
             be
             
             no
             toleration
             ,
             the
             good
             people
             will
             flye
             from
             you
             ,
             and
             stand
             a
             farre
             off
             ,
             and
             waite
             for
             the
             Reformation
             which
             you
             have
             all
             this
             while
             promised
             .
          
           
             But
             now
             at
             last
             you
             seeme
             to
             make
             a
             doubt
             of
             any
             Reformation
             at
             all
             ,
             when
             you
             say
             ,
             
               If
               the
               Ceremontes
               and
               Liturgie
               stand
               in
               full
               force
            
             *
             which
             presupposeth
             ,
             that
             you
             conceive
             they
             will
             stand
             
             still
             ;
             but
             no
             doubt
             ,
             but
             if
             they
             be
             setled
             by
             Law
             ,
             they
             will
             seeme
             glorious
             to
             you
             ,
             although
             they
             are
             in
             themselves
             
               Romish
            
             Traditions
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               adde
               ,
               if
               these
               stand
               in
               force
               ,
               and
               Churches
               tolerated
               ,
               they
               will
               make
               brave
               worke
               in
               a
               short
               time
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             you
             are
             so
             fearefull
             least
             the
             Lords
             people
             should
             enter
             into
             the
             citie
             of
             promise
             ,
             that
             it
             is
             very
             like
             you
             never
             intend
             to
             enter
             in
             your selfe
             ;
             and
             that
             makes
             you
             gather
             up
             your
             hopes
             ,
             in
             the
             midst
             of
             all
             your
             feares
             :
             setting
             a
             worke
             your
             confidence
             ,
             that
             God
             will
             preserve
             many
             judicious
             ,
             and
             advised
             Christians
             from
             your
             way
             ;
             and
             therefore
             you
             counsell
             them
             ,
             to
             whom
             you
             speake
             ,
             to
             let
             them
             be
             well
             shipped
             ,
             and
             a
             Reformation
             in
             Government
             and
             Ministers
             ;
             and
             then
             you
             say
             
               your
               feare
               will
               be
               over
               .
            
          
           
             Truely
             methinkes
             you
             patch
             your
             matter
             together
             very
             disorderly
             :
             for
             you
             have
             many
             times
             said
             ,
             that
             upon
             a
             Reformation
             they
             would
             communicate
             with
             you
             .
          
           
             
               But
               now
               you
               would
               have
               them
               well
               shipt
               ,
            
             which
             I
             thinke
             is
             the
             Reformation
             
             which
             you
             desire
             :
             as
             may
             appeare
             by
             the
             confused
             speech
             which
             you
             make
             afterwards
             ;
             for
             you
             say
             ;
             
               When
               there
               is
               a
               Reformation
               amongst
               you
               in
               Government
               and
               Ministers
               ,
               that
               feare
               is
               over
               with
               you
               ;
               and
               your
               Reason
               is
               ,
               because
               when
               that
               which
               first
               bred
               these
               men
            
             
               *
            
             
               is
               taken
               away
               ,
               which
               (
               say
               you
               )
               was
               the
               violent
               pressing
               of
               Ceremonies
               ,
               and
               the
               casting
               out
               of
               good
               Ministers
               ;
               and
               many
               notorious
               persons
               being
               suffered
               in
               the
               Church
               of
               England
               without
               all
               censures
               ,
               shall
               be
               removed
               ;
               many
               (
               say
               you
               )
               will
               not
               be
               bred
               ,
               and
               others
               will
               be
               satisfied
               ,
               and
               some
               godly
               painefull
               Ministers
               of
               the
               Church
               of
               England
               would
               out-preach
               them
               ,
               and
               out-live
               them
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             you
             seemed
             in
             the
             beginning
             of
             your
             Answer
             ,
             to
             make
             them
             proud
             persons
             ,
             or
             conceited
             of
             themselves
             But
             now
             methinkes
             ,
             I
             
               heare
               you
               boast
               very
               much
               of
               your selfe
               ,
               and
               others
               of
               your
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             But
             I
             thinke
             it
             may
             be
             very
             true
             :
             for
             you
             cannot
             chuse
             but
             
               out-preach
               them
               ,
            
             if
             you
             preach
             them
             out
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             .
          
           
             And
             it
             is
             very
             like
             you
             may
             
               out-live
               them
            
             also
             ;
             if
             you
             can
             but
             banish
             them
             into
             some
             hard
             country
             ,
             or
             else
             get
             them
             into
             some
             stinking
             prison
             ,
             as
             you
             and
             the
             rest
             of
             your
             Fathers
             house
             have
             done
             very
             lately
             .
          
           
           
             
               But
               further
               you
               adde
               ,
               that
               you
               and
               your
               fellowes
               ,
               will
               compare
               with
               them
               for
               all
               excellencies
               and
               abilities
               .
            
          
           
             Me
             thinkes
             it
             had
             beene
             more
             credit
             for
             you
             to
             have
             given
             your
             neighbours
             leave
             to
             speake
             .
          
           
             But
             now
             you
             have
             advanced
             your selfe
             ,
             you
             labour
             to
             cast
             them
             downe
             ,
             for
             you
             say
             ,
             
               you
               knew
               many
               of
               them
               long
               before
               they
               fell
               to
               this
               way
               ,
               but
               you
               have
               not
               seene
               any
               of
               them
               better
               ,
               nor
               more
               profitable
               ,
            
             for
             you
             say
             ,
             
               whilst
               they
               were
               in
               the
               Church
               of
               England
               ,
               they
               preached
               often
               ,
               and
               now
               seldome
               .
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             it
             is
             very
             like
             they
             dare
             not
             tell
             such
             as
             you
             when
             they
             preach
             ,
             that
             cry
             out
             to
             the
             
               Parliament
            
             to
             disturbe
             their
             meetings
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               they
               goe
               looser
               in
               their
               apparell
               and
               haire
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             know
             some
             indeede
             that
             have
             beene
             constrained
             to
             change
             their
             
               apparell
            
             for
             feare
             of
             
               persecution
               ,
            
             and
             (
             it
             may
             be
             )
             the
             
               haire
            
             you
             were
             offended
             at
             ,
             might
             be
             some
             
               Perriw●gge
               ,
            
             which
             some
             of
             them
             have
             beene
             constrained
             through
             feare
             to
             put
             on
             ,
             to
             blinde
             the
             eyes
             of
             the
             Bishops
             Blood-hounds
             ,
             when
             they
             have
             come
             to
             take
             them
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               exclaime
               against
               them
               ,
               that
               they
               take
               lesse
               care
               for
               publike
               things
               that
               concerne
               the
               glory
               of
               God
               ,
               and
               the
               salvation
               of
               mens
               soules
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             their
             care
             be
             so
             little
             ,
             you
             may
             wonder
             ,
             what
             makes
             them
             to
             take
             this
             paines
             ,
             and
             care
             ,
             to
             travell
             out
             of
             a
             farre
             countrey
             ,
             to
             sue
             to
             the
             
               Parliament
               ,
            
             by
             humble
             petition
             ,
             for
             freedome
             of
             conscience
             ,
             and
             liberty
             for
             Gods
             publike
             worship
             ,
             which
             are
             things
             most
             concerning
             the
             glory
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             the
             salvation
             of
             mens
             soules
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               accuse
               them
               ,
               that
               their
               spirits
               are
               growne
               narrow
               ,
               like
               their
               Churches
               ,
               and
               that
               they
               grow
               strange
               ,
               reserved
               ,
               and
               subtill
               ;
               further
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               in
               a
               word
               ,
               they
               minde
               little
               else
               ,
               but
               the
               propagation
               of
               their
               Independant
               way
               .
            
          
           
             For
             answer
             whereof
             I
             say
             to
             you
             ,
             that
             it
             is
             no
             marvell
             though
             their
             spirits
             grow
             narrow
             ,
             towards
             such
             an
             Adve●sarie
             as
             your selfe
             ,
             and
             great
             cause
             they
             have
             to
             be
             
               strange
            
             towards
             you
             ,
             and
             
               reserved
            
             and
             
               subtill
            
             also
             .
          
           
             
               But
               whereas
               you
               say
               their
               Churches
               be
               narrow
               :
            
          
           
             I
             say
             they
             are
             even
             like
             the
             way
             to
             
               ●e●v●n
            
             or
             the
             gate
             that
             leadeth
             unto
             life
             ,
             which
             is
             so
             narrow
             ,
             that
             such
             as
             you
             can
             hardly
             enter
             in
             thereat
             .
          
           
             But
             if
             their
             greatest
             care
             be
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             to
             set
             up
             the
             Independant
             way
             
               *
            
             (
             which
             is
             the
             way
             of
             
               God
               :
            
             )
             This
             still
             crosseth
             your
             former
             slander
             of
             them
             ,
             that
             they
             little
             minde
             the
             publike
             good
             ,
             
             and
             salvation
             of
             mens
             soules
             .
             But
             that
             this
             is
             true
             (
             namely
             ,
             that
             they
             minde
             little
             else
             but
             the
             propagation
             of
             their
             Independant
             way
             )
             you
             bring
             the
             
               Protestation
               Protested
            
             to
             witnesse
             ,
             which
             Testimony
             maketh
             them
             peaceable
             men
             ,
             because
             they
             desire
             to
             meddle
             with
             no
             mans
             businesse
             but
             their
             owne
             .
          
           
             And
             if
             they
             minde
             little
             else
             but
             to
             set
             up
             the
             Independant
             way
             ,
             then
             it
             will
             also
             crosse
             your
             following
             speech
             ,
             (
             
               which
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               speak
               from
               your
               conscience
               and
               experience
               )
               that
               never
               any
               of
               them
               ,
               had
               so
               large
               a
               spirit
               for
               good
               ,
               after
               they
               fell
               into
               that
               way
               ,
               nor
               tookesuch
               care
               (
               you
               say
               )
               for
               the
               propagation
               of
               the
               Gospell
               ,
               and
               preaching
               the
               Word
               to
               men
               without
            
          
           
             I
             tell
             you
             ,
             indeede
             if
             they
             did
             not
             take
             care
             to
             preach
             the
             Word
             to
             men
             without
             ,
             they
             would
             never
             come
             to
             preach
             amongst
             you
             ,
             much
             lesse
             would
             they
             then
             sue
             for
             libertie
             so
             to
             doe
             ,
             (
             as
             the
             
               Welsh
            
             Ministers
             have
             done
             )
             if
             they
             had
             not
             a
             desire
             to
             informe
             the
             
               ignorant
               ,
            
             in
             those
             truths
             that
             God
             hath
             revealed
             to
             them
             .
          
           
             And
             therefore
             you
             may
             see
             in
             your
             accusations
             against
             them
             ,
             you
             are
             proved
             a
             very
             
               slanderer
               ,
            
             and
             have
             taken
             upon
             you
             the
             office
             of
             Sathan
             ,
             the
             old
             accuser
             of
             the
             Brethren
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               conceive
               God
               never
               honoured
               them
               so
               much
               afterward
               .
            
          
           
             But
             seeing
             it
             is
             but
             your
             conception
             ,
             it
             matters
             not
             ;
             for
             if
             they
             were
             active
             for
             God
             ,
             and
             did
             famously
             and
             worthily
             before
             they
             entred
             into
             the
             way
             of
             God
             ,
             I
             am
             sure
             they
             could
             not
             but
             be
             more
             active
             afterwards
             ;
             for
             when
             a
             man
             is
             in
             a
             Journey
             (
             especially
             if
             he
             know
             or
             conceive
             himselfe
             to
             be
             out
             of
             the
             way
             )
             he
             goeth
             on
             heavily
             till
             he
             meeteth
             with
             some
             directer
             ,
             either
             to
             informe
             him
             that
             he
             is
             in
             the
             right
             way
             ,
             or
             to
             direct
             him
             how
             he
             shall
             get
             into
             it
             ;
             and
             being
             setled
             in
             his
             right
             way
             ,
             hee
             goeth
             on
             more
             cheerefully
             ,
             and
             actively
             than
             hee
             could
             doe
             in
             the
             time
             of
             his
             doubting
             ;
             even
             so
             it
             must
             needs
             be
             with
             these
             men
             ,
             as
             I
             said
             before
             .
          
           
             
               Againe
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               the
               men
               that
               hold
               those
               principles
               of
               Separation
               ,
               God
               did
               never
               honour
               much
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             it
             seemes
             you
             thinke
             Gods
             thoughts
             are
             as
             your
             thoughts
             ,
             and
             because
             you
             seeke
             for
             the
             praise
             of
             men
             and
             have
             it
             ,
             and
             a
             few
             men
             honour
             them
             :
             and
             because
             
               Christs
               flocke
               is
               a
               little
               flocke
               ▪
            
             therefore
             you
             imagine
             they
             are
             not
             honoured
             of
             God
             ,
             which
             is
             very
             carnall
             reasoning
             .
          
           
             ●
             .
             But
             as
             you
             have
             slandered
             the
             
               men
            
             all
             this
             while
             ;
             so
             now
             you
             here
             slander
             their
             
               way
            
             (
             and
             
               principles
            
             )
             which
             
               way
            
             is
             the
             
               way
            
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             whose
             principles
             are
             Gods
             truthes
             ;
             yet
             (
             you
             say
             )
             
               there
               is
               such
               a
               malignitie
               cleaves
               to
               it
               ,
               even
               as
               doth
               to
               the
               Episcopacie
               .
            
             
             This
             is
             a
             very
             great
             slander
             ,
             to
             compare
             Godswayes
             to
             the
             wayes
             of
             Sathan
             ,
             in
             saying
             there
             is
             such
             a
             malignity
             cleaving
             to
             it
             ,
             which
             alters
             mens
             spirits
             ,
             and
             makes
             their
             hearts
             worse
             ;
             and
             yet
             you
             here
             confesse
             ,
             that
             many
             of
             them
             continue
             good
             in
             the
             maine
             .
          
           
             Thus
             much
             for
             your
             Fourth
             Reason
             .
          
        
         
           
             YOu
             say
             ,
             their
             fifth
             Reason
             is
             ,
             That
             this
             is
             no
             other
             but
             envy
             in
             the
             Ministers
             ,
             that
             makes
             them
             against
             Toleration
             ,
             because
             they
             feare
             their
             people
             will
             desert
             from
             them
             ,
             and
             come
             to
             us
             ,
             being
             so
             pure
             in
             Ordinances
             ,
             and
             Churches
             ;
             and
             thus
             you
             say
             the
             
               Protestation
               Protested
            
             speakes
             .
          
           
             Your
             answer
             to
             this
             Reason
             is
             ,
          
           
             1.
             
             
               That
               it
               is
               not
               out
               of
               envie
               ,
               but
               you
               hold
               their
               practise
               sinfull
               and
               unwarrantable
               to
               separate
               from
               your
               Churches
               ,
               and
               to
               erect
               such
               Congregations
               ,
               and
               therefore
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               speake
               against
               it
               ,
               and
               that
               you
               here
               promise
               to
               make
               good
               in
               a
               following
               Discourse
               .
            
          
           
             For
             answer
             to
             this
             ,
             I
             must
             tell
             you
             ,
             that
             it
             is
             not
             your
             denying
             it
             to
             be
             out
             of
             
               Envie
               ,
            
             that
             will
             cleare
             you
             ,
             for
             there
             is
             nothing
             appeares
             more
             plainer
             ,
             than
             that
             
               envie
            
             against
             the
             
               truth
               ,
            
             and
             the
             Professors
             thereof
             ,
             was
             the
             cause
             of
             your
             writing
             against
             Toleration
             .
          
           
             And
             that
             it
             is
             through
             feare
             your
             people
             will
             desert
             ,
             is
             plaine
             ,
             by
             your
             owne
             confession
             in
             your
             Fourth
             Reason
             ;
             where
             you
             say
             ,
             that
             if
             the
             Liturgie
             ,
             and
             Ceremonies
             ,
             stand
             in
             force
             ,
             and
             Toleration
             be
             granted
             ,
             they
             will
             make
             brave
             worke
             in
             a
             short
             time
             ▪
             and
             yet
             you
             hope
             some
             judicious
             Christians
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             will
             be
             kept
             from
             their
             way
             .
          
           
             
               But
               in
               that
               you
               here
               say
               ,
               you
               hold
               the
               practise
               sinfull
               and
               unwarrantable
            
          
           
             You
             have
             made
             that
             part
             of
             your
             judgement
             knowne
             already
             before
             ;
             but
             your
             judgement
             was
             grounded
             upon
             no
             true
             Principle
             ;
             and
             therefore
             it
             hath
             beene
             already
             proved
             to
             be
             emoneous
             .
          
           
             
               And
               whereas
               you
               say
               ,
               you
               will
               make
               it
               good
               to
               be
               sinfull
               in
               a
               following
               Discourse
               :
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             If
             you
             can
             but
             make
             men
             beleeve
             this
             ,
             you
             will
             worke
             a
             wonder
             .
             But
             I
             know
             it
             is
             impossible
             ,
             for
             you
             to
             make
             good
             your
             promise
             ,
             and
             therefore
             I
             cannot
             expect
             performance
             .
          
           
             Now
             to
             cleare
             your selfe
             .
          
           
             2.
             
             
               You
               say
               ,
               it
               cannot
               be
               counted
               envie
               in
               Ministers
               ,
               to
               be
               unwilling
               to
               have
               their
               flocks
               ,
               and
               people
               fall
               from
               them
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             By
             so
             saying
             ,
             you
             rather
             confirme
             their
             Reason
             than
             remove
             it
             ,
             (
             namely
             )
             that
             it
             was
             your
             feare
             of
             the
             de●erting
             of
             your
             people
             .
          
           
             But
             for
             you
             to
             insinuate
             ,
             that
             the
             people
             that
             be
             called
             out
             of
             a
             way
             of
             
               sinne
               ,
               and
               brought
               into
               the
               way
               of
               grace
               ,
               and
               liberty
               ▪
               be
               stol●●●
               away
               ,
            
             
             
               and
               tempted
               away
               by
               strangers
            
             (
             as
             you
             would
             make
             it
             )
             
               concluding
               that
               it
               is
               as
               tolerable
               for
               children
               to
               forsake
               their
               parents
               ,
               renouncing
               the
               〈◊〉
               that
               bare
               them
               ,
               and
               the
               ●●pp●s
               that
               gave
               them
               sucke
               ▪
               throwing
               dirt
               in
               the
               face
               of
               father
               and
               mother
               ,
               as
               it
               is
               for
               a
               man
               to
               forsake
               Idolatrous
               worship
               ;
            
             this
             is
             an
             unjust
             comparison
             ,
             and
             crosseth
             the
             whole
             tenor
             of
             the
             Scripture
             .
          
           
             Now
             you
             would
             make
             this
             your
             owne
             case
             ,
             for
             you
             allude
             to
             your
             spirituall
             children
             ,
             who
             (
             say
             you
             )
             are
             the
             fruit
             of
             your
             labours
             .
          
           
             I
             pray
             you
             ,
             how
             can
             you
             count
             the
             Parish
             of
             St.
             
             
               Elens
            
             your
             
               spirituall
               children
               ,
            
             seeing
             you
             are
             there
             but
             an
             
               hireling
               ;
            
             and
             as
             you
             have
             not
             begotten
             them
             to
             the
             
               Faith
               ,
            
             so
             you
             have
             not
             taken
             the
             
               charge
            
             of
             them
             ,
             to
             watch
             over
             them
             as
             a
             
               Spirituall
               Father
               ,
            
             and
             you
             will
             onely
             preach
             to
             them
             so
             long
             as
             any
             will
             pay
             you
             wages
             ,
             but
             no
             longer
             ;
             how
             then
             have
             you
             converted
             them
             to
             God
             ?
             from
             what
             have
             you
             converted
             them
             ?
             or
             what
             have
             you
             converted
             them
             too
             ?
             have
             you
             turned
             them
             from
             serving
             dumbe
             Idols
             ,
             to
             serve
             the
             
               living
               God
               ?
            
             I
             have
             heard
             of
             no
             great
             change
             of
             them
             ,
             nor
             of
             any
             other
             where
             you
             have
             preached
             ;
             you
             found
             them
             in
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             and
             you
             found
             them
             Christians
             ,
             (
             in
             your
             owne
             judgement
             )
             and
             you
             know
             they
             were
             
               baptized
               ,
            
             when
             you
             came
             to
             them
             ;
             and
             in
             the
             same
             Church
             where
             you
             found
             them
             ,
             there
             you
             leave
             them
             ;
             I
             pray
             you
             ,
             how
             have
             you
             begotten
             them
             to
             God
             ?
             you
             found
             them
             under
             a
             false
             power
             ,
             submitting
             to
             a
             false
             worship
             ,
             and
             you
             justifie
             them
             as
             men
             begotten
             to
             God
             ,
             and
             you
             justifie
             their
             standing
             there
             .
             Thus
             doe
             you
             sow
             pillowes
             of
             flatteries
             under
             their
             elbowes
             .
          
           
             But
             you
             neede
             not
             to
             feare
             any
             mans
             comming
             to
             steale
             your
             Disciples
             away
             by
             night
             ,
             as
             the
             Jewes
             gave
             out
             falsely
             of
             
               Christs
               naturall
               body
               ,
            
             for
             that
             was
             but
             a
             
               lie
               ;
            
             therefore
             let
             no
             man
             presume
             to
             
               lie
            
             by
             their
             example
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               therefore
               you
               ought
               to
               watch
               against
               us
               ,
               (
               and
               ought
               not
               to
               sleepe
               )
               least
               they
               should
               be
               stolne
            
             
               *
            
             
               away
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             so
             did
             the
             Jewes
             watch
             the
             
               naturall
               body
               of
               Christ
            
             and
             yet
             he
             by
             his
             power
             raised
             himselfe
             ,
             and
             also
             departed
             from
             them
             ;
             even
             so
             by
             the
             same
             power
             will
             he
             raise
             from
             the
             
               death
            
             of
             sinne
             ,
             many
             that
             are
             amongst
             you
             ,
             and
             will
             cause
             them
             to
             separate
             themselves
             from
             your
             
               false
               worshipping
               ,
            
             and
             from
             you
             that
             are
             
               false
               worshippers
               ,
            
             and
             he
             will
             tell
             them
             where
             he
             feedeth
             his
             sheepe
             ,
             and
             causeth
             them
             to
             lie
             downe
             at
             noone
             .
             
               *
            
          
           
             Neither
             can
             you
             cleare
             your selfe
             by
             saying
             ,
             
               you
               ●i●ty
               them
               ,
               and
               love
               them
               ,
               and
               would
               not
               have
               such
               a
               sword
               as
               a
               tolerátion
               put
               into
               their
            
             
             
               hands
            
             (
             as
             you
             are
             pleased
             to
             say
             )
             
               to
               hurt
               them
               ,
               though
               some
               amongst
               them
            
             (
             say
             you
             )
             
               might
               perhaps
               use
               it
               better
               .
            
          
           
             I
             pray
             you
             feare
             not
             this
             ,
             (
             which
             you
             here
             call
             
               an
               error
               on
               the
               right
               hand
            
             )
             but
             rather
             feare
             your
             Church
             ,
             if
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             your
             
               Liturgie
            
             and
             
               Ceremonies
            
             stand
             still
             in
             force
             ,
             which
             (
             you
             say
             )
             
               were
               the
               causes
               that
               bred
               the
               Separates
               .
            
             
               *
            
          
           
             I
             tell
             you
             ,
             if
             the
             sa
             ne
             cause
             remaine
             you
             may
             justly
             feare
             ,
             it
             will
             take
             the
             same
             effect
             ;
             you
             have
             also
             as
             great
             cause
             to
             feare
             the
             prophanenesse
             and
             Atheisme
             ,
             which
             is
             seated
             in
             the
             hearts
             of
             most
             of
             your
             people
             ,
             but
             onely
             that
             you
             blesse
             your selfe
             ,
             in
             
               hope
               that
               all
               ignorant
               and
               scandalous
               persons
               shall
               be
               driven
               out
               .
            
             But
             I
             pray
             you
             tell
             me
             ,
             whither
             doe
             you
             intend
             to
             drive
             them
             ?
             if
             you
             leave
             them
             anywhere
             in
             the
             Land
             ,
             they
             will
             be
             still
             of
             your
             Church
             :
             except
             you
             will
             make
             you
             a
             new
             Church
             :
             But
             if
             you
             should
             drive
             them
             out
             of
             the
             Land
             ,
             you
             would
             leave
             many
             places
             of
             the
             Land
             uninhabited
             ;
             for
             the
             generalitie
             of
             the
             people
             (
             in
             most
             parts
             )
             be
             
               ignorant
               ,
            
             and
             
               prophane
               ;
            
             and
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             your selfe
             in
             a
             great
             streight
             ,
             and
             therfore
             you
             have
             great
             cause
             to
             feare
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               Author
               would
               intimate
               that
               the
               honest
               soules
               are
               with
               them
               ,
               and
               would
               be
               for
               their
               way
               ;
               but
               as
               for
               those
               that
               are
               against
               their
               way
               and
               Toleration
               ,
               they
               are
               not
               such
               honest
               soules
               .
            
          
           
             If
             this
             Author
             be
             the
             
               Protestation
               Protested
               ,
            
             you
             have
             wrested
             his
             words
             ,
             for
             he
             hath
             not
             said
             they
             are
             not
             such
             honest
             soules
             neither
             hath
             he
             entred
             into
             judgement
             against
             any
             .
          
           
             
               But
               further
               ,
               (
               you
               say
               )
               you
               would
               have
               them
               know
               that
               the
               honest
               soules
               are
               not
               onely
               with
               them
               :
               for
               in
               the
               Church
               of
               England
               (
               say
               you
               )
               there
               ever
               have
               beene
               ,
               and
               are
               honest
               Ministers
               and
               people
               ,
               that
               have
               rejected
               our
               way
               ,
               and
               any
               that
               fell
               to
               it
               ,
               nay
               the
               greatest
               Nonconformists
               ,
               and
               most
               able
               in
               that
               way
               (
               you
               say
               )
               have
               written
               the
               most
               against
               our
               way
               ,
               and
               laboured
               upon
               all
               occasions
               to
               preserve
               the
               people
               from
               falling
               to
               us
               .
            
          
           
             For
             answer
             whereof
             ,
             I
             must
             tell
             you
             ,
             that
             the
             
               Ministers
               ,
            
             and
             
               people
               ,
            
             were
             never
             the
             honester
             
               for
               '
               rejecting
               of
               that
               way
               ,
            
             (
             which
             hath
             beene
             proved
             to
             be
             the
             way
             of
             God
             )
             though
             they
             were
             the
             greatest
             
               Nonconformists
            
             in
             the
             world
             :
             for
             it
             is
             not
             our
             way
             properly
             ,
             but
             the
             gift
             of
             the
             Father
             ,
             which
             he
             hath
             given
             us
             ,
             to
             walke
             in
             ;
             and
             surely
             ,
             it
             is
             no
             signe
             of
             honesty
             to
             commend
             the
             Saints
             in
             their
             infirmities
             ,
             or
             to
             condemne
             them
             in
             their
             workes
             of
             pietie
             ;
             I
             say
             ,
             it
             is
             no
             signe
             of
             an
             honest
             soule
             to
             speak
             evill
             of
             such
             a
             holy
             way
             :
             I
             tell
             you
             ,
             I
             take
             
               Hugh
               Latimer
            
             to
             be
             an
             honest
             soule
             ,
             though
             he
             have
             declared
             both
             by
             word
             and
             writing
             against
             such
             as
             you
             ;
             and
             affirmed
             ,
             that
             a
             lay
             man
             fearing
             God
             ,
             is
             much
             more
             fit
             to
             understand
             the
             holy
             Scripture
             ,
             then
             a
             proud
             
             and
             arrogant
             Priest
             ;
             yea
             ,
             then
             the
             Bishop
             himselfe
             be
             hee
             never
             so
             great
             and
             glistering
             in
             all
             his
             pontificalls
             :
             and
             such
             honest
             soules
             (
             though
             they
             are
             not
             of
             the
             Clergie
             ,
             but
             of
             those
             whom
             you
             call
             the
             Layetie
             :
             )
             are
             the
             fittest
             men
             on
             the
             earth
             to
             make
             Churches
             ,
             and
             to
             chuse
             their
             owne
             Ministers
             (
             as
             I
             said
             before
             )
             though
             they
             be
             Trades-men
             ;
             and
             such
             as
             these
             have
             dependancie
             upon
             
               Christ
            
             alone
             ,
             whose
             way
             is
             properly
             the
             sincere
             way
             of
             God
             .
             And
             as
             for
             any
             that
             have
             writ
             against
             this
             way
             (
             or
             against
             those
             who
             walke
             uprightly
             in
             it
             ▪
             )
             it
             will
             not
             make
             much
             for
             their
             account
             ,
             for
             that
             part
             of
             their
             worke
             shall
             burne
             (
             as
             well
             as
             yours
             )
             though
             they
             may
             be
             saved
             :
             and
             as
             for
             these
             Authors
             which
             here
             you
             bring
             ,
             
               which
               have
               beene
               so
               carefull
            
             (
             as
             you
             say
             )
             
               to
               keepe
               the
               people
               from
               falling
               into
               that
               way
               ;
            
             I
             have
             reade
             some
             of
             their
             bookes
             ,
             and
             found
             the
             most
             of
             them
             ,
             prophesie
             sad
             things
             against
             he
             Church
             of
             England
             ,
             except
             she
             repent
             .
          
        
         
           
             THeir
             sixth
             Reason
             (
             you
             say
             )
             is
             ,
             that
             they
             are
             good
             men
             ,
             and
             men
             of
             great
             gifts
             ,
             and
             therefore
             they
             should
             be
             tolerated
             to
             have
             such
             Churches
             ,
             it
             is
             pitty
             they
             should
             leave
             the
             Land
             ,
             and
             wee
             loose
             their
             prayers
             .
          
           
             Indeede
             (
             Mr.
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             this
             may
             be
             some
             other
             ,
             mans
             Reason
             ,
             on
             their
             behalfe
             ,
             but
             I
             hardly
             beleeve
             ,
             that
             they
             lived
             so
             farre
             from
             good
             neighbours
             ,
             that
             they
             must
             thus
             set
             forth
             their
             owne
             praise
             .
          
           
             But
             for
             answer
             to
             this
             Reason
             ,
             in
             the
             first
             place
             ;
             you
             say
             ,
             
               the
               better
               men
               they
               be
               ,
               and
               the
               more
               able
               ,
               the
               worse
               ,
               to
               set
               up
               separated
               Churches
               .
            
          
           
             To
             this
             I
             answer
             ,
             that
             I
             ever
             conceived
             by
             the
             Scripture
             ,
             that
             those
             that
             Christ
             ordained
             ,
             to
             plant
             his
             Churches
             were
             good
             men
             ,
             as
             it
             was
             said
             of
             
               Barnabas
               ,
               that
               he
               was
               a
               good
               man
            
             
               *
            
             and
             the
             very
             like
             was
             said
             of
             
               Stephen
            
             
               *
            
             and
             therefore
             me thinks
             you
             are
             shreudly
             mistaken
             .
          
           
             But
             further
             ,
             you
             say
             ,
             
               they
               will
               the
               more
               indanger
               the
               peace
               of
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               and
               make
               the
               Schismes
               greater
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             If
             it
             be
             good
             and
             able
             men
             that
             indanger
             the
             peace
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             ,
             you
             may
             doe
             well
             to
             perswade
             the
             Parliament
             ,
             to
             keepe
             still
             in
             your
             Church
             ,
             all
             the
             
               dumb
            
             and
             
               drunken
               Priests
               :
            
             for
             they
             are
             bad
             enough
             ,
             and
             unable
             to
             doe
             good
             ,
             and
             yet
             of
             my
             knowledge
             ,
             they
             are
             very
             able
             to
             disturbe
             the
             peace
             ,
             and
             to
             breed
             strife
             ,
             and
             to
             bring
             Gods
             judgements
             upon
             the
             Land
             ,
             which
             is
             able
             to
             make
             a
             greater
             Schisme
             than
             you
             are
             a
             ware
             of
             .
          
           
           
             Secondly
             ,
             you
             say
             ,
             
               for
               their
               prayers
               ,
               you
               have
               the
               benefit
               of
               them
               ,
               as
               well
               when
               they
               are
               absent
               ,
               as
               present
               ,
               and
               some
               of
               them
               have
               sa●
            
             (
             say
             you
             )
             
               they
               prayed
               more
               for
               England
               when
               out
               ,
               of
               it
               than
               in
               it
               .
            
          
           
             Indeede
             if
             they
             did
             so
             ,
             they
             did
             well
             ,
             for
             that
             was
             their
             duty
             ;
             but
             I
             suppose
             you
             (
             for
             your
             particular
             )
             had
             little
             benefit
             of
             those
             prayers
             ,
             and
             that
             ,
             because
             God
             hath
             hardened
             your
             heart
             ,
             even
             against
             them
             ,
             and
             all
             good
             men
             .
          
           
             Thirdly
             ,
             
               For
               these
               their
               prayers
               you
               have
               rewarded
               them
               with
               an
               accusation
               (
               namely
               )
               that
               they
               left
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               when
               it
               was
               in
               greatest
               danger
               ,
               and
               in
               most
               neede
               of
               helpe
               ,
               and
               provided
               for
               themselves
               to
               keepe
               in
               a
               whole
               skinne
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             they
             did
             evill
             in
             it
             ,
             that
             evill
             is
             to
             be
             passed
             by
             ;
             for
             it
             is
             very
             probable
             ,
             that
             they
             did
             know
             that
             the
             
               GREAT
               CANONS
            
             were
             already
             made
             ,
             and
             that
             they
             were
             mightily
             charged
             ,
             and
             overcharged
             ,
             as
             it
             may
             appeare
             by
             their
             shivering
             in
             pieces
             :
             but
             if
             they
             had
             held
             to
             have
             beene
             shot
             off
             ;
             they
             might
             easily
             perceive
             ,
             that
             they
             might
             beate
             holes
             in
             their
             owne
             skins
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             in
             other
             mens
             ,
             and
             they
             seeing
             the
             plague
             before
             hand
             ,
             might
             be
             borne
             with
             to
             hide
             themselves
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               you
               stood
               without
               them
               here
               in
               the
               gappe
               ,
               and
               prevailed
               with
               God
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             It
             may
             be
             conceived
             ,
             that
             they
             prevailed
             with
             God
             ,
             who
             praye
             ▪
             d
             so
             much
             for
             England
             ,
             when
             they
             were
             out
             of
             it
             ,
             
               for
               God
               will
               not
               heare
               sinners
               ,
            
             
               *
            
             therefore
             you
             cannot
             expect
             that
             God
             should
             heare
             you
             ,
             so
             long
             as
             you
             justifie
             the
             abominations
             of
             your
             bespotted
             Church
             ;
             and
             you
             know
             
               Moses
            
             prevailed
             for
             
               Egypt
               ,
            
             when
             he
             was
             out
             of
             the
             city
             .
             *
             
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               it
               is
               better
               to
               want
               their
               company
               ,
               than
               to
               buy
               it
               at
               so
               deare
               a
               rate
               as
               a
               toleration
               ▪
               and
               you
               say
               you
               question
               not
               ,
               but
               the
               King
               donte
               will
               doe
               well
               enough
               without
               them
               .
            
          
           
             Is
             it
             possible
             ,
             that
             you
             should
             enjoy
             the
             benefite
             of
             the
             prayers
             of
             those
             that
             you
             so
             much
             sleight
             ,
             and
             set
             so
             little
             by
             their
             company
             ,
             
               that
               rather
               then
               they
               shall
               have
               liberty
               ,
            
             to
             worship
             God
             in
             a
             peaceable
             way
             (
             by
             your
             will
             )
             
               they
               should
               depart
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
            
             when
             it
             is
             proved
             ,
             by
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             ,
             that
             Gods
             servants
             are
             the
             strength
             &
             glory
             of
             the
             Kingdome
             :
             for
             even
             as
             the
             Prophets
             were
             the
             Charets
             and
             Horsemen
             of
             
               Israel
               ,
            
             so
             are
             they
             that
             feare
             the
             Lord
             ▪
             a
             support
             to
             the
             Kingdome
             and
             Common-wealth
             wherein
             they
             live
             .
          
           
             But
             as
             for
             your
             
               Kingdome
               of
               Priests
               ,
            
             it
             shall
             neither
             stand
             without
             them
             ,
             nor
             with
             them
             ,
             for
             though
             the
             Prophets
             sought
             to
             heale
             
               Babel
               ,
            
             yet
             it
             could
             not
             be
             
             healed
             ,
             for
             your
             hornes
             shall
             be
             knocked
             off
             ;
             and
             methinks
             I
             heare
             the
             decree
             gone
             forth
             ,
             
               that
               your
               Kingdome
               is
               devided
               ,
            
             and
             therefore
             you
             have
             neede
             ,
             to
             set
             downe
             your
             resolution
             ,
             that
             it
             shall
             not
             long
             stand
             ,
             but
             the
             Kingdome
             of
             England
             may
             safely
             stand
             with
             Toleration
             .
          
           
             
               Fourthly
               ,
               you
               say
               for
               this
               Objection
               ▪
               of
               being
               good
               men
               ,
               you
               will
               answer
               it
               at
               large
               in
               another
               Tractate
               ,
               wherein
               (
               you
               say
               )
               you
               shall
               minde
               men
               of
               many
               dangers
               that
               may
               arise
               to
               them
               from
               good
               and
               eminent
               men
               ;
               and
               further
               ,
               you
               say
               you
               will
               fully
               shew
               what
               little
               strength
               is
               in
               that
               Reason
               ,
               and
               cleare
               also
               many
               things
               in
               reference
               to
               that
               Objection
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             when
             I
             see
             this
             performed
             ,
             I
             will
             take
             it
             into
             consideration
             ,
             and
             then
             you
             may
             heare
             more
             of
             my
             minde
             ;
             in
             the
             meane
             while
             ,
             I
             rest
             in
             the
             Scriptures
             ;
             which
             satisfie
             me
             ,
             that
             good
             men
             ever
             bring
             a
             blessing
             .
          
           
             The
             next
             thing
             you
             bring
             is
             this
             question
             (
             namely
             )
             whether
             
             conscientious
             men
             ,
             who
             agree
             with
             you
             in
             the
             maine
             in
             points
             of
             Doctrine
             ,
             and
             practise
             ,
             may
             be
             tolerated
             ,
             and
             spared
             ,
             in
             some
             things
             wherein
             they
             differ
             from
             that
             which
             is
             commonly
             received
             .
          
           
             Indeede
             you
             have
             made
             divers
             answers
             to
             this
             already
             for
             it
             was
             before
             your
             owne
             question
             ,
             in
             some
             of
             your
             Reasons
             alledged
             against
             them
             ,
             where
             you
             affirme
             ,
             
               that
               you
               justifie
               much
               ,
               both
               bearing
               and
               forbearing
               ,
               and
               have
               also
               set
               the
               Counsell
               of
               ancient
               Fathers
               before
               them
               ,
               to
               teach
               them
               to
               heare
               with
               others
               both
               in
               points
               of
               Doctrine
               and
               practise
               ;
               wherein
               they
               may
               something
               differ
               from
               that
               which
               is
               commonly
               received
               .
            
          
           
             
               But
               here
               further
               ,
               you
               adde
               a
               more
               large
               answer
               ,
               That
               you
               still
               say
               it
               is
               your
               judgement
               ▪
               that
               there
               should
               be
               bearing
               in
               many
               differences
               of
               opinions
               and
               practise
               ,
               so
               as
               Christians
               ought
               not
               to
               judge
               nor
               censure
               one
               another
               ,
               nor
               refuse
               communion
               and
               fellowship
               ,
               by
               ●ot
               admitting
               men
               into
               their
               Churches
               ,
               and
               to
               the
               Ordinances
               .
            
          
           
             You
             have
             seemed
             (
             all
             this
             while
             )
             to
             be
             afraid
             least
             they
             should
             admit
             too
             many
             into
             their
             Churches
             ,
             and
             now
             you
             seeme
             to
             say
             ,
             it
             is
             the
             fault
             of
             the
             Independant
             Churches
             to
             deny
             ▪
             communion
             to
             many
             Saints
             ▪
             for
             some
             differences
             in
             judgment
             ,
             about
             Church-Government
             and
             Orders
             .
             Now
             if
             this
             be
             true
             (
             as
             you
             say
             it
             is
             )
             they
             are
             so
             farre
             from
             stealing
             away
             your
             members
             ▪
             that
             they
             will
             not
             receive
             them
             into
             fellowship
             ,
             if
             there
             be
             differences
             in
             judgment
             ,
             
               *
            
             
               for
               which
               you
               here
               seeme
               to
               blame
               them
               ▪
            
             and
             therefore
             I
             think
             you
             would
             have
             them
             open
             the
             mouthes
             of
             their
             Churches
             wider
             ,
             even
             as
             wide
             as
             yours
             .
             But
             the
             Scripture
             hath
             declared
             ,
             that
             the
             gates
             of
             the
             holy
             city
             ,
             are
             
             of
             an
             equall
             widenesse
             ,
             for
             they
             are
             never
             shut
             ,
             
               Rev.
            
             21.
             25.
             and
             yet
             they
             are
             so
             well
             watched
             by
             the
             Angels
             of
             God
             ,
             even
             the
             Ministers
             of
             Christ
             Jesus
             ,
             that
             there
             shall
             be
             no
             uncleane
             thing
             suffered
             to
             enter
             in
             thereat
             ,
             
               &c.
               
            
             
               *
            
             Here
             you
             may
             see
             if
             any
             of
             you
             attempt
             to
             come
             in
             (
             who
             are
             so
             ignorant
             and
             scandalous
             and
             spotted
             (
             as
             you
             say
             they
             be
             )
             they
             shall
             not
             be
             suffered
             amonst
             us
             ;
             for
             indeede
             they
             are
             fit
             for
             no
             society
             ,
             but
             the
             society
             of
             your
             Fathers
             house
             :
             yet
             (
             I
             say
             )
             if
             any
             of
             these
             doe
             creep●
             in
             ,
             it
             is
             through
             the
             neglect
             of
             the
             Portor
             ,
             which
             the
             Lord
             hath
             set
             to
             watch
             ,
             or
             else
             it
             must
             needs
             be
             by
             their
             cunning
             transfiguring
             themselves
             to
             be
             that
             which
             they
             are
             not
             .
          
           
             
               But
               (
               you
               say
               )
               you
               would
               not
               have
               men
               forced
               to
               change
               their
               mindes
               ,
               and
               opinions
               ,
               by
               casting
               them
               violently
               out
               of
               the
               Ministry
               and
               Church
               ,
               which
               (
               you
               say
               )
               was
               the
               practise
               of
               many
               in
               these
               late
               times
               ,
               and
               hath
               caused
               ,
               so
               many
               Schismes
               and
               strifes
               amongst
               you
               .
            
             
          
           
             Well
             ,
             here
             all
             men
             may
             take
             notice
             ,
             
               that
               it
               was
               the
               cruelty
               of
               the
               Clergie
               ,
               that
               caused
               the
               Shismes
               and
               strifes
               ,
               by
               forcing
               men
               to
               change
               their
               mindes
               ,
            
             and
             not
             the
             practise
             of
             the
             Separation
             (
             as
             you
             here
             acknowledge
             )
             therefore
             in
             this
             confession
             you
             have
             crossed
             the
             tenor
             of
             many
             of
             your
             other
             arguments
             ,
             as
             that
             the
             Separates
             have
             caused
             strife
             in
             the
             three
             Kingdomes
             ,
             and
             that
             they
             had
             made
             the
             rents
             and
             Schismes
             ,
             which
             now
             you
             acknowledge
             to
             be
             done
             by
             them
             (
             that
             force
             men
             to
             change
             their
             mindes
             )
             which
             are
             the
             Clergie
             of
             England
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               ,
               that
               you
               approve
               not
               of
               such
               practises
               ,
               but
               desire
               to
               be
               a
               follower
               ,
               and
               lover
               of
               the
               wayes
               of
               peace
               and
               communion
               ,
               with
               any
               who
               agree
               in
               the
               maine
               ,
               and
               have
               something
               of
               God
               and
               Christ
               in
               them
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             you
             approve
             not
             of
             such
             practises
             ,
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             not
             hereafter
             be
             an
             occasion
             to
             move
             Magistrates
             to
             force
             men
             to
             change
             their
             mindes
             ,
             and
             so
             justifie
             your selfe
             in
             that
             you
             condemne
             in
             others
             ,
             for
             you
             confesse
             your selfe
             ,
             
               that
               though
               these
               Independant
               mens
               spirits
               be
               growne
               narrow
            
             (
             even
             closed
             up
             from
             you
             )
             
               yet
               they
               continue
               good
               in
               the
               maine
               ;
            
             
               *
            
             and
             then
             sure
             they
             have
             something
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             of
             Christ
             in
             them
             .
          
           
             
               You
               say
               further
               ,
               that
               the
               practise
               of
               the
               antient
               Fathers
               ,
               that
               pleaded
               for
               bearing
               ,
               are
               infinitely
               pleasing
               to
               you
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             if
             they
             be
             
               infinitely
            
             pleasing
             to
             you
             ,
             I
             hope
             you
             will
             never
             be
             unpleased
             againe
             ,
             with
             any
             of
             the
             Lords
             servants
             ,
             about
             keeping
             of
             dayes
             ,
             which
             you
             say
             was
             the
             diffierence
             betweene
             these
             Fathers
             
               *
            
          
           
             
               Moreover
               ,
               you
               seeme
               to
               inferre
               ,
               that
               because
            
             Siprian
             
               (
               whom
               you
               confesse
               ,
               erred
               in
               the
               point
               of
               rebaptizing
               )
               would
               not
               condemne
               them
               ,
            
             
             
               who
               were
               of
               a
               contrary
               opinion
               :
               that
               therefore
               men
               may
               be
               tolerated
               in
               their
               differences
               of
               opinions
               .
            
          
           
             But
             here
             you
             have
             brought
             an
             erring
             Father
             (
             by
             your
             owne
             confession
             )
             to
             perswade
             us
             to
             keepe
             communion
             with
             those
             that
             are
             contrary
             minded
             ;
             but
             the
             Apostle
             exhorteth
             us
             to
             labour
             to
             
               be
               of
               one
               minde
               ,
               that
               we
               may
               walke
               by
               one
               rule
               ,
               but
               if
               any
               be
               otherwise
               minded
               ,
               we
               ought
               to
               waite
               till
               God
               reveile
               further
               ,
            
             and
             not
             to
             force
             him
             to
             be
             of
             our
             minde
             ,
             till
             he
             hath
             faith
             in
             himselfe
             ,
             grounded
             upon
             the
             Word
             of
             God
             .
             
               But
               that
               ground
               which
               you
               have
               (
               that
               men
               should
               be
               tolerated
               in
               their
               differences
               of
               opinions
               )
               is
               built
               upon
               the
               sayings
               of
               this
               Father
            
             Ciprian
             .
          
           
             But
             presently
             you
             come
             with
             your
             provisall
             ,
             which
             hath
             quite
             altered
             the
             Case
             ,
             your
             provisall
             is
             
               (
               they
               may
               be
               tolerated
               )
               so
               long
               as
               they
               keepe
               communion
               with
               the
               Church
               ,
               and
               submit
               to
               the
               Discipline
               and
               orders
               ,
               and
               be
               peaceable
               ,
               and
               not
               speake
               against
               what
               is
               established
               by
               common
               consent
               nor
               practise
               to
               the
               scandall
               and
               contempt
               of
               the
               Magistrate
               and
               Church
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             this
             is
             but
             even
             a
             crossing
             of
             your
             owne
             speech
             againe
             ,
             for
             this
             constraining
             of
             men
             to
             yeeld
             to
             whatsoever
             is
             established
             by
             common
             consent
             ,
             is
             but
             a
             forcing
             of
             men
             to
             change
             their
             minds
             ;
             
               which
               you
               said
               before
               ,
               was
               the
               cause
               of
               Schismes
               and
               strifes
               ,
            
             and
             though
             you
             approve
             not
             of
             it
             in
             others
             ,
             yet
             (
             it
             seemes
             )
             you
             could
             freely
             practise
             it
             your selfe
             ,
             as
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             by
             what
             you
             speake
             hereafter
             ,
             which
             is
             the
             very
             same
             thing
             which
             you
             have
             often
             spoke
             already
             ;
             that
             is
             ,
             
               If
               a
               few
               men
               (
               halfe
               a
               dozen
               ,
               or
               halfe
               a
               score
               )
               refuse
               communion
               with
               your
               Church
               ,
               and
               vent
               opinions
               every where
               ,
               to
               the
               disturbing
               of
               the
               Kingdome
               ,
               and
               drawing
               disciples
               after
               them
               ,
               though
               they
               were
               Ministers
               of
               gold
               ,
               and
               had
               the
               tongues
               of
               men
               and
               Angels
               ,
               they
               should
               not
               be
               tolerated
               .
            
          
           
             Now
             you
             have
             strucke
             up
             the
             stroke
             ,
             but
             it
             will
             not
             serve
             your
             turne
             ;
             for
             this
             your
             vaine
             insinuation
             (
             
               that
               they
               disturbe
               the
               Kingdome
               and
               draw
               Disciples
               after
               them
               ,
            
             )
             ha●h
             beene
             many
             a
             time
             disproved
             already
             ,
             because
             it
             hath
             beene
             oftentimes
             repeated
             by
             you
             ,
             to
             fill
             up
             your
             matter
             ;
             nay
             your
             owne
             words
             have
             disproved
             your selfe
             ▪
             where
             you
             say
             ,
             
               they
               will
               not
               receive
               them
               into
               fellowship
               except
               they
               be
               of
               their
               mindes
               .
            
             
               *
            
          
           
             
               But
               further
               (
               you
               say
               )
               you
               would
               have
               us
               to
               reade
            
             Calvin
             
               upon
               that
               subject
               ,
               in
               his
               last
               Epistle
               to
            
             Felerius
             :
             
               The
               matter
               you
               say
               is
               this
               ,
               that
               if
               He
               would
               not
               be
               reduced
               into
               order
               ,
               the
               Ministers
               should
               tell
               him
               ,
               that
               he
               is
               not
               to
               be
               accounted
               as
               a
               brother
               ,
               because
               he
               disturbed
               the
               common
               discipline
               .
            
          
           
             What
             the
             Disciscipline
             was
             that
             he
             disturbed
             I
             cannot
             tell
             ,
             but
             you
             say
             it
             was
             a
             Discipline
             that
             was
             common
             ,
             which
             makes
             it
             
             appeare
             to
             mee
             ,
             that
             it
             was
             like
             your
             Booke-worship
             or
             your
             Common
             Prayer-booke
             ,
             which
             is
             
               common
            
             as
             farre
             as
             the
             Pope
             hath
             any
             preheminence
             or
             jurisdiction
             ;
             and
             that
             you
             confesse
             this
             Common
             Discipline
             ,
             was
             not
             the
             Discipline
             of
             God
             ,
             neither
             a
             Discipline
             that
             you
             approve
             of
             ,
             appeares
             by
             your
             owne
             words
             .
          
           
             That
             you
             judge
             it
             not
             of
             God
             ,
             appeares
             here
             in
             your
             following
             words
             ;
             where
             you
             grant
             this
             to
             be
             the
             
               authority
               of
               men
               ,
               and
               that
               it
               is
               not
               to
               be
               sought
               after
               it
               :
               &c.
            
             and
             you
             know
             the
             things
             that
             they
             decreed
             was
             ,
             
               that
               he
               that
               would
               not
               submit
               to
               the
               Synod
               must
               be
               put
               out
               of
               his
               place
               ;
            
             and
             you
             say
             ,
             
               that
               you
               would
               not
               have
               any
               cast
               out
               of
               the
               Ministery
               ,
               or
               Church
               ,
               because
               it
               breedeth
               Schismes
            
             
               *
            
             and
             by
             this
             it
             appeares
             ,
             that
             you
             allow
             not
             of
             this
             manner
             of
             Discipline
             ,
             and
             by
             this
             one
             may
             also
             plainely
             see
             ,
             that
             you
             are
             made
             all
             of
             contradictions
             ,
             as
             it
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             in
             the
             very
             next
             words
             following
             ,
             where
             you
             conclude
             ,
             
               that
               the
               authority
               of
               men
               is
               not
               to
               be
               sought
               ,
               when
               the
               Spirit
               of
               God
               pronounceth
               of
               such
               ,
               &c.
            
             and
             here
             you
             quote
             the
             1
             ▪
             
               Cor.
            
             11.
             19.
             
               where
               you
               would
               make
            
             Paul
             
               an
               author
               of
               casting
               men
               out
               of
               their
               places
               ,
               because
               they
               would
               not
               yeeld
               to
               the
               Synod
               .
            
             I
             pray
             you
             hath
             
               Paul
            
             in
             this
             Chapter
             discoursed
             of
             any
             such
             thing
             ?
             was
             not
             the
             controversie
             here
             about
             long
             haire
             ,
             about
             which
             
               Paul
            
             saith
             the
             Church
             hath
             no
             such
             custome
             of
             contention
             ;
             and
             doth
             not
             
               Paul
            
             himselfe
             put
             the
             thing
             to
             be
             judged
             by
             the
             Church
             ?
             in
             the
             thirteenth
             verse
             ,
             where
             he
             saith
             ,
             
               Iudge
               in
               your selves
               ,
               Is
               it
               comely
               that
               a
               woman
               pray
               unto
               God
               uncovered
               ?
            
             and
             further
             ,
             in
             the
             14th
             ▪
             verse
             ,
             
               Doth
               not
               nature
               it selfe
               teach
               us
               ,
               that
               if
               a
               man
               have
               long
               haire
               it
               is
               a
               shame
               unto
               him
               ?
            
             and
             was
             not
             this
             Doctrine
             grounded
             in
             the
             Law
             and
             Prophets
             ,
             and
             confirmed
             and
             established
             by
             God
             long
             before
             the
             Apostles
             time
             ?
             yes
             surely
             it
             was
             ,
             and
             therefore
             it
             will
             not
             serve
             your
             turne
             ,
             to
             prove
             that
             Synods
             may
             decree
             Customes
             ,
             for
             the
             Church
             of
             God
             ;
             but
             it
             will
             serve
             your
             turne
             to
             prove
             what
             you
             desire
             ,
             that
             is
             ,
             a
             dependancie
             betweene
             
               Rome
            
             and
             
               England
               ,
            
             and
             that
             the
             Bishops
             of
             
               Rome
            
             and
             
               England
            
             by
             their
             Synods
             ,
             should
             make
             all
             their
             shavelings
             to
             crouch
             and
             submit
             ,
             and
             bow
             to
             their
             injunctions
             ;
             for
             your
             owne
             practises
             prove
             it
             ,
             by
             your
             very
             submitting
             ,
             be
             it
             never
             so
             contrary
             to
             the
             Law
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             of
             Nature
             it selfe
             ▪
             if
             it
             be
             but
             confirmed
             by
             a
             Synod
             ;
             and
             therefore
             it
             appeares
             that
             it
             is
             your
             malignity
             of
             spirit
             ,
             which
             causeth
             you
             to
             write
             as
             you
             doe
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               you
               doe
               it
               from
               a
               zeale
               ;
            
          
           
             But
             I
             tell
             you
             ,
             it
             is
             a
             zeale
             against
             Gods
             glory
             and
             the
             good
             of
             his
             Church
             ,
             and
             against
             the
             preservation
             of
             puritie
             of
             Doctrine
             ,
             and
             holinesse
             of
             life
             ,
             even
             at
             the
             best
             like
             unto
             the
             zeale
             
             which
             
               Paul
            
             had
             ,
             before
             hee
             knew
             Christ
             ,
             when
             he
             went
             with
             Letters
             from
             the
             high
             Priest
             ,
             to
             pe●secute
             the
             Church
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             when
             he
             was
             their
             Pursevant
             ,
             to
             enter
             into
             houses
             ,
             and
             to
             hale
             men
             and
             women
             to
             prison
             
               *
            
             if
             
               Paul
            
             should
             have
             said
             for
             himselfe
             ,
             as
             you
             would
             now
             pleade
             for
             your selfe
             ,
             
               that
               peace
               could
               not
               stand
               with
               toleration
               ,
               and
               therefore
               it
               was
               meete
               to
               disturbe
               their
               meetings
               ,
            
             it
             would
             not
             have
             served
             his
             turne
             ,
             for
             if
             God
             had
             not
             stricken
             him
             downe
             in
             the
             way
             he
             should
             never
             have
             seene
             the
             Lord
             Jesus
             (
             but
             to
             his
             confusion
             )
             though
             he
             was
             a
             man
             every
             way
             as
             well
             informed
             as
             your selfe
             .
          
           
             Yea
             ,
             ●e
             might
             have
             pleaded
             as
             well
             as
             you
             ,
             
               that
               he
               did
               it
               not
               out
               of
               passion
               ,
               but
               that
               he
               had
               thoughts
               of
               the
               Church
               way
               before
               ;
            
             for
             you
             may
             know
             that
             
               Paul
            
             was
             a
             member
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             the
             Jewes
             ,
             which
             was
             erected
             by
             God
             ,
             and
             was
             zealous
             for
             the
             Law
             ,
             and
             mighty
             in
             knowledge
             being
             brought
             up
             at
             the
             feete
             of
             
               Gamaliel
               ,
            
             
               *
            
             and
             also
             a
             free
             borne
             
               Roman
               ,
            
             
               *
            
             and
             yet
             he
             neither
             knew
             Christ
             ,
             
               *
            
             nor
             what
             Christ
             would
             have
             him
             to
             doe
             ,
             
               *
            
             but
             hee
             thought
             other
             wayes
             of
             himselfe
             ,
             or
             else
             he
             would
             not
             have
             persecuted
             the
             professors
             of
             the
             truth
             ,
             but
             that
             hee
             imagined
             there
             was
             evill
             in
             the
             practise
             of
             the
             truth
             ;
             even
             as
             you
             say
             
               you
               apprehend
               evill
               in
               the
               practise
               of
               Independancie
               ,
               though
               they
               see
               it
               not
               that
               practise
               it
               ,
               because
               (
               say
               you
               )
               they
               are
               ingaged
               in
               it
               ,
            
             but
             it
             was
             ignorance
             in
             
               Paul
               ,
            
             so
             to
             thinke
             ,
             and
             so
             (
             at
             the
             best
             )
             it
             is
             ignorance
             in
             you
             .
             Therefore
             you
             have
             no
             neede
             to
             say
             ,
             that
             
               you
               see
               more
               evill
               in
               it
               ,
               then
               the
               Independants
               can
               doe
               ,
            
             but
             you
             should
             rather
             have
             said
             you
             seeme
             to
             see
             ,
             for
             you
             cannot
             see
             an
             evill
             where
             none
             is
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               wish
               that
               the
               Independant
               Ministers
               ,
               would
               consider
               what
               hath
               beene
               written
               .
            
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             Indeede
             (
             for
             my
             part
             )
             if
             their
             considerations
             be
             as
             mine
             ,
             and
             though
             they
             consider
             it
             as
             I
             doe
             ,
             without
             partialitie
             ,
             yet
             they
             will
             finde
             nothing
             in
             it
             ,
             to
             perswade
             them
             to
             lay
             aside
             all
             thoughts
             of
             setting
             up
             separated
             Assemblies
             (
             which
             hath
             beene
             plainely
             proved
             to
             be
             the
             way
             of
             God
             )
             much
             lesse
             that
             they
             should
             come
             ,
             and
             grow
             into
             one
             body
             ,
             and
             joyne
             in
             one
             way
             with
             you
             ,
             so
             long
             as
             you
             have
             so
             foule
             a
             body
             (
             
               which
               you
               confesse
               you
               have
            
             )
             and
             your
             way
             so
             contrary
             to
             the
             way
             of
             Christ
             ,
             being
             indeede
             away
             of
             your
             owne
             devising
             .
          
           
             
               And
               touching
               the
               counsell
               of
               Mr
            
             Calvin
             
               to
               this
               purpose
               .
            
          
           
             I
             say
             ,
             If
             he
             should
             counsell
             ,
             as
             you
             counsell
             ,
             it
             would
             be
             to
             me
             but
             a
             as
             blast
             of
             breath
             ;
             for
             we
             are
             to
             take
             the
             councell
             of
             the
             holy
             Ghost
             ,
             by
             the
             mouth
             of
             
               Paul
               ,
            
             which
             
               bids
               us
               follow
               him
               ,
               as
               hee
               followes
               Christ
               .
            
             *
             
          
           
             But
             you
             would
             have
             us
             to
             consider
             ,
             what
             
               Paul
            
             requires
             in
             a
             
             Pastor
             ,
             of
             which
             things
             you
             say
             ,
             this
             is
             not
             the
             least
             ,
             that
             hee
             ought
             not
             to
             be
             selfe-willed
             ;
             that
             is
             (
             say
             you
             )
             to
             be
             adicted
             to
             his
             owne
             proper
             judgement
             .
          
           
             I
             answer
             ,
             I
             have
             considered
             this
             text
             already
             ,
             and
             doe
             conceive
             ,
             that
             this
             rule
             of
             
               Paul
            
             is
             broken
             by
             the
             Pope
             of
             
               Rome
               ,
            
             and
             the
             Popes
             of
             
               England
               ,
            
             which
             are
             adicted
             to
             their
             owne
             wills
             ,
             and
             set
             up
             their
             own
             proper
             judgements
             for
             a
             Law
             ;
             which
             evill
             and
             error
             
               Paul
            
             saw
             in
             his
             time
             ,
             when
             he
             said
             ,
             
               the
               mystery
               of
               iniquitie
               began
               then
               to
               worke
               .
            
             *
             
          
           
             Moreover
             ,
             I
             do
             acknowledge
             that
             
               it
               is
               a
               vertue
               in
               a
               go●d
               Pastor
               from
               his
               heart
               to
               feare
               contentions
               ,
               and
               not
               to
               differ
               from
               his
               brethren
               ,
               ●nlesse
               it
               ●e
               in
               cases
               greatly
               necessary
               ,
            
             but
             what
             is
             all
             this
             which
             you
             have
             said
             to
             the
             matter
             in
             hand
             ,
             you
             know
             
               Paul
            
             spake
             to
             the
             Churches
             planted
             in
             the
             order
             of
             Christs
             Gospell
             ,
             and
             not
             by
             the
             order
             of
             the
             man
             of
             Sin
             ,
             and
             therefore
             it
             will
             not
             help
             you
             to
             call
             them
             againe
             ,
             to
             consider
             what
             they
             may
             enjoy
             in
             your
             Church
             ,
             for
             I
             have
             proved
             it
             plainely
             before
             in
             my
             reply
             to
             your
             Answer
             to
             their
             third
             Reason
             ,
             that
             a
             Saint
             of
             God
             can
             injoy
             no
             thing
             in
             your
             Church
             without
             sinne
             ,
             and
             therefore
             what
             you
             thinke
             you
             have
             shewed
             before
             in
             your
             three
             first
             Reasons
             is
             nothing
             at
             all
             ;
             for
             though
             you
             say
             it
             is
             but
             some
             circumstances
             that
             be
             wanting
             ,
             about
             the
             manner
             and
             forme
             of
             Discipline
             .
             I
             tell
             you
             you
             want
             the
             substance
             ,
             even
             Christ
             to
             be
             the
             head
             of
             your
             Churche
             ,
             and
             have
             made
             you
             a
             head
             of
             Archbishops
             and
             Lord
             Bishops
             ,
             which
             head
             is
             full
             of
             leprosie
             .
          
           
             But
             here
             you
             have
             brought
             Mr.
             
               Calvin
            
             to
             crosse
             you
             shrewdly
             ,
             and
             you
             would
             have
             us
             to
             beleeve
             him
             ;
             and
             indeed
             with
             my
             heart
             I
             beleeve
             it
             ,
             whether
             Mr.
             
               Calvin
            
             speake
             it
             or
             no
             ;
             you
             say
             he
             affirmes
             that
             the
             Scriptures
             expresse
             the
             substance
             of
             discipline
             ;
             this
             is
             very
             true
             ;
             but
             in
             another
             place
             you
             say
             ,
             that
             
               Calvin
            
             said
             ,
             there
             is
             no
             expresse
             precept
             concerning
             this
             matter
             :
             
             And
             the
             like
             you
             rehearse
             presently
             in
             your
             next
             words
             for
             you
             say
             he
             affirmeth
             ,
             that
             
               the
               forme
               of
               exercising
               it
               ,
               must
               be
               ordained
               by
               the
               Ministers
               for
               edification
               ,
               because
               it
               is
               not
               prescribed
               by
               the
               Lord
               .
            
          
           
             Doth
             not
             
               Clavin
            
             and
             you
             both
             crosse
             your selves
             here
             ?
             hath
             Christ
             indeede
             written
             in
             his
             Word
             the
             substance
             of
             Discipline
             and
             not
             the
             forme
             ?
             you
             would
             make
             (
             indeed
             )
             the
             substance
             of
             discipline
             without
             forme
             ,
             and
             voide
             ,
             even
             as
             the
             earth
             it selfe
             was
             ,
             when
             darkenes
             was
             upon
             the
             face
             of
             the
             deepe
             :
             so
             you
             would
             have
             men
             conceive
             there
             is
             a
             substance
             ,
             but
             they
             must
             have
             no
             rule
             to
             know
             where
             to
             finde
             it
             ;
             
               for
               you
               say
               ,
               the
               forme
               of
               exercising
               it
               ,
               is
               not
               prescribed
               .
            
             Here
             you
             would
             make
             Christ
             wanting
             to
             his
             
             owne
             house
             ,
             for
             we
             know
             that
             
               Moses
            
             had
             the
             forme
             of
             the
             house
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             the
             substance
             of
             the
             house
             ,
             and
             the
             forme
             of
             every
             Ordinance
             ,
             with
             every
             ,
             circumstance
             that
             was
             to
             be
             used
             ,
             in
             and
             about
             Gods
             worship
             ,
             and
             the
             forme
             was
             given
             unto
             
               Moses
            
             by
             God
             himselfe
             and
             
               Moses
            
             had
             not
             power
             to
             alter
             any
             thing
             in
             the
             forme
             ,
             neither
             had
             any
             of
             the
             Ministers
             which
             came
             after
             him
             :
             but
             the
             wicked
             Priests
             did
             alter
             the
             forme
             ,
             and
             Apostated
             from
             the
             truth
             of
             those
             Ordinances
             taught
             by
             
               Moses
               ;
            
             even
             so
             the
             wicked
             Antichristians
             apostated
             from
             the
             forme
             of
             wholsome
             words
             given
             by
             
               Paul
               ,
            
             which
             was
             to
             follow
             him
             as
             he
             followed
             Christ
             .
          
           
             And
             also
             from
             the
             rule
             of
             our
             Saviour
             Christ
             given
             to
             all
             his
             Apostles
             ,
             that
             they
             should
             teach
             the
             people
             what
             he
             commanded
             them
             ,
             (
             
               Matth
               ▪
            
             28.
             20.
             )
             And
             this
             (
             you
             may
             see
             )
             was
             not
             onely
             in
             substance
             but
             in
             forme
             also
             ,
             for
             
               Paul
            
             expresseth
             to
             the
             
               Corinthims
               ,
            
             the
             very
             forme
             of
             breaking
             of
             bread
             ,
             which
             he
             had
             received
             of
             the
             Lord
             Jesus
             ;
             
               *
            
             and
             by
             this
             you
             may
             see
             you
             have
             given
             the
             holy
             Ghost
             the
             lie
             ,
             even
             as
             
               Calvin
            
             also
             ,
             affirming
             ,
             
               that
               the
               forme
               of
               exercising
               it
               ,
               is
               not
               presribed
               by
               the
               Lord
               ;
            
             and
             therefore
             I
             would
             have
             you
             ▪
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             to
             take
             the
             Counsell
             your selfe
             ,
             that
             you
             give
             unto
             others
             ,
             for
             it
             is
             very
             good
             counsell
             .
          
           
             First
             ,
             that
             you
             
               please
               not
               your selfe
               in
               your
               owne
               Opinions
               .
            
          
           
             Secondly
             ,
             that
             you
             
               be
               not
               so
               adicted
               to
               your
               owne
               judgement
               ,
            
             but
             remember
             the
             danger
             that
             
               Calvin
            
             laies
             downe
             here
             ,
             that
             a
             man
             being
             wedded
             to
             his
             owne
             Judgement
             ,
             so
             soone
             as
             ever
             an
             Ocation
             offers
             it self
             ,
             will
             be
             a
             Schismaticke
             ;
             and
             I
             have
             told
             you
             already
             ,
             that
             this
             was
             the
             first
             occasion
             of
             Schisme
             and
             Apostacie
             ,
             from
             the
             truth
             of
             the
             Gospels
             worship
             ,
             that
             being
             darke
             in
             their
             mindes
             ,
             and
             judgeing
             the
             substance
             of
             Gods
             worship
             to
             be
             without
             forme
             ;
             and
             as
             they
             them selves
             (
             so
             presuming
             )
             tooke
             upon
             them
             to
             prescribe
             a
             forme
             themselves
             ,
             so
             they
             being
             wedded
             to
             their
             owne
             judgement
             ,
             did
             Schisme
             from
             the
             truth
             of
             the
             Scripture
             .
          
           
             
               Thus
               you
               say
               you
               have
               delivered
               your
               owne
               soule
               .
            
          
           
             But
             to
             whom
             ,
             or
             from
             what
             you
             have
             delivered
             it
             ,
             I
             cannot
             tell
             .
          
           
             
               But
               you
               say
               further
               :
               you
               hope
               the
               brethren
               ,
               will
               withdraw
               their
               petitions
               ,
               that
               they
               may
               not
               be
               reade
               in
               the
               honourable
               house
               of
               Commons
               ,
               but
               ,
               if
               they
               should
               be
               read
               (
               you
               say
               )
               you
               hope
               the
               House
               will
               cast
               them
               out
               .
            
             
               *
            
          
           
             I
             Answer
             ,
             That
             they
             should
             withdraw
             their
             Petitions
             ,
             is
             but
             one
             of
             your
             vaine
             hopes
             ,
             for
             they
             had
             more
             neede
             now
             to
             petion
             then
             ever
             they
             had
             ,
             both
             to
             God
             and
             men
             ▪
             seeing
             such
             a
             
             
               Goliah
            
             as
             you
             ,
             musters
             up
             so
             many
             forces
             against
             them
             .
          
           
             But
             the
             later
             of
             these
             your
             vaine
             hopes
             ,
             doth
             manifest
             the
             
               malice
            
             of
             your
             heart
             ,
             in
             that
             
               you
               hope
               the
               house
               will
               cast
               their
               pe●itions
               out
               ?
            
          
           
             Are
             you
             so
             void
             of
             true
             piety
             towards
             that
             Honourable
             House
             ?
             or
             judge
             you
             that
             House
             so
             void
             of
             common
             Reason
             ?
             being
             as
             they
             are
             indeede
             the
             very
             Eyes
             of
             the
             whole
             land
             ;
             the
             Eares
             of
             the
             whole
             land
             ,
             and
             the
             Tongue
             of
             the
             whole
             land
             ;
             yea
             the
             hand
             and
             power
             of
             the
             whole
             land
             :
             being
             so
             as
             I
             conceive
             in
             my
             simplicity
             ,
             would
             you
             have
             them
             ,
             I
             say
             to
             be
             blinde
             of
             one
             eye
             ?
             and
             to
             looke
             upon
             the
             Petitions
             and
             complaints
             of
             some
             of
             the
             people
             of
             the
             land
             ,
             and
             not
             upon
             all
             ?
             would
             you
             have
             them
             so
             partiall
             ?
             would
             you
             have
             them
             also
             deafe
             of
             one
             ●are
             ?
             that
             they
             should
             not
             hearken
             to
             the
             cries
             and
             petitions
             ,
             and
             complaints
             of
             all
             the
             Kings
             subjects
             ,
             one
             as
             well
             as
             another
             ?
             would
             you
             have
             them
             also
             so
             defective
             in
             their
             tongue
             ,
             that
             they
             should
             not
             be
             for
             the
             praise
             of
             them
             that
             doe
             well
             ,
             as
             well
             as
             for
             the
             punishment
             of
             evill
             doers
             ?
             nay
             ,
             seeing
             they
             are
             called
             Gods
             ,
             
               *
            
             would
             you
             have
             their
             hands
             so
             shortned
             ,
             that
             they
             should
             not
             once
             stretch
             them
             forth
             ,
             to
             support
             and
             helpe
             the
             poore
             afflicted
             members
             of
             Jesus
             Christ
             ?
             Then
             indeede
             you
             would
             have
             them
             very
             unlike
             unto
             
               Moses
               ,
            
             even
             as
             unlike
             as
             your selves
             are
             unto
             
               Aaron
               .
            
          
           
             Would
             you
             have
             this
             House
             to
             exercise
             their
             power
             upon
             persons
             before
             they
             have
             made
             due
             triall
             of
             the
             cause
             ?
             (
             by
             hearing
             witnesses
             speake
             on
             both
             sides
             :
             truely
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             if
             you
             would
             (
             as
             it
             appeareth
             plaine
             it
             is
             your
             minde
             ,
             )
             then
             I
             will
             submit
             to
             the
             judgement
             of
             both
             the
             Houses
             of
             
               Parliament
               ,
            
             whether
             you
             be
             not
             a
             man
             void
             of
             common
             Reason
             ;
             for
             he
             is
             a
             
               foole
            
             that
             judgeth
             a
             matter
             before
             he
             know
             it
             .
          
           
             And
             you
             are
             not
             onely
             void
             of
             Reason
             your selfe
             ,
             but
             you
             would
             have
             the
             
               Parliament
            
             to
             be
             like
             you
             ;
             for
             if
             the
             
               Parliament
            
             should
             judge
             a
             man
             before
             they
             heare
             his
             cause
             ,
             they
             would
             be
             like
             the
             Court
             at
             
               Lambeth
               ,
            
             which
             were
             used
             to
             sit
             in
             the
             high
             Priests
             Hall
             ,
             judgeing
             matters
             without
             due
             triall
             .
          
           
             
               Further
               ,
               you
               say
               you
               are
               perswaded
               ,
               that
               it
               will
               never
               be
               said
               of
               this
               Parliament
               ,
               that
               they
               opened
               a
               doore
               for
               Toleration
               .
            
          
           
             For
             Answer
             to
             this
             ,
             I
             must
             tell
             you
             ,
             that
             I
             conceive
             ,
             they
             may
             receive
             a
             Petition
             ,
             and
             yet
             not
             open
             a
             doore
             for
             Toleration
             ;
             I
             meane
             for
             such
             a
             Toleration
             as
             you
             here
             speake
             of
             ,
             
               for
               setting
               up
               Churches
               against
               Churches
               ,
            
             for
             that
             is
             not
             the
             Toleration
             that
             we
             pleade
             for
             ,
             but
             your
             evill
             conclusion
             .
          
           
             
               And
               therefore
               you
               may
               pray
               ,
               if
               you
               will
               ,
               that
               that
               doore
               may
               be
               kept
               shut
               .
            
          
           
             And
             we
             will
             pray
             also
             that
             all
             doores
             may
             be
             kept
             shut
             ,
             that
             
             will
             let
             any
             evills
             into
             the
             Kingdome
             in
             processe
             of
             time
             ,
             least
             that
             any
             succeeding
             generations
             ,
             should
             have
             cause
             to
             write
             in
             their
             Chronicles
             of
             this
             
               Parliament
               ,
            
             as
             it
             was
             written
             of
             
               Naaman
            
             the
             
               Syrian
               ;
            
             that
             is
             (
             as
             you
             say
             ,
             (
             it
             will
             be
             said
             of
             them
             )
             
               but
               they
               granted
               a
               Toleration
               .
            
          
           
             Moreover
             ,
             we
             desire
             nothing
             at
             their
             hands
             ,
             
               that
               may
               cast
               a
               darke
               shadow
               upon
               their
               glorious
               light
               .
            
          
           
             But
             that
             which
             we
             desire
             ,
             is
             liberty
             of
             conscience
             to
             practise
             Gods
             true
             worship
             in
             the
             land
             wherein
             we
             were
             borne
             ,
             which
             will
             be
             no
             blemish
             to
             any
             Christian
             Magistrate
             to
             grant
             ,
             
               nor
               for
               any
               Counsell
               of
               state
               to
               establish
               .
            
          
           
             And
             therefore
             you
             should
             not
             have
             concluded
             this
             your
             Discourse
             against
             
               independancie
               ,
            
             and
             against
             
               Toleration
               ,
            
             before
             you
             had
             offered
             it
             to
             the
             triall
             before
             some
             lawfull
             Committee
             chosen
             by
             the
             
               Parliament
               ,
            
             to
             heare
             both
             you
             and
             them
             ;
             and
             then
             if
             you
             could
             have
             maintained
             your
             
               Churche
               of
               England
            
             (
             which
             you
             plead
             for
             )
             with
             your
             Synods
             ,
             and
             Counsells
             ,
             Ceremonies
             ,
             and
             Booke-worship
             ,
             Canons
             ,
             and
             Sensures
             ,
             Citations
             ,
             Degradations
             ,
             and
             Excommunications
             ,
             with
             your
             Absolutions
             ,
             to
             be
             founded
             upon
             the
             substance
             of
             that
             Worship
             and
             Discipline
             ,
             which
             you
             say
             
               Calvin
            
             affirmeth
             ,
             is
             expressed
             in
             the
             Scriptures
             ▪
             then
             you
             might
             with
             the
             more
             shew
             of
             honesty
             have
             admoninished
             the
             
               Parliament
               ,
            
             to
             have
             cast
             out
             their
             Petitions
             ,
             but
             till
             then
             you
             may
             lay
             your
             hand
             upon
             your
             mouth
             ,
             and
             never
             for
             shame
             affirme
             ,
             that
             
               the
               granting
               of
               Toleration
               unto
               us
            
             (
             to
             worship
             God
             ,
             without
             molestation
             )
             
               will
               be
               setting
               up
               Churches
               against
               Churches
               .
            
          
           
             Neither
             ought
             you
             to
             have
             concluded
             against
             them
             ▪
             before
             you
             had
             proved
             their
             way
             of
             worship
             to
             be
             contrary
             to
             the
             word
             of
             God
             ,
             or
             not
             to
             have
             footing
             in
             his
             word
             (
             as
             yours
             hath
             not
             )
             for
             except
             you
             had
             done
             this
             ,
             you
             have
             small
             cause
             to
             rejoyce
             in
             your
             thoughts
             ,
             
               in
               respect
               of
               the
               accounts
               that
               you
               are
               to
               give
               about
               this
               coutraversie
               ;
            
             for
             your
             contraversie
             can
             be
             conceived
             at
             the
             best
             ,
             to
             be
             but
             ▪
             the
             
               contraversie
            
             that
             
               Paul
            
             had
             ,
             when
             he
             went
             unto
             
               Damascus
            
             which
             was
             a
             
               Contraversie
            
             against
             
               Christ
            
             
               *
            
             though
             
               Christ
            
             in
             his
             rich
             grace
             pardoned
             him
             ,
             when
             hee
             had
             smitten
             him
             downe
             ,
             and
             driven
             him
             out
             of
             himselfe
             ▪
             and
             made
             him
             to
             confesse
             ,
             that
             he
             knew
             not
             
               Christ
               ,
            
             in
             these
             words
             (
             where
             hee
             saith
             ,
             )
             
               LORD
               WHO
               ART
               THOV
               ▪
            
             and
             further
             acknowledged
             that
             he
             knew
             not
             the
             will
             of
             Christ
             ?
             by
             asking
             him
             (
             with
             these
             words
             )
             
               WHAT
               WILT
               THOV
               HAVE
               ME
               TO
               DOE
               ?
            
             thus
             you
             may
             see
             ,
             though
             the
             controversie
             was
             against
             
               Christ
               ,
            
             yet
             
               Paul
            
             was
             reconciled
             to
             God
             the
             Father
             ,
             by
             
               Iesus
               Christ
            
             
             the
             
               Sonne
               ,
            
             and
             endued
             with
             the
             
               holy
               Ghost
               ,
            
             which
             made
             him
             a
             
               Minister
            
             of
             the
             
               New
               Testament
               ,
            
             which
             all
             his
             
               humane
               learning
            
             could
             not
             doe
             .
          
           
             And
             
               Paul
               might
               have
               boasted
            
             that
             he
             was
             stirred
             up
             by
             the
             Spirit
             of
             God
             ,
             against
             the
             way
             of
             Christ
             ,
             
               as
               you
               boast
               ,
               that
               you
               are
               stirred
               up
               by
               Gods
               Spirit
               against
               the
               way
               of
               Separation
               .
            
             But
             that
             would
             not
             have
             justified
             
               Paul
               ,
               much
               lesse
               shall
               it
               justifie
               you
               ;
            
             for
             
               Paul
            
             did
             that
             hee
             did
             out
             of
             a
             zeale
             to
             maintaine
             the
             Law
             of
             God
             .
             
               But
               yours
               is
               to
               maintaine
               the
               Law
               of
               Sinne
               ,
               even
               the
               Law
               of
               Sathan
               .
               Paul
            
             persecuted
             those
             that
             he
             did
             conceive
             to
             be
             evill
             ;
             
               but
               you
               persecute
               those
               that
               you
               acknowledge
               good
               men
               ,
               and
               such
               as
               have
               beene
               active
               and
               famous
               for
               God
               .
            
          
           
             And
             therefore
             you
             have
             no
             neede
             to
             boast
             of
             the
             Spirits
             enabling
             you
             all
             along
             ,
             and
             that
             above
             your
             owne
             strength
             (
             as
             you
             declare
             )
             for
             it
             may
             plainely
             appeare
             (
             unto
             all
             men
             of
             understanding
             )
             that
             it
             was
             the
             very
             spirit
             of
             delusion
             .
          
           
             And
             therefore
             ,
             you
             may
             justly
             expect
             
               Censures
               and
               Reproaches
            
             (
             as
             you
             say
             you
             doe
             )
             because
             your
             way
             in
             this
             action
             was
             not
             pleasing
             to
             God
             .
          
           
             But
             for
             my
             part
             ,
             instead
             of
             censuring
             you
             ,
             I
             would
             rather
             reprove
             you
             ;
             and
             admonish
             you
             ,
             rather
             than
             reproach
             you
             ,
             and
             
               pray
               that
               God
               might
               turne
               you
               .
            
             And
             if
             God
             would
             be
             pleased
             to
             give
             you
             that
             reward
             of
             your
             labour
             ,
             which
             hee
             gave
             unto
             
               Paul
               ,
               even
               to
               strike
               you
               downe
               ,
               and
               to
               make
               you
               to
               heare
               his
               voyce
               ,
               and
               learne
               to
               know
               him
               ,
               and
               what
               he
               would
               have
               you
               to
               doe
               ;
            
             then
             it
             would
             turne
             much
             to
             the
             praise
             of
             God
             ,
             and
             to
             the
             comfort
             of
             your
             poore
             soule
             ,
             if
             you
             be
             a
             chosen
             vessell
             unto
             him
             ,
             (
             
               which
               is
               the
               thing
               you
               pretend
               you
               aime
               at
            
             )
             and
             then
             you
             shall
             be
             sure
             to
             gaine
             
               truth
               ,
               and
               love
               and
               peace
               ,
               and
               holinesse
               in
               all
               your
               after
               discourses
               ,
            
             when
             you
             shall
             speake
             with
             a
             new
             tongue
             ,
             and
             expresse
             the
             language
             of
             
               Canaan
               .
            
          
           
             And
             now
             (
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
            
             )
             for
             conclusion
             of
             the
             whole
             ,
             I
             doe
             here
             affirme
             ,
             that
             if
             upon
             the
             sight
             of
             this
             Booke
             ,
             you
             shall
             conceive
             that
             I
             have
             either
             misconstrued
             your
             words
             ,
             or
             accused
             you
             without
             ground
             (
             necessarily
             drawne
             from
             your
             owne
             speeches
             )
             or
             that
             I
             have
             mistaken
             the
             sence
             of
             any
             Scripture
             ,
             that
             I
             have
             quoted
             in
             this
             Booke
             ▪
             or
             that
             I
             have
             not
             answered
             you
             directly
             to
             the
             point
             (
             by
             any
             oversight
             )
             Then
             chuse
             you
             sixe
             men
             ,
             (
             or
             more
             ,
             if
             you
             please
             )
             and
             I
             will
             chuse
             as
             many
             ,
             and
             if
             you
             will
             we
             will
             agree
             upon
             a
             Moderator
             ;
             and
             trie
             it
             out
             in
             a
             faire
             discourse
             ,
             &
             peradventure
             save
             you
             a
             labour
             from
             publishing
             your
             large
             Tractates
             ,
             which
             you
             say
             you
             intend
             to
             put
             out
             in
             Print
             against
             the
             whole
             way
             of
             Separation
             ;
             and
             if
             it
             can
             be
             made
             appeare
             
             that
             (
             in
             any
             of
             these
             particulars
             )
             I
             have
             missed
             it
             ,
             I
             will
             willingly
             submit
             ,
             But
             if
             you
             overcome
             me
             ,
             your
             conquest
             will
             not
             be
             great
             ,
             for
             I
             am
             a
             poore
             worme
             ,
             and
             unmeete
             to
             deale
             with
             you
             .
          
           
             But
             if
             you
             doe
             give
             another
             onset
             ,
             before
             you
             accept
             of
             a
             parse
             ,
             (
             seeing
             I
             have
             offered
             you
             conditions
             of
             peace
             )
             the
             world
             will
             judge
             you
             an
             unreasonable
             man
             ,
             and
             you
             shall
             never
             have
             the
             day
             .
          
           
             But
             if
             you
             will
             (
             say
             your
             quarrell
             is
             only
             against
             those
             
               Ministers
               ,
            
             that
             justifie
             your
             Church
             and
             Ministry
             ,
             and
             worship
             )
             and
             can
             prove
             that
             the
             Minsters
             of
             
               Holland
            
             and
             
               New
               England
            
             doe
             generally
             justifie
             the
             Church
             of
             
               England
               ,
            
             and
             the
             Ministery
             of
             the
             Church
             of
             
               England
               ,
            
             and
             the
             worship
             instituted
             by
             the
             Church
             of
             
               England
               :
            
             I
             say
             if
             they
             thus
             far
             justifie
             you
             ,
             (
             as
             I
             have
             here
             specified
             )
             then
             will
             I
             freely
             acknowledge
             (
             when
             I
             heare
             them
             speak
             it
             )
             that
             I
             was
             mistaken
             concerning
             them
             (
             yet
             the
             case
             in
             controversie
             stands
             still
             to
             be
             tried
             between
             you
             and
             me
             )
             but
             I
             do
             otherwise
             conceive
             of
             them
             for
             the
             present
             ,
             because
             I
             am
             credibly
             informed
             ,
             that
             they
             doe
             ,
             generally
             and
             publikely
             ,
             renounce
             the
             power
             by
             which
             they
             were
             called
             to
             their
             office
             of
             Ministry
             ,
             in
             and
             by
             the
             
               Church
            
             of
             
               England
               ;
            
             some
             of
             them
             affirming
             that
             they
             have
             stood
             Ministers
             too
             long
             under
             such
             a
             false
             power
             ;
             others
             confessing
             here
             in
             publike
             ,
             that
             it
             was
             their
             sinne
             ,
             that
             they
             had
             not
             revealed
             so
             much
             to
             the
             people
             before
             they
             went
             away
             ,
             with
             many
             the
             like
             expressions
             ,
             which
             I
             can
             prove
             ,
             if
             wee
             come
             face
             to
             face
             ,
             which
             maketh
             it
             apeare
             to
             me
             (
             for
             the
             present
             )
             that
             though
             they
             preach
             in
             the
             Assemblies
             met
             together
             by
             publike
             authority
             ,
             yet
             they
             judge
             themselves
             to
             be
             Ministers
             sent
             of
             God
             to
             separate
             the
             precious
             from
             the
             vile
             ,
             and
             that
             though
             they
             have
             not
             an
             outward
             mediate
             calling
             (
             seeing
             they
             have
             cast
             it
             off
             ,
             because
             it
             was
             false
             )
             yet
             they
             have
             an
             inward
             immediate
             calling
             ,
             as
             all
             the
             Ministers
             of
             God
             had
             in
             former
             time
             ,
             which
             were
             able
             to
             unfould
             the
             Misteries
             of
             the
             Scripture
             ,
             though
             they
             had
             neither
             calling
             by
             man
             ,
             nor
             by
             the
             will
             of
             man
             but
             by
             the
             holy
             Ghost
             .
          
           
             And
             I
             hope
             these
             men
             ,
             (
             of
             whom
             I
             speake
             )
             will
             never
             returne
             to
             serve
             God
             before
             the
             Idols
             ,
             nor
             preach
             for
             wages
             ,
             as
             
               Balaam
            
             did
             ,
             but
             still
             stand
             fast
             in
             the
             liberty
             wherein
             Christ
             hath
             set
             them
             ;
             Seeing
             they
             cave
             hast
             off
             the
             grievous
             yoke
             of
             Antichrist
             ,
             separating
             betweene
             the
             precious
             and
             the
             vile
             ,
             fitting
             men
             for
             the
             Lords
             building
             ,
             that
             so
             they
             may
             goe
             up
             to
             
               Ierusalem
            
             by
             troupes
             .
          
           
             This
             is
             my
             charity
             towards
             them
             ,
             though
             I
             know
             them
             not
             
             by
             face
             ,
             and
             I
             thinke
             I
             may
             boldly
             say
             that
             none
             of
             them
             knowes
             me
             .
          
        
         
           
             Esay
             41.
             21.
             
          
           
             Stand
             to
             your
             cause
             ,
             saith
             the
             Lord
             ,
             bring
             forth
             your
             strong
             reasons
             ,
             saith
             the
             King
             of
             
               Jacob
               .
            
          
        
         
           
             Esay
             5-8
             .
          
           
             Take
             counsell
             together
             ,
             yet
             it
             shall
             be
             br●ught
             to
             nought
             ,
             pronounce
             a
             Decree
             ,
             yet
             it
             shall
             not
             stand
             ,
             for
             GOD
             is
             with
             us
             .
          
        
         
           FINIS
           .
        
         
      
    
     
       
         Notes, typically marginal, from the original text
         
           Notes for div A32820e-410
           
             *
             Deut.
             32
             ▪
             ●
             .
             1
             King.
             ●
             .
             53.
             
          
           
             *
             Gen.
             4
             ▪
             14.
             15.
             16.
             
          
           
             c
             Gen.
             4.
             3.
             
          
           
             d
             Mat.
             24.
             38.
             39.
             1
             Pet.
             3.
             20.
             
          
           
             e
             Gen
             ▪
             7
             ▪
             1.
             
          
           
             f
             Ver.
             21
             ,
             22
             ,
             23.
             
          
           
             g
             Gen.
             12.
             1.
             
          
           
             h
             Exo.
             3.
             7
             
             ▪
             8
             ▪
             9.
             10.
             Chap.
             6.
             26.
             27.
             
          
           
             i
             And
             12
             ▪
             ●2
             .
          
           
             k
             Num
             16.
             12
             ,
             13
             14.
             
          
           
             l
             Ver.
             21.
             24
             ,
             25
             ,
             26.
             
          
           
             m
             Ver.
             35.
             
          
           
             n
             Ver.
             31
             ,
             32
             ,
             33.
             
          
           
             *
             Ver.
             5.
             
          
           
             Deut.
             5.
             26.
             27.
             
          
           
             *
             Deut.
             28.
             9.
             10.
             
          
           
             Ezza
             .
             1.
             Hag.
             1.
             2
             ,
             3.
             4.
             8.
             12.
             14.
             
          
           
             p
             Ier
             51.
             6.
             
          
           
             q
             Ier.
             3.
             12.
             
             Hos.
             11
             ,
             7.
             
          
           
             Christ
             made
             so
             great
             a
             difference
             betweene
             the
             world
             and
             the
             Church
             ,
             that
             hee
             would
             not
             pray
             for
             the
             world
             ;
             yet
             would
             die
             for
             the
             Church
             ,
             which
             was
             given
             him
             out
             of
             the
             world
             ;
             and
             without
             a
             Separation
             the
             Church
             can
             not
             be
             known
             from
             the
             world
             .
          
           
             r
             Rev.
             1.
             3
             ▪
             
          
           
             s
             Rev.
             18.
             4.
             
          
           
             *
             Amos
             7.
             12.
             13.
             
          
           
             *
             Gen.
             10.
             8
             ,
             9.
             
          
           
             *
             Ecster
             3.
             8.
             6
             ,
             6.
             
          
           
             *
             Neh
             ,
             6.
             
          
        
         
           Notes for div A32820e-1330
           
             ●●●
             .
             15.
             19.
             
          
           
             
               Verse
            
             13.
             14
             ,
             16.
             
             Compared
             with
             1
             
               Cor.
            
             12.
             
          
           
             Matth.
             1●
             ▪
             15.
             16.
             17
             ▪
             
          
           
             Acts
             15.
             1.
             
             ●●
             .
          
           
             1
             Cor.
             12.
             
          
           
             Act.
             16.
             1.
             3.
             
          
           
             See
             the
             Answer
             to
             his
             second
             Reason
             against
             Independencie
             .
          
           
             See
             Ezek.
             43.
             11.
             
          
           
             a
             Tit
             3.
             10.
             
          
           
             b
             Rev.
             1.
             20.
             
          
           
             Rev.
             2.
             20.
             
          
        
         
           Notes for div A32820e-5170
           
             c
             ●
             2
             Cor.
             6.
             14
             ,
             15.
             16.
             17.
             
          
           
             d
             Rev.
             14.
             9
             ,
             10
             ,
             11.
             12.
             
          
           
             e
             Chap.
             18.
             4.
             
          
           
             See
             the
             3.
             &
             4
             leafe
             of
             his
             Epistle
             .
          
           
             Reason
             .
             1.
             Pag.
             23.
             
          
           
             Pag.
             23.
             
          
           
             *
             1
             Tim.
             6.
             
          
           
             *
             For
             this
             see
             the
             Reply
             to
             his
             Answe
             to
             their
             third
             Reason
             for
             Toleration
             .
          
           
             Pag.
             29.
             
          
           
             *
             For
             this
             see
             his
             Book
             pag.
             5
             5.
             
          
           
             *
             Esay
             4
             2.
             8.
             
          
           
             Pag.
             30.
             li●
             .
             30.
             31.
             
          
           
             b
             1
             Tim.
             2.
             1.
             2.
             
          
           
             c
             Pro.
             15.
             8.
             
          
           
             *
             ●ph
             .
             4.
             5.
             
          
           
             Pag.
             31.
             lin.
             ●●
             .
          
           
             *
             Matth.
             6.
             5
             
          
           
             *
             Ver.
             7.
             8.
             
          
           
             Matth.
             6.
             9.
             
          
           
             Ver.
             10.
             
          
           
             Ver.
             11.
             
          
           
             Ver.
             12.
             
          
           
             Ver.
             13.
             
          
           
             c
             Rom.
             8.
             15
             
          
           
             d
             Ioh.
             14.
             26.
             
          
           
             *
             For
             this
             see
             the
             third
             part
             of
             his
             Answer
             to
             their
             second
             Reason
             against
             Toleration
             ,
             pag.
             30.
             
          
           
             *
             2
             Tim.
             3.
             5.
             
          
           
             *
             For
             this
             see
             his
             fif●
             Reason
             against
             Toleration
             .
             pag.
             28.
             lin.
             12.
             13.
             
          
           
             Matth.
             18.
             15
             ,
             16
             ,
             17
             ,
             18
             ,
             19
             ,
             20.
             
             Rev.
             21.
             27.
             and
             22
             ,
             14
             ,
             15.
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             34.
             
          
           
             Exod.
             5.
             17.
             
          
        
         
           Notes for div A32820e-9360
           
             *
             Pag.
             34.
             
          
           
             *
             Gen.
             45.
             24.
             
          
           
             *
             Pro.
             18.
             19.
             
          
           
             *
             Gen.
             50.
             20.
             
          
           
             *
             1
             Ioh.
             2.
             19.
             
          
           
             *
             Ioh.
             6.
             66.
             67.
             
          
           
             *
             I
             pray
             thee
             (
             good
             Reader
             )
             take
             notice
             ,
             that
             here
             I
             acknowledge
             an
             ove●sight
             (
             in
             
               taking
            
             Mr.
             
             
               Edwards
               his
               eleventh
               Reason
               ,
               to
               be
               a
               second
               tenth
               Reason
            
             )
             it
             was
             th●ough
             my
             neglect
             ,
             in
             not
             looking
             into
             his
             
               Errata
               .
            
          
           
             *
             For
             th●t
             reade
             the
             Answer
             to
             his
             third
             Reason
             against
             Independancie
             .
          
           
             *
             See
             the
             Reply
             tothe
             sixth
             part
             of
             his
             Answer
             to
             this
             their
             following
             Reasou
             .
          
           
             Rev.
             13.
             
          
           
             Whence
             the
             Church
             of
             England
             is
             derived
             .
             Whence
             the
             Church
             of
             Rome
             is
             derived
             .
          
           
             What
             the
             Image
             of
             the
             first
             beast
             is
             .
          
           
             *
             In
             the
             Second
             Part
             of
             his
             second
             Reason
             against
             toleration
             ,
             pag.
             24.
             
             In
             his
             sixth
             Reason
             against
             toleration
             pag.
             29.
             and
             the
             third
             part
             of
             his
             Answer
             to
             their
             second
             Reason
             for
             toleration
             .
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             43.
             lin.
             16
             ▪
             17.
             
          
           
             Rev.
             7.
             
          
           
             Rev.
             12.
             11
             ▪
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             45.
             
          
           
             *
             Rev.
             12.
             14
             
          
           
             *
             Verse
             16.
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             46.
             li.
             ●●
             .
          
           
             Pag.
             48.
             lin.
             14.
             
          
           
             Pag.
             48.
             lin.
             20.
             
          
           
             *
             What
             it
             is
             that
             bred
             the
             Separates
             .
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             49.
             
             ●
             9.
             10.
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             50.
             lin
             23.
             〈◊〉
             lin.
             29.
             
          
           
             *
             Cant.
             1.
             7.
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             48.
             l.
             23
             ,
             24.
             
          
           
             *
             Acts
             ●●●
             24.
             
          
           
             *
             Acts
             6.
             5.
             
             ●
             .
             10.
             
          
           
             *
             Ioh.
             9.
             31.
             
          
           
             Exod.
             9.
             29.
             33.
             
          
           
             Pag
             52.
             
          
           
             *
             When
             
               Stephen
               Gardiner
            
             harped
             upon
             unitie
             ,
             unitie
             :
             yea
             Sir
             (
             said
             
               Latimer
            
             )
             but
             in
             Veritie
             ,
             not
             in
             Popery
             :
             better
             is
             a
             Diversiti●
             ▪
             ●●●●●●
             Vnitie
             in
             Popery
             .
          
           
             *
             Rev.
             21.
             27.
             
          
           
             Pag.
             52.
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             49.
             lin.
             31.
             
             ●
             .
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             52.
             lin.
             33.
             34.
             
          
           
             *
             For
             this
             see
             his
             eigth
             Reason
             against
             Toleration
             .
             pag.
             32.
             lin.
             23.
             24.
             25.
             26.
             27.
             
          
           
             *
             Pag.
             26.
             
          
           
             *
             Acts
             8.
             3.
             
          
           
             *
             Act.
             22.
             3●
             
          
           
             *
             Ver.
             2●
             .
          
           
             *
             Ver.
             8.
             
          
           
             *
             Ver.
             10.
             
          
           
             1
             Cor.
             11.
             1.
             
          
           
             ●
             Thes.
             2.
             7.
             
          
           
             ●or
             this
             see
             Reasons
             against
             Independancie
             ,
             pag.
             5.
             lin.
             12.
             
             ●●
             .
          
           
             *
             1
             Cor.
             11.
             23.
             
          
           
             *
             For
             this
             see
             his
             Book
             pag.
             55.
             
          
           
             *
             Psal.
             8●
             .
             1.
             6.
             
          
           
             *
             Acts
             9.
             4.
             5.